- 7 weeks ago
In this episode of News Today, the big talking point is the ongoing crisis in Nepal, where the army has assumed control following days of violent protests.
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00:00Good evening, hello and welcome. You're with the news today. This is your prime time destination.
00:04News, newsmakers, talking points, plenty on the show tonight including our big talking point.
00:11The army has taken charge of Nepal. There is likely to be an interim prime minister.
00:17We'll ask the big question, what happens next in Nepal? One of the country's top journalists
00:22will join me on the show tonight. Also, how should India respond to Nepal's Gen Z revolt?
00:29We'll have all the details on what's been happening in and around Kathmandu, plus across the world.
00:34There's plenty of news tonight. But first, as always, it's time for the 9 headlines at 9.
00:42Uneasy calm on the streets of Nepal after the army takes control.
00:47Death toll rises to 30. Over a thousand protesters have been injured.
00:52Kathmandu's international airport reopens. Her view to stay in place till 6 a.m. tomorrow.
00:59Within hours of urging EU to slap 100% tariffs on China and India,
01:08Donald Trump now says that India-U.S. talks to continue.
01:14Prime Minister Modi responds positively, says India and U.S. are close friends and natural partners.
01:20Prime Minister Modi speaks with the Emir of Qatar, condemns the violation of Doha's sovereignty,
01:29supports resolution of issues through dialogue and diplomacy, pushes for de-escalation,
01:34a day after Israel targeted Hamas leaders based in Doha.
01:39Amidst political turmoil, block everything, protests intensify in France. Buses are set on fire.
01:51Roads and trains block. Nearly 200 people arrested. 80,000 security forces deployed on the ground.
01:57Tensions flare up in Europe after Poland claims that they shot down Russian drones in their airspace.
02:09Poland claims we are closer to an armed conflict since World War II.
02:13Russia says they didn't target Poland in the overnight strikes.
02:17Big move towards nationwide special intensive revision of voter rolls,
02:24Election Commission of India holds key meeting chief electoral officers
02:28and asks them to finish paperwork, start preparation.
02:31After actor Karishma Kapoor's children file a plea in the Delhi High Court,
02:39Sanjay Kapoor's widow Priya Sajdev Kapoor says Karishma's children have already received assets worth 1,900 crores.
02:47It's the big family battle.
02:49And a brand war breaks out a day after Apple launched iPhone 17.
02:57Samsung takes a dig, posts on X.
02:59I can't believe this is still relevant.
03:02Let us know when it falls.
03:03But our top focus tonight, Gen Z protesters in Kathmandu have conducted an online poll
03:23to choose their prime minister and former chief justice Sushila Karki leads that race.
03:30Army has taken complete charge, imposed curfew in many cities.
03:35Police say more than 13,500 people escaped jails during protests.
03:421,033 injured, dead toll has risen to 30.
03:46So dramatic events again taking place in Kathmandu across the border
03:51with Gen Z protesters now conducting an online poll to pick their prime minister.
03:57That's what we are picking up at the moment.
04:00I want to go across to get a live report at the moment.
04:05Amit Bhardwaj is our man who's been on the spot in Kathmandu.
04:10Amit, tell us at the moment, is there an uneasy calm?
04:14I know the airports have reopened.
04:16Is there a sense now that the worst is over?
04:19Or is the situation still tense?
04:21Well, Razeeb, the worst is certainly over in Nepal.
04:29And if you would have asked me this question last evening, my answer would have been certainly,
04:35you know, we do not know which way Nepal is going.
04:38But I've seen this city, capital city of Kathmandu change over, you know, in the span of 12 hours.
04:46When I say 12 hours, when we reached the safe location last night, after all our reportage, everything looked vulnerable.
04:54But that's when army chipped in on the streets and every lane of Kathmandu.
05:00And those who were using violent methods to protest were actually, you know, given a straight message by the army, Nepalese army,
05:11that violence and damage to the government property or private property will not be tolerated.
05:15No arson will be tolerated.
05:17In the morning when we were on the ground, whether it be the parliament building, the prime minister's office,
05:23Supreme Court, everywhere the army was marching with its armored vehicles.
05:27So that was a clear message which has settled the debate about normalcy, law and order situation.
05:34Because in fact, there's a Delhi Bazaar jail in the heart of Kathmandu town.
05:39And the prisoners attempted a jailbreak there.
05:42But within a few minutes, you had the army rushing in with their armored vehicles using force, you know,
05:49with restraint, although to manage things there.
05:52So that's how things are unfolding right now.
05:54And I have just come from the place where the Gen Z protesters or activists, if we can call them now,
06:02because I have seen them clearing the streets all through the day today in Kathmandu city,
06:07you know, taking everything that was devastated from the out of the street so that traffic movement can be restored in the city.
06:14So meeting, what we are telling you right at this point in time,
06:19the first round of talks between the Gen Z community representatives and the army is over.
06:26This meeting went on for nearly two hours.
06:29And now, yes.
06:30I'm just waiting.
06:36I'm just going to hold you for a moment because Pritha Pokharal is one of the protesters.
06:42She's joining me at the moment.
06:44Pritha, are we to say that now the protests are over?
06:48Now that the army has taken over, the prime minister has resigned, Pritha,
06:53can we say now that your protests are over?
06:58Or are you just waiting to see what happens next?
07:03I think that we need to keep the momentum going in terms of how the protest was about anti-corruption and bad governance, right?
07:13But in terms of the leadership, I think still a lot of things are at stake.
07:21There is a lot of uncertainty, I would say,
07:25because personally, the discussion to this was done through discord,
07:31you know, and as well as the meeting that the chief of army had,
07:34had also involved Durga Prasai and Ravi Lami Chhane as the stakeholders.
07:38And the Gen Zs, the representatives from the Gen Z protest side have expressed their disappointment
07:45because the stakeholders now are different, you know.
07:49So I am, me as a protester, I am wondering why any official spokesperson has not come forward
07:56from the Gen Z side as, okay, this is what is happening next.
08:00There is, this is what we are planning to do, you know.
08:02No, but who is your leader?
08:04I think people still are in charge.
08:05Pritha, you're saying?
08:06Yes.
08:06No, no, but Pritha, who is the leader?
08:09Now, who is the leader of your Gen Z protest?
08:12They seem to us leaderless.
08:13Is there a leader?
08:14Is there a single leader who can be spoken to,
08:17who has the authority to speak to the army or indeed to the establishment?
08:23So see, there is a lot of speculation regarding this.
08:26I wish I could give you a name, but I myself am speculating,
08:30like people have been, as per the discord discussion that was happening online,
08:35Sagar Dhakal was leading the discussion platform.
08:38So his name has come forward.
08:40But so far, there is no such name that, okay, this is the leader, this person was leading.
08:45That is also one reason why the protest got out of hand, because number one, there was
08:51no code of conduct in the protest, right?
08:53Like now that I look back, like so many people have now aligned to different ways, you know,
08:59like I don't stand for violence, but people started resorting to violence.
09:03So now I'm questioning if we were following somebody, we were not, right?
09:08It was all through social media.
09:10So there is not particularly a face or a person who has stood up and said, okay, I'm leading this.
09:16So you're not justifying, you're not justifying the violence.
09:21Am I correct, Preeta?
09:22You're not justifying the violence at all.
09:24You're saying that you all came together on social media,
09:28but then this movement was taken over by violent protesters.
09:32Yes.
09:34This was something that we didn't expect.
09:37Like when the first day of violence, that was just on Monday, right?
09:41That day as well, like it started off very peacefully.
09:45A lot of youths were on the street and it was really sad that 20 people were killed.
09:50But the next day, how events unfolded, like Singa Darbar was burned down.
09:54Our Supreme Court is burned down, you know, a lot of vandalism.
09:58All over the city, I think things really went out of control.
10:02And there was a lot of meddling from, I think, some political, you know, parties.
10:09Or we still do not have any like particular name that has come forward.
10:13But this isn't just the Zenzi's doing, you know, it is not.
10:17Because things got like, it was very anarchic, you know, it was very out of hand.
10:22And I do not condone that kind of behavior at all.
10:26And it's very shameful that we have burned down important administrative places, judicial buildings, you know, police officers have been burned down.
10:35So, yeah.
10:35Okay, let me leave it there, Preeta.
10:42What you are saying is interesting.
10:44You are saying this was a social media movement that wanted change, but you didn't want violence.
10:49I appreciate you joining me on the show today.
10:51Now, remember, of course, the army, as we are saying, has now taken full charge of Kathmandu.
10:56After two days of continuous violence, there is a sense of calm.
11:01And there is possibility of an interim prime minister also being put in place.
11:06The country, though, remains on the edge.
11:09Take a look at this ground report.
11:11And then we'll be joined by one of Nepal's leading journalists.
11:14Take a look.
11:15Limping to normalcy after days of violent clashes.
11:23The army has taken charge in Nepal, imposing curfew in cities across the country.
11:28The army has taken charge in Nepal.
11:58And we are getting you those exclusive visuals from inside the Nepal's parliament, inside the complex, inside the Nepal parliament house, where the law was, you know, drafted.
12:23And legislations were brought into effect.
12:26This is the main entrance of the main complex of the floor of the house.
12:31And from here, the lawmakers used to come.
12:33The prime minister, the cabinet ministers would take same steps.
12:37But probably they forgot as to why they were brought here.
12:41This is the entire grand structure, which has been now brought down by the Gen Z crowd.
12:51And the heat can be felt even 24 hours later.
12:55The Katmandu district court was set on fire late on Tuesday night.
13:03This courtroom and the premises of the district court could speak everything that everything has been destroyed, has set on fire by a protester.
13:17Smoke continuously coming through this window, which has been broken by the protester.
13:24And now this is a real picture of Nepal, which shows how intensive this protest was.
13:32And still, you can see this fire, which has set on these documents.
13:39And nothing could be saved in this courtroom.
13:43Several politicians were targeted on Tuesday.
13:49Their homes ravaged.
13:51This is the main entrance of the house.
14:21It will show you, the bed is removed from the whole way.
14:26This means that the loot part is also shown in a beautiful way.
14:36Kathmandu's skyline too changed overnight.
14:39The iconic Bhat-Bhoteni supermarket, the country's largest retail chain consumed by fire.
14:46The political fallout has been no less dramatic.
14:50Several MPs announced resignations.
14:52Many more are weighing similar exits, threatening a near-complete collapse of parliament.
14:58The trigger for Nepal's Gen Z uprising could have been this hit and run involving a politician.
15:03A government vehicle carrying Koshi Province Finance Minister Ram Bahadur Magar struck 11-year-old Usha Sunwar Magar in Lalit.
15:12The child survived, but the actions of the minister, whose car did not stop after the incident, angered citizens.
15:19From the corridors of power to the streets, shops and prisons, the unrest is testing its institutions and shaking its political foundations.
15:29With Amit Bhatwaj, Ashish Srivastav and Kumara Bishek, Bureau Report, India Today.
15:39And joining me now is a very special guest.
15:43I'm joined by one of Nepal's leading journalists, Yubaraj Ghimre has written on his country for several years.
15:51He's joining me now in the national capital, New Delhi.
15:53Appreciate Yubaraj you joining us.
15:55I want to ask you at the very outset, are you surprised yourself by the scale and intensity of the protests we witnessed in the last 48 hours, especially on Monday and Tuesday?
16:06Did it catch you and others by surprise?
16:08Not really, not on the scale of the protest, but the scale of violence the government resorted to that was unprecedented and unacceptable.
16:18That has cleared up the situation and I think it will take much longer than we think to, you know, that everything comes to normal situation.
16:27So what you're saying is interesting. You're saying it was actually the targeting of the protesters on day one, the killings of 20 people by the state that has angered people enough to hit the street.
16:38Had this been handled better, it may not have escalated.
16:43But what explains this level of anger, Yubaraj?
16:47Is this been something simmering like a volcano below waiting to erupt?
16:51Was the social media ban the real trigger or was something building up for a while?
16:56Many things together. Razdeep, one was this corruption, the image of political leaders, top political leaders in the opposition as well as the ruling party.
17:06That was very transparent.
17:08They were seen as transparent and corrupt.
17:10Transparently corrupt. I've been writing and I've been saying that if there is one thing transparent in Nepal, that's corruption.
17:17And the leaders tainted image. They never took this criticism in right spirit. They never tried to address it.
17:25Second, you know, after what has been happening in the U.S., the dream destination of young people of this region including Nepal,
17:35when they are finding it difficult, they want to create their future and congenial atmosphere for themselves in their own country.
17:44But this corruption at the highest level and lack of sensitivity among the rulers, that came in the way and they were very angry about it.
17:54And social media was an effective forum to discuss all these things.
18:00So when the government banned the social media to protect themselves and their image, I think they decided to come in the street.
18:10But it was provoked by the government unrestrained response by violence.
18:18And this corruption is across the board. It's not as if one political party is better than the other.
18:24You've had nine governments in the last ten years. Is this built into the system in a way now?
18:30They have injected much bigger doses in the system. And not only that they are corrupt.
18:36They have together authored a way of being immune, you know, like preventing any kind of investigation into corruption in high places.
18:45There can be no investigation into corruption in high places. You were pointing out to me before you came on the show that ministers and prime ministers cannot be investigated in Nepal.
18:56Yes. What they have said is anything that is a policy decision. And in their definition, policy decision is any decision taken by the cabinet.
19:05So any minister who can autonomously do it, you know, take a decision, takes it to the cabinet, gets it abrupt and prevents all the possibilities of those irregularities being investigated in future.
19:20Am I right in saying that this movement has been leaderless, that there is no one leader out there who represented this Gen Z?
19:27There's been talk of the mayor of Kathmandu, Balen Shah, the rapper turned politician, that he is, in a way, the face of the, or is someone who is admired by a lot of the youth protestors.
19:40But there is no leadership, is there? Or is Balen Shah a potential leader of the future?
19:45Well, unfortunately that is the case. A movement not having a leader, not being guided by command and control system at times becomes dangerous.
19:54Yes, Balen is popular because he is independent. He doesn't belong to any political parties which are perceived as corrupt.
20:03So, but, and Balen also played a catalyst role in this movement in the sense that, okay, he said, politically he has taken a very anti-Modi, sorry, very anti-Oli position.
20:14Right.
20:15But, and he said, I am past 28, I don't belong to your generation, so you lead it, but my supports are there.
20:25And that really helped people to get mobilized. They saw a face in Balen there, but Balen has definitely not been tested.
20:34You know, he doesn't have any other past experience, but he is a well-known figure, a popular figure among the youth and the fact that he took position against Uli.
20:44And very interestingly now, the Gen Z protesters have started an online poll and they are claiming that Sushila Karki, the former Chief Justice, will now become the acting Prime Minister.
20:57Do you see that happening? Who is she? Is she a crusader against corruption?
21:01Yeah, I'll say that. Sushila Karki is the first woman Chief Justice and would be the first woman Prime Minister in Nepal.
21:10She will be the Prime Minister.
21:11Yeah. And the connect, connect is because after she demoted the office seven years ago, she publicly started speaking against corruption and there is a connectivity, this anti-corruption movement and she has that image.
21:29But she doesn't have definitely the experience of running the country holding ministerial position in the past, but that image.
21:36And she was, she was very, she was very critical of the political interference in judiciary, the corruption and, you know, like, so she must have caught the imagination.
21:52What role do you see, Yubaraj, the army playing? They've taken over the streets at the moment to maintain law and order, but you don't see the army playing any greater role?
22:02Will now they just allow an interim government, hold fresh election, maybe even change the constitution? Do you see that happening?
22:08Yeah, I think for all practical purposes, this constitution is gone, this system is gone.
22:14Constitution is gone?
22:15Is gone.
22:16So the 2015 constitution is gone.
22:18Is gone.
22:19Will there be a new constitution?
22:21It has to be, there has to be, there has to be a new constitution because a president and prime minister, all the judges, you know, like, are being protected by army in unknown camps and no visible, you know, visibility of the government in one place.
22:40Then army takes the control of the situation under whose command we don't know.
22:46So this constitution is gone.
22:48But army for the first time in Nepal has accepted a political role under a general consensus.
22:57That is something new because with political parties perceived as corrupt, their leaders perceived as corrupt, the army appears to be the only state-bearing institution in the country at the moment.
23:09So they are playing that role.
23:12You know, what we saw, Yuvraj, in Bangladesh last year was that the student protests also turned somewhere into anti-India protests.
23:19Will we see that in Nepal?
23:21Is that a fear or these protests are not about India at all.
23:24They are about problems of Nepal, poverty, unemployment, misgovernance, nepotism, the problems of Nepal not directed at India.
23:34Yeah.
23:35Rajdeep, any, the present moment is definitely against corruption in high places in Nepal.
23:40But Nepal is definitely a strategically important place for any stakeholders, distant and, you know, like, far neighbors, like, U.S. has its, India is there, China is there.
23:56And in any emerging situation, the stakeholder external forces will, you know, accept that position and try to further their interest.
24:07But Nepalese have seen that 2006 situation was bungled because in Maoist peace process, peace process began to bring the Maoist to the main political spectrum.
24:21One side of the conflict included, that included monarchy and traditional forces, they were excluded.
24:26It doesn't happen anywhere.
24:28It was like South Africa's, you know, like Nelson Mandela, not wanting to work with the apartheid reason for, you know, in the, that, that, Nepal is paying the price for that.
24:39And India's role was quite negative in that sense, up to, you know, like bringing parties together for peace process was appreciated.
24:51But when you insist that one section of the conflict is not included, then that spoiled the whole thing.
24:59You know, so therefore what you're saying, correct me if I'm wrong, is this is an eruption of anger that has been triggered by a long period of corruption and no accountability in the system.
25:12Yes.
25:13You believe it will lead to a change in the constitution of Nepal.
25:16You believe that the chief justice will become an acting prime minister.
25:21Yes.
25:22And maybe six, twelve months down the line, Nepal will have a fresh election.
25:25Yes.
25:26Where maybe some of these young faces will actually take prominent positions in government.
25:32Do you see this youth revolution actually resulting in a new kind of politics for Nepal?
25:38I think, I hope so.
25:40But one thing that would be clear, like you were interviewing one of the, you know, protestors.
25:46And they have to own the responsibility for this violence.
25:52They have to condemn it.
25:53They have to bring the culprits to justice.
25:57Otherwise, a movement not under control of its leaders spoils.
26:04So who was responsible for the violence?
26:06You believe that some of these protestors included anti-social element.
26:10There were jail breaks.
26:11There were a hotel.
26:13The Marriott Hotel was burned.
26:14Did anti-social elements take it over?
26:17Yes.
26:18Yes.
26:19I think these, you know, young people who were, you know, like, looking at the corruption angle,
26:27they didn't realize there are many dimensions.
26:29There are possibilities of infiltration of wasted political groups.
26:34There are possibilities of infiltration by criminals and all that.
26:38They didn't, they didn't anticipate, anticipate this.
26:41But that, it has happened now.
26:43They should, they should at least ensure, now that they will be having influence in the government,
26:50they must ensure that the culprits are brought to justice.
26:54One final question.
26:55Are you more optimistic about Nepal's future as a result of the last 72 hours?
27:01Or do you fear that Nepal is heading for chronic instability?
27:05No, I'd say that I'm optimistic in the sense that youth have started thinking about their future
27:10and the future of the country and their common street.
27:13They should be careful, but it gives space for hope.
27:18And also, interestingly, Yuvraj, you told me it all started with one Facebook post.
27:24One Facebook post, tomorrow's Nepal, or worded along those lines, triggered this revolution.
27:31In that sense, Nepal has set a precedent.
27:34This could be called, at least in South Asia, possibly the first kind of digital revolution that we've seen.
27:40Yeah, digital, you know, like space becomes very vibrant and sometimes constructive and sometimes destructive forum for debate
27:50and seeking address all to many problems.
27:53Let's hope where it goes.
27:55Okay.
27:56Yuvraj Ghiminev, for giving us your perspective as someone who's tracked your country for many years.
28:01All I can wish is your wonderful, beautiful country returns to calm sooner rather than later.
28:08Thank you so much for joining me on the show today.
28:12Now, as Yuvraj says, an element of calm may be slowly returning, but it's an uneasy calm.
28:18And caught in the crossfire were many Indians, tourists who had gone to, of course,
28:23look at the wonders of the Himalayan Republic, but instead found themselves caught in a battle zone.
28:30Take a look.
28:38After two days of mayhem, Nepal picks up the pieces.
28:46Hundreds of Indian tourists, traders and students are stranded in the Himalayan nation
28:52with violent protests leading to cancellation of flights over the last two days.
28:57Many of them posted videos on social media seeking government intervention.
29:03Outside the Tribhuvan International Airport on Tuesday, India Today team met a group of pilgrims.
29:31Now, the flights are all closed.
29:35And the atmosphere of the outside is very dangerous.
29:39So, our mission has been done in Poshpatinath.
29:43Now, the temple has also been built.
29:45Everyone has been built.
29:46Many tourists posted video, giving updates, reassuring families back home.
30:08We are here.
30:10We are here.
30:11We are with another British and other people.
30:13We are here.
30:14We have been here.
30:16We have been here.
30:18Our contact is with Gujarat and Kendriya.
30:22We have been built with Indian Embassy.
30:24We have been in the same place.
30:26We have been in the same place.
30:28We have been here.
30:29We have been here.
30:30We have been here.
30:31We have been here.
30:32We have been in the same place.
30:33We have two families here.
30:34We have come to leave.
30:35But, Medhi, these people we have sent them right away.
30:36We are just waiting.
30:37We are here.
30:38We are here.
30:39Nearly 200 people from Andhra Pradesh are stuck in Nepal.
31:09With the Civil Aviation Authority of Nepal announcing the Tribhuvan Airport in Kathmandu will resume operations on Wednesday itself, stranded Indians are hoping they can return home soon.
31:29With Amit Bhardwaj, Bureau Report, India Today.
31:39And in news just coming in, we're getting more breaking news on that story.
31:44India, Air India has decided to start special flights to and from Nepal.
31:49Flights will directly operate from Delhi to Kathmandu.
31:52This is part of a move to bring back the stranded Indians in Nepal.
31:56The scheduled operations to resume from tomorrow.
31:59Remember, as we are saying, several Indians have been stuck in Nepal due to the violence.
32:04So clearly the situation has been alarming enough for special flights to start.
32:09Which brings me to my next guest on the news today.
32:22So how should New Delhi respond to what's happening in Nepal?
32:28Joining me now, a very special guest, Ranjit Ray, former ambassador of India to Nepal between 2013 and 17, a very crucial period.
32:36An author of the Kathmandu Dilemma.
32:39Appreciate your joining us, Mr. Ray.
32:42How should India respond?
32:43Should India have a hands-off approach to what happens in Nepal?
32:48Or is it simply impossible, given our strong relationship with Nepal, for India to really keep its hands off what's happening at the moment in Nepal?
33:00Nepal is a critical relationship for India.
33:03And it's a very, very deep, it's a fraternal relationship.
33:06So clearly India cannot have a hands-off policy.
33:09And historically, India has always supported popular aspirations, you know, people's aspirations for whatever system they want.
33:17And I think India's policy should remain the same.
33:21And we should really support whatever new dispensation is going to emerge out of all this chaos.
33:27Some steps are already being taken.
33:29And I'm sure the government of India is also closely monitoring and is also in touch with all the political forces in Nepal.
33:37But given the rapid flow of developments, Mr. Ray, do you fear somewhere that we were caught a bit off guard?
33:48There are those who are likening what's happening in Nepal to what happened in Bangladesh only a year ago.
33:55Student protests that spiraled out of control.
33:57Do you believe that we've been caught napping or that we didn't expect it to reach the proportions it did so quickly?
34:06I don't think anyone was caught napping.
34:09Nobody could have anticipated the magnitude of the protests, and especially on the second day.
34:15And I think that was in part a reaction to the killing of 19 students the day before.
34:21Had the situation been handled differently?
34:23Had the prime minister resigned in time?
34:27Had the protesters not been killed?
34:30I don't think we would have seen the kind of situation that we saw yesterday.
34:34The other thing is, you know, these are students, Nepalese students, and that's the way the protests started.
34:39But I think yesterday, as, you know, the issue dragged on, perhaps other elements also got into the act,
34:47and there was some looting and vandalism.
34:49And, you know, all the state institutions have been burnt down.
34:52So it's a bad situation, but I understand that the army chief is in touch with Gen Z's representatives,
34:59and they're trying to see what kind of interim arrangements can be made.
35:02Which brings me to a question that's often asked whenever there's a crisis in Nepal, Ambassador Ray,
35:14that such situations, particularly with anti-social elements at times taking over,
35:20can also turn into anti-India sentiment.
35:23We've seen that happen on occasion in the past.
35:25Do you see this as very different, a purely internal issue caused by anger against joblessness and misgovernance?
35:31Misgovernance, there is no anti-India angle here.
35:35So I largely see this as a homegrown protest.
35:40And, you know, the banning of the social media apps was only the trigger.
35:44There's a long, you know, for several months, even years, there's been a lot of resentment.
35:49And, you know, there has been a feeling that the political leaders have not delivered development to the people.
35:54My worry, of course, is that people might conflate this with the Constitution of 2015, you know.
36:03Who do you blame for the non-delivery or development of jobs?
36:07Is it the political leaders?
36:09Is it the Constitution?
36:10And, you know, if you enter into the latter part of this kind of thinking,
36:16then you're entering very, very dangerous waters.
36:19Because the 2015 Constitution itself was a negotiated compromise between the diverse elements of Nepalese society
36:27and was forged in the aftermath of the violent Maoist insurgency and the Madesi andolans.
36:33So I think it's very important to keep that in mind.
36:40You know, because since the monarchy's abolition in 2008, Nepal has seen 14 governments.
36:46Since the Constitution in 2015, it's seen nine governments.
36:50Is there a chronic instability built in which should worry India?
36:54Because having a Himalayan republic on our borders with chronic instability can be a destabilizing factor.
37:02How worrying should that be for India, this chronic instability at the moment in Nepal?
37:08You know, this is one of the problems.
37:10There is this chronic instability because they have a mixed electoral system.
37:14It's a combination of first-pass-the-post and proportional representation.
37:18As a result, nobody really gets an absolute majority.
37:20So this is inbuilt in the system.
37:22But what I'm trying to say is that certainly the system needs to be improved and can be improved.
37:28But, you know, the question is whether you work with the present system or you jettison the system
37:33and, you know, come up with something different.
37:36And if it's the latter case, then I think we're, you know, heading or looking at very different scenarios.
37:43So what should India's role then be?
37:49Can India play a stabilizing role or will any role played by India be seen in the present environment
37:55as interference in Nepal's internal politics?
37:58No, I don't think so.
37:59I think the situation is far too serious within Nepal.
38:03It's in India's interest to have stability in Nepal.
38:06It's in India's interest to work with whichever dispensation arises.
38:11It's in India's interest to support stabilization in Nepal.
38:15We have very good relations with the Nepalese army.
38:18We have across-the-board contacts with Nepalese political forces.
38:22And I'm sure we are engaged with each of them.
38:24So I think India's role right now should be a supporter to what the people of Nepal want.
38:29How easy is that, though?
38:35You were, of course, in Nepal.
38:37I recall during the blockade that took place, it became very contentious, controversial at times.
38:43The informal blockade or unofficial blockade at the time.
38:48Is it easy for India, being this large country, to be able to play any kind of role?
38:55Because, as I said earlier, the moment we do, we could be accused of being the big brother or the big bully.
39:02So do we have to navigate this issue very, very carefully, not be seen to be taking any side at all?
39:10Well, absolutely.
39:12I mean, you know, but this is something that we've known for the last 70 years.
39:15And this has to be factored into our policy.
39:17So there's no doubt about it.
39:19And, you know, this is a fact of life.
39:20We have to live with this.
39:22But given that, how do we support and stabilize the situation in Nepal, which is in Nepal's interest and in our interest?
39:30And we have to be engaged.
39:31Today, the situation is very different from, you know, the situations in the past.
39:35Because earlier you had established political parties.
39:38Today, you have these new political forces that are, you know, relatively unknown.
39:44Of course, some of them are quite well known, like the mayor of Kathmandu, who's very popular, or the leader of the Rashid Swatantra Party, who's just been released from jail and is also very popular.
39:54So we have to reach out to the youths, to the newer elements of society in Nepal.
40:00We are doing that.
40:01We need to do much more of that because they are going to control the reins of power in Nepal in the foreseeable future.
40:09So does that call for a complete reset in the way we look at this new generation which has emerged, which has taken to the streets in this unprecedented manner, expressing their anger against joblessness, against nepotism, corruption, misgovernance?
40:28Do we have to have a complete reset of the way we look at Nepal, given these new forces that are emerging there?
40:36Well, you know, I don't think diplomacy ever involves a complete reset.
40:40But certainly, the emphasis and the priorities have to be adapted, you know, and they must respond to the emerging situation.
40:50And now that political power is really going to be with the Gen Z or the young people, I think we've got to make every effort that we can to reach out to them.
41:00So, net-net, would I be right in concluding that our priority at the moment should be to strike some kind of a new relationship, a more durable relationship with these new forces emerging in Nepal, engage with them, dialogue with them, is the way forward rather than simply looking at previous old historical and cultural ties?
41:25Well, certainly, we need to look at our historical and cultural ties and the people-to-people relationship.
41:31But we need to build more on that.
41:34And we need to look at the economic relationship, the connectivity that we have.
41:38And, of course, the focus has to be the youths.
41:41The bulk of the people in Nepal are the youths.
41:43And, you know, in the past, perhaps they did not directly control the levers of power.
41:48But today, you know, they're in the process of achieving that.
41:51So, clearly, the focus has to remain on what we've been doing.
41:55But new dimensions have to be added to our diplomacy in a very, very focused and significant way.
42:08Ranjit Ray, for speaking to me, I appreciate you joining us and sharing your wisdom.
42:14Thank you very much.
42:15Okay, from our special focus on Nepal, let's turn to another big foreign policy challenge that India will be facing.
42:24Is there a thaw in India-US ties or not?
42:28Well, US President Donald Trump is doing what Donald Trump does.
42:32Keeps everyone guessing.
42:33He's blown hot and cold over the last 24 hours.
42:37In a post on Truth Social, he has praised the Indo-US partnership, praised Prime Minister Modi and said that trade negotiations with India were continuing and has expressed optimism about an eventual breakthrough.
42:55And he says he will be speaking to Prime Minister Modi in the coming weeks.
43:00Mr. Modi has responded by echoing the optimism.
43:04The Prime Minister saying talks will unlock the limitless potential of bilateral talks.
43:10Now, that's the good news.
43:12The not-so-good news is that Donald Trump is also pushing the European Union to join the United States in slapping tariffs on China and India of 100%.
43:24Arguing that these are the two biggest importers of Russian crude oil.
43:30Remember, all of this is coming even as the Ukraine war continues to escalate.
43:35NATO fighter jets have shot down multiple Russian drones that violated Polish airspace during an attack on Ukraine.
43:45I'm joined at this moment by Raymond Vickery, Senior Associate Chair on India and Emerging Asia at Washington DC.
43:52Appreciate your joining us, Mr. Vickery.
43:55What's your sense?
43:57How are we to now look at Donald Trump?
43:5924 hours, one moment says 100% tariffs on India and China.
44:03Next moment says that India and the United States are about to resume their trade talks.
44:08Well, thanks very much for having me.
44:12I think it's useful to step back and understand that the relationship between the U.S. and India is very, very important for both of these great democracies.
44:25That having been said, in order to have a plan for waging peace and prosperity, you have to have a strategy and you have to have partners.
44:37Unfortunately, President Trump does not subscribe to that.
44:42He sees things in his egoistic, narcissistic kind of way that everything is like a real estate transaction rather than a relationship.
44:58And it is to be welcome that Prime Minister Modi, Minister Goyal have been very temperate and have not succumbed to sort of the outlandish up and downs of Donald Trump's pronouncements.
45:18Because I think they realize that this relationship is among the most important in the world.
45:28The business of 100% tariffs in regard to Russia and Ukraine, again, has to be taken with a grain of salt.
45:39Because President Trump has shown he's up and down on that as well.
45:45He said he was going to solve this on day one, that he and Putin were great friends and it would happen that way.
45:56That's not the way in which international relations needs to be conducted.
46:01I do subscribe to the proposition that India needs to show more leadership in regard to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
46:13This is the greatest transgression of the principles of the UN Charter against non-imperialism, taking over somebody else's territory.
46:23And India has stood four-square behind those principles.
46:29But this is not the way to do it, to shake a sledgehammer, say 100% tariffs, without really regard to what you're doing in regard to your own imports, in regard to what Europe is doing with its imports, much less China, which is really the fly in the ointment here.
46:50If China didn't stand up for Russia, they wouldn't have the wherewithal to continue yet for another day.
47:00So the pronouncements of the prime minister, the so-called fall are to be welcome.
47:08But we've got to get back to some semblance of organizational adherence to constitutional values rather than just going on what seems to be most in Donald Trump's interest in his drive to get the Nobel Peace Prize.
47:27But do you then see a ray of hope that the trade talks could begin in a couple of weeks, given what the president says?
47:39Can India trust the president at face value, given all the contradictory statements that he's made in the last month?
47:48Do you believe that the trade talks now will resume or do the two leaders need to pick up the phone first and not just dialogue over social media?
47:58India cannot take Donald Trump at face value.
48:02The relationship, which was moving along for the last 30, 35 years, in which I've been very deeply involved in, has been damaged more in 24 hours than we were able to make progress in 30 years.
48:22That having been said, Donald Trump is mercurial.
48:28He wants to do what's in his best interest.
48:32It's a very self-centered approach.
48:35Everybody knows that.
48:37And now I think that the negotiators, particularly on the Indian side, appreciate that.
48:45The problem is not with the negotiation and the deal.
48:50The problem is with Donald Trump and what he feels are in the interest of getting him a Nobel Peace Prize and making him what he thinks he is, the great man of the 21st century.
49:05There was, as you recall, almost a free trade agreement reached in Donald Trump's first administration.
49:14And my information is that both sides really had come to an agreement before Donald Trump came in and said, no, I'm going to get more.
49:26India cannot give up on its core interests, whether they be in dairy, whether they be in agriculture.
49:33But there are a lot of things that can be done around the edges.
49:36And I'm sure that Minister Goyle and the prime minister are working that.
49:41So what we hope to be able to navigate this very difficult situation and get back to the upward trend that we've had in U.S.-India relations for the last 30 years.
49:53Well, Mr. Vikri, on that note, on that optimistic note, let's hope that we've seen some kind of light at the end of what's been a pretty dark tunnel over the last few weeks,
50:09given the kind of statements that have emanated from Washington.
50:12But as always, appreciate you joining me here on the news today.
50:16You're watching the news today. Let's turn to tonight's ground report.
50:20And our Get Real India story comes from Chhattisgarh, which has become the latest state where Ayushman Bharat's services are being stopped by private hospitals.
50:30Many of them are claiming that they haven't been compensated for the work they do under the health insurance scheme.
50:37Is Ayushman Bharat under the scanner?
50:40Take a look. Sumi Rajapan reports.
50:42Ayushman Bharat, the scheme meant to provide free treatment to the poor, has hit turbulence in Chhattisgarh.
50:59Private hospitals claim nearly 200 crore rupees in pending dues.
51:05Many have stopped treatment under the scheme.
51:07When the Association of Healthcare Providers or AHPI announced suspension of the scheme for five days
51:15and they cited delays in reimbursement of payments by the state government as their reason
51:21and they said that it is almost unwiable for them to continue services here.
51:26While some patients are still getting treatment out of the scheme,
51:29most patients are being turned away or are being demanded in cash.
51:33Hospitals claim several bills are stuck at multiple levels, while many have been rejected,
51:53shifting the financial burden to hospitals.
51:56If you take a job, there is a budget that you have to pay for the past 3,000 crores in the past year,
52:03and this year you have to pay for the 1500 crores in the past year.
52:06You are aware that you have to reduce your budget from the past year,
52:09and then you say that you have to be treated in Ayushman.
52:11That is not possible.
52:13While some patients are still being treated under the scheme, others are being turned away or asked to pay in cash.
52:35We have to pay for the 50000 crores.
52:49We have to pay for the government.
52:50We have to pay for 5,000,000.
52:52Where do we pay for the money?
52:54We have to pay for the money.
52:56We will pay for the money.
52:58We will pay for the money.
53:00The Vishnu Diyosai government maintains that funds are not the problem.
53:18Officials say 505 crores, including the centre's share, has already been released.
53:24If funds are not released promptly, experts warn the implications could be severe,
53:46with disruptions spreading on much larger scale, as has already been witnessed in other states.
53:52With Sumiraj Pan, Bureau Report, India Today.
53:59Okay, from that Get Real India story, let's bring you a good news story.
54:02It comes from Gujarat, where in a village, a school teacher is ushering in a chess revolution.
54:10That's right.
54:11The teacher is funding his students to ensure that they become the grandmasters of the future.
54:18Take a look.
54:22Rathu Singh Na Mawada, a small village in Gujarat's Mahisagar district, is chasing a dream.
54:29Almost every student at the local government lower and upper primary school is mastering moves on the chess board.
54:37The man behind the mission is the mathematics teacher at that school.
54:43Upadia has bought 125 chess sets, 35 timers and numerous chess books for the students.
54:50He has even translated Emmanuel Naiman's book, The Magnus Method, into Gujarati to help the students.
54:57He explains that chess doesn't affect regular class.
55:04So, we don't have any compromise in education.
55:11The things that happens when it comes to the school, if there are things that happen on Sunday,
55:12or if there are things that happens on Sunday, it will go to the Diwali, as it will be a pace.
55:14A lot of people are going to miss the school.
55:15If there are things that happens on Sunday, it will be a even trip to home.
55:16Emanuel Naiman's books the Magnus method into Gujarati to help his students.
55:22He explains that chess doesn't affect regular class.
55:46Many students from the school have been picked for district-level chess program, which provides them free education, hostel accommodation and training.
56:16We have been selected for the DLSS program.
56:23After going to the DLSS program, we practice at DLSS program.
56:31My goal is to call GM.
56:33We have a lot of children, but we have a selection of 14 children.
56:37That's why I also have a selection.
56:40We have two times practice at DLSS program.
56:43My goal is to become a GM and become a big player.
56:50Whether they eventually make it big or not, Upadia believes that every child should play games like chess that improve thinking skills.
56:58With Viren Joshi, Bureau Report, India Today.
57:05Well, that's all we could pack in on the show tonight.
57:08Thanks for watching.
57:09Stay well.
57:10Stay safe.
57:11Good night.
57:12Shubratri.
57:13Jai Hind.
57:14Namaskar.
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