At a tense September 17, 2025 Congressional hearing, Kash Patel faced sharp questioning from Jamie Raskin over his shifting position on the Jeffrey Epstein files and the alleged “hidden” black book. Raskin replayed Patel’s earlier public demands for full disclosure of Epstein’s co-conspirators and accusations that federal agencies were suppressing key names. Patel pushed back, saying his remarks had been mischaracterized, but lawmakers continued pressing him on why critical details of the Epstein network remain sealed years after Epstein’s death, reigniting bipartisan frustration over transparency and accountability.
#KashPatelEpstein #EpsteinFiles #KashPatelTestimony #EpsteinTrump #TrumpEpsteinFiles #EpsteinEmails #TrumpEpsteinProbe #KashPatelTruthFiles #EpsteinCase #TrumpEpsteinPhotos #EpsteinLeaks #KashPatelSpeaks #TrumpEpsteinList #EpsteinConnections #KashPatelVideo
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#KashPatelEpstein #EpsteinFiles #KashPatelTestimony #EpsteinTrump #TrumpEpsteinFiles #EpsteinEmails #TrumpEpsteinProbe #KashPatelTruthFiles #EpsteinCase #TrumpEpsteinPhotos #EpsteinLeaks #KashPatelSpeaks #TrumpEpsteinList #EpsteinConnections #KashPatelVideo
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00:00Christmas ornaments, drywall and Jerry Epstein. Name three things that don't hang
00:07themselves. That's what the American people think. That's what the American
00:13people think. And they deserve some answers. And I know that you're not in
00:20charge of these investigations. Yes sir. But you talk to the people who are. And I
00:27need you to take a very respectful message today. Tell the American people
00:37what happened. And don't rush it so that they don't do a thorough investigation.
00:43But you and I both know they can make this a top priority and get it done more
00:50quickly than they normally would. As I indicated in my opening statement I
00:54wanted to talk about the death of Mr. Epstein. Do you concur with the opinion
01:01that it was a suicide? That was the finding of the coroner sir. Okay do you
01:06have any evidence suggest otherwise? I do not. How could this have happened?
01:10Unfortunately sir this thing is this the death and the whole situation is still
01:15under the investigation of the FBI and the inspector general's office. And I'm
01:19really not at liberty to discuss specifics of this case. I can discuss
01:23issues around institutional operations but I can't specifically talk about that
01:28particular issue. Okay. Well the case this high profile there's got to be
01:35their major malfunction of the system or criminal enterprise at foot to allow
01:40this to happen. So are you looking at both? Is the FBI looking at both? If the FBI is
01:46involved then they are looking at criminal enterprise yes. Do we have people in in
01:51custody today of this high-profile nature? Have we done anything to adjust since
01:56Mr. Epstein's death? Sir we take every inmate's life very seriously in the Bureau
02:01of Prisons. A high-profile inmate is no more important or significant in terms of
02:06our operations than just the average inmate that comes our way. I mean high profile
02:09somebody's on a suicide watch. I would like to explain our suicide watch system if I
02:14may. I can't talk specifically about Epstein but we have different tiers of
02:18response if we identify an inmate who appears to be having suicidal thinking.
02:22And I came into the Bureau as a psychologist. I worked with lots of
02:25suicidal inmates. I was warden in our psychiatric facility in Butner and I
02:28know how difficult it is to always be able to predict who's suicidal and who is
02:31not. But once an inmate is identified as potentially suicidal we have a
02:35suicide watch operation that we can place them in. It's a very stark very
02:39difficult setting where everything is stripped from the room except a
02:42mattress. They get a coarse gown like to wear that cannot be twisted in any way
02:47that they could hang themselves from it. They have one mattress and one blanket and
02:51they are watched constantly. There's nothing else in that room. Is Mr. Epstein on
02:54suicide watch? Yes he watched. However the average time on suicide watch is only
02:59about 24 hours because it is such a stark and actually depressing situation. We
03:03then can move them to another tier of observation which is called
03:06psychological observation. Did that happen in this case? I can't speak
03:10specifically but I am sharing this with you so that you understand our
03:13procedure sir. They then can move to another tier which is suicide or
03:17psychological observation where they get their clothes back. They're in a more
03:21normalized setting. They are watched and scrutinized every moment of the day but
03:25that is a much more normal environment. Do they have roommates?
03:29Do they have roommates? No they do not when they're on psychological observation
03:33because they're being watched continuously. Did Mr. Epstein have a roommate when he
03:36allegedly committed suicide? No he did not. Okay. Go ahead. They move into
03:42psychological observation. Psychologists see them routinely, interview them
03:46repeatedly and once it's determined that the threat of suicide seems to have
03:52passed then that inmate can be returned back to open population. Well clearly it
03:58didn't work here so we await the report because all the victims of Mr. Epstein
04:04have to have their heart ripped out. I still never see justice. Dr. Sawyer can you
04:11think of any other incidents in the history of the BOP that have caused as much
04:15crisis for public trust for your institution as Epstein's death? I can only speak for the
04:21the BOP since 1976 when I joined the Bureau. I don't know prior to that but I
04:25would say it's probably gotten the most public attention. There are lots of
04:28taxpayers and citizens who've never thought about the BOP and you have lots
04:32of good patriotic hard-working folks there. I get that. But in terms of a
04:36crisis of public trust in general but also in terms of your workforce this death
04:40happened in the middle of August, early August. It's Thanksgiving and you're here to
04:45testify today and you say you're not allowed to speak about this incident. I think
04:48that's crazy. Can you distinguish among types of investigations at least for us?
04:53Because I'm aware of at least three Epstein investigations. You've got a whole
04:56bunch of women who were raped by this guy. This is a sex trafficking ring in the
05:00United States. This guy had evidence. He's got co-conspirators and there are
05:05victims out there who want to know where the evidence has gone. Can you tell us a
05:10little bit more about the different investigations? I understand there's at
05:12least one that you're directed by Maine Justice not to speak about but there are at
05:16least three investigations. Can you unpack them please? There are there are two
05:20investigations that are ongoing. One is the FBI's investigation and the other is
05:24the inspector general's investigation. Both inside BOP but there's a third one
05:27outside which is why Epstein was in your institution to begin with. Yeah and that
05:31sir is completely out of my... I get that. There's there's a lot here where DOJ has
05:36failed. There's a lot here that BOP has failed. Let's just be clear so we have a level
05:39set for everybody in this room. You're in your job because of this crisis, right? You come here today and you say
05:45you can't testify about it but the reason your director now is because the last guy
05:49got fired, right? Senator I can't tell you what I don't know. I have received no
05:53information from the FBI investigation yet nor no information from the
05:57inspector general. Once those entities go into one of our facilities we are
06:00forbidden from talking to anybody in the institution. We can send in a team and
06:05look at wherever there might have been a security flaw or something but we are
06:08not allowed to talk to anybody in our institutions about anything that happened
06:12over the episode. With all due respect you still have an obligation to speak to
06:16the girls who were raped by this guy today. You may not have to speak about
06:20every particular of the guards that were arrested last night but the fact that
06:24there is an ongoing attempt by the United States government to find out if
06:28there's still any evidence about the co-conspirators you do have an obligation
06:31to speak to those girls who were raped today. You may not speak about the
06:35specifics of the charges against those two guards this morning who were
06:40taken into custody but more broadly you should be able to unpack have we
06:44changed any processes about how cases like this are handled. It's been more
06:48than 90 days and you said I think your quote was we treat every inmate the same. We
06:54believe in America that every individual has equal dignity but not every
06:58inmate has equal value for future criminal investigations. Jeffrey Epstein was
07:03still to testify in a case. Somebody who's already been convicted who may be on
07:07suicide watch. There are lots of good reasons to not want that guy to be able
07:10to kill himself. This is different because it isn't just about the
07:14individual inmate who might kill themselves. It's about the fact that that
07:17bastard wasn't able to testify against his other co-conspirators. So it is wrong as a
07:23management matter for you to say we treat everybody the same. We should be
07:27treating people who are yet to testify against other felons, against other
07:31rapists. They have a lot more priority for your institution, don't they? Senator Oliver,
07:36pretty much all of our inmates that are any of our jail facilities are
07:40pretrial. They're still yet to testify, to be involved, to share information on
07:44other cases. I don't know what evidence you're asking of me. If you're saying was
07:47there any evidence in his room in his possession at the time, that was all
07:50confiscated by the FBI. In his brain and in the cameras and in the tapes that the
07:54American public well understands appear to not be urgent enough for the
07:58Department of Justice. No, it's very urgent for the Department of Justice and it's
08:02all been confiscated by the FBI and it's all part of their
08:05investigation. That's why none of that is shared with the Director of the Bureau of
08:08Prisons or anyone in the Bureau until the investigations are completed. Once
08:12those are completed, I'd be very happy to come up here and talk with any one of
08:15you that want to hear everything about we glean from those investigations. But
08:19until I have that information, there's nothing I can tell you. If I don't have the
08:22information, I cannot share anything with you. Then how widespread is the
08:26problem of sleeping on the job? There are lots of people in the public who think
08:30this seems a very convenient excuse. And so tell us, is it a systemic problem? Do
08:35we have a lot of people who sleep on the job when they're supposed to be
08:38guarding federal inmates? We have a few, sir, and we have been monitoring the
08:41cameras that are existing in every one of our institutions to determine how well
08:45and how effectively our inmates are, I mean our staff members, are doing their
08:49rounds and counts in the institutions. We have found a couple of other
08:52instances and we have immediately referred those to the Inspector General's
08:55Office, and I'm encouraging that if people just chose not to do their job,
09:00we're hoping the US Attorney's Office will pick up those cases and prosecute
09:04them for us, because we don't want those people in the Bureau of Prisons. They are
09:07dangerous to everybody, the inmates and the staff, and so we are zealously going
09:12about trying to determine which of our employees are good employees and who do
09:16their job, and that is the vast majority of the prison staff. But we do have some, I
09:20know, out there who obviously choose not to follow policy, choose not to do their
09:26job, and we want them gone. I do not want them in our institutions, and I am
09:30exploring those very, very carefully to identify them and get them out of our
09:34system. Now, if it's a training problem and they didn't know what they were
09:36supposed to do, that's our problem. That's management's problem. We have to do a
09:40better job training our staff. But if someone is well-trained, well-experienced,
09:44and chooses not to do their job, we want them gone. I assure you of that.
09:48I'm at time, so I'll just give you a preview of something I'm going to ask you
09:52for the record after the event. You made a really important statement about drone
09:55drops of different kinds of contraband into your institutions. That's obviously a
10:00new and hard problem. That's a problem against which we have to play defense, but
10:04there's also new opportunities for offense. And so what's your long-term
10:07strategy is inside the institution about cameras is something that I think a lot of
10:11us would like to hear more, and I'll send you a letter with some questions.
10:13Okay, very good. Thank you. Because Epstein's hallway should have still been monitored by
10:16cameras, even if his guards were asleep, and we don't have information about
10:20whether or not there were adequate cameras there. And so I think a lot of us
10:23would like to understand where technology dollars are going. Thank you,
10:26Dr. Schwerer. Thank you, Senator. Senator Blumenthal's next, but just follow up on this.
10:29Will there be an IG report regarding what happened? There should be. Usually after
10:34the Inspector General's Office investigates, they do come out with a report. If
10:37people are pending criminal charges, we're not going to interfere in their cases. But
10:40there's an IG report, I promise you we'll get fully briefed by the committee here.
10:45How can I put this? Christmas ornaments, drywall, and Jerry Epstein. Name three things that don't
10:59hang themselves. That's what the American people think. That's what the American people think. And
11:07they deserve some answers. And I know that you're not in charge of these
11:13investigations. Yes, sir. But you talk to the people who are. And I need you to take a very
11:20respectful message today. Tell the American people what happened. And don't rush it so that they don't do a
11:35thorough investigation. But you and I both know they can make this a top priority and get it done
11:42more quickly than they normally would. As I indicated in my opening statement, I wanted to
11:47talk about the death of Mr. Epstein. Do you concur with the opinion that it was a suicide?
11:55That was the finding of the coroner, sir. Okay. Do you have any evidence to suggest otherwise? I do not.
12:01How could this have happened? Unfortunately, sir, the death and the whole situation is still under the
12:08investigation of the FBI and the Inspector General's Office. And I'm really not at liberty to discuss
12:14specifics of this case. I can discuss issues around institutional operations. But I can't
12:19specifically talk about that particular issue. Okay. Well, the case this high profile,
12:25there's got to be either major malfunction of the system or criminal enterprise at foot
12:32to allow this to happen. So are you looking at both? Is the FBI looking at both? If the FBI is involved,
12:39then they are looking at criminal enterprise, yes. Do we have people in custody today of this
12:45high profile nature? Have we done anything to adjust since Mr. Epstein's death? Sir, we take every
12:51inmate's life very seriously in the Bureau of Prisons. A high profile inmate is no more important
12:56or significant in terms of our operations than just the average inmate that comes our way.
13:01What do I mean high profile? Somebody's on a suicide watch.
13:04I would like to explain our suicide watch system, if I may. I can't talk specifically about Epstein,
13:09but we have different tiers of response if we identify an inmate who appears to have suicidal
13:14thinking. And I came into the Bureau as a psychologist. I worked with lots of suicidal inmates. I was
13:18warden at our psychiatric facility in Butner, and I know how difficult it is to always be able to
13:22predict who is suicidal and who is not. But once an inmate is identified as potentially suicidal,
13:27we have a suicide watch operation that we can place them in. It's a very stark, very difficult
13:32setting where everything is stripped from the room except a mattress. They get a coarse gown like to
13:37wear that cannot be twisted in any way that they could hang themselves from it. They have one mattress
13:42and one blanket, and they are watched constantly. There's nothing else in that room.
13:46Mr. Epstein on suicide watch? Yes, he watched. However, the average time on suicide watch is
13:51only about 24 hours because it is such a stark and actually depressing situation. We then can move
13:57them to another tier of observation, which is called psychological observation. Did that happen
14:01in this case? I can't speak specifically, but I am sharing this with you so that you understand our
14:05procedure, sir. They then can move to another tier, which is psychological observation, where they get
14:12their clothes back. They are in a more normalized setting. They are watched and scrutinized every
14:16moment of the day, but that is a much more normal environment that is . . . Do they have roommates?
14:20And once . . . . I'm sorry, sir? Do they have roommates? No, they do not when they are on
14:24psychological observation because they are being watched continuously. Did Mr. Epstein have a roommate
14:28when he allegedly committed suicide? No, he did not. Okay. Go ahead.
14:33The move into psychological observation. Psychologists see them routinely, interview them repeatedly,
14:39and once it's determined that the threat of suicide seems to have passed, then that inmate can be
14:46returned back to open population. Well, clearly it didn't work here, so we'll wait the report because
14:54all the victims of Mr. Epstein have to have their heart ripped out. I still never see justice.
15:00Dr. Sawyer, can you think of any other incidents in the history of the BOP that have caused as much
15:08crisis for public trust for your institution as Epstein's death? I can only speak since 1976 when
15:15I joined the Bureau. I don't know prior to that, but I would say it's probably gotten the most public
15:19attention. There are lots of taxpayers and citizens who have never thought about the BOP, and you have
15:24lots of good patriotic, hard-working folks there. I get that. But in terms of a crisis of public trust,
15:29in general, but also in terms of your workforce, this death happened in the middle of August,
15:34early August. It's Thanksgiving, and you're here to testify today, and you say you're not allowed to
15:39speak about this incident. I think that's crazy. Can you distinguish among types of investigations,
15:45at least for us? Because I'm aware of at least three Epstein investigations. You get a whole bunch
15:49of women who were raped by this guy. This is a sex trafficking ring in the United States. This guy had
15:55evidence. He's got co-conspirators, and there are victims out there who want to know where the
16:00evidence has gone. Can you tell us a little bit more about the different investigations? I understand
16:05there's at least one that you're directed by Maine Justice not to speak about, but there are at least
16:09three investigations. Can you unpack them, please? There are two investigations that are ongoing.
16:14One is the FBI's investigation, and the other is the Inspector General's investigation. Both inside BOP,
16:19but there's a third one outside, which is why Epstein was in your institution to begin with. Yeah, and that,
16:23sir, is completely out of my... I get that. There's a lot here where DOJ has failed. There's a lot here
16:29that BOP has failed. Let's just be clear, so we have a level set for everybody in this room. You're in your
16:34job because of this crisis, right? You come here today, and you say you can't testify about it, but the
16:39reason you're director now is because the last guy got fired, right? Senator, I can't tell you what I don't
16:44know. I have received no information from the FBI investigation yet, nor no information from the
16:49Inspector General. Once those entities go into one of our facilities, we are forbidden from talking to
16:54anybody in the institution. We can send in a team and look at wherever there might have been a security
16:59flaw or something, but we are not allowed to talk to anybody in our institutions about anything that
17:04happened over the episode. With all due respect, you still have an obligation to speak to the girls who
17:09were raped by this guy today. You may not have to speak about every particular of the guards,
17:14that were arrested last night, but the fact that there is an ongoing attempt by the United
17:18States government to find out if there's still any evidence about the co-conspirators,
17:23you do have an obligation to speak to those girls who were raped today.
17:26You may not speak about the specifics of the charges against those two guards
17:32this morning who were taken into custody, but more broadly, you should be able to unpack,
17:36have we changed any processes about how cases like this are handled? It's been more than 90 days,
17:42and you said, I think your quote was, we treat every inmate the same. We believe in America that
17:47every individual has equal dignity, but not every inmate has equal value for future criminal
17:53investigations. Jeffrey Epstein was still to testify in a case. Somebody who's already been convicted,
17:59who may be on suicide watch, there are lots of good reasons to not want that guy to be able to kill
18:03himself. This is different, because it isn't just about the individual inmate who might kill themselves,
18:09it's about the fact that that bastard wasn't able to testify against his other co-conspirators.
18:14So it is wrong as a management matter for you to say we treat everybody the same. We should be
18:20treating people who are yet to testify against other felons, against other rapists. They have a lot more
18:25priority for your institution, don't they? Senator, all of our, pretty much all of our inmates that are
18:30in any of our jail facilities are pretrial. They're still yet to testify, to be involved, to share information
18:36on other cases. I don't know what evidence you're asking of me. If you're saying was there any
18:40evidence in his room, in his possession at the time, that was all confiscated by the FBI.
18:44In his brain, and in the cameras, and in the tapes, that the American public well understands
18:49appear to not be urgent enough for the Department of Justice.
18:52No, it's very urgent for the Department of Justice, and it's all been confiscated by the FBI,
18:56and it's all part of their investigation. That's why none of that is shared with the director of the
19:00Bureau of Prisons, or anyone in the Bureau, until the investigations are completed. Once those are
19:05completed, I'd be very happy to come up here and talk with any one of you that want to hear
19:09everything about we glean from those investigations, but until I have that information, there's nothing
19:14I can tell you. If I don't have the information, I cannot share anything with you. Then how widespread
19:19is the problem of sleeping on the job? There are lots of people in the public who think this seems a
19:23very convenient excuse, and so tell us, is it a systemic problem? Do we have a lot of people who sleep
19:29on the job when they're supposed to be guarding federal inmates? We have a few, sir, and we have been
19:33monitoring the cameras that are existing in every one of our institutions to determine how well and
19:38how effectively our inmates are, I mean our staff members, are doing their rounds and counts in the
19:42institutions. We have found a couple of other instances, and we have immediately referred those
19:47to the Inspector General's Office, and I'm encouraging that if people just chose not to do their job,
19:53we're hoping the U.S. Attorney's Office will pick up those cases and prosecute them for us,
19:57because we don't want those people in the Bureau of Prisons. They are dangerous to everybody,
20:01the inmates and the staff, and so we are zealously going about trying to determine which of our
20:07employees are good employees and who do their job, and that is the vast majority of the prison staff,
20:12but we do have some I know out there who obviously choose not to follow policy, choose not to do their
20:18job, and we want them gone. I do not want them in our institutions, and I am exploring those very,
20:23very carefully to identify them and get them out of our system. Now, if it's a training problem
20:28and they didn't know what they were supposed to do, that's our problem. That's management's problem.
20:32We have to do a better job training our staff, but if someone is well-trained, well-experienced,
20:36and chooses not to do their job, we want them gone. I assure you of that.
20:41I'm at time, so I'll just give you a preview of something I'm going to ask you for the record after
20:45the event. You made a really important statement about drone drops of different kinds of contraband
20:50into your institutions. That's obviously a new and hard problem. That's a problem against which we have
20:55to play defense, but there's also new opportunities for offense, and so what's your long-term strategy
21:00is inside the institution about cameras is something that I think a lot of us would like to hear more,
21:04and I'll send you a letter with some questions, because Epstein's hallway should have still been
21:08monitored by cameras even if his guards were asleep, and we don't have information about whether or not
21:13there were adequate cameras there, and so I think a lot of us would like to understand where technology
21:17dollars are going. Absolutely. Thank you, Dr. Schwer. Thank you, Senator.
21:20Senator Blumenthal is next, but just follow up on this. Will there be an IG report regarding what happened?
21:25There should be. Usually after the inspector general's office investigates, they do come out
21:29with a report. If people are pending criminal charges, we're not going to interfere in their
21:32cases, but if there's an IG report, I promise you we'll get fully briefed by the committee here.
21:42How can I put this? Christmas ornaments, drywall, and Jerry Epstein.
21:48Name three things that don't hang themselves. That's what the American people think.
21:57That's what the American people think. And they deserve some answers. And I know that you're not
22:05in charge of these investigations. Yes, sir. But you talk to the people who are.
22:10And I need you to take a very respectful message today.
22:21Tell the American people what happened. And don't rush it so that they don't do a thorough investigation.
22:29But you and I both know they can make this a top priority and get it done
22:34more quickly than they normally would. Why have you not met with them?
22:38You said you haven't met with them. Have you met with them? I'll give you one more chance.
22:42You said you were not met. My job as the FBI director is to invite all investigative leads.
22:47Is the answer yes or no to whether or not you met with these women who were sexually abused and raped?
22:52You appeared to say that the survivors were not credible.
22:58I think what happened, Mr. Patel, is that suddenly you discovered that Donald Trump's name was all over
23:05these files. And you started a giant cover-up. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Patel, before you
23:13joined the FBI, you had very strong opinions about what the FBI was hiding regarding Jeffrey Epstein.
23:19In a September 2023 interview with Glenn Beck, you said, the Black Book is under the, quote,
23:24direct control of the director of the FBI. In December 2023, you said, let us know who the
23:30pedophiles are. Even for a short time after becoming FBI director, in February of 2025, you tweeted,
23:36quote, there will be no cover-ups, no missing documents, no stone left unturned. In June,
23:42you told Joe Rogan, quote, we've reviewed all the information. We're going to give you every single
23:47thing we have and can. But then suddenly in July, everything changed. You and Attorney General Pam
23:54Bondi released one video and said that there was nothing more to see. Your July memo says you
24:02uncovered more than 300 gigabytes of data and physical evidence, but that you had decided no further
24:10disclosure would be appropriate or warranted. That is a quote. I think what happened, Mr. Patel,
24:16is that suddenly you discovered that Donald Trump's name was all over these files and you started a
24:23giant cover-up. So you are under oath, Mr. Patel. You just testified to Mr. Swalwell that you did not
24:32speak to the president about the Epstein files. To your knowledge, did Attorney General Pam Bondi speak
24:39to the president about what was in the Epstein files? I can't speak for Attorney General Pam Bondi.
24:45So to your knowledge, you don't have any information. The question was, do you have any
24:50knowledge? Do you have any knowledge? I can't speak. You are refusing to answer the question.
24:54So let me tell you that the Wall Street Journal reported that in May, Bondi told Trump that he was
25:01in the Epstein files and at the same meeting said that the DOJ did not plan to release the files.
25:08Yesterday, you testified to Senator Kennedy that there was, quote, no credible information that
25:14Epstein trafficked girls to anyone else, and that you have, quote, continuously and publicly
25:19asked the public to come forward with more information and will look into it. Today,
25:25in response to Mr. Massey's question, you appear to say that the survivors were not credible. These
25:34are survivors. That's not at all what I said. Okay, great. I'm going to ask you this in a second,
25:39but let me tell you about the survivors and let's bring them up here into the room. These are women
25:45who came to the Hill and testified that they were groomed and raped at the age of 14 and 16 years old,
25:53and they called to meet with the president and to meet with the FBI and to have people investigate
26:00their claims. Some of them have never testified before. If you are so interested in getting the
26:05public to submit any information, why have you not met with them? You said you haven't met with
26:10them. Have you met with them? I'll give you one more chance. My job as the FBI director is to
26:15invite all investigative elites. Is the answer yes or no to whether or not you met with these
26:20women who were sexually abused and raped? Any insinuation by you or any people on your side
26:27that I am not manhunting child predators and sex traffickers, just look at the stats. Mr. Patel,
26:32and you talk about cover-ups, man. Mr. Chairman, this is my time, and I will take as much time as I
26:38want. Where were you during the Obama and Biden administrations when these so-called cover-ups were
26:43going on? Why did anyone in those administrations talk to any of these purported witnesses?
26:48Mr. Chairman, let's get some regular order, man. Every single person to provide credible
26:51information. Time belongs to the gentlelady from Washington. And I'm going to take another
26:55couple of minutes. When you accuse the witness of something,
26:57he's allowed to respond. That's how it works. Listen, he didn't even, excuse me, Mr. Chairman,
27:01you have always been fair, but this is not fair. No, this is my time, and he said that the
27:08witnesses were not credible. Seconds of time. I'm going to get an additional minute of time,
27:13because that's how much time he took. You won't get a minute, you'll get some seconds,
27:16what we think is under five minutes. You don't get to demand how much time you get. That's not how it
27:21works. Mr. Patel, are the victims of the Jeffrey Epstein horrific trafficking ring? Are they credible?
27:31Any person with information about ongoing sexual trafficking? I'm asking you if they're credible.
27:38Ma'am, I'm commenting on the evidence we have. We have routinely asked for people to come forward
27:44with more evidence, and we will look at it. And the evidence that we have was the same evidence that
27:48the Biden and Obama justice departments had. And they determined, not me, they determined that that
27:54information was not credible. Mr. Chairman, he's not letting me even ask my questions.
27:57You ask the questions, he gives an answer. You may not like what he says, but that doesn't mean
28:01you're going to interrupt him. Mr. Chairman, could we restore the
28:04gentlelady 45 seconds so she can complete her question? We will give her additional 30 seconds,
28:08which is what I said earlier. I'm going to keep taking my time.
28:10No, you'll take the time that you get. You are not answering the question. The question is,
28:16I have. You just don't like the answer. Are these women credible? It's a yes or no answer.
28:21I have answered the question. Well, what is the answer? I keep telling you,
28:24I'm the only FBI director that has welcomed new information in this case. This administration
28:29is the only one that has welcomed any new information in this case. Is there a yes or
28:33no to whether the victims are credible? Present new information. Are the victims credible or not?
28:41I'll tell you what happened in the last Trump administration. Are they credible or not? You
28:44can't even say. Victims credibly came forward. And you know what happened? President Trump
28:48authorized the indictments of Jeffrey Epstein. President Trump called them a hoax. Not Biden,
28:52not Obama. President Trump called them a hoax. No one else.
28:54The entire thing a democratic hoax. So I would like to ask you if you will meet.
28:59The gentlelady's time has expired. I gave her the additional 45 seconds she requested. The
29:04gentlelady yields back. The gentleman from New Jersey is recognized for his five minutes.
29:08If you would meet with the women who were sexually abused and raped and groomed at the ages of 14
29:16and 16 years old. Are you going to cover up? Are you going to continue to cover up for the rich
29:23and powerful men, including those that might be on this committee? Or are you going to allow them to
29:31testify? Are you going to allow them to testify, Mr. Patel? Will you allow them to testify to you,
29:40Mr. Patel? Mr. Patel. Born in his director more than 200 days ago. Now the black book is under your
29:47direct control. So why haven't you released the names of Epstein's co-conspirators in the rape and
29:53sex trafficking of young women and girls? We have released more material than anyone else before.
29:58The Biden administration, Obama administration had the exact opportunities to release this material,
30:02and they never did. And if you are selling the men and women of the FBI, we're not going after
30:05child predators. Hang on. You said, we're not going after child predators. 1500 child predators
30:10arrested this year. 35% increase. 4,700 child victims. Mr. Chairman, I'm going to reclaim my time if
30:16you can instruct the word. And let me make something crystal clear. I never said Jeffrey Epstein didn't
30:19traffic other people, other women, and they're not other victims. This is the investigation we were given
30:25from 2006, 7, and 8, and the search warrants from 2006, 7, and 8. Everything the court has allowed us
30:31to release. Which court are you talking about? Three separate federal courts have come in and said.
30:35We're talking about the evidence you've got. It's got nothing to do with what those courts have.
30:39Do you have any idea how the law works? Director Patel, before you joined the FBI,
30:43you railed against it for covering up Jeffrey Epstein's human trafficking ring. Let me refresh your
30:48memory with this clip. So you finished that December 2023 interview with a challenge to the FBI and harsh
30:55words for Republicans in Congress for not getting the Epstein files out to the public.
31:01Put on your big boy pants and let us know who the pedophiles are, you said. You emphasized that the
31:06president and the FBI director each had complete authority to release Epstein's client list. You said
31:12Epstein's black book is under the quote, direct control of the director of the FBI. Look at this clip.
31:17All right. So you were sworn in as director more than 200 days ago. Now the black book is under your
31:23direct control. So why haven't you released the names of Epstein's co-conspirators in the rape
31:28and sex trafficking of young women and girls? The Rolodex, which is what everybody colloquially
31:36refers to as the black book, has been released. Oh, no, you're talking about what the journalist got
31:41five years ago? No, that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about what you were talking about
31:45there. The black book under the direct control of the FBI director. We have released more material
31:50than anyone else before. The Biden administration, Obama administration had the exact opportunities to
31:54release this material, and they never did. And if you are selling the men and women of the FBI,
31:58we're not going after child predators. Hang on. You said, we're not going after child predators.
32:021,500 child predators arrested this year. 35 percent increase.
32:064,700 child victims now. Mr. Chairman, I'm going to reclaim my time,
32:09if you could instruct the witness. Why have you changed your position? There,
32:13you were saying it's under the direct control of the FBI director and all of it should be released.
32:19Why have you changed your position? Everything that has been lawfully
32:22permitted to be released has been released. And as I told you, the investigation was limited. And let me
32:28make something crystal clear. I never said Jeffrey Epstein didn't traffic other people,
32:32other women, and they're not other victims. This is the investigation we were given from 2006,
32:377 and 8, and the search warrant from 2006, 7 and 8. That's what we're working with.
32:41Wait, have you released all of the stuff that the FBI has seized from Epstein's house?
32:47The computers, the emails, the file cabinets, the documents? What about the financial records?
32:52Have you released all of that? Everything the court has allowed us to release.
32:55Which court are you talking about? Three separate federal courts have come in and said.
32:59We're talking about the evidence you've got. It's got nothing to do with what those courts have.
33:03Do you have any idea how the law works? Do you want me to break the law in a federal judge's order?
33:08No, I want you to follow your own word, Director Patel. You said up there,
33:12it was under the direct control of the FBI director. He had the black book.
33:16And everything I have direct control over, we have gone to court. You haven't.
33:20Complete your sentence. Everything you have direct control over, you said.
33:23Everything you have direct control over, I. And then you stop that sentence.
33:39You've released everything that you have direct control over?
33:41I have direct control over and can lawfully release. If you're not familiar with the court orders,
33:46that's not my fault. I'm perfectly familiar with them. How did we prosecute Ghislaine Maxwell?
33:55She was prosecuted with the investigatory material that was collected from 2001 and 2005. Because of
34:02the non-prosecution agreements and the court orders on the investigations and search warrants,
34:07we were not able to develop new information. And oh, by the way, Jeffrey Epstein was out for 12 years,
34:13and the Obama and Biden administration did nothing to look at his work, his pedophile network.
34:17If you want to blame me, that's fine. But now you're blaming the men and women who conducted this
34:21great search- No, stop that. I'm not blaming anybody other than you. You're not keeping your word.
34:25You said that you would release all of the materials under your direct control.
34:27Has anyone released more information on Epstein than I have? Has anyone?
34:30Look, much more- Did Comey, did Ray.
34:32Did they?
34:33Excuse me. Much more has come out in the days since the American people in Congress have been demanding it,
34:39but it's coming out in dribs and drabs. Why don't you just release the entire file,
34:43as you promised to do?
34:44I literally just told you, there are multiple federal court orders. I'm not going to break the
34:49law to satisfy your curiosity. You didn't join us when we filed court to release the court orders.
34:55You could have. You have lawyers. You could have shown up. You didn't do that.
34:59That's a tiny fraction of the material we're talking about.
35:01That is not.
35:01How do you know that? Have you seen everything?
35:04It's all misdirection.
35:05Time of the gentleman has expired.
35:06Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Patel, before you joined the FBI,
35:10you had very strong opinions about what the FBI was hiding regarding Jeffrey Epstein.
35:15In a September 2023 interview with Glenn Beck, you said,
35:18the Black Book is under the, quote, direct control of the director of the FBI.
35:23In December 2023, you said, let us know who the pedophiles are.
35:27Even for a short time after becoming FBI director, in February of 2025, you tweeted, quote,
35:33there will be no cover-ups, no missing documents, no stone left unturned.
35:38In June, you told Joe Rogan, quote, we've reviewed all the information.
35:42We're going to give you every single thing we have and can.
35:45But then suddenly in July, everything changed.
35:49You and Attorney General Pam Bondi released one video and said that there was nothing more to see.
35:55Your July memo says you uncovered more than 300 gigabytes of data and physical evidence,
36:04but that you had decided no further disclosure would be appropriate or warranted. That is a quote.
36:10I think what happened, Mr. Patel, is that suddenly you discovered that Donald Trump's
36:16name was all over these files and you started a giant cover-up. So you are under oath, Mr. Patel.
36:24You just testified to Mr. Swalwell that you did not speak to the president about the Epstein files.
36:31To your knowledge, did Attorney General Pam Bondi speak to the president about what was in the Epstein
36:38files? I can't speak for Attorney General Pam Bondi. So to your knowledge, you don't have any
36:44information. The question was, do you have any knowledge? Do you have any knowledge? I can't speak.
36:49You are refusing to answer the question. So let me tell you that the Wall Street Journal reported
36:54that in May, Bondi told Trump that he was in the Epstein files and at the same meeting
37:01said that the DOJ did not plan to release the files. Yesterday, you testified to Senator Kennedy
37:08that there was, quote, no credible information that Epstein trafficked girls to anyone else and that
37:13you have, quote, continuously and publicly asked the public to come forward with more information
37:19and we'll look into it. Today, in response to Mr. Massey's question, you appear to say
37:26that the survivors were not credible. These are survivors. That's not at all what I said. Okay,
37:33great. I'm going to ask you this in a second, but let me tell you about the survivors and let's bring them
37:38up here into the room. These are women who came to the Hill and testified that they were groomed and raped
37:46at the age of 14 and 16 years old and they called to meet with the president and to meet with the FBI
37:54and to have people investigate their claims. Some of them have never testified before. If you are so
38:00interested in getting the public to submit any information, why have you not met with them?
38:05You said you haven't met with them. Have you met with them? I'll give you one more chance.
38:09My job as the FBI director is to is the answer yes or no to whether or not you met with these
38:16women who were sexually abused and raped. Any insinuation by you or any people on your side
38:24that I am not manhunting child predators and sex traffickers, just look at the stats and you talk
38:29about cover-ups, man. You talk about cover-ups. Where were you during the Obama and Biden
38:36administrations when these so-called cover-ups were going on? Why did anyone in those administrations
38:42talk to any of these purported witnesses? I had some regular order. Every single person to provide
38:47credible information. Time belongs to the gentlelady from Washington. When you accuse the witness of
38:53something, he's allowed to respond. That's how it works. Listen, he didn't even... Excuse me,
38:57Mr. Chairman, you have always been fair, but this is not fair. No, this is my time,
39:03and he said that the witnesses were not credible. Seconds of time. I'm going to get an additional
39:09minute of time because that's how much time he took. You won't get a minute. You'll get some seconds.
39:13What we think is under five minutes. You don't get to demand how much time you get. That's not how it works.
39:18Mr. Patel, are the victims of the Jeffrey Epstein horrific trafficking ring? Are they credible?
39:28Any person with information about ongoing sexual trafficking... I'm asking you if they're credible.
39:35Ma'am, I'm commenting on the evidence we have. We have routinely asked for people to come forward
39:40with more evidence, and we will look at it. And the evidence that we have was the same evidence that
39:45the Biden and Obama justice departments had. And they determined, not me, they determined that that
39:50information was not credible. Mr. Chairman, he's not letting me even ask my questions.
39:54You ask the questions, he gives an answer. You may not like what he says, but that doesn't mean you
39:58get to interrupt him. Mr. Chairman, could we restore the gentlelady 45 seconds so she can complete
40:03her question? We will give her additional 30 seconds, which is what I said earlier. I'm going to keep
40:05taking my time. You are not answering the question. The question is, are these women credible? It's a yes
40:16or no answer. I have answered the question. I keep telling you, I'm the only FBI director that has
40:22welcomed new information in this case. This administration is the only one that has welcomed
40:27any new information in this case. Is there a yes or no? Present new credible information. Present new
40:34information. Are the victims credible or not? The victims, I'll tell you what happened in the last
40:39Trump administration. Are they credible or not? You can't even say. Victims credibly came forward,
40:42and you know what happened? President Trump authorized the indictments of Jeffrey Epstein.
40:47President Trump called them a hoax. Not Biden, not Obama, no one else. President Trump called the entire
40:51thing, a democratic hoax. So I would like to ask you, if you will meet, if you will meet, Mr. Chairman,
41:02I would like to ask if you would meet with the women who were sexually abused and raped and groomed at the
41:11ages of 14 and 16 years old. Are you going to cover up? Are you going to continue to cover up for the rich
41:20and powerful men, including those that might be on this committee? I can yell too, Mr. Chairman,
41:25but I don't want to yell above this. The time belongs to the gentleman from New Jersey. I appreciate
41:30the gentlelady yielding back. Are you going to allow them to testify, Mr. Patel?
41:34Will you allow them to testify to you, Mr. Patel? Mr. Patel. Does Donald Trump appear anywhere in the
41:41Epstein file? We have released where Mr. Where President Trump's names in the Epstein files and everybody
41:46else. And all credible information that we are illegally allowed to release has been released.
41:52They are unsealed as part of discovery given to Ghislaine Maxwell. They are no longer sealed.
41:58That's just not true. We can argue about it all you want. You are not releasing all of the videos
42:04that you have acknowledged. There are so many and that the FBI spent thousands of hours of reviewing.
42:10The overwhelming majority of that video is pornographic material that was downloaded from
42:17the internet and child sexual abuse material. We will never release that. Well, as you should not
42:22release the victims. But if there are videos that relate to others who Epstein trafficked to,
42:28such as maybe Prince Andrew or photographs, that you have total control to release.
42:36Yes. And if it exists. So why haven't you released it? Why are you supposing that that is a fact when
42:41in fact it is false? I'm saying that none of the videos relate to anything relevant to the Jeffrey
42:48Epstein trafficking. Every single video that we have collected pursuant to the prior search warrants
42:54has been examined for the last 10 years. Donald Trump appear anywhere in the Epstein files.
42:59I'm sorry. Could you say that again? It's not a complicated question. Does Donald Trump appear
43:06anywhere in the Epstein files? I didn't say it was a complicated question. I just didn't hear you.
43:10So my apologies. We have released where Mr. where President Trump's names in the Epstein files and
43:16everybody else and all credible information that we are illegally allowed to release has been released.
43:23All right. So let's go through that. You're you're referring to court orders that prohibit you from
43:30releasing grand jury testimony under Rule 6E. Is that what you're referring to when you say is the law
43:37allows? That's a piece of it. Really? What are the what other evidence does the do those three court
43:44orders you cited prohibit from being released? Information that was collected pursuant to those
43:51search warrants that were limited in fashion. Wrong. Wrong. That's not what the court order says and
43:56that's not under 6E. And you're talking and I said that's 6E and I said there was others and I'm
44:00answering that there are sealed court order documents. There are protective orders. They are unsealed
44:05as part of discovery given to Ghislaine Maxwell. They are no longer sealed. That's just not true.
44:11We can argue about it all you want. Okay. Well, you agree that there are. So wait,
44:15your testimony here is that the reason why you are not releasing all of the videos that you have
44:21acknowledged. There are so many and that the FBI spent thousands of hours of reviewing the photographs,
44:29all of the and the photographs that you have. You're saying that you're not releasing those because
44:34there's a court order requiring them to be sealed. Is that your testimony? Never said that about the
44:40videos on the totality of the videos of the thousands of images that were seized pursuant to the search
44:47warrants executed at the time. The overwhelming majority of that video is pornographic material
44:55that was downloaded from the Internet and child sexual abuse material. We will never release that.
45:00Well, as you should not release the victims. But if there are videos that relate to
45:05others who Epstein trafficked to such as maybe Prince Andrew or photographs, that you have total control
45:14to release. Yes. And if it exists. So why haven't you released it?
45:18Why are you supposing that that is a fact when in fact it is false?
45:22Are you saying that I'm sitting on that evidence? You're saying that none of the videos relate to
45:26anything relevant to the Jeffrey Epstein trafficking? Every single video that we have collected
45:32pursuant to the prior search warrants has been examined for the last 10 years. And every single
45:38video has been utilized for whatever prosecutions were able to be legally brought. I'm not asking
45:43about prosecutions. I'm asking about why you aren't releasing the full Epstein files, including the names
45:50of people who were involved in the sex ring that you promised to do before you became FBI director.
45:58I just told you I'm not going to release downloaded porn. I'm not asking about that. Fine. I'm asking
46:03about all the other files. What other videos? Tell me. Tell me. That's what I'm asking. Tell me.
46:09You're saying there are no videos that would be relevant to anyone else involved in the Jeffrey
46:14Epstein sex ring. Pursuant to Mr. Acosta's collection of information based on the search warrants.
46:20That's all we have in our possession. And I'm asking you that stuff. That's all we got. I'm not
46:25asking all you got. I'm asking you in that stuff. There's nothing that's related to the, uh, to any
46:30other sex traffic, any other people engaged with Epstein in underage sex. That's correct. To my
46:36knowledge, no. Okay. Let's talk about the witness interviews, 302s of witness interviews. Those are not
46:42subject to the court order. Those are not subject to any fictional sealed order for a search warrant.
46:48Why aren't you releasing those with the redacted names of the victims? We are releasing as much
46:54as legally allowed. That's why we went back to court. How is that? How is that not legally allowed?
46:59Sir, do you know how court orders work? Do you know how protective orders work? Actually,
47:02Mr. Patel, I was a prosecutor, a real prosecutor for 10 years. I know exactly how court orders.
47:06So I was a fake one? And I want to understand what the court order prevents you from releasing
47:13witness statements that the FBI took. You should know that as a real prosecutor,
47:17when the court hand downs a protective order and a motion to seal, the material is sealed unless
47:22that just waves it. So your testimony here is that all of those witness statements are under
47:28a court order, a protective order. We are providing everything we can legally provide.
47:35No, that's not my question. My question is,
47:38why are those witness statements that are not grand jury testimony,
47:41that if they were under a protective order are no longer under a protective order,
47:46why are they not being released? How are they not under a protective order?
47:49Why are you not going to the court like you did for the grand jury testimony to unseal those records?
47:55The DOJ did go to the court. No, not on those records. Why aren't you going? You just went on grand jury.
48:00I mean, the gentleman is expired. You are hiding the Epstein files.
48:04I mean, the gentleman is expired. You are part of the cover up.
48:08Can I respond? Sure can.
48:11Any allegations that I'm a part of a cover up to protect child sexual trafficking and victims of human
48:18trafficking and sexual crimes is patently and categorically false in the work of my
48:24So I hope you will talk to them when they have requested to speak with you.
48:27Because the victims have requested and you are not responding to them.
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