00:10Hello and good evening. I'm Melissa Idris. Welcome to Consider This. This is the show
00:15where we want you to consider and then reconsider what you know of the news of the day. Prime
00:19Minister Anwar Ibrahim has warned that Malaysia could be the target of cyber security threats
00:25following recent cyber attacks in other countries that have disrupted their critical infrastructure.
00:32Now Putrajaya says it is strengthening national cyber security and preparedness but just how
00:38vulnerable is our country and what happens if our critical systems are disrupted. So tonight on the
00:44show we'll examine the potential threats and whether our preparedness matches the risk. Well joining me
00:52to do that I have with me on the line Alina Ngo who is non-resident scholar in the Asia
00:56program
00:56at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace where her work focuses on how technology is reshaping
01:03power dynamics governance and security in Southeast Asia. Alina good to have you on the show. So so
01:09much has been happening around the world I'm curious to know when you look at these incidences
01:12that are happening how are you reading them? Are they to you separate events separate incidences or
01:20are they interconnected? Are they a trend? Are they a pattern? I want to know what stands out to you.
01:26Well thanks for having me back Melissa. So I think the last few weeks we've seen what seems to be
01:33a
01:33strange build-up of all sorts of weird happenings cyber attacks threats of a nuclear war and all these
01:41seem to be coalescing around some event eventuality that we're uncertain of and we're all asking very
01:50similar questions. What should we do? How should we prepare? Is there something that's going to happen?
01:56And I'm afraid I don't have a short answer for you but I do think there are at least two
02:01things that
02:02seem to be contributing to these concerns if not alarm in some countries. One is the fact that we've seen
02:10with
02:10the release of advanced AI models an increasing number of cyber attacks because of the vulnerabilities
02:19that have also been found by these AI models. So it's AI models increasing cyber attacks at speed
02:28and scale but it's also the number of vulnerabilities that have been latent for some in some cases many
02:34decades that are now being exploited by attackers and operators at speed and scale again. The other
02:43thing that is contributing to these concerns is the fact that there are these geopolitical pretty
02:50significant geopolitical events happening and there is some alarm about how they might pan out in terms of
02:58stability. So the results of the Israeli election and the hung results of that what that means for a
03:05Netanyahu coalition or otherwise whether that in turn will impact the midterms and we have seen some of the U
03:13.S.
03:13midterm results already coming out whether the Israeli elections will sway any actions by the U.S.
03:20President and his administration which in turn will also be affected by the outcome of the
03:24midterm elections because there was some concern at least in the U.S. about how President Trump would react
03:29if the midterm results did not go his way. So the fact that there are these AI models that are
03:35contributing to the rise of cyber attacks and the geopolitical events that are happening I think has
03:40really resulted in this rash of will something happen or will something not. Okay so talk to me about what
03:48we
03:49what your what your working hypothesis is Alina do we know why let's focus on the cyber attacks do we
03:56know why AI models are contributing to cyber attacks the reasons behind it is it are these actors operators
04:02that you talk about are they motivated by political ideology are they motivated by money and profit are
04:10these state-backed actors are these lone wolf operators what's your sense? So I think it's E all of
04:18the above it's very hard to determine or attribute these incidents to different actors right because
04:26attribution is itself in in cyber operations a difficult thing at a technical at a legal and a
04:32political level so setting aside you know who's really behind these attacks there are a number of
04:37motivations and all of those that you listed you know whether it's just scams whether it's just people
04:42acting for malicious reasons whether it's political motivations all of those come into play I think
04:49in the case of Malaysia none of these incidents are particularly new last year alone you know the
04:55computer emergency response team for Malaysia reported thousands of attacks and this year from January to
05:02September they've already been about 7 000 cyber incidents many of which are fraud related but also
05:08things like denial of service malicious code spam and and so I think the fact that AI models are able
05:16to
05:16automate a lot of these incidents just makes it so much easier for perpetrators to execute a lot of
05:23their ill intent okay all right so we have the prime minister warning or saying that Malaysia could be a
05:33potential target so when a prime minister says a country could be a potential target of cyber attacks
05:40or other security threats how should the public interpret that I think this should be a wake-up call
05:48because honestly for those of us who look at security issues none of this is new and you know you
05:53might be
05:54cynical and say well what's the purpose of the timing of this announcement but setting that aside the fact that
06:00we have had some major data breaches in the past involving our very personal information confidential
06:07information you know and really nothing woke us up to that threat we've had this many times already
06:14and the fact that the prime minister is calling for yet another wake-up call uh is something that we
06:20should be taking more seriously it's not just the the cyber domain that we're facing threats in I think the
06:26prime minister also mentioned that there are these risks in neighboring countries that we have to be
06:31alert to and again this is nothing new you know um that threat has always been there the fact that
06:36we do
06:37not have diplomatic relations with Israel for example should alert us to the possibility very much the
06:44likelihood of uh interest from Israel and and its interested parties in what we're thinking what we're
06:52planning to do or what we're not and chances of manipulation within our society so honestly nothing
06:58is new it's just the timing of this announcement I think that raises a lot of questions yeah well so
07:04the prime minister also I think he he basically stopped short of um asking Malaysians to stockpile
07:10emergency supplies but we you I'm sure have seen that other governments around the world have
07:15been issuing these public uh preparedness advisories and they range from you know three days to
07:21up to 10 days or so if I'm not mistaken in Europe so I'm curious to know Alina what you
07:26think is the
07:27right balance because I understand that uh governments you know cannot reveal some of the
07:32intelligence behind these warnings but there is a need to keep the public informed to avoid um alarmist
07:39being you know um being alarmed but also to ensure that the public is prepared there is a delicate balance
07:45and where do you think that line is so I think part of this preparedness panic has been um catalyzed
07:53by
07:53the pentagon's initiation of what they call fortress America so the US military now has to put in plan
08:02or actually implement a plan for the military to be prepared for 90 days if I'm not mistaken
08:09um and obviously with what's going on between Russia and Ukraine I think this is also set into motion the
08:15fact that European countries feel they need to prepare their citizens in an eventuality of an
08:20attack now what is the right uh number of days we should be prepared for I mean I live in
08:26Singapore
08:26and many Singaporean apartments have bomb shelters in place now whether or not this would be overkill for
08:32Malaysia is something we can have a conversation on but I know of people who for example have
08:39uh an emergency back packed just in case you know they need to flee somewhere and I don't think that's
08:45a bad idea in case something happens and it could be a natural disaster right it could be floods and
08:50you
08:50need to just grab your bag and go to a hotel somewhere or go to a different state uh but
08:55I think you know you
08:56should have a certain amount of canned foods which we all do and just put in place like minimum necessary
09:02preparations uh the fact that there is a security threat that we've all been sleeping on should actually
09:07alert as to some form of preparation it doesn't necessarily need to be for 90 days but um maybe
09:14just for whatever a family feels is right for it right Elena thank you so much for joining me on
09:20the
09:20show today I appreciate your time Elena Ngo from the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace we're
09:24going to take a quick break here on consider this but more on this topic in just a few minutes
09:28stay tuned we'll be right back
09:39we'll be right back
