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In this edition of Newstrack, the focus is on the Government versus Opposition showdown on the first day of the Winter Session of Parliament.
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00:00Hello everyone, you're watching NewsTrack with me, Maria Shaquille.
00:04Today was day one of the winter session.
00:06It's a short session, but the one that is loaded with expectation and political heat.
00:12Just 15 sittings at a time when the government hopes to push key legislative business through before the year ends.
00:20But if recent trends are any guide, the real story might not be inside the bills, but inside the bickering.
00:27This morning, the Prime Minister set the tone, accusing the opposition of turning electoral setbacks into parliamentary roadblocks.
00:36He pointed to a pattern.
00:38Every time elections are lost, from Haryana to Maharashtra to Delhi, Parliament, he said, suffers the aftershocks.
00:48Rahul Gandhi's sister and Wynad MP Priyanka Gandhi responded strongly to the Prime Minister's remarks
00:55When asked about his accusation that the opposition was disrupting Parliament,
01:00she said that issues such as SIR and air pollution directly affect the public and must be discussed.
01:07She also emphasised that speaking up and raising concerns in Parliament is not drama.
01:12If you look at the last few sessions, there have been disruptions which have dominated over debate and discussion.
01:21The lockjam has often replaced legislation.
01:24So as MPs return to the House, the question is,
01:28will this short winter session thaw into some real work,
01:33or freeze again in the familiar chill of political confrontation?
01:38First up, let's listen in to what the Prime Minister said
01:42and all the political reactions that came in earlier today.
01:46and do this?
01:47The campaign has been in the meantime,
01:48so that the our economies are the most important thing of this year.
01:53The global warming happening is that we are being used to pay for the problem of our lives.
01:56Out of the time, we are being used to pay for the peace,
01:57or including the power of our lives.
01:58What the inductors should be used to the reform?
02:00We are being used to pay for the power of our lives.
02:01We should be used to pay for the rights of our lives.
02:03Two countries should be a в a bon moment.
02:09The conditions in the future seems like that we are being used to pay for the rights of our lives.
02:11foreign
02:14foreign
02:23foreign
02:28foreign
02:35foreign
02:38ुद्धिति राजनीति के लिए इस्तमाल करने के नई परंपरा को कुछ दलों ने जन्म दिया है
02:45अब उन्होंने एक बार चिंतन करना चाहिए कि पिछले दस साल से जो खेल खेल रहे हैं देश स्विकार नहीं कर रहे हैं इन पद्धितियों को
02:57तो अब थोड़ा बदले अपनी रणनीति बदले मैं टिफ्ट देने के लो त्यार हूं उनको कैसे परफॉम करना चाहिए
03:09लेकिन कम से कम सांसदों के हकोप और तराप बत लगाईए
03:18I suggest that urgent issues like what you said pollution other issues SIR which are a it is a huge issue for democracy
03:29what is going on whether it's the election situation or the SIR these are huge issues let's discuss them what is parliament for let's discuss them
03:38let them have a discussion it's not drama speaking about issues raising issues is not drama drama is not allowing discussion drama is not having a democratic discussion about issues that matter to the public
03:51we've spoken about pollution why are we not raising it why are we not allowed to today I have asked for zero on it why are we not allowed to discuss these things
03:59drama drama love ocean dream drama Capital इसली ने ईसलीए इसलीए ड해요 advertising is
04:14we will see that sincerity can be done
04:17and no matter how much of the person is not
04:20who knows this drama is
04:23we will get a drama
04:25we will get a drama
04:28so this drama is not
04:31so this is not
04:35the words of the person
04:36election commission
04:38that all the people
04:39have been
04:42We have an all MPs panel on news track tonight, Prajita Sarangi, Member of Parliament of the BJP, Manikam Tagore, MP of the Congress Party.
04:54We have Sushmita Dev representing the Trinamool Congress.
04:57Manikam Tagore, I'm looking at how the House has functioned.
05:01The Prime Minister is right.
05:03Electoral losses are actually reflecting into parliamentary roadblocks.
05:08The winter session of Parliament, the Lok Sabha in fact functioned for just 52% of its scheduled time which was held after Jammu and Kashmir, Maharashtra, Jharkand and Haryana and Rajya Sabha functioned for just 39% of its scheduled time.
05:24Then why is the opposition not letting the House function and is reflecting its electoral setbacks on the floor of the House?
05:37Prime Minister has misunderstood the whole thing.
05:40Prime Minister must understand, should have seen this in a different, every session has some kind of issues to come.
05:48The monsoon session was a sudden SIR in Bihar, which turned the whole game.
05:55And the SIR was a weapon which was used to delete names of those people from particular communities, from backward and struggle caste and minority communities in that 30-day gap.
06:12All the opposition parties were united for a debate on that subject.
06:17We were demanding for a debate.
06:19We were not asking some other thing.
06:21We were asking for a discussion on that thing.
06:24And discussion was not allowed.
06:25The arrogance of the government was so high that every time when we are asking for some discussion,
06:31when, if you remember, 143 MPs have been suspended in Parliament, what was the thing we were asking?
06:37We were asking for the discussion on the attack on the Parliament.
06:41We were asking for the Home Minister to reply.
06:44For that, we have all been suspended.
06:46Therefore, every time when we demand for it, when we demand for a discussion, discussion is not allowed and the Parliament is not functioning.
06:55This we have to understand.
06:56Prime Minister always pins every fact into some other thing.
07:01He has done that, this part also.
07:03It is good that you are asking the question.
07:06We are very clear.
07:07We want a discussion in the Parliament.
07:09We are asking.
07:10It is not a Parliament.
07:11It is not a cheerleaders club.
07:14We have to ask us, opposition MPs, our duties.
07:18People have voted us to the Parliament to ask questions.
07:20Yes, but among asking questions should not mean disruptions.
07:26That is the point that has been made as well.
07:28I am coming to Prajita, but before that, Sushmita Dev, a question being asked now is that,
07:34isn't the Parliament a platform for constructive discussion?
07:39Why, how is this constant disruption helping the cause of any of you, any of the political parties?
07:46Because you are answerable to your constituents as well and they want issues to be raised in Parliament.
07:52Yeah, I agree with you, Maria.
07:57When you say that what people expect from us, whether it's in the constituency or in the nation,
08:05it is a good discussion and a good debate.
08:07But having said that, in a democracy, the government or the people in power cannot force you to discuss on issues that suit them
08:21and is convenient to them and avoid topics that is inconvenient to them.
08:27When we say discuss on price rise, they want to discuss Olympics.
08:31When we want to discuss the death of BLOs and the manner in which the SIR is being done,
08:40they want to now discuss oranges.
08:43You know, that's what's happening in Parliament.
08:45Of course, we want to discuss, but you cannot expect us to discuss what the BJP chooses to discuss.
08:53We reflect the mood of the nation.
08:55We reflect the sentiment of the people and you have to discuss things like air pollution.
09:03You have to discuss things like how the SIR is impacting electoral democracy.
09:11We have to discuss that need for electoral reforms.
09:16You can't say now start discussing Olympics and Sports Day.
09:19So, I mean, please, I want the people and your viewers to iron that is that this.
09:24While the Prime Minister spoke about where the opposition may be going wrong,
09:30he also said that the Treasury benches should not approach a Parliament session with arrogance of victory.
09:38Does it mean that with repeated victories that the BJP is facing,
09:42it's also not willing to accommodate what the opposition is demanding as their legitimate concern?
09:52Honourable Prime Minister Srin Narendra Modi ji has shown the mirror to all the opposition members today
09:59and at the same time, he has also given, I would say, a piece of advice to all the members of Parliament cutting across party lines.
10:10I have also been advised to indulge in constructive discussion.
10:14So, I think all the members of Parliament, whether in the Lok Sabha or the Rajya Sabha,
10:18should utilise their time and actually focus on constructive discussions.
10:23Now, let me tell you, the monsoon session was a complete washout.
10:29And at that point of time, SIR, of course, had surfaced and vote Chori had surfaced.
10:34And then, I remember, thereafter, the Bihar results came.
10:38And then, thereafter, the Bihar results actually made them sink in frustration and disappointment and anger.
10:46These are the three words that come to my mind today.
10:48After seeing their behaviour in the house and outside the house,
10:52I can only say that there is a lack of maturity, there is a lack of balanced approach.
10:57And, of course, they are sinking into the pit of depression and frustration and anger.
11:02See, they just cannot accept the fact that for the past 12 to 13 years, they are out of power.
11:09They have never been used to this.
11:11Now, here is a government which comes to the Lok Sabha and the Rajya Sabha with reform agenda.
11:17We want progress. We want reform.
11:19We want India to be among the list in the list of developed nations.
11:23We are still a developing nation.
11:25We want to be the third largest economy in the world.
11:28I think these are our priorities.
11:30Now, as far as the demand of the opposition is concerned,
11:34I can tell you all our erudite people who are on the panel today,
11:38they are all my esteemed colleagues in the Lok Sabha and the Rajya Sabha.
11:41They know it very well that there is a business advisory committee.
11:45The business advisory committee of the Lok Sabha at this juncture has decided
11:48that there would be about 10 to 12 hours discussion on one-day matram.
11:53And one-day matram has completed its 150 years.
11:56So, I think it is very befitting that we have discussion on that.
12:00And, in fact, all have agreed.
12:02And it is a multi-party sitting.
12:03It is not just the BJP or the NDA deciding in the BSE.
12:06And I think Kiran Rijuji in the Rajya Sabha was absolutely candid today.
12:11Very firmly, he said, very candidly, he said that the business advisory committee will take a view on the discussion on SIR.
12:21And we are not averse to discussing any matter of whatsoever.
12:26So, tomorrow, SIR may also be taken up, provided the BSE decides.
12:31So, I think the BSE will take a view.
12:35But before I end, please, I can only…
12:38Yes.
12:39Okay, Manikam Tagore, let's wait for the business advisory committee.
12:44Yeah, business advisory committee met on Saturday also.
12:48You have to understand that the business advisory committee on Sunday, 6 o'clock, it met, 5 o'clock, it met for a…
12:54and first meeting happened, and the opposition parties.
12:58You have to understand that opposition means what it is.
13:01Opposition in Lok Toba means 240 MPs.
13:04In a 543 house, member house, 240 MPs are demanding for a subject to be included.
13:12And you say a thing that we will not include.
13:1340% of the MPs, 43% of the MPs say a thing that we want this discussion to happen.
13:19Why SIR?
13:20In Bihar, 65 lakh voters has been deleted.
13:2212 states, they have rolled out that pilot project back.
13:26Now, how many crores of people's votes are going to be removed?
13:29We want that discussion.
13:31Unilateralism of the election commission, the way Gyanesh Kumar and company are doing,
13:35bulldozing the whole exercise, this is our question.
13:38With 30 days' time, BLAs are committing suicides.
13:44There are pressure on those officers in every level.
13:47District administrations are standing still in everywhere.
13:49Disha meetings are not able to happen.
13:51Because of these SIR things, a lot of pressure is on the officials there.
13:56Therefore, we want that to be discussed.
13:59And you are saying that we will not, it's a political agenda, it is victory, Bihar victory.
14:04Come on, please.
14:0662 lakh voters have been deleted.
14:07That model is, they are extending to 12 states.
14:10We are against that thing.
14:11But Manikam Tagore, having covered the Bihar elections and having followed the entire SIR process,
14:20also the issue having been taken to the Supreme Court, that deletion process may very well be a clean-up exercise.
14:27To say that it is linked to the Bihar results may not be correct.
14:31No, that is your opinion.
14:35Our opinion is different.
14:36No.
14:36Your opinion may be different.
14:39And the BJP opinion may be some other thing.
14:42But my opinion is different.
14:44RJD's opinion is same.
14:46And the CPMML opinion is same.
14:48The irony is that the elections happened in two phases.
14:55And till now, not a single voter who was supposed to be an eligible voter was not given a right to vote,
15:02has been identified by any of the political parties, either by the RJD or by the Congress.
15:08To say that there are a significant number who have not been given the right to vote is a huge charge.
15:13Perhaps you should take this up.
15:15And it's a matter of concern and a concern that the opposition has all right to take up.
15:20But the question then is, how will the House function if this is about more political confrontation,
15:27Sushmita Dev, and ideological disagreement rather than parliamentary practice or, you know,
15:34it's about let there be discussion, debate.
15:38You may agree, you may disagree.
15:40But there has to be the functioning of the House.
15:42The House should be allowed to function.
15:45I agree with you.
15:47I have no disagreement with you, Maria, that there should be debate, there should be discussion, discussions.
15:54We may agree on things, we may not agree on things.
15:58But like I'm saying again, that you want to debate Bande Mataram, please debate Bande Mataram.
16:05The only reason they want to do it now is because they were naive enough and ignorant enough to say,
16:11you can't say Bande Mataram in Rajya Sabha.
16:13And you can't say Jay Hind in Rajya Sabha.
16:15They're just trying to prove a point.
16:17But you have to reflect that what are the other burning issues.
16:22Today, Manikam Ji is saying again and again that nobody is opposing SIR.
16:31Please understand, it's not the first time that the SIR is happening in this country.
16:36But the manner in which it is being done, the manner in which it is being done and the fact that the ECI is sounding more and more like the mouthpiece of the BJPs is the main concern.
16:50Intensive revision has happened before, but it's the manner in which it's done and it is manipulated.
16:57That's the problem.
16:58And see, we can shout on the streets, we can debate on television, but for it to be debated in the two houses of parliament is important because it comes on record.
17:12It's very different to debate on TV and very different to debate in parliament.
17:16So you want to debate Bande Mataram, go ahead.
17:19You want to debate Manipur, go ahead.
17:23But that doesn't mean that you don't accept the burning issues impacting the nation because it doesn't suit you.
17:29We are happy to debate.
17:30Let's debate tomorrow.
17:31Yes.
17:32Okay.
17:33It is a short winter session.
17:36You know, perhaps the shortest that we have seen, Prajita Sarangi.
17:39So the government will be asked this question that why is the winter session such a brief one?
17:45You could have extended the session and showed that the house would have functioned.
17:49And as late Arunjaitli famously said when he was in opposition, that the onus of running the house is on the treasury benches.
17:56If there is constructive discussion within the Lok Sabha and the Rajya Sabha, naturally the entire duration of the parliament session would be lengthened.
18:10But we are not here, MPs from different corners of the country, to listen to all this ruckus.
18:17We are not wanting to be a party to the ruckus.
18:19We don't want to get disturbed so much.
18:21It's better to, you know, go back to your constituency and work.
18:24So I think there has to be order within the parliament.
18:26Now a couple of things.
18:28Now a couple of things.
18:30Haryana, Karnataka and Maharashtra chief electoral officers.
18:34Please recall.
18:36They had written to or rather told Rahul Gandhi to give information about the bogus voters.
18:43He was not able to provide that particular list.
18:46So what is the halabulu when you are not able to qualify your statements with facts and substance?
18:51And let me tell you that the integrity of the electoral roll is fundamental to parliamentary democracy.
18:58And please, for heaven's sake, go through Article 324 of the Constitution of India.
19:03Nobody is above the Constitution of India.
19:06It vests the superintendents' direction, control of the preparation of electoral roll
19:11and the conduct of all elections in India in the Election Commission.
19:14The Election Commission has been going for sanitization of the voter database since 2003.
19:22It started with Bihar.
19:24So let me tell you, this is not something new.
19:26Only that there are certain documents which have been added, which is good.
19:29We are trying to sanitize the database as best as we can.
19:333.60 lakh fake voters found in Bihar.
19:38I think we all should welcome this.
19:40And I think Election Commission, being an independent body, has started an exercise.
19:43And all of us should actually commend the efforts of the Election Commission.
19:47It is a good governance measure.
19:49And it is as per the provisions of the Constitution of India.
19:52So I think there is nothing big deal done now.
19:54No big deal about having it done in 12 states of the country besides Bihar.
19:59Okay.
19:59So it's not there.
20:00No.
20:01But as far as the discussion on burning issues is concerned,
20:05the government of Narendra Modi ji is very much ready.
20:08We would be taking up, provide the BAC decides.
20:10My colleague from the BJP, colleague in the Lok Sabha and the BJP spokesperson,
20:18in the passing remarks, was mentioning about the Leader of Opposition.
20:21Leader of Opposition was raising a very important issue on the vote-chory thing,
20:26on Maharashtra and Haryana, and Karnataka, particularly on Mahadeva Parseet.
20:32Mahadeva Parseet, how the inclusion has created, fake voters has been created,
20:42and how in Haryana also 25 lakh new fake voters are there.
20:45So this is a very serious thing.
20:47Let us understand that the state election commissioners are just working as irresponsible people.
20:55They have to be responsible.
20:56We are speaking about a serious thing.
20:58A leader of opposition is speaking about a serious thing.
21:01And the way the government, as well as the election commission,
21:04particularly the BJP and the election commission, are speaking the same language.
21:09The problem is there only.
21:10The problem lies there.
21:12Therefore, we want the election commission to be neutral.
21:14We don't want the election to be on our side.
21:17We want the election commission to be neutral.
21:19They are not doing it.
21:20Therefore, only this debate, only we want to do it in parliament.
21:23We are asking for some kind of discussion on this thing.
21:28We know that government will accept at last,
21:31because they have done it like this on Manipur issue also.
21:33Whole session was washed out one time because of Manipur.
21:37We demanded for Manipur discussion.
21:39Next time, they have to accept for that Manipur discussion,
21:42and Manipur discussion happened.
21:43Therefore, this discussion also, SIR, electoral reforms, vote theory,
21:47all are very important things.
21:48This is the right to vote of an Indian is the most important thing.
21:53And BJP members also knows that this is a very serious thing.
21:57It is to save democracy in India.
22:00The right to vote has to be saved.
22:01And that is under attack.
22:03Therefore, we have to understand that the importance of parliament
22:07lies with the members, the opposition party also,
22:11and the ruling party also.
22:12Our voices are not heard.
22:14The business of government only is accepted,
22:18not the opposition's business.
22:19Opposition also has demands.
22:21Opposition also has issues to be raised in parliament.
22:24We want the parliament to function.
22:26But the government's arrogance, government's one-sided views
22:29are only stopping the parliament.
22:31And just my friend, Leonard friend, mentioned,
22:36mentioned about that curtailing of the House.
22:41It's a Gujarat model.
22:42Now, Gujarat assemblies also works very less.
22:45Now, parliament is also working very less.
22:47Okay.
22:47Sushmita Dev?
22:49You see, we, every session,
22:52we have the same debate on television.
22:54That, oh, disruption, and why is this not happening?
22:58What is that?
22:58Now, you think about it.
23:00In Delhi, recently, near the Red Fort,
23:04there is a bomb blast.
23:06Okay?
23:06Internal security needs to be debated.
23:09You tell me, when was the last time
23:12home ministry was debated as a ministry?
23:17Because why?
23:19In the BAC meeting that you talk about,
23:22generally, it is negotiated between the party,
23:25between the government and the opposition,
23:28which is the ministries that will be debated.
23:30Now, what the government does is,
23:34they cushion their ministries.
23:37They save the ministers and they save the government
23:41from controversial debates.
23:43That's what happens in the business advisory committee meeting.
23:47Now, there was a time in the 16th Lok Sabha
23:50when Modi government was very new.
23:52That time, Madam Sarangi was not there
23:55and I think the Modi government has still not run,
23:58you know, learned the ropes.
24:01We used to have short-duration discussions.
24:03We used to have calling attention.
24:06We used to react to urgent issues in the state.
24:09And it is to be done there and then.
24:13People who have watched,
24:14Maria, you have been a journalist for almost two decades.
24:18You've watched parliament.
24:20Tell me, I mean, tell me,
24:22put your hand on your heart and tell me
24:24that how badly parliament and democracy
24:28has been impacted since BJP has learned the ropes.
24:33You know, parliament was vibrant.
24:35You could criticize the government.
24:37The government would be accountable.
24:39The government would tell us where they went wrong
24:41and what they're going to do to make it right.
24:44That entire spirit of democracy is gone.
24:47Today, we go to the well,
24:49not because we like to go to the well,
24:51but it's very simple.
24:53Desperate times need desperate measures.
24:57Okay.
24:57This is a dictatorship.
24:59Okay.
24:5930 seconds I have
25:00and then I'll wrap up this discussion.
25:02Aparajita Sarangi,
25:03you'll get the last word on the show
25:05because you have had two opposition leaders,
25:07two opposition MPs
25:08questioning each and every move
25:10and particularly the fact that
25:12this is a very brief winter session.
25:15You know, so opposition, of course,
25:17and neither will you get much chance
25:19to raise questions
25:20or raise issues.
25:22There are 14 legislative and financial items
25:29listed for this session.
25:3115 sittings spread over 19 days.
25:33Now, my dear friends,
25:35should actually decide to allow discussion
25:38on these 14 items.
25:39We are aware of the fact that
25:41once the bills are discussed,
25:43all opinions taken,
25:44they will be formulated into acts
25:46and acts will be implemented
25:47for the benefit of the general public
25:49in the country.
25:50So, it's very important
25:51to focus on development.
25:52Are they going away from development?
25:54Are they going away from progress
25:55when they say no
25:56towards for discussion
25:58in the legislative item session?
26:02Now, number two question.
26:04Today, I was quite interested
26:06when, amused rather,
26:08when Priyanka Gandhi said,
26:10I wanted zero hour,
26:11they are not letting the zero hour done.
26:13Now, who stopped the zero hour?
26:15If you create this kind of ruckus
26:18in the house
26:19and keep telling things
26:20against the government
26:21outside the house
26:22and you don't allow things to function,
26:25naturally, the zero hour cannot take place.
26:27We want zero hour.
26:28I'm an MP.
26:29I want zero hour.
26:30But you have to allow
26:31that zero hour to take place.
26:32Okay.
26:32So, I think
26:33it is a collective responsibility.
26:35Yes, you're talking about
26:36collective responsibility.
26:38Okay.
26:38Now, this is collective responsibility
26:40to run the parliament
26:42with maturity.
26:43Okay.
26:44Aparajita Sarangi,
26:45Manikam Thiggor and Sushmita Dev,
26:46really appreciate your time.
26:47And thank you for joining us
26:48here on NewsTrack.
26:50Of course,
26:50we were expecting
26:52a similar debate
26:52to perhaps take place
26:53on the floor of the house
26:54inside parliament.
26:56That did not happen.
26:57So, thank you
26:57for a fine debate
27:00on NewsTrack.
27:01That's all from me.
27:02I'll be seeing you tomorrow.
27:03Thanks so much for watching.
27:03We'll see you tomorrow.
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