Watch | Pavan Varma Video Interview: Can Jan Suraaj Redefine Bihar Politics?

3 months ago

In an exclusive interview with Outlook, Jan Suraaj’s Chief National Spokesperson, Pavan Varma, discusses Prashant Kishor’s political strategy, the party’s refusal to align with the BJP or RJD, and Bihar’s readiness for change ahead of the 2025 Assembly Elections. As Bihar’s political stage braces for a new disruptor, can Jan Suraaj truly emerge as a credible third alternative?

Transcript

00:00Prashant Kishore himself is a new entrant in politics.

00:03Please see the kind of crowds he gathers spontaneously.

00:08During his Padhyatra and now during the Badlavyatra.

00:11He's not heading a Balu Mafia.

00:13He's not heading a Sharab Mafia.

00:16People come to listen because they want the change.

00:21And that is the USP of our candidates.

00:30Hello and welcome to Outlook Talks.

00:33After a long time in Bihar politics, there is a disruptor to the traditional parties.

00:39The Jan Suraj Party, founded by Prashant Kishore.

00:43The parties, it kind of shuns both the communal line of the BJP as well as the socialist agenda of the RJP.

00:53While this is, as the party says, it's a USP, given the brand of politics in Bihar,

00:59it could also be undoing.

01:01To discuss these, we have joining us Pavan Verma.

01:05Thank you very much, Pavanji, who is the chief national spokesperson of Jan Suraj,

01:12as well as a very senior leader there.

01:14And of course, an old Bihar hand, you know, who's seen the politics from all angles.

01:20So thank you very much for joining, Pavan.

01:22Let me begin with the most dramatic news that has come from Jan Suraj recently.

01:28The fact that the founder, Prashant Kishore, will not be contesting these elections.

01:35Two, three days ago, he made his announcement.

01:38Of course, he says that he's done this because he shouldn't focus only on his constituency.

01:43He needs to sort of go to all other constituencies also.

01:46That is his reasoning.

01:47But sir, on the ground, many feel that, you know, he's kind of run scared at the last moment

01:52after making some very, you know, bombastic challenges to RJD's stages we are there.

01:58Let me answer your question.

02:00First of all, it's a very tried and tested strategy in electoral politics

02:05that for the leader, a decision needs to be made whether he or she is required to use their resources

02:16to campaign for the other candidates across the states or stand himself or herself from a particular constituency.

02:24This choice was before Prashant Kishore.

02:28He could have stood from Raghapur, which I am sure he would have given a very tough fight to Tejasvi

02:33and if not, in all probability, defeated him because Tejasvi has done nothing there.

02:39But on reconsideration, we felt that since we are the only party which is fielding all 243 candidates

02:49in the Bihar election, the BJP has got 101, JDU has 101, Tejasvi has 143.

02:57We are fielding 243 candidates, all candidates.

03:02Therefore, Prashant's utility, purely in terms of electoral strategy, is far greater if he barnstorms the state

03:12as he is doing now, boosting the chances of our candidates across the state.

03:21Rather than being tied down to one constituency, even if it was for three or four days,

03:26given the time left for the elections, we felt his utility is much more.

03:31So, in doing what he can and will do for the 243 candidates which we have audaciously put up on all constituencies.

03:42And let me add to you, we are not a disruptor.

03:45We are a credible third alternative.

03:49Okay.

03:49Which Bihar needs.

03:51And that is the strength of our party.

03:54No, disruptor I meant in terms of, you know, just one more question coming back to him,

03:58Prashant Kishore not contesting.

04:00I get your point.

04:01I do see that, you know, how it's a young party.

04:04So, you know, the leader has to be there for all its contestants who are also very young, many of them.

04:10But, you know, Pavan, won't it have been a sign of confidence, you know, sort of a show of strength,

04:16so to say that, yes, I am conquesting Tejasvi, come what may, you know, whatever the results may be.

04:21Don't you think that would have been also a very strong signal to both Janisuraj's supporters as well as its party workers?

04:31Satish, it was a possibility we considered.

04:34But Bihar is not Delhi, where Arvind Kejriwal could stand against Srinath Dikshit.

04:40We are dealing with 243 constituents.

04:44And each of those candidates, although very credible, strong locally, come from a different cloth than the normal politicians of Bihar.

04:56Without Balu Mafia, Sharaaf Mafia, Musclemen, bagfuls of money, these are credible candidates with the respect and support of their constituency,

05:09but they need a catalyzing force.

05:11And that forces Prashant Kishore.

05:14He stands for the essential message of change.

05:18And therefore, we have decided that that is far better than proving the point against Srinath Dikshit,

05:26which we can do at any time, in any case, he can win an election whenever he wants.

05:32So we have to weigh what is the best, what is in the best interests of the party,

05:37rather than making one constituency a prestige fight at the cost of 242 constituencies.

05:44Coming back to what you were saying, the disruptor part, you know, what I meant by that,

05:48was that, you know, here is a party which is talking about a corruption-free administration,

05:53you know, the emphasis on health and education, development in praise of, you know,

05:58the criminal politics that happens in Bihar.

06:01So a disruptor in that sense.

06:03But, you know, Pawan, going by the ticket distribution of the other parties,

06:08do you think Bihar is ready for something like this?

06:10Or, I mean, when it comes to the cracks, it just goes back to the old ways?

06:15Yeah, that's the stereotype about Bihar.

06:18Bihar, which is projected by those vested interests who believe that Bihar can never change

06:23and can only be a supply of cheap labor, which is exploited in other states,

06:28living in miserable conditions.

06:31Bihar has been the cradle of change.

06:33You remember Jai Prakash Tarayan, Sampoor Pranthi?

06:36People believe that Bihar is incapable of changing.

06:40Biharis are completely tied down to caste loyalties, can't think beyond it.

06:46These are stereotypes.

06:47Tell me which state in the country does not have caste.

06:51And there are states which I know have greater caste equations than Bihar.

06:57So that, to say that Bihar is not ready for change, would be to completely ignore 30 years of misrule,

07:10misgovernance, and the neglect of Bihar.

07:14Listen, 30 years ago, where Bihar was, which was the poorest and most backward state in the country,

07:2030 years after Nitish, Lalu, and the various combinations in which they have been in power.

07:26Bihar is exactly there, the poorest and the most backward state,

07:31with the lowest per capita income, the highest rate of unemployment,

07:37the highest rate of out-migration for work of its youth.

07:43Yeah, that is exactly why Bihar is ready for change.

07:46And the same faces and the same parties using dharma and jati, caste and religion,

07:53use the people of Bihar as though they are puppets at the end of a string that they can pull

07:58to come back to power and they do nothing, to have institutionalized foundational change in Bihar.

08:05But if today Jan Suraj has a paid-up membership of 1,30,000,000, it is proof that people of Bihar

08:14were looking for an alternative, they want change, and Jan Suraj's entry has touched the right chord with them.

08:24So I don't understand what you mean when you say Bihar is not ready for change.

08:28You know, what I mean is that when you look at the other traditional parties, say, candidate list,

08:33or, you know, the kind of seed distribution that is happening in terms of which caste is this region prominent in, etc.

08:40So, I mean, it is a very going, or on the other hand, is welfarism, 10,000 rupees to each family,

08:47a job for every person in the government from, you know, these kind of schemes.

08:52I mean, it's both in terms of PBs or welfarism, as well as the caste equations, the rest of them

09:00still seem to be 30 years ago, what they were 30 years ago.

09:05Yes, they haven't changed, but Bihar has changed.

09:09Because finally, the people of Bihar, however poor, however backward the state may be,

09:15people of Bihar realize that enough is enough.

09:20They've had enough of these people.

09:22Today, raveries and jumlahs are raining down.

09:26I mean, for the NDA to transfer one hour before the moral code of conduct comes in,

09:3410,000 rupees to 21 lakh women by direct benefit transfer.

09:39It's not only unethical.

09:42Frankly, it's against the spirit of the constitution, because it is straight bribery.

09:47But the people of Bihar see through it.

09:49Prashant Kishore has repeatedly been saying they will throw money at you to get votes.

09:54Give the money.

09:55It's your own money coming back, which you have paid as bribe.

09:58People, if they have seen through that game, then Jan Suraj is going to do extremely well.

10:06If they have not, we will see in which case Jan Suraj will begin the fight again.

10:12But one thing is very clear.

10:14The kind of politics Bihar has seen for the last 30 years, ideology less, no morality, complete corruption,

10:25no governance, no governance, misrule, and crime.

10:33It cannot continue anymore.

10:35And I think in this time, in this election of the youngsters, we stay to, you know, call, to make the youth as a homogenous group.

10:46I mean, within them, there are the same fissures of caste, of religion, of region that existed in the older generation.

10:55No, no, the youth and Bihar is demographically a very young state.

11:00The youth are aspirational.

11:02The youth resent the fact that there is no education.

11:08What's the name?

11:08If there is a school, there is no teacher.

11:10If there is a teacher, there is no school.

11:12If they are both, there is no teaching.

11:13The youth resents the fact that Bihar, which was the cradle of civilization and once called the dharti of jnan,

11:20the land of knowledge, is today universities and colleges, which can only produce people who are unemployable.

11:29They resent the fact that they have to leave their state, their home, their families, and go out,

11:3450, 60 lakh of them, to get miserable jobs at miserable salaries.

11:40They are angry at the fact that over term, Bihari is still a pejorative.

11:44Because Prime Minister Modi builds, has investment summits in Gujarat, vibrant Gujarat,

11:52but in Bihar what he says is, more trains, faster trains, to take shrammics, labor from Bihar.

12:01Five lakh Biharis work in Surat.

12:03What has the NDA, double engine, circa done for Bihar?

12:07I want to ask you, one-third of Bihar lives below the poverty line of a state of 14 crore people,

12:15earning less than 100 rupees a day, fighting to get one meal a day.

12:20Bihar has the lowest per capita income.

12:22So you think that most youngsters, I mean, the youth who can constitute, I mean,

12:27most of them see this frustration and would want to break free?

12:32In my view, a large number will.

12:37I am not saying caste does not matter.

12:40Caste matters in every election, in every state in India.

12:44But I am saying that to believe that no state can ever, in perpetuity,

12:51rise above caste for change, which is for its own benefit,

12:56of its own people, is a misnomer.

12:59It has happened in other states, it can happen in Bihar,

13:02and it is likely and perhaps will in Bihar during this election.

13:06You know, as you were saying, that this is the, yours is the only party

13:10which has actually fielded 243 candidates and all the constituencies.

13:16Many of them are, you know, very young.

13:18I think most of them contesting for the first time.

13:21From various walks of life to, with not a very, you know, political background, so to say.

13:26How do you think they can weather, you know, this might, the financial might of, you know,

13:31the BJP, the NDA or the, you know, the entrenched sort of political machinery of, say, an RJD

13:39or from the Mahagat Pandan?

13:42I get your question.

13:45Their USP is the fact that they are not more of the same.

13:51Their USP is that they are the backing of the people.

13:54Their USP is that they have talents other than merely being head of one corrupt lobby

14:01or the other or being Muslim.

14:04That's their USP.

14:05Prashant Kishore himself is a new entrant in politics.

14:08Please see the kind of crowds he gathers spontaneously during his Padhyatra

14:14and now during the Badlavi Yatra.

14:16He's not heading a Balu Mafia.

14:18He's not heading a Sharab Mafia.

14:19People come to listen because they want the change.

14:25And that is the USP of our candidates.

14:29They are usually, most of them are educated.

14:32They are respected.

14:34They have something to contribute to society.

14:37They are not there only for the power.

14:40They are there because they are the kind of people who should be representatives

14:45in the assembly.

14:49That is our strength and we are proud of it.

14:51Prashant Kishore has said anything less than 150 seats would be seen as defeat

14:57for the Jan Suraj party.

14:59You know, Pawan, you're a practical man.

15:01You're quite realistic in, you know, getting estimates.

15:04What is a realistic figure really that one can think of for the Jan Suraj?

15:09And can you walk, you know, take us through a few of the seats

15:13where you're very confident, like why?

15:15No, no, I cannot and will not, because of shortage of time, do a micro-analysis too.

15:22But let me make a broader point to you, Satish.

15:25What Prashant Kishore has said is that if the message for which he and the Jan Suraj party

15:35have worked incessantly for the last three years, which is politics of issues, jobs, education,

15:48health, out-migration, corruption, change, but love, issue-based politics

15:59and the need for change, if this has percolated down to the people

16:06in the backdrop of 30 years of this complete misrule of Nipish Lalu plus allies

16:15at one time or the other, then we will sweep.

16:19Then if we get 125 or 130, well above the majority mark, he will consider it a defeat.

16:29Then our numbers will be in the vicinity of 150 and counting.

16:34But if this message is not percolated in, Prashant himself is the first to say,

16:39we'll get 10 seats, we'll just try for the next five years again.

Watch | Pavan Varma Video Interview: Can Jan Suraaj Redefine Bihar Politics?

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