00:00We could be speaking to you every day. You probably don't have the time for us every day.
00:03But the news that continues to emerge from the latest batch of the Epstein Files and the focus
00:09of one of your recent stories is Goldman Sachs' Kathy Rumler. She corresponded with Jeffrey
00:15Epstein about a prostitution scandal a few years ago. What did you learn?
00:19Yeah, this was actually quite intriguing and certainly raised a lot of questions. I came
00:29and it showed that Kathy Rumler was corresponding with Jeffrey Epstein about a prostitution scandal
00:36that engulfed the Secret Service in 2012 in Columbia.
00:42This is a while ago. When you wrote this, I was like, oh yeah, I forgot that that happened.
00:47Yeah, and essentially what happened was it eventually engulfed the White House as well.
00:53She was White House counsel at the time. So you had some oversight committees that were
00:59investigating it. The White House was taking a beating in the media about what did they know
01:05and when did they know it, who of their personnel were involved. Kathy Rumler leaves the White House,
01:12resigns her position in June of 2014. Apparently she had just met Epstein around that time.
01:20In October 2014, there were news reports coming out, notably from the Washington Post,
01:25about the White House having denied this for years and now suddenly it turns out that there was something there.
01:34She starts corresponding with Epstein and reading him into what went on behind the scenes
01:40as the White House was investigating this.
01:44And she provides him with an email that was intended for a reporter.
01:50A reporter, it was addressed to Carol. It was supposed to be for a journalist.
01:57And...
01:57It was not me. I'm just telling you.
02:00Not you, Carol.
02:02But it read him into how the White House handled this investigation.
02:07And Epstein then started to correspond with her about it, even offering edits.
02:15This was non-public info, by the way.
02:18Yeah. This is new stuff.
02:20Yeah.
02:20I think what's interesting on so many different levels. First, there always seems to be, or often,
02:25Jason, as you guys are going through this and uncovering thing, of individuals in high-profile
02:29positions, politics, business, you name it, who are like, didn't really know this guy.
02:35And then when you start digging into these troves of documents, you see hundreds of emails
02:41and a level of intimacy and a relationship that's there. And I feel like that's part of this story.
02:47It definitely is part of the story. I mean, this one stood out to me.
02:51And then there's the government side, but go ahead.
02:52Yeah, no, it's true. And this one stood out to me because she was sharing this with Epstein,
02:59but also had recently met Epstein. So this is really insidery or inside info. And it just didn't
03:11really make sense as to why he would be brought into it at that time. But to your point, yeah,
03:19I mean, that's what we're seeing throughout the files. As you dig deeper, you see how deep
03:25that those connections are.
03:27One of the reasons we like talking to you is because we get information about the reporting
03:30process and how you're able to get access to these documents. This is sort of a different
03:36than the typical FOIA request that you would work on. But why is this story coming out now?
03:43Yeah.
03:43And why did, I don't, you know, feel free. I don't want you to give away everything and how
03:46you guys are doing this, but like, why didn't this come out, you know, two weeks ago? Because
03:51these documents have all been there.
03:52It's a great question. And one of the things that we do as we're going through these files
03:57is you can imagine there's a thousand, probably more than a thousand reporters on it. And then
04:02you have the public is kind of trying to do a deep dive to see if anyone has reported on
04:08it. Right. So, so people are doing different kinds of searches in the documents. I mean, even,
04:14you know, uh, our folks, you know, for certain companies, certain individuals. And so it's,
04:20it's, it's just, it wasn't caught, you know, no, nobody found this until, until we found it.
04:25That's how massive these files are.
04:27That's how big, oh yeah.
04:28Because one could say like, okay, well we could just do a control F or like I've searched,
04:32I've searched the Epstein files for names and it seems like you can just kind of keep clicking
04:37and, and any of us can, can get access. Yeah. Anyone can, can go onto the website and search
04:44names, but you know, we also have a system here without giving away too much, which allows us to
04:49kind of do more than just the searches, but to actually connect the dots, put these puzzle pieces
04:54together. I do want to know that, um, uh, spokeswoman for, uh, uh, Kathy Rumler, uh, she did
05:02respond saying she did nothing wrong. She has nothing to hide. Uh, and, uh, that, that was her
05:07comment on this. But let's go back to then the government part of this. And this is also something
05:12that's being explored over in the UK that all of a sudden there's somebody who had a connection to
05:18Epstein. Um, maybe you can debate how deep that relationship was, but all of a sudden there's maybe
05:24access to a government or things that might be part of national security or national strategy. And I
05:30think this is where I'm not saying there's any conclusions here, but it just shows a relationship
05:36that has access to the white house. Right. And maybe documents that are not supposed to be revealed
05:43or things set or information that's supposed to be revealed. And that's what we're trying to figure
05:47out. Right. Yeah. And you have to remember also that at the time that they were writing these emails
05:52at the time that they were discussing, you know, uh, a prostitution scandal and engulfing the secret
05:58service, no one had any idea that this one day would be public. Right. So same with us, right? We
06:04send an email and, and, and not thinking that it would ever get out there. But so they were having
06:10these discussions with that assumption that this would never be out there. And now we're seeing it.
06:16And that's why you're sort of getting a glimpse into not just what was discussed, but how high it went,
06:25you know, in terms of the levels of power. Oh, go ahead. Well, are there expectations? And again,
06:31I don't want you to give any great reveal, but I mean, as you guys are going through and my
06:35understanding is things aren't always in chronological order, like it's really piecing
06:39together this puzzle, but Jason, this idea that there is still so much yet to be known. And again,
06:44when you talk about whether it's in various governments or politics that they're, you guys are just
06:51starting to find things at a higher level. Yeah. And I, and I think there will be even bigger
06:56reveals down the road, you know, once you sort of kind of get a real handle on everything here
07:02and connect those dots, because to your point, it is out of order and you do have to put these
07:07puzzle
07:08pieces together, but that leads to additional questions, additional findings, and it will give you
07:14a better picture as to what it all meant, you know, why they were, you know, why their correspondence
07:21took place on a particular subject or, or a certain bank was bank, you know, was, was moving money for
07:27him. You are someone who does this, like you get access to files that most of us wouldn't think
07:33about, look about, right. So you are constantly getting not constantly, but yeah, maybe constantly
07:38getting information that is in public and kind of probably going through stuff and being like,
07:42oh my God, or some of it's probably boring, but how do you put this cash or these constant drop
07:48of documents? Like, how do you classify this? Or is this on a whole other level? This is on a
07:52whole
07:53other level. I mean, I, I do get documents regularly. I mean, the voluminous nature of these records makes
07:59it stand out, you know? So, um, quantity and quality, uh, definitely both without a doubt, because just as
08:08an example, you're not just getting emails. What you're getting is that, is the DOJ's internal,
08:14you know, uh, emails as well, discussing this. Do you think we'll get to a point where you will say,
08:22we've done it, we've combed through all of these and everything that we know is, is out there.
08:27I do think we'll get to that point, but it will be, you know, probably not for quite some time.
08:33And then
08:33it, you know, it's always going to, uh, be where you keep your ear to the ground. You kind of
08:39like,
08:39just make sure you check it every now and then because other things are going to absolutely pop
08:45up. Well, how do we know what's not, what hasn't come out or what you're still waiting for? At least
08:51in, in, in the so-called Epstein files? Yeah. I mean, it, it's all based now on, um, subject matter,
08:58right? We have certain subject matter, certain companies, certain, uh, uh, areas that we want,
09:03to dig into. Um, and believe it or not, you know, you throw in a search through, uh, our own
09:11systems
09:11that we have into it and you're starting to find pieces. But I think, as I mentioned last week,
09:18um, when we discussed, uh, some of these files is, is you then going out to report it out.
09:24Yeah. So the great thing about the records is that it gives you a roadmap, but then actually
09:30expanding upon that and speaking to people outside, you know, uh, who may be able to give
09:37you a piece that allows you to sort of make sense of it all. Um, that, that helps with the,
09:44with the picture. Are people just got 20 seconds increasingly being willing to speak?
09:49They are. Yeah, they are. As this moves along. Yeah, they absolutely are.
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