- 20 ore fa
In occasione della GDC 2018 il game director di NieR: Automata, Yoko Taro, ha tenuto un panel nel quale si è parlato diffusamente dello sviluppo del gioco.
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00:00:06Buongiorno a tutti.
00:00:07Let's get started, but before we do...
00:00:10Wow, I see a mask over there, too, in the audience.
00:00:16So, a few things.
00:00:18Please turn off your phone so we're not distracted or interrupted by anyone's phones ringing.
00:00:24And then we kindly ask you that you fill out a survey that you will get via email under the
00:00:31email address that you, I think, registered.
00:00:33And we do kindly ask that you refrain from taking photos of Yoko-san or on stage.
00:00:40You're more than welcome to take photos of the slides today.
00:00:44And as you can see, we have two speakers and we're covering a lot.
00:00:49So, the QA session may or may not happen.
00:00:52It will all depend on how much time we have left.
00:00:55Okay?
00:00:56So, without further ado, I'm going to hand it over to the speakers.
00:01:00Hi.
00:01:22Hello everyone.
00:01:24You might...
00:01:25If those sitting on this side, especially on this side, you might be able to see part of my face.
00:01:29But just pretend that you're not seeing it.
00:01:31And that you can only see the mask.
00:01:34I have created a game called Nia Automata, but I want to talk about that game today.
00:01:47So, the two of us here, we worked on a game called Nia Automata and we figured it'd be a
00:01:55nice opportunity to talk a little bit about it.
00:01:57The first half, I'm going to give it over to Taura-san.
00:02:00We will talk about the action.
00:02:02And then the second half, I'll take it.
00:02:03And I will talk about giving the sense of freedom in the game.
00:02:12So, without further ado, I'm going to hand it over to Taura-san.
00:02:32Hello everyone.
00:02:34My name is Takahisa Taura.
00:02:36I am a game designer from Platinum Games.
00:02:40This is mainly the title of the title of Nia Automata and enemy characters.
00:02:46But, when you're making a game every time,
00:02:49you're going to be able to hit the button only to hit the button and hit the button.
00:02:55So, I want to talk about Nia Automata.
00:02:59So, my primary job and role...
00:03:02There are some titles on the slides here, but...
00:03:04I'm primarily responsible for player character and enemy planning and design.
00:03:09On every game that we make, we strive to make sure that even the just act of pushing a button
00:03:15is fun.
00:03:15So, I'm going to elaborate on that a little bit more, using or talking about Nia Automata as an example.
00:03:32So, we take a number of approaches to making the action fun from the moment you first touched the game.
00:03:39Today, I'd like to talk about these three key topics in particular.
00:03:47So, the first one, although it may seem pretty basic, is to envision your ideal.
00:03:55And what I mean by that ideal is...
00:04:00So, from the get-go, from the very very beginning, you need to firmly decide for yourselves what you want
00:04:09and what you don't want.
00:04:19So, maybe it goes without saying, but the impression of a game makes very...
00:04:24Game varies depending on the player's taste and on the type of game you're trying to make.
00:04:35To give an example of what I mean by that is, if you're making a game like Dark Souls,
00:04:39then putting in something like Bayonetta-like action is definitely not going to work.
00:04:48So, with that in mind, what I'm about to talk to you about today is, it doesn't apply to every
00:04:54single game.
00:04:58And the second topic is...
00:05:04Are you able to make specific, precise, and sort of accurate criticism on what needs to be changed?
00:05:21When you imagine in your head what you want the ideal form to be,
00:05:24and then compare that to what you see on the screen in front of you.
00:05:28If you can't explain what's good and what's bad and point those things out,
00:05:32you're not going to be able to create that ideal.
00:05:39And there are all sorts of factors that affect whether a game feels good or not.
00:05:58The range is quite wide from the quality of the animations themselves to whether they connect each other,
00:06:05and how smoothly they connect each other to the responsiveness of the player input to the visuals and the sound
00:06:12effects.
00:06:12The list goes on, but every single thing that you see on the screen is a factor.
00:06:28And among those, which is a very long list, like I said, when it came to Near Automata,
00:06:32we at Platinum Games were especially concerned about making the response to the player input feel really good.
00:06:42And to elaborate a little bit,
00:06:48if pressing a button doesn't cause an immediate action,
00:06:56then the player will become frustrated while playing.
00:07:04And if playing is frustrating, then it's not going to feel good.
00:07:09It's pretty simple.
00:07:20So if the button response is slow, it's unlikely that the action will meet our goal of fun from the
00:07:26moment you first touch it.
00:07:28We kept that in mind as we created Near Automata.
00:07:35So then what kind of approaches did we take to accomplish that?
00:07:46So then what kind of approaches did we take to accomplish that?
00:07:50So we make it so that actions such as dodging and jumping,
00:07:54which feel good and are used very frequently during gameplay,
00:07:59can always be executed at any time, no matter what.
00:08:02You push the button and it delivers right away.
00:08:06In the beginning of the game, Bayonetta and Near Automata,
00:08:10we started to make the action of the player character.
00:08:17So in games where dodging is important, like Bayonetta and Near Automata,
00:08:23we make sure that there's never a time when you can't dodge or you can't jump
00:08:27from the very beginning of the work on the player character implementation side.
00:08:38So we actually brought a short clip here so you can take a look at what I mean.
00:09:01So as you can see here, whether you're standing still, jumping, attacking,
00:09:06no matter what position you're in, if you press the dodge button, it will happen.
00:09:24However, in the final game, in the final product, there are certain situations in which you can't dodge,
00:09:32such as when you're in the middle of taking a hit.
00:09:35So what we do is we set a flag to prevent dodging in those cases,
00:09:39so the dodge button won't respond at that time.
00:09:54And there's a good reason for that.
00:09:56We concluded that from both the visual and game balance perspective,
00:10:00not being able to dodge in these specific circumstances actually felt better.
00:10:16And the responsiveness to player input isn't just about how quickly the game reacts to the button press,
00:10:23but we also placed importance on how quickly that action results in the desired effect.
00:10:34So if the time between when you press the button and that action, you see the result of the action,
00:10:43and this too results in frustration if it takes too long,
00:10:51and it ends up being a frequent sort of factor in the action not feeling good.
00:10:56And it ends up being a frequent sort of factor in the action not feeling good.
00:11:00So for a notable example of our approach to this topic,
00:11:11is that we make the time it takes for the basic attack to count as hitting the enemy as short
00:11:17as possible.
00:11:31We place importance on both the responsiveness of the attack button.
00:11:38You press it and the attack animation immediately starts.
00:11:42And on the result of the attack, which happens right away,
00:11:46striking the enemy without making the player wait.
00:11:50Near Automataでは, player character 2Bが待機している状態で攻撃ボタンを押した場合に
00:11:56And so in Near Automata, if you press the attack button while the player character 2B is not
00:12:02performing other actions,すぐに攻撃アニメーションが発動して
00:12:06the attack animation comes out and it happens immediately.攻撃判定が出ます.
00:12:13で、ここまでの時間が
00:12:14And the hitbox becomes active.
00:12:16And the time it takes for this to happen that you see on screen is
00:12:2560分の10フレーム、時間で言うとボタンを押してから約0
00:12:30.16秒後には敵に攻撃がヒットしています。これはなかなか速い方だと思います。
00:12:59もちろん全ての攻撃に対してこれが当てはまるわけではなくて、チャージを必要とする攻撃など結果が出るまでに遅く、時間が必要な攻撃を
00:13:06すぐに発動してすぐに結果が出るということが触った瞬間に気持ちいいを感じ取る上で重要なものだと思っています。
00:13:20で、チャージが一番性の要素を発揮することがあったんだけど、これはなかなか速いゲームの場合っているので、ここからの攻撃が一番性ができるようになるので、uin
00:13:362ゲームの場合は、それは、全ての結果ができないので、場合によって、経済する可能性をつけているというものが成功することがあるので、このアイディングの内容についての方向を突然USTRESSIONに対して、
00:13:42So, to sum up the topic of responsiveness.
00:13:48So, if the game reacts as soon as you press the button, and the desired result of that action also
00:14:01occurs as quickly as possible,
00:14:03that leads to the game feeling really fun, feeling good from the moment you first touch it.
00:14:19And then in other areas of the game design process as well, we refine our game's quality little by little
00:14:27through a repeated process of finding, calling out, pointing out,
00:14:31and then correcting parts that don't feel good.
00:14:41And then the third important topic for creating action that's fun from the moment you first touch is?
00:14:52Again, pretty basic, but iteration over and over, so fine tuning and adjusting.
00:15:03And I have a few examples to show what I mean here.
00:15:09First, there's flags.
00:15:18Not only does the player characters and enemies have flags, but every single individual animation in the game has a
00:15:26set of flags associated with it.
00:15:33And the content of those flags are things like what you see listed here, but a total of 64 flags
00:15:42were used.
00:15:47So, here's an example. This is the tool for setting animation flags.
00:15:58Characterがセットされて選択したアニメーションを流すことができまして
00:15:59So, you first select a character and can play back the selected animation.そのタイムラインが表示されます。
00:16:06And the timeline appears right above the arrow there.で、タイムラインに対して一覧で表示されたフラグを一つずつ設定していきます。
00:16:16And you can set the flags from the flag list
00:16:18that you see in the black box onto the timeline.
00:16:23そのフラグの一覧が
00:16:24The flag list itself looks like this.こんな感じになってます。流石にちょっとツールは英語に翻訳することができなかったので書かれているか気になった人はこの画面を写真に撮ってもらって後で各自翻訳してください。
00:16:39And I do apologize. We
00:16:41didn't have the resources to bring an English translated version of this.
00:16:46But you're more than welcome to take a picture and perhaps do your own translation for yourselves.今この瞬間だけ写真撮ってOKです。
00:16:57Yeah, even Yoko-san is saying please go ahead and take pictures
00:17:01right now.ただ、適当な名前が付けられたりするものもあるので今僕が改めて見てもこれなんだろうというようなフラグがあったりするので翻訳してもらってもあんまり意味ないかもしれません。
00:17:12ただ、適当な名前が付けられたりするものもあるので今僕が改めて見てもこれなんだろうというようなフラグがあったりするので翻訳してもらってもあんまり意味ないかもしれません。
00:17:13But surprisingly even for me, it's like these names were kind of made up or labeled at that time what
00:17:22made sense to us. So now that I look back at all these labels, not every single
00:17:27one makes sense to me quite well.
00:17:31And so if you go ahead and translate, I might not even be able to say what that meant at
00:17:36that time.
00:17:39So how do we set these flags on animation?
00:17:48For example, we're going to take one that says follow or that you can follow.
00:17:57And we'll click on the box there and then set the time frame to which the flag's effect will apply.
00:18:14And then we can set, with this tool, we can set the flag to apply the animation starting from a
00:18:20certain frame and ending on a certain frame.
00:18:22Or to have it stay turned on permanently starting from a certain frame.
00:18:33今設定方法でお伝えしたこの追尾可能というフラグも気持ちいいアクションを作る上で重要なものになるので
00:18:36少しだけ内容を説明させていただきます。
00:18:36So there's a reason why I picked this flag because I want to use this as an example.
00:18:41It's an important one for making action that feels good and I want to talk a little bit about it.
00:18:52追尾可能というフラグはその名の通り、ターゲットを追尾するかしないかを設定するフラグです。
00:18:52So this one I know exactly what it means and I'm not confused here.
00:18:56Just like it sounds, it means that I can set the flag to follow an enemy or a target.
00:19:08勝利としては一定範囲内に敵がいるときにこのフラグがオンになっていると
00:19:12必ずその敵の方向にプレイヤーキャラクターが体を向けるというものになっています。
00:19:13So what it does is if animation plays with this flag turned on and an enemy is present within a
00:19:19certain range,
00:19:20the player character will turn their body to face the enemy.
00:19:27このフラグをどういった使い方をするのかといいますと
00:19:27And as for how the flag is used
00:19:36攻撃アニメーションの頭に少しだけ付けてあげることによって攻撃する際に
00:19:39キャラクターは必ず敵の方を向くようになります。
00:19:40So by turning it on for just a little bit at the very beginning of an attack animation,
00:19:45the player character will always turn to face the enemy when attacking.
00:19:54つまり正確に敵を狙わなくても適当にボタンを押すだけで攻撃を当てやすくなるという
00:19:58プレイの快適さを向上させるためのフラグとなります。
00:19:59So in other words, even without perfectly aiming at the enemy, you can still hit with your attack just by
00:20:05pressing the button.
00:20:06The flag improves the feel of the gameplay, and we find it important for achieving our goal of immediate fun.
00:20:18これも触ってすぐ楽しいと思わせるために非常に重要となります。
00:20:18Yes, very important to achieving that goal and to have that instant sort of gratification.
00:20:26フラグがオンになっている時間が短すぎると敵に攻撃は当たりづらいですし
00:20:44長すぎると敵がどんな動きをしていようが攻撃をヒットさせやすくなる反面
00:20:47動きが不自然に見えるようになって気持ちよさが損なわれます。
00:20:47But on the opposite, if it's too long, while it does make it easier to hit the enemy,
00:20:52no matter how they're moving, it makes your movement look unnatural, a little sluggish, losing that feel-good feel.
00:21:05また膨大なアニメーションの一つ一つは動きや尺が異なるために
00:21:11フラグのセットは自動化せずにすべて手でそれぞれに合う設定方法を見出しながらセットしていっています。
00:21:12So this is not a small sort of chunk of work here.
00:21:16There's a massive volume of animation in the game, and each individual one has its own movement
00:21:22in length, so we were unable to automate this whole process of setting the flags.
00:21:28I did it all manually, experimenting to find what settings matched each of the animations.
00:21:41It does take a very very long time, and it depends heavily on the sense of the person performing that
00:21:48work.
00:21:56他にもニーヤオートマタでは、フラグ以外にアニメーションの再生速度をゲームデザイナーが調整したりもしています。
00:21:57So besides the flags and Nier Automata, the game designer also fine-tunes the animation speed.
00:22:11先ほどのフラグ同様各アニメーションに対してフレーム数と速度の倍率を設定することで調整を行っています。
00:22:12So as with the flags, we use a tool function to set frame count and playback speed to fine-tune
00:22:18the animation.
00:22:36アニメーションのデザイナーがどれだけかっこいい動きを作ってくれたとしても、実際にゲームプレイで動かしたときに、もう少し速い方がいいとか、もう少し遅くしたいというようなゲームデザイナーの思いと食い違うことは多々あるので、出来上がったアニメーションを確認した後に、勝手にこちらで調整していったりもしています。
00:22:38So no matter how awesome the motion of the animation designer has created for us, when we actually see it
00:22:46in motion, we might find that it needs to be adjusted a little bit or feel that the move is
00:22:53powerful, so it should take longer to come out.
00:22:56There are all these little fine-tuning adjustments that we feel is needed.
00:23:01It's very common for the animation to not quite line up with my vision, the game designer's vision.
00:23:08So after an animation is created, we will go back in and check it and adjust it ourselves.
00:23:25こちらが調整した後に、ちゃんとその速度に合った動きにアニメーションデザイナーがデータを修正してくれるというサイクルで、セクションをまたいだ調整を繰り返していました。
00:23:25And once we've made the adjustments on the designer's side, the animation designer will make those, implement it, and to
00:23:33match the speed that we set.
00:23:35And that cycle just continues to repeat.
00:23:45直接指示せずに自分の手で調整してしまうことで、結果的には調整にかかる時間は少なくなっていたと言えます。
00:23:46However, by making adjustments myself, rather than issuing or asking them to make these adjustments based on my verbal sort
00:23:55of requests, the time required for fine-tuning is actually shortened, and the process is reduced, and it's a lot
00:24:03more effective that way.
00:24:07というところで調整についてまとめます。
00:24:07So, to sum up the fine-tuning process.
00:24:16フラグや速度など自社ツールを使ってアニメーションに対してプレイしていて気持ちよくなるような設定を行い、
00:24:17We use our internal software tool to apply flags and speed settings to the animation to make it feel good
00:24:24to play.
00:24:29それをすぐにゲームに反映してプレイして確認します。
00:24:37このサイクルを永遠とも思えるような時間を繰り返します。
00:24:38And we repeat this cycle for what it seems like eternity. Like it's not gonna ever, ever end.
00:24:49一度設定したものでも少し時間を空けて触ると気持ちよくないなって思えるようなこともあるので、
00:24:54もう完成するまで本当にずっとこの確認をずっと続けていきます。
00:24:55And it's something that we, you know, we thought we had gotten right, may not feel good after some time
00:25:02has passed or some days have passed.
00:25:04So this process is truly a repeated cycle of adjusting and testing non-stop until the game is really locked
00:25:12and complete.
00:25:17先ほども言いましたように自動化できるような作業ではないため、
00:25:19すごく面倒くさい作業ではあるんですけれども、
00:25:25ここがアクションの触り心地に大きな差が出るところだと考えて地道にこなしていきます。
00:25:26And as I said earlier, because none of this can be automated,
00:25:30It's a very tedious, challenging process.
00:25:34But I share the opinion that whether or not you can effectively perform this,
00:25:41So not so glamorous, not so fun task is what makes the difference on how you can make the game
00:25:49feel good,
00:25:50resulting in the action that you want to see in the game.
00:25:59というわけで触った瞬間に気持ちいいと思えるアクションを目指すために大事だと思っていることを、
00:26:04今回は時間も限られていて漠然としたお話がメインになってしまいました。
00:26:04So to sum up, these are the things we consider very important to achieve our goal of action that feels
00:26:11good from the moment you first touch it.
00:26:14With the limited time we have today, I can only go into a very sort of general broad overview, but
00:26:21to reiterate,
00:26:26自分たちが気持ちいいと思える理想を描く
00:26:27Create a very clear plan for what feels good
00:26:37そしてできたものの良し悪しを的確に見極めて丁寧に調整を繰り返します
00:26:37And precisely identify the good and the bad and perform a very careful fine-tuning cycle.
00:26:53ただし、過程や完成品そのすべてに完全な正解はないので、 だからこそ最初に理想を描くことが重要となります。
00:26:54But it's also important to remember that there's no absolute correct answer to be found in the process of making
00:27:03this game.
00:27:04And so that's exactly why it's important to have a very clear vision or plan from the very beginning.
00:27:15というところで、僕からは本日は以上になります。
00:27:17ご清聴いただきありがとうございました。
00:27:17And that wraps it up for my section of the talk.
00:27:24では、横尾さんに変わります。
00:27:25I'm gonna hand it over to横尾さん.
00:27:31横尾さん。
00:27:37すごい、皆さんが思っている以上にこれ喋りづらいんで、 ちょっと座って喋らせてもらえますね。
00:27:42It's actually not that easy for me to talk in this position.
00:27:47So I'd rather sit down if that's okay with you guys.
00:27:56じゃあ、僕の方から話をさせていただきます。
00:28:02横尾さん、そこに横尾さんが座ってるんですけど、 時間を押してるってことで、ものすごい早口で喋ろうと思います。
00:28:03Okay, so I'm gonna start my session now, or part of the session.
00:28:09The Square Enix staff who's sitting in the front row have told me that I need to talk at maybe
00:28:14a hundred miles per hour to get through it.
00:28:16So here I go.
00:28:20名前は横尾太郎で、代表作はこんな感じです。
00:28:20So my name is Yoko Taro or Taro Yoko, and here are some of the games I've worked on.
00:28:27今回話すテーマはこちら。
00:28:28And this is a theme for today.
00:28:34自由とは何かというテーマについてです。
00:28:34So what is freedom?
00:28:43もう少し詳しく言うなら、最新作人やオトマトを作る上で考えていた ゲームにおける自由とは何かということをお話しさせていただければと思います。
00:28:44Okay, maybe that's not fair.
00:28:45So a little bit more about what I'm going to talk about today is what is freedom as we thought
00:28:51of it within the context of creating our title near Automata?
00:29:00なんかシナリオの作り方とかを期待されてた皆さんもいるかもしれないんですけれども、ご期待にすれず申し訳ないです。
00:29:05ただ過去に僕はGDCで講演したのがどっかにあると思うので、頑張って検索してください。
00:29:05He's talking really fast, as you can tell.
00:29:09There might be some people today in the audience who came here expecting to hear about a scenario creation sort
00:29:15of process.
00:29:16I apologize that I may disappoint you today.
00:29:20That said, I have done presentations here at GDC in the past about that process.
00:29:24So maybe you could search, look it up on YouTube and listen to that subject or topic later.
00:29:33さて、自由という点についてお話します。
00:29:33So I'd like to bring it back to the topic of freedom.
00:29:41高い自由度を持つというとまず普通にオープンワールドのゲームを想像すると思うんですよね。
00:29:44サンドボックスとかフリーローミングとかも呼ばれるんですけれども、
00:29:48雑に説明すると広いマップでいろんなことができるという感じですかね。
00:29:51これを聞いて皆さんはご存知かと思うんですけど、一応説明しておきます。
00:29:52So when you think of games that offer a high degree of freedom,
00:29:56the first thing that usually comes to mind are open world games.
00:29:58They can also be called sandbox games or free roaming games.
00:30:02But to give a rough explanation of what that entails,
00:30:04it means there's a large map and there's so much stuff to do.
00:30:08Something like that probably.
00:30:10But regardless, I'm sure everyone listening to this knows that already.
00:30:14English is much better.
00:30:16Thank you.
00:30:22それで僕がディレクションしたニーヤとニーヤオートマタなんですけれども、
00:30:25構造的にはまあオープンワールドとも言えなくもない感じなんですね。
00:30:25So if we were to look at the structure of Nier and Nier Automata,
00:30:29two games that I worked on,
00:30:31it wouldn't be technically incorrect to refer to them as open world games.
00:30:37というかもともとニーヤはゲームのマップの構造として、
00:30:40ゼルダの伝説、時のオカリナをパクった経緯があって、
00:30:44中央に平原があって、周りに特徴があるエリアがあるという構造そのままですし、
00:30:49平原の広さに至っては、時のオカリナで平原を横断したときにかかる時間を測定して、
00:30:51それをまんまコピーしたっていう経緯があります。
00:30:52So, well, I'm gonna be honest here.
00:30:54If we look at the structure for Nier's game map,
00:30:57it's something that I basically stole from the Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time.
00:31:02I just said it.
00:31:03It's built in the exact same way with planes in the center and distinct areas surrounding it.
00:31:08Even if the size of the planes, it's to the point where you might think I used a stopwatch to
00:31:12time it,
00:31:12how long it took to cross the planes in Ocarina of Time,
00:31:15and copied it down to the second.
00:31:18Well, the time of Ocarina is not an open world,
00:31:21but it's actually an easy one-way game.
00:31:24So, Nier's copy of Nier's game,
00:31:26compared to the time of Ocarina of Time,
00:31:27it's a very low freedom of freedom.
00:31:29Well, I suppose it wouldn't be incorrect to call Ocarina of Time an open world as well,
00:31:37but I think it's actually more of a perfectly straight sort of road and path
00:31:41that you can go back and forth as much as you want.
00:31:44In that sense, since Nier copied that,
00:31:48it actually has extremely little freedom
00:31:50when compared to the kinds of open world games that we have now.
00:31:59So, a short while back, there was this term that people were discussing.
00:32:08Even in Japan, it was open world fatigue.
00:32:11I think this phenomenon was especially prominent in the West,
00:32:14where there was a sustained string of major open world game releases,
00:32:17one after another.
00:32:20GTA, Skyrim, Just Cause, like,
00:32:40just to name a few, which are pioneers in the field of open world games,
00:32:46including things like what you see here.
00:32:48vast maps, various items, mini quests, tons.
00:32:52There are also lots of games that include tons of other things,
00:32:54like crafting, character growth elements,
00:32:57making games that you can put in hundreds and hundreds of hours,
00:33:00and still not feel like you've played nearly enough.
00:33:10So, this genre that was carved out by all these pioneers, you know,
00:33:14it felt so fresh and so new at first.
00:33:17But as a result of putting out tons of these, one after another,
00:33:34And now people are starting to say that not only are they tired of elements like these,
00:33:39but there are entirely too many of these elements to begin with.
00:33:43So then why did this happen?
00:33:45How do we end up in this very contradictory situation
00:33:47where people have started to complain about having a high level of freedom,
00:33:52even though a high level of freedom is supposed to be what they were expecting?
00:34:05So I think our conclusion, at least in my opinion, is that because things like enormous maps
00:34:10and lots of items, tons of things to do, once they became ordinary,
00:34:15people started to think of them as just simple chores.
00:34:25And I think it's fair to say that a state of high level of freedom not being directly connected
00:34:32or does not equate to the actual sensation of feeling free, and that is very unique to games.
00:34:39I think the creators want to play freely and use the content to make a lot of fun,
00:34:43but the result of the creators, they don't have to lose all the quests.
00:34:50So, the game creators like ourselves, we work and work and prepare
00:34:55a number of quests and content because we think that that's what players want to play
00:35:01and freely sort of play.
00:35:03But the end result of that is that the player feeling like they need to get through every single quest
00:35:08because they feel like they're going to be missing out on something.
00:35:12It is transformed into kind of an obligation.
00:35:21So, how do we go about fixing this problem that's happening?
00:35:25I took some hints from other games.
00:35:28This is Super Mario.
00:35:30When I was playing in the past,
00:35:31I had to move on to the top of the character map,
00:35:33the score on the top of the map.
00:35:36The left is that.
00:35:36So, we're going to go way back in time here, as you can see.
00:35:40So, Super Mario Brothers is one example.
00:35:43I was able to move my character all the way up to the top of the map
00:35:47where the score is positioned.
00:35:48And that's what we see on the left here.
00:35:57And from there, I was able to warp to a different area, as you see on the right screen.
00:36:04The very top, the place where the score was, was actually a hidden passageway.
00:36:17I was shocked.
00:36:19I was shocked.
00:36:20I was shocked.
00:36:20I was like, what is going on here?
00:36:21I was seeing that smash the entire idea about how the world was framed and made me feel as though
00:36:28this game contained an enormous world.
00:36:35So, here's another example.
00:36:37A screenshot from GTA 4.
00:36:57So, here's one thing that surprised me when I was playing this game.
00:37:01You can't actually talk to the NPCs in the city.
00:37:06NPCs, like having dialogue in their own, as a matter of course, in most JRPGs.
00:37:10And I can't think that a game with an enormous budget, like the GTA series, would have shirked implementing something
00:37:17like that.
00:37:18If you think about it, it's a very natural thing.
00:37:22In reality, we don't have to talk to other people in the world.
00:37:27So, in the reality of GTA, we can't talk to other people in the world.
00:37:43But I had an aha moment, and maybe you guys did too.
00:37:46If you stop to think about it, it actually does make sense.
00:37:49Because in the real world, I don't know about you guys, but I don't think we go around town just
00:37:55talking to strangers all the time.
00:37:57So, in that sense, since GTA is imitating the real world, not being able to talk to most NPCs actually
00:38:04creates that sense of realism.
00:38:06In the game, even if you could freely soar through the skies, run at 500, 600, 700 km per hour,
00:38:15or pass through anything in the world at will, that's not going to make you feel free.
00:38:21Super Mario and Grand Seft Auto are the key to feel free.
00:38:29So, from just these two examples, from Super Mario Brothers and GTA, in order to make someone feel a sense
00:38:37of freedom, we need a frame that inhibits freedom.
00:38:41And that is key to making that world happen.
00:38:53So, let's say this is our world, and you are free to go anywhere within this circle.
00:39:04So, at this point, what's important is not the size of the circle here, but rather the circumference, the circle,
00:39:12the frame, the gray frame that you see around it.
00:39:24So, this frame is what the player believes to be what the limit is, or the scope of the world.
00:39:29And it's this moment that we expand what this frame has been perceived to be that people feel a sense
00:39:39of freedom.
00:39:47So, in order to foster this idea of freedom, what's important is the moment when, as you see here, just
00:39:54two simple sort of circles, that your perceived framework of the world suddenly expands.
00:40:13So, in a game, let's say a player rides a vehicle that they didn't think they could, or breaks an
00:40:19object that they didn't think they could break.
00:40:22Like, they say, I didn't think I could do that. And that's what makes them feel the sense of freedom
00:40:28at that moment.
00:40:29So, the most important part here is, oh, I didn't think I could do that, but I could.
00:40:41So, freedom is in a future that you did not have in the past.
00:40:48I have a nice文章. It's written in the same way.
00:40:51The reason why it's in bold and it's in large font is because I think that sentence actually sounds really,
00:40:58really cool.
00:41:01Well, if you read it well, it's just a sense of meaning.
00:41:03Well, I'd like to say that I want to say that I want to be able to feel freedom without
00:41:07being able to feel freedom without being able to feel freedom.
00:41:12But the more you think about it, it's actually kind of a hard to understand sort of sentence.
00:41:18So, what I'm trying to say here is, to make people feel a sense of freedom, what's important is not
00:41:25volume.
00:41:26Freedom is felt the moment that the perceptions held by the human mind are expanded.
00:41:38So, I'm going to go even faster because I need to cover a little bit more.
00:41:47So, to speak more on the idea of expanding that perception held in our mind, I'd like to explain a
00:41:54case from Near.
00:42:03So, like I said before, the world has a framework that shows that indicates its limits. What's important is creating
00:42:09what's outside of this world.
00:42:18That said, Near is not a AAA class project. We don't have that budget to go left and right and
00:42:24expand the world. So, this is the approach we took.
00:42:30Went smaller.
00:42:39So, I created an additional framework inside the limits of the world. And by doing this, I wanted to have
00:42:46players experience the moment the world's framework expands.
00:42:53And to make this happen, I did a planning that looks like this.
00:43:08So, I emphasize the inner framework, not the outer, preventing them from recognizing that the world that would appear later
00:43:18on. It's necessary to make the player incorrectly assume that this inner framework is where the edge of the world
00:43:25is.
00:43:28And I'll use a specific example from the game so that it makes more sense.
00:43:36So, broadly speaking, the original Near scenario is structured in this manner.
00:43:51So, for starters, Near is structured such that players will go around the same map three times. The reason is
00:43:57simple. We did not have the budget to make a large map.
00:44:08So, as far as the scenario is laid out, you first present the character's life as a child, and then
00:44:13you present them as a youth on the same map. And when that's done, you watch ending A.
00:44:25And of course, that's also a copy of Ocarina of Time.
00:44:51So, after watching ending A, it's then possible to replay just a section of the time when the character is
00:44:57older.
00:44:58But that's when a new element comes into play. Now you can hear the enemies' voices. There's a reason why
00:45:04you're being attacked by these enemies. You had previously thought as very vicious. It was as though we were telling
00:45:12a story with a flip side to it.
00:45:14So, completing this flip side of the story would then let you see a different ending, which is ending B.
00:45:21Un'esperienza di ripresi, quindi un'inizio di ripresi.
00:45:59Sì, come dovete fare l'automata di Nia e l'automata?
00:46:02Quindi, come dovete fare l'automata?
00:46:08Nia e l'automata, ha già visto che sia un giro inizio di Nia.
00:46:14Quindi, non è possibile fare l'automata.
00:46:16Quindi, l'automata ha fatto l'automata.
00:46:19Allora, nella prima volta che lavoravamo l'automata,
00:46:21tutti hanno già niente di avernele una giro che i dei giocatori che hanno un giro inizio.
00:46:25Quindi, l'automata è un giro inizio di un giro inizio di cui è un giro inizio.
00:46:35Allora, l'automata è un giro inizio di un giro inizio di Nia.
00:46:40Quindi, l'automata è un giro inizio di Nia.
00:46:43Ma poi, la prima volta che fare l'automata è l'automata,
00:46:45quindi vi faccio immaginare la prima volta un ruote, come in giro.
00:46:49Questo è stato proprio una versione del della produzione,
00:46:52e ciò che avrò in giro a realizzare la sua visibilità.
00:47:20and then we show ending B at the time when the boy story is over
00:47:25and then after ending B we then show an entirely new chapter that tells a story
00:47:37for leading up to ending C
00:47:43and the reason why we did that is
00:47:53to have once players have reached ending B we make them feel as though the game is over
00:48:14so fans of the previous game they know that there's another route to the game so they will be playing
00:48:19the game with the assumption that it will end once they have finished this alternate route
00:48:24we counter that assumption by presenting them with an experience where there is still more waiting for them at the
00:48:31end of the alternate route when that's over
00:48:34giving them that experience of a new world opening up that was our goal
00:48:44okay I was going to go into another example but seeing that we're running out of time I'm going to
00:48:49have to skip that now
00:49:01we don't need to talk I guess you guys understand the content of this speech
00:49:05then I'm going to go to the last topic
00:49:07okay so this is the last topic I definitely wanted to talk about today
00:49:13this is the last topic I definitely wanted to talk about today
00:49:16as you all probably know this is a screenshot from the game's final section
00:49:25messages of encouragement from across the world
00:49:27for players who are struggling with the game's final battle
00:49:40Sì, questo è stato detto che ho parlato alla prossima, ma oggi ho parlato alla prossima.
00:50:01I've been wanting to talk about all day today.
00:50:03I know it took a little while.
00:50:07The truth is, this genius idea is not mine.
00:50:12I stole this one too.
00:50:16It's from a campaign called the Coca-Cola Small World Machines.
00:50:29So, I don't know if any of you were at my previous GDC session,
00:50:33but this is a campaign that Coca-Cola deployed
00:50:37between two countries that are on bad terms.
00:50:50Right. It's a story between how can people still,
00:50:54human beings still get along,
00:50:56even though they may have disagreements on their situation,
00:51:00the country's situation and society.
00:51:02But if I talk about it, it's a little too long,
00:51:05so please look it up on YouTube.
00:51:06But because it is something that I was very deeply
00:51:08sort of inspired and influenced by.
00:51:26That project left an extremely strong impression on me.
00:51:30You don't have to look very hard in this
00:51:32today, real world sort of society
00:51:35to see that it's overflowing with hatred.
00:51:37We are capable of just easily detesting people
00:51:41that we have never met or seen or heard of before.
00:51:44And so, I was really impressed by this project
00:51:46and what it was trying to do.
00:52:01So, just like what Coca-Cola did,
00:52:03I wanted to use this final message in Nier Automata,
00:52:06the screen you see here, to communicate something.
00:52:08By having people share messages
00:52:11with people from other countries
00:52:13that they have not so great relationships with,
00:52:15I wanted them to realize
00:52:17that the person that they're directing hatred towards
00:52:20is also, just like themselves, a gamer.
00:52:24But, I ended up giving up on that.
00:52:29That's why I thought it was
00:52:31because I thought it was a push-up on my own主義.
00:52:33And the reason for that is
00:52:35because I felt like if I did that,
00:52:37that would be me imposing
00:52:39my own principles on to others, yourselves.
00:52:54So, what we did instead was
00:53:04make it so that the screen display messages
00:53:07from words of encouragement
00:53:09from people and countries selected at random.
00:53:12I believe video games should allow players
00:53:14the freedom to make their own decisions
00:53:16and not have the opinions of our creators,
00:53:19myself, forced upon them.
00:53:21I don't know what a player will think
00:53:24when they see this
00:53:25or what you guys all thought
00:53:27when you saw this.
00:53:28That's exactly the kind of video game freedom
00:53:30I wanted to make this time.
00:53:46Having said that,
00:53:48if I were to have a personal wish
00:53:51or thought of my own
00:53:53just like I was influenced by the
00:53:55Coca-Cola campaign
00:53:56I hope that the people who played this game
00:53:59took the time to think about someone they don't
00:54:01know in a faraway country
00:54:02even if it's just for a little bit
00:54:05that would make me extremely happy
00:54:07and secretly that's really what
00:54:09all I hope for
00:54:11thank you for listening and thank you for coming today
00:54:13thank you
00:54:15applause
00:54:37yeah normally we would have all you guys
00:54:39come up to the mic and ask some questions
00:54:47and we don't have any time
00:54:49five minutes left
00:54:51and there's a QA
00:54:52Q&Aコーナーを自分たちで作ってきて自分たちで答えるコーナーに変えたいと思います
00:54:57we're so selfish we brought our own QAわかりやすいように僕と田村さんがお互いのキャラクターを描きました
00:55:34これリハーサルだと僕ら立ち位置逆だったんでごめんなさいじゃあまず僕からの質問田村さんプラチナゲームズの開発ってどんな風に進めるんですかプラチナゲームズは全員がゲームクリエイターを目標にしていてこれ当たり前のようなことなんですけど
00:55:43何十人とチームにいてそれぞれが絵を描くモデルを作るなど特化した部分だけやればいいということではなくてみんなでアイデアを出し合える環境づくりというのを大事にしています
00:55:44So the goal of everyone at Platinum Games is to actually become a game creator
00:55:50You know I'm sure there's all these different disciplines
00:55:53Art, programming, design and whatnot
00:55:56And we have teams of 10, 20, 30 people
00:55:58But it's very important to us that we foster an environment
00:56:03dove non sono necessario di avere un'acquiettivo che non si può essere necessario
00:56:06e che si può contribuire a loro ideali e lavorare.
00:56:10Inoltre, la stessa domanda,
00:56:12ha fatto il suo progetto di Platina Games?
00:56:14Quindi, la questione è la prima volta, Yoko.
00:56:19Tauro, mi sembrava più di più.
00:56:22Eh?
00:56:23Si.
00:56:25Platina è molto piccolo, ha molto amico.
00:56:28Il suo progetto di Beonetta,
00:56:28«Cascendo il Gamiya ètycznieato per averte del contesto che sono fissato nella loro famiglia del Gamiya.
00:56:34Magari, una situazione abbastanza della creazione del Gamiya in Italia?»
00:57:11Quindi la mia domanda è la mia domanda,
00:57:18So my next question to you, what were you particular about creating NIA AUTOMATA?
00:57:26I've got to ask you a question, but I'm going to show you a little bit of time.
00:57:38Yoko-o-san, who has to ask you a question about NIA AUTOMATA?
00:57:51I've got to ask you a question about NIA AUTOMATA?
00:57:54I've got to ask you a question about NIA AUTOMATA?
00:57:57I've got to ask you a question about NIA AUTOMATA?
00:57:57So this is a near sequel, but I was really attentive to making sure that the people who were newcomers
00:58:04to the series could still ease in and it wasn't intimidating for them to get into the series.
00:58:20When you talk about a long-standing IP or franchise, there are so many of those that you feel like
00:58:26you can't get the full enjoyment, the 100% satisfaction if you don't know the previous story or the previous
00:58:33iterations of the series.
00:58:35So I wanted to really avoid that and instead doing whatever I could to make sure that you'd be able
00:58:40to enjoy the game equally, whether you had previous knowledge of the series or not.
00:58:50So, Tauro-san, what did you struggle with when creating this game?
00:58:59So, as Platinum Games, we have no experience in creating an RPG game, so I think that was the most
00:59:10challenging for all of us as a team.
00:59:12So, the same question with the Yoko O'o-san, what was the same question?
00:59:15And yourself?
00:59:18Well, the staff was excellent, but honestly, I didn't have a lot of difficulty with the director.
00:59:23Wow.
00:59:24So everyone on staff was incredibly talented.
00:59:28So as a director, I really didn't struggle at all.
00:59:31Well, in the end, I was really sad that I didn't have a lot of difficulty.
00:59:40But on the flip side, I didn't have a lot of difficulty.
00:59:42Because everyone was so on top of things and so talented, I was a little embarrassed that me delivering the
00:59:49scenario was delayed.
00:59:52And, you know, it's a good thing to have talented people and staff around you, but it's also not the
00:59:58best thing because then my sort of delays and I guess challenges stand out a little bit more.
01:00:13Okay, so we are out of time. We had more Q&A, but we're going to pick just one last
01:00:18one.
01:00:19So, Taura-san, choose your question.
01:00:25Which one would you like to take, Taura-san?
01:00:27Why did you include auto mode?
01:00:33There.
01:00:47So, you know, you can skip cut scenes and we felt like, well, if you can skip cut scenes, then
01:00:53you should be able to skip parts of the game as well.
01:00:55So, it was pretty simple, but it was also proposed from Yoko-san.
01:01:07So, you are totally welcome if you want to skip the cut scenes and skip the game parts and just
01:01:12go for the trophies. I'm all okay with that.
01:01:22Okay, so I'm going to pick my last one.
01:01:26Yeah.
01:01:26That one? No.
01:01:38Is alcohol necessary to write a scenario?
01:01:51Interestingly, or maybe not so interestingly enough, the stuff that I write while I'm a little tipsy and drunk is
01:01:58usually a lot more popular.
01:02:10You know, I've concluded that when I'm like super proper and serious and thinking about work, it doesn't really come
01:02:17into shape the way that I want it.
01:02:19So, it's alright to have a little bit of alcohol, get a little tipsy, have a little fun, and make
01:02:25it easier for me to come up with my own ideas and put it in writing.
01:02:33The only drawback is that when I do that, the productivity level is really low.
01:02:39And so, because I will pass out easily, maybe, in an hour.
01:02:46Well, I hope you guys enjoyed our talk today.
01:02:53Thank you.
01:03:09Thank you.
01:03:11Thank you.
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