'It's Just Three Words & A Talking Point': Garamendi Explodes At GOP Over Cuts To Inspectors General

4 months ago

During a House Armed Services Committee hearing in July, Rep. Eugene Vindman (D-VA) introduced an amendment to stop cuts to the Department of Defense Office of Inspectors General. Rep. John Garamendi (D-CA) joined him in support.

Transcript

00:00We will now consider log number 5606 by Mr. Vindman of Virginia.

00:05For what purpose does the gentleman from Virginia seek recognition?

00:10Mr. Chairman, I have an amendment at the desk.

00:14Clerk will please distribute the amendment.

00:16Without objection, the reading of the amendment is dispensed with.

00:19The chair recognizes the gentleman from Virginia for the purpose of explaining his amendment.

00:23Thank you, Mr. Chair.

00:24During my 25-year Army career, I had the privilege of serving as a paratrooper infantry officer in JAG,

00:30and I had the honor of serving as deputy legal advisor on National Security Council staff.

00:35I got a chance to work with inspectors generals across many different departments and agencies,

00:41and our inspectors general are skilled professionals.

00:46This amendment aims to protect those who conduct vital investigations and for the DOD itself.

00:52It will help ensure loyalty to the administration is not the determination for retention

00:59and prevent further decimation of this essential oversight workforce.

01:03Importantly, Congress has recently asked the OIG to investigate the use of unclassified networks

01:08we've spoken about a number of times today, like Signal, to discuss sensitive and unclassified information.

01:14This directly impacts the Secretary of Defense,

01:16and he's shared information about military operations in a chat.

01:19We know from what we've heard today that accountability matters,

01:24and the inspector general investigation is at least a piece of accountability,

01:30an important piece of that in that.

01:32Overall, it's important to maintain a fully staffed OIG office

01:35to maintain oversight of DOD's operational leadership.

01:39This amendment would ensure that IGs cannot be fired for political or personal reasons,

01:43allowing them to do their job without fear or favor.

01:46We saw IG firings in January.

01:48We know IG personnel are at risk.

01:51We also know that civilians are being targeted for cuts in the administration awards loyalty

01:55and subservience over facts.

02:00The Inspector General Act of 1978 established independent oversight offices

02:04across various departments and agencies, including the Department of Defense.

02:07These OIGs conduct audits and investigate, detect, and prevent fraud, waste, and abuse,

02:14which is a stated goal of this administration.

02:17The purpose of the IG, the primary goal,

02:22is to improve the efficiency and economy of government operations

02:25by providing independent oversight of federal agencies.

02:29Independence is a critical aspect of this.

02:31While IGs report to the heads of their respective agencies,

02:34they also have a degree of independence to conduct their work

02:36without undue influence and interference.

02:40Reporting requirements include Congress.

02:43That is one of the key venues of how we receive our information.

02:47That's why it's so important to have independent IGs

02:50that function at each department agency.

02:53IGs have various powers, including the ability to conduct audits,

02:57investigations, issues, subpoenas, and access agency records.

03:00IGs play a critical role in preventing and detecting fraud, waste, and abuse,

03:07promoting economy and efficiency,

03:08and ensuring agencies are held accountable to the public.

03:13Really, the original sort of doge, if you will.

03:18That's why it's critical that we support IGs

03:21and prevent them from being politicized.

03:23I urge you to support this mission at DOG and vote yes.

03:26Gentleman yields back.

03:27Chair not recognizes himself.

03:28Once again, this amendment unnecessarily restricts the President

03:32and the Secretary of Defense from managing DOD personnel.

03:34I oppose all amendments that place unnecessary limitations

03:37on the President and the Secretary of Defense's authority

03:40to dynamically manage their workforce.

03:42Chair now recognizes the gentleman from California, Mr. Garamendi.

03:50Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member and members of the Committee,

03:54I do not believe we can do our job of oversight,

03:59and even before oversight, our job of directing policy, creating policy.

04:06What direction should the Department of Defense go?

04:09What should it be doing?

04:10Should it do this?

04:11Should it do that?

04:12Should it do neither?

04:12We do not, despite an absolutely terrific staff,

04:20some of whom are behind me, others behind other members here at the top row

04:24and then at the table,

04:27we depend upon Inspector General.

04:30They have been there day after day.

04:33They specialize in specific sets of issues,

04:36and they do their report,

04:39and then that report could be classified, more likely public,

04:44and it gives us the information that we must have to set policy.

04:51It's not a matter of the President doing the right thing or the wrong thing

04:56or head sex doing the right thing or wrong thing

04:58by reducing the number of IGs out there.

05:01This is for us.

05:04This is for the American taxpayer.

05:07These IG specialists are absolutely critically important.

05:15I know from my 15 years here,

05:18I don't have a clue what's going on until I read an IG report.

05:22Maybe some general will retire or otherwise come by,

05:26and wow, that's interesting.

05:27But I depend upon the IG reports.

05:31And then that leads to additional questions.

05:33It is fundamental to our work of establishing policy

05:39and then the oversight of the existing policies.

05:41I cannot understand why any member of this committee,

05:44Democrat or Republican, would not want,

05:48would accept the situation in which half of the IG staff disappears.

05:54We cannot do our job without that information.

05:59Mr. Vindman is correct.

06:03And all of us ought to be jumping up and down and saying,

06:05yes, bring them back.

06:09Make sure these people are there.

06:11Make sure that that experience, that knowledge is available to us.

06:18Waste, fraud, and abuse doesn't mean a good goddamn thing

06:21unless we have the knowledge to go with it.

06:23It's just three words and a talking point.

06:27It's critically important that we have the information.

06:32And often, not always, but often it comes from the IG.

06:36Mr. Vindman, don't ever give up on this.

06:39It's critically important.

06:40Any chance you get, drive this issue.

06:44And those of us that care about waste, fraud, and abuse will be with you.

06:49Gentleman yields back, Chair.

06:50I recognize the ranking member.

06:53Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

06:54There's a series of amendments here all surrounding personnel,

06:57which can sort of make it sound a little, I don't know, bureaucratic and boring,

07:02that we're like quibbling over exactly how to handle personnel.

07:05And I just want to make sure everyone knows how completely unprecedented what the Trump administration has done to personnel is,

07:14and the fundamental threat that it poses to civil service,

07:18and the very concept that we are a nation of laws, not of individuals.

07:23We have seen across the board, not just at DOD, obviously in a more dramatic fashion in other places in our civil service,

07:32a direct attack on civil service, and basically the goal and the effort is to terrorize them.

07:39Certainly there's been thousands of firings across the board with very little reason given,

07:44but you have to get at some of the specifics.

07:46Some people have been fired, weeks later have been given a notice that they are allowed back in,

07:53weeks after that, fired again.

07:56They have been given a level of uncertainty that has made it very difficult for them to do their jobs.

08:01I read about one case where someone was fired, brought back,

08:06but then told that their health insurance was no longer active,

08:10even though they were still paying for their health insurance.

08:13Tens of thousands of workers have been treated this way.

08:17So we have also seen at DOD the firing of the inspector generals,

08:21the firing of the Jags, the firing of four stars.

08:25It's hard to say exactly which one is the most egregious case,

08:28but the firing of the dual-hatted NSA cyber command chief, Mr. Hawk, is perhaps the worst,

08:35where Laura Loomer showed up in the White House, said, you know, this guy might not be trusted,

08:39and despite the fact that he has enjoyed years of bipartisan enthusiastic support,

08:46he was fired, and as far as I know, has not yet been replaced.

08:50What the Trump administration is trying to do is strip any check on Trump's power

08:57in a way that will weaken us as a country.

09:01Now, this focuses specifically on inspector generals, but as I mentioned,

09:05a whole lot of other people in the federal government have been terrorized in this way.

09:10And as I alluded to earlier when we were talking about the problem with the Secretary of Defense

09:15using a signal chat for secure communications,

09:19yes, there is an acting inspector general,

09:22but when the Trump administration makes it clear that loyalty is the one and only test

09:27that is going to apply for you to keep your job,

09:30are we going to be able to continue to rely on these independent reports

09:34in the way we have in the past?

09:36Clearly not.

09:38So I think this committee should exercise its oversight authority

09:42to say civil service still matters, laws still matter, we still need oversight.

09:48Now, the IG amendment here, I think, is the one that best drives home this point,

09:51but all these amendments are crucial on that front.

09:54I support them all, and I urge the committee to do so as well.

09:59Does any other members seek recognition on the Vindman amendment?

10:05There's no further debate than the question occurs on the amendment offered by Mr. Vindman.

10:09So many who's in favor will say aye.

10:11Aye.

10:11Those opposed, no.

10:13No.

10:13Opinions of the Chair, the no's have it.

10:15A recorded vote is requested.

10:16A recorded vote will be postponed.

10:18A recorded vote will be postponed.

'It's Just Three Words & A Talking Point': Garamendi Explodes At GOP Over Cuts To Inspectors General

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