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00:00I think you're closet entertaining, and people just think that this is all Murph.
00:05I'll give it up to Murph, but when you two are together,
00:09it's a little song and dance routine there, Matt.
00:13You get the low-key.
00:15You're low-key entertaining.
00:17No, I lead the league in boring.
00:20No, you're good.
00:22The humble routine is really working here.
00:25It's just tough to compete with Murph, that's all.
00:27You're good.
00:28You can't compete with Murph on this.
00:30He's one-on-one.
00:31It was Abbott and Costello.
00:33You know, you need both guys.
00:35John, no shock anymore.
00:37The Milwaukee Brewers are out great.
00:40They've won the last three NL Central titles,
00:43and they look like they're sprinting again.
00:46And Matt Arnold, their head of baseball operations, is joining us this week.
00:50It's an amazing job.
00:51Milwaukee and the Dodgers have been the two best teams so far.
00:54The Dodgers are spending $400 million to do it.
00:57Milwaukee is spending almost nothing by baseball standards.
01:00Matt Arnold is a big part of that.
01:02I don't know if I want to call him Matt the magician.
01:04I don't know if he'll mind if I call him that.
01:05But I'm anxious to hear how he does it, how it's possible to have the best record in baseball yet
01:13again with one of the lowest payrolls.
01:15John, the Yankees said, hold my beer for the Brewers and Dodgers being the best teams in baseball.
01:21I think that they probably are feeling like they're in that conversation, too.
01:24You and I are going to talk about if they've got a chance to kind of run away in the
01:29AL East.
01:29We'll ask the same question about the Dodgers and the NLS.
01:32We'll play hit and error at the end if you stick with us on the show with Joel Sherman and
01:36John Hamer.
01:42John, we're about a week and a half into the season.
01:45Probably, what is that, about 5% or so.
01:48Usually, you don't want to make bold statements.
01:50But I do think our expectation when this thing began is the AL East was going to be a beast
01:56and that the Yankees were going to be one of the very, very good teams in the division.
02:01Early on, they're the only team when we're doing this that's even over 500.
02:05When we're doing this, they got a night game tonight.
02:08They're 7-2.
02:09They've broken out really well.
02:10But I think just as pertinent to all this is that the other teams have not played well.
02:16I think we probably thought that Tampa Bay wouldn't be a big contender, but that Baltimore, Boston, and Toronto would
02:22all be pretty good.
02:24And they haven't been.
02:25And it does lead to at least an early question here is, are the Yankees flexing and going to dominate
02:32this division?
02:33Or are these three teams going through their bad stretch right now and ultimately are still going to be high
02:3880s, low 90 win teams?
02:40Yeah, I think they'll be better than they've shown.
02:43They all have a negative run differential.
02:45Nobody has a winning record other than the Yankees.
02:47It does seem like there is a potential for the Yankees running away with it.
02:53You know, I'm not going to say that it's over.
02:55They clinched it or anything like that, you know, a couple weeks into the season.
03:00But it does feel like if there is somebody to contend with the Yankees, they haven't shown themselves yet.
03:06And beyond that, there's just a lot of injuries.
03:09Toronto's got four guys on the injured list who are starting pitchers beyond the other ones.
03:14And that doesn't even include Max Scherzer, who came out of the game last night with a forearm situation.
03:20He doesn't think it's too serious.
03:21But even four guys on the IL from the rotation, that's rough.
03:27I mean, the Yankees obviously got three guys who are still coming back.
03:30But they have a very deep rotation, all healthy.
03:34And Baltimore's got a situation going on with Eflin.
03:38And Boston, wow.
03:39They're 2-8.
03:40They've never made the playoffs starting 2-8.
03:44The fans were chanting, sell the team.
03:47And, you know, I got stopped on the street a couple days ago.
03:52And somebody said, what is Breslow getting fired?
03:54The Red Sox GM.
03:55It's a bit strong.
03:57But it feels like the Yankees are much the best, as they say, in horse racing at this stage.
04:04You know, John, I was watching the Red Sox game against the Brewers last night.
04:09And Matt Arnold, the head of baseball operations, is going to be our guest of the Brewers later on.
04:14And you know what I felt watching that game is, you know, Boston came back.
04:18They got it to 5-5.
04:20And through the television, there felt like an energy in that ballpark.
04:24In Fenway, like pre-2004.
04:27Like, what was going to go wrong?
04:28They've won four championships since then.
04:31Now, obviously, there's also â they've been a bizarre organization.
04:34They've had these high highs over the last 22 years.
04:38And last place finishes, et cetera.
04:42I look at them as not â you know, I wonder what you think about the ownership situation to the
04:47degree that they clearly are not â
04:50like, we listen to complaints about Hal Steinbrenner in this town, right?
04:53Not spending.
04:55But here goes a team.
04:56They traded Devers' money away.
04:58They didn't re-sign Bregman, and their idea was, well, we're going to do run prevention with Ranger Suarez.
05:04And Suarez has been terrible, and he certainly isn't making as much money as Devers and Bregman combined.
05:10So, like, we have not seen them flex the way that the teams that ended the dynasty under Theo Epstein
05:17said,
05:18we're going to go kind of muscle for muscle, dollar for dollar with the Yankees.
05:22And these Red Sox just simply have not followed the same policy.
05:26To me, the team that needed Pete Alonso and a power hitter in the division the most was not the
05:31Orioles.
05:32It was the Red Sox.
05:33Yeah, they made noise about going after a big bat and didn't end up getting that big bat.
05:40They did get Wilson Contreras, who's a solid player and above-average hitter.
05:44But he isn't that big bat.
05:46He isn't Bregman.
05:47He certainly isn't Alonso.
05:49You know, I think part of the issue with John Henry, the owner of the team, is that he's doing
05:53a lot of other things in sports.
05:56And combine that with the fact that he isn't spending big bucks.
06:00They aren't up there.
06:01Forget the Dodgers and the Mets.
06:02They're not up there with the Yankees and the Phillies.
06:04They aren't in that top five in spending when they are in that top five in revenue.
06:09And the complaint is, obviously, it's a huge sports town.
06:13Everybody's into the Red Sox.
06:14I mean, New York is a baseball town.
06:16But there are people in New York, believe it or not, who are not following baseball.
06:19I think in Boston, everybody is following the team.
06:22And they're all wrapped up in it.
06:24And, you know, I kind of like the idea that it looked like they had a great rotation coming in.
06:29But it isn't panning out the way that I suspected, the way they suspected.
06:34To start 2-8 is a bad sign.
06:36There is a reason they've never made the playoffs starting 2-8.
06:39I know it's only a small percent of the season.
06:44But you begin 2-8, you're kind of suggesting maybe this isn't going to be such a great year.
06:49We shall see.
06:50I'll be surprised if they're below 500 teams by the end.
06:53But, you know, normally a team that starts 2-8 doesn't win 95 games.
06:58I'll say that.
06:59You know, John, having said that, I think for the reasons that you stated when you talked at first about
07:06this division,
07:07that the team I'm most concerned with is the Blue Jays, just because of the depth of injury in their
07:12rotation.
07:13Plus, you know, one of the most important guys on the team is Alejandro Kirk.
07:17And he, you know, I think he fractured a thumb.
07:20And he's going to be out a while.
07:22And some of the guys who kind of were there surprises last year, like Addison Barger, who's gotten off terrible.
07:28But I just keep going back to a rotation.
07:30Bieber, Berrios, Yasevich, Cody Pons.
07:36And as you mentioned, Scherzer came out of the game yesterday.
07:39And I think probably under the best circumstances, they're hoping for 15 of 20 starts from Scherzer at his age
07:44anyway.
07:45He doesn't get through seasons.
07:46So, but they were hoping a lot of those would be early as the rest of these guys were getting
07:50healthy.
07:51So any kind of setback.
07:52And it's hard to ignore, John, I wrote about this today for my online column.
07:57The Yankees have not taken on an injury since spring training began.
08:01So that's six weeks of spring training and about two weeks now.
08:04Now, they went in knowing, like they built their pitching staff to withstand early, knowing they wouldn't have Cole Rodon
08:12in particular, Cole and Rondon in particular.
08:15And then Clark Schmidt, maybe to the second half.
08:17And Anthony Volpe was the other guy on the injured list.
08:19And they built the team.
08:20And they've used the same 26, the 26 players we thought who would make the team, made the team.
08:25They're playing round and round.
08:26And I know this is from the duh category, but if you play your best players over and over again,
08:31that's a big advantage over teams that are not getting to play their best players all the time because of
08:36injury.
08:36I know a storm is coming, but the longer the Yankees put off the storm and maybe create some distance
08:41now, the better for them.
08:43Yeah, I mean, there are many teams that can survive four starting pitchers on the injured list.
08:48Maybe the Dodgers can.
08:49I mean, maybe the Yankees could.
08:51Maybe.
08:51I mean, they've got three right now who are returning.
08:54We knew we're going to be injured at the start of the year.
08:57But this is why I didn't think Toronto would be a playoff team this year.
09:02They just began with too many injuries.
09:04I like the way they operated in the winter.
09:07They did make a try for Tucker.
09:09They did talk to Bichette.
09:11They did a lot of talking.
09:12They signed some guys.
09:14I mean, what if Gaussman's been the best pitcher in the league, basically?
09:18What if he hasn't been that guy?
09:19Is he going to continue with 10 strikeouts, no walks every game?
09:22I don't know.
09:24He is a good pitcher.
09:26Obviously, you've got â they did sign Cease, which he's a good pitcher.
09:30But it just doesn't feel like right now they have ammunition to contend with the Yankees.
09:36It really doesn't.
09:37Yeah, you know, like last year.
09:39I mean, maybe we should have given the Yankees a little more credit last year.
09:42They began the season with three starters on the injured list.
09:45Hill, Cole.
09:46Cole, who missed the whole season.
09:47Hill, who missed about four months.
09:48Clark Schmidt missed a couple of weeks at the beginning and then went down again.
09:51I mean, they got to 94 wins with a rotation that opened with Stroman and Carrasco in it.
09:57And I do think, like, if we're looking for what the downside could be, the Mets would stood it early.
10:02They put three starters on the injured list in spring, Montas, Minaya, and Blackburn.
10:06And they would stood it early.
10:08But because, like, Montas and Minaya were never really good last year and Blackburn was â got to the point
10:15where they just released them, like, it began to wear on it over the course of the season.
10:19And I think we probably think that one of the weaknesses of the Blue Jays was probably going to be
10:23the length of their bullpen.
10:24You have to probably worry about blowing it out early.
10:27But also, if you're going to, like, be in it all the time because you're either using openers or short
10:33starts, et cetera.
10:35John, can I â the other team we haven't mentioned here is Baltimore.
10:38You mentioned they â Zach Ethlin was put on the 60-day IL.
10:42So he's going to be gone for a while.
10:44And he was obviously going to be a key part of the rotation.
10:48You know, Trevor Rodgers has continued to pitch well.
10:50I like Braddish.
10:53You know, we'll see what â you know, they sent Dean Kremit to the minor leagues.
10:56So they have a starter to bring back.
10:58But they haven't fired early either yet.
11:02Do you believe in that team as a team that is going to â again, 85-plus is probably going
11:07to â it's what you'll need to at least get into the playoffs.
11:10Yeah, to me, they're borderline.
11:12They still â it feels like they're still kind of young.
11:15It's good that they added Alonzo.
11:17That's a big plus.
11:18Obviously, Gunnar Henderson is a terrific talent.
11:21But many of their young talents in the high draft choices haven't panned out the way they had hoped.
11:27I mean, Adley Rutschman is doing a little bit better this year.
11:30But he isn't the superstar that he looked like he might be at the beginning.
11:35Jackson Holliday is, you know, a solid average player at this point.
11:40He's very young.
11:40So I think eventually he's going to be good.
11:42But he's not a star yet.
11:44They've had other guys who they've drafted in the top five who have not really panned out to be stars
11:50to this point.
11:51They feel like a young team.
11:53I feel like a team with questions still.
11:55They should be better.
11:56Certainly, Alonzo does help them.
11:59You know, Eflin's a big blow, though.
12:02I think that is a huge blow for that team.
12:04He's a very, very solid, above-average starter.
12:09And a team like that can't really afford to lose somebody like that for half a year or more.
12:13John, look, I'm sitting here at Citi Field.
12:17The Mets are going to play the Diamondbacks today.
12:19The Diamondbacks and the Padres have kind of been the teams that have chased and pushed the Dodgers a little
12:25bit the last few years, especially the Padres.
12:27To me, it feels like the Dodgers not only kind of got closer to perfecting their team by adding Diaz
12:37and Tucker, but that Arizona, which I think has the most players on the injured list in the whole sport
12:44right now,
12:45and the Padres, who kind of just shot a lot of their bullets to kind of, like, use their farm
12:51system, use the money that they were allowed to when Peter Seidler was still alive and running the team.
12:58They both feel like they've stepped a step back, and the Dodgers have taken a step forward.
13:02And I don't know what's going on with the Tony Vitello Giants, but it doesn't look very good from a
13:07distance.
13:07And, of course, the Rockies should probably be relegated in the Premier League or something to another lower field.
13:12Hey, the Rockies are doing okay.
13:13Hey, they've won a couple games.
13:15They've only got a negative two-run differential.
13:18We've got to give them props at this point compared to what we've thought about them.
13:22But they're certainly not a contender.
13:23And this division, I mean, this is even more of an overmatch.
13:27I mean, not unexpected, but is there any chance anybody could contend with the Dodgers?
13:33It feels like there's zero chance here.
13:34At least with the Yankees, there's some chance that those other three teams that we're talking about.
13:39John, don't you think there's a real â I mean, just to go back to that,
13:41it's like I assume one or two of these teams at least is going to â like this is their
13:46â
13:46you know, the Yankees will probably have a 2-8 at some point during the â
13:49they almost always do under Boone.
13:51Like there is bad stuff coming as far as play and injury that they haven't suffered yet.
13:55I don't think that this will be a cake â
13:57do you actually think this is going to be a cakewalk for the Yankees?
14:02It might be.
14:03I wouldn't be shocked.
14:04I mean, it's early.
14:05You know, they've played 10 games or so at this point.
14:07Yankees have played nine.
14:09They've looked very, very good.
14:12Their lineup, the top half of it, is good enough.
14:15The rotation has looked excellent.
14:18Yeah, I mean, I don't think they're as good as the Dodgers.
14:21And I think the teams below them are probably better than the teams chasing the Dodgers.
14:25So it's not a guarantee.
14:26But I see the potential there that this is not going to be that close.
14:31And you mentioned before about not giving the Yankees enough credit.
14:34I mean, the Yankees are not going to get credit unless they win the World Series.
14:37That's just â that's just, you know, that's their thing.
14:41You know, they set that up themselves by always saying it's a failure if we don't win the World Series.
14:46And now the fans all buy into that.
14:48And it's â I mean, it makes them different, I guess.
14:51But I won't be shocked if they run away with it.
14:54The Dodgers, I'll be shocked if they don't run away with it.
14:56Now, they're not going to put in a full effort in the regular season.
14:59They don't have to.
15:00They didn't last year.
15:01They ended up having to play that first round and have two days where they had to play the Reds.
15:06It could have been the Mets, but it wasn't.
15:08In either case, the Mets weren't going to beat them either in those two games.
15:12But I do feel like at this point, and you mentioned the Giants, I mean, they're off to a disastrous
15:18start.
15:19The Padres and the Diamondbacks, I'm with you.
15:21The Diamondbacks, I think part of it is injury, but it feels like both teams have not taken a step
15:27forward at the very least.
15:29You know, John, you went a little off the board last week where we ended up talking about the â
15:32like, who's the Yankee kind of top four or five, the Mount Rushmore of it all.
15:37I wonder if I could go off the board a little.
15:38Will, you made me think about something here.
15:42So this â you know, like you mentioned, the Yankees only are given credit if they win the World Series,
15:47and it's their paradigm.
15:48It's the Steinbrenner model, you know, championship or bust.
15:52Would you rather have the Yankees' 2000s or the Red Sox' 2000s?
15:56Yeah, I was thinking about that earlier.
15:58The Red Sox have the four championships, and I think championships are the most important thing.
16:03But also just a lot of, like, last place finishes, incredibly bad years in there.
16:09The Yankees pretty much haven't played a meaningless game in this century.
16:12Right.
16:13Have a championship in 2000, if you consider that, this part of this century.
16:17And obviously won in 2009, while the â since 2004, the Red Sox have the four championships.
16:23Red Sox are kind of like the football giants.
16:25If they get close, they actually win the Super Bowl or a championship, but they're kind of not great all
16:29the other times.
16:30Right.
16:31Who would you â like, if you were a fan, would you rather be a fan and get the four
16:36parades, but there's a lot of miserable seasons, or have it matter every day?
16:40I think it mattering every day is better.
16:42You know, that makes the Yankees special.
16:44They haven't had a losing season since 92, I think it is.
16:48So, 93.
16:49No, no, you're right.
16:50You're right.
16:50Right.
16:50So, it's been a long â in either case, it's been more than three decades since they had a losing
16:55season.
16:55I think I'd rather have that, but it would be nice to have those three extra championships, right, to see
17:00you have a nice round 30 championships.
17:02That wouldn't be bad.
17:03But I don't think the Yankees would put up with last place finishes.
17:07I do think if there were multiple last place finishes, they would have more changes than they have had.
17:12You know, I think there would be more upheaval, although obviously Hal is generally against upheaval, but you wouldn't have
17:20a general manager who's been in there since 1998, I think.
17:25He's been in there a long time, longer than any other general manager.
17:28And, you know, he's had a winning season every year, so there's something to be said for that.
17:34You know, John, you mentioned earlier the passion in Boston for the Red Sox.
17:39I mean, I do think one of the things is they are the only game in town.
17:43Like here, you know, you do have the Mets to multiple teams in every sport, and it's just like they
17:52â and Fenway Park is â you know, they still draw even when they do poorly.
17:57I kind of think part of the thing would be if the Yankees had a last place season, I think
18:01they'd bleed hundreds and hundreds of thousands of fans, which would change their business model to some degree.
18:08Sure, when I was a kid, they would draw a million, right, or less, I think.
18:12You know, I mean, obviously there were fewer people, less interest maybe, but â and you can watch the games
18:20on Channel 11 very easily.
18:21Maybe that makes a difference.
18:23I don't know.
18:24Yeah, I think you're right.
18:26The fans in Boston are pretty diehard, so they'll be with them through thick and thin, and that's what it's
18:33been for them, thick and then thin and back and forth again.
18:36So, yeah, it's interesting.
18:39Half the people would say they'd rather have the championships, and half would say they'd rather have the consistent winning
18:44teams.
18:45But I think it's nice to have the consistent winning teams.
18:48I'm not against it.
18:49Yeah, I think you and I create the 50-50.
18:52I think I'd rather have the championships and deal with the misery when it's bad because just the championships are
18:56so forever.
18:58A team that hasn't won the championship, but they keep just winning division after division, and I'm not exactly sure
19:04how they do it, is the Milwaukee Brewers.
19:07The guy who is their head of baseball operations is Matt Arnold, and he joins us next on the show.
19:41We'll see you next time.
19:44Matt, it was a mouthful, but we're appreciative that you're joining us again on the show.
19:49Thanks for having me, guys.
19:50Good to see you.
19:51You know, Matt, I think when you've been on before, I've asked a question about Secret Sauce and the Brewers,
20:00and at some point, I think it's probably disrespectful.
20:04Like, you just have a lot of good baseball players.
20:06So I wonder, what is the Milwaukee Brewer key under your restrictions to accumulating this level of talent where you're
20:18good in your market year after year?
20:22Yeah, it's probably, it's good players, it's good people, you know, and we're very fortunate.
20:26Good ownership, good, you know, good leadership.
20:28It starts at the top, obviously, with Mark Atanasio and his family being super supportive of everything that we've tried
20:34to push here for a lot of years.
20:35Those guys have been incredible stewards of our franchise and really care about Milwaukee like we all do.
20:41And, you know, being a part of a great group of people is what it's all about, you know, and
20:45whether you're winning or losing, you know, when you're around good people, it makes everything a little bit better.
20:52And, you know, when you're winning, it makes it even better, you know.
20:55And so I think just starts with having really good people and then having good process around that hopefully leads
21:00to acquiring and developing good players that we can hopefully have here in Milwaukee for a really long time.
21:06I agree with you on the good people, and I think Mark Atanasio is one of the best owners in
21:11baseball.
21:12That said, you do have payroll restrictions in the smallest market in the game.
21:17When you make, obviously, over the last several years, you've traded Hader, you've traded Burns, you lost Adamas, most recently
21:26lost, traded, excuse me, Peralta to the Mets.
21:31And the expectations around the league are not always that you're going to win the division.
21:36Give Joel credit.
21:37He picked you guys to win.
21:38I don't know he did on faith or whatever.
21:40I had you second.
21:43What do you think when you make these trades, when you trade Peralta, do you say to yourself, I mean,
21:47obviously, it was a solid trade from your perspective, in a way, looking forward.
21:53But do you say to yourself, we're going to win again anyway?
21:56Or what do you say?
21:57Did you feel going in?
21:58And you do have the best record in baseball as we do this.
22:01Do you feel going in confident even after trading all these great players?
22:06Yeah, we do.
22:07I mean, I think we've created a culture where we expect to win, you know, and we say that with
22:11a lot of humility, because I totally recognize how hard that is to do.
22:15And to get to that point where you expect that is something that's a credit to the people in our
22:20clubhouse and the people around the building, for sure.
22:23But yeah, I mean, obviously, when you're making those types of trades or the names that you mentioned, those are
22:28always challenging, you know, and I don't take those lightly.
22:32Certainly, when you're moving away from good players like the ones you mentioned, those are tough, you know, for our
22:36franchise.
22:37But we have the culture, hopefully, to be resilient around those types of losses and have the next man up
22:43mentality that Murphs talks about all the time.
22:45And, you know, the combination of the right type of people in the room and then obviously the talent of
22:51the players, you know, hopefully yields really good results over time.
22:54You know, I think I'm doing this from Citi Field, if you could hear here, Matt, and just on the
23:00timing, Freddie Peralta is walking out to the bullpen as we speak.
23:05Let's talk about your side of the trade.
23:07You know, you've gotten off eight and two.
23:09Brandon Sprout actually is it's been a little rough for him early on here.
23:15Ten hits and a little over six and two thirds innings, seven walks, almost a 15 ERA.
23:20Jet Williams, a triple A. He's done what one of the things he's good at.
23:22He's played a bunch of positions, but he hasn't.
23:25It's a week's worth of games or so, but he hasn't gotten off.
23:28What are you seeing and hearing and what are you expecting?
23:32Yeah, I think both those guys, I mean, made a great impression when we first got them, you know, and
23:37we continue to still feel incredible about having both of those guys.
23:41And Sprout, if you saw his last outing, was actually outstanding for his first three innings and then got touched
23:46up a little bit in the fourth there.
23:48But again, the ingredients there are tremendous and we still feel like he has a chance to be a really,
23:52really valuable contributor here to our franchise.
23:55And the same with Jet Williams as well.
23:57I mean, Jet's made a great impression on everybody.
23:59He plays the game the way that Murph always talks about, playing hard, his mentality, his approach, you know, what
24:05he can do, his athleticism, like all the ingredients and just who he is as a person.
24:09And honestly, he really stood out.
24:11So both those guys, again, a week into this, we still feel really good about both of them.
24:15Let me ask you about the other end of that trade, and that's Peralta.
24:18Did you make an attempt to try to keep him long term or just figure or just know that it'd
24:24be impossible at this point with the smallest market in baseball?
24:28And what are your thoughts about him going forward?
24:31Yeah, obviously can't get into any specifics around negotiation, certainly, but, you know, feel the world about about Freddie and
24:38who he is.
24:39You know, he's he's one of the guys that meant a lot to our franchise.
24:42I think we first traded for him when he was something like 18 or 19 years old and just watched
24:47him grow up and mature and be a leader and an anchor on a on a on a really good
24:52team.
24:52You know, and just like we talked about earlier before we got on here was just kind of who he
24:56is and the person that he is meant a lot to our clubhouse.
24:59And I think he's a, you know, a frontline starter in this game.
25:03And, you know, I hope he gets rewarded the way he deserves to because he really is a valuable player
25:08in this league.
25:09I wonder, Matt, can you go a little further?
25:11You know, obviously, we have a big New York listenership on our podcast.
25:16Tell us something about they're getting to know Freddie Peralta.
25:19And obviously, the smile comes off the page, the positivity does.
25:24Do you have a favorite Freddie story, something that you think embodies the man?
25:30Man, I mean, there are a lot of moments, you know, where I could just tell you, like, even even,
25:35you know, you reveal yourself oftentimes in tough situations.
25:39And I feel like when there were times when we lost some tough series here, including to the Mets, you
25:45know,
25:45and this guy was just the first to step up and give you a big hug, you know, or just
25:49just be the right kind of person in those tough moments.
25:52You know, he's just a really good, good person, you know, that that you want to be on your on
25:57your team.
25:57You know, when things are down, he's just always so optimistic and so positive, you know.
26:02And I think those are the kind of guys that help you get to those those winning type of cultures
26:06and mentalities as a team.
26:07And again, I can't say enough great things about about Freddie.
26:11He's tremendous.
26:12Matt, you've been with us a couple of times and we appreciate that.
26:15But I think our most frequent guest, a non-New York guest, is Pat Murphy.
26:20As you know, he's quite an entertaining fellow.
26:22So we enjoy having him on.
26:24I was amused recently when he said that, you know, he wasn't sure he had that much faith in Garrett
26:30Mitchell this year.
26:32And he credited the front office for putting him on the team and putting him in position.
26:35And that's an unusual thing for a manager to say.
26:38Well, what are your thoughts on that?
26:40And Murphy in general.
26:41And like you, he is a two time.
26:44You are two time general manager of the year and reigning and he's two time manager of the year.
26:49Yeah.
26:49Murph's been a great partner with me here and us for the last decade, you know, and I love him
26:57as a partner, as a teammate.
26:58I mean, he makes us all better and continues to challenge everybody.
27:01So, you know, when he has something rough to say about somebody, it's not just that one person, I can
27:06tell you.
27:07He's a straight shooter with everybody, honestly.
27:09But I think that helps us all be better as a whole because of his expectations.
27:13And look, nobody bats a thousand on, you know, their evaluations.
27:18And, you know, certainly it's nice and refreshing for Murph to be honest about, you know, how he's feeling.
27:24But he also, he changes his opinion just like we all do, you know, when you see a player and,
27:28you know, somebody in the case of Garrett Mitchell, who's been hurt a lot, you know, you can understand that
27:32he just hasn't been out there enough to really evaluate.
27:34But once he's out there, he's showing us exactly why we took him in the first round.
27:38I mean, he's just a really, really talented player.
27:41And I'm just so happy for Garrett, honestly, for what he's overcome, you know, with his health over the last
27:47couple of years and to finally have some success on the major league field because it's been such a grind
27:51for him.
27:51He got hurt. He was back healthy, got hurt again, and has missed real time.
27:55And it's been an emotional journey for him.
27:57And I'm certainly super, super happy for Garrett and the success that he's having.
28:01Now, I want to say something.
28:02As somebody who likes stopping in your camp in Arizona every year, I think you're closet entertaining.
28:08And people just think that this is all Murph.
28:12I'll give it up to Murph.
28:14But when you two are together, it's a little song and dance routine there, Matt.
28:20Matt, you're low â like, you get the low-key.
28:22You're low-key entertaining.
28:24No, I lead the league in boring.
28:26No, you're good.
28:27No, it's not.
28:28You're good.
28:29The humble routine is really working here.
28:31It's just tough to compete with Murph.
28:33That's all.
28:34You're good.
28:35You can't compete with Murph on this.
28:37He's one-on-one.
28:38It was Abbott and Costello.
28:40You know, you need both guys to make it really sense.
28:42Right, but you need a straight man, right?
28:44Abbott was a straight man.
28:45I think Matt's better than a straight man.
28:47Look, we were talking about your marketplace and what you can do and what you can't.
28:51You did make news in the last few weeks by signing Cooper Pratt to a long-term contract.
28:56What was it?
28:57Eight years, $50.75 million.
28:59I'm wondering for a guy who hadn't really played above AA and hadn't even played there much
29:07and hadn't yet showed the full blossoming of offense, which I assume you think is coming,
29:11but did show some of the other stuff.
29:14Why do it?
29:15Why do it now?
29:16Go through doing something that is still we're seeing more of, but it's certainly not standard yet.
29:23Yeah, look, I mean, it's really a great organizational win.
29:27You know, when you have these guys and you draft them and develop them and then, you know,
29:32hopefully see their careers out and are able to extend them, similar to what we did with Jackson
29:36Trurio, you know, where you sign and develop a player like that.
29:40And we really believe in Cooper Pratt, you know, and a lot of these deals, you're obviously just
29:44betting on a person, you know, as much as you're betting on the player.
29:48And so I feel like Cooper shows us all the ingredients you want to see in a young, you
29:54know, budding, really good major league player, you know, and so I'm not trying to put any
30:00undue pressure on him, but we really like him.
30:02We like his profile and, you know, we felt like the time was right and obviously he did
30:08as well.
30:08And so, you know, we're certainly thrilled to come up with an agreement with him because
30:12we think he has a really bright future.
30:13And you weren't one of the first, if not the first to sign a big deal for a non-major
30:18leaguer at the time in Jackson Trurio.
30:20And that has worked out.
30:21So, and obviously you've done this with Cooper Pratt.
30:24I'm curious on two other players.
30:26One of them is actually a major leaguer, but since you did sign Cooper Pratt, I mean, who
30:31Jesus Made is ranked high.
30:33And I love that name, by the way, ranked even higher than Cooper Pratt on the list.
30:39You know, is there a way to keep him too?
30:43I mean, you've done it now with two guys.
30:45I mean, this guy is now, I think, number two or three ranked player in baseball.
30:49And while I ask about him as well, I should mention you have another infielder who is a
30:55hell of a player and was one of the best players on Team USA, and that's Bryce Terang.
31:00Is there any hope at this point or is he too good at this point for the Milwaukee Brewers
31:04to lock up?
31:05Yeah, I think just, you know, in general, I mean, we're certainly open to these, as you've
31:09pointed out, you know, and these kind of conversations come up organically.
31:13Sometimes they happen, you know, that we're approached or we're approaching them.
31:17But ultimately, it's a two-way street on these types of things.
31:20And sometimes you can miss the window.
31:22Sometimes it's the appropriate time, you know, but we're always, I think, just as a rule
31:27of thumb, we're always open to having these conversations, no matter who it is.
31:29And whether it's Bryce, who's established as a Team USA starting second baseman and won
31:36a platinum glove and everything that he's done and who he is, I can't say enough great
31:39things about Bryce Terang, you know, or a really young, less proven player like Jesus
31:47Made, you know, we're always open to having these kinds of conversations here.
31:51I'm so glad John handled that question because I would have definitely called him
31:54Jesus Made because of Jesus, right?
32:00You, you, you've mentioned Chirio a few times.
32:03I think one of the, again, this is a very, very Milwaukee Brewer thing.
32:06You score, you're averaging the second most runs in the majors and Chirio hurt himself
32:11just before the season began, fractured his hand, I believe.
32:15I'm wondering just like a two-part thing.
32:18Why is the offense compensating without him?
32:21And can you give us some kind of update when you think you might be getting arguably your
32:25best everyday player back?
32:27Yeah.
32:28So, yeah, I think our offense is thriving just because we've had that mentality of next man
32:32up, like we talked about.
32:33I mean, these guys really do step up and I think we've accumulated some really good depth.
32:38I mean, there's no way to replace somebody like Jackson Chirio.
32:42I would also add Andrew Vaughn to that mix who we lost, you know, almost right in that same
32:46window, you know.
32:47And, you know, losing both of those guys has obviously been tough on our offense.
32:52But, you know, you see what a lot of the guys are, like we talked about Garrett Mitchell
32:55earlier, you know, Terang Yelich has been absolutely on fire to start the season, which
33:00is just so great to see from what he's overcome, you know, with his health.
33:05And so there are just a lot of guys that, again, have stepped up.
33:08And I would expect Jackson Chirio to be back hopefully within, you know, maybe early May,
33:15you know, something in that range.
33:16But again, you know, these things heal at their own pace.
33:20So it's hard to say, but I would say probably right in that range for Jesus at this point.
33:24Last night, Wilson Contreras was hit by a pitch.
33:27And I think he said it was the 24th time he's been hit by the Brewers.
33:30It was interesting to me in that obviously he used to be a Cardinal and a Cub, so he
33:37had more opportunity to be hit.
33:39But it was interesting to me that his brother is one of the stars of your team and the catcher
33:42of your team.
33:43What's your perspective on this?
33:45Do these two brothers not get along or what's going on there?
33:49No, my understanding is they get along great, you know, and that's his brother and its family,
33:55you know, for sure.
33:56But, you know, I don't I think those are not necessarily related, you know, to their to
34:01their on field.
34:02You know, William is a competitor and wants to win.
34:04I know that he's as competitive as any player I've ever been around.
34:09And if you're around him for a couple of minutes and he just wants to be in the lineup every
34:12single day.
34:13And William has just been an absolute horse for us and just so valuable to our team, you
34:20know, and again, we've we've gone against, you know, Wilson Contreras here for years.
34:25You know, for the better part of a decade since I've been here.
34:29And he's obviously a talented player.
34:31And, you know, things you see last night, you know, again, I'll let other people judge
34:36on whether that's that's that's good for our sport or not.
34:39But I like the fact that our our players didn't didn't need to take the bait there or respond.
34:44I felt like our guys handled it, handled it like pros.
34:46You know, Matt, you guys not only lose players, ultimately, as you're doing this again, I'm
34:53at Citi Field, as you see, all my friends keep coming in the room here where I am.
34:59And, you know, David Stearns is running baseball operations here.
35:02He was he was with you in Milwaukee.
35:05Craig Council has left for the Cubs.
35:09And again, Murph is one manager of the year in the two years after Council's left.
35:13I wonder what that's like for you with these people, like like they are competing in the
35:18National League.
35:18They are people you have long term relationships with.
35:21Feel good to keep kicking their butts when from the small market as when they leave your
35:27organization.
35:28I wonder, especially Council, who kind of stayed in your division.
35:33No, I don't I don't think about that personally.
35:35I mean, I have great relationships with those guys and always will, you know, what we do,
35:39you know, after seven o'clock, you know, between seven and ten, you know, when the lights are
35:44on is is probably a little bit different, you know, but I think, you know, hopefully, you
35:48know, built long term, you know, lifelong friendships with those types of people.
35:52And certainly we're we're all competitors and we want to fight and win every single game.
35:57But I consider all those guys really, really good friends of mine.
36:00Just just act like we're alone.
36:01You really loved it.
36:04Nobody listens to this.
36:05It's a silly little podcast.
36:07No, it's true.
36:08No, it's true.
36:09Those guys are our dear friends.
36:10I think the world of them.
36:11I really I really do.
36:13You know, I love Caleb Durbin.
36:16I think Joel probably does, too, from dealing with them.
36:18And he had a terrific year for you guys.
36:21And I think people in Boston had pretty good expectations about that trade.
36:25Yet Harrison has been fantastic for your team.
36:28What did you guys see in him and do you feel like he can be a major contributor or even
36:34a star at this level?
36:35Yeah.
36:36I mean, obviously, we've targeted Kyle Harrison for a long time and really didn't have much
36:40interest in trading Caleb Durbin.
36:42But, you know, over time, just the conversations continued to expand and grow.
36:47And as you saw, it ultimately ended up being a big trade.
36:49And I hope it works out for everybody because Caleb was really, really talented.
36:53And, you know, for us, he did a tremendous job, especially in the playoffs.
36:56So really, really always pulling for Caleb, you know, in his career, certainly.
37:02And so at the same time, you know, very happy with the players that we got.
37:06You know, David Hamilton has also been really, really good for us so far and dynamic on the
37:12bases and, you know, even in the box has really made some adjustments and done some
37:16nice things.
37:17So, you know, we'll see Drohan.
37:19We just got just got called up, has a chance to contribute over the next couple couple days
37:24and hopefully years for for us here.
37:26So the combination of all those guys is certainly something we're happy about.
37:30You know, one player I've continued to stay interested in from his New York days, and he
37:35actually played with both teams that he's obviously associated with the Yankees is Gary
37:38Sanchez is back with you guys.
37:40And obviously, he could still put a ball over the fence.
37:42I think he's got three homers and 13 at bats for you early on this season.
37:47Um, what do you see in Gary Sanchez?
37:50Yeah, I mean, he's been a monster and I will say like he's probably one of the most underrated
37:56funny guys in the entire game.
37:58I mean, he's just he's not say that about you that you were an underrated.
38:02No, you shouldn't because I'm not he is like he is he is incredibly funny.
38:07I mean, he is and not just funny, but like he he has really good baseball instincts, you
38:11know, and just having even been a huge prospect of a major pedigree signing, you know, as an
38:17amateur player and then, you know, having a great career.
38:20I mean, we're thrilled to have him.
38:21He's such a great partner here with with William Contreras.
38:24And and he's he's come off the bench in in cases and had huge hits for us.
38:29Obviously, you know, William Contreras is the man here and won a couple silver sluggers,
38:33but have somebody like Gary around not just for his his performance, but also what he
38:38brings to our clubhouse has been has been tremendous.
38:40How great can the Miz be?
38:42And what do you tell him?
38:43What's the strategy with him going forward so he doesn't get hurt?
38:46Yeah, look, I mean, he's he's he's kind of a unicorn a little bit the way he goes about
38:52it.
38:52I mean, he is he's there's there not too many pitchers like him.
38:55You know, you hear different comps about what he might be.
38:59But, you know, ultimately, I think he's he's just Miz, you know, and I think he goes about
39:04his business.
39:05He's he's a really hard worker.
39:06He's a bright kid.
39:07He's very thoughtful.
39:08And he's just got an absolute rocket of an arm, you know, and and I love the fact that
39:13he wants the ball and he gets so pumped up out there and and our fans love to watch
39:17him.
39:18And yeah, I'm thrilled for all the success that Miz is having matters way to wrap this
39:23up.
39:23You your franchise over the last period of times when David Stearns took over and then
39:28handed the baton to you has been incredibly successful.
39:33You're still looking for the first championship in the history of the franchise.
39:37Do you think that there is anything that you have to do to make sure you're good over
39:42162 games that doesn't translate well to October, where maybe some of the teams that
39:48with bigger stars like the Dodgers, who you faced last year or the Mets the year before
39:53that something is just tougher in a short series at that time of year that might be tough for
39:59you and your market to overcome.
40:02Yeah, I think it probably means we just need to be healthy at the end, you know, and and
40:06and get hot.
40:07You know, I mean, we were hot at different points last year, certainly, and we won 97 games,
40:11but we ran into the, you know, the Dodgers who got hot at the right time and won the World
40:15Series, you know, and so I think you got to be hot at the right time.
40:19And and I don't know if there's any formula for that.
40:21We're still looking looking for that one.
40:23But, you know, and you need to be healthy.
40:25And again, we've lost, you know, Brandon Woodruff and Yelich and Devin Williams.
40:29And we've had a couple of these things throughout it towards the end of the season have just
40:32popped up for us for a number of years.
40:35And, you know, weren't quite at 100 percent, but nobody's at 100 percent, you know, so that's
40:39not an excuse. It just sort of happens for has has happened for us a couple of times
40:44there. But I would say, honestly, just trying to get hot at the right time and just have
40:49your horses out there, you know, at the end of the season.
40:51And but we need to we need to get there.
40:53We have a long way to go, you know, and again, I know we're off to a good start here,
40:56but, you know, a long way to go because we have we have a tough division and it's going
41:00to be a tough National League for sure this year.
41:02Yeah, it's a lot more interesting.
41:03NL Central got a lot more interesting in the last week, right, when Connor Griffin was brought
41:07up by the Pirates. But the class of the division for the last few years has been the Milwaukee
41:11Brewers. Matt, you've obviously had a ton to do with that.
41:16It's another outstanding start at this point.
41:18We can't say we're surprised anymore, regardless of who might leave.
41:22What you put on the field continues to be outstanding.
41:25And you've been a guest a few times.
41:27And I know speaking for John, we truly appreciate you joining us and wish you nothing but the best
41:32with your season.
41:33Awesome. Thanks, guys. Appreciate you having me.
41:35Yeah. And understated funny, whether you're saying it or not.
41:38I second that.
41:41Boring.
41:42No, thank you, guys. I appreciate you having me. Thank you.
41:45All right. Thanks, Matt. Appreciate it.
41:46Thanks, guys.
41:53John and I, of course, thank Matt Arnold for joining us on the show.
41:56John, hit or error?
41:58Well, I'm going to give an error. I don't know if I gave him an error last week, but if
42:01I did,
42:02no one will remember and I'll give it to him again.
42:03Tony Vitello, I don't get what he's talking about. I don't understand the man.
42:08You know, he brings in his ace reliever, his closer into a Mets game where he's winning
42:15either by three or four runs. It's the sixth inning. There's one out. There's nobody on base.
42:20The number five hitter, Luis Robert, is up five, six, seven. And he brings in the closer claiming
42:25that's a high leverage situation. You know, you can't redefine what high leverage means.
42:30High leverage means that the game is on the line. It is not on the line in the sixth inning
42:35with a
42:35four-run lead. The number five hitter up with nobody on base and one out. That is not high
42:40leverage. Maybe if you're playing South Carolina on Friday night, it's high leverage.
42:46Yeah. I mean, you know, it's a gamble. It was a gamble to hire him. And sometimes these gambles,
42:50look, A.J. Hinch was a gamble when he was hired by the Diamondbacks, right? And everybody was,
42:55not everybody, but the scouts were all over him. And it didn't work because, partly because of the
43:00negativity surrounding him. And maybe Vitello won't work because of the negativity, which I'm
43:05part of around him. I don't know. And maybe he really will be a great manager someday, like A.J.
43:09Hinch ended up becoming in another place. But for now, Tony Vitello is making no sense to me.
43:17Yeah, John, it was by a kind of stoic, traditional baseball guy like Buster Posey to go off the
43:25chessboard like this was really interesting. And I think it's one of the fascinating stories of the
43:30year and has kind of been fascinating disaster-wise early this year. John, I'll give a hit. Jose
43:36Ramirez, in the last few days, became the all-time games leader in the history of a longtime franchise
43:44in Cleveland, 1,620. It had been Terry Turner, who last played in September of 1918. So it had
43:50lasted- I saw that. Was he called Old Cottonhead or something like that? Yes, it was. We really
43:55missed the nickname game. We missed the nickname game. Well, nobody's named- We can name Old
43:59Cottonhead on one of the teams- We can't go Cottonhead. I don't think- I think Whitey is out
44:03at this point.
44:04You know, that would seem normal 30, 40, 50 years ago, but nobody's going to be called Whitey now.
44:10Nobody's going to be called Old Cottonhead. Where was- What about Lap LaJoy,
44:14or is it LaJoy? Where did he stand? He was apparently below Ramirez.
44:19Chris Beaker, Jim Tobey. Earl Averill. Yes. Well, you know what? They don't have the rich history
44:27that the Yankees have, but I give Jose Ramirez props. I mean, the guy's a top five MVP guy every
44:33year with the stolen bases, the home runs, all-around play, and the guy loves Cleveland. He keeps signing
44:39up to reasonable deals to stay in Cleveland, so I'm giving him props for that. I'm with you.
44:45That's a hit. Yes. Six top six MVP finishes. You know, if Manny Machado, Nolan Arenado,
44:55and Jose Ramirez are on a Hall of Fame ballot and you can only put one in, who goes?
45:00What do you got? Machado? Arenado. Kind of the elite. Arenado. Maybe we'll say Gregman at some
45:07point. I think Gregman and Justin Turner. I'm going to have to give Ramirez the nod at this
45:11point, right? I mean, Arenado's kind of, he was the top guy, but he's the faded. Machado,
45:18I mean, to me, they're probably all Hall of Famers. They're probably all Hall of Famers. Yeah,
45:22they're probably all in. They're all in. Machado and Ramirez are in for sure. I think Arenado's a Hall of
45:29Famer, too, but I'm going to give you a Ramirez at this moment. Yeah, I think those are the guys
45:33from this era are kind of like the top, top third baseman, and I guess that was my way of
45:40saying
45:40it was stealth for a while while the Hall of Fame candidacy Jose Ramirez was building. I don't think
45:45it's stealth anymore. It's just kind of a bird that the guy is just one of the best 10, 15
45:50players in
45:50the sport year after year after year. To your point, he does everything well. Our guy who does
45:55everything well is Tommy Hogan. He's our producer. Thank you, Tommy, so much. Apple, Spotify, wherever
46:00you listen, please rate, review, download, do it all. Look, I say this all the time is when you do
46:08these things, you help the show. If you'd like to help the show, Soto's going to the New York Post
46:14sports YouTube page and giving us a view, and we hope you continue to stick with us on the show
46:19with Joel Sherman and John Heyman.
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