- 3 days ago
In this episode of Power House, Diego Sanchez and Zeb Lowe discuss the transition of hosting responsibilities and Zeb’s perspective on where housing and mortgage conversations need to go next.
Drawing on his background in origination and content creation, Zeb explains why storytelling, collaboration, and community matter more than ever in a crowded, fast-moving industry. The conversation explores HousingWire’s evolving content strategy, shifting generational attitudes toward homeownership, and the importance of education in addressing affordability challenges.
They also unpack the role of AI in housing, making the case for technology as an amplifier of human judgment rather than a replacement, and why empowering teams with the right tools is key to productivity and engagement.
This episode sets the tone for Power House’s next chapter: focused on people, perspective, and practical insight.
The Power House podcast brings the biggest names in housing to answer hard-hitting questions about industry trends, operational and growth strategy, and leadership. Join HousingWire president Diego Sanchez every Thursday morning for candid conversations with industry leaders to learn how they’re differentiating themselves from the competition. Hosted and produced by the HousingWire Content Studio.
Drawing on his background in origination and content creation, Zeb explains why storytelling, collaboration, and community matter more than ever in a crowded, fast-moving industry. The conversation explores HousingWire’s evolving content strategy, shifting generational attitudes toward homeownership, and the importance of education in addressing affordability challenges.
They also unpack the role of AI in housing, making the case for technology as an amplifier of human judgment rather than a replacement, and why empowering teams with the right tools is key to productivity and engagement.
This episode sets the tone for Power House’s next chapter: focused on people, perspective, and practical insight.
The Power House podcast brings the biggest names in housing to answer hard-hitting questions about industry trends, operational and growth strategy, and leadership. Join HousingWire president Diego Sanchez every Thursday morning for candid conversations with industry leaders to learn how they’re differentiating themselves from the competition. Hosted and produced by the HousingWire Content Studio.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Welcome to Powerhouse, where we talk to the biggest names in housing and ask them about
00:14their strategy for growth. My name is Diego Sanchez. I'm the president of HousingWire.
00:20And my guest today is a special one. It's Zeb Lowe, the senior director of HousingWire's
00:27content studio. Zeb, it's so great to talk to you today.
00:30Diego, thank you for having me.
00:32So this is a special episode because we've been sharing hosting responsibilities over the past
00:39couple of months. And at this point, you're going to start to take the lead as the host of Powerhouse,
00:46which I'm super excited about. I know you're super excited about. Why do you think the audience
00:52should be interested in and excited about you jumping in to be the primary host of Powerhouse?
01:00I think that there's probably a lot to that. I think that I've kind of got a unique seat in the
01:08industry or perspective of the industry. I come from an origination background, content creation
01:13background at a mortgage company for a long time. And I've been here at HousingWire for a couple of
01:19years. And so I get to talk to contributors and I get to work with clients on the most relevant topics
01:29and messaging and tone that resonates throughout the industry. And so I've got a unique, I guess,
01:36exposure level to what's happening across the industry that I definitely didn't have before I got
01:43here. And over the last two years, like I said, that exposure at what is happening across the board
01:49is, like I said, is very unique. And I feel like I'm able to talk to people across a wide range of
01:57specialties in the industry and all the subsections in the industry to bring to our audience the people
02:05that are moving the industry forward, that are really shaking things up. Because you can learn lessons
02:11from a loan originator can learn lessons from a real estate developer, right? And an executive can
02:19learn lessons from the tip of the spear, right? A loan originator that's executing with homeowners
02:26and homebuyers at the ground level. And so I think I've got a pretty good handle on what's happening,
02:35when, why, because of all the content that we create and the fact that we know who is engaging with
02:41what, it'll allow us to bring relevant topics and interesting topics to the audience in real time.
02:48Yeah, the thing that I love about you in your role, and as the primary host of Powerhouse,
02:55and this goes back to when we hired you, you know, in fact, you know, a little story for the audience.
03:01When we posted the role to run our content studio, I got a call from Adam O'Daniel,
03:08who is the CMO at Gill Mortgage. And he's like, you can just stop your hiring process. I have the
03:15right person for you. And the person that he referred was you, Zeb. And he talked about
03:22you being on the front lines as an originator, and then stepping into more of a corporate role as a
03:28marketer for a lender. And how your passion is revealing the great stories that happen in our
03:38industry. And using those to educate everybody on how to be a better LO, how to be a better lender,
03:48how to be a better real estate agent, how to be a better housing professional.
03:51And, you know, we really saw that from day one of your tenure here. And it really is,
03:59you kind of epitomize the all things housing mission that we've got here, where just like you
04:06said, you know, we do think that the tip of the spear needs to know what's happening in the executive
04:12suite and what the strategies are, and vice versa. And folks in real estate need to know what's going
04:18on a mortgage and title, and vice versa. And so I think you really bring that perspective
04:23into your role as now primary host of HousingWare, of Powerhouse.
04:28Thank you. Thank you very much. And I didn't, I didn't know, I knew that Adam had called and put
04:33in a good word for me. I didn't know that he had said that. That's good to know. I need to text him.
04:37Thank you. Yeah, he definitely went to bat for you, which was, and he's somebody that I trust. So
04:42that was really great. So for listeners who might not know you beyond your name in the byline,
04:51what does Zeb do at HousingWare? What is the content studio? What does your day-to-day look like
04:57at our organization? On a day-to-day, it varies wildly. But generally speaking, it's overseeing
05:04all of the content that comes out of our content studio, which is, this is painting with a really
05:09broad brush, but anything that is non-journalism, non-news stories. So all of our podcasts,
05:15but there's a lot of overlap, right, with HousingWare Daily. And we oversee that, we produce
05:21that, as long with the rest of our podcast, all of our virtual events, our webinars, our demo days.
05:28We create content at all of our live events, the instant impacts that you host.
05:32I oversee our contributor network and work with regular contributors and not just editing, but
05:39kind of giving feedback on this is what our audience is interested in, this is not what
05:45our audience is interested in. And the same thing with our sponsored content, talking to clients,
05:50a lot of phone calls, a lot of meetings. You probably know this, you know this actually booking
05:55meetings with me, you know what my calendar looks like. So it's mainly meetings throughout the day on
06:02giving feedback over this topic matters. This topic doesn't matter. People are not engaging with
06:08this. This is the direction that, that people are wanting. You know, we, HousingWare has a great
06:14platform for, for thought leadership and being able to provide feedback to these thought leaders.
06:21Like you got a lot of, you have a lot of great ideas. You have a, you have a, you have a, you have
06:25many messages to share. This is what our, this is what our audience is, is wanting right now.
06:30One of the things that I, it's a, it's a blessing and a curse, particularly with the contributor
06:36platform and my email address is associated to pretty much everything. And I receive a lot of
06:42feedback and I welcome it. Like I said, it's a blessing and a curse, but I receive a ton of feedback
06:46from what, from what the content studio publishes, which is a massive volume of content. And so having
06:53that real-time engagement with our audience along with our, our, our content creators is the vast
07:01majority of, of my day. You and your team have published some really interesting and great content
07:09over your tenure at HousingWire, which is, which has been more, more than a year at this point.
07:15What are the, uh, the projects that really got your, your juices flowing and got you really excited
07:21about, about being at HousingWire? There are several specific projects. I guess I can answer
07:27this in two parts. There's specific projects, and then there are specific themes that kind of permeate
07:31throughout. And we invested heavily in video, uh, this past year and created a lot of new video,
07:39I guess, products and mediums that we were able to start, start telling stories, which is unique
07:46for, you know, with HousingWire, we, we provide data and insights and these, these quick actionable
07:52insights, right? That you can kind of get like that. But there's, there's, this whole other realm
07:58to explore. As a matter of fact, you retain better information better and you make information,
08:03you make decisions better based off of narrative and based off of story, right? So if I was to give
08:09you a list of 15 words to memorize just bullet points versus if I was to embed those into a,
08:15you know, a four, a four sentence paragraph and have you read that paragraph, have you read that
08:20story, you'll remember those 15 words exponentially faster and retain them exponentially better through
08:26reading a short story with those 15 data points embedded into them. Then just forcing yourself to
08:33just cold memorize 15 bullet pointed words and applies, applies with data, it applies with insights
08:40across the board. And so there is so much to learn that we, and so much information that we embed or
08:46able to embed through our storytelling. In particular, we had like some docu series that came out this past
08:51year, uh, that was, uh, that was really impactful and, and did really well. We've expanded the way that
08:58we've, uh, uh, done our, uh, our, our interviews and our interview format about the instant impacts
09:04that you've been a part of, which have been really, really, really impactful where we have on site on
09:09location. So it's an hour never type situation where we're at a particular live event. We have a unique
09:15venue and they get to sit down with you. And at that, at that venue, at that live event, we record this
09:22interview, our team publishes it overnight. So the next day, what's being good. There's this feeling I felt it my
09:30entire career and it's not unique to me where people feel like they're on the outs in this industry. It's so easy to
09:37feel like you're on the outside and you feel like the decisions that are being made, you know, that there are
09:43decisions that are being made and you feel like they're happening in rooms that you'll never travel. And sometimes you
09:49really, because you actually, you can't, right. But a lot of the decisions that are made are happening at
09:54conferences that we're able to go to, not just housing work conferences, but the other ones that
09:58we revisit. And those instant impacts are unique because it, uh, it provides like in real time, you're,
10:04you're, you are a part of that conversation, right. And that matters to, to a loan originator that would
10:09never go there, right. Or that, or that can't go there. And it provides access to that information,
10:15to those insights, to the decisions that are being made to people across the industry.
10:19So those projects are really special to me. Um, and I think are really important, but the themes
10:26throughout the, uh, the past year or so that really has stood out to me, this does tie into the insider
10:32thing though, like being on the inside versus being on the outside and the conversations that I've been a
10:39part of it's, it's been interesting to see how, how much the movers and the shakers in this industry,
10:48the people that are pushing it forward, the decision, how much they actually want the,
10:52they want a larger community to plug into, and they want a platform to share their message,
10:58to share their story. Because a lot of these, like I said, these decisions that are being made,
11:03or the information that's being shared, it's not, it's not being done secretly, you know,
11:08they're not secretive on purpose. Right. And so there is this need or desire to be able to plug in
11:15to a platform like HousingWire and like our various podcasts to really share and receive feedback from
11:20the community and from people in their own industry. Yeah. It's one of the things that I've noticed the
11:26most about the housing industry is there is a real willingness to collaborate and share and people
11:36aren't holding their strategies that close to their vest. Yeah. And whether it's through,
11:43like you said, whether it's through podcasts or the contributor network that you run or through our
11:48events, people are really open about what's making them successful. And I find that really,
11:56really refreshing. All right. So let me ask you, did you, I mean, what was your impression,
12:00like coming in to HousingWire and, you know, you're, you're a part of so many more of those
12:05conversations than, than I am. Was that surprising to you? Yeah, it's very surprising. You know, I,
12:11I came from B2C media and, you know, with, with a definite tech focus and, you know, spent some time at
12:23Microsoft a while back and much more secretive, you know, people don't want to let out the special
12:29sauce. And, and so, you know, coming to an industry that is so open and collaborative and is looking for
12:39channels and forums to network and collaborate. It's really refreshing. And it, it, it was a huge
12:47opportunity for us. Uh, and it's why, you know, why we built the gathering, which, you know, brings
12:53these different verticals together under one roof. Um, and, uh, you know, it's part of our all things
12:59housing mission is like, people do want to share across these, uh, you know, what, what before have
13:05been silos. Uh, people want to break down those silos. Uh, and that, and that as an executive, uh,
13:11at housing wire is, is, is, is really exciting and, and, and means a lot of opportunity for us.
13:16Um, so as you think about powerhouse going forward, what does that powerhouse title mean to you?
13:29Who, who, who are the kinds of powerhouses that you want to have on the show moving forward? And what
13:35do you want to talk about? Okay. So I, I talked to our, our managing editor, uh, editor,
13:41excuse me, uh, Alison LaForgia about this quite a bit. And we, uh, she has brought up that Teddy
13:47Roosevelt, uh, passage where he talks about the man in the arena. And that's a major theme at play here.
13:56Roosevelt wrote that though, kind of with the angle of talking back at critics, right? Like you're on
14:02the outside and you're criticizing the, the man in the arena. That's taking action. That's doing the
14:08things that's taking the lumps. That's, you know, that's, that's bleeding in the sand and, and, and
14:13all of that. And, um, the, the, uh, the concept of the man in the arena with notwithstanding the,
14:20the, the, the critic pushback, I are, I'm really interested in the people that are
14:26engaging and they're innovating in the industry and being able to, to shine a light on those people,
14:36because I think that, well, actually I know that there are, we kind of mentioned this before,
14:40there are lessons to be learned by every innovator and disruptor in the housing industry. Our
14:46industry is notorious for as, for as necessary as it is for all of the sub sections of the industry or
14:54the sub industries that make up the housing industry for them to work together from an operational or
14:59technical standpoint from the real, from, you know, real estate to the mortgage, to the entitled and
15:05servicing the communication, the silo of an, of a, of a through line of an overarching narrative of
15:12we can make this a better industry. And we can make this a better industry by learning what the
15:17people in these, in our specific industries are doing. Right. And so for, you know, thought leadership,
15:23strategy, leadership, the same thing applies for a real estate agent as it does for a loan originator
15:28as it does for someone that works in title. Right. But a, a real estate developer, for example,
15:34that's a full stack real estate developer that is, that is just, I'm going to talk to him soon.
15:40His name is Austin Tunnel, who is designing funding and building these beautiful walkable,
15:47you know, communities. There's a lot that a real estate agent can learn from. There's a lot for the,
15:52that, uh, that someone in the mortgage industry can learn from that because we're all working together,
15:58you know, kind of making this thing like run. But I, and we talked about this before, like you,
16:06um, um, uh, what did you call me? Not, not a creative. You, um, I forget the term that you,
16:11uh, that you, that you called me. Like, I really do believe that the more communication that we have,
16:16and the more that we can learn from people that are pushing the industry forward,
16:19the industry as a whole can move forward and become better. It doesn't need to just sustain and run.
16:24It needs to improve. And there are ways that we can do that because that's tied. I mean, the,
16:30we live in America, like the American culture and the American experience is specifically tied.
16:35It's central to the home, right? And so this industry is tied and pushes forward our culture,
16:44right? And, and the attitudes towards home ownership, they change from one generation to the
16:48other, but talk about stories a lot. It's an evolving story, but we need to be able to keep
16:54up with that story. And we need to, again, make this industry as good as it possibly can be.
17:00And we learn through the people that we are kind of in the trenches with this, you know,
17:05the story changes a little bit from generation to generation, but I don't think the American dream
17:11of home ownership changes. And that to your point is uniquely American, you know, where the home plays
17:20such an important part in our culture, which is, you know, which is generally a very individualistic and
17:28family oriented culture. So yeah, we, we work in a, in a very powerful industry in terms of that American
17:38dream and our, in our American culture. Um, what, what parts of the industry are you
17:47really interested in right now? Um, and what topics do you think, um, leaders aren't paying
17:54enough attention to right now? Actually that one, I don't think that leaders are, I do agree with,
18:01I mean, I agree with what you said, uh, and that, that, that, that home ownership is central to,
18:06from a generation to generation, but I do know, I know that, uh, I feel different about my, me as
18:12a homeowner and the prospect of home ownership, this isn't ideal than my parents do. And my parents
18:18feel very differently than my grandparents who my grandfather got, you know, his home after coming
18:23back from world war II. Like it's a, it's a, it's a, there's a through line, but it, it, those attitudes
18:28change. And we talk a lot about, uh, you know, I listened to, uh, Logan talk about the railing
18:36against the doom porn, right? The doom porn talking heads, because I know that the industry, you know,
18:40we've kind of leveled out could be better, but it's not, you know, it's not what the people that
18:45are racking up views, scaring people to death are experiencing, but we're not, I don't feel like
18:52we're paying attention to the, not just like our generation, but the generation below us, how they
18:57act, how they feel about home ownership, because the reality is this human behavior 101, which is
19:03ties into economics 101. The way that people feel shapes their reality far more than any data point
19:08actually can. And it's, you know, I'm 42 people that are by age are jaded. People that are younger than
19:15me are very, very jaded about home ownership and the prospect of home ownership. And there,
19:20you see this rise in more and more, you know, build to rent communities like that simply because
19:27it's cheaper and are slightly cheaper. They kind of get to buy, they're kind of getting a home,
19:32but not, not really. And, uh, the idea that they'll never own a home. And so that
19:40we're people at home, you know, leadership in, in, in the, in the housing industry, we're partly
19:45responsible for how they feel. The reason that we're responsible for how they feel is because we
19:49haven't educated them. Right. I I'm still, I don't originate anymore, but I still keep my license
19:54and on a regular, I mean like every month, man, I'm, I'm, I'm telling somebody who's called me a
20:00friend of a friend or a friend of a friend that you don't have to put 20% down on a home.
20:04Right. You know what I mean?
20:05That's crazy. Right. And so, so, and I'm thinking, and I'm thinking like, well,
20:10shit, how many people are not calling me because they've just thrown up their hands. Cause they're
20:14never going to save 20%. Right. Right. And this ties in just work that with Kristen miserly on, on,
20:19on the podcast and stuff with the personal me queue and the first, uh, first home buyer education,
20:26but we could do so much more to be, uh, educating people at a, at a, at a leadership level to change
20:34the way that people feel about homeownership because ultimately the way that people feel,
20:38that's what they base their actions upon. Yeah. I mean, there's, there's so many sides
20:43to the affordability issue. Um, you know, on the one hand, it is very true that things are relatively
20:50unaffordable right now, uh, in terms of where home prices have gone and how high mortgage rates are
20:56compared to where they were a couple of years ago. It is also true that, like you said,
21:02a lot of people still think that you need a 20% down payment, um, which those of us in the industry
21:07know that's not true in a lot of cases. That is absolutely not true. Uh, and that's preventing a
21:13lot of people from, from being homeowners. What about you? What do you see? Yeah. I mean, I, I see,
21:18I see it, I see it being, um, uh, a multi-headed problem. Um, and I, I see our industry being in,
21:26you know, really in charge of, uh, of coming up with the solutions, um, solutions on the affordability
21:31side, um, you know, working with policymakers in DC, uh, helping, um, as us as a society, think about
21:40ways to increase supply. Uh, really, I think increasing supply is the only way to, um, to really address the
21:47affordability challenge. Um, the education challenge is fully in our hands. You know,
21:52we, we just need to be better at, at, at education and at educating the educators, right? Like, you
21:58know, making sure that, you know, in the community and in certain organizations, there are people who
22:04are empowered with knowledge to let everyone know, Hey, you, you can, you can get yourself a home.
22:10Um, so, um, yeah, it's, it's a, it's a big problem. It's a multifaceted problem. Um, but it's one that
22:18it's not unsolvable. You know, I think some people throw up their hands, especially with the
22:22affordability issue and just say, Hey, we're never going to, we're never going to tackle that. Um,
22:27but, um, it, it, it can be solved with a concerted effort between industry and government.
22:31Well, I think that's what makes housing water so special. Like, I don't know a better platform or a
22:35better place to responsibly platform the right people and the right voices and guide and guide
22:43that conversation. Yeah. Yeah. I completely agree with you. And I, and I think it's such a great
22:49theme for powerhouse, um, you know, to, to help us move forward on, on the affordability and the
22:57education challenge. Um, all right. So, uh, that's what you're really interested in right now on the flip
23:05side, what do you think feels overhyped or distracting, uh, in, in the current housing
23:13conversation and social, uh, and, uh, online and at events? AI, AI, it's not, uh, AI is overhyped,
23:24not it's like an echo chamber where you have people repeating the same, uh, like thought leadership
23:31phrases or like buzzwords. And there's not real, I don't see forethought in true implementation.
23:39And I actually, I just said something about this the other day on, uh, what maximizing efficiency
23:47really is how the bowl mole effect. And if you, and it happens throughout any industry,
23:53anytime that there is an, and this is a, this is a machine working with a human or this machine,
23:58human relationship, anytime that there is a rise in efficiency in the machine, there's always going
24:02to be something that the human can't do. Right. Which is kind of what we're playing. I mean,
24:07and that's, we're planning for end game. There are no humans at all involved in the workforce
24:10whatsoever in some Elon Musk world. But in the meantime, the, the, the more things that a machine
24:16is able to do, whatever is identifiable that a machine can't do that a human has to do
24:22that becomes infinitely more valuable. Like, so a very, a basic, just a very basic examples. Like you
24:27say the average branch has three processors and AI advances, technology advances, automation advances
24:35to where you're able to replace two process, two processors and just have one, you're not going to
24:40be able to say, pay that process or the exact same amount that you were paying earlier. And no one's
24:46really talking about the, the, the best weatherman is the vaguest weatherman. And so there are a lot
24:57of people that are talking about AI in this industry that are not being specific. They're not being clear.
25:04And it's either because they don't really know because we, because we don't really know. Right. But
25:10at a certain point you have to, especially if you're, if you're a leader, you're a thought leader,
25:13you're in your, you know, you want people to pay attention to what you're saying. You have to provide
25:18people with a re with certain realistic expectations of like, this is what, like the next five years,
25:24you need to start planning from, for this realistically, not vagary, not generally,
25:30realistically. And then you can adjust your, you know, your strategies from there. But people are,
25:37are, are, are hyping buzzwords. It's not that AI itself is overhyped, but people are getting caught
25:43in this echo chamber, just repeating the same phrases that ultimately mean nothing. And I think
25:48that again, I, I received so much feedback from just people in the industry that it, that only lasts
25:56for so long, like buzzwords, they had become, it's like the M dash in chat GPT, right? Like now, if you
26:02heard something on chat GPT and there's an M dash, everybody accuses you of using chat GPT, even if you
26:07didn't. Right. And so it's kind of the same thing with buzzwords around AI, where just people are
26:11kind of like getting the hairs on the neck are starting to. Yeah. The BS, the BS meter
26:17gets triggered for sure. And you know, like any new technology, there's a lot of slide where a lot
26:23of vaporware that, that gets associated with it. I think we are in an, in an AI bubble, but I also
26:29think that AI is going to have a profound and lasting impact on everything housing. You know, I think we're
26:38in this heights of euphoria for, for a little bit longer. I think we will go through a little
26:43bit of the bubble bursting, but we'll come out on the other side and everyone will recognize that
26:48it's, it's a game changing technology. Um, uh, but you're, you're right. There are a lot of,
26:53there's still a lot of hype and buzzwords out there right now. So, um,
26:56Well, can I, can I say something to you? Cause I gotta, you and I've had this conversation a
27:02while back, but like, but you've made this very clear. Cause we, you know, at HousingWire,
27:05we are heavily invested in AI. We have our own internal AI and you have made it like you,
27:12Clayton, how's it? You're doing it right because you're focused on using AI to enhance the team that
27:19you've got to help the team that you've got, not replace the team that you've got. And the, the,
27:24the, the processes and the strategy that's like, that's unfolding is that's, you know, that's,
27:29that's, that's, that is, uh, it's playing out, I guess, in real time where I, there are,
27:35I feel like there are a lot of people that kind of talk that game or being, again, being vague about
27:39it and the, either their team or other people in the industry, kind of like, you don't really,
27:44you know, walking the walk, I guess, let's say. Yeah. I mean, the way I view it is, um,
27:49it will absolutely let you do, um, more with the same team, right? So, uh, I, I, you know,
27:56I anticipate that we will grow significantly in, uh, in 2026 and 2027, just like we did in 2025 and
28:052024 without really growing our team very much, if at all. Um, and, you know, but I really like the
28:12team we've got. We, we're very intentional about our hiring. You know, we try to get the unicorn in
28:17in every role that we fill and, and you've been very familiar with that process and you've gotten
28:21some unicorns yourself, uh, in, in the hiring that you've done. Um, and so I, you know, I don't
28:28want to, I don't want to get rid of those people and replace them with a robot. Uh, but I do want
28:32them to, to collaborate with the robots to, to, to do better stuff. Yeah. I mean, every person we've
28:37got on our team, even down to our video editor has worked in the industry. I mean, our video editor
28:42worked at a mortgage company, our company writer worked at a mortgage company, our managing editor sold,
28:46was a real estate agent, our education, doing our education. She was a real estate agent in New York,
28:51you know? And I think that no matter where you are in our organization, you, you can get empowered,
28:56uh, by, by AI. And that's why we have our own internal tool and platform where people can build
29:03their own assistance and, and, you know, do their jobs more effectively. Um, so that, I mean, that bottom
29:08line that does allow us again to, to grow revenue, uh, without growing the team and therefore increase
29:14profitability, you know, um, uh, at housing where we, we tend to invest a lot, a lot of that
29:20profitability back into growth. Um, and, uh, and, and so it's, it's been a really good story for us
29:26in terms of integrating AI into our organization. Uh, you know, I think it's mixed at other places.
29:32I don't think people necessarily have that same strategic view on, uh, on the technology. Um, so, um,
29:40um, as, as, as we move towards wrapping now that we've, you've told us where, you know, what,
29:46what powerhouse means to you and, and, and where you want to take this show in terms of topic and
29:52coverage, who do you think this show is for in, in the housing industry? Well, I said, obviously I'm
29:59coming at it through the lens of, uh, uh, someone from the mortgage side and, uh, and, and a content
30:05creator and kind of being embedded into housing wire, but this show, in my opinion, this show is
30:11for anyone in the housing industry that wants to do their job better. And they want to apply the,
30:17the insights and the lessons that are, that are, that people in the industry, the people that we're
30:26interviewing, they're talking to that are making a difference in the industry. You can apply those
30:31lessons to wherever you fit in the housing industry and you can be better at your job.
30:36You can be on the inside. Again, that's the thing that kind of keep on, uh, talking about over and
30:41over again, is that there is such a perception felt by most people in the industry that they're
30:45on the outside and they don't really, they're reacting. They're constantly reacting to changing
30:50information. They're constantly reacting to decisions that are being made in rooms that we talked
30:54about, that they feel like that, and they're not a part of, or that they'll never be a part of.
30:58And the reality of the situation is like, we can bring them on the inside and they can know what's
31:03happening ahead of time. They can be able to plan for that ahead of time. And so if you're a
31:10professional in the housing industry and you want to be on the inside, you will be.
31:15I'm, uh, I I've really enjoyed my time, uh, as a, as primary host, uh, of powerhouse. I'm not going
31:25anywhere. There's still be some episodes that I will, that I will come in and guest host. Uh,
31:30you know, I'm a little bit sad to, to be letting go that, that role as primary host. I've, I've really
31:36enjoyed it, but I'm also really excited. You know, you're a content guy through and through,
31:42you're a creative guy through and through, uh, and you have some real themes that you're thinking
31:48about, some real important themes, uh, for this show. And I think the show and the audience will
31:55really benefit from that, um, uh, from, from you being primary host. So, uh, I, I love passing the
32:02torch, uh, to you, uh, for this show. And it was great catching up with you today, Seb.
32:09Yeah, I really appreciate it. And, uh, please, please come back and, uh, and host on the regular.
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