- 6 weeks ago
Gary Vaynerchuk joins Jason to share why he believes traditional social media is fading and where smart businesses should focus next. He explains how to find the audience you’re overlooking, and offers a practical framework for getting your content in front of the right people in 2026. Plus, why one of his agencies is rebranding and what it signals about where marketing is headed.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Instagram and TikTok look nothing like television.
00:02Let me explain.
00:03If Entrepreneur Magazine right now
00:04on its Instagram or TikTok posted,
00:06you were not reaching your followers on Instagram
00:08completely like email.
00:10You were putting content into the interest graph
00:12and there will be hundreds,
00:13hopefully for you millions of humans
00:15who will see the content based on what we have shown
00:18the platform we tend to be interested in.
00:21You are eliminating the potential of consideration
00:24by not making content that will find
00:26its potential audience.
00:28We are no longer in social media, Jason.
00:30Interest media is here.
00:31Social media is dead.
00:33Running a business means solving problems.
00:35I tell you how the smartest entrepreneurs do it.
00:38Hi, I'm Jason Pfeiffer,
00:39Editor-in-Chief of Entrepreneur Magazine,
00:41and this is Problem Solvers.
00:47If you want to master marketing in a social media era,
00:51this conversation is for you.
00:53I am talking with Gary Vaynerchuk.
00:55Of course, you know Gary Vaynerchuk.
00:57What you might not know is how deeply sophisticated
01:00he is as a marketer.
01:02Today, we are talking about some news at his company,
01:06some shifts that they're making,
01:08but after that, we get into the incredible weeds,
01:13get really geeky on how to think about the funnel today
01:18and how to structure a team for maximum nimbleness,
01:23maximum responsiveness,
01:25so that no matter what kind of brand you are,
01:28you are able to communicate to exactly
01:31who you need to reach at the moment
01:33in which they are most likely to be listening.
01:37Fascinating, super detailed conversation.
01:39Really excited for you to hear it.
01:40Here's Gary.
01:41Gary Vaynerchuk,
01:42a man who needs no introduction
01:44when talking in the world of entrepreneurship.
01:46You bring me news today, don't you?
01:48I do have some news.
01:50It's funny, a lot of people see me
01:51as a public figure or speaker,
01:54motivational speaker, author, content creator,
01:57but I've been very feverishly building
01:59a very large marketing agency holding company
02:04and we're growing up over here.
02:06Yeah, you sure are.
02:07And I know that there's some big news.
02:09Actually, wait, you know what?
02:09Before we even get to it,
02:10can I just pick up on that thing
02:11that you just said there?
02:12Because people know you for your personality.
02:16They know you for your influence, let's say.
02:19And they don't necessarily know
02:20that you've built this incredible marketing agency.
02:23Something that I have noticed
02:24about the people who succeed the most
02:27in the world of content and ideas,
02:29and I want to say this to you
02:31to hear you react to it,
02:33they're not actually often content-first people.
02:37Like me, I came up making content in magazines.
02:39They're actually marketing people.
02:41They're people who understand
02:42how to connect with audiences
02:43and then figured out how to build great content.
02:45And I would say for me personally,
02:48I'm also an operator, right?
02:50Before anyone who knew who I was on earth,
02:52I was a child, literally a teenager,
02:56who started the process of building
02:58the largest wine store in the country.
03:00That's like real life.
03:01That happened.
03:02You know, and then obviously, you know,
03:06VaynerX, my holding company,
03:07started with VaynerMedia.
03:08We're about to talk about my beloved
03:11small business agency, Sasha Group,
03:13being rebranded to Chuck Media.
03:18You know, we're talking about hundreds
03:19and hundreds and hundreds.
03:21I mean, it's not gonna be long
03:22before I ping you and say,
03:23hey, do you want to talk about VaynerX
03:24doing a half a billion in revenue?
03:27We're on the doorstep.
03:28And, you know, that's humbling,
03:30to be very frank,
03:31for a guy who has a lot of ambitions and bravado.
03:33Like, we built one of the largest independent
03:37advertising agencies in the history of the industry,
03:41Mad Men, in the history of the industry
03:45from, like, the most improbable angle.
03:48Like, literally, here comes a kid.
03:50I was 34, so I don't know.
03:52I think I was a kid,
03:52but I'll be respectful that not everyone thinks that.
03:55Here comes a guy who's making wine videos
03:57on the internet,
03:57and he puts a flag in the ground
03:59that he's gonna build a big advertising agency.
04:01Jason, you know, I caught a lot of flack on Twitter,
04:06you know, and the ad magazines were not kind
04:10about Wine Boy, Madison Avenue,
04:13and yet here we are 15 years later,
04:15and it happened.
04:17Do you think that's because the fundamentals
04:19of growing that wine business
04:21are not actually all that different
04:22than the fundamentals of building any other brand?
04:26Yes, comma.
04:29I built Wine Library because I was such a good marketer,
04:32and I was a good operator and salesman,
04:34and, like, a good guy,
04:36and had good retention of employees,
04:38all things that I used for Vayner,
04:41but what VaynerMedia is,
04:43is that you had a human
04:44that was outflanking everyone
04:47in contemporary marketing in the 90s and early 2000s
04:50when it was website, email, Google search, blogging.
04:54I built a firm that did contemporary marketing.
04:58Madison Avenue still does not do contemporary marketing.
05:01I've been doing this for 15 years.
05:03And now the day of reckoning is here.
05:05The people that are television commercial first,
05:08classic marketing, traditional first,
05:11the ones that are yesterday's digital marketing first
05:16are being upended, feeling the pain
05:18to the social first agencies,
05:21and we're the largest of that.
05:23Well, then that's a good tee-up for the actual news.
05:26So you said it a moment ago,
05:28but really unpack it here.
05:29So you've had this company, The Sasha Group,
05:31which has been focused on small business marketing,
05:33and it's being rebranded and also refocused.
05:38So tell me what's going on and tell me why.
05:40There's so much demand for VaynerMedia.
05:42You know, it starts to get too big
05:44where it becomes not mad.
05:46Like, there's a lot of corporate,
05:48this is just very nerdy,
05:49but luckily this is why I think you're the right-
05:52Yeah, we can nerd out right here, right now.
05:54We're in the right place.
05:55This is business nerdy.
05:56Look, we're operators and we're strategizing
05:59and, you know, keeping so many brands under one roof
06:03is like challenging and has all different dynamics.
06:06It's kind of like sometimes you need to lose 15 pounds
06:09to get like tight.
06:10Like the concept of Chuck Media being another agency
06:14that's going to be just as big as VaynerMedia.
06:17Look, I'm no genius.
06:19This was done a long time ago.
06:20WPP and Omnicom and IPG and Publicis,
06:24they have many agencies that look similar-ish
06:28with subtle different strategies.
06:30And they've built very large holding companies
06:32and are all publicly traded.
06:34And we're building the next great, big, large, massive holding company.
06:39And Chuck Media is the next piece of that puzzle.
06:43A place where Fortune 500 brands
06:46can get the best contemporary marketing
06:48and a place where I can elevate a lot of my great talent.
06:53There's a lot of kids in VaynerMedia
06:54that I think are ready for the prime time,
06:56but we're big.
06:57And so it gets a little corporate
06:59and it gets a little slower to get promoted.
07:01And so a lot of opportunity for people to flourish in Chuck Media
07:05and just allows us to go to where I want to go to.
07:07I want to have the advertising agency
07:10that does billions and billions and billions in revenue
07:12as a holding company.
07:13And you need more than one or two agencies to do that.
07:16And so here we are.
07:17All right, so we've got the Sasha Group,
07:19which used to focus on small business.
07:21It's being rebranded as Chuck Media
07:22and it's going enterprise.
07:23So now you're going large.
07:25And there are two things that I want to understand from you.
07:27Number one is why the move away from small business there.
07:30And then number two is you keep saying the word scrappy.
07:35And in the announcement that came out from your company about this,
07:39it emphasizes over and over again,
07:42nimbleness that we're going to bring a startup attitude
07:45to these enterprise brands.
07:47So that tells me that there's something,
07:49even though you're moving away from small business,
07:50there's something about the nimbleness
07:52and scrappiness of small business
07:54that you think large brands are missing right now
07:57that you want to bring to them.
07:58Can you unpack that?
07:59I can, sir.
08:00Number one, I'm a small business guy.
08:03So stay by for another text or email from us.
08:08Like you might have another exclusive soon
08:10because I am strategically doing this
08:13because it's what I need to do.
08:14I have more deal flow and opportunity in SMB
08:21than I do in enterprise.
08:24So this is a strategic move to set up my next chess move.
08:30So we'll see how that plays out.
08:31And honestly, because I really do adore you
08:33and I just want to give it to you,
08:34I actually have three different things I'm working on
08:37that could scratch the itch of the SMB world.
08:41I'll have to figure out here over the next six to 12 months
08:43what I want to do.
08:45So that's that.
08:45All right.
08:46Well, you know who to call.
08:47On the scrapping cart, brother,
08:49I would say that,
08:52yeah, it's just, you know,
08:54you know,
08:56I'm even laughing because the,
08:58whatever the comms team wrote you,
08:59A, I don't even know what it is.
09:00B, it's just so in our ether.
09:03Even, you know,
09:03VaynerMedia itself has more of an entrepreneurial spirit
09:06than your average Fortune 500 massive company.
09:10This is not lost on you.
09:11Every company takes the DNA of their,
09:14his or hers founder, right?
09:16Like I am who I am.
09:18Like, you know,
09:19it is what it is.
09:20You know,
09:21I'm wearing a,
09:21I'm wearing a sweatshirt right now
09:23that has a picture of the sweater my mom knitted me
09:26because my family couldn't afford a $25 Jets jersey
09:29and my mom didn't want me to feel left out
09:31when I was playing football
09:32outside in Edison, New Jersey.
09:35I am who I am.
09:36And yeah, I mean,
09:37look, don't forget,
09:38I'm sure not lost on you,
09:40VaynerChuck, right?
09:41Like this is,
09:42this is the extension of my last name
09:44that I'm very proud of
09:45and want to honor.
09:46And these are,
09:48at some level,
09:49they're identical twins.
09:50And in some levels,
09:51they're twins that don't look identical.
09:53What is that called again?
09:54Fraternal?
09:55Fraternal.
09:55Yeah, fraternal twins.
09:56So, you know,
09:58I think,
09:58I think that's how I think about it
10:00and I'm excited about it.
10:01Yeah.
10:03But,
10:04let's go a little deeper there
10:05because
10:06even though that is your DNA
10:08and so that is the natural thing
10:10that someone is going to expect for
10:12and seek
10:13when they're going to be working with you
10:14and your companies,
10:16you're also making a statement here
10:18about what large brands need now.
10:21And I'll give you some context.
10:23I remember,
10:23I'm sure you do too,
10:25when the lights went out at Super Bowl,
10:28whatever that was,
10:30and Oreo turned around
10:31that really fast,
10:33funny thing,
10:34everyone's minds exploded
10:36because at the time,
10:37it was very hard
10:38for large brands
10:39to move fast with marketing.
10:41Anybody who's been in a large brand
10:42understands there's layers
10:44and layers of review
10:44and the lawyers have to see it
10:46and it just slows things down
10:48in a world in which
10:49if you're one beat behind
10:51by the time you speak,
10:53everyone else has moved on.
10:54So,
10:54there's something here
10:55that you're saying
10:56that brands need
10:58that there may be missing
10:59and I'd love to hear
10:59you articulate that
11:00for anybody
11:01who works at a large brand
11:02or frankly,
11:03anybody who's building a brand
11:05and wants to be mindful
11:06of how scale
11:08could possibly slow them down.
11:09I cannot believe
11:11you brought that up.
11:11I brought it up last night
11:13at dinner
11:14with a bunch of CMOs.
11:16When that happened,
11:18I think that was 13.
11:20Sure.
11:21I,
11:22within three minutes
11:23of the tweet,
11:25not the aftermath,
11:26not the next,
11:27three minutes after the tweet,
11:28I could already see it moving.
11:29The Oreo tweet, yeah.
11:30Right.
11:32A,
11:32I wanted to find out
11:33if we did it
11:34because we were working
11:34with Mondelez
11:35and I was like,
11:36whoa, whoa, whoa
11:36and it wasn't us
11:39but we were put
11:39in the mix of the war room.
11:41Two,
11:42I sent a company-wide email.
11:45Remember this?
11:46Sent a company-wide email
11:48three minutes
11:49after the Oreo thing happened.
11:50All in my entire email
11:52like I often do,
11:53all in the headline
11:54and it said,
11:56our company
11:57has changed forever.
11:59Wow.
11:59That was it.
12:00We had been preaching
12:01for four years
12:01about speed,
12:03volume,
12:04relevance at scale,
12:05social first,
12:06attention,
12:07contemporaneous,
12:08relevance leads to consideration,
12:10leads to purchase,
12:11things are changing.
12:12I will tell you that
12:13that dream,
12:14that moment
12:15has been realized at scale.
12:17What I would tell everyone
12:18is this.
12:19I'm going to go
12:19very, very nerdy.
12:21Here we go.
12:21Please.
12:22There's something called
12:23the mid-funnel now
12:24in marketing.
12:24It's existed.
12:25We're redefining it.
12:26It's organic social media, Jason.
12:28Every company listening
12:30needs to invest
12:31as much money
12:32as humanly possible
12:33cutting from
12:34every aspect
12:35of their business
12:35to funnel
12:36into a production
12:38capability
12:39to make scaled
12:41social media content
12:42that is contextual
12:43to the distribution channel
12:45it's posting on,
12:46whether that's LinkedIn
12:47or YouTube Shorts,
12:49Facebook
12:49or Snapchat Spotlight,
12:51even extending
12:52into things like
12:53Pinterest podcasting
12:54and Substack.
12:55They must make
12:56that content
12:57contextual
12:58to the platform
12:59both from
13:00a relevance standpoint
13:01but also
13:02from a format standpoint
13:04understanding
13:05what gives you
13:06the highest propensity
13:07to create
13:08organic reach
13:09which is predicated
13:11only these days
13:12on relevance.
13:13the AI algorithms
13:14of these news feeds
13:15are written
13:16to understand
13:17if it is relevant
13:18to people
13:19and to continue
13:20to feed people
13:21at scale
13:22if it is
13:23and not feed it
13:24if it is not
13:25what I would call
13:26the interest media era
13:28not the social media era
13:31and that
13:32in the mid funnel
13:34when you are fortunate
13:35to have something perform
13:37then requires companies
13:39to send it down
13:40to the lower funnel
13:41performance
13:41and have media
13:43amplify that asset
13:44with a slight tweak
13:45to create
13:46CAC and LTV
13:47and ROAS
13:48but also take it
13:50from the mid funnel
13:50when it's successful
13:51and send it up
13:52to brand land
13:53and consider running it
13:55millions of dollars
13:57amplifying an organic
13:58successful piece of content
13:59as if you would do
14:00a TV
14:01and or my friend
14:02use it as the brief
14:04to do a campaign
14:06or something bigger
14:07this my friend
14:08in two minutes
14:09I just articulated
14:10actual
14:11real life
14:142026
14:14marketing
14:15that
14:16the next
14:17influencer
14:18like Alex Earl
14:18or Cooper
14:19or Beast
14:20and every fortune
14:225,000
14:22not even 500
14:23the private equity
14:24or brands
14:25must understand
14:26cold
14:27because demand
14:28creation
14:29is one of the last
14:30things that's going
14:31to be left
14:31in an AI universe
14:32as a competitive
14:34advantage
14:34and whoever
14:35knows it best
14:36and whoever
14:37executes that best
14:38will win
14:40now tell me
14:41how to structure
14:42a team
14:42so that that can
14:43actually happen
14:44how do you make sure
14:45that you can go
14:46from idea
14:47to execution
14:48fast enough
14:49that you're still
14:50playing at the speed
14:51of culture
14:51whether you have
14:53a internal
14:54or external
14:55or JV
14:56structure
14:57so we at
14:58VaynerMedia
14:58are obviously
14:59the agency of record
15:00for many people
15:01on this
15:01there are some teams
15:03that take it internal
15:04there are some teams
15:05that work in
15:06Vayner CoLab
15:06a JV with us
15:08PepsiCo
15:09famously
15:09with Pepsi
15:10we are many
15:11of the employees
15:12there are many
15:12of the employees
15:13here's how you do it
15:14you have a creative
15:15captain
15:15the
15:16you know
15:17they used to say
15:18the throat to choke
15:19I don't know if that's
15:20politically correct anymore
15:21but the person
15:21the person in charge
15:23right
15:23there's a human
15:24on your logo
15:25who is in charge
15:27she or he
15:28is the one
15:29you need to build
15:30a production team
15:31not a creative team
15:33not people
15:34pontificating ideas
15:35Jason
15:35in a room
15:36slow
15:37and then outsourcing
15:38the making
15:39no no
15:39you're a production team
15:41that happens to do
15:41creative media strategy
15:43you need a relevance
15:44strategist
15:45something that we have
15:46that nobody else has
15:47humans that are
15:48paying attention
15:49and using AI
15:50and research
15:51and everything
15:52to understand
15:53what is popping
15:54what matters
15:55what is relevant
15:56to the consumers
15:57we're trying to reach
15:58and how does our brand
15:59interact
16:00inject
16:00play with
16:01jam on that
16:02you need paid team
16:04strategy team
16:05creative team
16:06all on the same team
16:08not separated
16:08like every company does
16:10you need a legal
16:12if you're a fortune 500
16:13person
16:13as a brand
16:14part of the full team
16:16in case you are
16:18a financial service
16:19an alcohol
16:19a fashion brand
16:21lighter
16:22they're worried about brand
16:23you need a KPI
16:24organic views achieved
16:28everybody judges everything
16:30on did it get views
16:31the end
16:32not Jason saying
16:33that that's not
16:34the right color
16:34for entrepreneur
16:35like that's off brand
16:37not me pontificating
16:38I got a big
16:39no no
16:39doesn't matter
16:40post it
16:41understand it
16:42this structure
16:44that we
16:45you know
16:45to your point
16:46I'm glad you asked
16:47and you can see
16:47my passion for it
16:48it's maybe even bigger
16:49than the thesis
16:49we won
16:51Chuck Media
16:52will win
16:53because we know
16:54how to operationalize
16:56our teams
16:56and how to give
16:58feedback to the clients
16:59we have something called
17:00elephant meetings
17:01internally
17:01where the leaders
17:02of our account
17:03must bring a client
17:04into a meeting
17:05to address the elephant
17:06in the room
17:07because Jason
17:08almost all of our clients
17:10after hiring us
17:11to be VaynerMedia
17:13ask us to be
17:14Widen and Kennedy
17:16they don't even realize
17:17they're doing it
17:18it's in your subconscious
17:19it's in the inertia
17:20of corporation
17:22I
17:23you saw what I just did here
17:25we do that
17:25for 25 hours
17:28before we start
17:28with clients
17:29over and over
17:29different ways
17:30and by the third week
17:31they want to debate
17:32if the color is on brand
17:34we're like
17:34what are we doing here
17:35right there
17:36they naturally slow down
17:38which means that
17:39you naturally need to be
17:40either pushing
17:41or setting those expectations
17:42you naturally go to
17:43television subconsciousness
17:44got it
17:46yeah
17:46they don't realize
17:48that debating something
17:48in the conference room
17:49is more expensive
17:51than the content cost
17:52to make
17:52and we can get insights
17:53from it
17:54if we actually post it
17:55I gotta go back
17:56maybe two minutes
17:57in that really excellent
17:59outlay of strategy there
18:01and ask you
18:02to unpack
18:04strategy
18:05no sorry
18:06relevance strategist
18:08I have never heard
18:09the term
18:10relevance strategist
18:11I did not know
18:12relevance strategist
18:13was a job
18:14it's a job
18:15in one place on earth
18:16so far
18:17right
18:18right where you're sitting
18:19yes sir
18:20we believe that
18:22brand strategy
18:22which is what strategy
18:23has been
18:24has been commoditized
18:25with AI
18:26with LLMs
18:27and just has lost
18:29its value
18:29over time
18:30we still value it
18:32but we think it's done
18:33pretty quickly
18:34and easily
18:35and then the next day
18:36happens
18:36like it's not hard
18:37to sit down
18:38and say
18:38you know
18:39what does Toyota
18:40represent
18:40or what does
18:41you know
18:42Kmart
18:42I don't even think
18:43they're in business
18:43but like
18:44you know
18:44what did they represent
18:45what did they represent
18:46or what does
18:47Marvel represent
18:48or what does
18:48you know
18:50Jaguar
18:51or Skittles
18:52or Raisin Bran cereal
18:53I think it's
18:54you can do that
18:55you can get a bunch of people
18:56to make a subjective opinion
18:58the question becomes
18:59what happens next
19:01and what happens next
19:02my friend
19:02is we have to make that
19:03just do it
19:04they got there
19:05right
19:05and they nailed it
19:07but I think you know this
19:08just do it means
19:09a lot of different things
19:10to a lot of different people
19:11yeah
19:11and it's subtle
19:13but it's all based on relevance
19:14people that buy Nike
19:16Air Force One sneakers
19:17to be cool
19:18are very different
19:19than someone buying
19:20you know
19:21a running suit
19:22or a pickleball paddle
19:24to be high performance
19:26you know
19:26there's just so many different
19:27or
19:28or
19:28views Nike
19:29as the place
19:30where they go to the outlet store
19:31and get good $20 sweatpants
19:33like
19:33it means
19:34or the
19:35or the slippers
19:36that they wear
19:36for coolness
19:37you know
19:38the slides
19:38or
19:39this goes
19:39or
19:40and Gary
19:40you know
19:41people don't know this
19:42but I'm sure you do
19:43that
19:44just do it
19:44which now we associate
19:45with
19:46LeBron James
19:47with the greatest athletes
19:49in the world
19:49the first
19:50just do it ad
19:51Nike debuted
19:52that slogan
19:53with a guy named Walt
19:55who was like 80 years old
19:56and would run around
19:58San Francisco every day
19:59that was their first
20:00because at the time
20:01they were appealing
20:02to the average person
20:03not to the major athletes
20:05that came later
20:06average runner
20:07average runner
20:08right
20:08hyper specific
20:09yes
20:10so
20:11yeah
20:11we're really excited
20:12about relevant strategists
20:14we
20:14we
20:14we're bringing
20:15so much value
20:16to clients
20:16we're telling them
20:17things about their consumers
20:18that they have no idea
20:19or opportunities
20:20that they never thought
20:21for their handbag
20:23or
20:24you know
20:24Chuck Media is very fortunate
20:26to have Subway
20:27as one of its early clients
20:29right
20:29like
20:29you know
20:30what
20:30there's so many things
20:31you think about
20:32like
20:33very off top of head
20:34when I say Subway sandwiches
20:35everyone thinks a certain thing
20:37but what are the things
20:38that we're not thinking about
20:39you know
20:40like
20:40you know
20:41the hard working mom
20:42feeding a family
20:43or
20:43you know
20:44like
20:44like the
20:45you know
20:45like
20:45the
20:46the
20:462am video game
20:48execute
20:48like there's just
20:49I could sit here for 40 hours
20:50of like
20:51things that could work
20:52that have not historically been done
20:54and that's about the relevance
20:56the niches
20:57the
20:58the
20:58the things that happen in one second
21:00the
21:00William Shatner's eating a
21:02cereal bowl while he's driving
21:03could he be eating a Sub
21:05like
21:05you start to get very creative
21:07some is very micro and fast
21:09others can be a 10 year thing
21:11it's about being an and culture
21:13meaning
21:13this and this
21:15one thing Jason
21:16that you probably are aware of
21:17given your perch
21:18a lot of these brands
21:19were taught to be
21:21to represent one thing
21:22that was a television first
21:24it was expensive to make a television commercial
21:26of course you were trying
21:27right
21:28right
21:28we are now in scaled
21:30creative
21:30with this device
21:32and so I would like brands
21:34to mean many things
21:35to many different people
21:36to actually have a big business
21:37you know that is a
21:39very counterintuitive
21:41feeling idea
21:42and
21:43I want to hear you articulate
21:45how a brand can do that
21:47because
21:47you just made the point about television
21:49and yes
21:50when television was your primary medium
21:52it is a mass broadcast tool
21:54you have to have a message
21:55that's going to just appeal
21:56to the widest possible audience
21:58and so now I think
21:59well sure
22:00you can segment audiences
22:02you can
22:03start lots of different kinds
22:04of conversations
22:05but you know
22:06if your primary channels
22:07are still Instagram
22:08and TikTok
22:09and you know
22:09a handful of other channels
22:11that is still reaching
22:12your mass audience
22:14so how do you start
22:15to be many different things
22:16when you still have
22:17roughly just a handful
22:19of distribution tools
22:20by realizing
22:22Instagram and TikTok
22:23look nothing like television
22:25let me explain
22:27if Entrepreneur Magazine
22:28right now
22:28on its Instagram or TikTok
22:30posted
22:30a video or imagery
22:32of a grandma
22:34and granddaughter
22:36discussing startup life
22:37when you post it organically
22:40you are not reaching
22:41your followers on Instagram
22:42completely like email
22:44you are putting content
22:45into the interest graph
22:47and there will be hundreds
22:49potentially
22:50hopefully thousands
22:51hopefully for you millions
22:53but let's just go with
22:54hundreds and
22:55or thousands
22:56and or tens of thousands
22:58of humans
23:01whether they are
23:02actual grandmas
23:03actual 19 year old women
23:05who have a grandma
23:06or were affected
23:07by their grandma
23:08or even
23:08someone like me
23:09a male
23:10who just likes
23:11family values
23:12and that kind of
23:13sweet stuff
23:14who will see the content
23:16based on our relevance
23:17based on what we have
23:18shown
23:19the platform
23:20we tend to be
23:21interested in
23:22understand that
23:23the creative
23:23finds the audience
23:25that may find
23:26this relevant
23:28that
23:28if you understand
23:29what I just said
23:30actually forces
23:32a very important
23:33conversation
23:34that it is
23:35detrimental
23:36to every brand
23:37to make the same
23:39old stuff
23:39for social media
23:40and that
23:42you are eliminating
23:43the potential
23:44of consideration
23:46by not making content
23:47that will find
23:48its potential audience
23:49that is
23:50wildly different
23:53let me
23:54state that back
23:55to you
23:55in a different way
23:56and see if I got it right
23:57what you are saying
23:57is
23:59look
23:59we think of
24:00algorithms
24:01in many ways
24:01as frustrating barriers
24:03I post something
24:04and I think
24:05is the algorithm
24:06going to distribute this
24:07only a portion
24:08of my audience
24:08is going to see this
24:09but what you are saying
24:10is
24:10no no
24:11there is another way
24:11of thinking about it
24:12which is
24:13that
24:13every piece
24:15of content
24:15that you post
24:16has a specific
24:18total addressable market
24:19and
24:19if you understand
24:20the algorithms
24:21well enough
24:22then you can actually
24:23post on the same
24:24channels
24:24and it will be
24:25distributed
24:26to different
24:26audiences
24:27and that way
24:28you are actually
24:29utilizing your
24:30whole audience
24:31but you are speaking
24:32to them
24:32in different
24:33more targeted ways
24:34your whole
24:34addressable audience
24:36that does not
24:37include your followers
24:37we are no longer
24:39in social media
24:39Jason
24:40in fact
24:40I might pitch you
24:41on a new cover
24:42for me
24:42I haven't been on
24:43one in a while
24:43that might be like
24:44interest media
24:45is here
24:46social media
24:47is dead
24:48we are in
24:49interest media
24:49brother
24:50it reframes
24:51everything
24:51I built on email
24:52and I built on
24:53social media
24:54me
24:54let me just do
24:57the real math
24:57here real quick
24:58we are talking
24:5820
25:00yeah it ended up
25:01being 20
25:01for 20 years
25:02from 97
25:03to 17
25:05right
25:06I
25:07me
25:08was at the
25:09forefront
25:10of the email
25:11and social media
25:12follower era
25:13amass as much
25:14as possible
25:15feed them good
25:16stuff for them
25:17you win
25:18I have also
25:19been at the
25:20forefront
25:20of the last
25:21six years
25:22of interest
25:23media
25:23I was the
25:24human being
25:25yelling
25:25on social
25:27saying
25:27tiktok
25:27tiktok
25:28tiktok
25:28musically
25:29musically
25:29even before
25:30that
25:30because I
25:31also invested
25:32in tumblr
25:32years ago
25:33and that was
25:33interest media
25:34the first time
25:34I ever saw it
25:35you follow
25:36interests
25:37not people
25:37and I thought
25:38that was
25:38interesting
25:39yes sir
25:40that is exactly
25:41what I'm saying
25:42fantastic
25:42hey Gary
25:43congratulations
25:44on this next
25:45phase of the
25:46journey
25:46really excited
25:47to see
25:47what is
25:48coming next
25:48for small
25:49business
25:49as you
25:49had hinted
25:50earlier
25:50so we
25:50got to
25:51talk about
25:51that
25:51and just
25:52finally
25:52I
25:53gotta say
25:54I love
25:54hearing you
25:55talk like
25:56this
25:56I don't think
25:57people get
25:57enough of that
25:58from you
25:58because
25:59you know
25:59look you're
26:00everywhere
26:00and you're
26:00often speaking
26:01to the
26:01masses
26:02but to be
26:02able to
26:02drill down
26:03like this
26:04in this
26:04really
26:04hyper
26:04specific
26:04way
26:05I think
26:05it's
26:05important
26:05for people
26:06to hear
26:06and I
26:06appreciate
26:07you
26:07I'm
26:08humbled
26:08thank you
26:08brother
26:09take care
26:14you
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