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Crimewatch Roadshow Season 22 Episode 3
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FunTranscript
00:01Hello and welcome. This morning, 75-year-old John Murray was fatally assaulted and left
00:08to die on the doorstep of his London home. John was punched to the face. He has fallen
00:16backwards and then there's been an additional sustained assault. Do you know anything that
00:24could help solve his murder? This is Crimewatch Live.
00:54Good morning and thanks for joining us and today I am thrilled to welcome Jennifer
00:59Rioch to the programme. Thank you so much, Rav. I'm so delighted to be here as part of the team
01:03working with the police and hearing from viewers across the series, really focusing on a really
01:08important set of appeals. It is a total privilege, so thank you for having me. Great to have you
01:12on board. We have got work to do today though. Today, an appeal from Gloucestershire Constabulary
01:17to identify these women. They're all caught on camera pinching a vulnerable victim's wallet.
01:24Yeah, we'll also be delving into the dark world of online radicalisation to see how a teenager
01:30fascinated with Satanism started to put his words into action.
01:34Cameron had been engaging online with a female and Cameron was actually encouraging her to kill
01:41herself in front of his group. Would that elevate your reputation? Yes.
01:48And I'll be talking to Luke Taylor from a think tank to find out more about how we can prevent
01:53boys from falling into our life of crime.
01:56Now, we have had a great response to our appeals yesterday, particularly the armed robbery at
02:01a newsagent. We'll keep you updated on that. And our team and the officers from today's programme
02:06are currently backstage, ready to take your calls. You can scan the QR code below using your phone's
02:12camera and just follow the link. You can call us on 08000 468 999 or you can text us on 63399.
02:20Start with the word crime, leave a space and then write your message. Or just drop us an email at
02:25cwl at bbc.co.uk. Now, first, in October 2024, 75-year-old John Murray was left unconscious outside his home
02:37after being brutally assaulted. The identity of his attackers remains a mystery.
02:42On Saturday, the 12th of October 2024, a 75-year-old man called John Murray was found unconscious
02:54outside his block of flats in West London. The London Ambulance Service received a call from
03:00one of John's neighbours. They arrived, they moved him into his house so they could try and
03:07treat him and save his life. But sadly, he died at scene.
03:16John was a much-loved family man and popular with his neighbours and had lived happily in Colton Road,
03:23Chiswick for around 15 years.
03:29Initially, John's death was treated as an unexplained death under investigation.
03:34There was no signs of a disturbance in the house. There was no sign of a break-in.
03:39There was nothing to indicate why
03:42John was found unconscious and subsequently died, unfortunately.
03:49And due to their level of injury,
03:50the pathologist also visited the scene to try and understand what could have happened on that day.
03:55The pathology revealed that likely John was punched to the face.
04:05He has fallen backwards, where John has hit his head on a concrete surface.
04:11And then there's been an additional sustained assault, which could have been caused by fists or feet.
04:22That's either been by the same person or another person.
04:30That's resulted in multiple fractures and severe damage to the brain, which subsequently killed him.
04:38This was a sustained and violent attack on a 75-year-old person in their own home.
04:47And he didn't try to put up a fight.
04:50And on the 4th of June, I declared a homicide investigation.
04:57Officers began to piece together John's movements on the day he was murdered.
05:02Around 11 o'clock in the morning, he returned back from Morrison's and his motorbikes,
05:07and one of the neighbours had seen him return.
05:10We don't know what happened between 11 o'clock and around 1.30 in the afternoon,
05:15because at that point, one of John's neighbours had seen him in the communal garden,
05:19and he wasn't feeling very well that day.
05:21He said to the neighbour he hadn't slept for around 36 hours.
05:25And then another neighbour, at 3 o'clock in the afternoon, saw John in the communal garden.
05:33And then around about 3.30, there was a scream that someone had heard.
05:39And that may or may not have come from John.
05:42We don't know.
05:42John lived in an area in West London, in flats.
06:05He lived on the second floor.
06:07It's not a high-crime area.
06:10It's not easy access.
06:12It wouldn't make any sense why someone would target his particular door.
06:17There's nothing to indicate John had a great deal of wealth.
06:24He's 75 years old.
06:26He lived on his own.
06:28He was retired, but he was very active.
06:31And he liked to collect things.
06:33Watches, lighters, fishing, camping gear.
06:37So he had a wide variety of interests.
06:41And that could bring him into contact with a number of different people.
06:45By understanding who he could come into contact with might help us identify the person that would want to cause him any harm.
06:52But in this case, we've struggled because John was a nice man.
06:57He helped his neighbours.
06:59He didn't, from our understanding, fear anyone.
07:03Often he would keep his door either open or certainly unlocked.
07:07And he also didn't fully believe in banks and kept just under £10,000 in cash in his flat.
07:20Did he tell anyone, because that could be an incentive for a criminal to steal that money?
07:26Now we've recovered that money, but that's not to say that someone wasn't in that flat trying to take that money from him.
07:33Or potentially an opportunistic criminal or someone possibly suffering from an acute mental health episode, for example,
07:41has just stumbled across John at the wrong time, at the wrong place.
07:49John didn't have what we would call defensive injuries on him.
07:52There's no weapon involved in this.
07:54So we have to consider that, did John surprise someone in the house and they've reacted by violently and repeatedly assaulting John?
08:08The impact of John's death has been really severely felt, both by his family and by his neighbours.
08:15Losing a loved one is traumatic enough.
08:18But then we had to tell the family that we're treating it as a murder investigation.
08:23And that really shook the family's world, because that's the last thing that they were expecting.
08:35And I'm now with DCI Brian Howey from the Met.
08:38And I just want to start by reassuring our viewers that this is a very rare type of attack.
08:43But can you just recap, Brian, what you know about what John did that day?
08:48Yeah, so on Saturday the 12th of October last year, at some point in the morning,
08:52John went to Morrison's supermarket in Acton on his motorbike, arriving back into Carlton Road around about 11 o'clock that morning,
09:01where he met one of his neighbours.
09:03There's then a gap until around about 1.30 that afternoon, where another neighbour saw John lying on the floor by his shed.
09:11He was complaining of a sore wrist and had collapsed, but there's no visible injuries.
09:15And he didn't need any medical assistance at that time.
09:19There's then a further gap until around 3 o'clock, but that could be from 2.45 to 3.30,
09:25where another neighbour has seen John again in the communal area, sitting on a wall and then standing up.
09:30And that could be the last sighting of John alive.
09:33And then around about between 3 and 3.30 that afternoon, another neighbour has heard a scream,
09:39believing it to be a male's voice, coming from the direction of John's flat, lasting for a few seconds.
09:45And that might or might not be connected with this.
09:48And then sadly around 3.30, another neighbour has found John unconscious,
09:53lying on the threshold of his flat with severe injuries.
09:56It really is so sad.
09:58And the cause of John's death, it was quite brutal, wasn't it?
10:03What do you know about that?
10:04It was. It was a complex crime scene.
10:07Initially, people thought John had fallen over due to his illnesses,
10:10but he was severely attacked in his own home with no weapon, no defensive injuries on John,
10:18which could indicate he surprised the person that had done this to him.
10:23And they could have followed him from the communal area up.
10:28The scream could be attached to that.
10:31But it was such a severe attack, it could indicate a personal grudge against John.
10:36It's just we don't know enough about his life.
10:39It's an incredibly tricky investigation for you.
10:42But have you managed to find out any sort of motive for the attacker?
10:46There's no clear motive.
10:48John was a nice guy, but he had an eclectic mix of hobbies.
10:52He liked to buy and sell lots of different items.
10:55And that could have brought him into conflict with the number of people.
10:59We also know he had £10,000 cash in the house.
11:03And therefore, that could be a motive for someone to break in.
11:07Has he told someone about that cash?
11:10Has someone found out about it?
11:11There was no signs of forced entry.
11:14We know John often left his door unlocked or opened.
11:17Did someone watch him that day?
11:18And trying to find the money and left without having it.
11:22But there's gaps in our knowledge of what John did and his lifestyle that we need the public to help us with.
11:29It's worth saying, Brian, that £10,000 is now in a very safe place.
11:34The family clearly have been deeply affected by John's murder.
11:38They gave us this statement.
11:39It reads,
11:40It has been 12 months since John was killed.
11:43And as a family, we are still struggling to come to terms with how he died.
11:47Someone must know why he was attacked.
11:50And we urge anyone who can help in any small way to please contact the police or Crime Stoppers.
11:57And on that note, Brian, there is actually a £20,000 Crime Stoppers reward for information that could lead to arresting conviction.
12:05There is.
12:06And we'd encourage people to contact either this show, Crime Stoppers, which they can do anonymously.
12:11But someone must know what happens.
12:13So we'd encourage the public to phone in.
12:15Yeah, very, very important to do that.
12:17You can contact Crime Stoppers directly on 0800 555 111.
12:23The number is also at the bottom of the screen.
12:25So, Brian, who do you want to hear from today?
12:28Who can help with this investigation?
12:30Well, we know John was at Morrison's in the morning.
12:32Did someone see him at that supermarket?
12:35Was he arguing with anyone?
12:36Had he contacted anyone, including the journey to and from Acton, back to his home address in Chiswick?
12:42It's not a long distance.
12:43What about people that were in the area?
12:46Did they notice anything unusual in the days, the weeks, the months, anyone hanging around?
12:50His family believed that there was a tradesperson due to visit him that morning.
12:57Did you have an appointment with John?
12:59Were you supposed to go there, even if it was to buy or sell some goods?
13:04Are you reconnected with John?
13:05Is there a person in his past that he has reconnected with recently?
13:09Was that you?
13:10Or have you made a new relationship with him?
13:13Have you spoken to John in the months and the days before he was killed?
13:16Did he feel threatened?
13:18Someone must know something about what happened to him.
13:21It's now almost 12 months since John was killed.
13:24And we need to find justice for John.
13:25And more importantly, we need to find answers for his family.
13:28We certainly do.
13:29It really is a mystery that needs to be solved.
13:32Jen?
13:33Indeed.
13:34Now, later, we'll be looking at some of the ways the police are foiling the efforts of those after a five-finger discount.
13:39But first, in March 2024, counterterrorism were alerted to a possible and imminent attack.
13:50What they found led them into a dark world where a satanist network were targeting vulnerable people
13:55and convincing them to do awful things.
13:57Online extremism has got a huge global reach.
14:09And as a result of that, we don't know what is happening inside people's living rooms
14:13and what young people are particularly accessing.
14:17The level of anonymity that exists within the online world
14:20means that people are much more willing to express extreme views.
14:25It's really difficult in the online space to understand if somebody is a genuine threat
14:32or they're a keyboard warrior.
14:35And they don't have the fear of recourse around that.
14:40We're now also seeing a lot more mixed ideologies, a lot more fixation with violence.
14:47And certainly the case of Cameron Finnegan was one of those.
14:50On the 26th of March 2024, I came into the office like any ordinary day
15:01and there was some intelligence that related to a threat that somebody was going to commit an attack,
15:09potentially a murder, on a homeless individual.
15:12This counter-terrorism officer can't be identified for operational reasons.
15:19They were going to use a firearm to conduct the attack.
15:22And the intelligence was that that attack could take place as early as today.
15:31Officers had picked up the threat of an imminent attack in an online chat room.
15:35We identified that a person by the username of ACID was associated to a group called 764.
15:46And he was the person intending to conduct the attack.
15:51764 is an online extremist group with links to terrorism
15:55and is centred on violence and the abuse of vulnerable people.
15:58This added weight to the legitimacy of the threat
16:02so detectives used digital forensic techniques
16:05to trace the source of the post to a home in Horsham, Sussex.
16:12When it comes to a lot of social media postings,
16:16it is a challenge for police to understand whether actually it is a lot of blustering
16:21or whether there is real intent and capability behind it.
16:25We did not have a big timescale in order to investigate that
16:32and ultimately our priority is public safety
16:35so we really felt that we needed to act now
16:38and get the suspect into custody.
16:42At that point it was really important to obtain an assessment
16:46as to who those occupants were
16:48and where the potential threat may be coming from within that address.
16:55One of the occupants of that house was an 18-year-old male
16:59called Cameron Finnegan.
17:03The teenager wasn't on the radar of the anti-terrorist unit
17:07but searches revealed he'd shown some troubling behaviour at school.
17:13He seemed to be the person who was most likely to be involved with this group
17:19and potentially looking to conduct this attack.
17:20Concerned their suspect might have access to weapons,
17:25the team called in specialist firearms officers to assist with the arrest.
17:30I wanted to make sure that this didn't have an overly impactive effect
17:36on Cameron or his family
17:38and for that reason, although we used firearms,
17:41we did call Cameron out of the address
17:44and tried to do that arrest in a compliant way.
17:47But remarkably, he refused to voluntarily come out of the house.
17:59It's quite unusual from my experience
18:02for somebody who's had limited interactions with the police
18:06and is quite young, you know, only 18,
18:08for somebody not to comply with the orders given by a firearms team.
18:14Most people would comply.
18:17Instead, Finnegan remained in his room
18:20and attempted to live-stream his arrest.
18:23That was because, for him,
18:26notoriety within the group that he was part of
18:30was more important than listening to the police.
18:34As a police officer,
18:35you know that you need to do the utmost in order to preserve life.
18:39It gets the heart racing
18:40and you feel nervous up until the point
18:43that that individual is secured and in custody.
18:48Cameron, this is all police.
18:51Come to the door now.
18:52There's nothing in your hand.
18:53Right, subject C.
18:54Hands on your head.
18:56Hands on your head.
18:57Right, walk towards the kitchen.
18:59That's it.
19:00Insult your fingers.
19:02Can you come down?
19:03Yeah.
19:04Down with you.
19:05Down with you.
19:06Yeah, please.
19:07This one, haven't you got anything on you you shouldn't have?
19:09I haven't got anything.
19:09All right.
19:10Once I was made aware that Cameron Finnegan was in custody,
19:13it was a relief
19:14because then I knew that we had time to investigate
19:17and to work through his digital devices
19:19and complete the search of his room.
19:25Following the arrest,
19:27there's lots of things that happen in tandem.
19:30We get him into custody,
19:31we start looking at interviewing him
19:32and the house search starts.
19:35Police could now establish if Finnegan was a viable threat
19:38and it didn't take long to make some alarming discoveries.
19:43There was a lock knife,
19:45a practice butterfly knife
19:47and a punch bag that had slash marks in it.
19:52That maybe would be an indication that he was actually practicing
19:55in order to hurt somebody.
19:57There was a banner with the satanic beast on it
20:01which indicated that maybe he was interested in satanism.
20:06There were defaced Bibles that were covered in blood.
20:11There were swastikas and writings that were racist within his bedroom.
20:16When they seized his devices for analysis,
20:18they found more grisly evidence.
20:20There was the photo of a dead rabbit within a pentagram.
20:25So Finnegan did have a real interest in extreme satanism.
20:29But this was just the tip of the iceberg.
20:33The only thing you're concerned about is if she went through with it
20:36and you got caught,
20:38not about whether she was dead or not.
20:41I don't think I passed off in that moment.
20:42And we will feature the second shocking part of that film shortly.
20:53Now, we have just heard that Lincolnshire Police
20:55have arrested a 54-year-old man
20:57in connection with the armed robbery appeal that we ran yesterday.
21:00Brilliant news.
21:01And we'll bring you more on that as soon as we can.
21:04Also hoping our viewers can help Gloucestershire Constabulary now
21:08who need information about the theft of a wallet
21:10from an elderly and vulnerable man in Cheltenham Town Centre.
21:14So Monday the 21st of July, around about 1.45,
21:17the victim, who was an elderly wheelchair user,
21:19had been shopping with a friend.
21:21He'd withdrawn a sum of money from his bank
21:23and put it into a bag on the back of his wheelchair.
21:27Now, he and his friend then went to a local deli
21:31on the high street to get some food.
21:32And a friend had positioned the victim's wheelchair
21:34so that he could see what was on offer.
21:37But this is the problem.
21:38Whilst there, two women, you can see it here,
21:40they grabbed his wallet and simply walked off.
21:44And they both made a swift exit back onto the busy high street
21:47in the direction of a nearby multi-storey car park,
21:50which is sadly where the CCTV trail goes cold.
21:54Now, police have released this image of the two suspects.
21:57So do take a look.
21:59Now, they've also asked us to share this clip of CCTV,
22:03which was taken prior to the incident.
22:05And they believe it shows the two suspects as well as an unknown male.
22:10And one of the female suspects, you'll notice there,
22:12was wearing a pink top, which was actually removed before the theft.
22:16Police would also like to identify the male,
22:18you can see in the middle of the image,
22:20who was seen with the two women before the event.
22:22So have a good look.
22:23Do you recognise them?
22:25If you have any information, then please do get in touch.
22:28Contact details are at the bottom of the screen.
22:30Now, there is a crime that is on the rise.
22:34It's bold, it's brazen,
22:36and it's probably happening on a street near you.
22:39Yes, shoplifting.
22:40Stats around this nationally have reached shocking levels,
22:43but officers and retailers are fighting back.
22:46Sergeant Christian Denning from the business crime team
22:48at Essex Felice is here to tell us more.
22:50Christian, thank you so much for joining us.
22:52Now, we're going to have a wee look at some examples
22:54of shoplifting from Essex.
22:56And people here, I mean, you can watch them.
22:58So bold, just walking in, taking what they want
23:01and sauntering them back out.
23:03It's quite galling.
23:05Is this typical of what we see now?
23:07Yes, yes, this is very typical of what you'll see
23:09these days across the nation.
23:12We have people that effectively are just walking in
23:15straight past any sort of security measures and taking.
23:18A lot of our organisations and businesses these days
23:21are set up much for that customer journey,
23:23to walk in, see everything,
23:25and everything to be obviously able to be able to hold and grab
23:28and take, but this has obviously left us
23:30with a further crime element to it,
23:32where people can come in and get what they need.
23:34You've done a lot of work around this type of criminality,
23:37and you've identified three different types of shoplifting.
23:41Tell us about those.
23:42Yes, so breaking it down on a national level,
23:45we sort of looked into it,
23:47and we saw that you've got, like you said, three types.
23:50You've got your opportunists,
23:52which are people that will take things just as and when
23:55they feel that they're owed it, they're entitled to it.
23:58You know, my price of my shopping's gone up,
24:00I'll have that loaf of bread.
24:01But then you've also got your prolific offenders
24:03and you've also got your organised crime groups.
24:05Now, prolific offenders and organised crime groups
24:07are the people we're really interested in,
24:09because we're talking about mass, repeat victimisation
24:12towards our businesses and the staff that work in them.
24:14So we have to look at all those different elements
24:18and problem-solve them in a different way.
24:19So how does that characterisation actually help you
24:23combat that crime that is so varied, really?
24:25Well, like I said, problem-solving's the main thing for this.
24:29You know, we need to understand what each of those problems is.
24:31Instead of just looking at shoplifting as a whole,
24:32break it down into those three,
24:34but look into why the suspects and those different things,
24:37why are they doing it?
24:38What are their actual motives for it?
24:40We look at the locations that are doing it,
24:42because a lot of them, when it comes to prolific offenders,
24:44they deal with the same place over and over again,
24:47because they're used to the security measures there.
24:49And obviously, with our organised crime groups,
24:52we need to make sure we're working with other forces
24:53to ensure that we're getting that message out there.
24:55So we look into that, and by doing that,
24:58what we try and do is, when we problem-solve anything,
25:00I always equate it to a fire.
25:02Fire has three elements, and those three elements,
25:05if you remove one, the fire goes out.
25:06If we can do that, destabilise one element, we're quitted.
25:09Yeah, it is. It's good. It's a good theory,
25:11but how does that actually help shopkeepers in practice, like, day-to-day?
25:15Yeah, so my team, what we do is,
25:17we tend to give advice and guidance on shop layouts.
25:20We go advice and guidance on evidence collection,
25:22because obviously, if people are getting arrested
25:25from certain areas a lot more, they tend to go back.
25:28But it's all about, for us, getting that information in
25:31and using it appropriately.
25:34So we try and speed up that information coming in as well.
25:36We've got a rapid video response team that we use
25:38at this precise moment in Essex.
25:39We're trialling it, where we're trying to get
25:41our contact management staff to speak to shop...
25:46..well, to victims in shops straightaway
25:49so we can get that evidence into the chain quickly
25:50whilst that person's under arrest
25:52and being brought into the police station.
25:53So we're finding that's speeding up our efficiency.
25:57But we're also finding that it's helping us understand
26:00where shop workers are,
26:01because some of them need further technology.
26:03Yeah.
26:04And it's also about how you deal with any offenders
26:06that are brought into custody as well.
26:08It's trying to streamline that process as well.
26:10That's right, yeah.
26:12We've done some work, which happens on a national area as well,
26:15where we've done some work on what you call Operation Retail,
26:17which is removing the need to actually interview suspects
26:22if we've got all the evidence in place.
26:24Effectively, we're turning around and saying,
26:26look, this is you on the video here.
26:27We can see you doing the offence.
26:28The offence is completed.
26:30We don't need to talk to you.
26:31If you want to talk to us, by all means do.
26:32But we don't need to.
26:33You can go straight to court.
26:34It's working out really well.
26:36It's saving officers lots of time.
26:37It's meaning we're getting much more arrests going on
26:39or much more, well, process going through.
26:42So much more you can do with your time.
26:44Yeah, yeah.
26:44Because these things take a massive amount of time.
26:46So much more efficient.
26:47So I presume it has been quite successful then.
26:49It has, yeah.
26:50And certainly in the last year,
26:52I think we've now managed about,
26:54well, we've solved about 1,600 further offences
26:58as we did two years ago.
27:00We've also led on to criminal behavioural orders
27:01where we've got about over 100 criminal behavioural orders
27:04in Essex against our most prolific people,
27:06which stops them going into certain stores as well.
27:09So there's really good stuff.
27:10It's having an impact, which is actually so important.
27:14Now, I have to ask this, Christian.
27:15There's going to be lots of people that might think,
27:17well, it's just a bit of shoplifting.
27:19There's these big companies.
27:20They can afford it.
27:21It's not really hurting anyone.
27:23What would you say to those?
27:25Well, that really annoys me, if I'm honest.
27:28It gets my goat, if I'm totally honest.
27:30With the business, I've been doing this
27:31for the last two or three years.
27:33It's not about faceless people miles away.
27:37This is about our actual friends and family
27:39that work in these stores
27:41that have to put up with this kind of abusive behaviour every day.
27:45You know, these people are on low wages
27:47and they have to stay at, well, effectively,
27:49they go to work, crime happens to them,
27:52and they have to go back to the crime scene every day.
27:55Yeah.
27:55They have to suffer that,
27:56worrying if someone's going to come through the door,
27:58or they're going to hurt them, harm them,
27:59or do something they're going to have to get involved.
28:00And they're worried about their jobs and their finances.
28:03That's what I would say to people.
28:05You know, it's certainly what I'd say.
28:06I'd even say that to people
28:07that are buying second-hand goods
28:08that they think may be stolen.
28:09Certainly not a victimless quote.
28:10Impact is huge.
28:11Exactly.
28:12It really is.
28:12It's massive across society.
28:13Christian, thank you so much
28:14and good luck with everything.
28:16Thank you very much.
28:16Now, back to the work of the counter-terrorism police
28:19who have arrested a teenager
28:21they believe is plotting to attack
28:22to increase his kudos with an online Satanist group.
28:26Again, this film has some upsetting themes.
28:3118-year-old Cameron Finnegan was tracked down
28:34and arrested at his home in Sussex.
28:36Bring his this one down.
28:37Have you got anything on you you shouldn't have?
28:38I haven't got anything.
28:41His devices had been seized and sent for analysis.
28:45We had about two and a half terabytes of data
28:51that we extracted from his devices
28:53and to put that in context
28:55if I was to print off all of that data
28:58onto sheets of A4 and piled it on top of each other
29:01that would be about 50 miles high.
29:05Police found that Finnegan
29:06who suffered poor mental health
29:08had joined an online extremist group called 764
29:12which had links to terrorism
29:13just six months previously.
29:17Ash, what do you know about 764?
29:20I told you the other day
29:22it's just an online terrorist group.
29:26It's about all I know
29:27that they extort people of race,
29:31mental health problems
29:32or if they're just mentally vulnerable
29:35for anyone to really use.
29:37So 764 was a real mix.
29:42We had people that were interested in cybercrime,
29:46that were interested in indecent images of children,
29:49people that were interested in violence.
29:52764's ultimate aim
29:53is to change society through violence
29:56and they've got a huge global reach
29:58which is why they are such a concerning group.
30:01What stood out with Finnegan
30:05is he was really driven by violence.
30:09During the investigation
30:10we did identify a manual on Finnegan's devices.
30:14This manual was basically an instructional manual
30:18on how to kill people
30:19and how to cause mass casualty events.
30:23The violence of the group really appealed to him
30:26and he looked to rise through that group
30:29in terms of his status.
30:30And one of the ways that he would do that
30:35would be to post content.
30:40One of the pieces of evidence that we found
30:42was Finnegan going out,
30:45identifying a vehicle
30:46and then using a knife
30:50to damage that vehicle.
30:53He filmed it, he posted it
30:56and he tried to get notoriety from that.
30:58Officers viewed over 700 hours of footage,
31:04finding indecent images of children
31:06and extremely violent content.
31:09But he wasn't just a passive receiver
31:11of other people's content
31:12as their next disturbing discovery would reveal.
31:16We became aware that Cameron had been engaging online
31:20with a female.
31:24She was a vulnerable individual
31:26who had been self-harming
31:28and Cameron was actually encouraging her to kill herself.
31:31But not only to do that
31:33but to also do it whilst online
31:35in front of his group.
31:38This type of material,
31:40encouraging somebody
31:41or helping them kill themselves,
31:43you've obtained that content
31:45then posting it on the 764 group.
31:48Would that elevate your reputation?
31:53Yes.
31:53He didn't see,
31:57I don't think in my view,
31:58her as a person.
31:59What he saw was an opportunity
32:01for him to escalate
32:02his standing in the group.
32:04The only thing you're concerned about
32:05is if she went through with it
32:06and you got caught.
32:14Not about whether
32:15she was dead or not.
32:17I don't think about stuff
32:18in that moment.
32:19This is somebody who wants to see death
32:21and he wants to be responsible
32:22for that death.
32:26Police believed
32:27that he then viewed
32:28another user's post
32:29where they'd murdered
32:31a homeless person.
32:33Finnegan had gone to a park
32:35where he located a tent
32:36believing that a homeless male
32:38was living there.
32:41He has then posted that online
32:42in order to show
32:43the rest of the group
32:44and he's made it quite clear
32:46that he intends to come back
32:48the next day
32:49in order to kill that individual.
32:53He then returns
32:54two days later
32:55and he takes another photo
32:57saying that he's waiting
32:58for the person to return.
33:01Later on that day
33:03he posts on the group
33:05that he's getting cold
33:06but he will come back
33:09and he will kill that person.
33:14Thankfully,
33:14it was at this point
33:15that Finnegan was arrested.
33:17I think he was going to do it
33:19because I don't think
33:20he left himself any options
33:21but to do it
33:22or be disgraced on the group
33:24which is the worst thing
33:26that I think
33:26in his head
33:27could have happened to him.
33:32In October 2024,
33:34he pleaded guilty
33:36to a string of offences.
33:39Finnegan was charged
33:40with possession
33:41of material of a kind
33:44and likely to be useful
33:45to a person
33:46conducting or preparing
33:48for an act of terrorism.
33:50He was charged
33:50with doing an act
33:52capable of encouraging
33:54or assisting suicide.
33:57He was charged
33:57with two counts
33:59of criminal damage
33:59and possessing
34:02indecent images
34:03of children.
34:03In January 2025
34:07at the Old Bailey,
34:09he was sentenced
34:09to six years in prison.
34:13This investigation for me
34:14was a real eye-opener
34:16in terms of the link
34:17between crime offences
34:20and terrorism
34:20and how we protect
34:21the public
34:22is very difficult
34:23when there's such
34:24a large amount
34:25of activity
34:26in the online space
34:27that's targeting
34:28really vulnerable people.
34:29The case of Cameron Finnegan
34:32has really shone a light
34:34on the grip
34:35that these online groups have
34:37and I think
34:38it was really difficult
34:38to judge
34:39with Cameron himself
34:41how he had fallen
34:42within this group
34:43and then actually started
34:45to act
34:45as a perpetrator himself.
34:49And part of this
34:50is just trying
34:51to make parents,
34:53carers, guardians
34:54more aware
34:56of the threat
34:56and what young people
34:58are actually being drawn into
34:59If you have any concerns
35:04about someone you know
35:05who's expressing
35:06extreme views
35:07or hatred
35:07you can call
35:08the anti-terrorism hotline
35:10on 0800 789 321
35:12or you can report them
35:14to actearly.uk
35:16Now I'm joined
35:18in the studio
35:19by Luke Taylor
35:19from the Centre
35:20for Social Justice
35:21a think tank
35:22who have been
35:22conducting research
35:23into why young men
35:24and boys
35:25are being drawn
35:25to organisations
35:26like the one
35:27Cameron Finnegan
35:28was fixated by
35:29Luke, thank you so much
35:30for joining us
35:31so can you tell us
35:32about some of the work
35:32you've been looking at?
35:33Yes, thanks for having me
35:35so we work with
35:36about 700 charities
35:37across the UK
35:38and for the last year
35:39or two
35:39they've really been
35:40telling us the same thing
35:41and that is that
35:42something is going on
35:43for our boys
35:43so we wanted to try
35:44and see if we could
35:45quantify this feeling
35:46so we've analysed
35:48over 100 data sets
35:49we've spoken
35:49to over 100 charities
35:50we've polled
35:51over 3,000 people
35:53and done lots of
35:53different focus groups
35:54and produced this report
35:56called Lost Boys
35:57So there's been
35:58a lot of research done
35:59what has it found?
36:00So I think increasingly
36:01a lot of young men
36:02are becoming isolated
36:04socially excluded
36:05I mean we've found
36:06now that young boys
36:08are more likely
36:08to have a smartphone
36:09in their pocket
36:10than a father at home
36:11and particularly
36:12for these vulnerable boys
36:14we might have found
36:16that 20 or 30 years ago
36:17they would have been
36:17introduced into
36:18something like a gang
36:19we know that belonging
36:20is the number one
36:21currency of a gang
36:22it gives them an opportunity
36:23to have a community
36:24to build some
36:25reputational status
36:26earn some money
36:27get some direction
36:28and it might not be
36:29a very good direction
36:30but it is there
36:31but what we're finding
36:32now is that
36:33these communities
36:34and spaces
36:34are increasingly
36:35being found online
36:37and that's a real challenge
36:38because they are
36:38ever present
36:39we don't know
36:40who's doing it
36:40where they're doing it
36:41from
36:41but also that they are
36:43just unchallenged
36:44echo chambers
36:45Yeah it is tricky
36:46it's really difficult stuff
36:47and this is all sorts
36:48of different radicalisation
36:49and toxicity as well
36:50it's not just what we saw
36:51in the film there
36:52and we actually even saw
36:53sort of a showcase
36:54of that in Adolescence
36:55the TV film
36:56and we got to see
36:57a wee bit more
36:58about that whole topic
36:59everyone's sort of
37:00aware of it now
37:01Yeah I mean
37:02in the conversations
37:02we'd have about
37:03what's going on
37:04with young men
37:04nine out of ten
37:05of the charities
37:06would talk about
37:06someone like Andrew Tate
37:07or the Adolescence show
37:09and I think it's really
37:10important to mention
37:11that like
37:12why are young men
37:13finding this content
37:14so appealing
37:14why is it drawing them in
37:15and part of that
37:16is that it's explicitly
37:17talking to young men
37:18it's giving them guidance
37:19but also it's because
37:21some of what they're saying
37:21is generally pretty good
37:23right
37:23it's work hard
37:24get a job
37:25look after yourself
37:26go to the gym
37:27don't watch pornography
37:28all these things
37:28are pretty good
37:29for young men
37:29absolutely
37:30but the challenge
37:31is that they weave
37:32in these misogynistic
37:33or regressive narratives
37:34and that can really
37:36shape the way
37:36that boys are thinking
37:37I think it's particularly
37:39worth pointing out
37:40that you know
37:41for young boys
37:41who don't have
37:42that kind of love
37:43or stability
37:43and consistency at home
37:45or you know
37:46their school environment
37:47is not a positive one
37:48they don't enjoy it
37:48they don't feel
37:49they're good at anything
37:50or actually
37:51their kind of
37:52future opportunities
37:53are limited
37:53so they can't look
37:54say in 10 or 20 years time
37:56I want to do that
37:57or I could be here
37:57if they don't have
37:58those kinds of things
37:59then the messaging
38:00that is online
38:01becomes so much more
38:02alluring and powerful
38:03and this is a message
38:04that's a problem
38:05that's seen not just
38:06here in the UK
38:07but around the world
38:07doesn't it
38:08yeah so I mean
38:09we've been talking
38:09with people in the US
38:10Australia
38:11France
38:11Germany
38:12it's certainly happening
38:13in a lot of different places
38:14and I think it's
38:16those two things
38:16of kind of men
38:17in communities
38:18but also the online world
38:20so it's not just fathers
38:21in the UK
38:22we have a third
38:23of primary schools
38:23with no male teachers
38:24at all
38:25and then universally
38:27almost
38:28social media
38:28and smartphones
38:29are just adopted
38:30by all young people now
38:31so what are you advocating
38:32for then
38:33what can we do
38:33so we're
38:35continuing with our research
38:36we're trying to actually
38:36come up with some ideas
38:38that can help with this
38:39we're focusing on
38:40particularly young boys
38:41what can we do
38:42in their lives
38:42to increase the
38:44the kind of protective
38:45factors that surround them
38:46and also working with
38:47kind of adolescents
38:48and young men
38:49how can we inject
38:50some purpose
38:51some resilience
38:52and direction
38:53into their lives too
38:54and I think there's
38:55a few ways we're thinking
38:56of particularly
38:56trying to do this
38:57one is working with
38:58so family hubs
38:59they're a little bit
38:59like short start centres
39:01they provide
39:02advice or guidance
39:03for parents
39:04with young children
39:05and best practice
39:06other things like
39:07youth clubs
39:08so how can we get
39:09spaces in communities
39:10for young men
39:11particularly those
39:12men that might be
39:13in those situations
39:14I mentioned
39:15they can find
39:16those trusted adults
39:17also how do we use
39:19the idea of sport
39:20and to really re-engage
39:22young men
39:22particularly in a
39:23schooling environment
39:23and then I think
39:25the final thing
39:25we're really trying
39:26to think about
39:26is how we can
39:27put a call out
39:28to men
39:29to stand up
39:30and help raise
39:31the next generation
39:31of young boys
39:32into good men
39:32great advice there
39:34and if someone's
39:34watching at home
39:35they want to get involved
39:36be that positive role model
39:37Luke thank you so much
39:38for talking to us
39:39thanks for having me
39:40thank you
39:41now it's time for
39:42today's wanted faces
39:43and first we've got
39:48John Casey
39:48though he also calls
39:50himself John O'Rourke
39:51Michael Casey
39:52and John Joyce
39:54he has breached
39:55the conditions
39:56of his license
39:56from prison
39:57and police say
39:57he has connections
39:58in Ireland
39:59Essex
40:00Surrey
40:00Luton
40:01Sussex
40:01and also
40:02Lincolnshire
40:03they also say
40:04he may have left
40:04the country
40:05and gone to America
40:06or Canada
40:07well have you seen
40:08this man
40:08this is John
40:09Bresnahan
40:10police in Surrey
40:11want to talk to him
40:12about an assault
40:13in a pub
40:13that left a man
40:14with injuries
40:15he's 34
40:15with dark hair
40:17and may have a beard
40:17now
40:18he has links to London
40:19as well as Surrey
40:20what about this man
40:21we've got Anton
40:22Newell here
40:23sometimes he calls
40:24himself Ashley
40:24and goes by the surname
40:26Williams
40:26in July 2025
40:27he went missing
40:29from prison
40:29and has been
40:30urgently recalled
40:31so if you see him
40:32just call 999
40:34and finally
40:34for today anyway
40:35have you spotted
40:36Gregory John Pawsey
40:38Surrey police
40:39want to locate him
40:40in relation to a burglary
40:41of a valuable watch
40:42he's 56
40:42has white hair
40:43and often wears glasses
40:45police say
40:46his connections
40:46to London
40:47Surrey
40:48and also Spain
40:49if you know
40:50where any of these men are
40:51do pick up the phone
40:52the number to call
40:53is 08000 468 999
40:56now we've just got time
40:58to bring you
40:59a few quick updates
41:00in October 2023
41:05police were asking
41:06for help
41:06to locate this man
41:08Ewan Corbett
41:09North Yorkshire police
41:10had charged him
41:11with causing death
41:12by dangerous driving
41:13after he crashed a car
41:14in the North York
41:15Moors National Park
41:16killing a 21 year old
41:18passenger
41:18well we are pleased
41:20to report
41:20that the authorities
41:21caught up with him
41:22earlier this year
41:23when Corbett was arrested
41:24trying to cross the border
41:25between Turkey
41:26and Iran
41:27Corbett was returned
41:28to the UK
41:28by Turkish authorities
41:29in May
41:30and officers were
41:31waiting for him
41:32at Heathrow Airport
41:33where he was promptly
41:34arrested
41:34he has since pleaded
41:35guilty to causing death
41:36by dangerous driving
41:37and awaits sentencing
41:39at York Crown Court
41:40also in 2023
41:42we ran an appeal
41:43with Norfolk Constabulary
41:45who wanted to track
41:46down this man
41:47John Debbage
41:48for a conspiracy
41:49to supply
41:50Class A drugs
41:51he had been linked
41:52to the supply of cocaine
41:53to Norfolk in 2022
41:54and was also wanted
41:56by the North West
41:57Regional Organised
41:58Crime Unit
41:58for large scale
41:59importation
42:00and supply
42:00of Class A drugs
42:01he was identified
42:03on CCTV
42:04leaving the country
42:05via Newcastle airport
42:06and we are pleased
42:07to say he was arrested
42:08in Belgium
42:09last month
42:10he's now been extradited
42:11to the UK
42:12and is currently
42:13under remand
42:14now it's not just
42:15your calls
42:16that are important
42:16but also sharing
42:17the appeals
42:18with people who live
42:19in the towns
42:19and cities
42:20these crimes
42:21take place in
42:22you can get links
42:23to lots of the appeal
42:24films we've covered
42:25on our website
42:26and of course
42:26our Facebook page
42:27so check it out
42:28and that is all
42:30we have time
42:31for this morning
42:32thank you so much
42:32for watching
42:33and remember
42:34you can catch us
42:34on iPlay
42:35for up to 30 days
42:36after broadcast
42:37well worth another look
42:39details of organisations
42:40that can provide support
42:42with some of the issues
42:43raised today
42:44are available
42:44at bbc.co.uk
42:46slash action line
42:47and you can reach
42:48Crime Stoppers
42:49on 0800-555-111
42:53tomorrow a manhunt
42:54for a murderer
42:55of 22-year-old
42:56Rykard Siafa
42:58who was fatally
42:59stabbed in Croydon
43:00the three meds
43:02around him
43:03he's attacked
43:05and suffers
43:05multiple stab wounds
43:07before they then run
43:09can you help
43:12track down
43:13one of his killers
43:14so we'll see you
43:15tomorrow
43:15same time
43:1610.45
43:16for that and more
43:17goodbye for now
43:46you
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