- 9 minutes ago
Category
📺
TVTranscript
00:23Australian universities are in crisis.
00:30Anybody who thinks that we don't have a governance problem with our universities is living under a rock.
00:35As public funding has declined, universities have become increasingly corporatised.
00:41We have all these finance and business experts on university councils now, but our finances seem to be getting worse.
00:49How's that?
00:50Big staff layoffs.
00:51I try not to check my student debt, but every time I do I can't help but think how it's
00:56being used.
00:57We reveal how much money is going to consulting firms and the influence they now wield in our unis.
01:04That is the standard operating procedure is infantilise the client, make them think that they can't do things without you
01:11and make sure that you end up with a permanent desk.
01:15Universities have redacted virtually all information.
01:18As courses have been cut and jobs lost, universities stand accused of lacking transparency and accountability.
01:26We have a right to know how much universities are spending on consultants.
01:33Is there any chance we can get a few words on the way in?
01:36So, I'm on the phone.
01:38While the government continues with a policy, it's slammed in opposition.
01:43It's a stupid policy, it's a policy that's failed and it needs to go.
01:48We investigate the turmoil on Australian university campuses and why there's so much visceral anger about the decisions made by
01:57university leaders.
02:13The University of Technology Sydney is one of Australia's top-ranked universities.
02:19But over the past year, it's been engulfed in turmoil.
02:24It is outrageous.
02:25It is unjustified.
02:27This is not how a public institution should be run.
02:31Parfitt, Parfitt, Parfitt!
02:32Out, out, out!
02:41My name is Andrew Parfitt and I'm Vice-Chancellor and President of UTS.
02:45And I swear that the evidence now about to be given by me shall be the truth, the whole truth
02:49and nothing but the truth.
02:50So help me God.
02:51Last year, the Vice-Chancellor unveiled a plan to slash jobs and courses to save $100 million a year.
02:59So how many job cuts are proposed?
03:00So initially we proposed $400.
03:03$400.
03:03And so I think the NTU was saying that's about 10% of the staff.
03:07It's, yes, around that.
03:08That's pretty drastic, I think.
03:11It must be a pretty significant sort of crisis to feel like you have to get 10% of your
03:18staff.
03:19Yes.
03:19Blaming debt and diminished funding, Andrew Parfitt's initial plan was to cut 167 courses and over 1,100 subjects to
03:29stabilise the university's finances.
03:34Hey guys, have you heard about the cuts happening at UTS?
03:38How are you, Ella?
03:38Good, thanks. How are you?
03:39Good. What are you up to today?
03:40Good. Well, this is our stall from the Stop the Cuts campaign.
03:43Yep.
03:44Ella Haid is a student union rep.
03:46She's studying a diploma in languages which has been discontinued in the cuts.
03:52We're handing out these flyers to let students know that hundreds of staff are going to be laid off at
03:56our university and hundreds of courses are going to be gutted from our subject choices.
03:59This is Andrew Parfitt. This is our Vice Chancellor. He earns $935,000 a year. He's the highest level executive
04:07at UTS.
04:09It's a lot of uncertainty in our education. A lot of people don't really know whether they're going to be
04:13able to finish their degree here.
04:15The university leadership is arguing here it needs to save money to pay the debts. What do you say to
04:22them?
04:22I think that students and staff shouldn't have to pay for the financial troubles that our university executives caused for
04:28themselves.
04:35Last month, UTS announced its revised plan.
04:40$100 million in savings would be trimmed to $85 million.
04:44Over 120 academics would lose their jobs.
04:50143 courses would be axed.
04:55Sarah Wise teaches public health.
04:58Two degrees in her school have been scrapped.
05:02We are going from 15 staff in the School of Public Health to a discipline of seven.
05:08And that is really going to reduce the real critical mass of expertise, teaching and research that's been built over
05:18the last eight to nine years.
05:20Her team trains future health workers in areas like pandemic preparedness and Indigenous health.
05:28Now decisions have been made, we're still not clear on really why.
05:32What is the rationale, I think is really, really disappointing.
05:37And it's something in the School of Public Health, because we are quite driven by our values, we have felt
05:42very deeply.
05:57These flashy buildings are a big part of the story.
06:02Before Professor Parfit's time, UTS launched a billion dollar redevelopment plan.
06:09Now he insists the $300 million bond that financed one of these buildings needs to be paid off next year.
06:18It's judgement about risk, it's judgement around what controls that we have,
06:23and it's judgement around what is actually going to deliver the long-term sustainability of the university.
06:30One UTS staffer said this rush to pay off the bond was like starving your children to pay off your
06:37mortgage earlier.
06:38And professors at the UTS Business School say this debt should be refinanced to avoid job losses and course cuts,
06:46and to avert reputational damage to what is one of the top 100 universities in the world.
06:54Leading UTS academics have branded this a manufactured financial crisis.
07:02Well, my colleagues and myself, we've looked at the accounting numbers, we've looked at what the university has said,
07:08and we don't believe it's a crisis.
07:12Paul Brown is an associate professor at UTS specialising in accounting, governance and innovation.
07:21One of the reasons that we think it's a contrived crisis is the debt we don't believe needs to be
07:26paid off straight away.
07:27In fact, our debt now is less than it was 10 years ago, and our income has increased significantly.
07:32The expenses that have gone up which have caused this financial tension are not necessarily the ones that are being
07:40looked at.
07:43Instead of relying on its own experts, UTS turned to external consultants.
07:48The firm, KPMG, that cost $7 million.
07:54Those $7 or $8 million that were paid to KPMG to advise on the long-term outlook for the university,
08:02that is an extraordinary amount of money.
08:07Brendan Lyon wouldn't let a Big Four consultancy firm anywhere near a university.
08:13He's a former KPMG partner, and says when he was at the firm, they began to target universities.
08:24When I joined KPMG, that was a real focus.
08:27They'd recently recruited a former vice chancellor of an Australian university,
08:32and from what I saw within KPMG, it was a real growth area and a real growth target.
08:41KPMG managed to embed itself inside UTS.
08:47They set out to identify academics and courses that didn't make money.
08:54They had UTS email addresses.
08:57My colleagues have been in meetings where these KPMG staff have been identified
09:01either during or after the meeting, and it wasn't disclosed in the beginning.
09:07KPMG's infiltration of UTS was so effective that by May 2025, the firm had 24 staff with UTS email addresses.
09:18They included three KPMG partners and two directors.
09:26So that is the standard operating procedure is get into a client and look as much like you're part of
09:32the client as you can.
09:34Infantilise the client, make them think that they can't do things without you, and make sure that you end up
09:39with a permanent desk.
09:43Staff Freedom of Information requests for KPMG's blueprint for the UTS cuts came back heavily redacted.
09:51Paul Brown was one of a handful of academics allowed into a room for one day to view the full
09:57document under strict supervision.
10:01We've done loads of reports. We know what a report looks like. And so we went in and we kind
10:05of like saw this document. It's about 200 pages. We start looking through it. It's kind of like a PowerPoint
10:09presentation.
10:12Paul Brown was stunned by some of its proposals.
10:16There's a couple of laugh out loud moments. One of them was where they had an organisational structure of UTS,
10:21how it kind of looks at the moment.
10:23And they kind of overlaid this triangle that looked like a cookie cutter. And they said, if we chop off
10:28the sides, you know, that's going to be a good thing.
10:30And we laughed because it was like a Woolworths type organisational structure, not a university with all its complexities and
10:37the like.
10:42KPMG has refused to give Four Corners an interview, but they've been asked to give evidence here at the New
10:48South Wales State Parliament today at an upper house inquiry into the university sector.
10:55Chris Matthews.
10:56Thank you. So Chris Matthews, National Education Lead for KPMG.
11:01Chris Matthews and his colleague Claire McGuinness gave evidence about the firm's work inside UTS.
11:07One element of our analysis included looking at academic performance, which is a common measure across the sector.
11:17As part of looking at academic performance, we looked at research income. Research income is one of the major revenue
11:25streams of an institution.
11:28KPMG's evaluation of academics as revenue streams angered many at UTS.
11:39KPMG employees were present during a two-day retreat at Manly Beach when the university's full leadership team first heard
11:47about the scale of the cuts.
11:50I've been told by people who were in the room that senior leaders were shocked when the numbers were laid
11:57out.
11:57And that the second in charge at UTS, the provost Vicky Chen, expressed frustration at the process.
12:06We've learned that the provost was not happy with how the data was interpreted in the KPMG report and had
12:14serious concerns over the proposed cuts.
12:18On the Monday after the retreat, Vicky Chen was suddenly called into a meeting up there in the vice-chancellor's
12:26office.
12:26The provost's employment was about to be terminated. Within hours, her email access was cut off.
12:34She didn't even get a chance to say goodbye to her work colleagues.
12:40In an email to staff, Andrew Parfitt said,
12:43With sadness, he was writing to advise that Vicky Chen has decided to pursue her research career.
12:50The truth is, she was forced out by the vice-chancellor just months after she received a performance bonus.
13:01Vicky Chen would not comment. She'd signed a settlement agreement.
13:13For months, Four Corners has been trying to get an interview with Andrew Parfitt.
13:18His office has said they could not find a suitable date.
13:23A few words on the way in? No, I've gone on the phone.
13:26Is there any chance we could get a few words on the way in?
13:29So, I'm on the phone.
13:31We wanted to ask him about the firing of Vicky Chen.
13:35About the use of KPMG consultants and the widespread anger over his cuts and how they've been handled.
13:43I've got an APTI breakfast.
13:45They're very happy.
13:47The man who ignored his own staff's no-confidence motion was now ignoring us.
13:53Is there any chance we can grab a few words?
13:55A little bit later.
13:56His office said he would only answer questions in writing.
14:06UTS did not answer any of our written questions about Vicky Chen's departure or its leadership retreat.
14:13The university said changes underway at UTS have been shaped by and reflect the ideas presented by staff during extensive
14:22consultation.
14:24And that an independent review of its governance would take place this year.
14:32Australian universities are now big business.
14:37In the 1980s, the Hawke government reforms increased university places.
14:42But public funding didn't keep pace, forcing universities to find that money elsewhere.
14:50They looked to international students.
14:53It was an entirely different world in the 1980s.
14:56At that point, 80% of university funding came from the Commonwealth.
15:00Today it's 40%.
15:01So it's actually halved as a percentage.
15:03But the number of students has tripled to 1.6 million.
15:07Changes made in 2020 put even more pressure on universities.
15:12Nearly a billion dollars each and every year has been ripped out of universities since the Morrison era.
15:19It causes real pressure and ultimately we're putting more pressure on our staff at universities to deliver more for less.
15:27Somewhere multicultural where international students are welcome.
15:30As universities pursued other funding streams.
15:33You become more than just you.
15:35They became more corporate.
15:36You become you to the power of us.
15:40Marketing, rankings and industry partnerships began to dominate.
15:47What drives international student demand is often international rankings.
15:50What drives international rankings is research and research outcomes.
15:54So it's no surprise you get this, if you like, this circular motion between rankings, research and international students.
16:03A year-long Senate inquiry heard growing concern about the corporatisation of our universities.
16:12We've got a system where we've seen corporate executives coming in running universities without the experience of running an educational
16:19facility.
16:20Knowing about the money is important, but knowing about the reasons why you're there is essential.
16:26As global leaders in higher education consulting, we can help you reimagine the future and deliver it.
16:33Central to this shift has been the rise of external consultants.
16:37Today, more than ever, they confront an environment of change and disruption.
16:42Firms advising universities on strategy, restructuring and cost cutting.
16:48Shape your future with Deloitte.
16:54Corinne Cortez is a professor of accounting at the University of Wollongong.
17:00We asked her to examine how much Australian universities are spending on consultants and contractors.
17:07For 2024, there was $1.8 billion spent by the Australian universities.
17:13$1.8 billion seems like a staggering figure.
17:19It does.
17:19Were you shocked by that?
17:21I was. I was.
17:23And as I was going through each individual one, I was like, that can't be right.
17:27And so the definition of contractor or consultant is unclear.
17:32So it could be some consultancy work or contracting work for IT, but it could also be the big four
17:39consultancy companies.
17:40Absolutely. And that's part of the problem.
17:42I think there's no clear definition about what a consulting engagement is and how it's to be reported.
17:49Definitely the education minister.
17:52We took Professor Cortez's findings to the education minister.
17:58Well, it is shocking, but what is also shocking is that you can't break it down.
18:02And we should be able to know.
18:04We invest a lot of money in our universities.
18:06They do great things.
18:08But if you're spending some of that money on consultants, then the Australian people do have a right to know
18:13who are the consultants,
18:15what's the work they're doing and what's the justification for it.
18:18And so they're the changes that we need to make.
18:20So that's good for transparency reasons, but it's not necessarily going to stop them spending all of that money.
18:25Are you concerned about the scale of the money they're spending on consultants?
18:29Well, there's a lot of terrific people in universities who I reckon could do that job for the university.
18:33But if universities choose to employ somebody outside of the university to do that work, and sometimes there'll be a
18:40good reason for it.
18:41Governments do that as well.
18:42Other organisations do it too.
18:44They need to be accountable for those decisions.
18:52Brendan Lyon is taking legal action aimed at forcing partners in the big consultancy firms to assume greater liability for
19:01the advice they give to clients.
19:02Including universities.
19:06Australia is the only country on earth that has provided practical legal immunity to the big four over everything they
19:12do.
19:13It means that they have no liability, no accountability.
19:17It produces the results that we've seen of terrible damage to universities, terrible damage to corporations and taxpayers.
19:26The firms that have this protection that operate as consultants are Deloitte, EY, PricewaterhouseCoopers, KPMG, Quartermentha, BDO.
19:37Effectively, the firms that are consultants but continue to masquerade principally as accounting firms.
19:43And they've expanded the public interest protections for regulated accountants out to all of their unregulated consulting work.
19:51It's a crazy situation.
19:52It's one that sets the country up for failure all over.
19:55The universities are but the latest victim of this ongoing scam.
20:03Consultants are not just advising universities.
20:05They're also embedded in their governing boards, shaping decisions about their future.
20:12Of 15 universities we sampled, 13 had serving or former staff from leading consultancies on their governing councils.
20:23I believe that there's an intended infiltration of our governing boards by consultancy firms.
20:29You know, it's all the mates looking after each other and seeing these consultancy costs balloon right across the university
20:37sector.
20:38You're actually going to have those hard conversations.
20:40One of the first recommendations of the Senate inquiry instigated by Tony Sheldon
20:45was that universities improve the transparency and accountability of their governing bodies.
20:52Clearly universities don't have the transparency that big businesses have.
20:57We've seen universities self-governing themselves, run by corporates, like a corporate, but without corporate responsibility.
21:08At a time when universities have been cutting jobs,
21:12vice chancellors and their executives have come under fire for bloated salaries.
21:18We have 300 senior executives in Australian universities that get paid more than their state premier.
21:27We've got numerous vice chancellors that are getting paid once, twice, three times more than the prime minister.
21:36Australian vice chancellors are among the highest paid in the world.
21:41A four corners analysis of the latest university annual reports from 2024 found that 20 Australian VCs were paid over
21:51a million dollars a year.
21:53All 20 earned more than the vice chancellor of Cambridge.
22:01Are Australian vice chancellors overpaid?
22:05Australian vice chancellors run some of the most complex and large universities in the world.
22:11Are they overpaid?
22:12I think it's really important that there is much more transparency and accountability in the way that those wages are
22:18set.
22:18I don't set wages for vice chancellors. That's the job of the chancellors and the governing bodies.
22:25As universities face financial pressure and consultants play a growing role in decision making, the consequences are being felt on
22:33campuses across the country.
22:40Orientation week is underway at the Australian National University.
22:46Behind the smiles and welcome speeches, the university has been in disarray.
22:52Plans to cut around 650 jobs and save 250 million dollars triggered a backlash across the campus.
23:03Well, ANU has been an absolute circus. We've seen student dislocation and disengagement. We've seen courses collapsed and closed.
23:16We've seen everything you could possibly do wrong happen the wrong way at the university.
23:22In 2023, Chancellor Julie Bishop announced tech executive and academic Genevieve Bell as her new vice chancellor.
23:30And I know there's some of you in the audience going, I don't even know what a vice chancellor is.
23:35I wasn't entirely sure what it meant either when I said yes to the job.
23:39She lasted just 20 months in the role.
23:42More than 800 staff passed a 95% vote of no confidence in both Bell and Bishop.
23:51One of the most contentious things about Professor Bell's appointment had been her remuneration package.
23:58Genevieve Bell, whilst getting paid, you know, $1.5 million was also moonlighting with Intel and getting paid for that.
24:06To have this sort of arrangements existing within a university raises some serious questions about governance and accountability.
24:14Under her leadership, ANU had planned to abolish its prestigious 60-year-old school of music to save money.
24:25Collapsing it into a new school of creative and cultural practice.
24:32It's been heavy. There were so many changes to our program that have been made on the fly.
24:40We have to take courses that, you know, we never thought about, ones that don't interest us, ones that we
24:45don't necessarily think are actually beneficial to our learning.
24:49The music students fought back, threatening legal action.
24:55Under the new interim vice-chancellor, the music school has been saved.
25:00But for these students, the damage has already been done.
25:06We lost a lot of our best students, our best friends.
25:11We lost all of our bass players.
25:13I'm a drummer. I can't really play without a bass player.
25:18We're paying around about 40 to 50 grand for the degree.
25:23Feels like we're wasting our money on something that they're not providing to us.
25:28The students say there are positive signs the university's new leadership will help restore the School of Music's prestige.
25:39There's no doubt that ANU has faced financial stresses in recent years.
25:45But serious questions have been raised about the scale of the proposed cuts.
25:51The whole argument behind ANU's cuts has been undermined by an unlikely source.
25:58They've been making their own annual reports.
26:00ANU claimed they had a deficit of $142.5 million.
26:05But they didn't count key revenue sources.
26:09In their annual report, it actually states they had a surplus of $90 million.
26:15And that's led to accusations of cooking the books.
26:19So back in 2020...
26:20Richard Dennis discovered the discrepancy.
26:23He's an economist and a former ANU academic.
26:26Is the ANU cooking the books?
26:29Yes.
26:29ANU are cooking the books.
26:31According to their audited accounts, they made a large surplus last year and the year before.
26:36They're claiming to be running a deficit.
26:38They're claiming to have a financial crisis.
26:40The audited accounts show that's not the case.
26:42Why would they do it though?
26:44What's in it for them?
26:44Well, with crisis comes opportunity.
26:46They are making the case that they have to sack certain staff.
26:50They have to change certain courses.
26:52They have to.
26:52They have to.
26:53They're saying they've got no choice.
26:55They've got no alternative.
26:56But they do.
26:57So could they argue that this is not permanent revenue coming in?
27:00That they're structurally in deficit?
27:02They could argue anything they want, but they haven't convinced their auditor of their argument.
27:09ANU did not respond to questions about what Richard Dennis asserted.
27:14In a statement, it said it was consulting widely with staff, students and other stakeholders about the next university strategy.
27:23And that financial stability remains a priority.
27:28ANU's leadership is about to come under even more scrutiny.
27:34The Australian National Audit Office has been examining ANU finances to see whether the cuts were justified.
27:41The ANAO report is yet to be released, but Four Corners has been briefed on its draft findings.
27:50It says that while ANU revenue was not keeping up with costs, it faced no immediate financial crisis.
27:58And that undermines the whole rationale behind those deep cuts.
28:04Four Corners understands the report says the ANU Council approved the proposed cuts
28:10without clear evidence that they were needed, urgent, achievable or likely to have their intended impact.
28:18That the Council should have considered alternatives to the plan.
28:22And that while the plan delivered some savings, it came with big risks and costs.
28:28We also understand the draft report raised serious questions about the university's longer-term financial health.
28:36The Minister's office says he has not seen the draft report.
28:42As the Minister for Education, you have unique powers and responsibilities for the ANU.
28:48Are you concerned that ANU announced $250 million worth of cuts at a time they had a budget surplus of
28:56$90 million?
28:57There's some very serious allegations have been made about what's happening at the ANU, and that's why I referred that
29:04to the university regulator, TEXA.
29:07That investigation is happening right now.
29:09TEXA, the regulator, has said at the moment they don't have the powers to really push and push for change
29:16when it comes to governance failures with universities.
29:19Do you want to legislate in that area?
29:20Yeah, I do.
29:21You know, TEXA's basically got a sledgehammer and a feather at the moment and nothing in between.
29:26That's why we're going to change the act.
29:29It will be the first major change to TEXA in 15 years to give them the sort of powers they
29:33need to act where universities don't.
29:36The ANU is now facing multiple investigations into its finances, governance and conduct.
29:44ANU leaders behave with impunity.
29:47One inquiry involves Dr Liz Allen, an ANU demographer who alleged under parliamentary privilege that she'd been bullied by Chancellor
29:55Julie Bishop while on the university council.
29:58Since 2024 I've experienced threats, intimidation and bullying because I sought greater probity of council conduct.
30:08One of the reasons you're most upset is because...
30:09Julie Bishop has emphatically denied the allegations.
30:12Well, I absolutely reject each and every allegation that was made against me.
30:20Neither Julie Bishop nor Liz Allen would answer questions about the allegations while they are subject to an inquiry.
30:28Julie Bishop declined an interview.
30:32Liz Allen was prepared to speak about what she considers to have been a manufactured financial crisis at ANU.
30:39ANU was doing well and then all of a sudden there was this catastrophic financial crisis that was put to
30:50council by ANU leaders, by ANU executives that hit the panic button to extreme.
30:59Liz Allen says she has concerns about the data that the university gave to the consultancy firm Naus and how
31:06it may have been used to find efficiencies at the university.
31:10The trouble is that that data and the process of the methodology of the creation of that data is an
31:19entire black box.
31:21That methodology is not transparent, it is not public.
31:25So we can't scrutinise the way that the data is transformed.
31:31And I solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that the evidence now about to be given by me shall
31:37be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
31:40Now CEO Tim Orton says they have done over $43 million worth of work for Australian universities over the past
31:48five years, including around $2 million worth for ANU.
31:53Naus insists it did not design the plan for the ANU cuts, but says the firm advised on future arrangements
32:01of their academic portfolio under the restructuring plan.
32:07After giving evidence at the New South Wales Upper House Inquiry, Tim Orton spoke to Four Corners.
32:13Some critics say there's a conflict of interest in your business model, that you're providing the analysis through the data,
32:19you're diagnosing the problem, then you're offering your services to cure it.
32:23Is there a conflict of interest in your business model?
32:28Now's Data Insights and Now's Consulting are two separate businesses.
32:31Now's Consulting does not have access to Now's Data Insights information, doesn't have access to the Uniform data.
32:36But of course we're good consultants and as good consultants we will approach universities and say we have an expertise
32:43we think would be of benefit to you.
32:46And do you ever?
32:46And they find that to be the case in some cases and in other cases they don't.
32:49So through Uniform you access the university's data, how do you know that data's accurate?
32:54Now again your premise is wrong. Through Uniform, Now's Data Insights accesses the data.
33:01Yeah, which is your company right?
33:02Now's Consulting, which is doing the...
33:04But they're both your companies right?
33:06They're both my companies, they're both owned by Now's Group International.
33:08But I wanted to emphasise to you, because many people misunderstand this and it's important you do understand it and
33:13give me time to answer the question, because you're keen to go.
33:16Now's Consulting does not access the Now's Data Insights data unless the university says we want Now's Consulting to have
33:22that data.
33:23Okay, but what I'm...
33:23Tim Orton argues the universities get good value for money from Now's.
33:28Over those five years that we've earned your $43 million, university's revenues were $200 billion.
33:37Everyone would understand that if you put $43 million versus $200 billion, it's a tiny, tiny amount, but it's incredibly
33:44high value.
33:45As I said, university leaders are sophisticated professional managers.
33:48They make really well-informed decisions about when they want to use consultants, such as Now's Group, and when they
33:54don't.
34:03This is what's left when a university is stripped back.
34:08Empty offices, lecturers gone.
34:15At the University of Wollongong, jobs have been slashed, courses cut.
34:22Around 200 staff lost their jobs after a major review of the university conducted by consulting firm Cordamentha.
34:34We're talking about a university that is central to its community.
34:39For those staff and those students to be put through what they have been in the last couple of years
34:46is deeply distressing.
34:51Academics, courses and disciplines were judged on how much money they made.
34:56Those that didn't measure up were cut.
35:06Unlike at UTS or ANU, no one's suggesting that Wollongong faces a fake financial crisis.
35:13The university's 2024 annual report shows debts totalling $462 million.
35:22These buildings up here are the main source of the University of Wollongong's financial problems.
35:29It's student accommodation and it's part of a public-private partnership.
35:35When COVID hit, guaranteed residency rates could not be met.
35:40The university borrowed heavily to buy out its private partner.
35:46In 2024, in a lavish ceremony, the University of Wollongong installed the businessman and banker, Michael Still, as Chancellor.
35:56He presided over a purge of the university's leadership.
36:02First of all, we lose a VC, then we lose two deputy vice chancellors, then an executive dean goes, then
36:12a vice president also goes, then a chief operating officer also goes, and he'd only been in the role for
36:1812 months.
36:19So we made jokes at the time about installing a revolving door on that building.
36:25Michael Still appointed an interim vice chancellor, John Dewar, who had run La Trobe University for over a decade.
36:35He proved a controversial choice because he was a partner at the consultancy firm Cordamentha.
36:44When John Dewar's appointment was announced, the university community was told that John Dewar was on leave from the consultancy
36:51firm Cordamentha.
36:52The conflict of interest then emerges when Cordamentha is invited, in fact, by Michael Still to put in a tender
37:00to manage a whole of enterprise operational review of UOW.
37:08Cordamentha had been asked to submit that tender just two days after the university announced the appointment of John Dewar.
37:16Independence is in our DNA. It shows in every decision that we make.
37:20The firm ended up securing $3.8 million worth of work from the university.
37:28At a university town hall meeting, Professor Fiona Proben-Rapsi confronted the new interim VC.
37:37John, you're a partner at a company called Cordamentha, which is a company that specialises in disaster capitalism, it seems.
37:47Cordamentha has been contracted to do a number of reviews at UOW.
37:52So it seems to many of us looking in that that constitutes a conflict of interest.
38:00Are you a consultant?
38:02I'm not working for Cordamentha at the moment. I'm working for the University of Wollongong.
38:06I've taken unpaid leave from the firm and my employment contract is with the university as interim vice chancellor.
38:16So I'm not employed as a consultant. I'm employed as the vice chancellor.
38:21When Mr Dewar came along...
38:23Michael Still told the NSW Inquiry that Professor Dewar was on unpaid leave from Cordamentha while employed as interim VC.
38:32He had a deal to work a nine-day fortnight.
38:35Which of those is correct?
38:37The chancellor was questioned about what Professor Dewar did on his day off.
38:42But he had no working relationship with Cordamentha. That was our insistence.
38:48Michael Still later qualified this comment in a written submission, saying Professor Dewar's contract gave him the flexibility to spend
38:56his free time at his own discretion.
38:59Michael Still's response to that inquiry failed to mention exactly what Professor Dewar was doing on that one day off
39:07a fortnight.
39:08A letter written by Still, obtained through Freedom of Information, shows Still and Dewar had an agreement.
39:15That the new vice chancellor, as part of his $1 million a year contract, would work at Cordamentha on one
39:23day a fortnight.
39:25You have confirmed that your ongoing role at KM during the term will be unpaid and will comprise one day
39:33per fortnight, during which time you will provide leadership to a team of consultants in the higher education practice.
39:43Michael Still and John Dewar both declined to be interviewed.
39:47The university says Professor Dewar was not involved in any part of the tender process, assessment or appointment decision of
39:55Cordamentha and that he did not do any paid work for the group while he was acting vice chancellor.
39:59What do you say to that?
40:00It sidesteps the whole issue of the fact that as vice chancellor, it's his job as part of the executive
40:08management to oversee that operations review and to be responsible for the decision making in relation to that operations review.
40:16So it doesn't matter that he wasn't involved in the decision about the tender process.
40:20That's a minor part.
40:21And we'll start with you, Mr. Shanks.
40:24The university's former deputy chancellor, now pro-chancellor, has also been accused of a conflict of interest, this time involving
40:33KPMG.
40:34We've set very tight rules to make sure that I'm never involved in any selection decisions or others, or be
40:40in a situation where KPMG would be reporting to me.
40:42Warwick Shanks is a partner with KPMG.
40:46As deputy chancellor, he chaired a financial committee of the university.
40:51I could say honestly until I was invited to this inquiry that I have not known how much work or
40:58the nature of any work that KPMG does with the university.
41:02In a written response to the inquiry, Warwick Shanks said that KPMG had done around $2.7 million worth of
41:10business for the university over the past decade.
41:14After looking at these financial documents, obtained through Freedom of Information, we discovered the figures disclosed to the inquiry were
41:23wrong.
41:24In fact, KPMG were paid more than double what the university had claimed.
41:31The university says that when all of its entities are included, that figure is actually $6.6 million.
41:41Warwick Shanks declined an interview.
41:47When Four Corners alerted the chair of the inquiry, Sarah Kane, she said it reinforced her concerns about accountability across
41:55the sector,
41:56and that it was up to the committee to decide whether the parliamentary inquiry had been misled.
42:03The university told us there was no intention to understate expenditure.
42:15At Wollongong, just like at ANU and UTS, a pattern is emerging of consultants shaping decisions about the future of
42:25Australia's universities.
42:26In Cordamentha's report that recommended making tens of millions of dollars worth of cuts, they acknowledged the workforce data they
42:35used was unreliable.
42:39They had poor quality data when it came to the workforce, when it came to workloads, and when it came
42:46to the reliance on casual staff.
42:48And they note in their own report that despite cleaning efforts, they still can't really stand by the quality of
42:56the data.
42:56So, does this prevent Cordamentha from coming up with massive recommendations for job losses across the institution? No.
43:07Academics at UTS say it was a similar story there, with the data provided to KPMG.
43:15We know that that data was fundamentally flawed.
43:18How do you know that?
43:18Because we've seen the report that was used and was never corrected.
43:23The problem with using external consultants is they don't know what questions to ask.
43:29They basically take what's given to them and then they use it.
43:33This kind of data is known as garbage in, garbage out.
43:37And the garbage out that consultancy groups are using is the garbage that we're presented with to justify our job
43:46losses and the restructuring of our universities.
43:54At Parliament House, leaders of Australia's university sector are gathering for an annual dinner.
44:02They know the minister, Jason Clare, is pushing for change.
44:06After commissioning a report into governance, he's vowed to make universities more accountable.
44:13This year, for the first time, the Remuneration Tribunal will get involved in the setting of salaries for vice chancellors.
44:20University boards will have to become a lot more open and a lot more accountable.
44:27One of the most controversial policies, the Job Ready Graduate Scheme, remains in place.
44:33Brought in by the Morrison government, it ripped close to a billion dollars out of universities each year and more
44:40than doubled the cost of an arts degree.
44:44It's actually turning students who have the best need for university, for social mobility, away from studying at uni.
44:50These are the poorer kids.
44:52And it's deeply unfair.
44:53The cost of an arts degree, $52,000 versus $14,000 for a maths degree.
44:58It's unfair and it's failed.
44:59And I see it as the most urgent reform needed in the sector.
45:04Given you've been Education Minister for nearly four years now, what's stopping you from getting rid of it?
45:10I've said it's failed.
45:12I've also said it's expensive to fix and not easy to fix.
45:15I've also said that the Tertiary Education Commission that we're setting up right now, that's in the parliament right now,
45:20will have a role in making sure that we find out the best way to fix this.
45:26So you've said Job Ready Graduates has failed, but you've failed to get rid of it, haven't you?
45:30It's a bit like eating an elephant, you've got to do it one bite at a time.
45:33We're investing about an extra $6.5 billion into the system right now to implement the sort of reforms to
45:40help more kids from poor backgrounds get to university in the first place.
45:44But the job's not done yet, and this is one of the other things we need to work on.
45:48Hey, have you heard about the staff cuts happening at UTS?
45:50We've got a petition about it, if you wouldn't mind.
45:52Students like Ella Haid say they can't wait any longer for the government to act.
45:58Hey, how's it going? My undergrad in history is going to cost at least $50,000 by the time I'm
46:03done.
46:04I think it's pretty telling from Jason Clare and the Albanese government that they will lambast university executives for not
46:11running the universities properly,
46:12but at the same time they're not willing to spend the money to increase tertiary funding.
46:19The system for funding universities is broken. It's a system that relies heavily upon universities getting money from other sources.
46:26It leads in a big emphasis towards corporatisation.
46:29And I actually think the real call is a return to mission, and starting with those students.
46:33If we're not giving our students the best education, a great opportunity to job, then we're failing at the most
46:39basic point.
47:04Thanks.
47:05Thanks.
47:06Bye.
47:06Max beef.
Comments