Trump PANICS as DEFIANCE Mission Launches | Scott Goodstein - video Dailymotion

Scott Goodstein

Trump's pressure on our troops MUST BE STOPPED.  DEFIANCE members are joined by expert panelists and organizations delivering real measures to support our military in DEFYING Trump.

Transcript

00:00:02This is Defiance Daily, Dispatches for the Defiant.

00:00:05Hello, I am your host, Miles Taylor, and as always, Wednesday is a special day.

00:00:11This is our weekly mission briefing.

00:00:13This is the day of the week where we talk about real actions we are taking.

00:00:17This is the day where we take doom scrolling and we put it to the side for a little bit

00:00:21and we talk about real, actual, concrete things we can do and you can do

00:00:25to push back against abuses of power and the lawlessness that we are seeing in our country.

00:00:32Now, that doesn't mean we're going to not talk about the news because we're going to do that first.

00:00:35We're going to talk about why this week's mission is so important,

00:00:39and our first panel will discuss that.

00:00:41But our focus today, our focus this week is on illegal orders.

00:00:46Our focus is on this controversy that has been bubbling up in Washington

00:00:52about the potential that members of the military are on the receiving end of manifestly unlawful orders.

00:00:59A lot of concern about this on Capitol Hill.

00:01:02A lot of concern about this in the mid to lower ranks inside the Pentagon.

00:01:06And so we're going to discuss that today.

00:01:08And first, we'll do that on a panel where we have special guests.

00:01:11We will be joined by former Republican Congressman Denver Riggleman.

00:01:15We will be joined by the incredible Glenn Kirshner, backed by popular demand, by the way.

00:01:21So many Defiance.org members wanted to see Glenn again, and we are thrilled to have him.

00:01:25And we'll also be joined by Seneca Project founder and former Lincoln Project senior advisor, Tara Setmeyer.

00:01:33And then after that, we've got a conversation with the team that's going to be working with Defiance.org

00:01:40to go and implement the campaign that we announced yesterday,

00:01:44but which we're going to give you the full details on today.

00:01:47We will also be joined by Scott Goodstein, Barack Obama's former social media guy,

00:01:52to talk about how we are going to raise public awareness across the country

00:01:56to make sure U.S. service members know their rights and have access to legal resources if they need it.

00:02:04And then you will get reminded why this program every Wednesday turns into Pro-Democracy Oprah,

00:02:11because we will make an announcement.

00:02:13And if you already thought that we put it all out there, well, we didn't yet.

00:02:17There's still more to tell you about this campaign than we've put out publicly,

00:02:21so stay tuned for that later in the program.

00:02:25And finally, our daily segment, Who is Joining the Defiance?

00:02:30We have another surprise today.

00:02:31I did not think this was going to be a name I would utter in the same sentence as the

00:02:36word defiance,

00:02:37at least not in a good way.

00:02:38But here we are.

00:02:41Well, then finally, finally, we'll talk a little bit more about the president's speech tonight.

00:02:46And if you want to stay up late with us, you can.

00:02:49The president is scheduled to make an address to the nation in the Oval Office at 9 p.m. Eastern.

00:02:54We will be covering that live and then afterwards assessing the speech.

00:03:00So if you want to join us later for a special edition of Defiance Daily,

00:03:04you can do that tonight during the president's speech and afterwards.

00:03:08Okay, first, let me take us into what we do at the top end of this program every Wednesday.

00:03:13What is the defiance win of the week?

00:03:16And I will tell you this, as the deadline narrows to extend the Affordable Care Act subsidies,

00:03:22right, these are the health care insurance subsidies everyone's been worried about.

00:03:26You, me, anyone who has health care and doesn't want to see that check jump at the top of the

00:03:32year.

00:03:33Well, here's what happened today.

00:03:34Speaker Mike Johnson was hit from inside his own party with defiance.

00:03:41CBS News tells the story.

00:03:43Breaking news at this hour, in defiance of Republican House Speaker Mike Johnson,

00:03:48four Republicans signed on to a Democrat petition to force a vote on extending Affordable Care Act tax credits set

00:03:54to expire January 1.

00:03:56Check your watch, everybody.

00:03:57That's very soon.

00:03:58Once that happens, that expiration, without a deal in Congress,

00:04:01health care premiums for millions of Americans are expected to do this, go way up.

00:04:06Last night, a House committee moved to vote on a GOP health care plan that excluded those Affordable Care Act

00:04:11credits.

00:04:11Well, today's move likely sets up a vote on an ACA extension, at least kicking the can down the road

00:04:17to early January.

00:04:18One of those defying House Speaker Mike Johnson is New York Republican Mike Lawler.

00:04:23Here's what he had to say on the takeout last night on GOP efforts to stop the extension vote.

00:04:30It's idiotic and it's political malpractice.

00:04:33To me, this is the height of absurdity.

00:04:36It is precisely why things don't get done in this place, because people would rather the upper hand or the

00:04:42issue or the political win rather than the hard work of bipartisan compromise.

00:04:48So let me give you the details here, folks.

00:04:50There are four Republicans who broke with GOP leadership.

00:04:53One was Mike Lawler of New York.

00:04:55You just saw him in the clip.

00:04:56Brian Fitzpatrick of Pennsylvania.

00:04:58Rob Bresnahan of Pennsylvania.

00:05:00And Ryan McKenzie of Pennsylvania.

00:05:02There's some defiance in the water there in Pennsylvania.

00:05:04And yesterday, Speaker Mike Johnson admitted that about a dozen Republicans wanted a vote, even though he refused to allow

00:05:13one.

00:05:13Now, here's the reality check. While this move does give Democrats the votes needed to force an action, the vote

00:05:19will likely not take place before Congress adjourns for the two week holiday recess.

00:05:24That's not good news for you and me and anyone else who's worried about those subsidies.

00:05:28House rules require seven legislative days before a discharge petition like this can happen.

00:05:33So this isn't going to go anywhere until the new year, and it's not going to go anywhere before those

00:05:38subsidies expire.

00:05:39However, what I will say is the takeaway here is that we're not doomed because the Republican Party under Donald

00:05:48Trump says that they don't want to do anything on health care and they don't want to vote.

00:05:52There are enough defiant members still in that caucus speaking out and willing to do something.

00:05:58And as I noted, Lawler isn't the only one who's doing that speaking out.

00:06:02Brian Fitzpatrick told reporters this today in responding to the news.

00:06:05Unfortunately, he said it is House leadership themselves that have forced this outcome.

00:06:12It's pretty extraordinary right now in Donald Trump's Washington, where Republican leaders see themselves as Darth Vader with a vice

00:06:18like chokehold on their party members to have those party members break, break ranks and call them out.

00:06:25Now, Lawler and Johnson were seen today in what seemed to be a heated argument on the floor.

00:06:29And upon his exit from the floor, the press swarmed Speaker Johnson.

00:06:33And this is what he had to say.

00:06:35Have you lost control of the House?

00:06:37I have not lost control.

00:06:38Because this is the third time.

00:06:40There are, look, we have the smallest majority in U.S. history.

00:06:45These are not normal times.

00:06:47There are processes and procedures in the House that are less frequently used when there are larger majorities.

00:06:54So when you have the luxury of having 10 or 15 people who disagree on something, you know, you don't

00:07:00have to deal with it.

00:07:02I have not lost control of the House.

00:07:05That's the type of quote you say when you have lost control of the House.

00:07:09But we'll get to that another time.

00:07:11Anyway, the defiance win of the week is that we are seeing Republican members of Congress break ranks, stand up

00:07:18for what's right and force the issue.

00:07:21Okay, folks, that takes us into our conversation today about the weekly mission.

00:07:28And our weekly mission is focused on this campaign that Defiance.org is going to be launching with our partners

00:07:34at WhistleblowerAid.org.

00:07:36That campaign is called Obey Only Lawful Orders.

00:07:39We're going to give you the details on that in a little bit.

00:07:42But first, I want to talk about the latest with the boat strike controversy because this is what prompted all

00:07:49of this.

00:07:49This is what prompted us to think about what could we do in response to the president's efforts to intimidate

00:07:55service members, to get them to shut up, to get them to be afraid of exposing the possibility of manifestly

00:08:03illegal conduct.

00:08:04And we decided on this campaign.

00:08:06And that controversy that led to this only gets worse.

00:08:10And I want to talk about that today with our guests.

00:08:13First, let me bring in Denver Riggleman, former Republican congressman.

00:08:17This man knows a thing or two about being a defiant Republican member of Congress.

00:08:21Denver, I assume you had some flashbacks as you saw that first segment.

00:08:25I did.

00:08:26You know, I know Brian pretty well, Fitzpatrick.

00:08:29So it was pretty incredible to see that.

00:08:30But again, he's got to win, right?

00:08:32So stupidity is terminal.

00:08:34And I think that Mike Johnson's finding out pretty quick.

00:08:37Well, it looks like they've gotten a little bit of courage through osmosis with you as their friend, Denver.

00:08:43Let's also bring in Glenn Kirshner, former federal prosecutor, just a total rock star.

00:08:51And I got to tell you, I wasn't sure if I was going to say this right at the top

00:08:54end.

00:08:55But Glenn is responsible in large part for what we're going to be talking about today, because a few weeks

00:09:01ago, you may remember Glenn seeded this idea in our minds about doing something on this issue.

00:09:07of unlawful orders.

00:09:10So, you know, Glenn, I don't know if you're going to want to take credit or not, but here we

00:09:13are.

00:09:14You know what?

00:09:14I will take credit for anything that helps service members navigate the dangerous circumstances that the Trump administration is putting

00:09:22them in.

00:09:24And so I'm all in giving accurate information to our service members to keep them from getting jammed up.

00:09:32Because, Miles, and as Denver well knows, if you disobey what turns out to be a lawful order, you could

00:09:38be court-martialed.

00:09:39If you obey what turns out to be an unlawful order, you can be court-martialed.

00:09:44I know because I was an active-duty Army JAG prosecutor for six and a half years before joining the

00:09:50Department of Justice.

00:09:51This is to help service members avoid getting themselves in trouble, because the Trump administration is endangering our military members.

00:10:01There you have it, folks.

00:10:02Well, you know, Glenn, you're going to get more than a participation trophy from us for all of that.

00:10:07Let me also bring in our third guest, Tara Setmeyer, founder of the Seneca Project.

00:10:12Hello, my friend.

00:10:13How are you?

00:10:13Gosh, you always just have the most delightful, festive holiday setup there.

00:10:17Look at that.

00:10:17You make Denver look like a total slop tart.

00:10:20Thanks a lot, Miles.

00:10:22Oh, my gosh.

00:10:23Well, I love Denver, and he could never be such things.

00:10:27But thank you.

00:10:28Listen, we all need a little holiday cheer.

00:10:31It's been a tough year.

00:10:32It's been a tough holiday season.

00:10:34And I'm always here to bring a bit of a bright spot to that.

00:10:37I love it.

00:10:38It's great to have you guys.

00:10:39And we're actually going to expand this group.

00:10:41This is going to be like the new Fox 5, because we've got one more person to add in, because

00:10:45of scheduled conflicts on our end.

00:10:47We're welcoming the remarkable Andrew Bacay, former CIA officer, former intelligence officer, world-class lawyer, whistleblower attorney, and a guy

00:10:56who knows what it means to defend people who want to stand up for what's right.

00:11:00Andrew, welcome, and thank you for joining us, my friend.

00:11:02Thank you for having me on.

00:11:04This is a pleasant surprise.

00:11:05Guys, some of my favorite people are all on screen together.

00:11:08Yeah, it just kind of happens, you know?

00:11:09We should just leave while we're ahead.

00:11:11What a great panel, guys.

00:11:12This was fantastic.

00:11:13Thank you for joining us today.

00:11:15This was fantastic.

00:11:17Let's jump in.

00:11:17Look, Denver, I'm going to start with you, because I'll play this clip first, and I want your reaction on

00:11:22the back end.

00:11:23This is what Pete Hegseth had to say about all of the controversy around the boat strikes and this strike

00:11:29on September 2nd, and the video, the video of that second strike that's been so debated, where it allegedly shows

00:11:37two people on an overturned boat, unarmed, probably trying to save their own lives before they're hit with another airstrike.

00:11:44And here's what Pete Hegseth had to say about why they can't release that video to the public.

00:11:48We're also going to, tomorrow, allow the Hask and Sask to see the unedited video of the September 2nd, alongside

00:11:56with Admiral Bradley, who has done a fantastic job, has made all the right calls, and we're glad he'll be

00:12:01there to do it.

00:12:02But in keeping with longstanding Department of War policy, Department of Defense policy, of course, we're not going to release

00:12:09a top-secret, full, unedited video of that to the general public.

00:12:14Hask and Sask and appropriate committees will see it, but not the general public.

00:12:25Denver, why are they hiding the ball?

00:12:28Well, let me tell you.

00:12:29First of all, you know, maybe they should be on signal chat.

00:12:32We'd figure it all out right now.

00:12:33But I think the real issue that I have with all this, Miles, and I'll be honest, is that I

00:12:38was on the other end.

00:12:39It's incredible to have this panel, especially JAG officers, intelligence.

00:12:44You know, Tara, I don't know if you know, she has a long history in government service.

00:12:47But I was the one, you know, a week after 9-11, I had to deploy to Diego Garcia with

00:12:51the B-1s and the B-52s.

00:12:53And I did the mission planning with the JAG over my shoulder.

00:12:56And even after 9-11, we were able to, you know, literally do legal things.

00:13:02And, of course, we were very angry.

00:13:04But looking at collateral damage, you're looking at rainbow patterns and frag patterns for bombs, whatever type of bombs they

00:13:09are.

00:13:10I find it amazing when Hegseth comes on there and says he actually can't declassify when they've showed all these

00:13:15other videos.

00:13:16And my guess is this, they can declassify it.

00:13:19I wonder what kind of ordinance they used as a dump target type of ordinance.

00:13:22Let me explain this, Miles.

00:13:23So at the beginning, you have specific types of ordinance you're going to lay down on a target.

00:13:27If they're doing a come around, right, they have to get, they have ROE, or they have to get permission

00:13:31in order to engage that target.

00:13:33And I'm wondering if they're not showing it because the engagement of that target would show the helplessness of the

00:13:37individuals,

00:13:38because it's very easy to redact or to blur out the specific type of weaponry or what they're looking at

00:13:44specifically on their HUD,

00:13:45their heads-up display, or actually on their targeting platform.

00:13:48So, you know, I'm sorry I got a little bit technical there, Miles, but that's the issue that I have

00:13:51with this.

00:13:52And, of course, you get that.

00:13:54And if you can show the other strikes, there's no other reason not to show this strike unless there's some

00:13:59really bad stuff in it.

00:14:00And I know that's a technical term, the really bad stuff.

00:14:02But as a mission planner and somebody who knows ordinance, I have to tell you, I think the reason they're

00:14:07not shown isn't because of classification,

00:14:09because it's, I would say it's because of the horror of what the American people would witness.

00:14:13Well, we got a JAG here with us.

00:14:15You know, Glenn, what do you make of Denver's assessment and speculation about why they might not be doing this?

00:14:22Yeah, a couple of things.

00:14:24So I think it is the horror.

00:14:26I think they understand that it will galvanize, you know, the opposition.

00:14:31And the opposition are people who are against not just homicide, but murder.

00:14:37Homicide is simply death at the hands of another.

00:14:40It doesn't connote criminal conduct.

00:14:42But what they did in international waters is murder.

00:14:45And I'm only sorry that we're getting distracted by the second tap, the so-called second tap, because all of

00:14:51the first taps were murder as well.

00:14:53There are military experts that we may be getting into that when we talk about your new project here, Miles.

00:14:59But, you know, guys like Dan Maurer, who taught constitutional law and criminal law at West Point.

00:15:05He's currently a law professor.

00:15:06Guys like Frank Rosenblatt, the president of the National Institute of Military Justice.

00:15:11I mean, when you talk to the experts in this area, there is no lawful justification under domestic law, international

00:15:19law, the law of war, the law of armed conflict, which this ain't.

00:15:23There's no justification for it.

00:15:25So when Pete Hegseth, you know, releases every damn video that looks like a video game where they're blowing, you

00:15:32know, boats out of the water, but you don't see the carnage.

00:15:35You don't see the human suffering.

00:15:37So, you know, maybe the murder isn't front and center.

00:15:41And then when he has one where I suspect the murder is front and center, he makes up reasons.

00:15:46I don't believe a word that comes out of Pete Hegseth's mouth.

00:15:49But the other thing that Denver said is when when he was engaged in, you know, war planning, he had

00:15:54the Jags, you know, standing, you know, shoulder to shoulder with him to make sure we were doing it lawfully.

00:16:00And, you know, what what has Pete Hegseth said?

00:16:03He doesn't want the Jags anywhere near military operations because they're obstacles, they're impediments to his maximum lethality.

00:16:13The problem is Hegseth wants maximum lethality with minimum legality or no legality at all.

00:16:20He's doing a disservice not only to the people that he's murdering, ordered murdered in international waters, but he's endangering

00:16:27our troops in the process.

00:16:29Well, so, Tara, I've got a question for you in a second.

00:16:32I want to show you a clip of one of the center senators who's seen the video and get your

00:16:36reaction to it.

00:16:37But but first, Andrew Bakai, I want to throw a question to you, which is that amidst all of this,

00:16:44Donald Trump's response has been threats and intimidation truly at a level that we've never seen from an American president.

00:16:52We've never, ever in the history of the republic seen an American president sit there and accuse sitting U.S.

00:17:00senators and congressmen of sedition and that they should be hanged simply because they restated the law.

00:17:07They just restated something written in the law and now that's happened and it's created this quite extraordinary chilling effect.

00:17:14I want to know how you assess that chilling effect.

00:17:17I mean, you are on the front lines of representing whistleblowers.

00:17:20You yourself have been a whistleblower.

00:17:22You have served in government.

00:17:23Is this making people afraid to come forward and sound the alarm about potentially illegal conduct?

00:17:30I think the answer is probably yes and no.

00:17:33I mean, first, Donald Trump is all bluster.

00:17:36We see that he attacks people, personally attacks people online, in the press, in speeches.

00:17:45That's who he is.

00:17:47But when when when it comes down to it, he's he's more bark than bite.

00:17:52With respect to the chilling effect of the whistleblowers coming forward, I have to say that we've actually seen a

00:17:57lot of whistleblowers come forward.

00:17:59And more importantly, we've seen senior officials come forward because the because that's effectively who's left in the government now.

00:18:07Right. I mean, he has terminated.

00:18:09He's fired a ton of federal employees.

00:18:14The the one thing that I will say that we've seen is that, you know, this is where we're trying

00:18:18to mitigate the fear is that there is a way for whistleblowers to come forward anonymously.

00:18:23So, you know, in the past, and I've done this in the Ukraine whistleblower matter, is that we've been able

00:18:28to protect the identity of the whistleblower.

00:18:30So that way they don't face retribution, whether it is through adverse personnel actions or being doxed online.

00:18:39So, for example, I've recently been able to facilitate disclosures to various offices, both in the executive branch and to

00:18:49Capitol Hill, where I'm the relator of the information.

00:18:52And if there needs to be clarifying, you know, evidence being produced, the congressional offices or the investigators can reach

00:19:02out to me and I can facilitate that information.

00:19:04So there is a way for people to come forward lawfully and in a secure way.

00:19:10And I will say, look, you know, there's the old adage where there's smoke, there's fire, and there is a

00:19:17whole lot of fire somewhere here in this administration.

00:19:19We are seeing so many indications of illegality and y'all, Andrew, are the firefighters at whistleblower aid.

00:19:28And so you're the ones who respond and you do that in a very disciplined way that protects people, as

00:19:33you noted.

00:19:34I want to get back to that in a moment.

00:19:35But first, Tara, like I said, I want to play this clip because Senator Tammy Duckworth has seen this video.

00:19:42None of us here have seen the video.

00:19:43We've only heard the speculation.

00:19:45She has seen the video of that strike.

00:19:48And here's what she had to say yesterday.

00:19:51Joining us, Illinois Democratic Senator Tammy Duckworth.

00:19:54Duckworth is a member of both the armed services and the foreign affairs committees.

00:19:59Thank you very much for joining us, Senator.

00:20:01Can you give us a rundown on what you heard today?

00:20:06Well, I heard a lot of chest-thumping, but not a lot of answers to the questions that I still

00:20:11have.

00:20:12And I would have to agree with the discussion you're having right now, which is I think the president is

00:20:17trying to lead us into yet another forever war that Americans don't want.

00:20:20If this is justifiable, then come to Congress.

00:20:23We have the power to declare a war.

00:20:26Come to us and ask for an authorization for use of military force.

00:20:29The fact of the matter is they're not doing that.

00:20:32And if they truly were going to go after drug traffickers and the president would not have pardoned the former

00:20:37president of Honduras who trafficked over 400 tons of cocaine into the United States.

00:20:42So what exactly is he trying to do here?

00:20:45So Duckworth there, of course, talking about how these strikes are being used as a partial predicate predicate to escalate

00:20:53things in Venezuela and lead us to war.

00:20:55Duckworth also, Tara, later in the day came out and said, based on what she has seen, these orders look

00:21:04to her to be illegal.

00:21:06What she saw in that video looks illegal.

00:21:08And then, Tara, we saw Senator Chris Murphy from Connecticut come out and say the same thing.

00:21:15He said, based on what I have seen, this looks like it's unlawful.

00:21:19We saw Ed Markey say the same thing.

00:21:21We saw Senator Richard Blumenthal basically say the same thing.

00:21:24I mean, senator after senator, congressman after congressman is coming forward and saying, look, I'm getting brief behind closed doors

00:21:30and looks like an awful lot of lawbreaking here.

00:21:33Do you think this is going to boil over to the point that the public is going to be able

00:21:39to see this?

00:21:41Well, first of all, I want to acknowledge that Senator Duckworth is an American hero who lost her legs in

00:21:48combat as a helicopter pilot, Purple Heart recipient, and is more of a warrior and exhibits the warrior ethos than

00:21:57cosplaying G.I.

00:21:58Joe wannabe Pete Hegseth any day.

00:22:01So I'm going to take her word and what she saw and her perspective over Pete Hegseth's.

00:22:07That's number one.

00:22:08Number two, they don't have anything.

00:22:11These senators who have come out, who have seen this video, have nothing to lose or run cover for by

00:22:19being honest and telling us what they saw.

00:22:21The Republican senators have a political agenda.

00:22:25They're trying to run cover for Donald Trump and Pete Hegseth and the illegality that they're involved in.

00:22:31Because guess what? Every single one of those people voted for this.

00:22:36They voted Pete Hegseth into office.

00:22:38They voted for this level of incompetence, this extrajudicial approach to doing things.

00:22:44They were warned.

00:22:45They knew how Donald Trump felt about the military, how he feels about the Constitution, how he feels about the

00:22:51rule of law.

00:22:51He's a felon.

00:22:53He's you know, Miles, and the people who follow, you know how Donald Trump approaches these types of things.

00:23:00Why can't you just shoot him in the leg or why can't we put up a, you know, a moat

00:23:03with alligators?

00:23:04He doesn't care what the law is.

00:23:06And he made sure someone like Pete Hegseth would be installed in that position and then gets rid of all

00:23:12of the people who would hold them accountable in the legal space so they can do just this.

00:23:17They are going to do everything they can to make sure the American people never see the actual video come

00:23:23to light.

00:23:24Because if they do, to the same point everyone else is making here, most people will be horrified.

00:23:29And it will be difficult for all of the legal eagle eyes who know better to sit there and justify

00:23:37it.

00:23:38It's they can't.

00:23:39When you see it in real time, it's much more difficult to defend.

00:23:43This way you can still have the allure, it's interpretation, it's behind closed doors.

00:23:47But I would tend to lean on the side of the people who don't have any kind of political, any

00:23:54kind of politics to gain from lying about it.

00:23:57Well, I will say one caveat there, and maybe this is a bright light in all of this, is today

00:24:06Donald Trump got spanked by the U.S. Senate on this.

00:24:10The defense bill came up, and in a 77 to 20 vote, they voted to send it to the president's

00:24:18desk.

00:24:18And in that bill, there is a condition that demands that the video be released.

00:24:26And now, look, I mean, my caveat here is I think what they did in that demand is they're going

00:24:31to hold part of Pete Hegseth's travel budget hostage until they release that video.

00:24:37So there's plenty of time they could drag this out.

00:24:40I think it's 25% of his travel budget.

00:24:42So I don't know, you do the math on that, you know, Pete Hegseth could go three-fourths of the

00:24:46way into the next fiscal year without having to worry about his plane getting grounded before they need to make

00:24:51some sort of decision.

00:24:52But it's at least something.

00:24:54And so, Denver, I want to throw that one to you because you voted on those defense bills before.

00:24:58Do you think this is going to be enough leverage to get them to do the right thing here?

00:25:04Or do you think the administration is going to keep playing the shell game with this thing?

00:25:09Do I think they'll give enough leverage?

00:25:10No, no, it's going to stay the same with the shell game.

00:25:15And I think you're going to have a protector over in the House and Mike Johnson.

00:25:17And I think they're just going to go back and forth as much as they can on redaction.

00:25:21And I wonder what type of legal, and I'm glad we have lawyers on here, you know, if I'm in

00:25:25Congress, I'm saying what type of legal action are they going to take with executive privilege?

00:25:29What are they going to do to try to, you know, slow roll this?

00:25:32What is a professional slow roll long play?

00:25:35And we're looking at Hegseth with a 25% cut in his travel budget.

00:25:38I mean, I don't think people realize too, and, you know, I know that we have military, other military on

00:25:44here, is that I just wonder if he's going to just pick up a, you know, an AMC or Mac

00:25:47flight, right?

00:25:48And, you know, fly on a C-17 somewhere, or he's going to just use Kash Patel's budget miles when

00:25:53he goes to see his girlfriend.

00:25:54But I think, you know, I think really the issue comes down to, I just don't see them moving on

00:25:59this.

00:26:00I don't think they can.

00:26:01I just don't see how they're going to be able to release that video.

00:26:04It comes to the same thing with the Epstein files, all this awful things that you see back there, the

00:26:08incompetency and the sycopency, the ignorance, right?

00:26:13The hubris, the arrogance and the ignorance of this administration, I think, prevents them from following the law.

00:26:18And I think they'll just try to keep wrapping it in some kind of obscure, opaque type of legal argument

00:26:23or try to push it back to the president where he uses whatever privilege he has to suppress it.

00:26:27I mean, I think that's what they've been doing.

00:26:29I just think they're going to follow that same game plan, Miles.

00:26:32Glenn, can I ask you big picture here?

00:26:35You know, we've focused so much in the past few weeks on that second strike and, you know, whether a

00:26:42war crime was committed or just the law was broken and murder was committed in a second strike.

00:26:48But it detracts from the much bigger picture here, the much bigger picture around this campaign, which is that the

00:26:56administration has made the case that these individuals are enemy combatants in a war, that they're on a battlefield.

00:27:06And they represent an imminent threat to the United States as narco terrorists.

00:27:11This whole campaign, a hundred people killed who otherwise would have normally just been arrested.

00:27:16That's normally what we do in these drug cases.

00:27:18You send a boat, you arrest them.

00:27:19It works very well.

00:27:19It happens every day.

00:27:20But instead, they're being killed.

00:27:23What do you make of the overall campaign here?

00:27:25I mean, certainly this one episode is indicative of what's happening big picture.

00:27:30But it's it's coming into sharper and sharper relief with almost every single strike.

00:27:35You know, I think the administration's arguments fall under the weight of their own frivolity.

00:27:40You know, to argue that these are, you know, armed narco terrorists who are, you know, preparing to flood the

00:27:48American streets with narcotics.

00:27:51I mean, how many ways is that rebutted?

00:27:54These tiny little boats.

00:27:55We don't even know that the folks are armed.

00:27:58But we have heard information creep out from some of the behind closed doors testimony.

00:28:05I believe it was by Admiral Bradley, if I'm not mistaken.

00:28:09One of these boats wasn't headed to the U.S., at least one of them.

00:28:12It was going to reportedly rendezvous with another boat that was going to take drugs to a third country.

00:28:18So please explain to me how we are combating narco terrorists who are involved in armed conflict.

00:28:26When one, we don't know they're armed and two, at least one boat wasn't even headed to the U.S.

00:28:31And then there is another data point that contradicts this nonsense.

00:28:35Some of the members of a boat or from an earlier strike reportedly survived.

00:28:41And what did they do?

00:28:42They repatriated them.

00:28:44Now, there was some additional reporting that after they repatriated them, they tried to get them over to the Seacott

00:28:51terrorism prison in El Salvador, presumably to shut them up, perhaps permanently.

00:28:57But if they were so dangerous that we have to murder them on the high seas, we repatriate them?

00:29:04What?

00:29:05So they can re-up and give it another try?

00:29:07I mean, all of these arguments fall under the weight of their own frivolity.

00:29:12You know, I don't know.

00:29:13And he's using it all as some kind of a pretext to launch a war that nobody wants and that

00:29:18we should not embroil the U.S. in.

00:29:20And, you know, not to mix Trump criminal apples and oranges.

00:29:23But, you know, I mean, he's got how many fruits and vegetables of crime going at the same time that

00:29:28he's juggling.

00:29:29But it all reminds me of what federal court judges are saying about Donald Trump when his administration makes these

00:29:36arguments.

00:29:36You know, whether it's Karen Judge Karen Immergut, who is a Trump appointee, saying that Trump and his administration's assertions

00:29:44are untethered to the facts.

00:29:47That could apply equally with the nonsense they're trying to sell us with respect to these boat strikes in international

00:29:54waters.

00:29:55It was Judge, I think, April Perry in Chicago, another federal court judge who said that Trump is pouring fuel

00:30:03on a fire he started, you know, and chaos reigns, which is what he wants.

00:30:09So I don't buy any of it.

00:30:11If any of these arguments ever move into a court of law proper, you know, Donald Trump may be able

00:30:16to get some traction, Miles, in the court of public opinion.

00:30:19But when any of this moves into a court proper, he loses badly, spectacularly.

00:30:26And that's why we need to drag the Trump administration into court early and often in every case that we

00:30:33can.

00:30:35That's absolutely right.

00:30:37And speaking of fruits and vegetables, we did lose Andrew because he turned into a pumpkin at 530.

00:30:44But we're going to talk on the back end here in a little bit with some of his colleagues about

00:30:49the other whistleblower aspects of this.

00:30:52You know, Denver, I want to throw you and Tara a question as we round out the conversation here about

00:30:58that bigger picture of apples and oranges that Glenn mentions of illegality in this administration and ask you what the

00:31:07consequences are if there is not accountability on this boat strike controversy.

00:31:14What does it mean for all of the other things that Donald Trump is trying to do to evade the

00:31:20law?

00:31:20Tara, why don't I throw that one to you first?

00:31:23Well, I think that's why you see so many people raising the alarm, sounding the alarm here, including Republicans, because

00:31:31they see this as a slippery slope.

00:31:33I mean, this administration is involved in so many questionably legal actions, whether it's this to what's happening with ICE

00:31:41and the amount of civil rights violations happening virtually daily on the streets of our cities across the country, perpetrated

00:31:50by this Department of Homeland Security,

00:31:52whether it's cover that's being run for Donald Trump on the Epstein issue with with Pam Bondi, whether it's going

00:31:59after his political enemies with these frivolous and absurd prosecutions like against James and James Comey and on down the

00:32:09abuse of power.

00:32:10The list is so long. And that doesn't even get into the financial misdeeds that are going on between Trump's

00:32:17family and the crypto world and these pardons, the pay to play there,

00:32:22the billions of dollars that Trump and his family have amassed because of the the wild, wild west that is

00:32:28the crypto business.

00:32:29That's clearly that clearly has no regulation and they're not interested in and having any oversight there.

00:32:34I mean, the list is so long that I think people are starting, particularly Republicans, because they're the ones in

00:32:42charge for now.

00:32:43They're really starting to recognize if we don't do something or stand up somewhere and say something about something that

00:32:51when the shoe is on the other foot, we're in big trouble.

00:32:53We cannot lose the full rule of law here and just what is so obvious on certain things.

00:33:00And so whether there's enforcement or not, it's up to the it's up to the Department of Justice, which is

00:33:06Pam Bondi.

00:33:07I'm not I'm not going to hold my breath thinking that we're going to see any of these people actually

00:33:11held accountable during this current administration.

00:33:14However, next year, when there is an opportunity to switch the Congress and get it out of the hands of

00:33:21the Republicans,

00:33:22then you can start seeing some accountability in Congress.

00:33:25And then in twenty eight, when they're voted out, we need to see Nuremberg style trials for some of the

00:33:30things that these people are doing.

00:33:31It's so outrageous and beneath what the American Constitution represents.

00:33:36Denver, what do you think a future Democratic Congress is going to do on all of this?

00:33:42Is it going to be, you know, the largest federal investigation we've ever seen?

00:33:46You were a part of the January 6th Select Committee, which was a huge, sprawling, congressionally directed investigation that, of

00:33:53course, then led into Jack Smith's investigation at the Justice Department.

00:33:58Should we expect something even bigger is coming if they win the House?

00:34:03I don't think it would happen until twenty eight.

00:34:06I think twenty six, you'll hear the rumblings.

00:34:08And I think if you're Democrats, it depends on the majority.

00:34:11Right, Miles?

00:34:12That's the one thing.

00:34:14And it depends on how much sepsis is in MAGA.

00:34:16And I think listening to Tara, let me explain that really quickly.

00:34:19I never thought that it was going to get worse before it gets better.

00:34:22You know, you've heard me, Miles, sometimes on my shows or when I'm in interviews, I'll always sort of make

00:34:26a joke.

00:34:27It's going to get worse before it gets worse.

00:34:29And now I can think I can say it's going to get worse before it's going to get better, because

00:34:33I think there's three simultaneous infections that I did not foresee.

00:34:38I think the first one is the Epstein files and the lack of the release of those.

00:34:42I think that's the first hit, right?

00:34:43When you got the first cut, right?

00:34:45And you're looking at it, they're starting to bleed a little bit.

00:34:47I think the second is actually health care and the economy.

00:34:50I think when you're looking at red states, right?

00:34:52I was in a rural district.

00:34:53When you're looking at red rural districts, you know that I would say R plus north of R plus eight

00:34:58on the PBI, right?

00:34:59On the political voting index.

00:35:00I would say that that's the second cut, right?

00:35:03That's a little bit deeper than even Epstein, right?

00:35:06Where people are like, oh my gosh, taking away our health care, the economy is in the toilet.

00:35:10They won't release the things, right?

00:35:12And MAGA is not paying attention as much as we are, like Tara is right, like bonding and stuff like

00:35:16that.

00:35:16They're not going to do anything.

00:35:17But the voters, what if there's a third thing?

00:35:20And what if that third thing is war?

00:35:22What if that third thing is going through the inherent nationalistic nature of MAGA itself?

00:35:28And I'm wondering the Democrats have to make that calculation.

00:35:32If I'm in there as a blue dog Democrat, I'm saying, okay, we got to do some investigations here.

00:35:37We got to look at this.

00:35:37But it's holding them accountable on the funding.

00:35:39And it's making sure they take back their Article I powers.

00:35:42Get freaking strong.

00:35:43Stop being wimpy, right?

00:35:45Go, you know, go for it.

00:35:46But I do believe they got to see how many seats they actually take.

00:35:49If it's north of 40, I think you're going to see some big investigations.

00:35:51If it's lower than 40, it's going to be tough.

00:35:53And I also think that they're going to be waiting for 28 a little bit too.

00:35:56They can't wait too long, though.

00:35:58But I do think, Miles, I just feel like I never thought I'd say this.

00:36:01I think the infection in MAGA is real.

00:36:04And, you know, it's in the polling and things like that.

00:36:06So listening to Tara, listening to Glenn, I just got this feeling it's starting to boil over.

00:36:11And I think if they pop that boil, it's going to get really bad.

00:36:13And I think war is the third leg of this grotesqueness that you see right now in MAGA.

00:36:20There is no replacement for Denver Riggleman's lexicon.

00:36:24No one like him.

00:36:26Glenn Kirshner, quick final word.

00:36:29You know, Denver says that the Dems have got to stop being wimpy on this.

00:36:34Will they?

00:36:36I hope we are all learning our lesson.

00:36:40It is a lack of accountability.

00:36:42It is the lack of consequences that have brought us to exactly where we are today.

00:36:48You know, one of my beefs with my beloved home for decades, the Department of Justice, is federal prosecutors don't

00:36:56like to run the risk of losing cases.

00:36:59And that will be the death knell of a law enforcement agency.

00:37:03Because if you've got the facts and you've got the law, even if it's not a bulletproof case, spoiler alert,

00:37:09there's no such thing as a bulletproof case.

00:37:12If it's a righteous case, you have to pursue it.

00:37:16Win, lose or draw.

00:37:18If you don't, you're doing a disservice to the victims of the crime and in Donald Trump's crime.

00:37:23And the crimes, you know, basically, I prosecuted RICO cases in federal court in Washington, D.C.

00:37:29The Trump administration looks a lot to me like a criminal enterprise, right?

00:37:34RICO is racketeer-influenced and corrupt organizations.

00:37:38I've seen them before.

00:37:40We're seeing it in the Trump administration.

00:37:42And I'm going to give Tara the amen chorus, because if we don't have our version of the Nuremberg trials

00:37:49to attack the rampant lawlessness that's victimizing the American people right now, then guess what?

00:37:55We don't deserve to keep our republic.

00:37:58So how about we get our justice on as soon as we have the opportunity?

00:38:03Get our justice on.

00:38:05I love it.

00:38:05Look, folks, you're probably looking at a future White House senior staff right here or a cabinet meeting.

00:38:13I think each of these individuals would be considered for those posts in the future, and I hope they are.

00:38:19The incredible Denver Riggleman, Tara Setmeyer, and Glenn Kirshner.

00:38:24If you are not following these three people, you're left out, my friends.

00:38:28You're left out.

00:38:29Thank you, you guys.

00:38:29I appreciate your insights, your incisiveness, and your courage.

00:38:33Thanks for joining us today.

00:38:35Thanks, Miles.

00:38:36Thanks, buddy.

00:38:36Thanks, Miles.

00:38:37We're going to bring in now my co-founder of Defiance.org, Xander Schultz, the most hated person on the

00:38:44program anytime we bring him on.

00:38:46Our numbers usually tank when Denver comes onto the screen.

00:38:49Sorry, Xander Schultz, not Denver.

00:38:51Denver's terrible.

00:38:52Everyone knows that.

00:38:53But Xander's very, very bad.

00:38:54And this is where people will start to leave the live stream.

00:38:57I think it's usually what we've usually found.

00:39:00How are you, brother?

00:39:01I'm doing good.

00:39:02I mean, I was better 20 seconds ago before that intro, but I'm doing all right.

00:39:06Yeah, sorry.

00:39:06I decided today I'm not going to be your hype man.

00:39:08I'm just going to nag you.

00:39:11Okay.

00:39:12What do you got on your mind?

00:39:13We've got some pretty big things to discuss today on this episode.

00:39:17Yeah.

00:39:18I mean, look, internally, you've really taken the lead on this campaign.

00:39:22And I'd love for you to have a chance to just share at a high level.

00:39:29I kind of had two questions.

00:39:30One, just an overview.

00:39:31What is this campaign?

00:39:33What are we doing?

00:39:34And two, this is a first for our club.

00:39:36In terms of previous weekly briefings have centered existing efforts.

00:39:42In this case, you decided really, and we all leaned in together, to be catalytic.

00:39:48And I want to know why you thought this was a moment where we need to take that step and

00:39:53not just support the ecosystem, but bring the ecosystem together, including the partners

00:39:56that we're going to see here, and be catalytic in this moment.

00:39:59Yeah, look, I mean, this is all very, very real.

00:40:02And when we had Glenn Kirshner on a few weeks ago, he talked about a number of different

00:40:07organizations that were thinking about how they could cobble together a legal defense

00:40:13network for U.S. service members concerned about illegal orders.

00:40:17And since we had had that conversation with Glenn, these controversies had gotten worse

00:40:22and worse and worse.

00:40:24And more and more members of Congress who are privy to some of that information behind the

00:40:29scenes had come out publicly and said, look, something very illegal is happening here, something

00:40:34very illegal.

00:40:35And the American people need to see those underlying documents from the Justice Department that are

00:40:40classified.

00:40:41They need to see those underlying videos that haven't been shown to the American people

00:40:45because, as these members of Congress indicated, if people used their own judgment and saw

00:40:51the things they have seen behind the scenes, they would come to the same conclusion that

00:40:55laws are being broken here.

00:40:57And then you couple that, Xander, with all of the reporting of members of the military, lawyers

00:41:02across the executive branch who were concerned they were being directed to do illegal things.

00:41:07And you've got to say, well, look, we can't just let the president tell them, shut your

00:41:11mouths.

00:41:12And that's what the president did.

00:41:13And it was worse than shut your mouths.

00:41:16The president of the United States was telling people when he went after these lawmakers that

00:41:22if you try to exercise your rights, if you dare to even think about refusing a manifestly

00:41:29illegal order, we're going to court martial you.

00:41:31We're going to take away your freedoms.

00:41:32We're going to put you in prison that is terrifying, that that by design intimidates

00:41:38the people who might have the information needed to disclose misconduct.

00:41:43It does a very, very, very big disservice to the men and women in uniform in the long

00:41:49haul, not just on this issue, because it says to them under no circumstances do you

00:41:54question an illegal order.

00:41:56That has happened before in American history that people have decided I don't want to question

00:42:00an illegal order.

00:42:02And you know what happens when that when that goes down?

00:42:04In some cases, innocent people die.

00:42:07Then those people who refuse to question those orders, they go to prison anyway.

00:42:11So as Glenn said, I know it puts our service members in a really difficult spot, but there

00:42:15are those competing obligations, one to generally assume that all orders are lawful.

00:42:20But if something is the direction of a the clear direction of the commission of a crime,

00:42:25you can't abide it and you have another obligation.

00:42:28And so we felt like Xander in looking at this controversy as it was ballooning, no one was

00:42:35stepping forward and saying, hey, by the way, for that actual man or woman who has that issue

00:42:40right now, who is morally conflicted, there are real things we can do to help you out.

00:42:44There are real lawyers, real resources, real pro bono actions that are there ready for you

00:42:51to take advantage of them again, confidentially and lawfully and securely.

00:42:56And we wanted to make that happen.

00:42:59Now, I know that in doing this, we might draw Donald Trump's ire.

00:43:03That's not what we're trying to do.

00:43:04But clearly he has shown he's got a bone to pick with anyone who wants to remind people

00:43:10of their obligations and their rights under the law.

00:43:14But we happen to be a group of people who are willing to do that.

00:43:17We're willing to take that risk because we want to defend good people who've served this

00:43:22country and make sure they don't end up in a position where they're coerced into doing

00:43:27something that doesn't just violate their conscience, but violates the Constitution.

00:43:32And Miles, just to take a step back real quick, when you say doing this, what are we doing?

00:43:36That's a great question.

00:43:39You're fired up.

00:43:40I like the energy.

00:43:41Let's break it down, though.

00:43:42If folks don't know, while I'm talking about this, you can pull up a window and go to defiance.org

00:43:48slash troops.

00:43:50So NBC News announced last night, they broke the story on this, that as an organization,

00:43:57defiance.org, in partnership with whistlebloweraid.org, is going to be launching this nationwide effort

00:44:05to let U.S. service members know, we've got your backs.

00:44:09What do we mean by that?

00:44:11Well, we're going to help them know what their rights and responsibilities are under military

00:44:16law.

00:44:16But most importantly, we're going to raise awareness in those communities that there are

00:44:21lawful pathways of confidential legal advice, and also, if a crime was committed, lawful pathways

00:44:30of disclosure.

00:44:31And we're going to do that in a very simple fashion.

00:44:34We are blanketing these military communities with public service announcements.

00:44:39So the first two places, Xander, that we are going to be launching this campaign as of today

00:44:45are around U.S. Southern Command in Doral, Florida, and around U.S. Special Operations Command

00:44:54in Tampa, Florida.

00:44:55Why those two places?

00:44:56Well, those are the two commands that have been put in charge of this effort, this controversial,

00:45:04lethal boat strike effort that the administration has underway.

00:45:08And so we think if we are going to prioritize any military installations in the country to

00:45:13reach out to, to let people in the community know these resources exist, it's those two places.

00:45:18And that starts today.

00:45:21Perfect.

00:45:22Perfect.

00:45:22Thank you, sir.

00:45:23And with that, I think it's a perfect time to bring on a couple of our partners in this project.

00:45:27Yeah, we got some rock stars to bring in here.

00:45:28So let's bring in Naomi Seligman, who is the Chief Strategy Officer at Whistleblower Aid.

00:45:35Naomi, great to have you.

00:45:37Thank you, Miles.

00:45:38We're excited.

00:45:40First repeat guest, by the way.

00:45:42You've earned an honor here with the Defiance community.

00:45:46You're a first repeat guest.

00:45:47Yeah, yeah.

00:45:48Again.

00:45:49You get, there's like, there's a t-shirt you get.

00:45:51We haven't made it yet, but, you know, at some point, you know, at some point uncertain

00:45:55in the future, you'll get that t-shirt.

00:45:57And then I'm excited to also bring in our friend, Scott Goodstein.

00:46:02Scott's got a lot of accolades, but my favorite is, you may know a little guy named Barack Obama,

00:46:09who ran for public office once upon a time.

00:46:12His social media guru was Scott Goodstein.

00:46:15So there really isn't anyone better we could imagine teaming with on this campaign to make

00:46:20sure we go raise awareness in those communities than Scott.

00:46:24Welcome, my friend.

00:46:25Awesome.

00:46:26Glad to be here.

00:46:27I want to name a name with guru in it.

00:46:29I don't know if I'm a guru of anything.

00:46:32Don't you just aspire to be guru?

00:46:34That's right.

00:46:35Gosh.

00:46:35I'm a guru of something.

00:46:36You just have to take it.

00:46:38You don't really want to.

00:46:38Oh, yeah.

00:46:38You got to self-brand these days, right?

00:46:41That's right.

00:46:42I am the guru.

00:46:43For the record, I've never called myself a guru.

00:46:45But all good.

00:46:47You know, Scott and I, who have worked together and known each other for decades, I think this

00:46:51is the first podcast or show we've ever been on in our careers together.

00:46:56So another victory.

00:46:58Yes.

00:46:59Well, I want to throw the first question to you, Naomi, because you're a whistleblower in

00:47:05your own right, but look, you're helping to lead an organization that we've partnered

00:47:09with in other ways.

00:47:10And it just seemed just so natural because we already had a partnership with you all

00:47:15to team with you on this campaign.

00:47:17You guys have dealt with, at Whistleblower Aid, so many super high-profile cases.

00:47:24I mean, bombshell disclosures about healthcare companies and tech companies like Facebook

00:47:30and presidential impeachments that it's sort of second nature for you all to waltz into

00:47:37something that's controversial and say, hey, everyone, relax.

00:47:41There's a thing called the law, and there's people who can help advise you on it.

00:47:45And to be sort of that calming influence, talk to me a little bit about that, because

00:47:50I think right now we might even have US service members watching this and saying, yeah, it

00:47:54is scary times.

00:47:55Should I be terrified or are my rights still protected?

00:47:59Do I have a pathway to go consult with someone if I think I've been told to do something illegal?

00:48:07Absolutely.

00:48:08Yes, there is absolutely a pathway.

00:48:10We have, for almost a decade now, we have been representing public and private sector

00:48:17whistleblowers.

00:48:18The federal workers that you're hearing out of the Trump administration right now are

00:48:22those, you know, a number of those are those that we represent.

00:48:25Those huge tech whistleblowers that you've heard about, like Francis Haugen or Mudge.

00:48:31I mean, there is not a Goliath that we have been intimidated to take on.

00:48:37We are there, we are ready, and we have a team of attorneys and also with co-counsel around

00:48:44the country that can take on these cases, that can guide, that can provide the appropriate

00:48:50counsel, can help make sure that when you take that oath that you've taken, that we can

00:48:56make sure you can live up to that oath.

00:48:58There is no service member that should be made in a legal order.

00:49:02We're now in a moment when there are new lows with President Trump targeting civilians, targeting

00:49:10those that are really putting their lives on the line for this country.

00:49:13So the way we operate allows them to get the guidance, the representation, and the wraparound

00:49:19services that we provide.

00:49:21Whether it's, you know, the last person you have or the last, you know, the last friend

00:49:26you have in the world is a dog, we make sure that we pay vet bills.

00:49:30We make sure that you have mental wellness stipends.

00:49:33So not only are we going to make sure that you are safe and secure and fully reporting

00:49:39out any kind of, any kind of unlawful orders, we make sure that you come out of this hole.

00:49:47That is our mission at whistlebloweraid.org.

00:49:51We are doubling down on that commitment right now with our partnership with Defiant.

00:49:57You said veterans bills.

00:49:58We just had to take our dog to the vet.

00:50:00I should have called you first, Naomi, and said, look, I've blown the whistle before.

00:50:04I need someone to pay that vet bill.

00:50:06I'm just kidding.

00:50:07It is truly remarkable that you all do that.

00:50:10It's not, it's not just, you know, hey, you're going to have legal bills if you decide

00:50:14to blow up your life and, you know, call out the president for breaking the law.

00:50:19We got you.

00:50:20We got you with these wraparound services.

00:50:22That is really, really important to someone who's thinking about coming forward and doing

00:50:27this.

00:50:28But it starts with first and foremost, just knowing their rights, just even being aware

00:50:35that they have an option other than going to their desk each day and saying, well, is

00:50:41today the day I go to my boss and say, hey, boss, I think the president told us to do

00:50:46something illegal, knowing that that conversation is not going to go well.

00:50:49And so, Scott, I want to ask you, you know, when it comes to that very, very first step

00:50:55of raising awareness, one of the things that we've done is gone back to basics here is,

00:51:01you know, where do you reach people?

00:51:02Well, one way you can reach them is on the way to work.

00:51:04I think our producer can put up on the screen here.

00:51:07You know, we're starting with billboards.

00:51:08Let's find these military installations and let's go on Google Street View and let's ride

00:51:14down the street and see what billboards we can go by to make sure that we're reaching

00:51:19those folks on their way to work, on the way home and have that first conversation.

00:51:24Talk to me about how you think about that as a communications professional, not just

00:51:28the billboards, but how to first reach someone on a campaign like this in a disarming way

00:51:35and to get their attention.

00:51:38Sure.

00:51:38I mean, look, Senator Kelly started all this and started the brainstorming where it was

00:51:44like, if he's talking about refusing any orders, where did you first see that video?

00:51:50And it was like on your phone.

00:51:52And so for me, I'm thinking about how are we able to reach more people?

00:51:58And so me and Miles, full disclosure, right, did some back and forth brainstorming.

00:52:02Are you seeing this like we need to get this message in the hands of everybody that works

00:52:07around the bases, everybody that's got a family member that's a service member, every service

00:52:13member.

00:52:13And so everything from similar to Naomi doing 360 services, you see media at 360, you see

00:52:22media on your phone, you look up from your phone, you're going to see media on the billboard,

00:52:26you go shopping at the local bodega, there's going to be different signs there, you go even

00:52:32to the gas pump, there's even going to be a seven second little talking thing at the gas.

00:52:37So we want to surround the areas and the neighborhoods and the communities that are impacted the most

00:52:42by this.

00:52:44Xander, I want to bring you back into the conversation because we had a discussion that I'm happy to

00:52:50have openly with our members here about what the consequences might be in going and defending

00:52:57these service members.

00:53:00This is not an environment where you can go do routine things like this anymore easily.

00:53:06Something as simple as know your rights training is now controversial, controversial.

00:53:13And you and I were talking about that the other day about how, you know, things like knowing

00:53:16your rights sound boring and, you know, just kind of ordinary.

00:53:21But right now, the president of the United States says it is sedition.

00:53:25It's sedition.

00:53:26It's punishable by death, potentially, to go tell people that they have a right and responsibility

00:53:34to refuse manifestly illegal orders.

00:53:38And you look back at me on the screen and said, yeah, okay, let's do it.

00:53:41It's the right thing to do.

00:53:43Yeah, this is right out of the authoritarian playbook, right?

00:53:45This is blind obedience trying to be enforced via fear.

00:53:51And so this and honestly, the creation of an emergency like the war in Venezuela are both

00:53:56out of the fascist playbook.

00:53:58And so I think the benefit we have, and we mentioned this on the podcast yesterday, is

00:54:03we do have 1930s Italy and Germany to look back on.

00:54:07We don't have to sit on our hands.

00:54:08We know the consequences.

00:54:09We know there's not safety and obedience, that things just get worse.

00:54:12And so I'm excited that we are in the American people in the Defiance Club are engaging at

00:54:19this stage of the emergency.

00:54:20It's really important that we do.

00:54:22And, you know, Miles, I had a question for you, because you haven't been in exactly the

00:54:26seat, but you were in a seat like this.

00:54:30I just wonder, what was your journey?

00:54:32Like, where was your headspace at from kind of, you were present for a lot of unlawful orders,

00:54:38your journey from I'm seeing this to I'm going to do something about it and what was

00:54:44critical in that journey?

00:54:46Well, you know, Naomi will know about this, too, and I want to get her take on it.

00:54:53It's sort of like a moral choose-your-own-adventure that is not so much an adventure, because when

00:55:01you're on this pathway, when you've witnessed misconduct, you do feel very alone.

00:55:06No one tells you when you go into government, hey, by the way, if you see the big boss break

00:55:10the law, you know, call this 800 number.

00:55:12That doesn't exist.

00:55:13And so you hear this with almost anyone who decides to blow the whistle, is that at the

00:55:20beginning, they're asking themselves, what do I do next?

00:55:23What's the way to go about this?

00:55:25Now, the circumstances that I was in inside the Trump administration were especially frustrating,

00:55:30because I wasn't fully alone in this.

00:55:34I had superiors in the president's cabinet that shared the same view, that vehemently felt

00:55:43like Donald Trump was on the side of breaking the law almost every day.

00:55:48He had the inclination toward illegality, and yet none of them wanted to call it out.

00:55:54So from underneath them, I had to figure out, how do we start to have this conversation in

00:56:01the United States about how the president's own team views him as a danger to the fabric

00:56:08of our republic?

00:56:09Now, the difference in my case was there wasn't one specific unlawful order that I felt like

00:56:15the American people needed to know about.

00:56:17There were dozens of attempted efforts by Donald Trump while I was there to break the law, and

00:56:24we were sliding up on an election where we had to decide whether we were going to fire

00:56:30or rehire this man.

00:56:32So I made the choice to take my disclosures initially into the political sphere, as in

00:56:37the public sphere, as in to tell people, here are all the things that are happening because

00:56:42you've got to go take a vote.

00:56:44You've got to go decide whether to keep this guy in office.

00:56:48And I don't think there's going to be time to litigate it slowly from the inside, make

00:56:53disclosure on issue after issue.

00:56:55Now, what I will say, I'm going to add a caveat like I always do.

00:56:58What I will say is I didn't know that organizations like the Government Accountability Project,

00:57:04like Whistleblower Aid, like all of these different groups existed out there until after

00:57:10the fact, until after I came forward.

00:57:12And I've even said to Naomi before, if I had known that whistleblower aid existed, I absolutely

00:57:21would have gone to them as my first phone call amidst all of this and said, look, here are the

00:57:26list of things I can make disclosures about right now.

00:57:29How do we sequence this?

00:57:31What's the right way to go about this?

00:57:32What are the right avenues of disclosure?

00:57:35And I think I could have had an even bigger impact and potentially on some of those issues

00:57:40held Donald Trump to account legally in ways he's not been if I had taken that path.

00:57:48But Naomi, I want to throw it to you on that front, because I think you hear that from a

00:57:51lot of people who come forward as whistleblowers to your organization.

00:57:55A hundred percent, Miles.

00:57:56You know, we are hearing, you know, public servants inside the government every single day.

00:58:03Um, as you know, we can only take 10% of, um, the folks that are coming to us because

00:58:10there

00:58:11are so many people who want to say, I want to do the right thing, who wake up in the

00:58:15morning

00:58:15and say, I'm not going to, I'm not going to be a part anymore, right?

00:58:19What's their point?

00:58:20And when they reach their breaking point, they get in touch with us.

00:58:23So that is all happening within, and a lot of those folks coming to us are anonymous way.

00:58:31They do not want to disclose publicly because as you know, Miles, it's, it's a, it's a really,

00:58:36uh, terrifying path and prospect in this administration to come forward.

00:58:42Uh, so we are, we're working with them on anonymous basis, or if they want to be public,

00:58:46we know what kind of impact they've had.

00:58:48Obviously, Miles, you've had that impact.

00:58:51You know, when I was a whistleblower, it was, it was fascinating because the, uh,

00:58:56administration I was working for decided to set up a hotline for folks to call if they,

00:59:01if there was some wrong.

00:59:03And what happened was when folks would call because it was internal to the mayor's administration,

00:59:10they would then tell the chief of staff who, who would say, we've got to figure out who

00:59:14person is because they would tell them what was coming in.

00:59:16So it was a fox in the hen house.

00:59:18So we were able to, for folks to come legally responsibly, because we know what's going

00:59:25on in this administration, but we also, there's so much we don't know.

00:59:28And we want to make sure these service members who put everything on the line have a place

00:59:32to go where they feel safe and secure.

00:59:34And just like you, Miles, you know, lots of folks don't know that these organizations exist.

00:59:41So we're so happy partnering with Scott Defiance to make sure that they know that our services

00:59:48exist because what we're doing every single day is just going to now turn by to all the

00:59:54service members that need our help as well.

00:59:57So we're thrilled.

00:59:58Both of you.

00:59:59Well, I will say, uh, Xander, you know, this would be, I think a good moment.

01:00:03We've got, uh, members of the defiance.org community who are going to, uh, announce our

01:00:10surprise today about how we as a club are, are going to approach this first week of the

01:00:16campaign and what level of effort, uh, we are putting in Xander, you want to tee that

01:00:21up for us?

01:00:22Yeah.

01:00:23Enough of our faces for a bit.

01:00:24Let's get some club members up here.

01:00:25We've got, uh, John ceiling and Tony ceiling, uh, from California.

01:00:29And let's bring on that message from them.

01:00:32Mercedes.

01:00:33Hi, my name is Tony ceiling from mill Valley, California.

01:00:36And I'm John ceiling from San Carlos, California.

01:00:38We're proud members of the defiance.org team.

01:00:41We are thrilled to announce we are launching a $50,000 campaign to make us service members

01:00:47aware of their legal rights, including what to do when confronted with manifestly unlawful

01:00:52orders and to help provide them with legal support if needed.

01:00:57Yes.

01:00:58Okay.

01:00:58So I hope that if you're watching right now, you're hitting the heart button, you're hitting

01:01:01the like button, you're hitting the subscribe button because this is awesome news.

01:01:05Now this is a combination of things.

01:01:07Unlike our usual pro-democracy Oprah scene, it's not like there's a one person or group

01:01:11that's going to be on the receiving end of this grant, but this is the initial spend of

01:01:16effort and ad funding and in-kind contributions that are going towards bringing this all live.

01:01:24So if you haven't yet go check out defiance.org slash troops, these are the resources that

01:01:30we are going to make available in those military communities.

01:01:34And I'll tell you this, our goal is to make sure that anyone that's in one of those military

01:01:39communities that we are going to initially seize these ads, seize these public service

01:01:46announcement, understands that these resources are available to them.

01:01:51And that's what we're going to do.

01:01:52And there's no more important place to be doing this right now than around US Southern

01:01:57Command and around US Special Operations Command.

01:02:00Scott, I want to get your reaction to that and also maybe get your thoughts on how in the

01:02:05long term, we can scale something like this nationwide.

01:02:12Oh, we've still got you muted.

01:02:13Am I muted?

01:02:14There we go.

01:02:15All right.

01:02:16No, this is, look, this is great, but it takes time and effort to scale.

01:02:21I mean, we've got the downloadable flyers on the website as well.

01:02:27Oh, it's in farming, defiance.org slash troop.

01:02:30But in addition to that, we're talking about, you know, going to fitness clubs around the bases.

01:02:37We're going to a bunch of different avenues on people's mobile phones that live around the bases to billboards that

01:02:48will be on streets within a mile of the base.

01:02:51So the goal of this is to expand that, you know, for weeks.

01:02:55And then, look, who knows if that what the next bases are that that our president takes action from.

01:03:04And so, you know, Miles is is rightly picked out the these bases in Doral and Tampa.

01:03:11Also, fun fact, Doral is also where President Trump's got a golf course.

01:03:17So we will be heavily targeting Doral over the next couple of weeks.

01:03:24I don't suppose that the president, Scott, would give us a discount on advertising at the at the golf course.

01:03:30I don't know.

01:03:31We'll take a look.

01:03:32He's noticing those billboards or not.

01:03:34But our goal is, look, to make sure that all of the military folks know this message, know the resources.

01:03:41And then to what Whistleblower Aid does is making sure that while they're learning about it on our site, they're

01:03:47going in and being able to safely, securely, anonymously, however they they want.

01:03:54But that's that's going to Whistleblower Aid's dedicated website, knownlawfulorders.org.

01:04:02Amazing.

01:04:03Well, look, we have to get to the next part of the program, which is Xander and I will dive

01:04:07in with Defiance.org members on how they can personally get involved.

01:04:12And I will just say, as we close out here, already members of Defiance.org have made this happen.

01:04:18Their membership fees have made it possible to launch this campaign.

01:04:21We have heard from many of you that this is something that you wanted to do.

01:04:25This is an action that you wanted to see taken.

01:04:28And so we are thrilled to be able to do this.

01:04:30We are thrilled to be able to go have the backs of our service members and to hopefully scale this

01:04:36campaign.

01:04:36If you are watching this right now and you are not a member of Defiance.org, but you want to

01:04:41help with the campaign, you want to get this in front of military communities, then go to that website, Defiance

01:04:46.org slash troops.

01:04:48You can contribute to the legal defense of service members who come forward.

01:04:54You can contribute to bringing this campaign into other communities around the country.

01:04:58You can get personally involved, even if you are not a member.

01:05:02So thank you to Naomi for everything you do, for partnering with us on this campaign.

01:05:08Thank you, Scott, for your extraordinary expertise and all of your hard work to make this possible.

01:05:14You two are patriots of the highest order.

01:05:18Thank you, Miles.

01:05:19We are so thrilled to be partnering with you and thanks for having us on today.

01:05:23Awesome.

01:05:23Thanks so much for having me on and I'm going to get back to work.

01:05:27Awesome.

01:05:28Thank you, friends.

01:05:28Fantastic.

01:05:30Xander, we get to round this out with telling folks how they can take action themselves.

01:05:37Talk to us about that.

01:05:38Yeah, I'm pretty excited about this week because I know, you know, oftentimes the most effective thing you can do

01:05:43is call your senator or call your congressperson, which is important, but maybe not the most exciting experience.

01:05:49It gets boring to do that.

01:05:51We're going to keep telling people to do that, by the way, because there are going to be so many

01:05:54issues where we need you to call your member of Congress.

01:05:56But this week, let's go out there in the world and do things.

01:05:58This is not that.

01:05:59Scott mentioned that 360 presence for military members is important.

01:06:03We're going to need the Defiance members to provide that 360 coverage.

01:06:07So this campaign is all about letting military members know they're somewhere safe they can go.

01:06:12And we're going to ask for you to participate in letting them know in a number of ways.

01:06:17Mercedes, if you could throw up that graphic.

01:06:20We have posters for you to distribute near military hubs.

01:06:23So these are things like bases, recruitment centers, MEPS, ROTC units, National Guard and Reserve centers, et cetera.

01:06:30So we have these big posters for you to distribute, put up and distribute near those centers.

01:06:34We're going to have wallet cards for you to have on yourself for when you cross a pass with military

01:06:40members.

01:06:41Something small you can provide them so they're aware of this campaign.

01:06:45We also have, obviously, low-hanging fruit.

01:06:47Posting on social media, always helpful.

01:06:50A lot of us have big, diverse networks.

01:06:53There's military members across them.

01:06:54Please post on social media.

01:06:56And then lastly, and more intimately, calling military members that you may know or families, military families that you know.

01:07:03Just letting them know this is there for them.

01:07:05We are going to try to make this as easy as we can.

01:07:07So as Scott mentioned earlier, on defiance.org slash troops, we're going to have assets online for you to either

01:07:13post on social media or to download and print.

01:07:16If you'd like it to be even easier to get these things, we're going to create items on our store

01:07:21so you can buy the posters or buy the business cards.

01:07:24We're going to do this as close to cost as we can.

01:07:28We're not trying to make a buck off you.

01:07:29We're just trying to make your life easier if you desire it that way.

01:07:32And we'll also share a recommended copy for those conversations with military members and military families.

01:07:37Those can be touchy.

01:07:39This is not meant to be confrontational at all.

01:07:42It's meant to be supportive and just an FYI for folks that may be in a position like Miles was

01:07:48so many years ago.

01:07:49And we could shorten the time between them seeing and witnessing unlawful things and being able to be an asset

01:07:56to the American people in the public and helping us understand what's going on.

01:07:59So that's the campaign.

01:08:00That's the actions this week.

01:08:02It's not one action.

01:08:02It's a bunch of them.

01:08:03We're here to be supportive in helping you execute on those actions.

01:08:08And, you know, we've been even considering the new year doing some office hours for Defiance members to meet up

01:08:14maybe on Zoom so we can do these things together as well.

01:08:17So look forward to that.

01:08:18And, yeah, I'm so excited about this campaign.

01:08:21Well, and you know what we'll do this week is, Xander, remind me, is the weekly coffee we do with

01:08:26members.

01:08:27Let's have you join the weekly coffee.

01:08:29And as we're doing catch up and taking Q&A from members at the weekly members only coffee, let's go

01:08:35back through our actions and give people the opportunity to do that there.

01:08:40I think that'll be a great thing.

01:08:41But look, folks, I'll pick up on what Xander said and just say from experience, this is very real.

01:08:48I mean, I normally hear folks when they talk about a public service, you know, campaign, say, you know, post

01:08:54on social media.

01:08:55And I think, you know, what difference is that going to make?

01:08:57You know, other people will do that.

01:08:58I don't need to do that.

01:08:59It makes a difference.

01:09:01Like I said, if I had been when I was in government, if I had seen posts from friends about,

01:09:07you know, whistleblower aid or some of these other organizations, it might have changed my thinking.

01:09:12It might have allowed me to have a greater impact in calling out presidential misconduct that I had witnessed.

01:09:20And so we've literally tried to make this as easy as possible for folks so that we can get in

01:09:26front of those service members and others.

01:09:28You have no idea, I'm sure, who in your social media followings might be connected to family members and friends

01:09:35that serve in the military that might be in a position right now where they're concerned about what's happening.

01:09:41And so if you just go to the website, we've got language there.

01:09:44You can just copy and paste it right now.

01:09:45If you're listening, you could go to defiance.org slash troops.

01:09:49You don't have to give anything.

01:09:50You don't have to download a poster.

01:09:51You could just scroll down and share on social media this message.

01:09:55Don't let anyone threaten our service members.

01:09:58Help them defend their rights and obey only lawful orders.

01:10:03And then it points them towards those resources and the site, including the confidential portal where they can reach out

01:10:10to and get those legal services.

01:10:13This is awesome, defiance.org community members, that you have been supportive of doing something like this.

01:10:20I applaud you for your bravery and being willing to take this on.

01:10:23I will tell you that today, I don't want to call any of them out without their permission, but a

01:10:28number of the members of Congress who were involved in sounding the alarm initially about illegal orders have reached out

01:10:37to us to express their gratitude that defiance.org is doing this when other groups would not, that we are

01:10:44stepping forward and telling those men and women in uniform that we will protect them.

01:10:49So that's exciting stuff.

01:10:50Xander, anything else to add on actions?

01:10:54You're muted.

01:10:58This happens, people.

01:10:59This happens.

01:11:0021st century.

01:11:01We still forget that mute button.

01:11:03It's been five years since the pandemic.

01:11:05I still don't have this down at all.

01:11:08No, Miles, unless you have something else to add.

01:11:10But I mean, the only thing, just in case anyone's feeling some anxiety, is just remembering we follow up with

01:11:15all our members with an email the following day, laying all this out simply.

01:11:19So don't worry.

01:11:19You don't have to jot down in a panic.

01:11:21This is all going to be in your inbox tomorrow.

01:11:23But we do have one more ask, which is if you live in or around Doral, Florida or Tampa, Florida,

01:11:31send us a direct message because that is where this campaign initially is focused.

01:11:37And we've got some extra special things that you could help with.

01:11:41So send us a direct message on our various social media platforms.

01:11:46Our producer will tell me if we have a favorite one.

01:11:48But I think it could be easiest on Substack.

01:11:52Our producer says Substack.

01:11:54So if you are a Defiance.org member and you just go to our members information site, Defiance.news, you

01:12:02can send us a direct message there.

01:12:04Or actually, you can just reply to any email we have sent you via Substack.

01:12:11You can just reply and that will go into our system.

01:12:14So let us know if you live near Doral, Florida or Tampa, Florida and want to be involved.

01:12:18But to any member or anyone watching anywhere else, you can just go to the website, download a poster.

01:12:24Put it up somewhere.

01:12:25This could change someone's life.

01:12:27This could protect a service member from doing something stupid that they shouldn't do because not every order is unlawful

01:12:34and not every order is lawful.

01:12:36Or it could make sure that they don't commit a crime unwittingly that they're being directed to do.

01:12:43So either way, we're going to make sure that they have that support and you could be the linchpin.

01:12:47Please do that.

01:12:48Please help.

01:12:50Let's go into our final segment here today.

01:12:51I know we're into overtime.

01:12:52We love to do this segment.

01:12:55Who is joining the Defiance?

01:12:57Because this is a reminder every day, folks, that our ranks are growing.

01:12:59There are more and more people joining the Defiance.

01:13:02And you may not be thrilled to have a new member joining the club today, but I'll tell you who's

01:13:06joining the club.

01:13:07I don't think he has signed up for Defiance.org.

01:13:10But his name is Ted Cruz.

01:13:11He's a United States senator from Texas.

01:13:13And our producer Mercedes will let me know if she's seen him sign up for membership since we started.

01:13:18But even if he hasn't today and the past couple weeks, he's shown that he's more interested in flirting with

01:13:27the idea of being a member of the Defiance.

01:13:30And during Trump 2.0, we have seen Ted Cruz standing up on an issue that is, I think, near

01:13:39and dear to all of our hearts.

01:13:40In fact, it happens to be the First Amendment of the United States Constitution, not the second or third or

01:13:4612th.

01:13:47And at an FCC oversight hearing before the Senate Commerce Committee this week, that senator challenged the FCC chairman, Brendan

01:13:57Carr, about his commitment to free speech.

01:14:00Take a listen.

01:14:01Well, another area of agreement between you and I is that Jimmy Kimball is angry, overtly partisan, and profoundly unfunny.

01:14:13That, sadly, is true for most late-night comedians today who seem to have been collectively broken by President Trump's

01:14:22election.

01:14:24Jimmy's remarks about Charlie Kirk were tasteless.

01:14:27And ABC and its affiliates would have been fully within their rights to fire him or simply to no longer

01:14:35air his program.

01:14:36That was their choice.

01:14:38But what government cannot do is force private entities to take actions that the government cannot take directly.

01:14:47Government officials threatening adverse consequences for disfavored content is an unconstitutional coercion that chills protected speech.

01:14:57Democrat or Republican, we cannot have the government arbitrating truth or opinion.

01:15:09Mr. Chairman, my question is this.

01:15:11So long as there is a public interest standard, shouldn't it be understood to encompass robust First Amendment protections to

01:15:21ensure that the FCC cannot use it to chill speech?

01:15:26Now, that may be a little bit of a backhanded way of joining the defiance.

01:15:31I can't say I agree with Ted Cruz about Jimmy Kimball.

01:15:35I find Jimmy Kimball to be completely hilarious and handling this whole thing very well.

01:15:41But it is notable that Ted Cruz continues to put Donald Trump's FCC chairman's feet to the fire.

01:15:51He has done it over and over again.

01:15:54He has needled them for veering off of their obligations and, in fact, veering towards running over the First Amendment.

01:16:04And for that, we applaud him.

01:16:06For that, I reluctantly say, Ted Cruz, come join us.

01:16:12Anyway, that's who's joining the defiance.

01:16:14Maybe, potentially, I don't know.

01:16:15Like I said, we'll see if he signs up at defiance.org as a member.

01:16:19I'm not going to hold my breath, but I'm glad that Ted Cruz is showing a little bit of courage

01:16:23here.

01:16:24Xander, what's your take?

01:16:25I suspect you're moving to Texas to vote for him.

01:16:27So, you know, as someone who used to have donors donate every time Cruz tweeted and it went to black

01:16:35-led organizing his state, probably not moving to Texas to go hang out with Cruz.

01:16:40I've been in his opposition for a while.

01:16:43But this is not hard.

01:16:44Fighting fascism is not hard.

01:16:46Fight for free speech.

01:16:47Fight for our Bill of Rights.

01:16:49Fight for our Constitution.

01:16:50People across the ideological spectrum can do it.

01:16:54And maybe we've just become so cynical about people doing that, especially in Trump's Republican Party.

01:17:03But it's nice to see it happen over and over and over again.

01:17:06It's honestly given me a lot of hope the last couple of weeks that even with the Republican majority in

01:17:11both houses, we may, in fact, be able to defy him with this set of Congress people before the midterms

01:17:19in meaningful ways.

01:17:20In very meaningful ways, including what we talked about today.

01:17:25So, folks, I know you're tired of hearing it.

01:17:27Miles, we know the web address, defiance.org slash troops.

01:17:31Do it.

01:17:32If you care about the rule of law in this country, if you care about U.S. service members, help

01:17:37them get protection.

01:17:39We're not telling them that they need to go defy the president.

01:17:42That's not what we are doing.

01:17:43We are telling them that resources are available if they are concerned about orders they have received.

01:17:49And that might be helping U.S. service members figure out that orders they've received are legal.

01:17:55That's just as important as helping them figure out if an order they've received is not legal.

01:18:01Because either way, they are going to make a great decision of consequence in their lives and the life of

01:18:07our nation.

01:18:08So help us do that, friends.

01:18:10This is a very important cause to be involved in.

01:18:13I will just say a big thank you to folks joining us today.

01:18:17If you are here because you're a member of defiance.org and you're here for the weekly mission briefing, which

01:18:22we do every Wednesday at 5 p.m. Eastern, you might be missing out on the other days.

01:18:27Because every single weekday, we are live at 5 p.m. Eastern on Substack, on YouTube, on X, maybe on

01:18:36other platforms I don't know about.

01:18:37We're live talking about the news of the day.

01:18:41We do these dispatches for the defiant because it is important for us to stay informed if we are going

01:18:47to make the best decisions as a club of courageous Americans on how to fight back.

01:18:53We've got to be aligned on what's happening and what matters and how we can do something about it.

01:18:58So please join us on those other days for Defiance Daily.

01:19:01Reminder, tomorrow, actually, there will be no show on Thursday.

01:19:04So even though I told you to join us every day at 5 p.m., tomorrow is an exception.

01:19:08A lot of crazy things happening around the holidays, namely air travel that gets screwed up.

01:19:14And so tomorrow, we're going to give you a break.

01:19:16Do whatever you want at 5 p.m. Eastern.

01:19:17But don't forget to join us this Friday because we're going to round out the year with a special conversation

01:19:23about a year of defiance.

01:19:26You may be thinking a lot of dark things happened this year, but a lot of really, really good things

01:19:31happened this year.

01:19:32And I am personally feeling quite bullish about the direction that the defiance is going in this country.

01:19:39So join us Friday at 5 p.m. Eastern for that closeout conversation for the year before we take two

01:19:44weeks off on a programming break.

01:19:46And then finally, finally, finally, tonight, if you're going to be watching the president's speech, watch it with us.

01:19:53Watch it with us here.

01:19:54We'll be going live just before Donald Trump speaks live to the nation from the Oval Office at 9 p

01:20:01.m. Eastern.

01:20:02So you can tune in just a little bit before 9.

01:20:04We'll be starting the conversation about that address.

01:20:07We still don't know fully what the president's going to be talking about tonight.

01:20:10A lot of speculation that he's going to be talking potentially about war in Venezuela or at least this embargo

01:20:17of oil boats and potentially his agenda for the years to come.

01:20:23Either way, it will be important for us to assess what the president is doing or thinking about doing.

01:20:29So join us tonight for that conversation.

01:20:31We have some special guests.

01:20:32We will be joined by former U.S. Senator John Tester and a number of others who will be in

01:20:38that conversation.

01:20:38So come be with us for that tonight.

01:20:41Thank you for joining Defiance Daily Dispatches for the Defiant.

01:20:46As always, friends, stay loud, stay brave and stay together.

01:21:20Defiance Daily Dispatches for the Defiant.

Trump PANICS as DEFIANCE Mission Launches | Scott Goodstein

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