Inside the Concert Boom: How CAA’s Top Agents Shape Touring w/ Rob Light & Rick Roskin | Billboard On The Record - video Dailymotion

Billboard

Live music is booming, and CAA’s top touring execs explain exactly how today’s biggest shows come to life. Managing director, Rob Light, and co-head of global touring, Rick Roskin, join host Kristin Robinson to unpack the rise of live music’s modern era. They dive into the post-pandemic concert boom, how agents build tours from the ground up and what it takes for an artist to grow from a club act to a headliner. Light and Roskin discuss the balance between fair ticket pricing and fan demand and how agents fight to keep more money with the artists. They share how gut instinct still plays a role in spotting future stars, how massive shows like Harry Styles’ 15-night Madison Square Garden run come together and the evolving impact of festivals and social media on touring. Plus, they reveal the wildest artist requests, unforgettable live moments, and their take on concert etiquette in the age of the live music boom.  Love what you hear? Follow Billboard On The Record on Instagram, Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Youtube @billboard so you never miss an episode.  Billboard On The Record is a podcast in partnership with SickBird Productions.

Transcript

00:00:00The business of live music has never looked quite like this.

00:00:03Stadium tours like Taylor Swift's Ares Tour are breaking records,

00:00:07ticket prices are breaking wallets,

00:00:09platforms like Ticketmaster are under greater scrutiny,

00:00:12and new venues like The Sphere are redefining what a concert can be.

00:00:16Artists are playing fewer cities but staying longer,

00:00:19fans are turning travel plans into world tours of their own,

00:00:23and behind it all, the economics, the logistics, the expectations of touring,

00:00:28they're all shifting in real time.

00:00:30So how did we get here, and what's next for the live music business?

00:00:38Welcome back to On the Record,

00:00:41a music business podcast from Billboard and Sickford Productions.

00:00:44As always, I'm your host, Kristen Robinson,

00:00:46and today we're joined by two of the most legendary agents in music,

00:00:50Rob Light and Rick Roskin of CAA.

00:00:52Rob Light is the partner and managing director of CAA,

00:00:55and he's spent his career building up the touring businesses

00:00:57of some of the biggest artists in the history of music,

00:01:01from Fleetwood Mac, Bruce Springsteen, Beyonce, ACDC,

00:01:05One Direction, Katy Perry, 21 Pilots, Ariana Grande, and many more.

00:01:10He was also CAA's longtime global head of touring,

00:01:13a role which he has since passed down to our other guests this week,

00:01:17Rick Roskin.

00:01:19Rick now shares the global head of touring title with two others,

00:01:21Emma Banks, and Daryl Eaton, and brings his own wealth of experience

00:01:25to the top job, working with a roster of clients like Eric Clapton,

00:01:29Santana, Kesha, Kelly Clarkson, Slipknot, The Black Keys,

00:01:34Fiona Apple, Iron Maiden, and more.

00:01:36So all this to say, we're in very good hands here

00:01:38as we explore the ways that live music has changed post-pandemic.

00:01:42There's almost too much to talk about, honestly,

00:01:45but we'll try to cover as many bases as we can here today.

00:01:48So without further ado, let's bring them in.

00:01:51Rob Light, Rick Roskin, welcome to On The Record.

00:01:54Thank you so much for being here with me.

00:01:56Thank you for having us.

00:01:57So I wanted to start off with something a little bit fun.

00:02:01I want to know why you got into this business.

00:02:03Was there a certain concert that you saw that really changed things for you

00:02:07and made you think, I want to work in live music?

00:02:10I just actually posted this back in August.

00:02:14When I was 17, 50 years ago,

00:02:17I went to see Bruce Springsteen play at the bottom line.

00:02:21It was August 17, 1975,

00:02:25and still have the ticket framed in my office.

00:02:28And I went home after and told my dad,

00:02:29I'm going to work in the music industry.

00:02:31And he said, what does that mean?

00:02:32I go, I don't really know,

00:02:34but I want to be a part of this.

00:02:36And from there, went to college,

00:02:39became a concert promoter in school

00:02:42and got a job in a mailroom.

00:02:44Wow.

00:02:45And also, I mean, obviously,

00:02:46you now work with Bruce Springsteen.

00:02:48And now I get to work with Bruce Springsteen.

00:02:50That's incredible.

00:02:50Which is the greatest full circle story of life.

00:02:53Yes.

00:02:53Yeah.

00:02:53And when did you start working with him?

00:02:5620 years ago.

00:02:5718 years ago.

00:02:58Incredible.

00:02:59Incredible.

00:02:59And Rick, what about you?

00:03:00What was the concert that really changed it for you?

00:03:01A very similar thing.

00:03:03I went and saw Cheap Trick in 1978.

00:03:06I think I was 12.

00:03:08And they were, I was blown away.

00:03:12It was my first concert I've ever seen.

00:03:15Like Rob, I was fortunate enough to work with the band

00:03:18in my future.

00:03:21And I kind of knew this was what I wanted to do as well.

00:03:25I didn't know how.

00:03:26Like everyone in our business,

00:03:27I was a failed musician.

00:03:28And same thing, started in the mailroom

00:03:32right out of college

00:03:33and have been at CAA my entire career.

00:03:36Wow.

00:03:36Okay.

00:03:36And I Want You to Want Me is his go-to karaoke song.

00:03:39That is true.

00:03:40I'm just going to put that out there for the record.

00:03:42Have you done it in front of the band?

00:03:44I definitely have not.

00:03:46Okay.

00:03:47We got to get that to happen.

00:03:48That would be very funny.

00:03:50Okay.

00:03:50So y'all both started in the mailroom.

00:03:52And I'm wondering, what was the mailroom like?

00:03:54Any horror stories from back in the day

00:03:56of trying to get your start as an agent?

00:03:58The mailroom 50 years ago was not what it is today.

00:04:01Now it's a very coordinated program

00:04:04where we're really trying to train people

00:04:06and develop them.

00:04:08When I started, we were literally just messengers.

00:04:11And I was in New York delivering packages

00:04:13and almost quit after the first week

00:04:16because I'd promoted so many shows in school

00:04:18I couldn't believe

00:04:19they were actually in my arrogant head at the time

00:04:23that they were wasting my talent

00:04:25delivering packages across Manhattan.

00:04:27But a desk opened up a week after I got there

00:04:31with a great agent who had just been transferred

00:04:33from the West Coast.

00:04:35And I was an assistant a week later

00:04:37and very quickly moved.

00:04:40But that could happen back then.

00:04:41It's much harder to do now.

00:04:43But back then in 1978,

00:04:45the whole process of being an agent was new.

00:04:48So.

00:04:49Yeah.

00:04:50Rick, what about you?

00:04:50How long were you in the mailroom?

00:04:51I was in the mailroom about six months.

00:04:55It was very different

00:04:58from what it's like being in the mailroom now.

00:05:01You have to remember there were no cell phones.

00:05:04There were no fax machines.

00:05:07We received offers on telex,

00:05:09which is like basically getting a letter by Pony Express.

00:05:13And, you know, we just functioned as the cleaning staff,

00:05:19the shopping staff.

00:05:21We copied everything.

00:05:22We delivered everything.

00:05:24We were the internal engine of the company.

00:05:27That has now shifted to where, you know,

00:05:30obviously the company's gotten so much larger.

00:05:33But it was a great experience.

00:05:35I knew nothing about the entertainment business

00:05:38when I started.

00:05:39My interview was basically, do you have a car?

00:05:42And I said, yes.

00:05:43And you learn so much.

00:05:46And it was such a great way to get a sense

00:05:48of every area of entertainment.

00:05:50And I always knew I wanted to be in music

00:05:52and got out six months later and got a desk

00:05:56and worked for Mitch Rose,

00:05:58who is one of our partners to this day.

00:06:01Yeah.

00:06:02Okay.

00:06:02That makes sense.

00:06:03That's really interesting.

00:06:04So the reason why I wanted to have you guys

00:06:06both here today is to talk about

00:06:08how touring is changing

00:06:09and how live music is changing.

00:06:11It really feels like the last five years

00:06:12have been super volatile.

00:06:14I mean, we started this decade with the pandemic

00:06:16and a total shutdown of concerts

00:06:18for a little bit at least.

00:06:20And now we've made our way out of that

00:06:22and things just seem to be changing a lot.

00:06:25It's like right before we started recording,

00:06:26we were even talking about

00:06:28how far out y'all are booking shows.

00:06:30I was wondering if we could actually start there.

00:06:32Rob, you could kind of talk more about that.

00:06:34Like at this point, how far out are you booking

00:06:37and why is it such a wide span at this point?

00:06:41Well, if I can put that question back

00:06:43and just say one thing prior

00:06:45because you sort of set us up post-COVID.

00:06:48If you look at the industry,

00:06:50live music and everything live experiential,

00:06:54while important to a younger generation,

00:06:56we were a very materialistic society

00:06:58towards the end of the century

00:07:00and even into the early 2000s.

00:07:03And somewhere 2010, 2015,

00:07:06we became an experiential society,

00:07:09not materialistic.

00:07:10Every generation wanted experiences.

00:07:13Even as the baby boomers like myself got older,

00:07:16we wanted experiences.

00:07:17Suddenly having an extra car,

00:07:19some fancy watch didn't mean as much

00:07:21as I want to go do something.

00:07:23And that combined with COVID taking it all away,

00:07:27all those experiences didn't exist.

00:07:30You couldn't go anywhere.

00:07:31You couldn't do anything.

00:07:33That when it was over,

00:07:34it suddenly created this boom of,

00:07:37I need to go do things.

00:07:39Who knows when I'll get to do them again.

00:07:41And so generationally,

00:07:43it just took on this life of,

00:07:45I want to go out,

00:07:46and I want to be at a festival.

00:07:48I want to be with my peers.

00:07:49I want to be communal

00:07:50because we couldn't be communal during COVID.

00:07:52And that drove an opportunity

00:07:55beyond anybody's vision.

00:07:57I don't even think Live Nation or AEG

00:07:59could have envisioned where we are today.

00:08:01But now you have all those experiences.

00:08:03Everybody wants to be on tour.

00:08:06And that just leads to the mechanics of,

00:08:08well, are there stadiums available?

00:08:09Are there arenas available?

00:08:11I better plan way in advance

00:08:12because I want to get the best days of the week.

00:08:15And monetarily,

00:08:17touring became literally

00:08:18the biggest revenue stream for most artists.

00:08:22It's roughly 80 to 85,

00:08:2390% of their revenue stream.

00:08:25So you take the money they're going to earn,

00:08:28the lead time it takes to book a tour,

00:08:30the amount of artists touring

00:08:31and the basic amount of consumption

00:08:35the consumer wants,

00:08:36they can't get enough,

00:08:37just led to this unbelievable explosion of live.

00:08:41And I think the whole industry,

00:08:44all boats rise when one rises.

00:08:45And so everybody's benefited from it.

00:08:48And going back to the start of the pandemic,

00:08:52I imagine, I mean,

00:08:53both of you guys were very closely watching

00:08:57as it developed.

00:08:59I'm wondering what was the point

00:09:00when you guys noticed

00:09:02that this was not just,

00:09:03we need to cancel some shows

00:09:04for the next few weeks.

00:09:05This is something that's going to impact

00:09:07potentially the whole year

00:09:08and into the next year.

00:09:09It was such a,

00:09:10obviously something none of us

00:09:13have ever experienced.

00:09:14And I think what happened was,

00:09:17you know,

00:09:18we were always trying to be optimistic

00:09:20and we had so much stuff that were,

00:09:22you know,

00:09:23tours that were routed

00:09:24and bands who were coming out

00:09:26and, you know,

00:09:27reunions being announced

00:09:28and all these things.

00:09:30And we hit a wall.

00:09:32So we,

00:09:33because there was no,

00:09:34you know,

00:09:36real timeline,

00:09:37we just kept moving

00:09:38and moving

00:09:39and moving

00:09:40until we finally got to a point

00:09:43where we're like,

00:09:44let's hit the brakes for a minute

00:09:45and just see where this shakes out.

00:09:47Because we had no idea,

00:09:49just like everyone else,

00:09:51when this was going to end.

00:09:52And it started as months

00:09:54and then it was three months

00:09:55and then six months.

00:09:56And then next thing you know,

00:09:57you're still at home a year later.

00:09:59So I think there was no gauge

00:10:03of what that was.

00:10:04We just kind of stayed in touch

00:10:06with our clients.

00:10:07We continued to function

00:10:08on growing our business

00:10:10and making key acquisitions

00:10:12in terms of agents that we hired

00:10:14and just being active

00:10:18when you really couldn't be proactive

00:10:22in terms of touring.

00:10:23There was a great lesson.

00:10:25One thing Rick just said,

00:10:27in that moment,

00:10:28when it looked like

00:10:28the business was just

00:10:29going to shrink to nothing

00:10:30and nobody knew

00:10:31how long it was going to last,

00:10:34most companies got very destabilized.

00:10:37They just didn't know

00:10:38what the next move was.

00:10:39And I give Rick

00:10:40and his partner, Daryl Eaton,

00:10:41who now run Worldwide Music

00:10:43with Emma Banks,

00:10:44they said, no, no, no,

00:10:45we're going to go higher.

00:10:46When everybody is sort of contracting

00:10:48and like, how do we,

00:10:49what do we do?

00:10:50We knew it was going to end.

00:10:52We didn't know when.

00:10:53And so they very quickly went out

00:10:55and convinced a lot of great agents

00:10:58who were looking to make transitions

00:10:59to come in and see AA.

00:11:02We met every week.

00:11:03We would have a meeting

00:11:04with every client,

00:11:05like management meetings.

00:11:06Even though there wasn't always

00:11:07something to talk about,

00:11:08we wanted them to feel empowered.

00:11:10So whether it was podcasts

00:11:11or book deals,

00:11:13we just wanted them to know

00:11:15there was going to be an end to this

00:11:16and we were going to come out of it.

00:11:17And it actually was a huge growth window

00:11:19for us when most companies

00:11:21were contracting.

00:11:22Of course, we saw the end.

00:11:25The other thing is we had an advantage

00:11:26by having a huge sports division.

00:11:28We were able to sort of follow

00:11:30what sports was doing.

00:11:31So when baseball shut down

00:11:33and football shut down,

00:11:34we sort of went, okay,

00:11:35we're not going anywhere.

00:11:37But we got insights

00:11:38and they were going to start

00:11:39to play some football games

00:11:40in the South

00:11:40and they were going to start

00:11:41to play some baseball games.

00:11:43And we realized the country

00:11:44was going to open up.

00:11:46And we actually had one

00:11:47of the first major tours

00:11:49with Green Day and Fall Out Boy

00:11:51and playing stadiums

00:11:54right at coming out of it

00:11:55because we saw these buildings

00:11:56were opening up

00:11:57and they were gung-ho to go play

00:11:59and the tour did amazing.

00:12:01Yeah, I mean,

00:12:01and also I remember so well

00:12:03during the pandemic

00:12:04when artists started doing these,

00:12:06you know,

00:12:07whether it's like a live stream concert

00:12:08or collaborating with a video game

00:12:11like Fortnite,

00:12:12was that also under y'all's domain

00:12:14as agents

00:12:15or was that handled

00:12:16by other parts of an artist team?

00:12:18No, we were involved in that.

00:12:20And certainly the live streaming

00:12:23and that was definitely

00:12:26a consequence of COVID.

00:12:30And I think that is still

00:12:31obviously a good business.

00:12:34But, you know,

00:12:36the minute the business came back,

00:12:39as Rob said earlier,

00:12:40it was about connection.

00:12:41It was about being around people.

00:12:44You know,

00:12:44that's what concerts are

00:12:47and that's what live is.

00:12:48It's about community

00:12:49and it's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity.

00:12:53Every show is different.

00:12:54Every game you see is different.

00:12:56Every experience is different.

00:12:58So I think

00:12:59it was so pent-up demand

00:13:02that it was,

00:13:04you know,

00:13:05the Wild West

00:13:06or the Roaring Twenties

00:13:07or whatever it was.

00:13:08We've definitely lived that.

00:13:09Yeah, and I mean,

00:13:12there were a few artists

00:13:13that blew up

00:13:14during the pandemic.

00:13:15And so I think

00:13:16for those artists

00:13:17that kind of had their rise

00:13:18at that time,

00:13:19they didn't get to go through

00:13:21the traditional steps

00:13:22that you do with live

00:13:23where you start

00:13:23in your small venues,

00:13:24you suck for a little while maybe,

00:13:27you're trying to get

00:13:28your footing as an artist

00:13:29and then eventually

00:13:29you gain your audience

00:13:30and you work up

00:13:31to bigger venues.

00:13:32I mean,

00:13:32some of these artists

00:13:33just didn't get to do

00:13:33their 10,000 hours.

00:13:35I'm wondering as agents,

00:13:36like how did you

00:13:37work with those newer artists

00:13:39once the pandemic lifted

00:13:40and they were all of a sudden

00:13:42playing sizable shows?

00:13:43How did you prepare them

00:13:45for that?

00:13:46I don't know that

00:13:46we prepare them

00:13:47as much as their

00:13:48entire team does.

00:13:49I agree with you.

00:13:50They didn't have the benefit

00:13:51of using the club system

00:13:53and the theater system.

00:13:54But generationally,

00:13:57these artists

00:13:58have been playing music

00:13:58since they're young.

00:13:59They've always dreamed

00:14:00about this.

00:14:01So they were

00:14:01a bit more prepared.

00:14:04I think we were

00:14:04very diligent

00:14:05in terms of

00:14:06not stepping too far

00:14:08beyond where they

00:14:09should have been

00:14:10and allowing them

00:14:11to have that experience.

00:14:12We were very concerned

00:14:13about ticket pricing

00:14:14at that time.

00:14:15We just didn't know

00:14:15how the public,

00:14:16how quick they would

00:14:17come back.

00:14:19Packaging became

00:14:20really critical

00:14:20in that moment

00:14:21of who was playing

00:14:22with who.

00:14:24And of course,

00:14:24when the festivals

00:14:25came back,

00:14:26it was sort of

00:14:26the great boom

00:14:27of all those acts

00:14:28now got to be exposed.

00:14:31But in career development,

00:14:33it's usually a great

00:14:34team of people.

00:14:35You've got great management.

00:14:36You've got great agents.

00:14:38You've got a record company

00:14:39that has a point of view.

00:14:40And we're all sort of

00:14:41collaborating to protect

00:14:42those artists

00:14:43and give them the best

00:14:44platform to succeed.

00:14:46That's all we've ever

00:14:46tried to do is put them

00:14:47in a position

00:14:48where they can win.

00:14:49And being,

00:14:50you know,

00:14:52intentional about

00:14:54taking steps.

00:14:55You know,

00:14:56hitting the right steps

00:14:57and growing a career

00:14:59and really thinking

00:15:00long-term

00:15:01instead of trying

00:15:03to sweep everything,

00:15:04you know,

00:15:05off the table

00:15:06in the first go-round,

00:15:08really trying to be smart

00:15:09and intentional

00:15:10and build artists' careers

00:15:12because,

00:15:13you know,

00:15:13we've had artists

00:15:14we've represented

00:15:15for 35 years.

00:15:17And I think

00:15:18that is

00:15:19not only the reward,

00:15:21but if you do it right,

00:15:22you can accomplish

00:15:24every goal

00:15:25that an artist

00:15:26is looking for.

00:15:27And I have always

00:15:29found it so fascinating

00:15:30like how you guys

00:15:31decide what size

00:15:33of venues

00:15:33an artist is ready for

00:15:35because sometimes

00:15:36an artist does

00:15:37really well on streaming

00:15:38or they do really well

00:15:39on social media

00:15:40and those metrics

00:15:40are very visible

00:15:41to the public

00:15:42so they seem

00:15:43like they're ready

00:15:44for a huge venue.

00:15:45But sometimes they're not.

00:15:46Sometimes if you actually

00:15:47put up those ticket sales

00:15:48for an arena venue,

00:15:49they actually couldn't

00:15:50sell it out.

00:15:51So on the back end,

00:15:52how do you as agents

00:15:54try to gauge

00:15:55what an artist

00:15:56is actually ready

00:15:57to sell out?

00:15:58Well, you have

00:15:59a lot of data,

00:16:00which we never used

00:16:01to have it

00:16:01at your fingertips.

00:16:03But some of it

00:16:04is a gut instinct

00:16:05of what are you

00:16:05trying to do

00:16:06over a two

00:16:08or three year cycle?

00:16:10When Dua Lipa

00:16:11had no rules

00:16:12and that record

00:16:14had exploded

00:16:15and she was

00:16:15doing unbelievable

00:16:16business in theaters

00:16:18in America,

00:16:20we were getting

00:16:22to the end

00:16:22of that tour

00:16:22and there were people

00:16:23around her saying

00:16:24we should go play

00:16:24the forum.

00:16:25Let's end at the forum.

00:16:27And we very specifically said,

00:16:30if we move to an arena,

00:16:32where do we go next?

00:16:34Let's end.

00:16:35And we played

00:16:35the Palladium

00:16:36for two nights,

00:16:36which became

00:16:37two of the greatest shows

00:16:38I'd ever seen.

00:16:39The place was packed.

00:16:41Every celebrity was there.

00:16:42It was sweaty.

00:16:42It was just

00:16:43an incredible two nights.

00:16:44But that allowed us

00:16:45on the next record

00:16:46to put up an arena tour

00:16:48and say,

00:16:49okay, we had moved

00:16:50from being special guests

00:16:51and playing clubs

00:16:52to playing big theaters.

00:16:54And now we set it up

00:16:55to go to that next level.

00:16:57And so Rick used

00:16:58a great word intentional.

00:17:00We're always trying

00:17:01to think what's

00:17:01the next step?

00:17:02Where did we go to?

00:17:03So when you're going

00:17:03to make a move

00:17:04from theater to arena,

00:17:06arena to stadium,

00:17:07you want to take that data

00:17:08and make sure

00:17:08you're going to get there.

00:17:09You want to price

00:17:10the tickets correctly,

00:17:11but you want it

00:17:12to feel like a statement.

00:17:13And so a lot of it is

00:17:16when is it going

00:17:16to have the most impact?

00:17:18To just suddenly move

00:17:19in the middle of a tour

00:17:21with no sort of impact

00:17:23if it doesn't always work.

00:17:25So, but there are a lot

00:17:26of people who weigh in on that.

00:17:28Yeah.

00:17:28And post-COVID,

00:17:30and Rob just said it,

00:17:32you know,

00:17:32you have to make a statement

00:17:33because volume,

00:17:35there's a ton of volume.

00:17:36I mean, you can look

00:17:37at what plays in every city

00:17:40on a weekly basis.

00:17:41And there are a ton of shows.

00:17:44So somehow you have

00:17:45to figure out a way

00:17:46to cut through the clutter

00:17:47and break through

00:17:49and get noticed

00:17:51and get your,

00:17:52and have your fans be aware

00:17:54and really make a statement.

00:17:56A great example of that

00:17:57three summers ago

00:17:58was Harry Styles

00:18:00and his management team,

00:18:02you know,

00:18:02full stop and Jeffrey,

00:18:04everybody was playing stadiums.

00:18:07And Harry easily

00:18:08could have sold out

00:18:09two or three or four nights

00:18:11at MetLife Stadium.

00:18:12But everybody was playing

00:18:13MetLife Stadium.

00:18:14It wasn't even a big event

00:18:15because everybody was doing it.

00:18:17And they brilliantly

00:18:18come up with the idea

00:18:18of let's do 15 nights

00:18:20at Madison Square Garden.

00:18:21And he owned New York.

00:18:24Didn't matter who was

00:18:24playing the stadiums.

00:18:25Everybody was talking about

00:18:27that move.

00:18:29And so it was a huge statement

00:18:30and intentional.

00:18:32And at the time

00:18:33sort of caught everybody.

00:18:34Oh my God,

00:18:34this is, you know,

00:18:36what a standout moment

00:18:37in New York City.

00:18:38So I really do believe,

00:18:40you know,

00:18:40trying to find those moments

00:18:41are really part of our job.

00:18:44You can't create them every day

00:18:45and you can't create them

00:18:45on every tour.

00:18:46But any moves you're making

00:18:48should hopefully lead

00:18:49to something.

00:18:51And the statement

00:18:53for those people

00:18:55to say,

00:18:55I was there.

00:18:57You know,

00:18:57I saw that show.

00:18:58You know,

00:18:59like Rob can say

00:19:00he saw Bruce Springsteen

00:19:01at the bottom line,

00:19:02which about 10 billion people say,

00:19:04you know,

00:19:05but to actually say it

00:19:07is different.

00:19:08And I think that

00:19:09that's the moment too.

00:19:11And you,

00:19:12you,

00:19:13as you build audience,

00:19:15having your fans

00:19:16feel like they're connected

00:19:18and say,

00:19:18I was there

00:19:19is so important

00:19:21as you,

00:19:22as you build artists.

00:19:23I'll give you

00:19:24another great example.

00:19:25You know,

00:19:25three years ago,

00:19:27Sabrina Carpenter,

00:19:28who's been working

00:19:29at this for a long time.

00:19:30She's been working

00:19:31a long time.

00:19:32And she is smart

00:19:32and creative

00:19:33and she gets

00:19:35the third

00:19:37from the top slot

00:19:37on Coachella.

00:19:38And she took

00:19:39every dollar

00:19:40of her fee

00:19:41and put it

00:19:41into that stage

00:19:42and into her set.

00:19:44And it was epic.

00:19:46It was one

00:19:47of those performances

00:19:47that people still

00:19:48talk about,

00:19:50you know,

00:19:50for somebody

00:19:51who's not headlining

00:19:51to break through.

00:19:53And that set her

00:19:54on a path

00:19:55that's just undeniable.

00:19:57Four nights

00:19:57at the garden,

00:19:58five,

00:19:58six nights

00:19:59five nights

00:20:01at the garden,

00:20:01six nights

00:20:02at the forum.

00:20:03I think all came

00:20:04out of that moment.

00:20:06And headlining

00:20:07Coachella this year.

00:20:08Yeah,

00:20:08and then headlining

00:20:09Coachella this year.

00:20:10Yep.

00:20:10I love that people

00:20:12are recirculating clips

00:20:13from the past

00:20:14Coachella performance

00:20:15that Sabrina Carpenter

00:20:15did where she talks

00:20:16about how she's like,

00:20:17next time I see you,

00:20:18I'll be headlining.

00:20:19And then she came back

00:20:20one year later,

00:20:21exactly,

00:20:22and did it.

00:20:23So it's always great

00:20:24when you have an artist

00:20:25who's unbelievably talented

00:20:26and then creative

00:20:28and smart

00:20:28at the same time.

00:20:29It all really

00:20:30played well for her.

00:20:31I also say,

00:20:33you know,

00:20:33talent and ambition

00:20:35are a dangerous

00:20:35combination.

00:20:37You know,

00:20:38they really are.

00:20:39Yeah,

00:20:40yeah.

00:20:40I mean,

00:20:41one of the things

00:20:42that you guys touched on

00:20:42that I have found

00:20:43to be really fascinating

00:20:44is,

00:20:45you know,

00:20:46Harry Styles doing

00:20:47all of those dates

00:20:48at Madison Square Garden.

00:20:49we're starting to see

00:20:51more and more artists

00:20:52do almost like

00:20:52mini-residencies

00:20:53in different markets,

00:20:55whether,

00:20:56I mean,

00:20:56I find it really fascinating

00:20:57that LCD sound system

00:20:58goes back to New York

00:20:59every December,

00:21:00it seems like now,

00:21:02and plays through

00:21:03a ton of different shows.

00:21:04We're also seeing

00:21:06artists like Beyonce

00:21:07maybe doing fewer cities,

00:21:08but more dates

00:21:09within those cities.

00:21:11I'm wondering,

00:21:11why do you think

00:21:12that's occurring now?

00:21:14Well,

00:21:14I think the cost

00:21:15of touring

00:21:15has gone up

00:21:16exponentially,

00:21:17and the size

00:21:19of these productions

00:21:20becomes more

00:21:20and more intricate

00:21:21that if you can sit

00:21:22in one place,

00:21:24you can actually

00:21:24make them a little bigger

00:21:25and make them

00:21:26way more impactful,

00:21:27and the audience

00:21:28is willing to come to you.

00:21:30So,

00:21:31you know,

00:21:31if Beyonce goes

00:21:32into New York

00:21:32for a week and a half

00:21:33or two weeks,

00:21:34Boston,

00:21:35Washington,

00:21:36Philly,

00:21:36they're all going

00:21:37to come to her

00:21:37if that's the only

00:21:38place to see it.

00:21:39So there's a cost factor,

00:21:41and then there's a wear

00:21:42and tear on people's lives.

00:21:43You know,

00:21:44if you've got children

00:21:45and any other part

00:21:48of your life,

00:21:49sitting in one place

00:21:50actually makes it

00:21:50more palatable.

00:21:52I don't think

00:21:52the day-to-day

00:21:53play a city,

00:21:54get on the bus,

00:21:55and go to the next city

00:21:55is ever going to go away.

00:21:57But if you have control

00:21:58of your environment

00:21:59and your career path

00:22:01and you're at that moment,

00:22:02it's certainly easier

00:22:04to tour,

00:22:05and then it makes

00:22:06that statement.

00:22:07You know,

00:22:07it's just a big,

00:22:08big difference.

00:22:09And to get technical,

00:22:11you know,

00:22:12a huge tour

00:22:13eight years ago,

00:22:1610 years ago,

00:22:17was like 13 trucks.

00:22:19I mean,

00:22:19that would be like,

00:22:19oh my God,

00:22:20that is a massive tour.

00:22:23This is like semi-trucks.

00:22:25You know,

00:22:25tours now are carrying

00:22:2630,

00:22:2740,

00:22:2850,

00:22:30you know,

00:22:30trucks of production.

00:22:32Yeah.

00:22:32And,

00:22:33you know,

00:22:33to move that

00:22:35is incredibly expensive.

00:22:38And,

00:22:38you know,

00:22:40it's just,

00:22:41you know,

00:22:42again,

00:22:43everything has been amped up.

00:22:45So in this boom

00:22:46post-COVID,

00:22:48you know,

00:22:49artists are taking it

00:22:50to a level

00:22:50that no one's ever seen before.

00:22:52One of our colleagues

00:22:53took his daughter

00:22:55to her first concert,

00:22:56which was Benson Boone.

00:22:58And he's like,

00:22:59it was amazing.

00:23:00But now every time

00:23:01she sees a show,

00:23:02she's like,

00:23:02why doesn't anyone

00:23:03swing you from a chandelier

00:23:04across the audience?

00:23:06No backflips?

00:23:06Yeah.

00:23:07So you're seeing

00:23:08these things happen

00:23:09in our business

00:23:09that are so amazing,

00:23:11but it is expensive

00:23:13and there is a cost to that.

00:23:15Yeah.

00:23:16That makes sense.

00:23:16I mean,

00:23:17the amount of trucks

00:23:18is absolutely crazy to me.

00:23:21I think the weekend

00:23:22on the stadium tour

00:23:23is 60.

00:23:2460.

00:23:24You know,

00:23:26the other thing too

00:23:26is if you go back

00:23:2820 or 30 years,

00:23:29a band like Bon Jovi

00:23:30would do 150 shows

00:23:31in 150 cities

00:23:33and play the whole world

00:23:35in order to break the world,

00:23:38not just break North America.

00:23:39Now,

00:23:40because of social media

00:23:41and the way you can interact

00:23:42with your fans,

00:23:43you don't have to do that

00:23:44as much to talk

00:23:45to the whole universe

00:23:46because people are seeing

00:23:47the clips every night.

00:23:49Anyway,

00:23:50and it's sort of

00:23:50what drives it.

00:23:51It's not unlike

00:23:52the movie business

00:23:54when it's great,

00:23:55the word of mouth.

00:23:56So whether,

00:23:57you know,

00:23:57it's Dua

00:23:58or it's Sabrina

00:23:58or it's Gracie Taylor.

00:24:01I mean,

00:24:01the shows are so powerful,

00:24:03you know,

00:24:04and that video gets out

00:24:05and it just drives ticket sales.

00:24:07So it's a lot easier

00:24:08to cover more ground

00:24:09with less cities

00:24:11than it used to be,

00:24:12which then creates

00:24:14a void in those markets

00:24:14for other bands

00:24:15to go in and play.

00:24:16So you're sort of

00:24:17adapting to it.

00:24:19And a lot of the older

00:24:20acts in Heritage Rock bands

00:24:21will go into those markets

00:24:22and do great.

00:24:22So yeah,

00:24:24absolutely.

00:24:24And I wanted to go back

00:24:26to Coachella,

00:24:27which we talked about

00:24:28a little bit earlier.

00:24:29So Coachella decided

00:24:30to put its tickets

00:24:32for 2026 Coachella

00:24:33on sale very early

00:24:35this year.

00:24:36I have to say,

00:24:37I read that at the time

00:24:38as them maybe being nervous

00:24:39about not selling out.

00:24:40I know that that's been

00:24:41an increasing issue

00:24:43for them over the last few years.

00:24:44But Coachella 2026

00:24:46sold out pretty immediately.

00:24:48I'm wondering,

00:24:49why do you guys

00:24:50think it sold so quickly?

00:24:53Why did it do so well?

00:24:54Is it the lineup?

00:24:54Is it increased interest

00:24:56in festivals again?

00:24:58What do you attribute that to?

00:24:59Well, nothing replaces

00:25:00Star Power.

00:25:01And it's a great lineup.

00:25:03Let's be fair.

00:25:04I think part of going earlier

00:25:06is they realize

00:25:07the public is getting

00:25:08more and more trained

00:25:09to buying earlier.

00:25:10And so waiting till January

00:25:12seems really late

00:25:14in the cycle.

00:25:15And Coachella

00:25:16has always wanted

00:25:17to be first.

00:25:18They wanted to sort of

00:25:18put out,

00:25:19make a statement

00:25:20about the festival season.

00:25:22And, you know,

00:25:24when they knew

00:25:24they had Justin Bieber,

00:25:25who hadn't done anything

00:25:26for a long time

00:25:27and had these two

00:25:29great records come out,

00:25:30it was,

00:25:31you wanted to go early.

00:25:32You wanted to say,

00:25:33we're going to be

00:25:34the most important festival

00:25:35of the year.

00:25:36Now,

00:25:36Juralala feels different

00:25:38in this one.

00:25:38You know,

00:25:38they all feel like they have,

00:25:39and they're all

00:25:40incredible festivals.

00:25:42But it was a great

00:25:43opportunity

00:25:44to make a statement.

00:25:46And the public's waiting.

00:25:48So, you know,

00:25:48they want to buy in advance.

00:25:49They want to make those plans.

00:25:51They want to be able to travel.

00:25:52I think it was very smart

00:25:53on Paul and his team's

00:25:55part to go earlier.

00:25:57And they had also seen

00:25:58that from stagecoach.

00:25:59Stagecoach had always

00:26:00been going earlier.

00:26:02So I think it was

00:26:03a smart move.

00:26:04You know,

00:26:04when you have

00:26:04the lineup they have,

00:26:06Sabrina and Justin,

00:26:07you're going to do great.

00:26:09So why not go early

00:26:11and let the public

00:26:12make plans?

00:26:13Yeah.

00:26:14To me,

00:26:14festivals kind of feel

00:26:15like the perfect thing

00:26:17in this moment,

00:26:18given they're kind of

00:26:19a bang for your buck.

00:26:20And also in a time

00:26:21when people are willing

00:26:21to travel to concerts

00:26:22and travel to the shows

00:26:24that they want to see,

00:26:25it feels kind of perfect.

00:26:27But yet,

00:26:27it seems like ticket sales

00:26:29have been a little bit

00:26:29soft with festivals recently.

00:26:31It doesn't seem like

00:26:32it's quite as hot

00:26:32as it was in the 2010s.

00:26:34I mean,

00:26:34correct me if I'm wrong,

00:26:35but I'm wondering

00:26:36why that seems

00:26:38to be happening right now.

00:26:39There's a lot of factors.

00:26:41You know,

00:26:41anytime you ask

00:26:41a question like that,

00:26:42there's no one answer

00:26:43that fills the void.

00:26:45Part of it is

00:26:46you've got so many shows

00:26:47and ticket prices

00:26:48have gone up,

00:26:49so there's an actual

00:26:50how much money

00:26:51do I have?

00:26:52I've got to pick

00:26:52and choose

00:26:53where I'm going to go.

00:26:56Part of it is

00:26:57who the headliners are.

00:26:59And then there was

00:27:00just a proliferation

00:27:00of festivals,

00:27:01so they were everywhere.

00:27:03So you couldn't

00:27:04go to everyone.

00:27:06And so when you feel

00:27:06some of the softness

00:27:07on the edges,

00:27:08it's really a function

00:27:09of I can't be

00:27:11at every one.

00:27:12I'm going to pick

00:27:12and choose

00:27:13and they got more regional.

00:27:15The granddaddies,

00:27:16the Lollapaloozas

00:27:17and the Coachellas

00:27:18and, you know,

00:27:19the giant ones

00:27:20in Europe,

00:27:20they have such

00:27:21institutional knowledge

00:27:23of what it's going

00:27:24to be and the fans do

00:27:25that it's almost

00:27:26a rite of passage.

00:27:27You know,

00:27:27it's why you see

00:27:28so many high school kids.

00:27:30You know,

00:27:30I think L.A.

00:27:31now closes

00:27:31all the school systems

00:27:32the Monday

00:27:33after Coachella

00:27:34because they know

00:27:35the kids are going

00:27:36to go

00:27:36and it is a rite of passage.

00:27:39But yet,

00:27:40I think all the festivals

00:27:41have done a great job

00:27:41bringing older talent

00:27:42in when David Byrne

00:27:44plays at Coachella

00:27:45or Brian Ferry

00:27:48plays at a festival.

00:27:49I think it's great

00:27:50because those kids

00:27:51know those bands.

00:27:52They've actually gone

00:27:53and discovered them.

00:27:55And it's somewhat cyclical,

00:27:57you know.

00:27:57And so,

00:27:58but I don't think festivals

00:27:59are ever going away.

00:28:00The one thing

00:28:01that AI can't touch,

00:28:03computers can't touch,

00:28:04live music is live music.

00:28:06And there's nothing

00:28:07you can put in its place.

00:28:09I don't care how cool

00:28:10it looks on a screen

00:28:12this big.

00:28:13The reality is

00:28:14it's not the same.

00:28:16And,

00:28:16and I actually feel

00:28:18as kids get more detached

00:28:19because of social media,

00:28:22festivals are the one thing

00:28:23that bring them back together.

00:28:24It is the thing

00:28:25that allows them

00:28:25to share

00:28:26a common experience.

00:28:29And we're constantly

00:28:30trying to create

00:28:31that Bruce Springsteen

00:28:31moment for me.

00:28:32I was there.

00:28:34And,

00:28:34also,

00:28:35you,

00:28:36you cannot

00:28:37understate

00:28:39the complexity

00:28:40of curating

00:28:41these events.

00:28:43Yeah.

00:28:43I mean,

00:28:44it is

00:28:44an overwhelming

00:28:46undertaking

00:28:47from,

00:28:48you know,

00:28:48a Coachella lineup

00:28:49to a See Here Now lineup.

00:28:51There are,

00:28:52you know,

00:28:52there are great festivals

00:28:53that happen all over

00:28:54the country.

00:28:55And it is really,

00:28:56really hard

00:28:57to thread the needle

00:28:59and kind of see

00:29:00what the audience

00:29:01is doing

00:29:02and see how Coachella

00:29:03has changed

00:29:04and what they're

00:29:05putting on the show.

00:29:06And,

00:29:06you know,

00:29:07everything is

00:29:07constantly evolving

00:29:08as,

00:29:09you know,

00:29:10hip-hop was here,

00:29:12it's,

00:29:13now it's gone down

00:29:14and now electronic,

00:29:15which was here,

00:29:16it's gone down

00:29:17and now it's back

00:29:18and anima's

00:29:19one of the headliners.

00:29:19So there's so much

00:29:21that goes into

00:29:22knowing the marketplace

00:29:24and knowing the audience

00:29:26because the audiences

00:29:28have gotten younger

00:29:29at the festivals.

00:29:30So,

00:29:31you know,

00:29:32I don't see it as much

00:29:33but if you go to

00:29:35Lala or Gov Ball

00:29:36or Coachella,

00:29:37it is 16,

00:29:38it's young kids

00:29:39and,

00:29:40you know,

00:29:40that's just a different

00:29:41type of curation.

00:29:42But,

00:29:43you know,

00:29:43at Coachella last year

00:29:45when Dudamel's playing

00:29:47with the L.A. Phil

00:29:48and it's packed,

00:29:51I thought that was amazing,

00:29:53you know,

00:29:53so I just,

00:29:55I give huge credit

00:29:57to the people

00:29:58who curate these festivals.

00:29:59It is a daunting task

00:30:01and they do it

00:30:02incredibly well.

00:30:03Yeah,

00:30:04I mean,

00:30:04it really is

00:30:05a daunting task

00:30:06and,

00:30:06I mean,

00:30:07especially with a thing

00:30:08like Coachella,

00:30:09you have all different genres,

00:30:10you're trying to target

00:30:11all different ages

00:30:12and demographics

00:30:12to try to get everyone

00:30:13there at the same time.

00:30:14I think that's why

00:30:15I love Coachella so much

00:30:16is because I feel like

00:30:17I can go there

00:30:18and discover things

00:30:19that I did not show up for

00:30:20but it's there

00:30:21so,

00:30:22you know,

00:30:22if I'm walking past the tent,

00:30:24why not go inside

00:30:25and check it out

00:30:25for a little bit

00:30:26and then maybe

00:30:27I become a fan.

00:30:28But,

00:30:29I think one of the

00:30:30things that I've been hearing

00:30:31from some of our

00:30:32live music reporters here

00:30:34is that

00:30:35there are people

00:30:37showing up later

00:30:37and later

00:30:38to festivals

00:30:38during the day

00:30:39which means that

00:30:41those baby artists

00:30:42who are at the bottom

00:30:43of the billing

00:30:43and at the top of the day

00:30:45are maybe having

00:30:46less crowds.

00:30:48I mean,

00:30:48they've always had

00:30:49very sparse crowds

00:30:50at that

00:30:51but I'm wondering

00:30:51do you still think

00:30:52that for your emerging

00:30:53artists at CAA

00:30:54that being on

00:30:56those festival lineups

00:30:57is still worthwhile

00:30:58as it once was?

00:31:00Well,

00:31:00I've said this for years

00:31:02about those slots

00:31:03and this is where

00:31:05agenting really

00:31:06plays a role

00:31:07in the artist development

00:31:08of a career.

00:31:09Part of getting on

00:31:09a festival

00:31:10is being on the poster.

00:31:12You want to be part of that.

00:31:13And playing at 12

00:31:15or 1 or 2 o'clock

00:31:16may not be great

00:31:17but a great agent

00:31:19is going to stop

00:31:19and say

00:31:20how do I get back

00:31:21to that market

00:31:22within 4 or 5 months

00:31:23of having done that gig?

00:31:24Because the 2 or 3,000 kids

00:31:26who might have seen me

00:31:27and have told their friends

00:31:29now want to be able

00:31:30to see them on their own.

00:31:32And so

00:31:33to just show up

00:31:35anywhere

00:31:35and play one day

00:31:37at 2 o'clock

00:31:38and then disappear

00:31:38for a year

00:31:39is bad management

00:31:41bad agenting.

00:31:42If you're going to get

00:31:43one of those slots

00:31:43how am I going to

00:31:44take advantage

00:31:45of that moment

00:31:46and make other things

00:31:47happen off the back of it?

00:31:48What am I going to do

00:31:49on social media?

00:31:50Am I going to show up

00:31:51at late night events?

00:31:52The beauty of Lollapalooza

00:31:53is all the late night

00:31:53club gigs

00:31:54so all those bands

00:31:55get to find places

00:31:56to play.

00:31:58And so I think

00:32:00there is a real

00:32:01it's where

00:32:02the representation

00:32:03comes in

00:32:04in taking advantage

00:32:05of a moment.

00:32:06And unto itself

00:32:07no, it's not the greatest

00:32:08spot in the world.

00:32:09But if it's done right

00:32:10and you really have

00:32:11good people around you

00:32:12you can really turn

00:32:13it into something

00:32:14and you can chart

00:32:16the bands

00:32:16who are on early

00:32:17and then play

00:32:17six or seven o'clock

00:32:19and then four years

00:32:20later headlining

00:32:21that's the track.

00:32:23I think the headline

00:32:23slot is such

00:32:24a fascinating thing.

00:32:25There's so few artists

00:32:26who are able

00:32:27to hold that

00:32:28especially at one

00:32:28of the premier festivals

00:32:30like your Coachella's

00:32:30of the world

00:32:31your Glastonbury's.

00:32:33I'm wondering

00:32:34in those negotiations

00:32:36when someone's

00:32:37approached you

00:32:38and said

00:32:38you know

00:32:38we want your artist

00:32:39to headline.

00:32:40I know you've done

00:32:40this with Beyonce.

00:32:42What are some

00:32:43of the things

00:32:43that you can negotiate

00:32:44back and forth?

00:32:46Like is it

00:32:47stuff that she can

00:32:48bring on stage?

00:32:49Is it the fees?

00:32:50I know there's

00:32:51so many considerations

00:32:52so can you give us

00:32:53any sort of peek

00:32:54behind the curtain

00:32:54and how that works?

00:32:57I don't want to get

00:32:57into the specifics

00:32:58of a deal.

00:32:59When Beyonce

00:32:59did Homecoming

00:33:00which I still think

00:33:01might be one of

00:33:02the greatest

00:33:03ever

00:33:04you know

00:33:05single performances

00:33:06at a festival

00:33:07she really wanted

00:33:09a second stage

00:33:09and they had never

00:33:10done one.

00:33:11It was the first time

00:33:12they ever let an artist

00:33:13do it

00:33:13and she had a vision

00:33:16and to her credit

00:33:18in rehearsal

00:33:18she brought Paul

00:33:19to let down

00:33:20to see it

00:33:20what she was going

00:33:21to do

00:33:22and he said

00:33:25I'm going to let it happen.

00:33:26Well now it's

00:33:27sort of commonplace

00:33:28to do it.

00:33:29Gaga took it

00:33:29to a whole new level

00:33:31this year

00:33:31in one of the most

00:33:32you know

00:33:32epic performances

00:33:34at a festival

00:33:34so

00:33:35yeah you're always

00:33:37looking for those

00:33:38opportunities.

00:33:39The secret sauce

00:33:40to Coachella

00:33:41and a couple

00:33:41of festivals

00:33:42is also

00:33:42the YouTube broadcast

00:33:43because worldwide

00:33:45Coachella is now

00:33:47a worldwide moment.

00:33:49Everybody

00:33:49who's not there

00:33:50is watching

00:33:51and so

00:33:52you're not just

00:33:53talking to the

00:33:53100,000 people

00:33:55you're talking to

00:33:55millions of people

00:33:56around the world.

00:33:57Glastonbury does that

00:33:58La Pollute Lucid

00:33:59does that

00:34:00and those moments

00:34:01are

00:34:01unbelievable

00:34:03you get to talk

00:34:04to the whole world

00:34:05so

00:34:06and the audiences

00:34:08are worldwide

00:34:09I mean

00:34:09Carol G

00:34:10on Coachella

00:34:11and then

00:34:11you know

00:34:12you look at

00:34:14Blackpink

00:34:15who did Coachella

00:34:15I mean

00:34:16there's so many

00:34:17you know

00:34:17artists that are

00:34:19you know

00:34:19global

00:34:20and that's

00:34:21and that's

00:34:22also great

00:34:23for our business

00:34:24I mean

00:34:25it's grown

00:34:26our business

00:34:27incredibly

00:34:27not only

00:34:28domestically

00:34:29you know

00:34:29as foreign

00:34:31artists

00:34:31come in here

00:34:32but the same

00:34:33way pushing out

00:34:34you know

00:34:34American artists

00:34:36around the globe

00:34:36it's what's most

00:34:38exciting about

00:34:38what's happening

00:34:39right now

00:34:39and one other

00:34:41thing that's

00:34:42cropped up

00:34:42in the last

00:34:43five years

00:34:43that presents

00:34:44a really

00:34:44interesting

00:34:45opportunity

00:34:45for artists

00:34:46in the live

00:34:46music space

00:34:47is Sphere

00:34:48in Vegas

00:34:48what are the

00:34:49special circumstances

00:34:50that you have

00:34:51to keep in mind

00:34:51when an artist

00:34:52that you're

00:34:52working with

00:34:53wants to play

00:34:53Sphere

00:34:54I mean

00:34:54it's such

00:34:55a unique

00:34:55venue

00:34:56and such

00:34:57a unique

00:34:57experience

00:34:58that

00:34:58you really

00:35:00have to have

00:35:01a vision

00:35:01for what

00:35:02you're trying

00:35:02to do

00:35:02and understand

00:35:04what you're

00:35:05trying to convey

00:35:05I think

00:35:06the more

00:35:07shows that play

00:35:08and the more

00:35:08people see it

00:35:08they understand

00:35:09it better

00:35:09and everyone

00:35:10uses differently

00:35:11I had the

00:35:12privilege to

00:35:13be there

00:35:13before you

00:35:14two even

00:35:14opened

00:35:15and Zach

00:35:16Brown

00:35:16came with

00:35:16me

00:35:17he wanted

00:35:18to see it

00:35:19and literally

00:35:21walked out of

00:35:21the room

00:35:21and said

00:35:22I'm playing

00:35:22here

00:35:22like

00:35:23I

00:35:24I know

00:35:24I have

00:35:25this

00:35:25in my head

00:35:26I see

00:35:27exactly

00:35:27what I

00:35:27want to

00:35:28do

00:35:28and now

00:35:28you know

00:35:29he's gonna

00:35:29be doing

00:35:30eight shows

00:35:30there in

00:35:31December

00:35:31but it

00:35:34takes a

00:35:34visual artist

00:35:35and an

00:35:35artist who

00:35:36really

00:35:36understands

00:35:37what they're

00:35:37trying to

00:35:38say

00:35:38and I

00:35:39think

00:35:39you two

00:35:40did a

00:35:40great job

00:35:40opening it

00:35:41the Eagles

00:35:41show was

00:35:41fantastic

00:35:42you know

00:35:43what John

00:35:44Mayer did

00:35:44in creating

00:35:45the film

00:35:45behind the

00:35:46Grateful Dead

00:35:46show

00:35:46or the

00:35:47Dead & Co

00:35:47shows

00:35:48absolute genius

00:35:49I mean

00:35:50he really

00:35:50took you

00:35:51on a trip

00:35:51for those

00:35:52four hours

00:35:53and

00:35:54my hope

00:35:57is that

00:35:58people who

00:35:58see something

00:35:58in the

00:35:59sphere

00:35:59just get

00:35:59excited

00:36:00and want

00:36:00to see

00:36:00more music

00:36:01because I

00:36:01think if you

00:36:02have a good

00:36:02experience in a

00:36:03concert

00:36:03you want to

00:36:04do it again

00:36:05the epitome

00:36:07of probably

00:36:08that is going to

00:36:09open the door to a lot

00:36:10of artists is the

00:36:10Backstreet Boys

00:36:11you know

00:36:12they

00:36:13you know

00:36:14with their

00:36:14management

00:36:14they were playing

00:36:16just a regular

00:36:16showroom there

00:36:17and someone said

00:36:17let's go

00:36:18and they created

00:36:19truly one of the

00:36:20most fun nights

00:36:21of music

00:36:22yeah I went

00:36:23it's fun

00:36:24it's really fun

00:36:25and the visuals

00:36:26so fit

00:36:27who they were

00:36:28and everyone

00:36:29there walked out

00:36:30with a big smile

00:36:30on their face

00:36:31and

00:36:32and that's

00:36:34what you want

00:36:34to see happen

00:36:35and I have

00:36:35no doubt

00:36:36there's a pun

00:36:38no doubt going

00:36:40it's going to

00:36:40create the same

00:36:41environment

00:36:41people are going

00:36:41to walk out

00:36:42going wow

00:36:42that was incredible

00:36:43but similar to

00:36:45a giant festival

00:36:46you're eventizing

00:36:49an experience

00:36:49where you can say

00:36:51I was there

00:36:52I saw you two

00:36:54in the first show

00:36:55at the Sphere

00:36:55and you're creating

00:36:56and eventizing

00:36:57something

00:36:58and making it

00:36:59so much larger

00:37:01which is what

00:37:01the Sphere is

00:37:02it's just

00:37:03so much larger

00:37:04than a regular

00:37:05concert

00:37:06when I saw

00:37:06Backstreet Boys

00:37:07I mean

00:37:07they were celebrating

00:37:08the 20th anniversary

00:37:09of Millennium

00:37:11their album

00:37:11I thought that

00:37:12that was such

00:37:13a great way

00:37:13to remind people

00:37:14of their greatness

00:37:16of what they did

00:37:1820 years ago

00:37:18and they also

00:37:19introduced Millennium 2.0

00:37:20the second

00:37:21you know

00:37:22iteration of this album

00:37:23while they were

00:37:24doing that

00:37:24and I thought that

00:37:25that presented

00:37:26such a great opportunity

00:37:27for a legacy artist

00:37:29to kind of

00:37:32create an event

00:37:33around an anniversary

00:37:34and to kind of

00:37:35drive attention

00:37:36back to

00:37:37one of their

00:37:38greatest moments

00:37:38but I feel like

00:37:40there's a lot of

00:37:40opportunities right now

00:37:41for legacy artists

00:37:42that are really

00:37:43interesting

00:37:43I saw Abba Voyage

00:37:44in London

00:37:45gosh what

00:37:47a year or so ago

00:37:48I'm wondering

00:37:49what you guys think

00:37:50are some of the

00:37:51exciting opportunities

00:37:52on the landscape

00:37:53in live music

00:37:54for your legacy artists

00:37:56well legacy

00:37:58or heritage

00:37:59or whatever

00:38:00we call them

00:38:01they

00:38:02they never go away

00:38:04there's something

00:38:05about music

00:38:06that literally

00:38:08defines your youth

00:38:09and so

00:38:10millions of articles

00:38:13written about the fact

00:38:14that most people

00:38:14consume music

00:38:15between 16 and 25

00:38:16that's the soundtrack

00:38:18of their life

00:38:18right

00:38:19it doesn't mean

00:38:20they won't hear

00:38:20a new thing

00:38:21here or there

00:38:21but they really

00:38:22build their body

00:38:23of work

00:38:24so you know

00:38:25someone in

00:38:26my 60s

00:38:27the Beatles

00:38:27and the Rolling Stones

00:38:28and the Who

00:38:29were what formed

00:38:30my childhood

00:38:31someone today

00:38:33who's 20

00:38:34it's going to be

00:38:35Taylor Swift

00:38:35and Dua Lipa

00:38:37and Sabrina Carpenter

00:38:38and you know

00:38:39Conan Gray

00:38:39and all these

00:38:40you know

00:38:40the weekend

00:38:41and 20-30 years

00:38:44from now

00:38:44that's going to be

00:38:45their artists

00:38:46that they look at

00:38:47and can't wait

00:38:48to go back

00:38:48to feel young again

00:38:50because it makes

00:38:51you feel young

00:38:52and that's the

00:38:53power of music

00:38:54no other art form

00:38:55transports you

00:38:56back in time

00:38:57so how do you

00:38:58take advantage

00:38:58of those moments

00:38:59you know

00:39:00you need artists

00:39:01who are creative

00:39:02I'm not a big fan

00:39:04of anniversaries

00:39:05past 20

00:39:06because I don't

00:39:07want to date

00:39:07the audience

00:39:07I don't want

00:39:08when you say 50 years

00:39:09then the audience

00:39:10immediately looks

00:39:11in the mirror

00:39:11and goes

00:39:11oh shit

00:39:12how am I

00:39:13so

00:39:13I remember being

00:39:15there 50 years

00:39:15yeah

00:39:16so I'm not sure

00:39:17I'm always

00:39:18an anniversary person

00:39:19but I love

00:39:19when artists

00:39:20celebrate

00:39:21who and what

00:39:22they are

00:39:22you know

00:39:23Paul McCartney

00:39:23does

00:39:23he's a Beatle

00:39:25and he owns it

00:39:26and those shows

00:39:27are incredible

00:39:28you know

00:39:29Bruce never fails

00:39:30to give you

00:39:31that same experience

00:39:33we finally

00:39:34convinced

00:39:35John Mellencamp

00:39:37to do a

00:39:37greatest hits tour

00:39:38so he's going

00:39:39to go out

00:39:39and sort of

00:39:40do you know

00:39:41that incredible

00:39:43catalog of music

00:39:44the way the public

00:39:45wants to hear it

00:39:46and so

00:39:48finding a way

00:39:49to market it

00:39:50the best part

00:39:50is you know

00:39:52I went

00:39:52we have the privilege

00:39:53to work with ACDC

00:39:54along with Chris Dalston

00:39:56and if you went

00:39:58to the show

00:39:58last summer

00:39:59in the stadiums

00:39:59it was three generations

00:40:01it was grandfathers

00:40:03fathers

00:40:04and their sons

00:40:05all watching

00:40:06this band

00:40:08do this incredible

00:40:09rock show

00:40:10and that's the beauty

00:40:12of music

00:40:12that's when legacy

00:40:13really kicks in

00:40:15when you start

00:40:15to bring

00:40:16and there were

00:40:16a lot of young girls

00:40:17at Backstreet Boys

00:40:18you know

00:40:18moms bringing

00:40:18their daughters

00:40:19to see it

00:40:20so

00:40:20also

00:40:21you know

00:40:22something

00:40:23social media

00:40:25which obviously

00:40:26drives

00:40:27you know

00:40:28a younger audience

00:40:29and pop music

00:40:30but you saw

00:40:31with the Goo Goo Dolls

00:40:33who we don't represent

00:40:34and the TikTok

00:40:36explosion of Iris

00:40:38they had the biggest

00:40:40year in their career

00:40:41ever

00:40:42ever

00:40:43so it can work

00:40:45other ways

00:40:46as well

00:40:46and you see

00:40:48bands

00:40:48take hold

00:40:49and grow

00:40:50like we've never

00:40:52seen before

00:40:53which is also

00:40:54really fun

00:40:54and exciting

00:40:55and it's

00:40:56totally genre-less

00:40:58that you're seeing

00:40:58this happen

00:40:59it's hard rock

00:41:00and metal

00:41:01and it's pop

00:41:02like with the

00:41:02Backstreet Boys

00:41:03and Goo Goo Dolls

00:41:04I mean it's

00:41:04it's incredible

00:41:05and even the whole

00:41:07Grateful Dead thing

00:41:09I mean it's like

00:41:09the audiences

00:41:11you know

00:41:12which is

00:41:12they've been around

00:41:13for 60 years

00:41:15and you see

00:41:17where that is headed

00:41:18now

00:41:18and what the age

00:41:19limit of the audience

00:41:19and half the people

00:41:20haven't even

00:41:21saw a show

00:41:22with Jerry Garcia

00:41:23yeah

00:41:24so true

00:41:25I mean

00:41:26we were talking

00:41:26earlier about

00:41:27how artists

00:41:28are really upping

00:41:29the production value

00:41:30of their shows

00:41:30going up to

00:41:31you know

00:41:31sometimes up to

00:41:3260 trucks worth

00:41:33of equipment

00:41:34that they're

00:41:34lugging around

00:41:35with them

00:41:36across the country

00:41:37on their tours

00:41:38I mean

00:41:39we're also talking

00:41:40about the rising

00:41:40costs of touring

00:41:41I imagine

00:41:42that it makes it

00:41:42really hard

00:41:43for an artist

00:41:44to make a statement

00:41:45and to keep up

00:41:46with everyone

00:41:46but also still

00:41:48make money

00:41:49I imagine

00:41:50is that

00:41:50an increasing

00:41:51challenge for your

00:41:52artists

00:41:52to be able to

00:41:53make money

00:41:54on their

00:41:54touring

00:41:55and how

00:41:56does that

00:41:56differ

00:41:56depending on

00:41:57how big

00:41:58the artist

00:41:58is

00:41:59like

00:41:59are big

00:41:59artists

00:41:59making tons

00:42:00of money

00:42:00and small

00:42:01artists

00:42:01are just

00:42:02scraping by

00:42:03the whole time

00:42:04like tell me

00:42:05a little bit

00:42:05about that

00:42:06funny enough

00:42:07I think the

00:42:08economics are

00:42:08similar

00:42:09as you're

00:42:10carrying so much

00:42:12on the top

00:42:12level

00:42:13and just the

00:42:14expensive

00:42:14when you're

00:42:15not making

00:42:15as much

00:42:16on the

00:42:16lower level

00:42:17it's

00:42:19I would say

00:42:20artists are

00:42:21doing just fine

00:42:22that's a great

00:42:23thing

00:42:23you wouldn't see

00:42:24them all on

00:42:24the road

00:42:25at the same

00:42:26time

00:42:27it's

00:42:27management

00:42:28you have

00:42:28to manage

00:42:29you know

00:42:30what you

00:42:30carry

00:42:30how many

00:42:31people in

00:42:31a crew

00:42:31that you

00:42:32carry

00:42:32you have

00:42:32to manage

00:42:33you know

00:42:34as Rob

00:42:34said earlier

00:42:35how long

00:42:35a drives

00:42:36you're doing

00:42:36how many

00:42:37days in a

00:42:38row

00:42:38how many

00:42:38shows

00:42:38per week

00:42:39all the

00:42:40things that

00:42:40we factor

00:42:41in to

00:42:42building a

00:42:43tour and

00:42:43building a

00:42:44tour budget

00:42:44and then

00:42:46kind of

00:42:46figuring out

00:42:47how you

00:42:47price it

00:42:47out

00:42:47do you

00:42:48need

00:42:48some of

00:42:48these

00:42:49massive

00:42:49tours

00:42:49have two

00:42:50rigs

00:42:50they have

00:42:51an A rig

00:42:51and a

00:42:51B rig

00:42:54from city

00:42:54to city

00:42:55ahead of

00:42:55the next

00:42:56show

00:42:56which saves

00:42:57money in

00:42:58terms of

00:42:58setting up

00:42:58production

00:42:59in stadiums

00:43:01you'll notice

00:43:02if you now

00:43:02pay attention

00:43:03a lot of

00:43:04back-to-back

00:43:04shows in

00:43:05stadiums

00:43:06so ACDC

00:43:08can share

00:43:09the stage

00:43:10with Billy Joel

00:43:11back-to-back

00:43:13you know

00:43:13somewhere

00:43:13to save

00:43:15costs

00:43:15and not

00:43:16having to

00:43:17you know

00:43:17entirely put up

00:43:19all new

00:43:19steel and

00:43:20terraplast on

00:43:20the floor

00:43:21of the stadium

00:43:22so there's

00:43:23ways that

00:43:23we're trying

00:43:23to figure

00:43:24out how

00:43:24we can

00:43:25you know

00:43:26save

00:43:26costs

00:43:27and be

00:43:29smart

00:43:30as we

00:43:30kind of

00:43:30route

00:43:31and book

00:43:31tours

00:43:31and working

00:43:32with

00:43:32promoter

00:43:33partners

00:43:33to figure

00:43:34that out

00:43:34and not

00:43:36everybody

00:43:36needs

00:43:37the giant

00:43:39productions

00:43:40you know

00:43:40Bruce Springsteen

00:43:41has one

00:43:41video screen

00:43:42and the

00:43:43music delivers

00:43:44so for a lot

00:43:45of these

00:43:45artists

00:43:45it's just

00:43:46finding the

00:43:46right setting

00:43:47and being

00:43:49aware of who

00:43:49your audience

00:43:50is and what

00:43:50it is

00:43:50or then

00:43:51creating a

00:43:51package

00:43:52the Charlie

00:43:52XAX

00:43:53choice of

00:43:53on package

00:43:54it was one

00:43:54stage

00:43:55one set

00:43:55and they

00:43:56came together

00:43:57and figured

00:43:57out how to

00:43:57use it

00:43:58together

00:43:58and everybody

00:44:00did great

00:44:00so costs

00:44:02are going to

00:44:03go up

00:44:03sort of what

00:44:05drives ticket

00:44:05prices

00:44:05but a lot

00:44:07of smart

00:44:08people out

00:44:08there trying

00:44:09to make it

00:44:09work

00:44:09and not

00:44:10everybody

00:44:10is trying

00:44:11to compete

00:44:11with the

00:44:12next person

00:44:12now if

00:44:15you're Taylor

00:44:15Swift or

00:44:15Beyonce

00:44:16you've created

00:44:16this holier

00:44:18than that

00:44:18big event

00:44:19so you

00:44:20have to

00:44:20live up

00:44:21to that

00:44:21in a way

00:44:22and sometimes

00:44:23I think

00:44:23that's why

00:44:24artists

00:44:24totally switch

00:44:25and just

00:44:25go play

00:44:26small

00:44:26because they

00:44:27realize they

00:44:28can be

00:44:28intimate

00:44:28and create

00:44:29the same

00:44:29sort of

00:44:30thing

00:44:30so we're

00:44:31always trying

00:44:31to give

00:44:31artists

00:44:32different

00:44:32options

00:44:33on how

00:44:33to go

00:44:33out there

00:44:33and I

00:44:35mean as

00:44:35well as

00:44:36the cost

00:44:37of touring

00:44:37rising

00:44:38we're also

00:44:39seeing ticket

00:44:39prices rise

00:44:40as well

00:44:40I know

00:44:41that Bruce

00:44:42Springsteen

00:44:43did try

00:44:43dynamic

00:44:43ticketing

00:44:44a few

00:44:45years ago

00:44:45and that

00:44:46led to

00:44:46some of the

00:44:47tickets ending

00:44:47up being

00:44:48thousands of

00:44:48dollars I'm

00:44:49wondering now

00:44:49a few years

00:44:50later like

00:44:51reflecting back

00:44:51on that how

00:44:52do you feel

00:44:52about dynamic

00:44:53ticketing as

00:44:53a model

00:44:54for big

00:44:54tours

00:44:55Bruce got

00:44:56a really

00:44:57bad rap

00:44:57because at

00:44:57that same

00:44:58time that

00:44:58that one

00:44:59guy bought

00:44:59a ticket

00:45:00at a high

00:45:00price

00:45:01Elton John

00:45:02and the

00:45:03Rolling Stones

00:45:03were charging

00:45:04tickets for

00:45:04twice the

00:45:05price but

00:45:06because he

00:45:06was a

00:45:07working man

00:45:07somebody took

00:45:08a shot

00:45:09at him

00:45:10there's always

00:45:13going to be

00:45:13supply and

00:45:13demand

00:45:14there just

00:45:15is and

00:45:16what we've

00:45:17tried to

00:45:17create

00:45:18and all

00:45:19the ticketing

00:45:19companies

00:45:20have tried

00:45:20to create

00:45:21is the

00:45:22closest way

00:45:23to be fair

00:45:24but where the

00:45:25money's going

00:45:25to the

00:45:26artist

00:45:26right

00:45:27if we're

00:45:28going to

00:45:28do dynamic

00:45:28pricing

00:45:29and you're

00:45:30buying a ticket

00:45:30at a higher

00:45:31price but the

00:45:32artist is getting

00:45:33paid he or she

00:45:34deserves that

00:45:34they built that

00:45:35career

00:45:35what we hate

00:45:37is when

00:45:38you know

00:45:39scalpers and

00:45:40bots and

00:45:41stub hubs and

00:45:42all these middle

00:45:42people now are

00:45:44making money with

00:45:45no skin in the

00:45:45game

00:45:45they did

00:45:46nothing other

00:45:47than got a

00:45:48ticket and

00:45:48now they're

00:45:49reselling it

00:45:49the artist

00:45:50doesn't see

00:45:51any of that

00:45:51money so

00:45:52some of that

00:45:53allows for

00:45:53these bigger

00:45:54productions you

00:45:55know the

00:45:55platinum and

00:45:56the VIP helps

00:45:57drive the ability

00:45:58to do these

00:45:58great shows

00:45:59and if you look

00:46:01at a lot of

00:46:01artists they're

00:46:03still putting out

00:46:04tickets at

00:46:04175 125 at

00:46:06the top to

00:46:07allow some of

00:46:07their fans to

00:46:08still be able to

00:46:09afford to go

00:46:09which I think

00:46:10is great

00:46:10but I'm a

00:46:15fan of dynamic

00:46:15pricing simply

00:46:17because it

00:46:17allows everybody

00:46:18to be equal

00:46:19in the process

00:46:20of if I can

00:46:21afford it if it's

00:46:22the show I want

00:46:22to see I get

00:46:23to pay for it

00:46:24but I want to

00:46:24see the artists

00:46:25get paid I

00:46:26don't want to

00:46:26see some

00:46:26outlier you

00:46:28know carpet

00:46:29bagger get

00:46:29paid arbitraging

00:46:31tickets somewhere

00:46:32it's you know

00:46:33which definitely

00:46:34is not fair to

00:46:35the artists or

00:46:36the industry in

00:46:37general yeah

00:46:38yeah absolutely

00:46:39I mean the

00:46:40federal government

00:46:41is attacking

00:46:41Ticketmaster on

00:46:42multiple fronts

00:46:43right now this

00:46:43includes the FTC

00:46:44suing the

00:46:45company and it

00:46:46has to deal

00:46:46with resale

00:46:47I'm wondering

00:46:49do you think

00:46:49that Ticketmaster

00:46:50should play a

00:46:51part in resale

00:46:52and if they do

00:46:53does there need

00:46:53to be a cap

00:46:54on the secondary

00:46:55market you

00:46:56know on

00:46:57platinum

00:46:57ticketing most

00:46:58artists have a

00:46:59cap on what

00:46:59they allow

00:47:00okay the

00:47:02tickets to sell

00:47:02for whether

00:47:03it's two times

00:47:04value you know

00:47:05usually is that's

00:47:06the range two to

00:47:07three times value

00:47:08so even if the

00:47:09secondary ticketing

00:47:10market exceeds

00:47:11that it doesn't

00:47:13feel like it's

00:47:14so you know

00:47:16harsh but as

00:47:19far as the

00:47:20secondary ticketing

00:47:21market isn't

00:47:23going anywhere

00:47:23this was one of

00:47:25Rob's stories but

00:47:26I'm gonna I'll

00:47:26tell it years and

00:47:28years ago ACDC

00:47:30was doing a tour

00:47:31and they go out

00:47:33on the road and

00:47:34they're like we're

00:47:34gonna sell all

00:47:35tickets paperless

00:47:36so you're gonna

00:47:37have to walk in

00:47:37with your credit

00:47:38card scan your

00:47:39credit card at

00:47:40the door they're

00:47:41gonna see your

00:47:41name you go into

00:47:43the venue and

00:47:44we're like they're

00:47:44gonna beat

00:47:45scalpers and

00:47:46they're gonna

00:47:46finally win what

00:47:48ends up happening

00:47:48the scalpers send

00:47:50gift cards to

00:47:51their own people

00:47:52who bought tickets

00:47:53and they walk in

00:47:54with a gift card

00:47:55scan the tickets

00:47:55and they beat

00:47:56you know ACDC's

00:47:58brilliant idea to

00:47:59get rid of

00:47:59scalpers they are

00:48:01always gonna find

00:48:02a way to get

00:48:03ahead be it

00:48:04bots be it AI

00:48:06whatever it is

00:48:08our responsibility

00:48:09as agents

00:48:10is to figure out

00:48:12ways that as much

00:48:13money stays with

00:48:14the artist and

00:48:16that's the job of

00:48:16the promoters and

00:48:18be it live nation

00:48:19or AEG or any

00:48:20festival or anyone

00:48:21promoting shows is

00:48:23that we do our

00:48:24best within anything

00:48:26we can do that

00:48:27makes sure that the

00:48:28artists are being

00:48:29paid for what

00:48:30they're doing that's

00:48:31our job yeah and

00:48:33the DOJ is also

00:48:34going after Ticketmaster

00:48:35and for antitrust

00:48:37violations could you

00:48:39guys actually foresee

00:48:40Ticketmaster and

00:48:41Live Nation getting

00:48:42broken up and if so

00:48:43how do you think that

00:48:44would affect what you

00:48:45guys do and in the

00:48:47touring market moving

00:48:48forward I'm not going

00:48:49to comment on an

00:48:50ongoing investigation

00:48:51or what may or may

00:48:52not happen because I

00:48:53find predicting the

00:48:54future is sort of a

00:48:55fool's errand these

00:48:56days that's fair

00:48:57but here's what I

00:48:59will say and Rick

00:49:01and I've worked

00:49:01together over 30

00:49:02years the industry

00:49:04changes in waves that

00:49:06nobody can anticipate

00:49:07and we adapt to what

00:49:10those changes are and

00:49:11try to get ahead of

00:49:12them and if you go

00:49:13into it with one

00:49:14mindset I'm going to

00:49:15do what's best for the

00:49:16artist and what's best

00:49:17for the fan because

00:49:19that's that that is the

00:49:20holy grail putting an

00:49:21artist and a fan

00:49:22together if those are

00:49:23what I'm working

00:49:24towards we'll adapt to

00:49:26whatever happens and

00:49:27we'll push back

00:49:27against it I don't

00:49:30know what the

00:49:30outcome of the DOJ

00:49:31investigation will be

00:49:33you know there are

00:49:34things that that I

00:49:35think all of us would

00:49:36like to see changed

00:49:37and how certain

00:49:38venues operate and

00:49:39how sports leagues

00:49:41operate you know

00:49:42it's impossible to

00:49:43get dates in April

00:49:43and May because of

00:49:44the playoffs because

00:49:45the leagues won't

00:49:46compromise in terms

00:49:47of what dates they

00:49:48can hold we deal

00:49:49with it you know

00:49:50would I love to

00:49:51change that and say

00:49:53pick a date and let

00:49:54us have the other

00:49:54ones of course and

00:49:55we fight it every

00:49:56year but if we keep

00:50:00our mission in mind

00:50:01which is help young

00:50:03talent grow help

00:50:04superstars make the

00:50:06most money they can

00:50:07help legacy acts

00:50:08stay relevant as long

00:50:10as they can and we

00:50:11make sure the fans

00:50:12having a great

00:50:13experience and feels

00:50:14connected to their

00:50:15artist then then

00:50:17that's our job and

00:50:17we'll adapt it always

00:50:22feels like people say

00:50:23well the industry is

00:50:24going to change it's

00:50:24not going to look the

00:50:25same the end of the

00:50:26day there's still

00:50:27somebody sitting in

00:50:28the front row screaming

00:50:29their head off having

00:50:30a great time and I

00:50:31don't I for the

00:50:33foreseeable future

00:50:34that's never going

00:50:35away so and as a

00:50:38representative of the

00:50:39artists and ultimately

00:50:40fans it's just

00:50:41transparency people just

00:50:42want to know what it

00:50:44is that they're getting

00:50:45and that it looks

00:50:46clear as to what they

00:50:48were promised when

00:50:49they bought a ticket or

00:50:49whatever and the

00:50:50artists the same thing

00:50:51so as long as there's

00:50:52transparency that

00:50:53business will continue

00:50:54to roll yeah and so

00:50:56before I end our

00:50:59conversation I wanted

00:51:00to do a little bit of

00:51:02a rapid fire question

00:51:03round for you guys

00:51:04before you guys take

00:51:06off so my first rapid

00:51:08fire question is what

00:51:09is the craziest request

00:51:10you've seen on an

00:51:11artist writer I've seen

00:51:13so many I can't

00:51:14remember all of them to

00:51:18be honest so my my

00:51:20memory is not that good

00:51:21I mean I will say

00:51:22that once a manager

00:51:23asked at a hotel for

00:51:241200 thread count

00:51:26sheets I thought that

00:51:27was a pretty good one

00:51:28it's funny that it's

00:51:30the manager oh yeah

00:51:31in particular what is

00:51:32the most shocking live

00:51:33music moment that

00:51:34you've watched from the

00:51:34crowd I assume you

00:51:35mean shocking good or

00:51:36bad I don't know I

00:51:38don't know I'm gonna

00:51:38tell you good because

00:51:39I I've always looking

00:51:41for that moment where

00:51:42an artist and the

00:51:43audience are so in

00:51:45sync with each other

00:51:46and you know I get

00:51:48asked my favorite shows

00:51:49and I always say three

00:51:50or four of them but

00:51:52Bruce Springsteen had

00:51:54split from the East

00:51:55Street Band for about

00:51:56three or four years and

00:51:57then they came back and

00:51:59they played 13 nights at

00:52:00Giant Stadium unprecedented

00:52:02even to this day and he

00:52:05walks out he does an

00:52:06incredible show bands

00:52:07back together and he

00:52:09hadn't played Rosalita in

00:52:1010 years which it was

00:52:12sort of one of the

00:52:13signature songs and does

00:52:16the set does the first

00:52:17series of encores goes

00:52:18off comes back out and

00:52:20see I'm getting

00:52:21goosebumps already and

00:52:22all he says to the

00:52:23crowd is what do you

00:52:24think is tonight the

00:52:25night and 60,000 people

00:52:29knew exactly what he

00:52:30meant and when he hit the

00:52:32first quarter Rosalita I

00:52:34thought the building was

00:52:35going to fall down it was

00:52:35so loud and those moments

00:52:38that's what it's all about

00:52:40you know that that magic

00:52:41moment that you just

00:52:42nothing else can capture

00:52:44and so yeah I think about

00:52:48that all the time I live

00:52:49for that those moments and

00:52:51I gave you 20 examples of

00:52:52that when you know a

00:52:53special guest comes out or

00:52:54an artist comes out and

00:52:55sings with another artist or

00:52:57just something magical

00:52:58happens and those are just

00:53:02undeniable how could I top

00:53:05that what's a show that

00:53:07marked a turning point in

00:53:07your career well for me it

00:53:09was it was convincing

00:53:11Barbra Streisand to go on

00:53:12tour after 27 years and

00:53:15being there that first

00:53:18night with her it was

00:53:21again one of my my

00:53:23favorite moments but that

00:53:25was a pivotal point and to

00:53:27watch that unfold and watch

00:53:29this genius go out and sing

00:53:31again was truly magical but

00:53:33you know the flip side is

00:53:36every time you walk into a

00:53:38club and you see something

00:53:39and go you know you're

00:53:40seeing something special you

00:53:42know and I was seeing

00:53:44Brian Adams 40 years ago

00:53:46play a club in Albany or

00:53:48seeing Dua Lipa play a 200

00:53:49seat club here in LA or I was

00:53:53in New York I don't know must

00:53:54be 15 years ago because one

00:53:56of our young agents said go

00:53:57check out this band it

00:53:58downstairs at Webster Hall and

00:54:01there's this two-piece band

00:54:02playing a 200 seat room and I

00:54:04walked out and said this is the

00:54:05best life band it's seen in 10

00:54:07years and it was 21 pilots

00:54:08that's what I was gonna guess

00:54:09right and it was just oh my god

00:54:12and there's no better joy being

00:54:16an agent than having that

00:54:17moment

00:54:17I just saw 21 pilots they were

00:54:20fantastic that was the first

00:54:21time I've ever seen them yeah

00:54:22they're unbelievable life yeah

00:54:24um I think for uh for me I I

00:54:26think the the turning point um

00:54:29years ago I uh uh represent and

00:54:34still represent Eric Clapton and

00:54:36he did a blues tour in clubs and uh

00:54:40him playing Buddy Guy's Place in

00:54:41Chicago and getting my parents to

00:54:43see that show uh meant a ton as you

00:54:46know that was a place where I'd gone

00:54:48my whole life as a kid so that was

00:54:50a huge moment in my agent career

00:54:55um what is an important piece of

00:54:57concert etiquette that you live by

00:54:59that you see people ignore

00:55:00I hate phones I mean I I really I

00:55:04really it's it's incredibly

00:55:06distracting to uh the people around

00:55:09you as well as the artist um I know

00:55:13that that's something we're going to

00:55:14be living with the rest of my life and

00:55:16you know have children who probably

00:55:19stand there with their phones up in

00:55:20the air um but I I think uh you know

00:55:24as we talk about experience and we

00:55:26talk about sharing the moment and we

00:55:27talk about all these great things

00:55:29about live music put it down and

00:55:32enjoy the moment because you're not

00:55:33going to forget it and it's so

00:55:35important for a generation well

00:55:39younger than me to understand that

00:55:42you know remembering Bruce Springsteen

00:55:44the bottom line or Cheap Trick and

00:55:46you know in Chicago that is the memory

00:55:50and it's not going to be a memory that

00:55:52you're sharing with your friends like

00:55:53this from an agent's perspective the

00:55:56one piece etiquette I'm a huge believer

00:55:58if you go to a show you stay till the

00:56:00end right because if you see the

00:56:03artist before you see the manager and

00:56:05you're not there at the end of the

00:56:06night what are you saying wasn't that

00:56:08good wasn't that important had

00:56:10somewhere else to be so if you're

00:56:12going to go cover a show be there when

00:56:14it's over finally a quality that all

00:56:16your best clients have in common for

00:56:18so many years I've said this brilliant

00:56:22artists great artists hear and see

00:56:25things differently than we do and and

00:56:27it's it's so hard to put up your

00:56:30fingers on it I you know when you sit

00:56:32with Stevie Wonder and he's tapping his

00:56:34fingers or he hears a windshield wiper

00:56:36he's hearing it differently than we are

00:56:39you see it differently than we do and

00:56:41the the greatest of the great they're

00:56:44just they work in a different way

00:56:47their vision and and their hearing and

00:56:49and how they assimilate all of that

00:56:51into the great music we hear it's

00:56:54indescribable and when you get to be

00:56:55near it I'm still in awe you know 50

00:56:59years later I'm just amazed by how they

00:57:03do it I don't it's like a magic trick

00:57:06as Bruce would say and boy when they're

00:57:08good at it there's nothing like it

00:57:10Rick

00:57:11listen you know it it's it's so much

00:57:17it's it's talent it's drive it's

00:57:21understanding the zeitgeist it's that

00:57:27special thing that Rob describes that

00:57:30you can't put a finger on it's creating

00:57:34mystery there's there's so much that

00:57:38goes into it that is what pulls

00:57:43everybody in and as music evolved from

00:57:47you know me looking at album covers to

00:57:49clicking through Spotify's Spotify songs

00:57:52it's just you know the the ability to

00:57:56grab someone's attention and make it

00:57:59personal is you know and you know be it

00:58:03any genre of music it makes it personal

00:58:06as such a gift that you can walk away

00:58:09feeling like you're connected and

00:58:10something moved you I say to young

00:58:13agents all the time and to young artists

00:58:15you can teach people to sing you can

00:58:18teach them to dance you can teach them

00:58:19play an instrument even write a song you

00:58:22can't teach charisma and that in fact if

00:58:24factor is so special and you know the

00:58:30best A&R men the best managers the best

00:58:32agents have an ability to see it and

00:58:34when you see it when you feel it you're

00:58:35just pinned to the wall and I could

00:58:37rattle off 50 names I won't but when

00:58:41you do you go I'm seeing something

00:58:43unique and and you can't teach that to

00:58:46people they either have it or they don't

00:58:47it's very true it's very true and so

00:58:51finally as I ask all of my guests on the

00:58:54show to do we are going to make a

00:58:56playlist where I'm gonna have you guys

00:58:58pick three songs based on some prompts

00:59:00so the first prompt is what is a song

00:59:03that you can no longer gatekeep and this

00:59:06is a really impossible question for me so

00:59:08I'm just gonna go totally vague I've

00:59:11been in a total Warren Zevon you know

00:59:14moment and then watching him be inducted

00:59:19into the Hall of Fame obviously post his

00:59:22his passing the performance of excitable

00:59:25boy that to me is you know just a moment

00:59:30I'm going through right now the song

00:59:33killers who are you know they did great

00:59:35rush that I'm a Linda Ronstadt fanatic and

00:59:40I think her version of I will always love

00:59:43you which came out years before Whitney's is

00:59:46the greatest version of that song and so not

00:59:51Dolly's version not Whitney's not everyone else who's

00:59:53tried to sing it the Linda Ronstadt version of I will always love you is

00:59:58remarkable great pick what is a favorite throwback you know it's

01:00:04impossible I'm a Bruce Springsteen fanatic I'm a Stevie

01:00:07Wonder fanatic I'm a John Mellencamp fanatic so I'm I mean all of those songs

01:00:13you know I love songs that look back I love glory days by Bruce Springsteen

01:00:18listen I'm just gonna go since we talked about it I want it that way by the Backstreet Boys

01:00:22there we go everyone gets a feeling when they hear that

01:00:26Max Martin's finest you know and finally what is a guilty pleasure for you guys

01:00:31I love sixties pop music I am a throwback to the sixties so I drive my daughter

01:00:37crazy listening to the sixties channel on Sirius because I just love the innocence of

01:00:43everything you know that came out and watching it evolve so you know I'm still

01:00:48a Beatles fanatic but I love all those pop bands they Clark five everything from the

01:00:53sixties I've dated myself tremendously right now but there was just an innocence

01:00:58to music that's I miss I am a massive hard rock and metal fan I you know from

01:01:07Iron Maiden to UFO to Rush to you know every artist that came out of that genre um I'm on

01:01:17a text chain with about you know 12 different people in the business who represent a variety

01:01:23of artists and we are that's all we talk about wow I love that and that's how you build a great

01:01:30agency because you have agents who all love different genres of music but can help each other appreciate

01:01:35it and uh um I think that's what we've done at CA we've got this incredible collection of people

01:01:41who um like all sorts of different things and if you had three other people here they'd all have

01:01:47different yeah playlists with as much passion so yeah that's what I love about Billboard too we have

01:01:53all these people who specialize in different genres and I'm always learning something new

01:01:57and it's it's nice to be around people who have totally different tastes than you sometimes

01:02:01so it's it's fun as an agent um because we're not you know so categorized and who we represent that you

01:02:11can represent you know ACDC and Bruce Springsteen or you can represent Iron Maiden and Santana and

01:02:17you know there's it's it actually makes it really interesting because you can kind of take on everything

01:02:23since we're on the heels of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame when I um uh I have the privilege to be on the

01:02:29nominating committee and the joy of being in that room every year when we sit down to nominate is you

01:02:35have 30 plus music individuals executives artists who are so passionate about what they love because

01:02:43they're nominating somebody and they're so inspired that I always leave going to listen to 20 albums I've never

01:02:51listened to because someone has pitched them to be in the Hall of Fame with such passion and fervor

01:02:57that I want to explore and um even as long as I've done it um I still spend Sunday afternoons listening

01:03:05to music things I haven't heard or new music coming out because you never stop enjoying the process of it

01:03:11so yeah yeah well um this playlist will be updated on Spotify with your picks or at least some picks from the

01:03:19artists that you mentioned um but Rick Roskin Rob Light thank you so much for coming to on the record and

01:03:25spending some time with me thank you thank you so much another special thank you to Rob Light and Rick

01:03:30Roskin for coming on the show and sharing their insights with us it's great to get a pulse on how

01:03:33the live music scene is changing from some of the best in the business and now up next we're going to be

01:03:38diving into our charts roundup where we'll highlight this week's biggest movers and shakers

01:03:42here's the billboard hot 100 top 10 for the week of november 15th number 10 is a halloween re-entry

01:03:50thriller by michael jackson number nine is i got better by morgan wallen

01:03:59eight is mutt by leon thomas

01:04:01seventh this week is folded by kehlani

01:04:10daisies by justin bieber comes in at number six

01:04:16man i need by olivia dean comes at number five

01:04:21number four this week is opalite by taylor swift

01:04:24number three is ordinary by alex warren

01:04:33number two is golden by huntrix

01:04:38and for its fifth week at the top of the hot 100 chart this week's number one is the fate of

01:04:43ophelia by taylor swift thanks for listening to this week's episode of on the record and

01:04:49another special thank you to our guests rob light and rick roskin for coming by if you like today's

01:04:54show please consider hitting us with a rating a follow a thumbs up all those good things they

01:04:59really hope our show grow and reach new people again i'm your host kristen robinson and tune in

01:05:04next week for another peek behind the curtain of the music business i'll see you then

01:05:19you

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