Un programma storico che ha documentato la storia del nostro paese in una riedizione preparata con l'intento di riportare alla luce personaggi ed eventi che offrono ancora un'occasione di riflessione. Protagonista di questa puntata: Giovanni Paolo II
| #Dio #Gesú #Religione #Santi #Santo #SpiritoSanto #Santa #Maria #Madonna #Preghiera #Preghiere #Chiesa #Chiese #Papa #Papi #Amen
| #Dio #Gesú #Religione #Santi #Santo #SpiritoSanto #Santa #Maria #Madonna #Preghiera #Preghiere #Chiesa #Chiese #Papa #Papi #Amen
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00:13Dear virioli, give your children a caress and say this is the caress of the father.
00:20Right now in Washington after a long trip, I would also say in this regard, and above all, of the Italian people.
00:34In other words, it is none other than all of them.
00:41Los imperialistas, there is a power, this power is only that of the State and its institutions.
00:52With doors that are by statute intended for defects, compacting of land, sea and wide.
01:08Good morning, yesterday May 18th John Paul II turned 83 and he was during his last pastoral visit to Spain
01:16speaking about himself he said
01:17I am an 83 year old young man. After Spain the Pope will go to Croatia, Bosnia, then again to
01:25Mongolia.
01:25A pilgrim who never stopped travelling and bringing the Gospel throughout the world even to
01:32despite his serious health problems.
01:35In 25 years of pontificate, John Paul II travelled over a million kilometres and made 99 trips to
01:45'abroad.
01:45To Pope Voitila, this extraordinary pontiff who profoundly marked the end of the twentieth century and who has never
01:54stopped making his voice heard loud and clear
01:58even recently during the Gulf War, we dedicated a special of Mixer with a portrait that had among
02:07others as witnesses
02:09an exceptional witness, Mikhail Gorbachev. And that story which is our, let's say, birthday present, I began in
02:18St. Peter's Square
02:20with those gunshots fired at him in May 1981, gunshots that made him tremble
02:28the world.
02:56Thank you all.
03:17Thank you all.
03:48On May 13, 1981, John Paul II was hit by a bullet fired by Ali Açka, a terrorist
03:57Turkish,
03:58who on November 26, 1979 had already publicly threatened to kill the Pope during his visit to Türkiye.
04:08In those months many secret services from all over the world had communicated to the Vatican their fears of a possible attack.
04:17to the Pope.
04:17Voitila's answer had always been the same then as it is today, my life and my destiny, he said
04:25the Pope, I am in God's hands.
04:27To underline not so much an insurmountable fatalism, but the awareness of having to carry out a mission that could involve risks,
04:38even the risk of life.
04:40This can perhaps be considered the deepest meaning of Voitila's entire pontificate.
04:47Direct and constant commitment to peace, in defense of human life and dignity.
04:53A commitment made on the very day of his election at a time when the Church seemed to be going through a period
05:02very problematic.
05:15Now many are waving, it's a way of expressing joy for the election while it continues to come out
05:21white smoke from the chimney right now.
05:23The Church seemed to be in crisis, in crisis in the West, the protests, religious practice was decreasing, the Church was being discussed
05:34in the newspapers, there was a crisis in respect for authority, abandonment by priests and religious people.
05:40In crisis in Eastern Europe, because the Church in Eastern Europe, despite ten years of Eastern policy and more than
05:46Paul VI had not obtained great spaces of freedom and seemed to be dying.
05:51From what can be deduced from the declarations of the 1978 voters, it is known that the hypothesis of a pope
06:02non-Italian, which had already been discussed in the first conclave of that summer after the death of Paul VI, the
06:11the conclave that elected Albino Luciani and the name of John Paul I, had been ripe for some time in the electoral college.
06:20I have some doubts that the election of a Polish pope was, so to speak, foreseen, even in that somewhat unusual situation.
06:31frenzy that was created after the sudden death of John Paul I.
06:35But as far as we know, there were two alternatives.
06:39One that was based on the name of Carignal Siri, the archbishop of Genoa, who had been Pius's dolphin.
06:46XII, he was the man of the pre-conciliar Church, the man who, it was said, would have brought about a certain conciliar liberalism, would have returned,
06:57let's say, in the old fashioned way, a candidate of tradition, so to speak.
07:02The other candidate was Carignal Benelli, who had been a collaborator of Paul VI, substitute of the Secretariat of State, a man
07:12strongman of the Montignano government, not the most communicative man of Paul VI's government, but the man faithful to the Pope.
07:19But there is something deeper, that is, Italians discuss among themselves, many Carignali have said, we are left
07:25a little scandalized by the debate among Italians, by the crisis, by the difficulties among Italians.
07:33Beyond this, however, there is one fact: Italian leadership is running out of steam. Already with the death of Paolo
07:39VI had said that it was necessary to look for a pope outside of Italy, a new pope, a pope outside of this one
07:46climate of crisis in Western Europe.
07:48Already during the August conclave that elected Pope Luciani, Voitila had some votes, some votes of esteem, some votes
08:00of signal, there were exactly nine.
08:02And so Voitila already knew he was a candidate with strong odds.
08:09When he heard about Luciani's death, it was eight in the morning, he was in the dining room next to the
08:18kitchen of the Archbishop's Palace in Krakow, he had just said mass, he was in fact having breakfast.
08:25When his driver and his priest friend, Malinsky, arrived out of breath to tell him that the Pope was dead and
08:34Voitila who was stirring in his cup of tea with the spoon, the sugar, held in his hand for a moment the
08:42spoon and dropped it.
08:43Voitila turned very pale, had a strong headache, immediately withdrew to the chapel to pray and many in Krakow
08:52they already had the feeling that he would never return, that after the conclave he would remain pope.
08:58The Carignali of the East were very few, they had little experience of the problems of the Universal Church because they had not left their
09:06countries and Voitila, the capital of Krakow, was one of the few possible candidates from the East.
09:14It is said that it was the Carignal Koenig, a very important conciliar leader, who had played a great role in the
09:22Eastern politics of the Church, well, Koenig launched this candidacy of Voitila which seemed an almost providential solution.
09:30I remember the interviews when the Carignali were leaving the conclave and there was a climate, I would say, a sense
09:38providential, it was not the climate of men who had made their own choice, but almost a somewhat
09:44grace, a feeling of having made a truly new choice.
09:48We must thank the Lord who gave us the Pope and this Pope.
09:54I really believe that providence has looked to the good of the Church also to give to everything the meaning of
10:02universality.
10:05Truly Catholic Pope for the Catholic Church.
10:13Annunzio Vobis Gaudium Magnum.
10:29Abremus Papam.
10:42Eminentissimum Acreverendissimum Dominum Dominum Carolum
10:49Sancte Romane Ecclesiae Cardinalem Voitiva
11:02Cardinal Voitiva, the Cardinal Primate of Krakow
11:06which is one of the most Catholic cities in the world
11:09in this a choice, excuse the term, truly extraordinary
11:13a non-Italian pope returns, a non-Italian after four centuries
11:20For most people, the dominant note of the reaction was surprise.
11:27who is he, who is this barbarian, where does he come from?
11:32Perhaps there was a sign of the times in this.
11:37because it is customary in the history of the Church
11:41to think that health comes from the barbarians
11:44And here the very eventful cardinals have called a new bishop of Rome
12:09They called him from a distant country
12:34I was afraid of receiving this nomination
12:42When he realized that too many votes were now running towards his candidacy
12:51she had a crying fit in the arms of Cardinal Viscinski
12:58But he recovered quickly also because Cardinal Viscinski told him that he
13:06had the task of leading the Church in 2000
13:09and he had to accept this assignment
13:13I don't know if I could explain myself well in yours either.
13:18our Italian language
13:21if I'm wrong
13:23If I'm wrong, please correct me.
13:41The very evening of the conclave once he had been elected
13:45he moved with great affability
13:50with great tranquility among the cardinals
13:53he joked with the nuns who brought the glasses of champagne
13:56in fact he even invited the nuns to have a drink
13:59and who instead could not stand the accumulated nervous attention
14:04Givic was his secretary
14:06that during the dinner still in the conclave
14:09he started crying
14:11and then Voitila consoled him with great tenderness
14:18Let us abbem the Pope therefore
14:20the Cardinal of Krakow
14:21Karol Voitiva the conclave is closed
14:24but in the previous weeks
14:26meetings, corridor encounters
14:28to secret dinners, walks in the Vatican gardens
14:31they saw numerous, very numerous cardinals
14:34involved in a carousel of discussions and agreements
14:39the need for everyone in those days
14:41was to know as deeply as possible
14:44the history, the life of a Pope
14:46outside of previously known patterns
14:49not Italian in short
14:51What did Voitila think of the Roman Church?
14:55of the world political order
14:57of the current ethics of women
14:59of the marginalized
15:01in a word
15:01Who was Karol Voitila?
15:03Many people only knew about him
15:06the city of origin
15:08Vadovize
15:26Vadovize was a town of 7,500 inhabitants
15:30in which a third, however, was Jewish
15:32This is something that greatly influenced Karol Voitila's growth
15:37because unlike other popes he had direct experience of the Jewish world
15:43he lived in an apartment where the landlord was a Jew
15:47the neighbors were Jews and sometimes Voitila's father
15:51he gave them the terrace so they could celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles
15:56Sukkot
15:57a friend of his in the same house he went skiing with
16:02in fact he used to wax her skis because he was very fond of this girl
16:07who was called Regina
16:08she was Jewish
16:09his best classmate was Jewish
16:12and sometimes when they were playing football in class
16:14and they made teams of Christians against Jews
16:17he played on the Jewish team if there was any gap
16:20of an absence and he was the goalkeeper
16:23it would be enough to see the photos when he was little
16:27to understand that he was a child with a great will
16:31a strong child
16:32he always wanted to do it
16:34he wanted to be the first they say
16:36those who knew him
16:38and then a child who suffered a lot
16:41who immediately found himself faced with the problem of death
16:44of the mother, of the sovereign who was stillborn
16:47of her brother who dies and who already at twenty years old practically
16:51her father also dies and she remains alone in life
16:58it's a childhood marked by death
17:01and when he was young, precisely in his twenties
17:04he also wrote a drama in verse
17:08who was called Job
17:10in which he underlined precisely this element
17:12of the will of God that can take a person
17:14and throw it in the dust at any time
17:17but this tied him more to God
17:20he tied him very much to the image of the Madonna
17:23which was already, let's say, always present
17:25in the Polish Catholic tradition
17:28but which for him has almost become a substitute
17:30of the earthly mother
17:32It is no coincidence that he in his papal coat of arms
17:35there is in the papal coat of arms of John Paul II
17:38this big M that stands for Maria
17:41and that his motto be totus tuus
17:43that is, I am entirely yours Maria
17:46On December 30, 1963, he became Archbishop of Krakow
17:51March 8 of the following year
17:53makes his triumphal entry into the cathedral
17:56with an amazing dress
17:59which filled the crowd with admiration
18:01in fact his vestments represented
18:04at least a thousand years of Polish history
18:09that day Wojtyla introduced himself to the Poles
18:11as the successor of the medieval bishop Stanislaus
18:15and told the world that he was ready to shed his blood
18:19for the cause of faith
18:21but all this for those who knew him well
18:24it was a kind of shock, a surprise
18:27it was a kind of shock
18:57and he never thought of becoming a priest when he was little
18:59rather the mother would have wanted
19:02because he had a doctor son like that
19:05the major who later died Edmondo
19:07and the other son Carol would become a priest
19:10but Wojtyla wasn't even thinking about it
19:12and indeed at 18 during the final exams
19:15when the Archbishop of Krakow
19:17Sapiea arrived in Vadovizze
19:19Wojtyla was chosen to give the welcoming speech
19:22and the archbishop asked
19:24what does this boy want to do?
19:25and Wojtyla replied
19:27I don't want to be a priest
19:29I want to study Polish philology at university
19:33I want to deal with literature
19:35and all his friends were convinced
19:37that he would have had a very normal life
19:40maybe as an actor
19:41and that he would then get married
19:44living a life just like everyone else
19:46it was a classic adult vocation
19:49this has a certain meaning
19:52Why?
19:52why us
19:53while we find a granite faith
19:56a granite religious faith
19:58in John Paul II
19:58which is that of all Poles
20:00we don't find
20:01the characteristics of the classical priest
20:04who entered the seminary as a child
20:06who has formed a certain mentality
20:08no, he doesn't have it
20:09Why?
20:09because he lived a large part
20:11of his youthful life
20:14outside the ecclesiastical environment
20:17and this maybe
20:19because this is the most interesting aspect
20:20It also explains a certain unscrupulousness of his
20:27regarding his working style
20:31I once told him
20:32It seems that His Eminence does not want to govern
20:35but to direct
20:36It seems like she wants her collaborators
20:39independently carry out the orders received
20:42and he told me I was right
20:44who did not want to govern
20:45and this is his working style
20:48collegiality
20:50when you receive the invitation
20:52the primate's call
20:53when the primate told him
20:55that the Holy Father
20:56he had appointed him bishop
20:58he happened to be rowing
21:00and from there he went directly to Warsaw
21:02the Cardinal Primate of Poland
21:06Stefan Wyszynski is one of the most imposing figures
21:10not only of Polish history
21:12but of the whole history of the church
21:13during the years of the Iron Curtain
21:15and Wyszynski actually at the beginning
21:19he had a mistrust
21:21for this young priest
21:24and then young bishop
21:25so intellectual
21:28John Paul II
21:29it is at the same time
21:31the student
21:33and as often happens
21:35in the students
21:35he is also the antagonist
21:36by Wyszynski
21:37certainly the student
21:40because I believe that
21:41in Poland
21:43of the years
21:4460s and 70s
21:46nothing could be done
21:48seriously realize
21:50in the Catholic Church
21:52outside the influence
21:53by Cardinal Wyszynski
21:54who was a man
21:55certainly of great personality
21:57but in their time
21:58maybe even an antagonist
21:59in the sense that
22:01not always
22:04Wyszynski had shared
22:06the attitudes
22:08note of an opposition
22:09mobile
22:10dialectic
22:11by Wyszynski
22:12towards
22:13of Polish communism
22:15John Paul II
22:18builds a church
22:19active
22:20in society
22:21it is the Polish model
22:22it's the model
22:22that Wyszynski
22:23had built
22:24that of a church
22:26present among the people
22:27a church
22:28soul of the nation
22:29a church
22:31that in front
22:32as Wyszynski said
22:33to a subservient government
22:34servant of the Soviets
22:35he introduces himself
22:36like the true soul
22:37of the nation
22:38the relationship with Wyszynski
22:40I would define it
22:42that
22:43by Karol Voitiva
22:45a relationship
22:46of student
22:48to father
22:48Karol Voitiva
22:50he was the son
22:51favorite
22:52by Wyszynski
22:53because he knew
22:53command like him
22:54besides being
22:56of a religious faith
22:57strong as his
22:57and it was
22:59but also
23:01let's say
23:02he
23:04that Wyszynski
23:05accompanied
23:06by the hand
23:06up to the throne
23:07of St. Peter
23:08the Pope
23:09was
23:10one of his students
23:11in fact
23:11of experience
23:12pastoral
23:13it is said
23:14That
23:14in conclave
23:16must
23:17star city
23:17but his
23:19personal friendship
23:19with Wyszynski
23:20he should make her say something
23:21Nothing
23:22many elements
23:24they were hiding
23:24behind this
23:25courteous
23:26but adamant
23:27silence
23:27of the cardinal
23:28Wyszynski
23:29an episode
23:30only
23:30to search
23:31to interpret
23:32the climate
23:33that was breathed
23:34among the cardinals
23:35Poles
23:35in Rome
23:36during the conclave
23:37Voitiva
23:38it had been
23:39just elected
23:40had just
23:41choice
23:41his name
23:42by John
23:42Paul II
23:43he was pronouncing
23:45his first speech
23:47after the investiture
23:48in front of the greats
23:50voters
23:51and to the cardinals
23:51who had chosen him
23:52one by one
23:53the cardinals
23:54they went to give it back to him
23:55gift
23:56on your knees
23:57when it was my turn
23:58by Wyszynski
23:59John Paul II
24:00he got up
24:01from his chair
24:02just the primate
24:03Polish
24:03he made the gesture
24:04to kneel
24:06the Pope
24:06he put his arms around him
24:08between the shoulders
24:09and hugged him
24:11the hard one
24:12imperious
24:12cardinal
24:13from Warsaw
24:14he clung on
24:14to the Pope
24:15like a child
24:17and John Paul II
24:18he supported it
24:19firmly
24:20maybe this
24:21gives a
24:22further
24:23key to understanding
24:25of those moments
24:26of that
24:27hard
24:28even if moved
24:29emotion
24:30of the primate
24:31from Warsaw
24:32but what
24:33Wyszynski
24:33then he didn't say
24:34for many reasons
24:36and he told us about it
24:37a friend
24:38opponent
24:39of the pontiff
24:41Mikhail Gorbachev
24:42former president
24:43of the Soviet Union
24:44the father
24:45of Glasnost
24:46and of the Perastroica
24:47What
24:47it meant
24:48the election
24:49by Vojtila
24:50for him
24:50in Moscow
24:51and throughout the east
24:52it was known
24:53that Karol Vojtila
24:54he was a man
24:55who had spoken out
24:56with decision
24:56against the regimes
24:57communists
24:58taxes
24:58that they were not
24:59the result
25:00of free elections
25:01In short
25:02his election
25:03was welcomed
25:03in the spirit
25:04of the opposition
25:05of then
25:06in the spirit
25:07of the hard
25:07ideological war
25:08that was fought
25:09between the two systems
25:10between the east
25:11and the west
25:11in particular
25:13the Pope
25:13was seen
25:14like a creature
25:15of the circles
25:16reactionaries
25:17and imperialists
25:18Westerners
25:18it was the logic
25:20of the Cold War
25:20the logic
25:21of a war
25:21rigid
25:22and illogical
25:23but I can't
25:24sure to say
25:25that politicians
25:25in Moscow
25:26they were desperate
25:27or in panic
25:27for the election
25:28of a Polish man
25:29to Pope
25:29no this
25:30I cannot
25:30just say it
25:31but of course
25:32it was known
25:32that it was about
25:33of a person
25:34with strong convictions
25:35and it was expected
25:36that this
25:36would have entailed
25:37an even more
25:38strong contrast
25:39of ideologies
25:41at the time
25:43of the Cold War
25:44and of the world
25:44divided into two blocks
25:45the contrast
25:46so he couldn't
25:47what to be
25:48the keyword
25:49the most used one
25:50in the narrow
25:51we heard it
25:52of the apparatus
25:53of the politburo
25:54let's do it though
25:55a leap back
25:56over time
25:57let's go back to the old ones
25:58even if not
25:59very far away
25:59scenarios
26:00in Moscow
26:01there was still
26:02the Soviet empire
26:03in Washington
26:04led the United States
26:06Reagan
26:06on the throne of Peter
26:07in the Vatican
26:08he arrives
26:09Pope Wojtyla
26:10the Polish
26:11and then
26:12how he reacted
26:12the world
26:13socialist
26:14of the east
26:15and in particular
26:16Poland
26:16native land
26:17of the new pontiff
26:19and in particular
26:54It was a shock, the secretary of the Polish communist party Gierek said, my goodness, just
27:04he let it slip, even though he was a non-believing communist, he let it slip
27:09as a sign of extreme disorientation, there was immediately a meeting of the
27:16Politburo and the highest state officials to analyze this event.
27:21We now have the documents of the classified Soviet government bodies and we see them,
27:30immediately the Soviet power understands that the election of this Pope is an element
27:35of destabilization, first and foremost in the weakest point of the Soviet empire, that is, Poland.
27:41Then the regime in Warsaw was also worried because immediately it passed with a storm
27:48of bells from one corner of Poland to another, the sense of a great triumph of the
27:54Church and therefore it was immediately understood that the Church as a social power, as a power
27:59political would have strengthened.
28:01Now a subject of the East has assumed a world platform, it is the man of the East who can
28:10no longer speak to the world, what will he say? And so the Soviet power immediately sets out
28:15on the alert, but here is the paradox of paradoxes because this power had intuited
28:24that religion, I don't mean the Catholic Church alone, but religious life was an element
28:30destabilizing, the appointments were controlled and yet it had escaped the Soviet power that
28:38The election of the Pope was fundamental for the European balance. Why didn't they understand this?
28:44Soviets? In my opinion there was some attempt at control, I have the feeling that some cardinal
28:51of the East was controlled by their respective embassies or by their respective services, here
28:59but you know, it wasn't through some cardinal from the East that a conclave was controlled and therefore
29:09Soviet power was impotent.
29:11Reagan was very struck by this fact and sensed that this election could represent
29:21a metastasis, a cancer within the communist system and therefore a little utopian,
29:28a little mystically, ideologically he thought that this could be the trigger
29:35in the fight against what he called the evil empire.
29:42The streets of Warsaw, so we heard them, were full of people celebrating and running towards
29:48churches. Suddenly, an officer threw open the door and, ignoring
29:55the protocol said, comrade general, sensational news, Vojtila has been elected
30:01Pope. The general companion was Jaruzewski, the Polish Prime Minister, things were not going well for him.
30:07good. The general understood it immediately and so let's try to analyze more closely what
30:13were the main lines of John Paul II's foreign policy, especially in
30:19reference to the countries of the former Iron Curtain.
30:46A question that many have asked themselves, whether what happened in the relationship between the Pope
30:52and communism was the fruit of a very clear and lucid strategy from the beginning,
30:57was the result of the coincidences of history, which this question does not find any
31:05confident answers, especially now. I have the impression that there was a reference note
31:13certain and constant in his relationship with communism. He constantly did something to communism.
31:20a precise note, a precise accusation, that of stripping man of his most important aspects
31:29peculiarities of his identity, both as a man and as a person projected towards a future
31:37of faith, as well as a human being who lived the daily experience. Here in
31:44at that time he tended to replace communism with the Church, because the Church was
31:51what it presented, re-proposed itself as the source of man's identity
31:57and gave him everything that communism took away from him. So the Pope used
32:02very often the word homeland, was another characteristic, but he used it in a
32:08precise meaning. The Church was the homeland of the citizen, of the man exiled from communism, because
32:15Under communism, man became an exile. Boitila wasn't very interested in politics,
32:21he thought that the confrontation with communism should above all take place on an ideal level,
32:27philosophical, in emphasizing the dignity of man and his friends when he was already
32:33cardinal, so when in Krakow in the 70s he occupied a prominent position, indeed
32:40they pressed, they said you can't ignore politics, he always said no, but these
32:45these are things that in reality are up to the cardinal primate, to Vyshynski, who always negotiated
32:52continuously with the communist state. Starting from the year 76, when they occurred in Poland
33:00of the accidents in Radom and Ursus in the factories, Boitila matured the conviction that he had to
33:13directly engage against the regime. He was a sharp man from the East, intelligent from the East,
33:22that is, he knew the contradictions, he couldn't know when it would fall, but he knew where
33:27work. This is the great difference between Western popes or ecclesiastics or politicians.
33:32Westerners and he, because he was a man who had lived in a very singular position in the East,
33:39because he had not been a dissident, a dissident is a hero, a brave man, but also a
33:44isolated in society. He had been a man of the opposition, but he had had a position
33:49of government, because governing a diocese like Krakow, participating in the episcopal conference
33:54It means having a lot of sensors in the country.
33:57We try to always be close to the people, to be with them, to share their problems,
34:05their worries, their difficulties and this creates an attitude of trust, of a
34:16credibility and it is an indispensable condition for carrying out our duty, our mission.
34:30The specific contribution of John Paul II was, first of a psychological nature and then
34:37practical, psychological and political psychology nature of course, that of having understood,
34:45of having seen first hand the true weaknesses of communism. He knew that it had truly
34:53feet of clay, which in short was weak. The political contribution instead was that
34:59of having placed all the weight of the chair of Peter in the direct and exclusive relationship
35:06with Polish rulers. He dealt with Polish rulers such as Innocent III or Boniface
35:13VIII would have dealt with other kings, with the difference that Boniface VIII was defeated
35:17Innocent III never and John Paul II never were defeated. If anyone remembers or
35:23if you look at the images again, Jaruseschi was humble in front of the Pope, he was humble, because
35:30historically he felt that the Pope had the power. That was the contribution of having
35:35the chain of communist countries was broken.
35:40However, it is not possible to understand the specific weight of this journey which took place in a
35:47very different social and political climate without immersing oneself in the Poland of that time, a country
35:53in a profound, traumatic transformation that was ushering in the birth of the first union
36:00free of the Eastern countries. And again Gorbachev tells us about that scenario, the scenario
36:06of that Poland.
36:09The return of John Paul II to his homeland had an enormous, enormous effect. Especially for
36:16as Poland welcomed him, because in fact he was welcomed by all the people, he made a strong
36:22impression. Especially because everyone realized that in that welcome there was no
36:28There was only the Poles' dedication to their faith. Of course, Catholicism has deep roots.
36:34in that people. It has always been present in history and destiny, in the dramatic destiny
36:40of Poland. And it was precisely Catholicism, the Catholic religion and its ministers of
36:45cult that in some way had a unifying role. But the very strong wave of support,
36:52clearly, it was perceived not only as a natural manifestation of faith, as a welcome
36:58to a compatriot who was now head of the Catholic Church, but also as a challenge to the regime
37:04political. However, Moscow made no attempt to prevent the trip.
37:20sing
37:29Thank you all.
38:07Thank you all.
38:22I was there in those days and I remember that there was a real state of collective exaltation throughout the whole
38:30the Polish population.
38:32It was something that went beyond the religious fact, it was as if the Messiah had come at the same time,
38:38'emperor, the liberator, a victorious general.
38:41There was even in people almost a kind of erotic charge, an electricity, a vibration that I have never experienced again.
38:52seen neither before nor after in a major event.
38:54Schlesinger said a sentence, he had a very beautiful expression about John Paul II, he said this policy that
39:03it's a mixture of boldness and caution.
39:06I am convinced of this. Why has John Paul II been described as the man who throws himself, throws the
39:13remains against Soviet power.
39:14No, John Paul II knows that there is a limit that cannot be crossed.
39:19That is, in Poland, for example, we must avoid the Soviet invasion, because it is true that Poland is not free, but
39:25It will lose even more of its freedom and autonomy if Soviet tanks enter.
39:30On his first trip he let the Poles know that he had not left his homeland, that he was
39:38in Rome as Pope but as Polish Pope and that therefore he would continue to do for Poland what
39:46that Mdiscischi had done up until then.
39:48The true primate of the Poles after the election of this pope to the throne was the pope.
39:54The government immediately understood that the population was rallying around the Pope and flocking to all the places where the
40:03Pope went, absolutely acting as if the regime no longer existed.
40:08The Pope's trip to Poland sparked the birth of Solidarnosc and Solidarnosc immediately became a very dangerous phenomenon for the
40:22Soviet totalitarian system.
40:24It was the first free mass trade union with millions of members.
40:29Solidarnosc is a very interesting reality because it is a working class reality with a strong participation of students, it is a reality
40:37Catholic who lives in Catholic structures but in which lay people, Jews, etc. also participate.
40:43So it is a movement of liberal Polish society in its components in which the church had a primatial function but
40:51also a shelter function.
40:52Why shelter? Because the church structures in Poland, more or less, had remained standing.
40:59John Paul II in turn, watching on TV at Castel Gandolfo, the great masses that were celebrated in
41:08occupied shipyards in Gdansk,
41:10the people who made confessions in the open air and the huge following that Echvalesa had among his own,
41:17he understood that the passivity that a totalitarian system needs had cracked.
41:25And he also said to a Polish nun friend of his, but the world doesn't understand, the world doesn't understand that here
41:31something absolutely extraordinary is happening.
41:45Of course the birth of Solidarnosc was a big blow, perhaps even a shock for some, but it was the intervention
41:51of the people.
41:52And I think that although at the beginning the relations between the regime and Solidarity were very difficult,
41:57later, and this was on Jaruzewski's initiative, we began to seek collaboration with that movement,
42:05because it was understood that there was only one people, one country, one territory, and they had to live there.
42:12So I think the birth of that movement was understandable and logical.
42:15In the end, the strength, the real strength behind Solidarnosc, was recognized.
42:20and it began to be considered a strong and real political partner, a political subject.
42:27Solidarity had therefore won, it had become a political entity capable of creating more than a little nervousness in the Soviet countries.
42:35And with Solidarity the Pope and the West in general had won.
42:39But this victory of a common front with an anti-communist function was part of a real project,
42:48it was just the logical consequence of history, of its complicated and partly unpredictable transformations.
42:57An essay, recently published by Rizzoli, co-written by Karl Benstein and Marco Politi,
43:03he formulates a hypothesis, the hypothesis of a holy alliance between the temporal power of the United States
43:10with the ultimate goal of delivering the final blow to the real socialism prevailing in Eastern Europe.
43:48Regan realized that this phenomenon could take Poland out of the orbit of the Soviet satellites.
43:58and decided to support Solidarity in every way.
44:03Regan wanted to exploit this fact to have the Vatican as his number one strategic ally.
44:10in the fight against communism, therefore he repeatedly sent the head of the CIA to the Vatican
44:15for secret meetings with the Pope so that he could explain to the Pope everything that America was doing
44:21to counter the Soviet Union, including by making top-secret information available to the Pope
44:27collected by spies, collected especially by satellites that photographed for example
44:33Soviet missiles aimed at Europe, which photographed the maneuvers of Soviet troops
44:39to intimidate Poland and Kesey to thank the Pope or in any case to establish a
44:46current of sympathy, the first photo he showed him was a huge crowd in Warsaw with
44:52a little white dot and this little white dot was the Pope himself holding his first mass
44:58in 1979 in Victory Square in Warsaw.
45:03However, it seems to me that I should exclude the possibility of a sort of holy anti-communist alliance,
45:08also because John Paul II did not only have the problem of overthrowing communism,
45:14but he had the problem of saving the life of the Eastern Church.
45:17Solidarity was openly supported by America during the most difficult years and this
45:23It also meant a direct commitment from the Church to support Solidarity in every way.
45:31It's interesting, precisely in relation to the secret collaboration between Reagan and the Pope
45:36and of the missions of the head of the Church in Rome, in the Vatican, and of economic issues,
45:43issues of secret Church operations should never be discussed in the Vatican.
45:48That is, it was a topic on which Reagan did not want to create difficulties for the Pope.
45:54In those years, the CIA allocated 50 million dollars to support Solidarity.
46:01At the same time there were official methods of collecting aid for Poland and the resistance movement.
46:12Polish,
46:13both through American unions and also Western unions, and through a collection center in Brussels,
46:23where Solidarity had an office abroad.
46:26To affirm the existence of a collaboration between the Vatican and the American secret services,
46:32I think it's a specious theory.
46:35The fact that the world was divided, split, that we were against each other
46:40and that this logic of ideological division into blocks is often
46:44if both politics and the action of confessions were to be subjected, he is a madman.
46:49And, as they say, you can't throw a word out of a song.
46:53One way or another, everyone, on both sides, followed that logic.
46:59But I am absolutely against the hypothesis of a holy alliance.
47:03between the President of the United States, Reagan, and the Pope.
47:07And then, if we really want to talk about it, what would they have done?
47:11if we in the Soviet Union had not initiated reforms,
47:13if we had not declared ourselves against the totalitarian system,
47:16if we had not embarked on the path of perestroika, of glasnost
47:20and democratization? What would have happened?
47:23Nothing. Everything would have continued as before.
47:25So let's try not to overestimate.
47:27Also because in the years of perestroika, both on the eve
47:31that just before the reforms began in the Soviet Union,
47:35Poland had started a process of awareness
47:37of its historical path, taking advantage of the fact that perestroika
47:41was accompanied by a strong position on the part of the Soviet leadership
47:45not to interfere in the affairs of friendly and neighboring countries.
47:49All this in Poland has led to an intensification, I would say,
47:52very rapid process of democratization.
47:54And what happened in Poland has in some ways even surpassed
47:58the same process that took place in the Soviet Union
48:01and even in other Warsaw Pact countries.
48:03In this sense, Poland was a sort of scout,
48:06of exploratory attack.
48:09So who deserves the credit for having determined,
48:12before anyone else, the transformation process,
48:16of course it doesn't apply.
48:17What remains for us to establish is the fact that history followed a whirlwind of changes.
48:24The protagonists were once again representatives of the Soviet empire,
48:30the American leaders and above all Pope Wojtyla himself,
48:34who returned to Poland for the second time in 1983.
48:37Police trucks, policemen with shields and some
48:40They had blocked the roads around the headquarters of the Solidarity leadership.
48:45Domestic and international telephones and telexes and the same...
48:52The second trip has a different story,
48:56it fits into a darker climate,
48:58because obviously there had been the coup,
49:01there had been the impoverishment of Polish society under the Arruseschi.
49:05John Paul II made that trip late,
49:08They didn't want him a bit, Gioroseski didn't want him to go,
49:12but he too was waiting for the right moment,
49:15because when he went to Poland,
49:19he presented himself as the only hope of the Poles
49:23to get out of that dead-end situation, as he called it.
49:27So while he was first encouraging them to do something new in this regime,
49:33now he felt communism, he felt its regime,
49:37the only way out of this situation is through me.
49:41Let us not forget that Valesa had been practically reduced to the margins of social life
49:46and so he remained the point of reference.
49:49I have the impression that the Polish regime of Gioroseski understood this.
49:53and that perhaps on that trip that very special relationship was born
49:57on which there are already many legends between Gioroseski and the Pope,
50:01which in the end, just like the Poles,
50:04they respect each other, they respected each other, they loved each other, they understood each other
50:08and they both, so they say, waited
50:12that the spark of the global crisis of communism would be ignited to close the game.
50:16I remember when John Paul II during his trip
50:20he promised not to make political speeches,
50:22but he only said that famous word to Anzica
50:25I know in solidarity, she shouted,
50:27it was a magic word, it was more than a speech.
50:30Many have praised at times exaggeratedly
50:33Voitila as the winner of the Soviet system
50:38that he would have shot down, like some kind of Superman,
50:42but the Pope never said this about himself.
50:45The Pope even said that it would be simplistic
50:48to say that this system fell through the intervention of providence.
50:51The Pope understood and said so
50:53which was a big implosion of this system
50:56which from an ethical and economic point of view,
50:59politician and military man could no longer stand on his own two feet.
51:04The end was determined by the system itself
51:07because it was a system that had solved many problems
51:11but at the same time it turned out to be anti-humanitarian,
51:15a system that did not apply democracy,
51:17which did not provide for the active participation of the people,
51:20the realization of one's potential, one's aspirations.
51:25I would say that this is where the main attack started
51:28to that model first imposed in the Soviet Union
51:31and later also in other countries.
51:34It's all very complex
51:35and I would not want that in discussing the role of the Pope
51:39this role was reduced to the sole fact
51:41that he participated in the world march against communism.
51:44Also because the fact that the communist regimes
51:47have suffered a defeat
51:48does not mean that socialist theories and values
51:51have been thrown away forever.
51:54In this regard, go and read the encyclicals
51:57and the speeches of his holiness.
51:59I know them well, I have them at my disposal.
52:01and I must say that he understands all this well.
52:04The Pope strongly criticized
52:07the flaws of both capitalism and communist regimes.
52:11So I would say that today His Holiness is the most left-wing person.
52:15because no one speaks with such passion
52:17it is so much pain of poverty
52:19and of those millions of people
52:21who are cut off from normal life.
52:23I would propose to declare that today
52:25the person who shows us that we need
52:28of both values
52:29it is his holiness himself.
52:31And I respect him for that.
52:33He is truly a great personality of our time.
52:37He is a humanist
52:39and his pastoral activity is at the service of the people.
52:43He puts man before everything
52:44and this is an example of high morality,
52:48of high responsibility.
52:49It is the testimony of awareness
52:52of one's mission before God
52:54and in front of men.
52:56This is that man for me,
52:57a man of great elevation.
52:59and in front of men.
53:37The Pope, the Church triumphant,
53:40return to Poland,
53:42let's tell the truth,
53:43of triumph before the great disappointment.
53:46Why then that triumph
53:47it lasted the space of a morning.
53:51The singular destiny of this Pope.
53:54After defeating communism,
53:56hoping and thinking
53:58that it was there at the bottom
53:59the new promised land of believers,
54:01he found himself with the same vices,
54:04the worst vices of the West
54:05capitalistic and decadent,
54:07he found them there.
54:10But who is John Paul II then?
54:13At least who has been up to this point?
54:15The main architect
54:17of the fall of the Berlin Wall,
54:19the father of the church
54:20triumphant and victorious
54:22in Poland
54:23of the former Iron Curtain,
54:25the ally of the Americans
54:27against the Soviet Union,
54:29the greatest interpreter
54:30of the transformation
54:32of the history of this century,
54:34or the last bastion,
54:36as Gorbachev says,
54:37of the values of poverty
54:39and suffering.
54:41Or again,
54:42maybe the flywheel
54:43of the transformation of the West.
54:46The first time
54:48It was Long Live Bapa
54:52and that is Italian.
54:55Applause
55:00Alleluia!
55:03Alleluia!
55:06Alleluia!
55:08Alleluia!
55:10Alleluia!
55:13Alleluia!
55:15Alleluia!
55:16Alleluia!
55:18Alleluia!
55:22Alleluia!
55:24Alleluia!
55:39Thank you all.
56:08Thank you all.
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