- 2 days ago
The Giants are keeping Joe Schoen as their GM. Was this a good move for the Giants? Can they rise under John Harbaugh?
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00:01Grant and Danny
00:02without Danny today. He is
00:04on vacay in Vegas. Toby
00:06Altizer sitting in. You're listening to the fan.
00:09So I mentioned that the Giants
00:10got a deal done with Joe
00:12Shane. He will hang around
00:14as their general manager, working with
00:16John Harbaugh into the future.
00:18A multi-year extension.
00:20This is one of those stories,
00:22Toby, where you find out nobody really knows
00:24anything. Do you remember
00:26about a year ago at this time
00:28when everyone said it's a make-or-break year?
00:30Or then six months ago at this time
00:32when it was obvious they would be hiring a new head
00:34coach because they'd blown Day Bowl out.
00:36And the idea was there's no way they're going to keep
00:38Joe Shane and have him heavily
00:40involved in that process. Then when they
00:42hired John Harbaugh, everybody said
00:44well, Harbaugh is going to be a
00:45Ron Rivera-esque, remember the phrase,
00:48coach-centric leader, where
00:50he's going to basically call the shots. He's going to
00:52run the show there. Joe Shane's
00:54days are numbered. And then the subsequent
00:56report, I still remember this from like, I don't know,
00:58maybe a month ago
00:59during free agency that he was
01:01cooked. Him and Harbaugh aren't seeing eye to eye.
01:04These are things that were being written
01:06about in the New York media, speculated
01:07about in the media, and then he gets a
01:09multi-year extension. And at least the initial
01:12storyline is he and Harbaugh have hit it off
01:13and seem to really like working together.
01:16Nobody knows anything.
01:18Yeah, as soon as I saw this
01:20notification come across the timeline,
01:22I audibly laughed.
01:24I was like, I don't know what the heck this is.
01:25I mean, Joe Shane is the
01:27sole reason why we're not getting
01:29off-season hard knocks anymore.
01:31Right? Like that whole process of
01:33Saquon Barkley and not bringing him back and
01:35the owner going, oh man, it's going to be tough to see him
01:37if he goes to Philadelphia. And sure enough, they go and
01:39win a Super Bowl, all that stuff. He's like
01:4298% of the reason why
01:43we don't have that anymore.
01:44I believe that is why everybody
01:47assumed his days were numbered.
01:49Because you knew the exchanges
01:51he's had with ownership about things that
01:53blew up. I just, we don't get to see
01:55that with everybody. So you don't know how normal
01:57it is that an owner will say to a GM,
02:00hey, I really hope this doesn't backfire
02:01and then it does. And you still
02:03can keep your job if you do enough other things well.
02:05But you're right. I mean,
02:06the worst thing that ever happened
02:09to him was that hard knocks series.
02:11100%. Because he came off looking
02:13so badly, just as an organization
02:15they looked so terribly, that
02:17he is now the butt of jokes constantly.
02:19No matter what he does, no matter who they bring in
02:21or how many things he gets right,
02:23he has been filed
02:25into a category, essentially,
02:28of boob.
02:30Unserious.
02:31A guy that couldn't land Barkley
02:33and that made these public comments.
02:35And the videos are still out there.
02:36I mean, they still circulate
02:37on social media all the time.
02:39But how many other executives
02:41are just like that, I wonder?
02:42He's the one that got exposed.
02:43He's the one we saw.
02:44Maybe it's more the norm than we think.
02:46Danny and I would constantly talk about,
02:48do you remember when they hired
02:49their coordinator, Bowen
02:51from the Titans?
02:52Yeah.
02:53And Brian Dable, at the time,
02:54the head coach, offensive-minded,
02:55was helping pick the defensive coordinator.
02:58So he interviewed with a bunch
02:59of these guys.
03:00And then he came into the office
03:01and he's like,
03:02I really like Bowen.
03:02I want to do that.
03:03And he's like, okay, why?
03:05And we're like seeing this on Hard Knocks.
03:06I still think it was the best series
03:07we ever got because of the access.
03:08I don't know if the Giants
03:09just didn't actually watch it first
03:11to edit things out or what.
03:13But they let us see a lot.
03:14Yeah.
03:14But I still remember, you know,
03:16Dable saying, oh, well,
03:18they've ranked fifth against
03:20the run last year
03:21and fourth the year before that
03:22or whatever the numbers were.
03:23And I'm like, dude,
03:24you sound like a guy
03:25on my fantasy text thread.
03:27You have to be looking at
03:29more than rushing yards per attempt
03:31to determine if this is
03:32the coordinator that you want.
03:33Correct.
03:34That was how basic it was.
03:36And that was the whole series
03:37was like that.
03:38Yeah.
03:38It made him look very, very bad.
03:39So it's kind of funny
03:41to see him get extended.
03:42And it's honestly funny looking.
03:44You think, okay,
03:45maybe there's something where
03:46there's a good draft history
03:48or something or a reason
03:49why he's sticking around.
03:50And there really isn't.
03:51I mean, when you look back,
03:52he took over in 2022.
03:54You go back to that draft,
03:56Kayvon Thibodeau.
03:57You have Evan Neal,
03:58who has been a disaster for them.
04:00Thibodeau has been up and down.
04:01He demolishes Washington,
04:02but it's not like
04:03he's been anything spectacular
04:04for a top five pick.
04:06Wandale Robinson was good,
04:07but you look through
04:08the rest of that draft
04:08and there's not a whole lot
04:10that's all that impressive.
04:11I guess Micah McFadden
04:12would be in there.
04:13Deontay Banks was the
04:14first round pick the next year.
04:15You had neighbors two years ago
04:17who looks like a really good player,
04:19but obviously got hurt last year.
04:20And it's just like,
04:21it's not like there's
04:22a great draft history either.
04:24So I don't quite get the allure there.
04:26But at the same point,
04:27maybe John Harbaugh,
04:28having worked with him
04:29for a couple of months,
04:30was like, all right,
04:31well, we can make this work
04:32and you can be the executive
04:33I work with.
04:34And, you know,
04:35maybe you're not going to be able
04:36to get a better executive
04:36knowing that they're going to
04:37walk into the building
04:38and be number two in charge.
04:40It is stunning to me
04:41that he got an extension
04:42because they're 13-38
04:45over the last three seasons.
04:4723-25.
04:48They're 25 games under .500.
04:52He was a GM
04:54that took him to the playoffs
04:54in year one,
04:55a la Adam Peters.
04:56They didn't go to the
04:57NFC Championship game,
04:58but they did win a playoff game.
04:59Effectively, you know,
05:00they were one win away
05:00from what Washington did
05:01in his first season.
05:02That was as a 9-7-1 team.
05:04It was not 12 wins.
05:05But remember,
05:06they upset Minnesota on the road.
05:08Daniel Jones ate the Vikings
05:09for lunch that day.
05:10His lone playoff win
05:12to this point.
05:13And then they ended up
05:14getting blown out
05:15by the Philadelphia Eagles
05:16the following week
05:17in round two of the playoffs,
05:18which is something
05:19we can relate to
05:19in the nation's capital here
05:20when you're going on
05:21a nice little run
05:22and then the Eagles
05:22blew you out of the water.
05:24But since then,
05:25they have won 13 games
05:26and lost 38 games under Shane.
05:27And yet,
05:28when they fired Daybull,
05:29he was the one
05:30running the coaching search.
05:31He brings in Harbaugh,
05:32and it felt like
05:33he effectively hired
05:34his replacement too.
05:36Because by hiring Harbaugh,
05:38you brought in a guy
05:39that's going to be the CEO
05:40of that organization.
05:41He is not just going to
05:43answer to Joe Shane.
05:45Shane likely answers to him.
05:47I mean,
05:47Harbaugh is coming in there.
05:48Remember,
05:49that was actually
05:49one of the reports
05:50that we saw from Schefter.
05:51I think it was at the end.
05:52Because we thought
05:54Harbaugh had taken that job
05:56days before he actually did.
05:58And then everyone's going,
05:59well, what's going on?
05:59And there was some type
06:00of back and forth
06:01over final say in personnel,
06:03maybe it sounded like.
06:04But the quote from Shane this week,
06:06and I just dismissed it
06:07when he said it.
06:08After the draft,
06:08he was sitting there
06:09at a press conference
06:10next to John Harbaugh,
06:11and he said,
06:11we were able to get
06:12on the same page
06:13right off the bat
06:13in terms of what
06:14we were looking for
06:15and in terms of team building,
06:17trying to find
06:18the right type of guys
06:19that fit our scheme
06:19and our system.
06:20We were aligned
06:21from day one.
06:22So it's been great.
06:23It's been a really good
06:24offseason for us.
06:26That went in conflict
06:27to what a lot of the
06:28Giants media was saying
06:29about their relationship.
06:30But based on this extension,
06:32unless you think
06:33it's phony
06:33and this is
06:33Monday Night Football,
06:35Donovan McNabb,
06:35and he's getting cut
06:36at the end of the year anyway,
06:38maybe they are
06:39getting along
06:39pretty swimmingly.
06:40I'd have to imagine,
06:41Toby,
06:42this just means
06:42Joe Shane saying yes a lot.
06:44Yeah, I would imagine.
06:44So it's probably
06:45just one of those things
06:46too, Grant,
06:46where they're like,
06:47okay, if we move on
06:47from Joe Shane,
06:48it's not like you're
06:49going to be able to get
06:50a better quality guy in
06:51just because of the fact
06:52that John Harbaugh
06:53is in charge.
06:54So, all right,
06:55have we been able
06:56to work together?
06:56Sure, okay,
06:57let's just have somebody
06:58that's been in the building
06:59then and let's just
06:59keep this thing going.
07:01I think the Giants
07:01are actually going to be
07:02super competitive this year.
07:04I think they're going to be
07:05a pain to deal with
07:06in the division.
07:06They're not going to
07:07make the playoffs
07:08and I don't think
07:08they're going to
07:10even finish over 500,
07:11but right now,
07:13if you told me
07:13they're going to go
07:156-11,
07:17which has kind of
07:17been the norm,
07:18or like 8-9,
07:20I would assume
07:21they go 8-9.
07:22I'm bullish on them.
07:24The Malik Neighbors news
07:25is bad.
07:25We're going to get into it
07:26in the audio vault today
07:28because we've got some audio
07:29from John Harbaugh,
07:30but his status for week one
07:31is now up in the air.
07:32Sounds like there's
07:33a chance
07:35he does not play
07:36their season opener
07:37against the Cowboys
07:38and isn't ready
07:38until two or three weeks
07:39into the season.
07:40He tore his ACL,
07:41as you mentioned,
07:42midway through last year
07:43and then we found out
07:44last week
07:45he had a secondary
07:46and an additional
07:47cleanup of the knee
07:49after the fact
07:50because there was
07:50something floating around
07:51and clearly the surgery
07:53didn't go perfectly.
07:54This is one of those things
07:55where we think
07:56ACL tears now,
07:57it's just 12 months,
07:58set it, forget it,
07:59no problem,
08:00this is a normal injury.
08:01Most of the time,
08:03Tommy John,
08:03same way,
08:04pitcher's going to have
08:05Tommy John.
08:05It happens,
08:0612 months,
08:06we'll see him back
08:07on the mound.
08:07It's a really serious procedure.
08:09You don't always know
08:10how it's going to go
08:11and for their best
08:12offensive weapon,
08:13Malik Nabors,
08:13it has not gone well.
08:14Yeah, especially for a guy
08:15that's built on explosiveness
08:17and wasn't necessarily
08:18always thought of
08:19as the crispest route runner
08:20when he was coming out.
08:21It was thought to be
08:21more of a yards after catch,
08:23really good explosive athlete
08:25and that's why a lot of people
08:26liked him over other receivers
08:27in that draft
08:27because of what he can do
08:28and if he's someone
08:31that's taken away
08:31just even a little bit,
08:32that's a totally different player
08:34than what you got
08:34when you drafted him
08:35who looked like someone
08:36that was going to dominate
08:37this division for a while
08:37so that'll be interesting to see.
08:39I mean, I don't know
08:40if I'm as high on the Giants
08:42just because I'm still
08:43up in the air
08:44on what their quarterback
08:45situation's going to be.
08:46Is Jackson Dart going to be
08:47a really good player
08:48or is he just a solid quarterback?
08:50What do you think of Dart so far?
08:52I think he's shown flashes
08:53of what he can be.
08:54He's another one though.
08:55I mean, he's bigger than Jaden,
08:56obviously, so, you know,
08:58when he does some of the stuff
08:59that he does
09:00in terms of getting hit as much,
09:01he can probably handle it
09:02a little bit better
09:03but you can't keep doing that
09:04if you want to be long
09:05for this league.
09:06So, I'll be interested.
09:07I liked him coming out.
09:08He was someone
09:09that I thought of
09:10as more of a project
09:12and I think he showed
09:13flashes last season
09:14but still needs some time.
09:15I think Harbaugh's going to
09:16do everything possible
09:17to help him out.
09:18They're going to try
09:18to run the football,
09:19do all those sorts of things.
09:20So, I do agree
09:21they're going to be
09:21a little bit friskier.
09:22I don't know if I could go
09:23eight and nine for it
09:24but it's one of those things
09:25where maybe they only win
09:26five or six games
09:27but it's not like
09:28they're getting the doors
09:29blown off when they lose
09:30those 12 games.
09:31It's, hey, we lost
09:32by four points in that one.
09:33We'll try to flip it
09:33around the next season.
09:35I wasn't a huge Dart guy
09:36coming out.
09:38Didn't have to study
09:39or really get locked in
09:40on any of the quarterbacks
09:41last year
09:41because Washington
09:42had their guy
09:42but just from the
09:44generic college football
09:45that I watch
09:45I thought he was a good
09:46little player
09:46but takes a lot of hits.
09:49One of those guys
09:50who's like super cocky
09:51on the field
09:51just wasn't my favorite player
09:53and he was well-traveled
09:53USC to Mississippi
09:54finished at Ole Miss
09:55pretty well.
09:57I really liked his game
09:58last year
09:59but he has two things
10:00he's got to clean up.
10:01You mentioned the first.
10:03You think Jaden Daniels
10:04gets hit too much?
10:05Yeah.
10:05This guy is reckless.
10:06He is legitimately
10:08unaware of his surroundings
10:10in a way that
10:11people say Jaden is
10:12and I don't think it's true.
10:13I think Daniels
10:14has had some fluke injuries
10:15and some things
10:16and you wonder
10:16based on his size
10:17and just his overall
10:19makeup body-wise
10:20is he going to be able
10:21to be durable?
10:22Jackson Dart's
10:23decently put together.
10:24He's 6'2 and change
10:25right around 225-227 pounds
10:27something like that.
10:28There's a lot of quarterbacks
10:29in the league
10:29that are playing at 205-210.
10:31So he's a decent-sized guy
10:33but he gets crushed
10:36and he tries to deliver blows.
10:39What is that?
10:40And all year long
10:41it was a story.
10:42I remember there was
10:42a full week
10:43of just all the
10:44talking head stupid
10:45loud shouty ESPN shows
10:47Jackson Dart
10:48taking hits
10:49and I turn on the game
10:50first quarter
10:51first drive
10:52the following week
10:53and he basically
10:54dives forward
10:55and tries to lower
10:56his shoulder in traffic
10:57and gets blown up
10:58and you're like
10:58if that was the biggest story
11:00in New York all week
11:01and that's how you come out
11:03the first game
11:03it reminded me of Robert Griffin
11:05honestly
11:05when he like would take
11:06one of these shots
11:07on the sideline
11:08after we had talked about it
11:09for three weeks in a row.
11:10So he's got to clean that up.
11:12He also turned the ball
11:13over way too much
11:13and that is very common
11:15for a young quarterback
11:15but for me
11:17not all turnovers
11:19are created equal
11:20and he had a carelessness
11:22to his protection
11:23of the football.
11:24When he's running
11:25no one's around him
11:26he just loses the ball
11:27on a fumble
11:27or he's leaving the pocket
11:28and the ball gets
11:30dropped down below the belt
11:31and someone just taps at it
11:32those types of things
11:33which are fixable
11:34but he has to get them fixed
11:35because they were costly.
11:36But he had 15 touchdowns
11:37and five picks last year
11:38so if he's legit good
11:40and can stay on the field
11:42I actually think
11:43they're going to be
11:43pretty solid.
11:45They made a lot of changes
11:46to that team too.
11:47This is a different
11:48looking roster.
11:49Malachi Fields
11:50in the third round
11:51Washington passed on
11:52people like the big wide receiver
11:53from Notre Dame
11:54they draft him
11:55they signed Darnell Mooney
11:56from Atlanta
11:58they brought over
11:58Calvin Austin
11:59from Pittsburgh
12:00so you've got
12:01Mooney, Fields, Austin
12:03with Neighbors
12:04and Slayton
12:04in the receiving core
12:05most talent
12:06they've given a quarterback
12:07there in years
12:08they've got a running game
12:09that I think under Harbaugh
12:11is going to be good
12:11you know how I feel
12:12about Scadaboo
12:13it's three yards
12:13and a cloud of dust
12:14but I think Tyrone Tracy
12:15is pretty decent
12:16Devin Singletary
12:17the former Bill and Texan
12:18is still on that roster
12:19is very solid
12:20the number one tight end
12:21on the market this year
12:22was Isaiah Likely
12:23they signed him
12:24to be a weapon
12:24and they upgraded
12:25their offensive line
12:26by bringing in Francis Maui Noah
12:28who they're kicking inside
12:29to guard
12:30from the University of Miami
12:31I think he could be
12:32C. Sam Cosme
12:33he was a tackle in college
12:34moves into guard
12:35and is a stalwart
12:36and they've got
12:37three new starters
12:37on their defensive line
12:38to go along with
12:39Brian Burns
12:40getting after the quarterback
12:41they drafted Arvel Reese
12:42they signed Tremaine Edmonds
12:43at linebacker
12:44who's a stud from the Bears
12:45they brought in Greg Newsome
12:46to help their corner room
12:47which was bad last year
12:48they made a lot of upgrades
12:50this is a
12:52a different looking team
12:53with a new coaching staff
12:54Harbaugh on
12:56kind of overseeing everything
12:58at the podium every day
13:00then you've got
13:00Matt Nagy on offense
13:01and Denard Wilson on defense
13:03I like this staff
13:05they brought over
13:05Chris Horton
13:06the special teams coordinator
13:07the former safety here
13:08to be their special teams coach
13:09I'm in on the Giants
13:11yeah I think they're
13:12going to be solid
13:12they're not going to be
13:13a pushover
13:14I just
13:14again when you get
13:16into a tight game
13:17which the NFL
13:17has done a fantastic job
13:19as a league
13:19of making it so
13:20that so many games
13:22I mean there's a reason
13:23that red zone
13:24in the witching hour
13:25is must see television
13:26even though I'm not
13:26a red zone guy
13:27there's a reason why
13:29people love it so much
13:30is because there's so many
13:31games that are close
13:31at that time
13:32so when it gets down
13:34to that
13:34it relies on
13:35your guys coming up
13:36making big time plays
13:37especially at the
13:38quarterback position
13:39I don't know that
13:39Dart's quite there yet
13:40but you look at that defense
13:41and if they have
13:44a solid coordinator
13:45who can get things
13:46going in the right direction
13:47and a solidly coached team
13:48which I think they do now
13:49I mean you're going to
13:50have pass rush
13:51because look at the number
13:52of guys that they have
13:53Abdul Carter I think
13:54is going to be much
13:55better this season
13:55in a second year
13:56who was thought to be
13:57this really really
13:58good pass rusher
13:59you add Arvel Reese
14:00and we'll see about
14:01the secondary
14:02I still have some
14:02questions about some
14:03of their guys back there
14:04Adebo is a good player
14:05their secondary is bad
14:06their pass rush is good
14:08yes
14:08and it makes up for it
14:09but their pass rush
14:10needs to be really good
14:11yes
14:11because they just don't
14:12have enough on the back end
14:13yeah so I'm curious
14:14to see exactly what
14:15that looks like for them
14:16but yeah it's not
14:17going to be one of those
14:17things where you know
14:18in previous seasons
14:19even though you know
14:20when it comes to a
14:21division game
14:21nothing's ever guaranteed
14:22but it felt like okay
14:23you can make some hay
14:25against the Giants
14:25it's not going to be
14:26that easy this year
14:27they should still beat
14:28them but it's not
14:28going to be one of those
14:29okay you just go to
14:30Meadowlands and win
14:31that one easier
14:32they come in here
14:32it's alright you just
14:33roll it's not going to
14:34be as easy against
14:35this Giants team
14:36the division I think
14:38has a chance in the
14:39next two years to
14:40become the best in
14:41football I don't see
14:42Philly as long as
14:44Howie Roseman's calling
14:45the shots and as
14:45layered as they are
14:46taking a massive step
14:48back I think they
14:48regress a little bit
14:49this year but that's
14:50an above 500 division
14:51championship caliber team
14:52more likely to win 11
14:5412 games than 9 or 10
14:55games Dallas is my pick
14:57to win the division
14:57which I know is a
14:58little bit of a hot
14:59take but I think
14:59they're going to be
15:00improved on defense
15:01and their offense is
15:02going to cook and
15:03then you've got the
15:03Giants who we're both
15:04saying are going to be
15:05more competitive the
15:06commanders should be a
15:0710 win wild card type
15:08team that's where I've
15:09got them so you could
15:10potentially as soon as
15:12next season have four
15:13teams at eight wins or
15:14more maybe the following
15:15year have four teams
15:16over 500 three teams in
15:17the playoffs like
15:18that's that's the fun
15:19stuff when everyone's
15:21hating each other
15:21because everybody's good
15:22at the top of the east
15:23we could be trending
15:24toward that the hardball
15:25hire was big yeah big
15:27time I mean when you
15:27look at it obviously
15:28there's a natural
15:29hatred of the Cowboys
15:30we're all growing up
15:31ingrained in that or
15:32you grew up as a big
15:34part of that rivalry so
15:35there was a hatred
15:36there there's obviously
15:37a hatred between
15:37Washington and Philly
15:39fans it's not that
15:40there's not a hatred
15:41between Washington and
15:42Giants fans because we
15:43can't stand New Yorkers
15:44but at the same point
15:46that hasn't felt like
15:47much of a rivalry
15:48recently just because of
15:49the way that it's gone
15:50with the two teams so
15:51it'll be fun when
15:52everything's competitive
15:53I think football's at
15:55its best when the NFC
15:56East is a driving force
15:57in the league so yeah
15:59it'll be good when you've
16:00got all four teams being
16:01competitive fighting each
16:02other for that NFC East
16:03ground double play comes
16:04your way next on Grant
16:05and Danny without Danny
16:06today in 20 minutes
16:07those tickets to see
16:09Jason all
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