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00:00:16Hello there, everybody. You're all very welcome to the show, and I hope you enjoy what happens
00:00:20here over the next hour or so. To find out who our first guest is, let me hand you over
00:00:24to our MC for the evening, the beautiful Fred Cook. Thank you, Tommy. Well, our first guest
00:00:30is Louise James. Hello. Welcome. Sit down there. Thank you. I don't know you. No. Where are
00:00:48you from? I'm from Derry. Derry. Yes. And what's your line of work like or what do you do? Well,
00:00:54I'm a mum. I'm a Zoom. Yeah. So in 2016, I lost my family in the Bon Canipier tragedy. So
00:01:06I lost my two sons, Mark and Evan, my mum, my sister and my partner, and my baby daughter
00:01:16at the time. She was four months. She was the sole survivor. Can you remind me of what
00:01:22happened there, please? So I had been away for the weekend with friends. We were on a
00:01:30home weekend. And my mum had the boys and my daughter and my partner, Sean had taken them
00:01:39out for dinner on the Sunday. And on the way home, they went to the pier to watch the sunset.
00:01:47And the car slid and the car slid in the algae on the pier. And the car went under the
00:01:54water.
00:01:59How come your baby daughter survived? A fella swam in and her dad handed her out. And he swam
00:02:10back to shore with her. What year was it, did you say? 2016. So it's 10 years. It'll be
00:02:1710 years now in March. The 20th of March. Yeah. Who told you? I knew. I had a feeling that
00:02:27something was wrong. But my brother was the one day, break it to me. I had a gut feeling.
00:02:45That you, would you have had those gut feelings before? Yeah. About things and nothing had happened?
00:02:53Yeah. But I had been, I got up on the Sunday. And I had phoned Sean. And I'd say to
00:03:00him,
00:03:00you know, I just want to come home. You know, I didn't leave the boys much. You know, they
00:03:05were mine. You know, I just had Raina. Raina was four months old. And, and I phoned him
00:03:10and he said, you know, enjoy, enjoy being away. You know, you're coming home tonight. You'll
00:03:17be fine. You know, the boys will see you when you're home. And so that was fine. Later
00:03:23on that evening, I had phoned Jodie to tell her that my flight had been delayed for an hour.
00:03:30And I said, where are you? And she goes, we're in the park playing. They had just gone for
00:03:33dinner. And I chatted to the boys. And Evan said, I just can't wait to get you home. I just
00:03:39want to give you a hug. He loved, he loved his hugs. He loved giving hugs. The two of them
00:03:44did. And Jodie started laughing and she says, I'm just laughing at these things, telling
00:03:48me how much they love you and can't wait for you to come home. And I hung up the phone.
00:03:54I told her to look after them. I was all like, look after him in the park. Evan had, he
00:03:59was
00:03:59the youngest boy and he had Duchenne muscular dystrophy. So she was all, he's fine. And I
00:04:05was like, Mark, watch your brother. And he was all, mommy, you worry too much. You know,
00:04:09he's fine. Leave him alone. He's having fun.
00:04:11Can you, can you just go through the, the people again, because I'm a bit overwhelmed.
00:04:16Yes.
00:04:17So who, because I'm getting mixed up with the kids.
00:04:21Yes. So Mark is my oldest son.
00:04:23Yeah.
00:04:23And Evan is my youngest son.
00:04:25Okay.
00:04:25And Jodie is my sister.
00:04:27Okay.
00:04:28So the three of them were playing in the park. And I was talking to Jodie. So she was 14,
00:04:34Mark was 12 and Evan was eight. And my mum and Sean were in the car with Raina.
00:04:42Yeah. And so I was chatting to her on the phone and then I hung up and I'm going to
00:04:47say it was
00:04:47about 15, maybe 20 minutes later. I literally felt like somebody had ripped my heart out of my chest.
00:04:58That's the only way to describe it.
00:05:00Yeah.
00:05:01And that happened when?
00:05:02At the airport. Hmm. So I immediately like rang her back and there was nothing, you know, no connection.
00:05:15And I started to panic. And I was like, I know there's something wrong.
00:05:20So this, this feeling of that, your heart.
00:05:23Yeah.
00:05:23Was ripped out of my chest.
00:05:26And there's nothing around you?
00:05:28No.
00:05:29Just something.
00:05:31Hmm.
00:05:32So I phoned, I phoned my brother and he had asked me, was I on social media? And I said,
00:05:39no, cause I had taken, I had taken all my, I took everything off my phone because my battery
00:05:45was low. So you turn everything off to save your battery. And I said, I said, no, no. And
00:05:53he said, there's been an accident in Boncranagh. And I, I said, it's them. I, you know, I have
00:05:59a feeling I, I just know. And he said, no, it's, it's a car with, with two men. And I
00:06:05said,
00:06:05and I'm very like, I need to see. So I was like, well, what color is the car? He says,
00:06:10I don't know. It's just, it's just come up. And I went, just tell me the color of the car
00:06:14and you know, I'll be okay, but I need to know the color of the car. And he went, well,
00:06:18you used to drive a Jeep. No, it's a car that's gone on. So it's gone off the pier.
00:06:24And I says, look, turn, don't go on anything and turn your phone off. And I says, right.
00:06:30Okay. So he hung up. I turned my phone off and I got on that plane. And as the plane
00:06:38was
00:06:38coming on the land, I had looked across and a girl had turned on her phone and it just came
00:06:47up, black SUV has gone onto the pier at Boncana pier. And I, I don't, I just remember running
00:06:59off that plane. And as I was running, I switched my phone back on. And that's when my brother
00:07:06phoned me to tell me.
00:07:09What did he say?
00:07:11He, he said, are you listening to me? And I said, I know. And he says, I know. I said,
00:07:19are they all gone? And he said, Brina's at the hospital. And he says, I don't know what
00:07:29stitches in. He said, but she's at the hospital. But yeah, they're all gone. Sorry.
00:07:36Hey. Just in case.
00:07:40Thank you. Yeah. So we went straight on to see Reina. And my mum always used to say, you
00:07:50know, if, if I die, I'll, I'll show you a sign, you know. And I was like, great. Well, what's
00:07:56your sign? She goes, well, I love elephants. So my sign will be an elephant. So if I ever
00:08:01die and you see an elephant, you know, that's me. And I'd gone on and the nurse said, I don't
00:08:09know if you give Reina a dummy or not, but I've given her a dummy because she's been crying.
00:08:13And I said, no, that's fine. And on the front of the dummy was a wee elephant, you know, and
00:08:21I just thought, right, that's, that's my sign. My mum's here and she's okay.
00:08:33What can you remember what your body felt like?
00:08:38Numb. I felt like I was just drifting. You know, I just felt like I was existing. I wasn't
00:08:49here.
00:09:09How long did that last? That, that, it's still here now. It's still here. You know, you laugh
00:09:18all day, you carry on, you cry all night. You know, you feel guilty for loving, you feel
00:09:25guilty for telling jokes, laughing, being involved, going to parties. But then that's not fair
00:09:33on Reina. You know, I still have to live a life for her.
00:09:41How's she getting on? She's fantastic. You know, she's our two brothers mixed into one, along
00:09:48with a wee pinch of her. She's, she's my everything. I exist for her. So she might be, she has
00:10:01no
00:10:01weight of grief. I hope not. When it comes to asking questions about it. No. So I'm imagining that she
00:10:08might have often been asking questions in a very happy way. And you're...
00:10:15you know, she'll be like, oh, do you want to go to the pier? Do you just want to go
00:10:18down
00:10:18and, you know, have a look or just to see? And she'll, no, I'll say aye, okay. I'll never
00:10:25say no. We can't. You know. And we do. She went down, she'll put a Derry City scarf on the,
00:10:31on the gate. And she writes their name on it. You know, and then she goes, can we go back
00:10:37down there and make sure that scarf's still there? You know. What, what do you reckon
00:10:45she makes of it? I don't know. I've never, you know, she knows it's hard. She, she, like,
00:10:52she misses them. She'll tell you, you know, she misses, she misses the fact that she had
00:10:57two big brothers and they're not here. You know, she goes, that's not fair that they got
00:11:02to know me, but I didn't get to know them. And I went, but you do know them, because they're
00:11:08basically you. Hmm. Is the house covered in... Not covered. I do have pictures. I'm not
00:11:17that morbid. Is there, are there photographs everywhere? In my hall. I've got photographs
00:11:24in the hall of them. And that's, and maybe two in the lovely room and then that's it. But
00:11:31is that a decision as well? Well, it's photos that was there anyway. You know, it's photos
00:11:35that I had. I just never took them down. Hmm. You know, and it's photos that some photos
00:11:41have been taken away and she's been in their place. Hmm. You know, but there's still some
00:11:48photos there to let her know that they still, they're still part of our family. We still
00:11:52talk about them.
00:11:59What's the journey from that moment like? Very hard. Very hard. You know, you exist. You
00:12:24know, the person that you want to talk to is no longer there. The person that you want
00:12:29to give you a hug, to tell you everything's going to be okay, is no longer there. You
00:12:34know, you think that can be your partner or your mum. But when the two of them's gone, you're
00:12:40left standing going, what do I do? Who do I turn to? Who do I talk to? You know, you're
00:12:45left, you're left talking to a four month old baby. Crying in the middle of the night
00:12:50or whatever. Sometimes I didn't sleep. I walked the floors. How important was the, were the
00:13:02three or four days of grieving before they were buried? That was hard because the house
00:13:10didn't empty. You're like, there was thousands of people came, they pay their respects. The
00:13:17house never emptied. You know, we didn't get a chance to, to breathe. You know, if there
00:13:22wasn't people and there was media trying to take pictures, you know, it was tough going.
00:13:30You know, you felt like you had no privacy. You were just invaded with people trying to take
00:13:37pictures of the coffins. You know, it was hard. And were you aware of that? Yeah. Can
00:13:47you, can you talk to me about those feelings and what they're like? Tough. They're heart
00:13:54wrenching. They're sick. You want to throw up. You don't want to let them go. You just want
00:14:02to keep them forever. You can't. That lad has to go in that coffin at some stage. And
00:14:09that's, that's the bit you don't want to do. Taking them to the cemetery is, is terrible.
00:14:17You don't want to leave the cemetery then. Like it's hard having a wake for one. But when
00:14:22you're having a wake for five, it's a different story. Did you choose everybody's clothes?
00:14:34I did. I did. What did you put them in? I put them in their Dairy City rigs. Of course.
00:14:43Had to be the red and white. Yeah. And your mom and your sister. Yeah. I put a nice dress
00:14:52for my mom, my sister. And my mom had a nice skirting top. Were you in the room when they
00:14:59closed the coffins? Yeah. Yes.
00:15:08You remember what you did? I gave them a kiss. Told them night night. All of them? Yeah.
00:15:25Yeah. Yeah. It was hard. But I had to. Do you, are you apart from Rena much now? No, only
00:15:35when she's at school. She's nearly like stuck to my side. Yeah. What do you think of, I know
00:15:42you feel the guilt. Yes. What do you think of that? What do you think about feeling guilty?
00:15:53I feel guilty every day. And then I feel guilty for feeling guilty because of, of Rena. You
00:16:00know, I just said, I feel guilty for going away, for being away. Cause I go, you know, might
00:16:06not have happened if I had been there. You know, but then you have to stop and tell yourself
00:16:11that what's happened's happened and you can't change it. And you can't feel guilty forever.
00:16:17You know, at some stage you have to draw a line and say, you know. And be brave. And be
00:16:24brave. Yeah. And go. Yeah. Enough's enough. This is me. This is my new chapter. So it's, it's
00:16:32ten years now in March. And I'm doing a charity event. Charity event is in Boncana. So it's
00:16:41a walk. It's going to start at the park where they were last playing, where they were last
00:16:46having fun. And it's going to go over towards the RNLI station. And the RNLI men are going
00:16:54to have the booked out and let people see what they actually do in remembrance of them. The
00:17:01money that I raise is going towards the RNLI. This is the, I want to celebrate their life.
00:17:09Celebrate them in the walk and a gala ball. I'm doing a gala ball in Everton Hotel. And the
00:17:19money that I raise is all going to the RNLI. Do you think it's, it's possible to have a
00:17:26bit of crack at something like that? Of course. Yeah. I don't want it to be doom
00:17:31and gloom. You know, I'm definitely not a doom and gloom person. You know, I do like to
00:17:36have a bit of crack. I'll cry when I go home. You know, I'll bawl my eyes out for having
00:17:41a bit
00:17:42of crack. But of course, yes, you know, I do, I do like a bit of fun.
00:17:48How about dating? Well, that hasn't taken off yet. With a big yet. Maybe someday.
00:18:02You're just getting yourself organised. Oh, maybe I'm a wee bit too much for someone. Too
00:18:10much baggage. No, but your body has needs. Do you mean? Yeah. You're a physical person.
00:18:22Yes. You know. Yeah, of course. You want to meet someone. Of course you do. You know, I
00:18:40want her to be, do you know that life is about having, having someone there? Being in a, in
00:18:48a relationship with someone? Yes, of course. Do people ask you advice about grief?
00:18:55Sometimes, yeah. But I can't give, I can't give them that answer. I know, everybody grieves
00:19:03in different ways, at different stages. You know, all I can say is just be patient. Be patient
00:19:09with somebody that's grieving. You know, you think the first, everybody thinks the first year's
00:19:17the hardest. It's not. That's the easiest. For me, it was the second and third. The reality
00:19:25of, you know, everybody getting back to normal. And then no longer being involved in people's
00:19:32lives. You know, their friends still calling to me. They're amazing. Their wee friends, their
00:19:38mummies, should all be so proud of them. Because they're amazing. You know, they still call and
00:19:43check on me and check on Reina. And they're so, they're so lovely. And they tell me that
00:19:49their memory will live on forever with them. You know. Remarkable. I don't want anybody to
00:19:54forget them. How old are these young Felisnatta? How old are they? Well, some of them would
00:19:59have been eight at the time. And some of them would have been 12. So Evan's friends would
00:20:03have been eight. Mark's friends would have been 12. So now you have eight, like 18 to 22
00:20:09year olds coming into me with tattoos and driving their cars and their girlfriends. All tell
00:20:15me, they all look what I've done. And say like when they do something, they come on to get
00:20:19my approval. You know, but they're amazing. You know, and Jodie's friends as well. You
00:20:24know, I see Jodie's friends and they want to meet me for coffee. And they want to chat to
00:20:28me. They want to talk to me about the fundraising. They want to get involved. They're like, right,
00:20:33is there a Facebook? You know, and there is. It's the Bunkranapir tragedy. That's the Facebook
00:20:40page and the Instagram page for donations. If anybody wants to go on and support us with
00:20:47the foundation. I just want to raise as much awareness for the RNLI. And Mark and Evan and
00:20:53Jodie's friends are helping with that. And they're remarkable. They're amazing. You know, and I love
00:21:00seeing them. What did you write on their tombstones? I wrote all, well, it's quite a big one. Is
00:21:08it one big one? Yeah, they're all in together. So my mum and Jodie's on one side and Sean and
00:21:13the two boys are in the other. And then I had a girl in between. I had a baby daughter
00:21:20in between
00:21:20the two boys. And she is now in with the boys and her dad. She died 17 hours after she
00:21:28was born
00:21:28with fluid in the lungs. So I have a wee prayer. I have the angel, the angel of God prayer
00:21:35on
00:21:36their headstone. Because we said that every night before we went to bed.
00:21:40How does that go?
00:21:43Angel of God, my guardian dear, to whom God's love commits me here, ever this day be at my
00:21:48side, to light and guard, to rule and guide. Amen.
00:21:54Yeah, so that's on their headstone. What was your daughter's name?
00:22:03Oh, Jessica. It's too easy a thing to say, but it's... I hope that there is... that you
00:22:21can leave a lot of stuff behind you. Yeah. That the 10 years thing is alright. It's nearly
00:22:28like... I wanted to be... you know, I wanted to be a celebration of their life. You know,
00:22:37and... thank every individual that was there that night that helped. You know, there's so
00:22:42many of them that I don't know and I want them to know that I'm grateful. I want them to
00:22:46know that, you know, I appreciate everything that they did. And for me, this is... it's
00:22:5410 years. And I do want to do, you know, the fundraising. But it's nearly like this is the
00:23:01closing of a chapter. And open up a new chapter with me and Raina. And it's like a fresh start.
00:23:08In a way, no, we'll never move on, but we can move forward.
00:23:13Hmm. What date in March is the... is the walk? The anniversary is the 20th. And the walk we're
00:23:23doing is on Sunday the 22nd at 11 o'clock at the park in Boncana. And then on Friday the
00:23:328th of
00:23:33May, which is my mum's birthday. That's when I'm doing my gala ball in Everington Hotel.
00:23:44So I don't know, really, what you were thinking in terms of coming on to the show, but I just
00:23:59want to thank you very much for being so open and talking to me about what happened and...
00:24:09I know this is my first ever interview. I've never done one before. This is the first time
00:24:14I've spoke publicly about it. I talk about it all the time. You know, I talk to friends and family
00:24:19and, you know, people who ask. If people ask me, I'll openly talk about it. No, I'm not afraid.
00:24:25People think if they bring it up they're upsetting me, but, you know, they're not. But, you know,
00:24:31I don't... I actually don't mind. I like knowing that I've helped people. Some people say,
00:24:36you know, you've helped me, you're three. And that's nice to know. You know, but the whole
00:24:41reason for me doing this was to promote the fact that I want to make as much awareness for
00:24:48they are in L.A. as possible, in Boncranet. OK. Yeah. Thanks, Louise. Thank you so much.
00:24:59Wow.
00:25:14Welcome back to the second half, everybody. Freddie, who's next?
00:25:18Tommy. Our next guests are Cormac and Brandano Bugli.
00:25:34Now, you're a man I often think of. Good way or bad way? Well, in a very inspirational way.
00:25:43Yeah. I'd be very inspired by you, Brendan, and your attitude to life.
00:25:50And the last time I was talking to you, you were on with Seamus, but I think after that
00:25:55I bumped into you somewhere and you were just about to drive across Mongolia
00:26:01in an old banger of a car. There's something about the attitude of saying yes to things,
00:26:08though that's very inspiring. Did you get any of that? Well, I'm here.
00:26:19What could be more dangerous than this? So for people who don't know, your father and son,
00:26:24are you a good dad, do you reckon? I'm full of faults. I've made mistakes. I might have been too
00:26:33hard at times,
00:26:34wished I wasn't. And I just gave it my best shot. I gave it my best shot. I made mistakes.
00:26:45Everybody makes mistakes. Everybody makes mistakes. Yeah. And...
00:26:53When did... This isn't a therapy session, but I don't wake over it. Was there...
00:27:00When did you realise that you'd be able to work with your dad?
00:27:07Um... Work with him... I don't know. I don't really see music as work, like...
00:27:13I could kind of grow up with it. But I guess working on, I suppose, the TV programme,
00:27:18She in the Milk Leach, and... That's a bit... That's kind of work, I suppose.
00:27:23Yeah. I guess when I was asked, he was very excited to work with him, like...
00:27:30The question you asked him, how he was as a father, like...
00:27:35I'd say I'm probably in the best position to answer that, maybe.
00:27:39But he's a great father, and a great musician, singer, very loving.
00:27:44He did his best for all of us, and I learned a lot from him.
00:27:49And I wouldn't be here without him, like, in terms of music, what I'm doing in my life.
00:27:54So, yeah, I'm very grateful to be born into the family I have been.
00:27:59What have you learned from him?
00:28:04Um... Music and honesty, I think. I think that connection.
00:28:08And how he plays. He's a very emotional player. And a very honest player.
00:28:16And... I've grown up with him playing.
00:28:18And I literally wake up in the morning to hear him playing the accordion for years.
00:28:22And then I'd go down and I'd associate that with how he was. It was formless.
00:28:27So I can tell what form my dad's in just by playing a few notes.
00:28:31There was one time I came home from the Hillgrove, the nightclub in Dingle.
00:28:34Came in late, and I could hear my dad playing.
00:28:37And I went down the hallway, and I looked into two holes in the door in the kitchen.
00:28:42And I knew from the millisecond I walked in the door that he was crying and playing.
00:28:45So I walked in, and sure enough looked in, and he was playing in the air and streaming, crying.
00:28:53So there's a big... like there's a lot of honesty in the man.
00:28:56And I kind of grew up in that.
00:28:59And I learned that from him, I think.
00:29:01I've learned a lot more from him as well as I can...
00:29:04But how long have you got?
00:29:06Any practical things like fixing punctures or...
00:29:10Bleeding radiators.
00:29:12He hates my car.
00:29:13Oh, his car, don't you?
00:29:15He's one wiper.
00:29:17I should be there. One wiper.
00:29:19You're driving at night.
00:29:22The window steams up.
00:29:24You try to press the heater to clear the window.
00:29:26It takes five minutes to clear it.
00:29:28There was a bulb gone there last week.
00:29:31Sticky seats.
00:29:32Sticky seats.
00:29:36You have no class, though.
00:29:38But the first priority of a car is to get you where you're going.
00:29:42She's never left me down.
00:29:43Yeah, yeah.
00:29:44That's my father's thing as well.
00:29:46A car is just to get you from A to B.
00:29:48That's all there is to it.
00:29:50That's an interesting word to use in terms of music, isn't it?
00:29:52Honesty.
00:29:53In terms of a tune.
00:29:56I'm very taken with that idea of...
00:30:01The full range of human emotions are...
00:30:06Can be found in a musical instrument.
00:30:09Yeah, they're in the tunes.
00:30:12Tunes don't grow on trees.
00:30:14They come from people's experiences and composers.
00:30:19And musicians generally.
00:30:21The good ones are very sensitive and they put their heart and soul
00:30:26and their experiences into these tunes.
00:30:28And I see tunes, they're kind of like blockchains.
00:30:30They capture meanings, feelings and also historical events in them.
00:30:38And I think the goal of an artist or musician or singer is to unlock that meaning
00:30:43and to apply it, like we play lots of old tunes, but to apply that to nowadays
00:30:49and to your own experiences.
00:30:51And that's why it lasts as long as it has.
00:30:57Is there a living for you in the music, Cormac?
00:31:00There is, yeah.
00:31:02How?
00:31:03How do you put that together?
00:31:05Well, to make a living in traditional music anyway, I think the main way to do is to play solo.
00:31:12So, I play, I play gigs.
00:31:15I play, at this stage I'm playing about between 10 and 20 gigs a year.
00:31:20Ireland and internationally.
00:31:22I play, I think, I play in different projects.
00:31:26I play duets and trios and the family, myself and my dad and my sister Cliona are recording at the
00:31:34moment.
00:31:35But it's mostly solo to make a living from it.
00:31:38It doesn't sound like an awful lot of gigs in fairness, does it 10 or 20?
00:31:41No, but...
00:31:42In terms of your living and in terms of, you know...
00:31:44Yeah, well, it's kind of supplemented as well, because at home in Dingle, I bought a guest house two years
00:31:50ago.
00:31:51And I'm setting that up as a school, like a week long courses and various instruments or dancing or music.
00:31:59And I have artist residency there as well.
00:32:03So, I spent about 14 years on the road playing, like in various different projects.
00:32:09At this stage, less is more, and I have to mind the love for the music and the playing.
00:32:19Because overdoing it, I was at a point where I was probably playing too much and losing the grot for
00:32:27it.
00:32:27So, trying to keep the core of it.
00:32:30Sometimes you might overbook a tour, and sometimes you come off the stage and you're getting through it.
00:32:40You're kind of going through the motions on some level.
00:32:42But I'd rather do three or four really good gigs than to do 20 gigs.
00:32:50Wow, yeah.
00:32:51Do you know?
00:32:52Yeah, yeah, totally.
00:32:52Those kind of tours can be relentless and almost about the honesty first.
00:32:57If you don't really feel that tune, like, I mean, unless you're really hard up and you need the money,
00:33:05you have the heart first.
00:33:08And I think the money will follow if you stick with that.
00:33:13That all sounds ideal and attractive. How does it tie into paying bills?
00:33:24I think you cut your cloth. I lived in a camper van in Galway for about seven, eight years.
00:33:29Toured around paying the camper van.
00:33:32Whereabouts did you park up?
00:33:34On campus.
00:33:35What?
00:33:35On campus, outside the Crane Bar.
00:33:37Really? You did seven years of that?
00:33:39I did, yeah. I had a Ford Transit, lived in a camper van.
00:33:43Can you describe the back of the camper van to me?
00:33:49Well, it's an old British railway, short wheelbase, high roof, Ford Transit.
00:33:55And so I had a bit of electrics in the back.
00:33:57So I had a Birko in the back of it for the hot water bottle.
00:34:03I had a microwave and I had an electric blanket.
00:34:07I feel like I was paying it forward, like you can live for very little.
00:34:10Yeah, yeah.
00:34:11And save money. And then, yeah.
00:34:15And I'm sure Dad was proud of it, but what did Mum think?
00:34:21Mum isn't a fan of Dad's car.
00:34:26Or my type of camper van.
00:34:31You separated, did you, yourself and Cormac's mum?
00:34:35Yes.
00:34:35Well, we did and we're still good friends.
00:34:37Right.
00:34:37And I think if you really love your children, you'll be good to their mother or their father.
00:34:41That was the golden rule number one with me.
00:34:46And things I simply let go was it more important for me to show that I love my children.
00:34:53So, I mean, the best way to do that is to be good to their father or their mother.
00:34:58Simple enough, I think.
00:35:00But easier said than done.
00:35:04That's good.
00:35:05Will you play me a tune?
00:35:07I'd love to, yeah.
00:35:07Yeah, yeah.
00:35:08Whatever flows out of you.
00:35:09Yeah, we do the children.
00:35:10It should, yeah.
00:35:13What are you doing?
00:35:14What are you doing?
00:35:15What are you doing?
00:35:17Oh, yeah.
00:35:17Oh, yeah.
00:35:18This song was written in 1880.
00:35:21There are 13 verses.
00:35:23I thought we'd sing one or two.
00:35:25And it was a celebration of a Naivóig from the Great Basket that won a regatta in Wintry.
00:35:33And people used the Irish language.
00:35:35They used Irish words for being cool.
00:35:38That time they used English words for being cool.
00:35:40So they were so happy with the boat.
00:35:42The Naivóig, they called it the beauty.
00:35:44The beauty das na lá.
00:35:49So, you know, we can just put the muscle away.
00:35:56It was pole playing a song like that.
00:35:57They were so happy, right?
00:35:57No.
00:35:57Go, I do not know how you sing it.
00:36:07You can never forget.
00:36:12I was making it seem proof.
00:36:13And I did just a tale.
00:36:14I've been paying, yeah.
00:36:43CHOIR SINGS
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00:40:50One full light coin!
00:41:20One full light coin!
00:41:50One full light coin!
00:41:54One full light coin!
00:41:56One full light coin!
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00:42:09One full light coin!
00:42:10One full light coin!
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00:42:13One full light coin!
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00:42:17One full light coin!
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00:48:07You know I'm a really smart woman and if you don't get these jokes, I don't really feel
00:48:15too bad about that.
00:48:16That was my sense of watching you.
00:48:17Right.
00:48:18Yeah.
00:48:18Yeah. How is that? That's the self-righteousness though that I'm kind of alluding to.
00:48:26Yeah. So your story in stand-up is interesting to me in that you decided at a particular time,
00:48:37okay, I am, for whatever reasons, I don't know, but I'm going to move to London and I'm going
00:48:43to work the circuit there. There's any amount of gigs, any amount of travel, but there's
00:48:48any amount of gigs. Yeah. How is all that? So the circuit in the UK, it's bloody brilliant.
00:48:57You can work and you can go into rooms and be on with some of the talent and the intelligence
00:49:08that you're talking about. I get to be on bills with some of the best talent in the world
00:49:15and it's just brilliant to be holding my own in that world. I have nights where I do sets
00:49:28in the Comedy Store, Central London. You know, there's no, like, you couldn't be asking.
00:49:36It's like high-speed broadband in terms of the electricity in the room and with the crowd.
00:49:43And I come off and you might have another gig to go to straightaway afterwards. And you're
00:49:50walking through the tube station and you just feel like, I'm fucking here in this city.
00:49:57No, but you can't say I wasn't here tonight. I fucking did it. I laid it out. And it's
00:50:02just the, like, and I'm going over the top here because I think the club comedy circuit is
00:50:08kind of maligned in a way. And it's because in a sense, it doesn't, it's an outsider of
00:50:14the whole, the thing we talk about a lot, which is the economy and the neoliberal kind
00:50:20of whole circus and funneling that happens to comedians, which is where you go and you
00:50:26build your own brand and you're selling out shows everywhere. And that's the high thing.
00:50:31But I think the club comedy circuit is, it's a very psychologically healthy space.
00:50:35So it's more anarchic.
00:50:36It's an, yes, it is. Yeah. There's, there's more that can happen. And, and I guess the UK,
00:50:45whatever you say about it, it's very politically alive. And it's, I think that fearlessness is,
00:50:53is all around me over there. And I'm, you know, it's, it's there to be come, come with us,
00:50:58come over and do more club comedy. Is it, um, is it demanding in terms of travel and money and
00:51:09no pension and you only get paid if you get on the train to Cardiff? Absolutely. Yeah. The rewards
00:51:16are not there in terms of, you know, comfort or, you know, future planning for yourself. But yeah,
00:51:23I guess, you know, that's the world where, uh, the world is changing and all that stuff is happening
00:51:31in every aspect of life. Uh, so we're not kind of different there, but. And so that there's,
00:51:37you're not going to be saving money. Absolutely not. No, no. So it's, you kind of have to really
00:51:44enjoy it and love it if you're, if you're going to do it and get your goods that way. I,
00:51:49but actually
00:51:50since I started doing, so I, um, went and did a master's, uh, uh, to kind of change things
00:51:58up and be like, introduce new, uh, reading and stuff into, uh, what I was looking at. And,
00:52:06um, I think I probably do see like more just myself doing more of that because of what you're
00:52:13talking about, but, uh, it has actually made me like just realize and appreciate the comedy
00:52:21circuit an awful lot more. Just the very fact, because actually when I went into the masters
00:52:26was in sustainability and I was, the whole thing was like, Oh, this is unsustainable.
00:52:31Yeah. So, um, it made a lot of sense in the end. And it wasn't a masters with a view
00:52:36to getting
00:52:37employment as a sustain abiliter. No, I wasn't really, I mean, I couldn't even go into, you
00:52:46know, uh, kind of a company now and be their sustainability manager. You know, it wouldn't
00:52:52be, uh, uh, it just wouldn't work really. I don't think. But, uh, I think I, I, it has definitely
00:53:00given me a new, I guess, point of view on the world. And, uh, um, yeah, it, it, it, it,
00:53:10it's gave me like the, the answers to a lot of the questions I had about like, what the
00:53:15hell is happening here? So what is happening? So, um, our whole society, uh, is caught up
00:53:25in this paradigm of neoliberal, trying to extract, extract, extract from the ground and the trees
00:53:34and the animals. And, um, um, I don't, I don't believe until we get right with the natural
00:53:39world, we're going to be able to, we're going to keep doing the same thing.
00:53:45I get that. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Why do you use the phrase neoliberal? Is there a definition
00:53:52of it? There's, it's, yeah, but it's long. Yeah. So it's like you have capitalism and then
00:54:02that capitalism is fine because it can operate in discrete small ways. But neoliberalism is
00:54:09like taking over everything and it wants to interact with yourself and change yourself so
00:54:16that you are in and under it. And the system is so big that you'd wonder how to act against
00:54:24it. Yeah. But that idea of the type of standup that world that you operate in is where it's
00:54:37not about people turning themselves into a product because they're, nobody knows who they are in
00:54:43a sense. They are where they are tonight. This is not part of a career move in a sense. It's,
00:54:52uh, I get that. Um, what do you find yourself, uh, writing jokes about?
00:55:01I actually like probably I'm funniest about, uh, like very mundane stuff. Uh, I, yeah, like
00:55:15household bits and just the frustration of that. I think it goes against because, you know,
00:55:21I kind of, here I am on television talking about neoliberalism, but you know, if I, you
00:55:26know, go on about the grade of cardboard in the box of the washing powder and how that's,
00:55:31you know, so good these days, that actually, it's so good. Yeah. They're getting stronger
00:55:38and stronger. I can't throw them out. That's the, yeah. Uh, just that kind of, uh, stuff that
00:55:49I guess I don't, I like, I think I'm kind of too good to be talking about, but actually
00:55:54that's, that's really funny, that stuff. And how do you feel then coming home to us in,
00:56:02in terms of the stimulation of England and what have you noticed about the English that
00:56:06you'd kind of think, God, you're so unusual and you, you've no idea. It's really funny
00:56:11because when I do your show, you know, how do you support for you in the UK? Yeah. And
00:56:17the, uh, you know, there'd often be, I would think more Irish than English in the audience.
00:56:25And there is a sense in the room, I think, and I, I have this in my head, whether it's
00:56:30true or not, but that everybody in, in the room is an Irish person who's been holding
00:56:36stuff in that they wanted to say about England, but that you have, because you're an immigrant,
00:56:43you have to mind your manners a bit and, you know, be kind of go, okay, no, no, that's
00:56:47absolutely normal. You put water on the toast before you give it to me. No, it's grand. It's
00:56:51grand. This kind of thing. Uh, it's, it's a great feel. And I, I, I like it as a show
00:56:57when
00:56:57we do it together because I do that thing, but then you're, you know, obviously doing, you
00:57:03know, the full set and everything. So that's brilliant. Do you, so what stereotypes do you
00:57:09think that they have of you? Yeah, they could, they probably think I'm, I'm very overwrought
00:57:14about religion. Uh, and yeah, that, um, uh, you know, if you, if you say you don't drink
00:57:23over there and an Irish accent, that's something that has to be explained.
00:57:30Wow. Yeah. Do you still not drink? Yeah, I don't drink, no. How long are you off it now?
00:57:35I'm off, uh, I haven't drank in 18 years, any alcohol. Yeah. Why did you give up the drink?
00:57:42I gave up the drink. I was sad. It was making me sad. And, uh, I, it was weird. I
00:57:51didn't
00:57:51know how else to, like, I had to take steps to get off the drink and that, like, I just,
00:57:57I couldn't do it on my own. So I went to, you know, uh, I went to meetings and, uh,
00:58:06yeah,
00:58:07acted on it. Hmm. Yeah. So I never had a sense of you of someone who was a problem drinker.
00:58:14You see, it was all kind of internal kind of, I never like was, you know, acted out. And that
00:58:21was
00:58:21a little hard actually, when I went to meetings first, because I was comparing myself to people who,
00:58:27you know, had also were at the same, you know, um, struggle, you know, and trying to stop and they,
00:58:34but like, they kind of maybe had wake up calls, like they had, uh, crashed a car or something like
00:58:40that, that, that kind of thing. And I, um, uh, would be kind of saying, but I'm not that, I
00:58:46didn't do that,
00:58:47you know, but it's, it's absolutely nothing to do with that. If you want to stop drinking, it's about your
00:58:51internal, how you feel about yourself. And is this impacting my mental health? And yeah. Yeah.
00:58:59Um, did it make sense to you when you, I don't know if you did, but standing up at a
00:59:04meeting and going,
00:59:05my name is Eleanor Tiernan and I'm an alcoholic. Did that, did that say, yeah, you've named it there now.
00:59:10Um, I, I had to work at that. Uh, I wasn't sure I ever really got there, but it, yeah,
00:59:19I guess that was,
00:59:20the words are another step, aren't they? Like sitting in the room felt right. So that was, that was,
00:59:28that was enough. Hmm. Um, I have a, uh, a sense of you as well as, uh, there's no definition
00:59:39of you
00:59:42that is accurate. So sometimes, and sometimes people want identity. Sometimes people say,
00:59:50I'm a this or I'm a that, but the truth of their lives is it's a lot. It's those categories.
00:59:59Yeah. Yeah. So I don't know when you came out as gay, maybe, what was that?
01:00:07Maybe 10 years ago or something or maybe a bit more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And the next time I met
01:00:11you,
01:00:11then you were going out with the fella. Yeah. So what, what was that experience? What was that?
01:00:17Um, yeah, I felt just found it very hard to be, uh, uh, yeah, really land on something that made
01:00:28sense.
01:00:29Hmm. And I guess you're kind of presented with a few categories and line up in one of those.
01:00:36Hmm. And, you know, I was stressed about that for a very long time. And I said, I have to
01:00:42say something,
01:00:42you know, just to kind of move on and move forward and, you know, whatever happens afterwards,
01:00:48at least it won't be inside me all the time and just me on my own with this thing. So
01:00:53I kind of did it
01:00:56and, and, uh, spoke to people and, you know, uh, and, um, then, uh, yeah, it just kind of went
01:01:08away then.
01:01:08It was all kind of...
01:01:14So can you talk to me about that a little bit? Just like that sense of having to say something
01:01:18in order to get beyond it. So it was a, it was a declaration of, of what, of not being...
01:01:28I'm not being straight. I'm not straight. Yeah. Yeah. But that was as far as I, I did go with
01:01:34it.
01:01:35You know, I was, uh, yeah, like you say, like, I, I do find it very difficult to say I
01:01:43am something.
01:01:43Mm. In that sense, but also other senses as well. Uh, but, yeah.
01:01:51Did you, now, did you go home to Athlon and say, I have something to tell you?
01:01:55Yeah, I did. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And how does that go?
01:01:57Uh, they were delighted. Yeah. Yeah. They were like, you know, kind of going, where's the gate here?
01:02:04And then, bingo.
01:02:08Like, were they washing the dishes and, and they kind of went, oh, great.
01:02:14No, I kind of, yeah, no, I said, come into the sitting room and, uh, cause that's where things are
01:02:20said.
01:02:22And, uh, they came in and, um, I, I just, no, I just said, here, listen for a second.
01:02:33Here's some information. And, uh, they were just grand, like, yeah, fine. No bother.
01:02:42Were you, how did you feel about their reaction to it?
01:02:47I, yeah, no, maybe I felt like a little bit more of a struggle would have been, would have, would
01:02:56have honoured my silence for my decades of.
01:03:04Wow. Yeah, yeah. Was there, um, I bet you if John had said he was gay, there'd be a lot
01:03:10more of a fuss.
01:03:12Yeah, well, that's true. That's just true.
01:03:16Oh, Jesus. Yeah, no, my mother would have been out, you know, buying rainbow stuff or, yeah.
01:03:24What do you see yourself getting up to over the next while? Is it to decide on?
01:03:29I want to get up in the morning more. Just experience the morning and experience, uh, yeah, birds and, uh,
01:03:38as much nature as I can.
01:03:40And, yeah, just, I feel that's really good for your head.
01:03:44Um, I'm not going to end this interview formally.
01:03:52Because we're blood-like, so I'll be talking to you.
01:03:58That's all from us this week, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you very much for watching.
01:04:05Did you tell Mum and Dad we were going to be on?
01:04:07No. Really? No.
01:04:08Thank you, Singing View TV for now.
01:04:11Cheers, everyone.
01:04:13Cheers.
01:04:24Cheers.
01:04:26Cheers.
01:04:28Cheers.
01:04:31Good to meet you.
01:04:35Cheers.
01:04:36Cheers.
01:04:37Cheers.
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