- 8 months ago
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🛠️
LifestyleTranscript
00:00She got you home for the street lights, come on.
00:02What are you running from?
00:03I'm not running, I'm walking fast.
00:04Yeah, well, you're walking fast from the truth.
00:06Trust me, man, you don't want to lose that.
00:07Thank you again, both, for taking the time to chat with me.
00:10I'm Brandi Victorian, Senior Entertainment Editor at Essence.
00:12And I would love to just jump right in with you all telling me about Johnson and how the concept for this series came about.
00:19Well, obviously, there hasn't been a show like this where you had four Black men who were unfiltered, unapologetic,
00:27who were vulnerable, who spoke their truth, who confronted, you know, life's issues head on,
00:35depended on their brothers, have great intentions.
00:38Obviously, they're very flawed, but they're all striving for greatness.
00:42You know, you just don't see that on television.
00:43And so having that void on television was the main catalyst for wanting to put a show like this out.
00:50You know, something that reflected myself, something that reflected my brothers, you know, my uncles, my cousins, Thomas.
00:56You know, people who he know, because we see a lot of imagery on television when it comes to Black men.
01:03And, you know, it's kind of foreign to us.
01:05It's foreign to me and Thomas because we look at these guys oftentimes, especially, you know, when they're painted in a negative light.
01:11Like, we don't really know too many people like that in our circle.
01:15And so the vast majority of Black men that we encounter, that we engage with, and, you know, people that we know are like these guys on the show.
01:25You know, they're everyday guys who are hardworking, who are trying to figure out, you know, their love lives, who are trying to figure out, you know, their careers,
01:33and who are just trying to keep going, you know, and they're highly motivated, you know.
01:37So it's very necessary.
01:39It's very timely.
01:39And so that was the reason for wanting to put the show on the air.
01:43Okay.
01:44And I wanted to ask about that because I feel like, you know, Black women are very vocal, but like, I want to see myself in characters, you know, on TV and what they want to see.
01:52And I wondered, you know, is it equally frustrating for Black men, you know, watching them for both of you, you know, being acting, you know, acting for some time.
02:00Have you felt like you've seen yourself in other characters, you know, before this show?
02:05I feel like I've seen a part of me, a part of me, because I think there's a lot of incredible shows on TV that have Black male characters,
02:15including shows that have, you know, primarily a woman's narrative, you know, some incredible shows that have been on TV.
02:22But I've only seen a part of me, I feel.
02:25This show gives people an opportunity to see me in my entirety in regards to just my ups, my downs.
02:32It also shows the motivations why I make the decisions that I make versus just some, you know, basic stereotypical reason why.
02:41I think that's the issue.
02:42I think a lot of times Black men are painted in a way with no depth and our motivations aren't really expressed because a lot of times the people that are creating the content to speak for us aren't living our lives.
02:53And that's why Johnson is so important is because it gives Black men a voice and to feel that they're represented as far as an honest, vulnerable Black man that's just trying to make it as a human being.
03:04And it gives people an opportunity to see us from that perspective, as opposed to the stereotypical ideal of, you know, us being, you know, everything's super funny or everything's super dangerous.
03:17Because the majority of Black men don't live in that space.
03:19We just don't.
03:20The majority of Black men live in the space that the guys on Johnson live in.
03:24You know, obviously, you know, Black men and Black women, we have the same struggles.
03:28Black women haven't been well represented in media for a long time, for a long time.
03:33And so it's just as of recent that Black women have taken control of their narrative and started telling their own stories.
03:42And now there's a good amount of shows that, you know, as a Black woman, when you watch it, you can say, oh, my God, I can relate to her or this character is me.
03:49It's refreshing to see.
03:51It's a beautiful thing to see.
03:52And I feel like, you know, we have to do the same thing.
03:55We have to control our narrative as well.
03:57So, you know, we can definitely both Black men and Black women get to a place to where we're both happy and comfortable with our imagery that we see on television.
04:06Yeah.
04:07And, you know, to that point of controlling the narrative, you know, how easy or difficult was it even shopping the show around and getting it picked up?
04:18That's all right.
04:19I feel like we can be real on this, on this, right?
04:23Yeah.
04:24Yeah, I feel like we can be real on this.
04:26I mean, from my experience, you know, historically, nobody's really wanted to hear what we've had to say, you know, and that's just being honest.
04:35We've been used as pawns in media, it seems like, to tell other narratives, to fill this hole, to bridge the gap, to tell a certain person's story.
04:45But for our truth and our narrative, we haven't seen that.
04:48And I think partly it's because there just hasn't been a wide interest, you know.
04:53And I do think that we're coming to a point now to where people are more invested in Black men and Black women in our stories.
05:02And, you know, I feel like it's so timely and the time is right.
05:05But shopping this, to answer your question, it was difficult at first.
05:09You know, it started off with a script.
05:10You know, when you give somebody a script, you know, a lot of people in Hollywood don't like to read scripts unless the person who's giving them the script is somebody who has a large resume, somebody who's super reputable, somebody who they know, somebody who has a name.
05:27And so what Thomas and I did was we shot a pilot.
05:31We shot an independent pilot.
05:32You know, I took the script to Thomas and I was like, hey, man, you know, you would be perfect for this role.
05:37But Thomas, you know, he's so motivated.
05:39You know, we have the same work ethic.
05:41He always looks at the bigger picture.
05:43And what he wanted to do was he wanted to be a part of controlling the narrative as opposed to just being an actor on the series.
05:49And he said, hey, man, I want to produce this with you.
05:51Thomas just wrote the check.
05:52He wrote half the check.
05:53Yeah, he wrote half the check.
05:54And we split the cost, you know, me and him, to shoot that independent pilot.
05:57And I think that was the start of us really getting more engagement.
06:01You know, because when people see the brotherhood, when people see the camaraderie and the characters come to life, then it's undeniable, right?
06:09When there's words on a page, it's a little bit more difficult.
06:11But when they come to life, it's undeniable.
06:13And so showing that around town, I think they got the attention of a lot of great outlets and distributors.
06:19We chose Bounce because we felt like that was the perfect home for this show.
06:24They already have a built-in demographic.
06:26And the trajectory of that network is just going up, right?
06:30They have some great executives over there with David Hudson, Keisha Cash.
06:35And they have a whole new vision for the network.
06:37Johnson is definitely leading the charge in the type of programming that they want to show when it comes to storytelling and quality.
06:44And they've been very supportive.
06:45And what's the history, you know, of your relationship for you to have taken, you know, the script to Thomas, Thomas, for you to write the check?
06:52Like, how long have you known each other?
06:54Well, I moved to L.A.
06:55I retired from the NFL in 2012 and started really taking acting seriously.
07:00And I moved to Los Angeles.
07:02Probably about two months after I moved there in 2014, I met this writer.
07:06And he wanted me for a project that he was working on.
07:10And he was like, you know what?
07:11You'd be good for this project called Johnson since 2014.
07:14And he told me about the premise of it and the narrative.
07:17And I was like, listen, I'm all for that.
07:19It's for Black men showing us in the way we want to be seen.
07:22Cool.
07:22But I didn't know that it was Deji's show.
07:25And every time I would see this guy, I would ask him, hey, what's up with Johnson?
07:28What's up with Johnson?
07:30He was like, yeah, you know, I'm still trying to figure it out.
07:33Figure it out.
07:34Three years later, 2017, he introduced me to Deji.
07:37And I find out that it's actually Deji's idea.
07:40And he wrote a script for it.
07:42And when we met, we just clicked.
07:44We both had, like you said earlier, the same work ethic, same energy, same amount of integrity for who we are as Black people and Black men.
07:51And the project just spoke to me.
07:53For three years, I really kept asking this guy about it.
07:55And then once he, you know, asked me to be an actor and a pilot, I was like, bro, nah, like, this is bigger than that.
08:04This is an opportunity for us to lead the charge and put Black men in media where they should be.
08:09And in that way, we can encourage other Black men and also enlighten Black women.
08:14So getting into details, what can each of you tell me about your characters?
08:18Let's talk about all the characters in general, if you don't mind.
08:22You know, they're all vastly different, right?
08:25We all have the same last name, Johnson.
08:27That's symbolic for all of us having the same struggle as Black men navigating in America, of course.
08:32But once you pull back those layers, we are vastly different.
08:35And what we wanted to do with this show is we wanted to tackle controversial topics, but we also wanted to tackle some stereotypes.
08:43We do have a character, Jarvis Johnson.
08:45He's a real estate agent, very successful, went to Yale.
08:48He's in a marriage with a white woman, interracial marriage.
08:51He's getting flack for it.
08:52You know, he's getting flack for it from my character.
08:54My character is a lot more pro-Black.
08:57My character, you know, he doesn't quite know what he wants to do with his life.
09:01He's more so kind of doing odd jobs, just getting by, not as successful as Jarvis.
09:07My character's name is Greg.
09:09He's in a relationship.
09:10He's in a good relationship at the moment.
09:12So he thinks so.
09:13But his girlfriend wants more.
09:15You know, she wants to know what's happening with their relationship.
09:19And he's a little afraid to commit.
09:22And so the assumption is that, you know, when it comes to a Black man who hasn't committed or hasn't taken things to the next level with somebody who he's been with for a period of time,
09:31is that he just kind of wants to play the field and just keep his options open.
09:34But that's how we flip the stereotype is because, you know, you learn to understand the reason why he's doing what he's doing.
09:44You know, there was an emotional component to it.
09:46There was an experience that he went through.
09:48And we explain all that.
09:49And hopefully, you know, when the viewers watch it, they'll connect with it.
09:53They'll understand it and relate it to their own experiences.
09:56And it'll spark a conversation about Black men and Black women equally giving each other the benefit of the doubt.
10:02We have another character.
10:04His name is Keith Johnson.
10:06You know, he's that guy who you wouldn't necessarily expect to hang out with us.
10:10He's a little more quirky.
10:11He's a creative.
10:11He's an artist.
10:12He's a photographer.
10:13He has trouble, you know, really nailing down a relationship.
10:17He's a little more awkward around women.
10:19But he's still cool.
10:21He's still cool in his own right, you know.
10:23And so that's the expectation is that when you see all these different guys, why are they friends?
10:29You know, but why can't we be friends?
10:30And I'll let Thomas talk about his character.
10:32Yeah, we're all different and complex and very specific.
10:36But that's what makes the show beautiful is that we all coexist in the same space comfortably.
10:40And when you watch the show, you see the chemistry is just natural.
10:43Omar is going through a divorce and a custody battle with his wife.
10:50They're separated.
10:51He's definitely misunderstood.
10:54He has the kind of angry Black man stereotype label.
11:00And he's trying to work his way through that situation so he can be understood.
11:05Because a lot of times, as Black men, people never give us the benefit of the doubt.
11:11And they definitely don't ask why we did something or why we feel the way.
11:14It's just we're being emotional or we just innately want to be that way.
11:19It's just not the truth.
11:21You know, everyone's motivated by something based off of their emotions.
11:25And a lot of times, like I said, Black men don't get the benefit of the doubt.
11:27How do both of you kind of, I guess, shake off maybe societal expectations?
11:33You know, a lot of times we hear men, you know, society won't let me be this or I can't be this.
11:37You know, how have you all or how do you kind of navigate that or just, you know, be your own person?
11:42We talk to each other.
11:43We all have a very similar experience as Black men.
11:45A lot of times we're not really awarded, like I said, the benefit of the doubt.
11:50And sometimes if you speak up, speak your emotions, you're too emotional.
11:53And then if you don't say anything, then, you know, you're emotionless.
11:58Sometimes it's like you can't win for losing.
12:00So most of the time we deal with it by talking to other Black men that can understand this very specific experience.
12:08Obviously, there's a lot of expectations and assumptions when it comes to us on how we should move and how we should operate.
12:14I've never personally subjected myself to live by those rules.
12:18You know, I feel like as Black people, we're coming to a space where we're becoming more and more accepting that we all do have differences and you can't fit us all inside of a box.
12:29The scene in episode two with Omar's character, he gets in a debate with the woman radio host and he says, you know, men want to talk to women, but they're scared of how women will react.
12:39So I'm curious, you know, how true is that statement?
12:42And how do you think this series might open up dialogue between men?
12:46That was a very specific conversation because a lot of times as Black people, we have to be very careful of how we say what we say.
12:54And then to go a step further, Black men really have to be careful because you're one tweet away from getting canceled because social media is literally, you know, feeding you to the wolves.
13:09So that conversation with us and with DLU Lee and that scene was very interesting because that was our way of saying we do have conversations.
13:21We talk to each other.
13:23We feel like women might not be able to either deal with our honesty or they won't hear it.
13:30And we also had to say that in episode nine because we had to give people a chance to see the characters visually and emotionally connect to them, go through these situations.
13:40So our truth isn't as harsh.
13:43And that's the thing.
13:44Our truth just out the gate is too harsh for people.
13:48And then, you know, they want to kill the messenger and don't hear the message.
13:51We talked about toxic masculinity.
13:53Yeah.
13:54You know, we talked about men actually being, you know, stereotypical of them being deadbeat dads.
14:00And then we also gave statistics on how they're the most informed.
14:03Black fathers are the most engaged with their kids.
14:07These are things that people don't know because these narratives and stereotypes are so strong that when they see a Black man, all they think is that.
14:12But a lot of those statistically just aren't true.
14:15So that was an important scene for sure.
14:16And Lexi, I want to ask, you know, how do you want audiences to show up for you all?
14:21You know, you've invested in this show, made it happen.
14:23And, you know, we ask so much to see other narratives and then sometimes we leave shows, you know, to die.
14:29We don't support like we should.
14:30So how do you all want to see, you know, audiences show up for you?
14:34We made this for our people.
14:37You know, it's a lot of hard work, a lot of strategic, creative conversations on what and who needs to be represented on this show.
14:49You know, Thomas and I, we study the culture.
14:51We study media.
14:52We study what people are saying online and the comment sections, what people want to see and what needs to be represented.
14:59Every detail in this show is very specific, even to the casting with the women who we casted and making sure that everybody was reflected.
15:07All shades of Black, you know, all shades of Black is reflected throughout, not just with our immediate female characters, but also, too, with some of the supporting characters that you're going to see guest star throughout the season.
15:21They might pop in for one episode or two episodes.
15:23We wanted to make it super reflective, you know, of what we see and how our lives are.
15:28And so I think and I hope that the audience will recognize that in the trailers and the teasers in the first episode.
15:34And they'll fall in love with the characters, but also fall in love with the show and the writing and the honesty and that they will show up and they will support, you know, as much as they can.
15:47If they're going to tell a friend, they're going to tell five friends, tell 10 friends, they're going to share it, you know, because a lot of things that we discussed on this show are conversation starters.
15:56And so when you hear these topics, you know, it's hard to just let the show go off and then that's it.
16:02You've got to talk about it. You've got to talk about it with your friends.
16:04So we want to carry that conversation onto social media.
16:07We want to carry that conversation into people's homes.
16:10And then that conversation will continue into the next episode.
16:12So if you feel strongly that this show will resonate with a lot of people.
16:16Well, nice. Well, crossing my fingers, Ruben, for you both.
16:19Thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me.
16:21And I'm excited for everyone to see you.
16:24Thank you so much. I appreciate it.
16:26Take care.
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