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00:00When you're with Diamond Dave, was it kind of like Dave's ship he was running or did he just
00:03accept everyone's ideas? He needed, especially the guitarist, to bring music to the party. The
00:10potential to be tremendously intimidated was there. I had to compete with Edward. That's a
00:16an insane proposition. I didn't see myself competing with Edward. How do you do that?
00:21Rock, metal, frog, and everything in between. Welcome to this episode of Talkin' Rock with
00:28Meltdown. Don't forget to follow the audio-only Talkin' Rock podcast on all podcast platforms.
00:33And now, it's time for today's conversation. Here's Meltdown.
00:38Yeah, it's days like today when I get to talk to legends that makes it worthwhile. How you doing,
00:42Steve? Doing great. Nice to be here. Thanks. Yeah, I, you know, I forgot my picture of you
00:47and I. I was going to bring, since we were doing Zoom, a picture of you and I from 1999.
00:51I think
00:52when I met and interviewed you for the first time and you were signing records back in the day.
00:57Yeah. Yeah. 99 would be about the time you'd be signing records still. Yeah. Yeah. Right.
01:04Oddly enough, I, you know, you see them popping up now, too. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a huge vinyl guy. Do
01:10you, what, what, do you collect anything like that? Anything musically like that?
01:13Well, yeah, I do. I, I, years ago, I bought a really nice turntable and I had my old record
01:20collection from when I was a kid and I occasionally will pick up a vinyl package that I, I see
01:28that I
01:29think is nice. And there's some artists that I just order everything, you know, like if Tom Waits
01:35comes out with anything or Frank Zappa, you know, I just get it. Yeah. That's great. So, all right. So
01:43I, I started collecting again back in like 2017 and I went home and my dad had, had pulled out
01:49all
01:49the records I had as a kid and there was only about 40 of them or something. So what kind
01:52of records did
01:53you have as a kid? Oh, wow. Well, you know, I, I came from a family where both my parents,
01:59um, were
02:00second generation Italian immigrants. So, you know, my house, you get things like polka, you know,
02:10you, uh, Engelbert Humperdinck, comedy records, Tom Jones. But one day my parents brought home and I
02:18was about three years old, probably, um, the soundtrack to the movie West Side Story. And that's
02:26one I lit up. I really lit up because I remember seeing the film and we had the record, we
02:33had the
02:33vinyl and there was just so much there, you know, it had drama, had gangs and street fights and romance
02:41and comedy and theater and amazing melody and compositions. I mean, Stephen Sondheim and Leonard
02:50Bernstein. So at a very early age, I, I heard that music and I said, uh, that's what I want
02:59to do.
02:59I want to compose. I'm going to, I kind of had a, I had a very strong attraction to music.
03:06I didn't
03:06realize it at the time. Um, but, uh, yeah. And then after that, my brothers and sisters started
03:14bringing home vinyl and then cassettes, you know, because cassettes kicked in and that's when I,
03:21I really woke up because, uh, my sister just had great taste in rock and roll. And I was like
03:29nine
03:30or 10 and she was probably, you know, mid teenager and she had Led Zeppelin and Alice Cooper and, uh,
03:38you know, queen and, and, uh, deep purple and all this really great seventies rock stuff.
03:46And then, uh, two houses down was my good friend, John Sergio. He was a couple of years older than
03:51me,
03:51but he was a real, real music head. So he had every record, him, his brother and, uh, had all
03:59these
04:00records. And that's where I was introduced to like, uh, progressive rock, King Crimson and
04:06Emerson Lake and Palmer, all this great stuff. Yeah. And, uh, you know, the first record I ever
04:12bought with my own money was, uh, ride the lightning. And I think I just bought it because
04:16of the cover, you know, obviously it's like one of those things. And plus, you know, when I was a
04:19kid growing up too, we had eight tracks and I'll never forget. I listened to the Steve Martin,
04:23a track over and over and over again. I didn't, I didn't even get some of the jokes for like
04:2620 years
04:26later, but I thought it was fun. I remember those two records you bought with your own money. Do you
04:33remember? Well, the first record I ever received that I can remember was from my mom and it was
04:40Yogi bear and friends. And the second one that she got for me was the Partridge family picture disc
04:48because that, you know, I was watching that show on TV, but then similar to you, um, we had this,
04:55uh, department store up the street from us and it had a record department. And I would go in there
05:00and just oogle over the records. And I came across this really weird, interesting record
05:06called freak out by Frank Zappa. And that was the first record I ever bought with my own money.
05:13Imagine that. And you, you probably told him that story, right? Um, you know, I, oddly enough,
05:19I don't think I did. Yeah. Interesting. Never told him that. Yeah. No, that's great. Yeah. Um,
05:26man, you just mentioned a King Crimson. Of course you're out in this, uh, beat tour with, uh,
05:29Adrian blue and Tony, Tony Levin and Terry Bozzio. Uh, and I, I saw recently this, this,
05:35this kind of, the band kind of gelled quickly when he got on tour and started playing with these guys.
05:41Yeah. You know, the previous band with Danny carry, uh, you know, that, that was humming along,
05:49you know, and, and the music really came together and I, and I, I felt the band was powerful and
05:55the
05:56the shows were very engaging. And when Terry came along, I know Terry's playing and his potential.
06:05And he is, uh, I've gone, I've said it multiple times through the years that there's certain
06:14performances that I've witnessed in my life for me that I felt have been profound where the artist
06:23is completely connected in a incredible, powerful stream of consciousness kind of improvisational way.
06:33And, uh, one of them, one of them was Anne Wilson from heart. I remember many years ago,
06:40I was just, I went to a heart concert and I just couldn't believe this woman. And the other was
06:45Tom
06:46Waits, but the other was Terry Bozio because when I toured with him with Zappa play Zappa, he would do
06:55a
06:55drum solo every night. And I've never seen anything like it. It, it, it was, it was, it was actually
07:01scary, you know, cause he was so connected, remarkable, remarkable artist. So we've all gotten
07:13up in age, you know, and, and some of us who have to hit things for a living, uh, you
07:21know, may slow
07:21down a little, uh, sooner, but Terry kind of for the past six years has really laid off. He hasn't
07:30played
07:30any shows, you know, he was kind of, I think, winding down that aspect of his career. So when I
07:38called him
07:39and asked him if he'd be interested, he just said yes, right away. And I knew two things. I knew
07:45that he was
07:47an absolute inspired artist, but I also knew he hadn't played for seven years. So when we first got into
07:56rehearsal, you, you could see that it was, it was there, but it, it was rusty. But after rehearsals, it
08:05took
08:05about three shows, three or four shows on the fourth show, San Diego, when all of a sudden things just
08:14started coming together. And then the, the shows after that, the band felt brought together again.
08:23And then now I'm seeing it just, and feeling it just starting to unfold. Terry is freaking me out,
08:31man. Uh, I mean, he started, you can see every day that scary Terry is coming back and, um, it's
08:44so much
08:44fun. It's so great. His time is solid as hell. And, uh, his ability to forever improvise is strong.
08:55And, uh, yeah, I'm feeling right now that the show is just screaming. We're right on time.
09:01And you guys are playing here at the, uh, Joe white or the, uh, Jack white theater at the Masonic
09:06coming up. Uh, have you ever met or played with Jack at all? No, oddly enough, he's one of those,
09:11uh, elusive artists that I, I respect tremendously, but never had the opportunity to meet.
09:19Yeah. I was going to say, I was texting with, uh, Steve black earlier and say who I believe,
09:22if you know, and yeah, Steve, and he told me, he goes, yes, Steve has played with everybody.
09:29Played with a lot of people. Yeah. Jack black. Yeah. Or Jack black. Probably right.
09:36Jack white. Jack white. I have played with Jack black. Of course you have.
09:41That's great. Is there, is there anybody on your list that, I mean, that, that, you know,
09:44you just mentioned, you know, Terry and stuff. He's a drummer, obviously would anybody else
09:47who you'd like to play with eventually? Well, there's so many, you know, there's so many,
09:52many great artists, uh, for the, for the most part, the last four years, I've five years,
10:00I've been, uh, on tour since May of 22. And I, I did a tour to support my solo record
10:08in Violet.
10:09And then I started with G3 and then Satriani and Vi and then beat and then Satch Vi and then
10:16beat and
10:18we're just kind of going back and forth. So in situations like that, it's, it's great to work
10:25with all the players that I feel, uh, understand the kind of thing that I do. And especially making
10:33the record with Joe, uh, that, that was great to have access to so many great musicians.
10:40But as far as, uh, you know, choosing to, so to speak, go to bed with another artist and,
10:48and create a project and do something like that. Um, I don't have much interest in that right now.
10:56Yeah. Not unless something extraordinary came along. I'm, I'm more interested in
11:03being the master and commander of my own ship. Right. So to speak, you know, I just want to get
11:08back and start, uh, getting some of my crazy music recorded. And when I do that, then the song tells
11:18me
11:19who, who would be most appropriate to participate with. And I'm very lucky because most, most people
11:26I reach out to are interested to contribute there. Yeah. You just mentioned, you know, you wanted to
11:33be, you want to be the master of your own ship. When did that feeling come up, come about for
11:37you
11:38in your life, in your career? When I opened my eyes. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Okay. When I came out
11:45of the shoot, maybe no, um, there was always, there was always this feeling that, uh, and I, I'm sure
11:54that this is a, uh, a relatively common feeling amongst a lot of people who have a hankering, you
12:04know, a hankering for something, whether it's business or arts or cooking or, or building something,
12:11whatever it is, um, there's a pull, um, sort of in a person. And ever since I can remember,
12:21I, I had these, I think I mentioned earlier that West Side Story, uh, triggered this desire to
12:28compose. And I, even at like eight years old, I, I understood, uh, the, the structure of composition,
12:36like how music would, why it's written the way it is in order to sound the way it sounds.
12:42I don't know why I was totally virtually ignorant at everything else, but with, with that came the
12:50understanding that I can create anything I want. And if I can get it out on manuscript, if I knew
12:57the
12:57language, I could get it out on paper and then there it is. So that's really a composer is the
13:06master and commander of their own ship, so to speak, you know, because they're all your ideas.
13:13Every little dynamic, every little phrase, every little articulation, you write it and it's there
13:20forever. And the musician knows how to read it and play it exactly the same way 200 years from now.
13:28Not that I expect, you know, the music will be played then, but, um, that is, uh, total control.
13:36Now, when you were a kid like that, did, did your parents recognize this in you and encourage you?
13:43I was very fortunate that my parents, um, supported my crazy guitar playing, especially,
13:50you know, when I'm playing the star spangled banner with my teeth at 13 and it sounds like hell,
13:55you know, they still were so supportive. It's, it, I don't know if they recognized any special time
14:05because you, you wouldn't know. I think if you see you, I would just look like another kid
14:11interested in music, but I knew, and I say this not, not to, you know, sound pretentious,
14:19but like in high school, in the music theory classes, in all other classes, I was
14:29average or below average at best, but music, I just knew it. And I could not understand how
14:36nobody else that I was going to school with was remotely as interested or could retain and
14:46understand the way I did music. It was just so obvious to me and everybody else. I was,
14:52I don't think, what is it, you know? And, uh, so that was, um, uh, you know, the, the,
15:02the calling card, so to speak, you know, so, you know, once I discovered composition,
15:10it was, uh, like heaven in a cup. I even wrote my first orchestra score in high school, but
15:16then I discovered Led Zeppelin, you know, and my brain, you know, the energy of rock and roll,
15:23which is just so great that like all those, you know, the years I spent with Dave Roth and
15:28Whitesnake, they were fantastic. You know, I got to really exercise that rock and roll energy,
15:35but for my music, my brain takes the composition side and the rock and roll side, and it kind of
15:41mixes it together and you get the crazy music I get. But when you're with Dave Lee Roth,
15:46and by the way, I've often argued that that might've been the greatest eighties rock band
15:50as far as I'm concerned with, you know, Billy Sheen and whatnot. When you're with Diamond Dave,
15:54um, did he just accept your ideas or was it kind of like Dave's ship he was running or did
15:59he just
16:00accept everyone's ideas? Well, people run their ship differently. Uh, some people need good, um, you
16:07know, generals and lieutenants and this kind of thing that they can delegate to. And in the situation
16:14with Dave, he needed for, especially the guitarist to bring music to the party. And then, so I would,
16:25and the other guys too would write and, um, present the songs and Dave would decide if he liked it
16:34and
16:34wanted to work on it or if it was shelved. So, you know, this is how you do it. It's
16:40nice to have
16:41an executive decision maker because there's no band arguing about whose song is going to be used or
16:51any of that. Uh, and many other things where it's just like, I don't know, you got to ask Dave,
16:56you know, it, it, it gets, it lets you off the hook. And also he was depending on myself and
17:04the
17:04band to bring music to him. He'd listen to it. If it struck a chord with him, he'd take the
17:09cassette
17:10and he'd get in his, in Panama, you know, which is that wild, wonderful red car that he has
17:18convertible. And he'd have his driver drive around and he'd sit in the back, listen and write lyrics
17:23to the demo. And then it would become a song. Was there ever a pressure or maybe even were you,
17:30maybe, you know, for lack of a better term, intimidated because he had just come out of a
17:35band with Eddie Van Halen or did that never even cross your mind? You're just going to do your own
17:40thing. Well, um, of course the, the potential to be tremendously intimidated was there,
17:49but I, I, that would mean that I had to compete with Edward and that's, that's a, an insane
17:56proposition. You know, I didn't, I didn't see myself competing with that, but how do you do that?
18:03Yeah. You know, I don't have that tone. I, I, he, I don't write music like that. He's a brilliant
18:11pop songwriter. And I just knew that I loved rock music. I could play it with great energy.
18:20Um, I love the Van Halen songs. I loved Edwards guitar parts. They're beautiful to play.
18:26They're guitar parts, you know, it's, it's no big mystery, but it's the way you play them. You know,
18:32nobody plays them like him. And I knew that, and I, and I didn't want to go into it feeling
18:38like, um,
18:41I had to copy him, so to speak, of course, the chords and the notes are the chords and the
18:47notes,
18:48but it's the way you play them. It's what you play around them. It's how you move.
18:53It's, uh, the solos you take, I wouldn't take his solos, you know, I mean, some certain parts of
19:02hot for teacher, that's a part of the song, you know? So you want to do that. But when it
19:08would
19:08come to the solo, I'm like, I'm like, I try to play Edwards stuff. I mean, I could play the
19:12notes,
19:14but why they're not going to sound the way he played them. And only I can play it to sound
19:21like
19:21me. So that seemed like my best bet. So I took it. I took those beautiful guitar parts and I
19:30just
19:30played them as me. Yeah. And I think I just saw, did I see a picture of you a couple
19:35weeks ago with
19:36Billy Sheen? Did you run into him somewhere? Oh, I ran into Billy all the time. I think we last
19:40time
19:41was recently at the Vegas, uh, yeah, that's what it was. That's right. I did see that. You know,
19:46when I talked to someone like yourself, you always have so many irons in the fire. And of course,
19:51like I said, the show coming up Thursday here in Detroit, you also got the record coming out
19:55with Joe Satriani. I just saw him, uh, I saw him over the summertime with Sammy at, um, and Sturgis
20:01and, uh, man, Joe, you know, I've only interviewed him and met him a couple of times. He seems like
20:07such a great guy and you've known him for 50 some odd years. What's he like to, to write with,
20:12write music with? Oh, Joe and I, this was one of my favorite records I ever made. It was my
20:18favorite
20:18collaboration because Joe has an inspired musical ear completely. And he's a, he's a melody fan.
20:27You know, if you listen to his records, first and foremost, there's melody that has legs that that's
20:36going to run into the future forever. I think, well, but, uh, he also has all this incredible
20:44technique and, uh, and, and, uh, and, uh, an affinity for the bizarre on the guitar. So we, we work
20:52together very well like that, but if I get a melody from Joe, uh, you know, it's not, there's
20:58nothing to that I could say about it because it's perfect. It's, it's Joe's refined. He's very refined
21:07and very, very classy in a way, you know, in the way that he shapes his melodies and the intention
21:15behind them. So if I get, um, one of his melodies, I, I have to contribute to it, uh, with
21:25a harmony
21:26or a doubling, you know, uh, or a rhythm part or anything. It, it, it, it happened many different
21:35ways. I would send him stuff. He would work on it. He'd send it back. I'd work on it. I'd
21:42send it back.
21:43He'd work on it. And it was really fun. I w I wouldn't say it was a situation where each
21:50other's contributions were accepted unequivocally, you know, I mean, we discussed most of the times.
21:59Yeah. Because they were worth it, but, um, there was, you know, we discussed certain things and
22:04the songs intentions and stuff. It was really great. And the record just, when you hear this
22:09record, if, if you're interested in this kind of stuff, you, you'll hear songs that you would never
22:14hear on a Satch record or a Vi record, you know, that we really kind of came together on a
22:20lot of
22:20songs to create something special. Yeah. 10 tracks, a sea of emotion. I mean, it's going to be released
22:27on November 6th, but sea of emotion right there. That's, that's, that's what you're looking for when
22:32you play music for someone, isn't it? Yeah. That's, uh, that's right up our alley. You know,
22:38that, that, those songs that all three of them, the sea of emotions one, the whole album,
22:44it's just very up our alley. Yeah. That's great. And did you write these with, with Joe? Were you
22:49guys together? Where's one of those things here in 2026 where, you know, you're on one part of the
22:54world and he's another part, or did you guys get together and jam or what? Yeah, it was remote.
22:57Yeah. Yeah. There's one space on the record where we're actually playing together in the same room,
23:04but I was 13 and he was like 16 and it was, uh, it's, uh, the beginning snippet of the
23:14sea of
23:14emotion part three reflections on a year and a half, because I was taking lessons from Joe for like two
23:21or
23:22three years. It started when I was 12 and, um, he had a tape recorder, a reel to reel. And
23:29one day he
23:30broke it out when I had been playing for a year and a half and we just started playing. And
23:36probably
23:3715 years after that, he sent me the tape and I digitized it and it was called reflections on a
23:43year and a half because that's how long I was playing. And I listened to it. It's about seven
23:50minutes of these teenage kids just exploring. And it was just so great. And every day, every week was
23:58like that with Joe when I was younger. So I took a piece of it and opened the song, the
24:03third movement
24:04with it, and then fleshed out a track based on what we were jamming on. That's pretty cool.
24:12That is really interesting. I wish I had, well, I don't wish I had any tapes of me DJ when
24:17I was a kid
24:17because they're all terrible, but, but, uh, yeah, that was, that's, that's an awesome idea.
24:21I can't wait. Yeah. Yeah. And then, and then there was some fretless stuff on there as well,
24:26if I'm not mistaken. And I think I saw, I, you know, Bumblefoot's one of my buddies and he,
24:31you know, and he, and, um, he says hello, by the way, so ask him about the show in Jakarta
24:36last year,
24:36but I mean, Bumblefoot, that guy can play anything. And the fretless thing that, that,
24:41that kind of gave you a little bit of hesitation. Well, you know, um, the fretless guitar playing it
24:49is an art. It is some, I know some people that can just do it, you know, uh, Frank did
24:56it well,
24:57really well. Zappa. Dweezil does it really well. Um, I do it, but I'm, you know, I'm not, uh,
25:07I'm not bulletproof with it. I I've never, I've never spent a lot of time with it. I've used it
25:11as effects, but Ron, he, I think he's the master because I've seen a lot of things that he does.
25:19His, his intonation on the fretless is stunning. That's really hard. And he's just so great at it.
25:27Yeah. That's awesome. Well, I'll tell you what, Steve, we'll, uh, cut you loose here. The, uh,
25:31record is coming out, like I said, on November 6th, a sea of emotion and, uh, the, the beat, uh,
25:36performance at, uh, at the Jack White theater coming up on Thursday. Hey, real fast. I have
25:41to mention, just thinking about this, as I'm sitting here talking to you that when I first
25:44got into radio back in the, in the stone age in 1990, my, one of my first bosses, his name
25:49was
25:49Art Wander. And I don't know if you ever met art, but he actually lived with Frank Zappa for a
25:53couple
25:53months in New York because he was programming an underground, like radio station. The programmers
25:59wanted him to really get the vibe for the city. That's great. I bet they had a blast.
26:06Yeah. He said, there's a lot of stories they can't tell, but I just thought that was interesting.
26:10Yeah, I bet. I toured with Frank. I, well, thank you so much. And I'm looking so forward to the
26:17show
26:17at the Jack White theater and, uh, the band is just, just pumping and it's the last time
26:24you get a chance to see this music performed. Yeah, that's great. Well, good luck with the show.
26:30Good luck with the album as well. And a safe travels and a Steve, thanks so much for your time.
26:34Really appreciate it. Thank you so much. Check out talking rock with meltdown on all podcast platforms
26:39and WRIF.com.