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Many of us may remember BlackBerry for its phones, but today, BlackBerry operates as a software company and one of their areas of focus is in cybersecurity and secure communications, working with governments and critical industries around the world. In Malaysia, BlackBerry and the Malaysian Communications and Multimedia Commission jointly operate the Cybersecurity Centre of Excellence in Cyberjaya which focuses on cyber threat intelligence and resilience. On this episode of #ConsiderThis Melisa Idris speaks with John Giamatteo, CEO of BlackBerry.
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NewsTranscript
00:10Hello and good evening. I'm Melissa Idris. Welcome to Consider This. This is a show where we consider and reconsider
00:17the news of the day.
00:18Many of us remember BlackBerry for its phones, but today BlackBerry operates as a software company and one of their
00:25areas of focus is in cyber security and secure communications.
00:28They work with governments and critical industries around the world. Here in Malaysia, BlackBerry and Malaysia's Communications and Multimedia Commission
00:36jointly operate the Cyber Security Centre of Excellence in Cyber Jaya.
00:41It's the first of its kind in the region and it focuses on cyber threat intelligence and resilience.
00:47Joining me today, I have John Giamatteo, who's the CEO of BlackBerry. Thank you so much for being with me
00:53today, John.
00:54I'm hoping we can maybe kick off our conversation a little bit with looking at cyber security threats.
01:00So now it being a matter of national security, can I ask you, when you work with governments around the
01:07world, what are they telling you about what they're most concerned about?
01:11Yeah, that's a great, great question. And I would say a lot of what we see with governments, some of
01:18the trends now is really around data and digital sovereignty, keeping the information, their communications, the data, the privacy of
01:28their citizens around the world,
01:30So keeping that safe and secure and some of the days of the cloud and hyperscalers and putting everything in
01:40the cloud, I think we've certainly seen over the last few years a bit of a step back as the
01:46geopolitical landscape has changed.
01:48And as a result, they're looking for much more security, they're looking for much more on-premise types of solutions,
01:56they're looking for solutions that they can ensure the overall security and sovereignty of their data and communications.
02:05Okay. I want to delve into data sovereignty a bit later, but let's talk first about the cyber threat landscape.
02:15You've been working in this area for quite some time. What's changed the most? What's been the most dramatic change,
02:21let's say even in the last five years or so?
02:23Yeah. The global threat, the global threat, the global threat, the landscape surface has widened significantly. Now that you, with
02:31the cloud, with mobile devices, with smart devices, IoT devices. So when you think about all the different things that
02:39can be infiltrated, it's probably grown at a massive, massive scale.
02:46So I think that's one dynamic. Then add on top of that, the acceleration of AI. And if you have,
02:54you know, some of the infiltrators and the people that are trying to do bad things, leveraging AI across a
03:03much more diverse landscape of devices to protect, you know, the combination of those two things, I think really create
03:11a challenge, you know, for the industry, for governments, for enterprises, all around the world.
03:16And how has Blackbird been able to stay abreast of these developments?
03:21Our focus has been very much more pinpointed towards things like secure communications. So secure communications from things like mobile
03:36device management. If you're a company where we find large banks and governments, they're really concerned about the applications and
03:44the services
03:45and the information that's going on their employees' devices. So leveraging Blackberry's UEM technology, our unified endpoint management solution provides
03:56a level of protection and management within there. So that's one area that we have been very, very focused on.
04:03And again, we serve a lot of governments and big banks around the world in that regard.
04:07The second is our secure SecuSuite platform. And SecuSuite is an encrypted, the most advanced encryption technology that exists on
04:18the planet. And this is encryption technology that protects voice,
04:22so your conversation, texting, even now video, we've introduced video as a solution. So fully encrypted voice data and video.
04:32And the kind of use case that this will, you know, resolve, is when you think about how many people
04:39communicate on WhatsApp, Signal, you know, all these different platforms that they telegram, all these different solutions.
04:52Now, maybe for the average consumer that might be texting to our friends or family, that might be okay. But
05:00for big government and big enterprises that have some very, very confidential types of information that they want to keep
05:08safe, a platform like SecuSuite is a much more reliable end-to-end encryption technology.
05:16And I understand that BlackBerry provided the secure comms for the ASEAN Summit last year.
05:22The ASEAN Summit, we've rolled that out. We got great feedback from the government on how this was the safest
05:29ASEAN Summit.
05:31And some of the hosts of the upcoming ASEAN Summit around the region are talking to us and how we
05:37might be able to help them as well.
05:38So you mentioned a few platforms. And now governments are increasingly using, needing secure communications, realizing the need for cyber
05:49resilience.
05:49Can you talk to me a little bit about the risk of governments worldwide being dependent or becoming too dependent
05:58on a handful of private technology vendors, essentially, for cyber resilience or for secure communications?
06:09Is there a risk or danger of governments being too dependent on these handful of tech companies?
06:15Well, I would argue I'd rather be reliant on a few handful of vendors that provide mission-critical types of
06:26services than leveraging a consumer-grade messaging product like WhatsApp to exercise your business.
06:33Right. Better to be secure than to be massive.
06:36100%. So, yes, there's fewer of us that are addressing these problems because many, many more organizations do tend to
06:46use off-the-shelf types of solutions.
06:48But we find we're getting, especially with all the trends that we talked about before that's happening in the marketplace
06:57right now, a tremendous amount of demand for the types of mission-critical solutions that we provide.
07:03So what makes a company, a private tech vendor, trustworthy enough to become part of a government's critical digital infrastructure?
07:15Great question. Now, honestly, I'm not going to, I can't speak to our competitors and what they, but I can
07:22speak to BlackBerry.
07:23And I will tell you that one of the reasons why I think we very much rise to the top
07:30of one of the top players that can help solve these problems is our 40-year history.
07:35BlackBerry has been in business for more than 40 years, providing security, trust, and innovation over decades.
07:43So when we come and talk to the Malaysian government or other governments around the world, I think there's a
07:49certain level of comfort and confidence in our, not only our abilities, but our track record as a company of
07:58providing those types of solutions.
08:00So the fact that we have a great brand and a great track record of partnering and working together with
08:08governments around the world, I think that's foundational.
08:11But then we bring these tremendous solutions like UEM, like our SecuSuite product, like our ad hoc product is emergency
08:19notifications.
08:20That's right.
08:21So, you know, this, you bring this set of capabilities along with the BlackBerry brand and our commitment to the
08:28regions that we operate.
08:30We're sitting here in our cybersecurity center of excellence.
08:33This is something that we built on our dime as a commitment to the Malaysian government of upscaling the skills
08:41of people in the regions that we work with.
08:43So I think that combination of the brand, the technology, our commitment to giving back and to the markets that
08:51we operate in.
08:52I think those are the things that help us differentiate ourselves.
08:55Well, the other thing is BlackBerry is a Canadian company.
08:58I'm wondering in this era of geopolitics, whether a company's country of origin comes into play when governments are considering
09:08who they want to let in, in terms of their cybersecurity infrastructure.
09:12Yeah, I think it does.
09:14I mean, you can't help but not in the world that we operate in today.
09:18And, you know, different countries have a different affinity or feel more comfortable with other countries.
09:23So has that been helpful for us?
09:26Yeah, I would say it has.
09:28I think Canada being a great export partner.
09:32We work really closely with the Canadian government here in Malaysia together to export our technologies and provide solutions.
09:39So I think there is a certain level of trust that a lot of our customers feel in the Canadian
09:46government and environment, and particularly a 40-year-old, proud, iconic Canadian company like us, that, you know, gives them
09:55a little bit of a more comforting feeling working with us.
09:57In this era of heightened geopolitical tensions, are the cybersecurity threats increasing?
10:05I'm just wondering, for a middle power like Malaysia, whether or not state-linked threats, cyber threats, are becoming more
10:14sophisticated, more aggressive, and if Malaysia as a middle power, even though we're not directly involved in any kind of
10:20conflict or geopolitical tensions, whether there is still a risk for countries like Malaysia?
10:25What do you think?
10:26I think there's always a risk.
10:29And, you know, I think all countries need to be, not just Malaysia, you know, on their toes and doing
10:38the types of things.
10:40Really, one of the reasons why we're here in Malaysia is because the prime minister had the vision of what
10:45he did.
10:45You know, we've now deployed over 100,000 products across the government to protect various levels of agencies around the
10:54government, and that took vision to do that.
10:57You know, that doesn't happen often.
10:59You see someone say, you know what, I want to make sure that all of my people across all of
11:04my agencies are protected.
11:06So, I think it starts from the top and setting the tone, and as a result, you come to a
11:13market.
11:14I think that's really kind of leading edge in that regard.
11:18You mentioned at the beginning of our conversation, you talked about digital sovereignty.
11:23Talk to me about that, because if we hear governments insisting, not just the Malaysian governments, but governments around the
11:30world, insisting that sensitive data be stored, you said on premise, right?
11:34So, stored locally, controlled domestically.
11:37Is that realistic, John?
11:39Can that feasibly done in a world where we're so interconnected, especially with tech companies who are international players?
11:46Yeah, that's a great question, Melissa, and I believe it can.
11:51I absolutely believe it can.
11:53There's hybrid solutions, you know, that you can use, whether it's a private cloud, a government cloud.
11:58There's other ways to really get at that interconnected nature of things.
12:03But I think starting from a really rock-solid, secure, premise-based, sovereign-based types of footprint,
12:10and then you can decide how far you want to maybe, you know, expand that out into, you know, other
12:16markets and how much, you know, broader cloud technology you want to leverage.
12:21So, I think you, you know, kind of crawl, walk, run, be a little bit careful around how you approach
12:27it.
12:28And, but I think starting by making sure that the information is locked down, is secure.
12:35I have to tell you, those solutions that we provide to the government today, we don't even have access to
12:40the data.
12:41Okay.
12:41Truly, it is the government's information.
12:44So, you know, if somebody came to us and said, well, we want some information, we tell them we have
12:48no access to it as a government.
12:50So, I think that's a great place for them to start.
12:52And then depending on the application, the agency, if you want to open up that aperture a little bit more,
12:58there's an opportunity to do that.
12:59Crawl, walk, run.
13:01Which stage is Malaysia at the moment?
13:05Walking pretty fast.
13:06Okay.
13:06I think they're walking pretty fast.
13:08A slow jog.
13:10We'll get to the running part.
13:12They're probably jogging faster than me.
13:15Okay.
13:15And you mentioned a bit earlier in our conversation as well, you talked about the emergency notification system.
13:20Can we talk about that?
13:21Because I think for many of us, we think cyber resilience is about elite infrastructure.
13:27We think it is only the purview of governments, but actually it affects the people as well.
13:31And it's a public service issue, essentially.
13:35Absolutely.
13:35So, in this age of the climate crisis, where we worry about flooding and disasters, talk to me about how
13:44secure communications, the ad hoc emergency notification system is crucial.
13:50It's key.
13:51Well, it's one of our fastest growing products in markets like Malaysia.
13:57Other markets in the ASEAN region are looking at it closely because of some of the challenges that you mentioned.
14:03What's interesting about this product, it started as a very much a military product.
14:08It was deployed with the armed forces in other markets around the world, really protecting forces, making sure that we're
14:18directing forces to be in the right place at the right time.
14:21So, we actually repurposed that use case, and now we're working with governments in rural locations to make sure the
14:29towns and the people are in those towns.
14:31It's the same technology, it's just a little bit of a different use case.
14:35And once we tweaked that, we found some really, really good uptake with governments around the world to keep their
14:42people safe by having regular emergency notifications.
14:46Whether that's using, you know, the mobile network, whether that's using satellite, whether that's using landline, can average, you know,
14:55leverage social media channels, you know.
14:58So, we can integrate it as far and as deeply as governments might want to integrate it into.
15:05And it's having a profound impact on keeping people and government safer.
15:10I can only imagine at a time of a national emergency, if the comms were to go down, what that
15:17would mean for, I mean, these critical infrastructures to go down at the time when you need the most coordination
15:22for relief and disaster management, right?
15:26Absolutely.
15:27Absolutely.
15:28If the 5G network goes down and people can't communicate on their mobile phone, we can actually flip a channel
15:35and have it interact directly from a satellite channel.
15:38So, has it been tested? What's the worst, I guess, scenario that you've had to face?
15:43I won't give you the specific scenario because it'll give, but it absolutely has been tested in really some mission
15:49critical cases involving some big governments around the world.
15:54Okay. When we talk about critical infrastructure, John, which areas are we talking about?
15:59Talk to me about what that means because I think for many people that's, it's an ambiguous phrase.
16:05What are the sectors that you're looking at in terms of where this is most key?
16:11Yeah. From a critical infrastructure perspective?
16:13Yes. Absolutely. Yes.
16:13Yeah. I think of things, you know, like, like water control, like energy, like that's one of the things we
16:20were talking at where the government of Sarawatt earlier in the week.
16:23You know, energy is a major, major asset and big part of that state.
16:30And, you know, how do we leverage secure communications in those environments to make sure their equipment is safe, to
16:38make sure they're alarmed correctly, to make sure that we get the right information back at the right time.
16:45So these are all different types of use cases, whether it's electricity, whether it's oil, whether it's water, you know,
16:53whether it's roadways and making sure that we keep people safe on the road.
16:57Think of that as a major infrastructure use case.
17:01Those are all things that leverage some part of our portfolio to help, you know, them operate in a more
17:09efficient way.
17:09I never thought about it that way. Are there areas that are continuing to evolve and you discover, oh, this
17:15is a sector that requires that is part of the critical infrastructure that requires looking at.
17:20I'm wondering whether governments underestimate certain areas, certain risks that may arise as the world develops.
17:28You know what? And I think that's an opportunity for us to bring our global experience, to bring our 40
17:33plus years of experience of providing these solutions to customers around the world.
17:38I think they value that we bring that and say, here's what we see.
17:42You know, here's here's high risk gain and here's some low risk things.
17:47And some of them, you know, will will you'll kind of elect to the depending on what's going on in
17:52their specific area.
17:53So I think that's the benefit of having a company that brings a lot of that perspective.
17:58And we like to think that's our value add beyond the technology.
18:03Is it easy to convince governments that they really need to invest in secure communications in this critical infrastructure?
18:13In general, the answer is no.
18:15You know, you're always you're always trying to fight.
18:19You know, a lot of it is you're you're fighting, you know, budgeting.
18:24Is that always cost an issue?
18:27There's always cost is an issue.
18:28But that's where I come.
18:30I would come back to Malaysia and in Prime Minister Anwar.
18:34And our whole initiative that we started three years ago, he saw the light.
18:38He absolutely saw the impact it can have to Malaysia, to its people, to its security, its cyber resilience,
18:45and didn't flinch to make the investment and the partnership with us to deliver on that.
18:51Sometimes, you know, there's other governments that are not so quick to do that because maybe they've got other priorities
18:57or other issues.
18:59So it's definitely not.
19:01It's always an uphill battle.
19:02I think they all with the geopolitical environment and some of the cyber challenges that we see around the world
19:09today,
19:09I think they all resonate with it and they understand it.
19:13It's just a matter of where does that fit in their prioritization of investments?
19:17Well, because I think it's a tough political sell because if you're doing your job right, we don't see it.
19:23We don't see it.
19:24100%.
19:25Right?
19:25It's invisible.
19:26Absolutely.
19:26Okay.
19:28Do governments, for the governments that do acknowledge that cyber resilience is important enough to invest in,
19:35do the regulations move fast enough?
19:38I'm just wondering because regulations, institutions, they tend to move quite slowly,
19:44whereas tech and cyber threats move at a pace like no other.
19:48Have you seen the mismatch in terms of keeping up from governments with what the threats are?
19:54It's a challenge to stay ahead of technology and the adversaries and all the different things that we're doing.
20:00I would say here locally from a Malaysian perspective, much more progressive and better than most in terms of really
20:10recognizing the risk and partnering with industry to address it.
20:16So, and it varies from region to region.
20:21So, all we could do is bring our know-how, bring our technology, bring our capabilities to the table and
20:31hopefully get an opportunity to serve governments around the world.
20:34And what are you keeping your eye on in terms of what threats are emerging in the horizon?
20:42You know, you got to continue, we think, to keep our eye on AI.
20:47AI is changing the world in so many different ways.
20:50So, that's part of, you know, we've got a special group that looks after, you know, advanced threats and trends
20:59and technologies and we keep an eye on that very, very closely.
21:05But, you know, I think partnering together with the industry, partnering together with governments around the world, I think we
21:12could stay ahead of it, but we just got to be really diligent in the process.
21:16Can you just very quickly elaborate what you mean when you say AI could be a big threat?
21:22Well, AI is so advanced now.
21:27It's so, you think of it before as adversaries would write up some code and set up and plant it
21:34into an enterprise's network.
21:37And that took a bit of time and effort and now you can do that in a nanosecond with AI.
21:43And if somebody blocks it, AI can redirect it.
21:46So, it's so sophisticated from the perspective of it can work around some of the measures that get put in
21:53place to stop it.
21:55You need to, in some ways, use AI to stop AI.
21:59So, those are the types of trends that we see and, as a company, we embrace it quite a bit
22:06to make sure that we can leverage that to keep our customers safe.
22:10John, it's been a pleasure talking to you. Thank you so much for your time.
22:12Melissa, thanks for having me on the programme.
22:14That's all the time we have for you on this episode of Consider This.
22:17I'm Melissa Idris, signing off for the evening. Thanks so much for watching. Good night.
22:23Bye.
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