- 3 months ago
Втягивают ли ЕС в войну? Евродепутаты обсуждают кризис на Ближнем Востоке в The Ring
В этом выпуске программы The Ring депутаты Европарламента Хана Жаллюль и Райнхольд Лопатка обсуждают эскалацию конфликта на Ближнем Востоке и его последствия для Евросоюза.
ЧИТАТЬ ДАЛЕЕ : http://ru.euronews.com/2026/03/05/vtyagivayut-li-es-v-vojnu-evrodeputaty-obsuzhdayut-krizis-na-blizhnem-vostoke-v-the-ring
Подписывайтесь: Euronews можно смотреть на Dailymotion на 12 языках
В этом выпуске программы The Ring депутаты Европарламента Хана Жаллюль и Райнхольд Лопатка обсуждают эскалацию конфликта на Ближнем Востоке и его последствия для Евросоюза.
ЧИТАТЬ ДАЛЕЕ : http://ru.euronews.com/2026/03/05/vtyagivayut-li-es-v-vojnu-evrodeputaty-obsuzhdayut-krizis-na-blizhnem-vostoke-v-the-ring
Подписывайтесь: Euronews можно смотреть на Dailymotion на 12 языках
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:14Продолжение следует...
00:44The U.S. and Israel's attacks on Iran and the ensuing Iranian retaliation marks one of the most serious escalations
00:51in the Middle East in years.
00:54Tehran's targeting of Western military bases in the region and the involvement of Iran-backed militias in Yemen and Lebanon
01:01have heightened fears of a spiraling conflict.
01:04For Europe, the crisis is not a faraway problem.
01:07It touches directly on the bloc's energy security, migration flows, inflationary pressures and the safety of European nationals in the
01:14region.
01:16Yet the EU is struggling to exert any diplomatic leverage on the conflict, which has exposed the fault lines dividing
01:24its leaders.
01:25Spain has openly condemned the U.S.-Israeli intervention and questioned its legality.
01:30Yet France, Germany and the United Kingdom, after initially distancing themselves, have fallen in line with the U.S.
01:37and expressed readiness to defend their allies' interests.
01:40Can the EU act as a credible diplomatic intermediary, providing space for de-escalation?
01:45Or will it remain politically aligned with Washington, while operationally sidelined and economically exposed to shocks it cannot control?
01:53Once again, Europe's long-standing preference for rules, trade and negotiation is being tested by hard-power realities.
02:03Just some of the pressing questions we have for our contenders today.
02:08Let's meet them.
02:11Hanna Yalul, a Spanish MEP from the Socialists and Democrats Group, a political scientist and former Secretary of State for
02:18Migration in Spain,
02:19she is the Vice Chair of the Committee on Foreign Affairs at the European Parliament.
02:23In the context of the war in Iran, she said,
02:26Unilateral military actions should be avoided and rejected.
02:30Diplomacy and respect for international law should be the path to follow.
02:34Wars, insecurity and uncertainty only make the world a worse place.
02:38The EU cannot have double standards.
02:40De-escalation is a must.
02:43Reinhold Lopatka, an Austrian MEP from the Central-Right European People's Party.
02:48A long-standing foreign policy specialist, he focuses on security and defense
02:52and is the Chair of the Delegation for Relations with the Arab Peninsula in the European Parliament.
02:57The totalitarian regime in Tehran poses a great threat to the Gulf region,
03:01to the Middle East, to Israel and to Europe as a whole.
03:04At a moment when the Middle East can least withstand further turmoil,
03:08Iran strikes on several Gulf countries, risk widening divisions and undermining hard-won efforts towards stability, he said.
03:17Hanna Yaloul, Reinhold Lopatka, welcome to The Ring.
03:22So the idea here is to give our viewers at home a glimpse into the debates that happen here in
03:27the European Parliament.
03:28So I'm hoping that you'll feel right at home here in The Ring.
03:32So my first question is to you, MEP Yaloul, were the initial attacks by the U.S. and Israel on
03:40Iran over the weekend, in your view, justified?
03:43I mean, as you know, and as my Prime Minister have stated, we think that any unilateral military intervention
03:50that has not passed through the security of the United Nations is not in compliance with international law.
03:57So we condemn any unilateral attack.
04:01This is not to say that we are supporting the Iranian regime in any case, you know,
04:06because we have been against the Iranian regime criticizing the killing of Masha Amini
04:10and, you know, the protesters, you know, in the streets that were fighting for human rights and their liberties.
04:16And we have always condemned the relation of the Iranian regime with the militias such as Hezbollah or the Houthis
04:23or Hamas.
04:24So very critical with them, always.
04:27And we fought to include the Revolutionary Guard in the EU terrorist list.
04:31So a condemnation of the Iranian regime, but also of the U.S.-Israeli intervention.
04:37Mr. Lopatka, do you think that this military intervention from the U.S. and Israel was justified?
04:43I can't agree. Why?
04:46Because if we would wait until the Security Council of the United Nations is acting, we would never have a
04:52result.
04:52You know, it is blocked by Russia and China.
04:56They always support Iran, whatever is ongoing there.
05:00So don't forget, this regime in Iran, the Mullah regime, is a terrorist regime.
05:06What did they do?
05:08They killed thousands of their own people.
05:11There was state oppression to the Kurds.
05:14There are eight million Kurds.
05:16Have in mind how they killed Masha Amini some years ago.
05:21They are founding terrorist groups in the region.
05:26Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis.
05:29And they are a big danger also for Europe.
05:32We should not forget it.
05:33It was a diplomat.
05:35He was in Vienna, in our embassy.
05:37Then he was sentenced here in Belgium for 20 years because he was supporting terrorism here on European soil.
05:44So what I want to say is, we can speak about international law and here you can say maybe it
05:53was illegal.
05:54But I think the United States and Israel were legitimized to start with these strikes.
06:02So let me put that argument to you, MEP, he's saying, well, maybe the legality is questionable.
06:09But isn't Europe letting the U.S. and Israel do its dirty work in the Middle East by going after
06:15the proxies,
06:16going after the nuclear and missile programs of Tehran, for example?
06:19Do you agree with that?
06:19Well, what I do think is that we have diplomacy for something.
06:23First of all, we cannot use double standards.
06:25We cannot criticize other aggressions, you know, for other countries and then say that this is something we can.
06:31But this is about international law, the system that we gave to ourselves after 45.
06:36So either we believe in international law or we don't believe in that.
06:39And we have means like diplomacy.
06:40Let's remember that one day before the conflict, even the Iranians sitting in a table of negotiations with the Omanis
06:49said that it will work not to enrich themselves.
06:52We know that and we have investigating and we send inspectors in order to see that it will enriching.
06:58And even if the director of the nuclear agency said a few days ago that they were not sure that
07:04they were building nuclear weapons,
07:06but they had more than 60 percent of the allowed enrichment of uranium.
07:10So we have been very critical of that.
07:12We were under control.
07:13But don't forget that we have also a deal in 2015 between Iran and six other countries where the U
07:17.S. were within that country, even Russia and China.
07:21And then the U.S. unilaterally deployed afterwards, which had as a consequence Iran enriching much more and restricting more
07:29of the inspections.
07:30So either we have a consensus against Iran on diplomacy, fighting the enrichment on uranium and targeting any other kind
07:40of activities they can have.
07:41Or, I mean, it cannot be unilateral.
07:44We need to go all together and based on international based rule system.
07:47You bring up this question of double standards because the EU does pride itself on upholding the rules based order,
07:53international law.
07:54You said yourself that you question the legality of this.
07:57But yet the EU always is talking about international law in places like like Ukraine.
08:01Isn't this double standards from the EU?
08:02No, not at all.
08:04Why?
08:04There's a big difference between the invasion in Ukraine of Russia to take the country, not respecting the sovereignty, not
08:13at all.
08:14And the situation here, the UN Charter, and I'm absolutely sure that the purpose of it is to protect human
08:22life and not to shield terrorist regimes like in Iran.
08:26The Security Council is not working.
08:29So we are in a very difficult situation because I think the bigger threat is when the Security Council is
08:38misused by regimes like Iran, by dictators like Putin.
08:46And on the other side, we have to do everything to protect the interests of our people and fighting terrorism.
08:57And Iran is the biggest sponsor of terrorism.
09:01Giving Israel the chance to survive as a nation.
09:05I think this is our duty.
09:07And it's absolutely in the interest of Europe.
09:10So there's a big difference and no double standards, not at all.
09:13Your reaction?
09:14But, Mr. Lopatka, we are not talking about the right of existence of Israel.
09:18We all do believe in the right of existence of the State of Israel.
09:21We have supported that.
09:22And we support Israelis.
09:23We don't support this government, certainly, of extreme right.
09:26But we do support Israel.
09:27This is not about this.
09:28Let's not going to mix things.
09:29And then you talk about the UN Charter to defend human rights, but then you are against the Security Council
09:35because it is inefficient.
09:36So there is a contradiction there.
09:38This is one.
09:39And second, what we are talking about here is that we need at least to talk between us, to have
09:44some resolution in our Council and, you know, with our member states.
09:49You saw yesterday night that even France was saying that they are against this invasion.
09:55Starmer, Prime Minister Starmer, is not even supporting that.
09:58So there is a huge division, even if Starmer is not part of the European Union, but Europeans as a
10:03whole.
10:03So we need to have at least some base, you know, of unity between our member states and us, as
10:10a European Union, in order to conduct this.
10:12And it's not to say that we will support certain things.
10:15For example, the French also deployed some, you know, some defense system now in Cyprus.
10:20So when it comes to certain things, we are going to be united, but we need to have a talk
10:24between us.
10:25This is not about unity.
10:27And please, let's not mix this with the issue of Israel being a state because we do believe in Israel.
10:33We don't mix this.
10:34Sorry, in the ideology of Iran, Israel is in the center.
10:38And Ahmadinejad, when he was a president in Iran, and his slogan, from the river to the sea, it is
10:47in the constitution of Iran to destroy the state of Israel.
10:51Don't forget it.
10:53Don't forget it.
10:54And you have to understand here, Israel and, of course, the United States are very close with Israel.
11:02And now, what did they do?
11:03Yes, on the one hand, we had the negotiations.
11:06When I was state secretary in Austria, in the foreign ministry, I traveled to Iran to start these negotiations.
11:12And then we had the negotiations in Vienna, but they used it, on the one hand, having the negotiations, on
11:20the other hand, to enrich uranium.
11:23And they were very close to the atomic bomb.
11:26They were very close.
11:27And then, when they are on this stage, it's too late.
11:31Okay, I'll have to stop you there.
11:32This brings this round to an end.
11:34There's plenty more time for debates.
11:36Do not worry.
11:37So, let's move on.
11:42It's now time for our contenders to challenge each other by firing their own questions.
11:48So, let's get started.
11:50I'll start with you, MEP Lopatka.
11:52Your first question for MEP Yalul.
11:53As we mentioned already, the government of Spain has been one of the very few in Europe to condemn the
12:02United States and Israel's military action.
12:05And you didn't allow U.S. bases in Rota and in Moron for operations against Iran.
12:15Do you think that it was okay how Spain acted?
12:21Was it solidarity or was it the opposite?
12:25Thank you for your question, Mr. Lopatka.
12:27Well, I will say that there is, from date, is a U.S. defense cooperation agreement between Spain and the
12:33U.S.
12:33and the use of the bases are something that is a prerogative of the government of Spain.
12:40So, they have the right to let this be in use.
12:43If it is in compliance with international law, we do think it's not in compliance with international law.
12:48The message of the president was very clear today in the morning.
12:51He said, no to the war.
12:52We don't know what is the outcome of this war yet.
12:55But we do really certainly know that what the wars bring is much more immigration, terrorism, uncertainty.
13:05You know, the rise of prices there.
13:06And this affects European citizens too.
13:08And this affects European security too.
13:10So, this is why we are really worried about that.
13:12And another thing you said before.
13:14We have defended the Gulf countries, of course.
13:16We have listed statements, even my prime minister and the European Union, because we do believe that Iran should not
13:23have attacked any Gulf countries.
13:25We are supporting of all of them.
13:26This is solidarity.
13:27This is solidarity because they have been attacked and they have also the right to defend themselves.
13:32And then when you were saying about the European Union and supporting the prime minister, we are very grateful because
13:39the commission said, stated yesterday, very clear,
13:42they will support the prime minister, Pedro Sánchez, in trade issues because of that touch of President Trump.
13:47Because, of course, we know last night that President Trump said he would halt all trade with Spain because of
13:52its position.
13:52Now, I want to give you the opportunity to ask your first questions, please, to Mr. Lopatska.
13:58Yeah, you know that the Secretary General Guterres has explicitly stated that U.S.-Israelis, like on Iran, launched February 28th,
14:07violate the UN Charter, the one you were mentioned also before.
14:09And there was no security case authorization.
14:13How do you justify military actions to Iran?
14:19First of all, I have to say the Secretary General is correct on the letter of the law.
14:25But we have to see a broader picture.
14:28You know, we cannot end with a legal paragraph.
14:32And it was a commission, an independent commission, initiated by the Swedish prime minister, a social democrat, in the year
14:412000, after the United States have bombed Serbia.
14:46And this commission, Kofi Annan was the Secretary General of the United Nations, they said at that time, yes, it
14:54was illegal, but legitimate.
14:57And I see it now in Iran.
15:01Yes, you can say it is illegal, but it was legitimated.
15:06And you gave the answer.
15:08What did Iran?
15:09They bombed the Gulf countries, all the Gulf countries.
15:13They are a big threat.
15:14They sent thrones to Cyprus.
15:17So we have not to forget how big the danger was coming from Iran.
15:25And they proved it.
15:26And they proved it today again because they bombed today again Qatar, the United Arab Emirates.
15:33And even they bombed Saudi Arabia.
15:35Let me stop you there.
15:36This brings this round to an end.
15:38We've heard the views from our two MEPs.
15:40I will still be quizzing you on this issue.
15:43But it's time to bring another voice into the debate.
15:50And I'd like to bring in a voice from across the Atlantic.
15:54General David Petros, the former CIA chief and U.S. Army general, spoke to Euronews earlier this week.
16:01And he said it would have been good for Europeans to join for defense purposes.
16:08Iran is not going to limit its targets to just U.S. bases and Israel.
16:14My understanding is that the possibility of European nations taking part in a more offensive capacity has been discussed.
16:23The fact that it is being discussed indicates that it is certainly a possibility.
16:29What's your reaction to that?
16:30I have certain doubts on it.
16:32Because as I said, I just said, France deploy some of their capacities and even the UK because of the
16:38bombing of near airbase strikes in Cyprus by the Iranians.
16:43So yes, they are deploying some teams and equipment there and everything.
16:47But that's not implied that they are fully involved in that, as far as I know, because of the statements
16:54of Prime Minister Starmer yesterday, Starmer, and then also Macron and certainly Prime Minister.
17:02But if I may ask you, if the assets and allies of the West in the Gulf, for example, are
17:08being now targeted relentlessly by Iran, doesn't that mean that Europe has now a responsibility to step in and help
17:16its allies?
17:17That depends if we are asked for.
17:19We have not been asked for, as far as I know, by the GCC countries.
17:22They have big capacities.
17:24They have big teams.
17:25We are super in solidarity, supporting the right to defend themselves against Iran.
17:29As well as we criticize also Iran attacks also to Israel that killed also nine people the other day in
17:38Israel, you know, and also criticizing the fact that more than 52 kids were killed also in Iran.
17:46But we have not been asked by now, as far as I know, by any GCC countries.
17:50Do you think it's a danger now that Europe is going to be dragged in in a more offensive way
17:54in this conflict?
17:55How I see it, Europe should be active.
17:59Sorry, we should not only look what Israel and the United States are doing.
18:03Also, it is in our interest, for example, to support the United States to open this trade of Hormuz again.
18:11And here we were active in the Red Sea.
18:15By the way, also a proxy supported by Iran, the Houthis.
18:19We haven't discussed, if I may, because I do want to bring this aspect in, is the regime in Iran.
18:24It's unclear whether Trump is pursuing regime change.
18:28The EU has made statements in recent days, von der Leyen, for example, supporting the idea of regime change.
18:33Should the EU be intervening here and calling for the toppling of the regime?
18:37You know, our strength in Europe is not in military operations.
18:42But we are very strong in institution building, in supporting civil society, in building up institutions for a free and
18:51democratic Iran.
18:52And here, of course, we should be very active to support the people and also to support the Kurds.
18:59And rumors that Reza Pallavi, the son of the last Shah, could be invited to the European Parliament, perhaps, in
19:04the next weeks.
19:05What do you make of that?
19:06I will refuse completely his intervention in this parliament.
19:09Everybody has the right to talk.
19:11But, of course, I think we cannot be supporting this person.
19:14Even Trump was saying yesterday, by the way, he will not be supportive of him.
19:19We cannot repeat the mistakes of the past.
19:21Who is this man?
19:22It's not representing the majority of the Iranians.
19:24Sorry, it's a decision of the Iranian people.
19:26This is why we're going to do elections.
19:28We should not judge.
19:29We should not judge them.
19:31It's their decision.
19:32And we should invite not only one person.
19:35We should invite a group of activists.
19:38And if he is one in this group, I don't have a problem.
19:43Okay.
19:44Focus not only in him, but in other people.
19:46We're all warmed up here.
19:47It's time, I think, to take a short break here on The Ring.
19:50But do stay with us.
19:51We will be back very soon.
20:02Welcome back to The Ring, Euronews' new weekly debate show,
20:07where I'm joined this week by MEPs Hannah Jaloul and Reinold Lopatka
20:12to discuss the escalating war in the Middle East
20:14and its implications for the European Union.
20:17The conflict has now caused the effective closure of the Strait of Hormuz,
20:22where 20% of the world's oil supplies and seaborne gas tankers pass each year.
20:27We took a look at fresh data showing the impact of this on the price of natural gas in the
20:33EU.
20:33And as you can see there, there has been a dramatic spike since the conflict broke out on Saturday,
20:40with EU gas prices almost doubling to more than 60 euro per megawatt hour,
20:46the highest in more than three years.
20:49So, okay, it's clear that we have an energy shock here in Europe.
20:54Is it true to say, MEP Alul, that Europe is always the one suffering the economic brunt of these conflicts
21:01in the Middle East
21:02and it's going to affect European citizens and their pockets?
21:05Yes, of course.
21:05Not only European citizens, but the rest of the world, you know,
21:08because as you just said, 20%, you know, of gas is passing through Hormuz.
21:12So, I think this is affecting our pockets, our economies.
21:17Prime Minister Sánchez was stating today in the morning that our country is prepared in order to confirm that reality.
21:23But certainly, that kind of war always brings in uncertainty.
21:26We saw it with Ukraine.
21:28We're seeing it again.
21:29The vulnerabilities of the EU energy infrastructure system.
21:36How worried are you about the impact of this on citizens, but also on industries as the EU tries to
21:41make itself more competitive?
21:43Yeah.
21:43I don't want to minimize it.
21:46Yes, there is an economic fallout, but it's for the moment.
21:52And yesterday, already, President Trump promised to send navels there that they can reopen the Strait of Hormuz.
22:03But Trump said that, but he didn't say anything about European tankers.
22:06It was about US tankers.
22:07Yes, but it affects us.
22:10And not only Europe is affected.
22:12Asia is more affected.
22:14Asia is more affected.
22:15You see it at the stock markets.
22:17So, what I want to say is, yes, for the moment, it is a bad situation.
22:23But on the long run, for me, the situation would be worse if Iran had got the chance to develop
22:31an atomic bomb.
22:34You have to see it.
22:36For the moment, yes, it is a bad situation.
22:40But on the long run, I think we must be willing to pay this price for the moment.
22:46We heard earlier, though, that the, you know, the argument here, that the International Atomic Energy Agency even saying,
22:53well, there was no real evidence that this bomb was imminent.
22:57Is that something that you would give back to Mr. Lombard?
22:59Well, I just want to say that this is not my statement, but the director of the Atomic Energy Agency,
23:04he was saying there was no any indication about the beating of any nuclear weapon.
23:10But it's still they were reaching more than 60 percent, which was more than civil use purpose that was said
23:15by Iranian government.
23:17So we need to criticize this.
23:18And they have restricted also inspection.
23:20I might say, though, let's see what's happened.
23:23If there is a resolution by the U.S. Congress, it's being thought in order to stop the strikes.
23:27So many Americans also are against this war, especially Democrats.
23:30Let's see what's happening in the Congress with that.
23:32OK, well, now it's time to move on to our fifth and final round.
23:38Are you ready?
23:42Now it's time for something a little bit different.
23:45I will ask you a set of very short questions and I require a very short answer, yes or no.
23:54So let's get started.
23:55I will start here with you, Mr. Lovatka.
23:57Should the EU help trigger regime change in Iran, yes or no?
24:02Yes, it's necessary.
24:08Yes, but democratically.
24:10Is Reza Pahlavi a legitimate opposition figure?
24:13Is Reza Pahlavi a legitimate?
24:15One of many figures.
24:17Have EU sanctions on Iran worked?
24:20No.
24:21Not as much as we wanted.
24:23Is de-escalation in the Middle East now feasible?
24:27If we want to, yeah.
24:29Very, very complicated.
24:31Has Europa lost its diplomatic clout in the Middle East?
24:34No.
24:36No, but we need to improve it.
24:38Does the EU have double standards?
24:40Yes.
24:41No, I don't see it.
24:43Should the EU now publicly condemn the initial US-Israeli intervention?
24:48No.
24:50Yes, condemning also what Iran is doing with the GCC and the rest of the countries in the region.
24:55Was Spain right in denying support to the US in terms of using its basis?
25:00Yes, of course, based on our prerogative to do that.
25:02No.
25:03Has Wanda Lion overstepped her mandate on foreign policy?
25:07No.
25:07She's a member of your group?
25:11Yes, because he needs to act with the council too.
25:14So it's nice, but she needs the council too.
25:16And what about Kaya Kalas?
25:17Is she now relevant in foreign policy?
25:19Can she have an influence?
25:20She could be better.
25:22Kaya Kalas?
25:22I agree.
25:24Should the EU continue to observe Trump's Board of Peace?
25:28Yeah.
25:31Yes, if that let us be part of negotiations.
25:34Is Europe too dependent on US security guarantees to act independently?
25:40Yes, but we are working in order to be independent and by ourselves.
25:43Broadly speaking, yes.
25:45And they need to become more independent?
25:47Yeah.
25:48Is the EU now just a payer, but not a player in the Middle East?
25:53More and more we are a payer and not a player.
25:56Yes.
25:57Is Trump's America still an ally of Europe?
26:01Always.
26:02Even after what Trump said about Spain last night?
26:04Yeah.
26:05I mean, we have signed these deals of 50% on trade issues and he is confronting us on
26:11that things, but we need to keep our transatlantic relationship, but not submissively.
26:15Not submissively.
26:16Is Trump still an ally?
26:17He is an ally.
26:18Even the situation is sometimes very complicated for Europe.
26:22Does the EU need to rethink its relationship with Israel?
26:26No.
26:28No, but that does not mean that we need to criticize what they are doing in Gaza, because
26:33there are kids more than 70,000 civilians, this government kids more than 70,000 civilians.
26:37Okay.
26:37And my last question to you both.
26:39Has anything that your opponent has said today made you change your mind or your viewpoint
26:44in any way?
26:45Let's start with you.
26:46Yeah, that we should also have in mind after this time of war to find a diplomatic, a political
26:54situation.
26:55And what about you, MEP Yaloul?
26:57Well, I like to hear my comrade Lopatka, and I think it's very important that we consensuate.
27:05This is part of diplomacy in what we believe, that we need to talk, hear each other, and
27:09we always learn some of the other.
27:11Yes, I'm positive on always dialogue.
27:13Okay.
27:14And that brings this edition of The Ring to an end.
27:18Thank you so much to MEP's Reynald Lopatka and Hannah Yaloul for joining us today.
27:23And thank you to everyone at home for watching.
27:26Remember, get in touch with your thoughts by emailing us on thering at euronews.com.
27:32And see you very soon here on Euronews.
Comments