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All in with Chris Hayes - Season 14 - Episode 06
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00:00Tonight on All In.
00:02I understand that Vice President Vance believes that shooting a young mother of three in the face three times is
00:10an acceptable America that he wants to live in, and I do not.
00:14New footage of the shooting of Renee Goode from the cell phone of the ICE agent who killed her.
00:20That's fine, dude. I'm not mad. It's fine.
00:23Tonight, Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison on the newly released video and the state investigation that the president does not
00:29want.
00:31Do you believe that the FBI should be sharing evidence with state officials in Minnesota?
00:35Well, normally I would, but they're crooked.
00:38Then what the growing protests say about the backlash to ICE in Minnesota and beyond, and as the oil companies
00:44meet the president of the White House, Senator Tim Kaine on his attempt to check our imperial president.
00:50We've taken over a whole country. We've taken $4 billion worth of oil in one day.
00:56But All In starts right now.
01:03Good evening from New York. I'm Chris Hayes.
01:05The government's lies are getting even more brazen about who Renee Goode, the 37-year-old mother of three, was
01:11and how she died.
01:13No one could watch the numerous eyewitness videos of her death and in good faith make the kinds of claims
01:18the Trump administration has been making and continues to make.
01:21That she was committing domestic terrorism.
01:24That she ran over the agent who is now recovering in the hospital, threatening his life.
01:29With a maroon Honda Pilot that had stuffed animals flowing out of the glove compartment box.
01:34Those claims never rang true. That much was immediately obvious.
01:37And it became even more obvious today with the leak of a new video from the confrontation with ICE that
01:43led to the shooting death of Goode.
01:45What we got today was a cell phone recording captured by the man who killed her.
01:50It's the first look we have gotten of Renee Goode alive and then dead.
01:55It was first obtained this afternoon by a conservative website.
01:58Hours later, MS now got its own copy from the Department of Homeland Security.
02:02A copy that is roughly 10 seconds shorter than the leaked version and omitted a few key details.
02:07So I want to play the longer version for you now.
02:10And as we have been the last few days, caution you that it is incredibly disturbing.
02:35It's okay, we don't change our plates every morning, just so you know.
02:39It'll be the same plate when you come talk to us later.
02:41That's fine. U.S. citizen, former fucking guy.
02:45You want to come at us? You want to come at us?
02:48I say go get yourself some lunch, big boy.
02:50Go ahead.
02:51Out of the car. Get out of the fucking car.
02:54Get out of the car.
02:55Get out of the car.
02:57Oh!
03:00Fucking bitch.
03:04Notice how Renee Goode lost her life.
03:06That is what the government claims was domestic terrorism.
03:08So what did you see?
03:10Again, I'll let you decide.
03:11Here's what I saw.
03:12The masked armed ICE agent who has been identified as Jonathan Ross exits his car.
03:16The first thing he sees is Renee Goode's dog in the backseat of her Honda.
03:23How many domestic terrorists have you seen taking their dogs for a drive out on their operations?
03:29It's worth noting that this portion of the video is missing from the version released to us by DHS.
03:33You might ask yourself why.
03:35Perhaps they don't want people seeing Goode's dog in the car.
03:38Then we see Ross circle the vehicle while recording, holding his phone to do so.
03:43He walks in front of the car, makes eye contact with Renee Goode behind the driver's wheel.
03:47This is where she speaks to the man who will end her life, saying,
03:52I'm not mad at you.
03:55Ross then circles to the back of the car.
03:57He records Goode's license plate.
03:59And here you can see the rear window stickers for national parks and kennel clubs on her Honda Pilot.
04:05He is verbally taunted by a woman who is believed to be Renee Goode's wife.
04:09After that exchange, she goes to get in the passenger side of the car.
04:13Then agents yell at Renee Goode to get out of the car.
04:16And at this point, Ross again walks in front of the vehicle recording Renee Goode.
04:21He still has his phone out.
04:24The phone is out even as he pulls a gun.
04:27The last thing she does is move the wheel to the right before she starts to pull forward.
04:33You can see Ross lowering the phone as he fires three shots.
04:38After Renee Goode is shot, after her car rolls towards an electric pole and Ross walks alone toward the car,
04:44you can hear a voice on the video uttering the words,
04:47Fucking bitch.
04:50We cannot confirm with certainty it is Ross's voice calling the dead woman a fucking bitch.
04:56That video was obtained by a conservative website with close ties to the Minneapolis Police Department.
05:01Minutes after it was published online, it was retweeted by,
05:03I guess the guy who's doing this full time, Vice President J.D. Vance,
05:07who told his followers to watch it because, quote,
05:09the realities of Ross's life was in danger and he fired in self-defense.
05:13So they seem to believe this video makes their case for them.
05:17Vance is using it to suggest Renee Goode was not, quote, an innocent woman.
05:21And his sustained campaign to demonize a dead mother of three is so bad his religious face is being challenged.
05:29The National Catholic Reporter yesterday, columnist John Grasso, wrote, quote,
05:32The Vice President's comments justifying the death of Renee Goode are a moral stain on the collective witness of our
05:38Catholic faith.
05:39His repeated attempts to blame Goode for her own death are fundamentally incompatible with the gospel.
05:44Our only recourse is to pray for his conversion of heart.
05:49He's right. It is a moral stain.
05:50But it's not the only one.
05:52Despite already giving their theory of the case,
05:54the Trump administration is still refusing to share evidence with state or local authorities.
05:57In an exclusive interview with MS Now's Josh Eininger,
06:01the district attorney of Hennepin County, where Renee Goode was killed,
06:03appealed to the feds to see reason.
06:07I think it's in the best interest of all of us, including the federal government,
06:12to just be really transparent.
06:13Just allow the BCAA in on the investigation to at least see what kind of evidence that you have,
06:19because I think we would all want that thorough information,
06:24the investigation, before we make a decision.
06:28Now, the Trump administration, I don't think, wants that,
06:30probably because the entire enterprise that brought Jonathan Ross
06:33and the rest of those ICE agents to Minneapolis in the first place
06:36is fundamentally based on a lie.
06:39And it's the lie that Donald Trump ran on.
06:41It's the lie that they've continued to push,
06:44that the Trump administration is clearing out the most dangerous criminal migrants in America
06:48going to make those communities safer.
06:49I want you to look at this analysis, because it's pretty important.
06:53According to analysis of the available data yesterday by political researcher Austin Kocher,
06:58almost all of new ICE detainees held since last September,
07:0392% have no criminal convictions.
07:07Those masked men with guns running roughshod are picking up random people.
07:13They're rounding up car washers and daycare attendants,
07:16construction workers sometimes standing down beneath an unfinished house
07:21and waiting for them to come off the roof.
07:23And American citizens, we should know.
07:26American citizens who were just in the way or looked too much like an immigrant
07:31or who have protested out of a desire to protect their neighbors
07:35from the incursions of those same masked henchmen of the state.
07:39And that's all because the Trump administration has decided to harass and abduct
07:43and sometimes shoot people who have committed no crimes and pose no threat like Renee Good.
07:49In a statement to Minnesota Public Radio, Renee Good's wife, Becca, said this today.
07:55Renee lived by an overarching belief.
07:57There is kindness in the world, and we need to do everything we can to find it where it resides
08:01and nurture it where it needs to grow.
08:03Renee was a Christian who knew that all religions teach the same essential truth.
08:07We are here to love each other, care for each other, and keep each other safe and whole.
08:11On Wednesday, January 7th, we stopped to support our neighbors.
08:15We had whistles.
08:16They had guns.
08:19Keith Ellison serves as the Attorney General of Minnesota, and he joins me now.
08:23Now, I know that you are not in the business of punditry and not in the business of jumping to
08:30conclusions,
08:31so I want to ask you, with prudence, if you've seen the latest video,
08:37if you've seen all the videos, and what you think of what you have seen.
08:41Yes, I have seen the latest video, and I've seen a lot of video.
08:46Let me tell you this, Chris, and I hope you'll forgive me.
08:48I'm resisting jumping to a conclusion about what I've seen so far.
08:55I'm maintaining that the proper thing to do is for the federal authorities to open up their file,
09:04to share it with state authorities and state leaders,
09:07and that we have a fulsome joint investigation which will lead us to the truth.
09:15That's what we're looking for.
09:16Don't get me wrong.
09:18I'm outraged.
09:19I've seen what everybody else has seen,
09:23and I'll note that, you know, that Mr. Ross appeared to walk steadily away from the scene,
09:35didn't appear to fall, didn't appear to lose his balance.
09:38Any of these things, I think anybody can see.
09:41I don't need to.
09:41People can watch it for themselves.
09:43But the idea that he was in fear of his life and is convalescing in the hospital afterwards,
09:52that's something that I think we got is not supported by the facts.
09:57And so, look, let's get a fair, fulsome, open, inclusive investigation and come to the truth,
10:06make discharging decisions, if any will be made, based on the evidence.
10:11And I think that's what we should be doing.
10:13And I want to encourage the federal government to reconsider their position,
10:17because after all, if their position is that Ross did nothing wrong,
10:22then of course they would want a full, transparent and independent investigation.
10:29The federal government has not been, as far as we can tell, allowing any local law enforcement
10:37any access.
10:38Is that your understanding?
10:38Like, what is, from where you sit, what is your understanding of the nature of
10:42cooperation or lack thereof right now as I speak to you tonight?
10:45Well, we started off on a pretty good foot.
10:47I mean, when the crime scene was being processed, I mean, Minneapolis MPD was there,
10:53BCA went to the scene, and it looked like things were fine.
10:57Then everybody got a notice that the state was out and that there wasn't even going to be
11:03access or sharing of information, which I was a little incredulous when I first heard it,
11:11because, as you may know, Chris, you know, state and local prosecutors work with federal prosecutors
11:20all the time on everything from guns to drugs to trafficking to fraud cases.
11:25It's not unusual at all.
11:28It's how we do business, right?
11:30And so to say that, hey, the state's out and you guys can't be a part of anything,
11:35that was a little startling and a little new.
11:38Two, we tried behind the scenes to actually get them to change their mind.
11:43So far, we have not been successful.
11:45The president was asked about this today.
11:47We played a little clip in the intro where he was asked, you know, should they be sharing
11:51evidence?
11:52And his response was, normally I would say yes, but in this case, no, because Minnesota's
11:56corrupt.
11:57And then as evidence of that corruption, he said that he won the state of Minnesota all three
12:02times and that it was Minnesota's election fraud and corruption that led to him erroneously
12:09losing the state.
12:10And because he's won the state all three times, but it was stolen from him, he can't trust
12:14Minnesota to have a joint investigation.
12:16What do you think of that?
12:18So in other words, we didn't vote for him, so we can't have justice.
12:23Also, I mean, I will point out, no president that I've ever heard of received a $400 million
12:30plane from a foreign country trying to curry favor with him, crypto deals, you know, park
12:38golf courses, the whole nine.
12:42This president has truly distinguished himself in the area of corruption.
12:49So for him to call the Minnesota corrupt is quite remarkable, but all of this is irrelevant.
12:57This is about Renee Good and her precious life and her family and the right that she has for
13:07safety and justice.
13:08That's what this is about.
13:10And so for him to centralize himself and his election losses is quite remarkable and stunning.
13:18But I hope that there's somebody at the Justice Department, U.S. Attorney's Office, somebody
13:24who can say, you know, we've got to keep the victims up front and we've got to, and we
13:29act quite honestly, Ross deserves a fair, free, thorough investigation.
13:36Everyone does.
13:37Everyone concerned.
13:38And if they say he didn't do anything, fine, let's just get on with the investigation.
13:42And I'm sure the evidence will prove that if they are right.
13:45But if they're not right, then there needs to be accountability.
13:50And that, but that requires an investigation that's thorough and fair.
13:55And they're, and I, and I urge them to not stand in the way of that.
13:59It won't engender trust.
14:01It won't make people more likely to cooperate.
14:04It'll just make people believe that you're hiding something and that the reason you don't
14:10want a full, fair, independent investigation is because you fear the outcome of that and
14:14you fear the truth.
14:16And that is the only reasonable conclusion that anybody could come to.
14:20But I'm still hoping that we can get to a cooperative, independent investigation where
14:27we get down to what really happened here.
14:31You've been careful in this conversation, I think advisedly so, about the actual facts
14:37here and calling for transparent investigation.
14:40There hasn't really been that care from the top.
14:43I mean, certainly not from the president of the United States, not from the vice president,
14:45not from the secretary of Homeland Security and various spokespeople.
14:50I mean, I want to just play you today a little bit of the exchange, a sort of tenor of
14:55the way
14:55that Ms. Goode in her death is being talked about and insulted, frankly, posthumously.
15:04Here's an exchange with President Trump today.
15:06Take a listen.
15:08The vice president yesterday suggested that Rene Goode, who was killed by this ICE officer,
15:14was part of a broad left-wing network.
15:17What has your team told you about this broad left-wing network?
15:21Who is in charge of it?
15:23Who's part of it?
15:24What's it called?
15:25Well, I haven't seen the vice president's statement, but he's generally very accurate,
15:29I hate to say.
15:30She was a agitator, probably a paid agitator.
15:34But in my opinion, she was an agitator, a very high-level agitator.
15:39She's been called a high-level agitator.
15:41She's been called a domestic terrorist.
15:42I mean, do you think it is appropriate, the approach rhetorically, that the administration
15:49has taken to dealing, to talking about this woman who's been killed?
15:55They're simply trying to justify her killing.
16:00They're trying to convince the public through their rhetoric that it's okay that she's dead.
16:07And that is unacceptable, and it's untrue.
16:10It's also cruel and completely unnecessary.
16:13I mean, this is a mother of three.
16:15This is someone's wife.
16:17This is someone's ex-wife.
16:19This is a daughter.
16:20She was a respected member of our community.
16:24And I am deeply saddened by these shameful, irresponsible comments.
16:29They're not true.
16:30And I want Minnesotans and anybody who knew Renee Good to know that we know that these
16:37things are not true.
16:38But quite honestly, this is what commonly happens.
16:42You know, I mean, we had to protect George Floyd's reputation.
16:46I mean, you know, the bottom line is if they shoot you, they're going to say that you deserved
16:49it in a multitude of ways.
16:52And so I can't say that I'm surprised.
16:58Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison, I really do appreciate you making time for
17:01our show tonight.
17:03Thank you, Chris.
17:03Please keep it up.
17:05Coming up, the dystopian effort to get Americans to disbelieve what they're seeing in front
17:09of their own eyes from Minnesota.
17:10That's next.
17:13We've now all seen the video that was apparently from the cell phone of the ICE agent who shot
17:17Renee Good.
17:17The administration is clearly pushing it as if it were exculpatory.
17:21To my reading, it's not at all that.
17:23It's the first and only time that we get to see Renee Good alive and on tape with her
17:27saying to the agent, I'm not mad at you, dude.
17:29I'm not mad at you.
17:31That's moments before she is shot and killed at point blank range.
17:34But there continues to be an attempt to get people not to believe what they can see with
17:38their own eyes.
17:39Adam Stewart was the staff writer at The Atlantic.
17:41His latest piece is first the shooting, then the lies.
17:43Michelle Goldberg is an opinion columnist in the New York Times where her latest piece
17:46is by killing Renee Good, ICE sent a message to us all and they joined me now.
17:53Adam, what did you make of the concerted effort today to push this video from the highest levels
18:01and the vice president of the United States as this, you know, magical exculpatory piece
18:07of evidence?
18:10Yeah, I think either that they made a tremendous error in judgment and thinking that this video
18:16is exculpatory or their position is simply that if you do not have the correct political views
18:23that is supporting Donald Trump, that the taxpayer funded and armed agents of the United States
18:32government can kill you if they feel like it and get away with it.
18:39Michelle, the video evidence, it's one of these situations I've been in, in very low
18:44stakes situations.
18:45Like if you've been in a sports bar or a game where like there's a replay and both sides
18:49can kind of cite it and contest it.
18:51And, you know, I've been trying to be very careful about all this.
18:54Like, I do not think that it's cut and dried at all that, for instance, this would live
18:58up to a legal standard of murder or that even reckless endangerment could be prosecuted.
19:02Like, I really don't know based on what we have so far.
19:05But this vilification of her has been so intense and really unlike anything I've seen in a minute,
19:12particularly coming from like the highest levels of the government, including the president.
19:16Well, I think, I mean, it obviously has precedents.
19:18You sort of see this whenever the police shoot a black man and you find out, you know,
19:23they're no angel, they're no choir boy.
19:25I mean, I think it's out of one case, it actually was a literal choir boy.
19:28Yes.
19:29But, and what's, what's striking is that the things that they're using to vilify her
19:32cannot even in their own kind of logical framework be evidence that she was a threat.
19:39It's more just evidence that she maybe had it coming.
19:43And I think that's what makes it so, you know, that gives it this new sinister quality.
19:47You have Jesse Waters on Fox, you know, kind of sneering that she had pronouns in her bio.
19:53You had Eric Erickson, the right-wing radio host, calling her awful.
19:58I can't remember.
19:59It's an acronym for something about affluent, affluent liberal white women.
20:03I don't remember exactly the, all the letters.
20:05But you have this, there's, there's been this kind of simmering rage on the right towards
20:10white women, towards kind of what they see as grading resistance moms.
20:14And all of that has been projected onto her.
20:19And so one of the things that video shows, it's not that she was dangerous, but maybe
20:23that she was mouthy.
20:24Yes.
20:24I think that's very well said.
20:26There's also your point, Adam, about this, this kind of belief that compliance, noncompliance
20:31deserves death.
20:32Um, and, you know, we should note here that for a long time, we've had the same sort of
20:38conservatives here who said the, the ICE officer feared for his life telling drivers who have
20:43nonviolent pedestrian protesters in front of them, that it's okay to run them over, even
20:48pushing for legislation such as in Florida and other states that would allow that.
20:51Right.
20:51So as soon as it's switched, who's in the driver's seat and who's the pedestrian, as
20:56soon as the political valence switches, but here's Congressman Wesley Hunt basically, Adam,
21:00making your point that, that noncompliance means that you risk death.
21:04Take a listen.
21:07The bottom line is this.
21:08When a federal officer gives you instructions, you abide by them and then you get to keep your
21:13life.
21:13And it is clear that she tried to use her vehicle as a weapon, mow over an ICE agent, and
21:19now
21:19she is dead.
21:21The second part I think is clearly not true, but that first line, what do you think about
21:25that?
21:25You abide by them and you get to keep your life.
21:28Yeah.
21:29Look, their real position is if you disagree with us, we get to kill you.
21:32Uh, and I think it's interesting, however, that whatever little nub of a conscience is
21:39in his mind there, uh, is forcing him to lie about the video and say that she tried to run
21:45the man over when we can all see her turning, turning the wheel away from the ICE agent.
21:51Uh, you know, and that kind of lie is sort of a tell, you know, like in poker, it's a
21:57tell.
21:57It says that he knows that he's making an unjustifiable argument by saying that, you know,
22:03a law enforcement gets to kill you if you're noncompliant or perceived to be noncompliant,
22:08which is what he's really saying.
22:10So they have to go back to this made up.
22:12She attempt, she was an attempted terrorist.
22:14She was an attempted murderer.
22:15But their actual position is we can kill you if you disagree with us.
22:19That's their position.
22:21Well, the two last things she does are turn the wheel to the right and then try to drive,
22:25uh, away.
22:27There's also, when you take a step back, Michelle, like, it's just like all this weird right
22:30wing discourse.
22:31I'm calling it like a clean shoot and, you know, when you take a step back, right?
22:36Okay.
22:36What's the context here, right?
22:37In, in the, in the context of policing, right, um, around George Floyd and other examples
22:43we've seen, you know, there's an argument like, well, we need police to keep us safe and
22:47fight crime and we can't have officers cowed.
22:49Put that discourse aside.
22:51In this case, what are they going to do?
22:54What, what did they, what did, what did they do a few hours after the shooting?
22:57They went to a high school in Minnesota where they started tackling people at a high school
23:00and pepper sprayed them.
23:02Like what is being protested here is that this has absolutely nothing.
23:05If you take a step back from what happened on that street with public safety or protecting
23:09people.
23:10Right.
23:10And I think the lesson is that, and this should have been clear from the beginning, but it
23:14should be doubly clear now is that when you put these unaccountable masked armed
23:19men on the streets, who've been told by the administration that they're fighting a war,
23:24that they're, you know, kind of involved in some sort of live action video game.
23:28This is not just the, the kind of the change in the fundamental relationship between the
23:34people who live in this country and its rulers does not just apply to immigrants.
23:38It applies to all of us, right?
23:41I mean, you're in this situation now by this Republican congressman's own words in which
23:46you as a citizen or as a person have the onus to be kind of perfectly disciplined and to,
23:54to behave like, you know, with kind of, with, to behave with perfect obedience.
23:58And they have sort of no onus, um, to be restraint, to be restrained in any way, to deescalate.
24:07It's a climate.
24:09I mean, it's a climate that's like anathema to just being a free citizen.
24:14And it doesn't matter if you're undocumented or not.
24:17And part of the context here, which is, you know, it's a true context when we talk about
24:20left-wing agitators is there's a huge organized effort by ordinary citizens to disrupt what ICE
24:26is doing.
24:26Right.
24:27And that's what they are trying to, I think, overtly intimidate people from participating
24:32in.
24:32I mean, yes, all over this country, wherever ICE has turned out, you've seen ordinary people
24:37turn out to peacefully document the people that they're snatching so that there's some
24:41record of their arrest and also to videotape them in part because when they don't videotape
24:47them, they are able to get away with kind of unspeakable things.
24:51And to use their First Amendment right, Adam, to tell them to take a walk and tell them
24:56they're not welcome, which is constitutionally protected.
24:59Here, I want to play you this quickly.
25:00This is this is the sort of menacing threat that comes from an ICE agent today to women
25:05doing the exact same thing.
25:06Take a listen.
25:08If I continually see you following us, interfering with us, honking your horns, blocking our cars,
25:15you have a very high probability of making a really bad decision and being arrested today,
25:20so you know, if we continue to have you follow us.
25:25OK, OK, have fun.
25:28Don't make a bad decision today.
25:31Don't make a bad decision today rings a little differently, Adam, a day after a woman like
25:35that was shot in the face.
25:37Yeah, look, again, you know, as Michelle said, this is actually reversed.
25:43It should not be the case that the burden is entirely on the citizen to preserve their
25:49own life against an agent of the state who has been empowered with the authority to protect
25:54the lives of citizens and to be able to use lethal force in their defense.
25:59Instead, now we have this sort of idea that, you know, they can do whatever they want.
26:05They can act as recklessly as they want or as contemptuously as they want.
26:09And individual people, if they are not perfect, can be put to death or summarily executed as a
26:15result.
26:15That is not freedom.
26:17That is tyranny.
26:18And it's something that every, you know, the reason that people are out there protesting ice
26:23or honking at ice or blowing whistles is because they are opposing tyranny, which is the most
26:29American thing I can think of.
26:30And as unfortunately, you know, masked men with guns killing people because of their
26:37political beliefs or because of their gender or because of their identity, that's also
26:42American.
26:42But it's a kind of American behavior, you know, that is should be relegated to the dark
26:48chapters of our history instead of something that is something that we should have to worry
26:52about today.
26:54But I'll just note as a final note here, you are, as a free citizen, allowed to honk at
26:58people, including agents of the government, Adam Serwer and Michelle Goldberg.
27:02Thank you both.
27:03Still ahead, Senator Tim Kaine on Venezuela and the completely insane oil rush scene at the
27:09White House today.
27:10Next.
27:15The Trump doctrine, such as it is, really boils down to this headline, today's New York Times.
27:19Trump asserts his global power has one limit himself.
27:23His view is essentially, who's going to stop me?
27:26Today, he hosted executives for more than a dozen oil and gas companies at the White House,
27:30discussing his plans for how they should invest in Venezuela after U.S. forces abducted the
27:35country's sitting president less than a week ago and brought him to the U.S. to face charges.
27:38And he continued to assert that he himself personally would dole out the proceeds of any oil sales.
27:48You know, Venezuela needs money, and we're going to make sure that they get money, and
27:53we're going to get money, and the oil companies are going to make something for the work they
27:56do, and they're going to get back their money.
27:59We're devising a formula, but it won't be so much of a formula.
28:02It's going to be what they need.
28:03We're going to take care of what they need.
28:05There'll be plenty left over.
28:06We're going to have a lot of money left over.
28:08And the money left over is going to the United States of America, and the oil companies are
28:12going to be very happy.
28:14Now, listen to this.
28:15The White House says the U.S. will control Venezuela's oil production, quote, indefinitely.
28:19Also, senior administration officials told members of Congress, listen to this.
28:23The proceeds from the sale of Venezuelan oil would not go into the U.S. Treasury, but to private banks.
28:32So those bank accounts would be controlled by who exactly?
28:37Senator Tim Kaine is a Democrat of Virginia.
28:39He serves on both the Armed Services Committee and the Foreign Relations Committee, and he joins me now.
28:43Senator, let's start on that.
28:45Is it in any way lawful to take captured oil, sell it at market, and divert the proceeds to a
28:53private bank account to dole out as you see fit?
28:59Chris, this whole thing is illegal.
29:01If you listen to the president's quote, the two words he repeated most were money, money, money, and oil, oil,
29:09oil.
29:09And nobody wants to send their sons and daughters into a military action to try to grab some other country's
29:18money or their oil.
29:19No, this is completely illegal.
29:21And that's why I challenged the president's action and said, let's have a debate on the floor of the Senate
29:28in front of the whole American public.
29:30Get this out of the classified setting where everything has to be held secret.
29:35Let's talk about this mission.
29:37Because the more we talk about it publicly, I think the more the American public will say, what the hell
29:42is this president doing?
29:45There were several votes yesterday on that War Powers Resolution.
29:48Will you actually explain to me?
29:50I feel like I don't actually understand what God voted on yesterday.
29:53I had Adam Schiff on.
29:55I know it sets up a debate next week.
29:58What it would actually do in real terms.
30:02Well, it's already had an effect.
30:04So the actual vote was any senator can file a motion to challenge the use of the military and hostilities
30:14without a congressional authorization.
30:16Unlike other bills in the Senate, it can't be locked up at a committee and deep six.
30:23You can file that motion and you're guaranteed a vote.
30:27The technical vote yesterday was a vote to release the bill from the committee.
30:32The Republican committee would have hidden it and never let it see in the light of day and put it
30:37and put it on the floor of the Senate in full view of the American public, which we've needed to
30:42do since September.
30:43I mean, it's amazing.
30:44The greatest deliberative body in the world has not had a single public hearing about this entire mission.
30:52Four plus months in, 200 combatants killed.
30:56U.S. troops now injured.
30:57Some hospitalized.
30:59150 aircraft.
31:01The deposition of a president.
31:02The U.S. now claims to control the Venezuelan economy.
31:07Venezuelan politics.
31:08Who's the interim government?
31:09When will elections be held?
31:11The vote yesterday was to say that we're going to debate this on the floor of the Senate in full
31:16view of the American public, and the American public deserves that.
31:20There were, I believe, four Republicans who joined the Democrats in voting for that.
31:24Today we got word, I mean, the president, you know, vented his spleen online, as he wants to do, but
31:30also called them individually.
31:31In some calls, he told the senators they were voting against the military, two officials said.
31:35He even was talking about how he's so mad at Susan Collins, he was maybe going to endorse her, I
31:39guess, Democratic opponent.
31:40But it does seem like he really doesn't want to have that debate.
31:45He's afraid to, because if you I know an awful lot about this, Chris, because of I've been in the
31:51classified room as an Armed Services and Foreign Relations Committee.
31:55I've seen the the weakness of the legal rationale.
31:58I've seen the shocking weakness of the targeting criteria.
32:03I've seen the video of the strike on shipwrecked survivors.
32:08But I'm not allowed to describe any of it because they'll only show it to us in classified.
32:13My Republican colleagues who voted with me, and there were actually five yesterday, they were just voting that it's time
32:22to get this out of the skiff and onto the floor of the Senate, especially after the president says this
32:27will likely go on for years.
32:29And he may also use military action against Colombia, Mexico, Greenland.
32:36He's already used it against Nigeria and Cuba.
32:39So if we're going to do that, it's time for the American public to understand it, because it's it's folks,
32:46sons and daughters who are going to be deployed by this president, who, as far as I know, has no
32:50connection to military service himself or in his family.
32:54You just mentioned Greenland.
32:56They're they're still at it.
32:57I think they're very real.
32:58There's kind of a good cop, bad cop thing happening where, you know, the White House, the president suggests a
33:04use of force, like you go outside someone's business with a baseball bat and you say, I'm going to smash
33:07your windows.
33:07And then Marco Rubio or someone else says, well, we want to buy it from you.
33:10Can we find an acceptable price?
33:12And Trump, in his sort of inimitable mobster way today, said it's the easy way or the hard way.
33:17Take a listen.
33:19I'm not talking about money for Greenland yet.
33:22I might talk about that.
33:23But right now we are going to do something on Greenland, whether they like it or not.
33:28We're not going to have Russia or China occupy Greenland.
33:32And that's what they're going to do if we don't.
33:34So we're going to be doing something with Greenland, either the nice way or the more difficult way.
33:40What do you think of that?
33:43He's completely wrong.
33:44It's not going to be the easy way or the hard way.
33:47It's no way.
33:48Denmark is an ally.
33:50Greenland is an ally.
33:51They're sovereign nations.
33:52And I've talked to my Republican colleagues in the Senate this week.
33:56If the president thinks he's either going to militarily engage or try to buy Greenland, he is completely deluded, which
34:05he may be.
34:06That's not going to happen.
34:07And Congress, even my Republican colleagues, are going to stand up against a president trying to strong arm an ally
34:15into, you know, caving.
34:18And I spoke with the ambassador from Denmark to the United States today, and I made that very plain to
34:25him.
34:25And he had heard the same thing from my Republican colleagues.
34:28All right, Senator Tim Kaine, thank you very much.
34:31Glad to, Chris.
34:33Still to come, as anti-ICE protests swell in the wake of Rene Good's killing, what a loud opposition means
34:38for America in this crucial moment.
34:40Next.
34:46In the wake of killing of Rene Good by ICE, we've seen protests across the country in communities large and
34:51small and in between and in Minneapolis, but then everywhere else.
34:55Thousands of Americans standing up to Trump's federal agents in the streets.
34:59We've seen protests, of course, where Good was killed, in the city of Minneapolis, in the Twin Cities.
35:04But we've also seen it in Philadelphia, in Chicago, Phoenix, Indianapolis, Portland, Maine, Cleveland, Louisville, Kentucky, many other cities.
35:14The expectation of these protests will only grow in the coming days.
35:16A number of grassroots organizations, including Indivisible, have scheduled events this weekend,
35:21giving more folks the opportunity to show solidarity against the Trump administration's mass deportation push
35:26and the government violence that we've witnessed over the duration of that push and specifically in the past week.
35:33In a joint statement today, a coalition organizer said across the country,
35:36communities will gather in nonviolent, lawful and community-led actions to honor the life lost, demand accountability and make visible
35:43the human cost of ICE's actions.
35:46Ezra Levin is the co-founder and co-executive director of Indivisible, and he joins me.
35:49Now, Ezra, I know you and other groups in this coalition have been organizing in response to this.
35:55I'm curious what you've been hearing from the kinds of people who are members who have been participating in things
36:00like No Kings and others in the last few days.
36:04Well, Chris, I actually have a note from one of our local leaders in the Twin Cities, Lisa, from Indivisible
36:09Twin Cities.
36:10I'd like to read it to you.
36:11We're not giving up.
36:13We're not going away.
36:14And we're not intimidated by them.
36:16That's what Lisa from Indivisible Twin Cities said today.
36:20What we are hearing from folks all around the country is outrage.
36:24And they should be outraged.
36:26That's, in fact, our job right now is to be outraged.
36:29Because this regime labeled Renee Good a terrorist immediately.
36:35And they labeled her that because they are terrified of what she actually is and what she represents, which is
36:43normal, everyday Americans who are fed up with this secret police force that is terrorizing American communities.
36:50She was a mother of three.
36:51She had just dropped off her kid at school.
36:54She was with her wife and her dog, and she saw her community in distress, and she did the most
36:59human thing imaginable, and she exercised her constitutional rights.
37:03She reached out to try to help her neighbors, and they shot her in the face and killed her for
37:08it.
37:09Every person watching the show right now probably has a person in their life who they might describe as Renee's
37:16wife described her, that she sparkled, literally sparkled.
37:19Renee's wife wrote today in a statement, she wrote, Renee was made of sunshine.
37:28If we're lucky, everybody has somebody in their life like that.
37:31We can imagine this regime coming after them.
37:33We can only push back in this moment together.
37:38Trump and his goons, they want us to feel alone right now.
37:40What I'm hearing around the country is outrage and a demand for elected officials to actually take action.
37:47Twenty-four hours ago, we launched a weekend of action tomorrow and Sunday.
37:53Twenty-four hours ago.
37:54Right now, there are more than a thousand events all around the country registered, so I would highly encourage folks,
37:59do not be alone this weekend.
38:01Find your community and show up.
38:03Remember Renee Good, but also push your elected officials because it's not their job to be outraged.
38:08That's our job.
38:09It's their job to act, and that's what we're asking of Democratic representatives and senators and governors and state legislators.
38:16Do not give one more penny to ICE to terrorize our communities and murder Americans.
38:21Start to rein in this lawless regime.
38:25It was so striking to me as I've read accounts of Renee Good's life, how familiar much of it was
38:32insofar as as a person who was not, I think, a particularly outspoken political activist.
38:37She certainly wasn't some kind of paid activist or professional.
38:40In fact, interviews with neighbors from the last state she lived in said they didn't have any idea what her
38:46politics were until the family decided to move.
38:50And this is someone who, in her normal daily life, dropped her kid off with her dog and her wife,
38:57but clearly had been activated.
38:59You know, like so many millions of Americans have been activated by what we've been seeing this year.
39:05Does it make you worry?
39:08Do you worry that people will get scared, that people will get physically freaked out, that this kind of thing
39:14will stop people from coming out to events like this?
39:18Chris, that's the point of this violence.
39:21That is the point.
39:23It is intimidation.
39:24They understand that fear is contagious.
39:27They fear peaceful, organized people power as authoritarians around the world do.
39:33That's how it works.
39:34But when your constitutional rights are under threat, if you give into that fear, if you give in and and
39:41lay down and just accept that they are all powerful, then you don't have those rights.
39:45The best thing we can do in this moment is link arms because there are more of us than there
39:50are of them.
39:51They are projecting strength, but their power is fragile.
39:55Their power is fragile.
39:56What they are doing is not popular.
39:58It is not popular.
39:59And I'm not just talking not popular among Kamala Harris supporters or Democrats or the left or the independents.
40:08Republicans don't like this.
40:09Police officers don't like this.
40:11Veterans don't like this.
40:12Independents don't like this.
40:13This is not a fight between Democrats and Republicans.
40:16This is a fight between people who want to feel safe in their communities, an authoritarian regime that is seeing
40:21a secret police goon squad out to murder them.
40:23And look, it's not just Renee Goode.
40:26Just a few weeks ago, they murdered another father, another parent who had just dropped his kid off at school.
40:32This is going to escalate as funds and ammunition and guns and equipment flows into ICE in the coming weeks
40:40and months.
40:40And so we have a choice.
40:42Do we show our outrage now?
40:44Do we do our job as Americans to express the outrage that is necessary to then hold our elected officials
40:51accountable for doing their job?
40:53That is our responsibility.
40:55We can only do what we can do.
40:57And this weekend, you're going to see people all over this country stand up to remember Renee Goode, but also
41:03to demand that their representatives actually represent them and get to work reigning in this in this lawless agency.
41:10Yeah, you mentioned the statement that Renee Goode's wife put out today.
41:13I was really struck by it.
41:14It's a really beautiful statement.
41:16People should find it online and read the whole thing.
41:17She seems like a really remarkable and special person, and it's very sad she's gone.
41:22Ezra Levin, thank you very much.
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