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60 Minutes - Season 58 - Episode 23: Targeting Americans; Secretary Hegseth
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00:05The worst pain I have ever felt, it felt like a vice gripping my brain stem was there.
00:14He's one of many U.S. government officials who tell us they were hit out of nowhere
00:19by an overpowering force that inflicts lifelong disabilities.
00:25I immediately felt fullness in my head and just a piercing headache.
00:31Tonight, the decade-long mystery may be solved.
00:3560 Minutes has details of a classified intelligence mission
00:39that discovered a new kind of weapon built by a foreign adversary.
00:45I mean, if we acknowledge that this was a state actor that was doing this,
00:48it is essentially a declaration of war against the United States.
00:56With American and Israeli strikes in Iran entering their second week,
01:01you will hear tonight from Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth about what the U.S. hopes to achieve.
01:06You said this is not a regime-change war, but the regime has changed.
01:10That's obvious.
01:11Can you square the two?
01:13Sure.
01:14Go ahead.
01:17I'm Leslie Stahl.
01:19I'm Scott Pelley.
01:20I'm Anderson Cooper.
01:21I'm Sharon Alfonsi.
01:23I'm John Wertheim.
01:24I'm Cecilia Vega.
01:25I'm Bill Whitaker.
01:27Those stories end in our last minute,
01:29a Ford reflects on what drives American innovation.
01:33Tonight on 60 Minutes.
01:42Tonight, we have details of a classified U.S. intelligence mission
01:48that has obtained a previously unknown weapon
01:51that may finally unlock a mystery.
01:54Since at least 2016, U.S. diplomats, spies, and military officers
02:00have suffered crippling brain injuries.
02:03They've told of being hit by an overwhelming force,
02:07damaging their vision, hearing, sense of balance, and cognition.
02:12But the government has doubted their stories.
02:16They've been called delusional.
02:18Well, now 60 Minutes has learned that a weapon that can inflict these injuries
02:23was obtained overseas and secretly tested on animals on a U.S. military base.
02:30We've investigated this mystery for nine years.
02:35This is our fourth story, called Targeting Americans.
02:39Despite official government doubt, we never stopped reporting
02:43because of the haunting stories we heard, like this.
03:02Chris and Heidi asked us not to use their last name.
03:07They met in the Air Force Academy.
03:09Chris retired as a lieutenant colonel working on highly classified spy satellites.
03:16He told us, near Washington, D.C., he was struck by an unseen force five times in five months.
03:25The second attack, I was standing in my kitchen looking out at the backwoods,
03:30and it felt like an immediate vice on my head,
03:35immediately disoriented, confused, and dizzy.
03:37The third attack, towards the end of September, I was sitting in our living room,
03:44and instantaneously, all of the muscles within my spine immediately cramped,
03:50much like a charley horse, and my spine felt like it was on fire, so very hot and sharp.
03:55The fifth one was by far the worst, and that was early December,
03:59and I woke up with a full-body convulsion.
04:03The worst pain I have ever felt, it felt like a vice gripping my brain stem, was there.
04:11All in your own home?
04:13All in my home in Northern Virginia, and Heidi was within my proximity for the last two attacks.
04:19Heidi, what happened to you?
04:21Right at the beginning of January, I woke up with immense joint pain everywhere,
04:27with shoulder pain in my left shoulder, out of the blue, no trauma.
04:32Bones in her shoulder were dissolving, something called osteolysis.
04:38She had to have surgery.
04:39Has there been any lasting effect?
04:43Significant.
04:43So I'm on two neurological drugs every day, and without them, I have very severe symptoms.
04:51I had sustained significant damage to multiple organ systems.
04:55You believe you were attacked?
04:57Yes.
04:58By a foreign adversary?
04:59Yes.
05:00In the line of duty?
05:01Yes.
05:02It's a belief shared by officials and their families that we've met over the years.
05:07See if you notice what we heard.
05:10There was this FBI agent.
05:12And bam, inside my right ear, it was like a dentist drilling on steroids.
05:19This Commerce Department official in China.
05:22I could feel this sound in my head.
05:26It was intense pressure on both of my temples.
05:31This early victim was among cases from Cuba, which gave the mystery the name Havana Syndrome.
05:38Severe ear pain started.
05:40So I liken it to if you put a Q-tip too far and you bounced off your eardrum.
05:44Well, imagine taking a sharp pencil and just kind of poke in that.
05:47And this wife of a Justice Department official posted in Europe.
05:52And it just pierced my ears, came in my left side, felt like it came through the window into my
05:59left ear.
06:00I immediately felt fullness in my head and just a piercing headache.
06:06Multiple surgeries have tried to repair bones in her inner ear and her skull.
06:12Many victims have lifelong disabilities.
06:15What struck us about their stories is this.
06:19People who never met tell it the same way.
06:24The government acknowledges the injuries and often pays for health care.
06:28But for years, it has doubted the cause.
06:32Victims have been told it may be atmospheric or environmental.
06:36A virus, a pre-existing condition, or, as the FBI put it, in an early investigation, mass hysteria.
06:46The official word published in 2023 and still standing says it is very unlikely these are attacks by a foreign
06:55adversary.
06:56Do you believe the victims?
06:58Absolutely.
06:59What we're hearing about now is...
07:01Dr. David Relman is a Stanford University professor of medicine asked by the government to lead two investigations.
07:10His panels included doctors, physicists, engineers, and others.
07:15Their reports in 2020 and 2022 proposed a theory.
07:20The two panels, the investigations that I know well, both concluded much the same,
07:27which was that the most plausible explanation for a subset of these cases was a form of radiofrequency or microwave
07:38energy.
07:39Microwaves are a range of frequencies in the electromagnetic spectrum.
07:44Various microwave frequencies are generated by your oven, radar systems, TV transmitters.
07:51Even your phone, Wi-Fi, and Bluetooth use microwaves.
07:56Dr. David Relman told us his investigations found that one country had done a great deal of research on creating
08:05something different,
08:07a unique pattern of microwaves that can damage the brain.
08:12In both of our investigations, we found the large majority of work to have been conducted in the former Soviet
08:19Union.
08:19And what they found was that effects could range from loss of consciousness to seizures to memory lapses,
08:31inability to concentrate, headaches, intense pressure, pain, disorientation, difficulty with balance.
08:39Many of the things that we heard about from victims of Havana syndrome.
08:45The Russians had been doing experiments in this area decades ago?
08:50Decades ago, yes, of a wide variety of sorts.
08:54In a previous story on this mystery, we found a 2014 reference to a weapon.
09:00Compelled by a lawsuit, the National Security Agency confirmed intelligence of a high-powered microwave system weapon associated with a
09:12hostile country.
09:14But the CIA believed such a weapon would need enormous power and be as big as a truck, so not
09:23likely.
09:23Years later, when Dr. Relman's expert panel suggested these could be microwave injuries, the idea was shelved by federal officials.
09:34And what really unnerves me is the confidence with which others have dismissed or ignored this work,
09:46only to say, that's not possible, that's not plausible, I don't believe it, that's fine, but show me new evidence
09:55nobody has.
09:57Do you believe that your studies were downplayed by the U.S. government?
10:01By parts of the U.S. government? Absolutely.
10:05And not only downplayed, but dismissed.
10:09In some cases, buried.
10:13I started in March of 2015.
10:15Why buried? This man may know.
10:18He's a former CIA officer who asked us not to use his name.
10:23He is speaking tonight for the first time.
10:26In 2021, he volunteered to work on the CIA's investigation because of the suffering he'd seen among CIA officers and
10:38their families overseas.
10:39I mean, these were my colleagues, these were my friends, these were people I had worked with, and I saw
10:44lives that were destroyed, careers were ruined, people's kids were affected, they have lifelong developmental issues.
10:51People now are even still having cognitive issues and having all types of secondary effects years and years later.
10:58It became an emotional topic for me because I saw this happening, and I volunteered to work in the AHI
11:06unit, and I wanted to make a difference.
11:07He joined the so-called AHI investigation at CIA headquarters.
11:14A-H-I, because the government calls the cases not attacks, but anomalous health incidents.
11:23He expected to dig in to whether a foreign adversary, a so-called state actor, was behind this.
11:31But it didn't go that way.
11:33So one of the very first things that I heard when I arrived at the AHI unit was,
11:37our job is to bring down the temperature on AHI at headquarters.
11:42And that was a surprise to me.
11:44So bringing down the temperature is not, hey, let's go after the issue and find out what's going on.
11:49It became very much an emotional and almost kind of like a propaganda type thing.
11:54And by bring down the temperature, they meant what?
11:57It basically was saying, hey, we're going to work towards this being an atmospheric and environmental issue versus it being
12:02a state actor.
12:03And so they did not want people talking about it being a state actor.
12:05Because, he says, fear of the mysterious AHIs was creating havoc.
12:13That fear and paranoia you describe, how did that affect CIA officers and their families?
12:19Yeah, so personally, my own family left early for my tour by multiple months because we were worried that, you
12:27know, my family would be affected by AHI,
12:30whether we were at home when we were serving overseas or in the field just walking around.
12:35I saw multiple other officers short their tours, their families leave early, pick different locations where AHIs were not happening.
12:43And this was U.S. government-wide.
12:44This was not just relegated to CIA.
12:46What would you say was the attitude of your bosses toward the victims who had reported in?
12:52So this was one of the more disgusting things that I came across, to be honest, working in the AHI
12:57unit.
12:57I'll never forget, in one instance, a senior member of the AHI unit came into my office.
13:02And that officer came in and said, yeah, we're going to have a happy hour.
13:06We're all going to have simulated AHIs and drink together.
13:09And she basically emulated that she was having a stroke and making fun of the victims.
13:15And to me, that was deplorable.
13:18It was disgusting.
13:19There was no sense of, we're going to get to the bottom of this.
13:22No.
13:22The bottom of it was, we're going to prove that this is psychosomatic, atmospheric, and environmental.
13:27All of this, he says, led him to resign.
13:31I left because I saw the personal impact of this issue.
13:34And for me, it became a moral issue because they kept saying, our people are our highest priority.
13:39But when it came down to it, that wasn't the case from what I saw.
13:42And it was something that tore me up emotionally.
13:45I knew people who were affected by AHI, who were victims of AHI.
13:48I saw it destroy their families, their kids, their careers.
13:51It wasn't somewhere I could keep working after that.
13:54The investigation at the CIA essentially ended in 2022.
13:59But about the same time, a different classified mission was underway.
14:0560 Minutes has learned U.S. agents who investigate illicit arms dealers heard that a Russian criminal network was selling
14:13a microwave weapon.
14:15Our sources tell us undercover agents of the Department of Homeland Security bought the weapon in 2024.
14:23The mission cost about $15 million, funded by the Pentagon.
14:28When we come back, details of the weapon and the results of testing at a U.S. military base.
14:4460 Minutes has learned details of a classified microwave weapon that may explain mysterious brain injuries suffered by U.S.
14:54officials.
14:54We've been investigating these injuries for nine years.
14:58And now, our sources tell us this microwave weapon is portable, concealable, and uses relatively little power.
15:08Hundreds of possible attacks have been reported, including, we've learned, at CIA headquarters in Virginia,
15:16and at least two incidents on the grounds of the White House.
15:21For years, the government doubted the stories of the injured.
15:25But now, the victims, including former CIA officer Mark Polymeropoulos, hope that word of a newly discovered weapon will finally
15:35vindicate them.
15:37There's a part of this, Scott, that has to do with moral injury, and that's the idea of betrayal.
15:42You know, I worked for 26 years for the CIA.
15:44I think I was involved in every covert action program in the Middle East.
15:47I did some very interesting things for the U.S. government, always with the idea that they would have my
15:52back if I got jammed up.
15:53I just needed to get medical care when I came back, and they wouldn't even do that.
15:57So this moral injury, this sense of betrayal, is so acute with me.
16:02That's something that I can never forgive them for.
16:04Mark Polymeropoulos rose to an executive level at the CIA about the equivalent of a three-star general.
16:12He was awarded a top decoration for service.
16:16In 2017, he says he was overwhelmed in a hotel room in Moscow.
16:23I woke up in the middle of the night.
16:25It was a, no, I didn't hear any sound, but I woke up with incredible vertigo.
16:30The room was spinning.
16:31I had a blinding headache.
16:33I had tinnitus ringing in my ears, and I felt like I was going to be physically sick.
16:37It was a terrifying feeling where I'd lost control.
16:40You know, something that seriously happened to me.
16:42And I remember feeling, you know, that this is so unusual.
16:45I'd been shot at in places like Iraq and Afghanistan.
16:48I'd been in physical danger.
16:49But this was terrifying.
16:51He was treated for vertigo, migraines, loss of vision, and trouble with memory and concentration.
16:58Disabled, he retired.
17:01Later, in 2023, his own agency was among those that concluded it is very unlikely that he and the others
17:10were attacked by an adversary.
17:12Which, of course, to me, is a betrayal, because CIA is supposed to be about putting people first, and they
17:17did not.
17:18Are you saying this is a cover-up?
17:21This is a massive CIA cover-up.
17:23And I'll say this with great regret.
17:25It's an organization that I loved.
17:27I believe in the mission.
17:28I was really good at this job.
17:29To this day, I want to see the CIA operate in a strong and effective manner.
17:34But Polymeropolis and other victims have been doubted for years.
17:39Some in the CIA believe that a microwave weapon must be the size of a truck, and so not plausible.
17:47But that changed dramatically in 2024.
17:51Three independent sources from different agencies tell us that undercover Homeland Security agents purchased a miniaturized microwave weapon from a
18:03complex Russian criminal network.
18:06It's classified.
18:07We didn't see it.
18:08But it has been described to us.
18:10We are told it doesn't look anything like a gun.
18:13It's designed to be concealed and small enough to be carried by a person.
18:17It is silent and doesn't create heat like a microwave oven.
18:22Our sources say the device is programmable for different scenarios and can be operated by remote control.
18:30The range of the beam is several hundred feet.
18:34It can penetrate windows and drywall.
18:37The vital components were made in Russia.
18:40Our sources say the key is not the hardware but the software.
18:45The programming shapes a unique electromagnetic wave that rises and falls abruptly and pulses rapidly.
18:56Pulsed microwave radiation.
18:58Just what Dr. David Relman's investigations predicted.
19:02He wouldn't talk about classified information in our interview.
19:06But his research found that Russian scientists had been perfecting the concept for decades.
19:12And what the Russians spoke about was the importance of the energy being pulsed in order to have biological effects
19:20on humans.
19:21When you produce pulses like this, you can actually stimulate electrically active tissue like brain tissue and the heart for
19:29that matter,
19:30mimicking what the brain normally does.
19:32But now you're driving it with your pulses from the outside.
19:36An ideal stealth weapon.
19:39Ideal. Ideal.
19:41Because literally, the person feels as if this is in my head.
19:49Our confidential sources tell us the still classified weapon has been tested in a U.S. military lab for more
19:57than a year.
19:58Tests on rats and sheep show injuries consistent with those seen in humans.
20:05Also, as a separate part of the investigation, security camera videos have been collected that show Americans being hit.
20:15The videos are classified, but they were described to us.
20:18In one, a camera in a restaurant in Istanbul captured two FBI agents on vacation sitting at a table with
20:27their families.
20:28A man with a backpack walks in, and suddenly, everyone at the table grabs their head as if in pain.
20:37Our sources say another video comes from a stairwell in the U.S. Embassy in Vienna.
20:43The stairs lead to a secure facility.
20:46In the video, two people on the stairs suddenly collapse.
20:53Those videos and the weapon were among the reasons the Biden administration summoned about half a dozen victims to the
21:01White House,
21:02with about two months left in the president's term.
21:05I remember the day well because I helped to organize the meeting.
21:09By that time, Dr. Relman was a White House advisor.
21:12These folks in the Biden White House believed these people and believed that their injuries were not caused by known
21:21medical or environmental conditions the way the CIA was asserting.
21:24Which, again, to me, was just egregious.
21:27Some of the specific explanations the CIA had used were just crazy.
21:31A high-level CIA source has told us, and this is a direct quote,
21:37this is the biggest cover-up I've seen in my adult life, end quote.
21:42Do you believe it was a cover-up?
21:45Yes, I do.
21:50Through a variety of purposes and means, not necessarily as a pre-planned strategic operation,
22:03but in essence, it arrives at the same result.
22:07Help me understand what you think the motive could have been.
22:12We want this to go away so that we can resume normal operations.
22:18They had dug-in opinions going back years about the plausibility of a non-thermal microwave mechanism.
22:27In fact, when we began our work, we were briefed by their experts and told nothing in the scientific literature
22:36will support the idea that microwave energy can do things like this.
22:41They had made up their minds.
22:44It seems they had.
22:45And it almost seems as though consistency was more important than objectivity.
22:56One is that...
22:57Retired CIA officer Mark Polymeropoulos was in that White House meeting.
23:03And so what the Biden administration was telling us is that something had changed.
23:07New intelligence had come in.
23:08Now, I don't have a security clearance, and this was an unclassified meeting, so they could not put forward that
23:13this was based on new intelligence.
23:14But it was clear to me that that's what they were insinuating.
23:18Dr. Paul Friedrichs brought a message to the meeting.
23:21He's a retired major general, formerly one of the Pentagon's top doctors.
23:26He said very clearly, I'm sorry.
23:28I want to apologize to you.
23:30I've never seen in 30-plus years of practicing military medicine victims treated in such a terrible manner.
23:36And I just want to offer my apologies to you.
23:39What did that mean to you?
23:40I have chills now thinking about it.
23:42I had chills then.
23:43It was an indication that at least some people in the Biden administration and the Biden White House believed us.
23:48Any American would be embarrassed if you were to see how these people have been treated and then to be
23:54dismissed this way as malingerers or people who are manufacturing things for some other purpose.
24:05It's insulting.
24:06Our sources tell us that the Biden White House wrote a public statement backing the victims, but never released it.
24:15So far, the Trump administration has not changed the words in the 2023 intelligence assessment that it is very unlikely
24:24the victims were attacked.
24:25But our sources also tell us that the Trump administration has briefed top intelligence officials in Congress and shown them
24:34a classified picture of the weapon.
24:37We're told at the Pentagon, people who had investigated the attacks for the Department of Defense have been moved to
24:46a unit that develops new weapons.
24:50It was apparent to me that they did not take this issue seriously.
24:52Looking back, the CIA officer who quit the investigation in disgust told us, in his view, the CIA was careless
25:02against a ruthless adversary.
25:05If there was a foreign adversary, Russia in particular, would you think of this operation as a success?
25:15Absolutely.
25:16From an intelligence perspective, this would be a resounding success.
25:21Let's say one of these cases was real, and it created all this fear, paranoia, anxiety here in the United
25:26States and overseas.
25:29The impact of that is astronomical, and it's something you can't almost even calculate.
25:34And I don't think if it was a state actor, if it was the Russians, which I believe it is,
25:38I don't think that is something they would have put into their calculus, that it would have gotten this big.
25:42And I think they saw the fear, the paranoia that it created, and I think that's why it continued to
25:47happen for that period of time over a span of a year.
25:49Across the previous stories that we've done on this subject, I have had the same question.
25:55I think you are the first person who could plausibly answer the question.
26:00And that is, why?
26:02Why would the government want to bury this?
26:05I think it comes down to a political question.
26:07I mean, if we acknowledge that this was a state actor that was doing this, it is essentially a declaration
26:11of war against the United States, which has to have a response from the United States government.
26:17In my opinion, I don't know that the appetite was there to respond to the Russians at that time.
26:21In our 2024 story, a collaboration with Russian dissident magazine, theinsider.ru, we found evidence of Russian involvement.
26:34When this wife of a Justice Department official was seriously wounded overseas, an agent of Russian intelligence was in her
26:43vicinity.
26:44For this report, the Department of Defense declined to comment.
26:49The Office of the Director of National Intelligence, which oversees 18 agencies, including the CIA, told us that a new
26:58review of AHI will be comprehensive and complete,
27:04and we remain committed to delivering the truth.
27:08And I really hope that they do.
27:09The victims are waiting, including Chris and Heidi, who told us at the beginning of our story of being attacked
27:18five times in their home.
27:20I think it's time we as a country come to grips with the fact that the game has changed.
27:27Our adversaries are now able to reach out and touch us here in the United States, specifically at our homes.
27:34What do you believe the government owes you?
27:38I would say that for me and my military brothers and sisters who are hurt, being issued a Purple Heart
27:48is acknowledgement of our sacrifice to the country
27:54and the sacrifice we made that affects not only us, but also our families.
28:01The sources who informed our reporting told us the classified mission to obtain the microwave weapon points to a troubling
28:09reality.
28:10They say there are likely many of these devices, and if undercover agents could purchase one from gangsters,
28:18then the Russians have lost control of a stealth weapon that could be used by anyone, anywhere.
28:30Should military victims of Havana syndrome receive the Purple Heart?
28:34It's not something that should be all too controversial.
28:37At 60MinutesOvertime.com
28:47With U.S. and Israeli strikes on Iran in their second week, tonight you will hear from Defense Secretary Pete
28:54Hegseth.
28:55According to the Pentagon, more than 50,000 members of the U.S. military are involved in the execution of
29:01what it calls Operation Epic Fury.
29:03Our CBS News colleague, Major Garrett, spoke with Hegseth about the war with Iran.
29:16The U.S. military said it had already struck 3,000 targets inside Iran when we met with Secretary of
29:24Defense Pete Hegseth on Friday.
29:26The Speaker of the House said late this week, the mission is, and I'm quoting him directly here, nearly accomplished
29:33by all estimates. Is that true?
29:35We're very much on track, on plan. I was down at CENTCOM yesterday.
29:39So we might hear that and think it's almost over.
29:41Well, we're not flying a mission accomplished banner like George W. Bush on an aircraft carrier. We're not doing that,
29:47and we haven't done that.
29:48But we can be clear with the American people that this is not a fair fight, and that's on purpose.
29:53Our capabilities are overwhelming compared to what Iran's are.
29:57And frankly, when you combine our air force with the air force of the Israeli defense forces, it's the two
30:01most powerful air forces in the world.
30:04The ability for us to be up over the top and hunting with more conventional munitions, gravity bombs, 500-pound,
30:101,000-pound, 2,000-pound bombs on military targets.
30:14We haven't even really begun to start that effort of the campaign, which is going to showcase even more how
30:19we will execute on those objectives.
30:22The President said recently there will be no deal with Iran except unconditional surrender.
30:26What does that look like, unconditional surrender? How will you know it's real?
30:30It means we're fighting to win. It means we set the terms.
30:34We'll know when they're not capable of fighting.
30:36There'll be a point where they'll have no choice but to do that.
30:39Whether they know it or not, they will be combat ineffective.
30:41They will surrender.
30:43Typically, the understanding of a surrender is person-to-person.
30:46Is that what would be required in a matter like this?
30:49Well, there's a lot of different ways.
30:50Whether they want to admit it or not, whether their pride lets them say it out loud or not,
30:54it's President Trump who will set the terms of that.
30:57The President of Iran said yesterday that the U.S. demand for unconditional surrender is, quote,
31:03a dream that they should take to their grave.
31:06There was a very long war between Iran and Iraq, almost eight years,
31:10and they never surrendered in that war.
31:12And I'm just wondering if that factors into your calculus or the President's calculus at all.
31:16I mean, there was a really long fight that I was a part of and my generation was a part
31:18of in Iraq and Afghanistan
31:20where a lot of foolish approaches were used.
31:23This is war.
31:24This is conflict.
31:26This is bringing your enemy to their knees.
31:28Now, whether they will have a ceremony in Tehran Square and surrender, that's up to them.
31:35There are varying versions of how and why the war started when it did.
31:40Some normally enthusiastic supporters of the President have criticized him,
31:44suggesting Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu pulled the U.S. into a war that,
31:50to their minds, did not put American interests first.
31:54Do you want to address that criticism?
31:56All I know is I'm in the room every day and I see how President Trump operates
32:00and what he's putting first, and it's America, Americans, and American interests.
32:04It has been said that the Israelis, through Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli Prime Minister,
32:09provided on February 23rd key information about intelligence they had developed,
32:14about the likely whereabouts of Ali Khamenei and many in his inner circle.
32:18That the U.S. then checked it out through the CIA, confirmed that,
32:21and that was an opportunity that presented itself to the President.
32:25And that was the precipitating factor for this war.
32:28That's the way it's been reported.
32:29Is that accurate, Mr. Secretary?
32:30President Trump's approach has been our interest in advancing those interests from the beginning.
32:35And so the fact that intelligence was gathered, whether from Israelis or ours,
32:39and always checked by our intel agencies to make sure it's accurate.
32:44A lot of times the best way to start operations is a trigger-based or condition-based moment.
32:49And you can work together on whether that makes sense.
32:52But we were always controlling the throttle about whether or not to go or not go,
32:57and ultimately to advance American interests and protect American lives.
33:01Some might look at that sequence of events and say,
33:03well, that it was an opportunity more than an imminent threat.
33:07I mean, I think much of that discussion is silly and academic.
33:12They've been killing us for 48 years, 47 years.
33:15They have unabated nuclear ambitions.
33:18And when we obliterated their nuclear program at the end of the 12-day war in Operation Midnight Hammer,
33:23they should have come to the table and said, OK, we get it.
33:26You mean business.
33:27We're not going to have nukes.
33:28And they haven't.
33:29And as a result, when the president looks at it,
33:32generationally he sees a threat that would continue to gather.
33:35Despite the administration's claim that it obliterated Iran's nuclear infrastructure in June,
33:42international monitors estimate that Iran still has more than 970 pounds of nearly bomb-grade uranium.
33:50Is it possible to achieve the objectives President Trump has set before you
33:54if we don't locate and obtain and extract the highly enriched uranium?
34:00There's a lot of different ways we can get after that.
34:01They've used a conventional umbrella of missiles that was growing every single day,
34:07their production capacity, to try to cover over their nuclear blackmail ambitions.
34:12As far as how you get at that nuclear option,
34:14we'll make sure that their nuclear ambitions are never achieved.
34:18Will we take it out ourselves?
34:19Well, I would never tell you or anybody else what our options are.
34:22See, that's another thing.
34:23People keep asking...
34:24It's a legitimate question.
34:25It's a very fair question.
34:27People ask, boots on the ground, no boots on the ground, four weeks, two weeks, six weeks, go in, go
34:31in.
34:32President Trump knows, I know, you don't tell the enemy, you don't tell the press,
34:38you don't tell anybody what your limits would be on an operation.
34:42We're willing to go as far as we need to in order to be successful.
34:45Do we have any overt or covert forces inside Iran now?
34:52I wouldn't tell you that if we did.
34:54The only reason I ask is earlier this week you said no.
34:59Is that still the answer?
35:00Yeah, that's still the answer, but we reserve the right.
35:03We would be completely unwise if we did not reserve the right to take any particular option,
35:08whether it included boots on the ground or no boots on the ground.
35:10CBS News has three sources telling us that Russia is providing intelligence to Iran on U.S. positions and movements.
35:20The average American might hear that and think that's a big and dangerous deal, is it?
35:24Well, we're tracking everything.
35:25Our commanders are aware of everything.
35:27We have the best intelligence in the world.
35:28We're aware of who's talking to who, why they're talking to him, how accurate that information might be,
35:33how we factor that into our battle plans, our CENTCOM commander.
35:37So we know what's going on, and the president has an incredible knack at knowing how to mitigate those risks.
35:44And so the American people can rest assured, their commander-in-chief is well aware of who's talking to who,
35:49and anything that shouldn't be happening, whether it's in public or back-channeled, is being confronted and confronted strongly.
35:55The American people can therefore expect conversations with the Russians to stop this?
35:59Well, President Trump, as people have seen, has a unique relationship with a lot of world leaders,
36:04where he can get things done that other presidents, certainly Joe Biden, never could have.
36:09And through direct conversations or indirect, through him one-to-one or through his cabinet, messages definitely can be delivered.
36:17Does this put U.S. personnel in any more danger than they otherwise would be?
36:20Well, no one's putting us in danger.
36:24We're putting the other guys in danger.
36:25That's our job.
36:26So we're not concerned about that.
36:28We mitigate it as we need to.
36:29Our commanders factor all of this, but the only ones that need to be worried right now are Iranians that
36:35think they're going to live.
36:37Six U.S. Army reservists were killed in an Iranian drone attack in Kuwait last Sunday.
36:43President Trump and Secretary Hegseth attended the dignified transfer yesterday at Dover Air Force Base.
36:49One more service member's death was announced this afternoon.
36:53The president's been right to say there will be casualties.
36:56Things like this don't happen without casualties.
36:57There will be more casualties.
37:00And no one is, I mean, especially our generation, knows what it's like to see Americans come home in caskets.
37:07It's, but that doesn't weaken us one bit.
37:10It stiffens our spine and our resolve to say this is a fight we will finish.
37:14So far, more than 1,600 Iranians have been killed, according to a group called Human Rights Activists in Iran.
37:23That includes 168 people, mostly children, at a school in the southern part of the country, an area the U
37:31.S. was attacking at the time.
37:34Have you made any conclusions about whether or not the United States, inadvertently or not, was involved in any military
37:40strike at that school?
37:41Well, we're still investigating, and that's where I'll leave it today.
37:44But what I will emphasize to you and to the world is that, unlike our adversaries, the Iranians, we never
37:50target civilians.
37:51There was a report late in the week from two officials that it was likely U.S. involvement. Is that
37:56report false?
37:57I've already said we're investigating.
37:58If you could tell the American public it definitively was not us, you would tell us, wouldn't you?
38:02I would say that it's being investigated, which is the only answer I'm prepared to give.
38:09Tonight, Iran announced that a son of its slain leader would replace him.
38:14President Trump said this morning, any leader picked without his approval is, quote, not going to last long.
38:21You said this is not a regime change war, but the regime has changed. That's obvious.
38:26Can you square the two?
38:27Sure.
38:29Go ahead.
38:30I meant what I said. It's not a regime change war in the conventional George W. Bush context of hundreds
38:36of thousands of troops.
38:37I mean, in Afghanistan, what I watched as a young captain was Americans thinking we were going to remake a
38:44society that was basically biblical times with AK-47s and cell phones.
38:48The hubris of we're going to take Afghanistan and turn it into a Jeffersonian democracy by building Western-style forces
38:55and Western-style institutions.
38:56It was never going to work, and I saw it and watched it play out.
38:59And it doesn't dispel the courage of the Americans who fought there, who I know there.
39:04But this is not a remaking of the Iranian society from an American perspective.
39:09We tried that. The American people have rejected that.
39:12President Trump called those wars dumb, and we're not fighting that way.
39:16President Trump also said this week he would like to protect some of the people who he would like to
39:20come to power in Iran.
39:22Is that a new mission for your department?
39:25No.
39:26How would you protect people that are inside the country that he might think could rise to the level of
39:30leadership there?
39:31The best way to protect them is what we're doing right now.
39:34What you see right now between American efforts and Israeli efforts is a generational opportunity for the people of Iran.
39:43This past week, Iran launched missiles and drones at nearly a dozen Middle Eastern countries,
39:50including American allies Qatar, Bahrain, and Saudi Arabia.
39:54There's reporting from our Margaret Brennan that not us, but allies in the region are running very low on interceptors.
40:02Is that true, number one?
40:04Number two, how prepared are we to help them restock interceptors to protect them as we continue this campaign?
40:11Very prepared.
40:12We plan for that.
40:14As you heard Admiral Cooper yesterday lay out, the CENTCOM commander,
40:18their missile projection is down 90% from that height.
40:21So if, excuse me, missile shots.
40:23So if they can't shoot anywhere near that volume, our projections of munitions are well beyond what we would need.
40:30And we can cross load for allies if need be,
40:32always ensuring that our forces and our troops and our bases are taken care of first.
40:36But where we can help allies, we will.
40:39Since the war began, oil shipments through the Strait of Hormuz,
40:43through which 20% of the world's oil flows, have stalled.
40:47U.S. gas prices are up an average of almost 50 cents a gallon.
40:52The president said this week the Strait of Hormuz will be taken care of.
40:55How will that be taken care of and how will the ships that are there, that are not moving,
41:00start to move and be moving with a degree of confidence that they will not be inhibited
41:05by what remains of the Iranian either boats or gun emplacements along that strait?
41:10Well, we're taking care of a lot of that.
41:12How?
41:12Well, American firepower.
41:14What was the Iranian Navy is largely no more.
41:19There will be more boats to be sunk, for sure.
41:22So their ability to project any power in that area in a naval sense is being...
41:26Diminishing.
41:27Diminishing and will be increasingly diminished.
41:29Again, what I want your viewers to understand is this is only just the beginning.
41:40The last minute of 60 Minutes is sponsored by UnitedHealthcare, coverage you can count on
41:47for your whole life ahead.
41:52The names of America's great innovators are as enduring as the nation's founders.
41:57Thomas Edison, George Washington Carver, Steve Jobs, Henry Ford, each complex as they
42:04were transformational.
42:05So what's the secret to American innovation?
42:08We asked Bill Ford, the executive chair of one of the nation's oldest automakers.
42:15For me, it's always been about more than technology.
42:18It's about a deep commitment to empowering workers so that everyone can achieve their
42:24full potential.
42:25My great-grandfather, Henry Ford, understood this.
42:28Back in 1914, he did more than just raise wages.
42:32He doubled salaries by creating the $5 a day wage.
42:36He pushed the boundaries of what was possible in American manufacturing, and he helped create
42:41a middle class.
42:43He understood that when you invest in people, innovation follows.
42:48In doing so, Ford Motor Company put the nation on wheels and provided a freedom of movement
42:54that the country had never known.
42:56I've always believed that companies shouldn't exist unless they make people's lives better.
43:01We're here to build opportunity and communities, and that's the secret to American innovation
43:08and will be for the next 250 years.
43:12I'm Bill Whitaker.
43:13We'll be back next week with another edition of 60 Minutes.
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