NEXA Lending and UMortgage join forces

HousingWire

On today’s episode, Editor in Chief Sarah Wheeler talks with NEXA Lending CEO Mike Kortas and UMortgage CEO Anthony Casa about NEXA’s acquisition of UMortgage and how that affects their roles, their employees and brokers throughout the industry.   Related to this episode:   NEXA Lending acquires UMortgage, adds Anthony Casa to exec team  https://www.housingwire.com/articles/nexa-acquires-umortgage-casa/  HousingWire | YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXDD_3y3LvU60vac7eki-6Q  HousingWire Mortgage Banking Summit – October 1  https://events.housingwire.com/mortgage-banking-summit-2026?utm_source=housingwire&utm_medium=website&utm_campaign=hwd_podcast_0727  More info about HousingWire  https://lnk.bio/housingwire   Want more from Sarah? Don’t forget to subscribe!  https://www.housingwire.com/subscribe/   The HousingWire Daily podcast brings the full picture of the most compelling stories in the housing market reported across HousingWire. Each morning, listen to editor in chief Sarah Wheeler talk to leading industry voices and get a deeper look behind the scenes of the top mortgage and real estate.

Transcript

00:09Welcome, everyone. My guests today are two former rivals who have now joined forces. We've got

00:15Nexa Lending CEO, Mike Cordes, and UMortgage CEO, Anthony Casa. We're going to talk about

00:20what Nexa's acquisition of UMortgage means for both of them, their employees, and the

00:25industry overall. Anthony, Mike, welcome to the podcast. Great to be here. Excited to

00:33be here. It's a big day. It's a big day. We really appreciate you making time to talk

00:39to our audience about this. Of course, they're very interested. We had a ton of traffic over

00:45the weekend when the story broke, and you guys have said this has been one of your busiest

00:49days, I can only imagine. So first off, what everyone's going to want to talk about before

00:53we get to the business? All the calls started heavy last night. The calls and the texts and

00:59the dialogues, and it's just progressed into today, obviously. I can only imagine. So I

01:05think the first thing that everyone wants to know is how did two people who had pretty different

01:10perspectives, you guys are both known as fighters for what you believe in and what you think

01:14is best for brokers, and maybe you were on opposite sides of that at different times very

01:18publicly. So from a personal level, how do you get past that?

01:23That wasn't really very hard to get past because Anthony and I basically sat down and had good

01:29conversations and realized we're not different people at the end of the day. We just had different

01:36organizations that competed at a high level. This is no different than a two-college rivalry,

01:41but at the end of the day, they still have this common goal in mind, right, at whatever they were

01:45doing. If they went to play into the pros together like Anthony and I are, then now it's time to

01:51bring

01:52those former rivals together into a pro game at this point. So we had the same ideology. So it's

02:02not like we started out as separate ideologies. We had the same exact ideologies of the broker

02:09network, the broker community, and the brokers are the way to go with this.

02:12And so once we got through the personal attacks and everything that we had and how we conducted

02:20our individual businesses and largely my attacks on Anthony and how he conducted his, I'll recognize

02:26that it wasn't hard to realize that we have the same goals in mind. We just want our loan

02:35officers to have the absolute best opportunity possible in the world for them. And so we just,

02:41we're both deathly passionate about providing value to our loan officers. And so the alignment

02:47wasn't hard. The cultures are relatively the same at the end of the day.

02:54Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I mean, it's like two people that are on opposite sides of the

03:01political spectrum. If they see each other at a political rally, they hate each other's guts.

03:05They see each other at a Philadelphia Eagles football game. They're both rooting for the

03:10Eagles. They'll be side by side, cheering their heads off, rooting for the Eagles.

03:13And like, I would never have a Cowboys fan.

03:16I was going to say the choice of the Eagles right off the bat.

03:21We still have disagreements.

03:25We 100% still have disagreements. But I think for Mike, when we sat down and we spent time

03:32together, it really was clear that we think the same way. Our philosophies are almost identical.

03:40Our value system is the same. And the minute we were no longer trying to fight each other and we

03:46were like, hey, let's let's do this together. All that stuff went away really quickly. Like there's

03:52zero, like there's zero tension or animosity or anything like that. Like we buried the hatch and

03:57we moved on really quickly. Well, let's talk about the business reasons why this made sense. Right.

04:04And Anthony would love to ask you, why were you excited about this?

04:08You know, there's a lot. I mean, I think it's funny because I spent my time at New Mortgage

04:14recruiting a lot of brokers and I would always say to them like, oh man, like being a broker

04:19owner stinks. Like come here. You don't want to deal with compliance and HR and running the

04:25business and all that stuff. Just focus on originating. And, you know, it became kind

04:29of a self-fulfilling prophecy here because like when I sat down with Mike, I was like, man,

04:32like they have, they have so much more greater economies of scale. I can go, our leaders can go

04:38there. We can focus on doing what we're best at, which is growing, recruiting, supporting

04:42our salespeople, doing the origination stuff without any of the expenses because we're

04:47now plugging into a platform that absorbs those expenses. So the business part of that

04:52was the easiest part. The numbers math immediately. And I've already had a dozen conversations today

04:57with broker owners where I'm like, hey man, if it maths for me at 2 billion, it's definitely

05:01going to math for you at 100 million or 150 million, whatever your broker shop is. So the numbers

05:06were the easy part. The hard part is the ego. That's the hard part. The hard part is like,

05:12hey, I'm the CEO today. I get to call the shots. I make, I run the meetings. I do all

05:17those things. And the truth of the matter is like, I think with my conversations with

05:22Mike is I built such a high level of trust in him and Jerry and their leadership team

05:27that to me, it was like, all right, like I don't need to be the guy. I can go there

05:30and be an executive partner. I can contribute at the highest level. I'll have a seat at the

05:34table. Our people will be well represented, but I don't need to be the guy. And I think

05:39that was actually the hardest part. I think that's the hardest part for a lot of

05:41broker owners too. Yeah, I'll second that. But let me just add to that conversation that

05:46the executive partner at Nexa is the highest position you can hold. And it's an earned

05:51title. You have to earn it. You don't get appointed to it, right? Like a CEO gets appointed. The

05:56executive partners decide if the CEO is doing the job or not. The executive partners are the

06:03ones who make the vote to say, okay, well, who's going to be the next? If anything happened

06:06to me or in the future to Jerry, right? Who takes over next? Those are the people who do

06:11that. If anything happens to me, my family knows. You go to the executive partners at Nexa for your

06:17advice. These are the folks who have the most to lose and will make sure the organization is working

06:23in a way that is good for the organization to be sustained and for the loan officers, of course.

06:30So you talked about executive partner and it turns out, Mike, that you're becoming an executive

06:36partner too. Tell us about that. Well, I've already earned the title of executive partner,

06:40so I'm already an executive partner at Nexa. But I am going to be relinquishing role of CEO. Quite

06:47frankly, I promoted Jerry to president five and a half months ago. And this was already in her path

06:54from the day I hired her almost a year ago is that the first six months where she had to

07:01understand the Nexa culture and the second six months, assuming that continued to come along is

07:06the Nexa culture had to accept her because let's not forget, she did come out of a retail environment.

07:12So they had to accept her and understand her ways. And she's done a great job putting a little bit

07:17more

07:17polished look on the organization, insisting that the online skirmishes must stop, drop the F-bombs

07:27as much in private. And she's done a good job of getting me to fix that. Not perfect, but she's

07:36done

07:36a great job in that. And then a lot of Nexons are really appreciative of that as well. And it's

07:40really

07:40helped. I mean, I think a lot of that is part of the reason that this could even happen is

07:44because

07:44I had to grow a little bit and I had to be willing to let go of certain controls. As

07:49long as I feel

07:50comfortable that the loan officers are getting what they want, the company is operating profitably and

07:54legally. That's what we go by. As long as they're doing those things, I'm perfectly fine to give up

08:01titles. Titles mean nothing to me, but executive partner is by far our most, our most valued title. So

08:07Anthony and I get the enjoyment now of being in all the leadership meetings, having a seat at the board,

08:14seat at the table, doing all the things that we are used to doing as the CEOs of our company,

08:20while we actually get to do the best part of this whole thing. The best part of this whole thing,

08:25the funnest part of this whole thing is the growth. It's the conversations. It's to be able to

08:29to brag about what we have and the things that we offer to loan officers and why this is the

08:34best

08:35platform. Now we can start doing the crazy things, right? One of the things we'll do our leadership,

08:39our executive partners retreats where we'll come together. And the biggest thing is like Anthony,

08:44myself, DuPont, Mike, you know, and Tyler's coming. He's got a couple of guys that are also

08:49going to be executive partners that next that they want on top of it, because they've all already

08:53earned the right of that many people that they brought into to their organization. So they get it,

08:57too. But this is where we, those things are where the executive partners decide the outcome of the

09:03company. The C-suite, they just have to execute those things. We're the ones who come up with the

09:08crazy ideas and to do things that just haven't been done. So having Anthony and his leadership team

09:16and as executive partners is just a blessing for all of Nexen's that we get. We can add, I mean,

09:23forget the fact that we're adding over $2 billion in volume and nearly 250 loan officers. We're adding

09:28some significant thinkers in this business who know how to, to really innovate things.

09:34Yeah. That's a, that's a big one, Sarah. Like, you know, you're talking about Tyler Hodges and

09:38Jimmy Hopps and like Ben Bell, like these are some really good entrepreneurial minds, people that own

09:43their own businesses before they came to you mortgage. I think that's, that's one of the biggest pieces

09:48of the acquisition is getting the, those types of people in the room to help contribute to the growth of

09:54the innovation of the organization, which, you know, all of them have, are eager to do and excited

09:59about the opportunity. Let's talk about the, the shareholders of you mortgage, right? So that,

10:04that was something really that you did from an operate, from an organizational standpoint, Anthony,

10:11that was really different. What, where do those shareholders stand now? Yeah. So the, the structure

10:16that we've put together, basically, this is an earn out, you know, an earn out agreement where,

10:21you know, it's all performance based as, as most of these earn out situations are. So, you know,

10:27as we fund production here over the next four to five years, they will, we, we will receive

10:34an earn out from Nexa to your mortgage holding group that hold the, those, those monies will then

10:41be distributed to shareholders equally. So like the scenarios, this is, you know, I own 48% of the

10:46company. So for every dollar that, that comes in from an earn out, you know, I get 48 cents.

10:51The shareholders get 52 cents and it'll get proportionally distributed to the shareholders

10:55based upon how much ownership they have. The key thing, and this is the biggest thing is like,

10:59the more we grow, the bigger the earn out is. And that, that was like the biggest thing from day

11:05one with Mike and I was like, Hey man, like we want it to be performance based, but you know,

11:10at the end of the day, we have to align your behavior, Anthony Casa's behavior. When you come here,

11:14you're not just getting a check and then riding off in the sunset, you know, I'm going there and I'm

11:18fully

11:19incentivized to grow this pie. And over four to five years, if, if I'm successful myself and our

11:26shareholders will not only get paid back, you know, our initial investments, but we'll, we'll get a

11:31significant return as well. So that's going to start in 2028, obviously 2027 will be our first full

11:37year of production there. And, you know, if we fund over $12 billion in volume over the first four years

11:43of this, uh, of this partnership, we get a fifth year of the earn out. And that's really what we're

11:48striving for. So I personally believe I'm a very optimistic person. Um, and I personally believe

11:54we're going to do a lot more than 12 billion. I think where this is going to be a minimum

11:58of $20

11:58billion in volume over five years. So I think our shareholders are going to be very richly rewarded,

12:02including myself, but, um, you know, we got to work and I'm already having conversations with some

12:07of the people that are shareholders that don't work with you mortgage currently about coming back and

12:12joining us and being part of this. So I think Mike's having some conversations as well. And our goal is,

12:16you know, let's, let's, let's bring the, let's, let's bring the band back together and make sure

12:21we get as many contributors here as possible. And those conversations are going really, really well.

12:28They're actually very much excited, um, to get that band back together. And those shareholders are

12:34really excited, um, because the culture that Anthony created amongst them was outstanding. They do want

12:39to help each other and they recognize it. If they come here back here, that all that production gets

12:44added to the top. So it's a rising tide, you know, rice is all ships mentality that Anthony's been able

12:50to create there. Let's talk about, you know, one of, one of the big cultural differences, right? Uh,

12:55you know, retail versus hold wholesale. Um, and, and Mike, when you guys rebranded to Nexcel lending,

13:02there are people who definitely were, you know, uh, alarmed by that, um, are probably not alarmed anymore.

13:08But when you think about like, are you a lender, you're a broker? How do you think about it?

13:13We did that as, as a, as a, almost a PR stunt, if you will. Right. Because I wanted the

13:19attention.

13:20I told our loan officers at Nexcel Fest, when we did it, that you're going to have everybody

13:24out there talking saying, Oh, they're going full retail now. And I says, we're not, we'll never be

13:29retail. My only point to rebranding Nexcel lending is to tell everybody that we are no different,

13:35right? We get to work with the same underwriters on the same files with the same lender. We just

13:39have more options. Anthony is no more you lending than he is you mortgage, just like Nexcel lending

13:47or Nexcel mortgage. It's, it's the same exact model. Nexcel was the same before and after.

13:52We just want to impress and make sure that all those folks who think there's a big difference

13:57between how we do business compared to how retail does business is not a big deal.

14:02The biggest difference is that we bear dramatically less risk the way we do business,

14:08which means we don't have to gouge the loan or we, we don't have the excuse to gouge the

14:13loan officer for massive margin. So our, our rates are better. Our product offerings are higher

14:18and our compensation is dramatically higher because we don't have those risks involved. And so it's no,

14:25Nexcel operates today the exact same way it operated a year ago before the lending. And it operates the

14:30exact same way that you mortgage operates. So there's no, no real difference in that. So,

14:35but it worked out wildly because here we are almost a year later from that branding and it,

14:40they're still talking about it. And I love it. And I told Nexcel stop with the fighting, right?

14:45And this is an example of why Anthony and Eric come together because we both grew and I grew and

14:48I'm

14:49like, no more, don't fight them. Let them talk, give them open dialogue questions and keep the dialogue

14:54coming. And they'll slowly understand, you know, that maybe, maybe this, this broker way of doing

15:01business in the correspondent world still works. And, and that's what we're proving.

15:06You know, I know you said that the personal part was easier, just like, you know, get getting over

15:11that part. But I mean, I have to ask you both, like, do you feel like it's because you got

15:15to a

15:15certain age where you just got mature enough that you wanted to talk? I mean, because, okay. Yeah.

15:19Once you met him, but like, why did you want to meet each other? Why, well, how did that happen?

15:24So what are you saying? It took me like till 49 to mature?

15:28I didn't say.

15:30So, cause that's when I really made my changes. I personally against Anthony and I had a real good

15:37walk in Philadelphia when we sat down face to face. Right. And the second day we did our walk,

15:42it was just him and I. Um, and we ended up at this, uh, little coffee shop,

15:47basement and coffee shop in downtown Philadelphia. I got to say that that coffee shop,

15:51I think did a lot for both of us. I almost choked up at that place. And, um, we got

15:56real personal

15:57and really understood that we're, we're not different. We both went through some things.

16:01We both went through some childhood things. Um, and then it caused us to be self-sabotaging

16:06people in some aspects, but we also now at an older age and after going through some things,

16:12right. Um, had to set the Eagles aside and recognize that we both recognize that in our

16:17lives at relatively the same times. And so it was really, Anthony was a little earlier than me.

16:22So I got to, we got to give him credit for that. Um, but, but again, it's, you know,

16:27is it maturity? Sure. I think I matured, you know, some more years ago, but in the context of fighting,

16:35right. Always feeling like life was a fight and somebody always had to be the enemy.

16:38I mean, that's the piece where I was able to mature from and kind of go away from it.

16:43And I strive every day to try and show the industry. I'm, I'm not the Mike 1.0 that,

16:48that they remembered me as an unblock me and, and, and have a dialogue with me. And I think you'll,

16:52you'll see a different me. I couldn't agree more. I mean, for me, I mean, obviously I've gone through,

16:59I've had, you know, I've had some humbling experiences happen to me over the last six,

17:03seven years, you know, public, you know, crash out with my role at aim. That was a really

17:08humbling experience for me and kind of like my rock bottom point. Um, but you know,

17:13sobriety has been a big part of my journey. Um, and I think going through that process of,

17:19you know, making amends and going through the 12 steps and doing all those things,

17:23um, it, it really is a humbling kind of experience. And, and I definitely have

17:27come on the other side of it and realized like, Hey, there's gotta be a better way. Like, like,

17:33like, like, like, like you don't need to dominate everybody. You don't need to,

17:38you know, be this overpowering force there. You can win. What's Dale Carnegie's book,

17:43you know, win people and win and influence people. Um, so I, I've tried a different approach.

17:49I'm still learning. And I think Mike will admit he's still learning too. We, we're, we're, we're,

17:54we're, we're kind of bouncing off each other with a lot of stuff, you know, more recently as well.

17:58Um, but at the end of the day, I think it's an evolution. You gotta remember like,

18:02you know, we're, we're still young guys. Like, I mean, I mean, at least I think we are,

18:07at least I'd like to believe we are, but, um, I, I, I think we've got a long ways to

18:13go,

18:13but we're, we're definitely accountable and we have surrounded ourselves with people that

18:17hold us accountable to our actions. And I think that's makes all the difference in the world.

18:23If you surround yourself with yes people, you're probably going to act like a buffoon a lot. If you

18:27surround yourself with people that hold you accountable, you know, you're going to probably

18:30mature and look in the mirror a little bit more often. I think it's going to be, um, it already

18:36has been maybe too inspiring to some people, honestly, because, you know, we're in a business,

18:41it can be cutthroat. Everybody, you know, I mean, we're in it to, to win it. Everybody is. And,

18:45and to see two guys who have been that way are still in it to win it, but, um, have

18:50clearly grown

18:51in a personal, you know, evolved personally. I just, I think it's great. So kudos to you both.

18:57Thank you. Um, along that line, we've seen retail. Um, one of the biggest stories of the

19:02last year has been the consolidation of retail, right? And how they are building an end-to-end

19:07or trying to an end-to-end machine. When you look at what Rocket's done and some other people have

19:11done to just, um, grow this. So let's talk about, uh, the future for wholesale and this kind of

19:17partnership that you guys are doing. Are we going to see more of it?

19:20I absolutely think we're going to see it, but the only reason you didn't see it, um,

19:25earlier in the wholesale space, quite frankly, is because broker owners can survive off less.

19:31They're used to it, right? So they, they didn't, they weren't unprofitable. Now, look,

19:36the longer rates stay elevated, the higher it becomes. Don't get me wrong, but, um,

19:42but, uh, brokers were able to hold out longer, but at the end of the day,

19:46right? Brokers are seeing and realizing, and it's not that anybody couldn't hold out,

19:50but brokers are seeing and realizing that, wait a minute, if we come together though,

19:53we can keep our brand, right? We don't, we can keep our leadership intact. Uh, we can just operate

19:59under the different, under an ecosystem that already has these things built out. So, I mean,

20:05for example, you know, you mentioned the rocket things and then the, the different mergers out

20:09there, you know, we have servicing available to us, MSR retainment available to us. Now,

20:14no other brokers ever had that in history. And so we provide something uniquely available to our teams

20:20that is just why it was, is not widely available. It was, you know, retail gets MSRs, retail gets all

20:26that, that stuff, the retaining. Now we get that too, and we're going to provide that. And so the

20:31attention that we're getting, um, just from the evil and thing alone, um, is incredible. Um,

20:38it's massive and people realize, uh, how much is, is in the, in the data.

20:43Yeah. And I'll, I'll say like, there's also, there's such a different broker world today than

20:47there was in the past. Like, you know, we had garden state home loans, you know, back in 20,

20:53you know, up until 2016, 2017, we were the number one broker in the country up until that point.

20:59And we were doing $1.8 billion a year. And we were number one, $1.8 billion a year today

21:04in the

21:05broker world, you don't, you're not a top 20, you know, player, you know, these guys are on pace to

21:11do $1.8 billion a month. So I think the reason why the dynamics changing is like, there's some

21:17powerhouses in the broker world now that have the economies of scale and the economics to make it

21:23make sense to do these acquisitions, which I think the bigger Nexa gets, um, the more of these deals,

21:30the bigger the deals they can do. And the more of these deals they can do, the small ones are

21:33the

21:33easier ones. The bigger ones is when it becomes a little bit more challenging. But I think in the

21:38past, it's always been a one way street where it's like, if there's going to be an acquisition,

21:41it's going to be a retail lender acquiring a broker shop. Like that's always been the case.

21:45That game is completely changing where now, you know, through, through Nexo, that's one of the

21:51areas I'll be spending a lot of time on is like, how do we roll up broker shops? How do

21:55we do these

21:56acquisitions? Um, and, and without the golden handcuffs that a lot of broker shot, like if you

22:01go retail, you know, you get a three year clawback and you're, you're kind of tied into the company.

22:06So, you know, they jack up your pricing or something. You really don't have control in this world.

22:10You still have all the independence, but you, you know, you roll up under a bigger platform.

22:15And it's not just brokers though. We have, um, you know, one in $200 million

22:21retail IMBs that are already coming over as well. So there's a lot of these things happening right

22:26now. And so they're recognizing that it doesn't necessarily make sense for those small IMBs to

22:31roll up and just roll into another retail shop. I always say, if you, why are you trading a bank

22:36for a bank? If you're going to make a change, um, come to a model that, that has proven long

22:41-term

22:41growth and we can all grow together. And they're seeing that. And then just the results of, um,

22:47this merger in the last, not even 24 hours, I can't tell you how many opportunities have come

22:53our way from other, um, broker owners right now. Um, so this isn't gonna slow down for us. This is,

23:00if anything, this is going to escalate. It is a reality.

23:05Well, we'll, we'll have to get back together in six months and talk about the mega business

23:09that you guys have rolling all these people up. I did want to ask about technology.

23:13Um, right. Because, uh, Anthony, like tempo, what, what happens to some of the technology that,

23:18that you've developed, uh, for your people?

23:21Yeah. You know, we're, we're really excited about that. Something Mike and I spent a good

23:24amount of time on, obviously they're, uh, they're in the process, the next of the families in the

23:29process of developing a platform called Bevery, which is, uh, very much in flight and, um, going

23:34to be launched here fairly soon if it hasn't already started with a pilot group. Um, our goal

23:39is to get tempo integrated into Bevery and to become part of the ecosystem. Um, I think, you know,

23:45in the short term, next three to six months, it'll probably continue to be exclusive to the

23:49mortgage team that's already on the platform. And we're going to work through a plan with Jason

23:53Dupont, the COO and the team there to figure out how do we get this integrated and available to all

23:58the Nexons. Um, obviously that's a sales performance ecosystem. It's not an LOS and it's, it's really

24:05what's been the backbone of getting our LOs to fund three loans a month. And that's kind of one of

24:10the

24:10big things Mike and I talked about is like, Hey, we, we really want to help our, you know, we've,

24:14they've got 4,000 LOs. We really want to help that bottom 2000 LOs get from, you know,

24:20half a loan a month, uh, two to three loans a month. So it's a big part of the future.

24:24We just are working through the roadmap of how we bring that to life.

24:28And I'll double down on his, his, his tempo product, because the one thing that you mortgage,

24:33I'm super excited. They get to bring to the table for all the Nexo loan officers. Um,

24:39our systems like that mentoring and training and accountability,

24:43that is something that Anthony and his team are just excelling at their loan count per loan

24:50officer is dramatically higher than ours. And if he can just bring a little bit of that flavor,

24:57um, into Nexa, um, our volumes can double over if our volumes could easily double overnight,

25:04if he can just bring that flavor over to Nexa a little bit. So.

25:07Yeah. I mean, without adding one loan officer, you know,

25:10if we can add one loan per loan officer, you know, Nexa can easily get to $20 billion without

25:15adding one more additional LO. So that's a pretty exciting opportunity for us. That's,

25:20that's one of the things that our sales leaders are really excited about the opportunity to do

25:24as a part of this partnership. Um, it seems like there's a lot of evolution going on in,

25:29in wholesale all over the place, right? Um, where does that leave? Um, where do you think

25:33aim is right now? You mentioned it earlier, Anthony, obviously a passion project for you earlier. Um,

25:38where does aim fit in this new world? You know, I think, I think aim is, is an incredible piece

25:44of

25:44the puzzle. I think, I think right now, um, that organization has gone through its own evolution.

25:49Um, and I think right now, Jonathan is doing an incredible job of making it a, a very valuable trade

25:58association to the broker community. I think this is going to be the best fuse that they've ever had.

26:03Um, I think ultimately, like for me, I I I'm, I'm really interested in being more involved. I've,

26:09I've kind of been out of aim for going on five, six years now since I departed. Um, but you

26:15know,

26:15I I've offered my services. I I'm, I've nominated, uh, I'm nominated to, uh, serve in the director of

26:21membership role, which they're having to vote for over the next 30 days. Um, so I'm really excited

26:26about the team at aim. They're doing a heck of a job. I think they're instrumental for the broker

26:29community. It's a very siloed community sometimes and having these elixirs that bring the community

26:36together really is what's made the, the, the channel grow as a whole. I know Mike's a huge

26:41supporter of aim and he's, he's, uh, built an enterprise, uh, partnership with them where

26:46every next, uh, team member is a member of aim. So I, I, I don't want to speak for him,

26:51but I, I think

26:51we're both in agreeance that we want to support the organization as much as humanly possible.

26:55Oh yeah. We, we have huge support, um, for aim. Um, and I, I believe firmly in the direction

27:02Jonathan is taking it. And, um, like I said, we did a, we, we support them so much that we,

27:09we worked out a deal where every one of our loan officers become members. Um, we want to make sure

27:14that the AIM fuse events, um, are some of the biggest there are at the end of the, you know,

27:19that they've, they've ever seen. Uh, I remember when Anthony was doing those AIM fuse events and the

27:23crowds were enormous. Right. And I think, you know, we can, um, we can get, um, aim back to that.

27:29No problem with, with their current leadership. Mike, Anthony, thank you so much for being on

27:34talking to our audience. Uh, lots of exciting things happening. We will be following along

27:38and talk to you guys again soon. Absolutely. Thank you. Appreciate you.

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