- 2 months ago
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00:00We've got something to play for you here in a second,
00:02but let's go to the phones first.
00:03Jonathan in San Jose.
00:04Hi, Jonathan.
00:05Thank you for calling.
00:06What's up?
00:07Hey, thanks for having me on.
00:09I had a quick question regarding Devers.
00:11I've been hearing stuff that says his contract is underwater.
00:15As a giant fan, why should I care about contracts being overpaid
00:19when there's no salary cap?
00:20I can understand that criticism towards NFL and NBA contracts,
00:24but just don't understand that concept for baseball.
00:27Yeah, Jonathan, I think you're largely right.
00:30First of all, the whole idea of the contract being underwater
00:35in and of itself is an opinion, maybe.
00:39I don't even know how you could sort of quantify that at this point.
00:44I would actually sit here and tell you that at age 28
00:47and where we sit contractually with baseball salaries,
00:52Rafi Devers is underpaid right now.
00:54He has been underpaid for the last few years.
00:56Well, for what he's done for Boston, yeah.
00:58No doubt.
00:59Now, if he does in San Francisco what he did for Boston
01:02over the course of these years, then yeah,
01:04you could argue he's underpaid because I was looking at his contract details
01:08earlier in it.
01:09It's just a flat rate.
01:11It doesn't go up.
01:13NBA contracts always seem to escalate the majority of them,
01:17and this one's just a fixed price,
01:19and so you're going to pay him this much.
01:21And the last couple of years when he's 35 and 36,
01:24those might be underwater moments,
01:27but right now at 28 with a 900 OPS, which is elite, top 12 in baseball,
01:33I would argue like you're saying, he's probably underpaid.
01:36No doubt.
01:36And then as far as a fan, why should you care?
01:39You're kind of right you shouldn't,
01:41except for the only thing that you worry about is if the Giants eight years
01:48from now or seven years from now essentially are dealing with Devers,
01:54Adamas, and Chapman all sort of feeling like, whew, they're getting old,
02:00they're not producing, and we are basically like,
02:04what would it be in the final year of Chapman's got the shortest of the three,
02:10but in the final year of that deal, what are the three making combined?
02:14I don't know.
02:15It's somewhere around $80 million.
02:17And so if the Giants at that point are like, yeah, sorry,
02:21we just don't have any more money to go be good.
02:25We can't go get players.
02:27I don't foresee that because, again, six, seven, eight years from now,
02:31these numbers that we're talking about right now aren't actually that big anymore.
02:35Number two, who knows what the hell is happening between now and then
02:39with these guys.
02:40Maybe they're still producing.
02:42But number three, I don't think that the Giants would be acting the way
02:46that they are if they didn't feel like they were about to be a consistent
02:52big spender.
02:53And I have more on that in just a second.
02:56Yeah, Grandy, what's up?
02:57Really quick, you guys were speculating on a potential roster move.
03:00We were right to assume Brett Wisely has been recalled from AAA Sacramento.
03:05The corresponding move, though, is Justin Verlander has been placed
03:08on paternity leave.
03:10Paternity leave for Justin Verlander.
03:13Paternity leave.
03:14Yeah.
03:15All right.
03:16Congrats to Kate.
03:17Is Kate having a baby?
03:19I would assume so.
03:20Did we know that?
03:22I did not know that.
03:22Did you know that Kate Upton was present?
03:23I was not following her trimesters very closely, so congrats to the Verlanders.
03:29Verlanders.
03:30Great.
03:30It's awesome.
03:31He'll be, in theory, he'll probably, I would think he's going to be back for his
03:35next start, would be my guess.
03:37Which would be in three days?
03:39Well, he threw on Tuesday.
03:42So Wednesday, Thursday.
03:44Well, no.
03:44He threw on Tuesday?
03:45No, no, no.
03:45He threw on Wednesday.
03:46Yeah.
03:47So Thursday, Friday, Saturday, he would throw on Monday against the Marlins.
03:50Yeah, I would guess that's a skip.
03:52I mean...
03:53Think?
03:53Yeah, because if you're on paternity leave, it doesn't mean the baby's here yet.
03:58Maybe it does.
03:59I have no idea.
03:59Yeah.
04:00It might also be inducing, like, who knows what they're doing this week.
04:02Exactly.
04:03I would imagine that if the baby is being born as we speak on this Friday, and he starts
04:09again, you were saying Monday?
04:11Monday would be the schedule.
04:12Yeah.
04:13But you're also right.
04:14They've got a number of different things they could do.
04:17There's no off day, but they could let Jelly start that game.
04:20Yep.
04:21Or something like that.
04:22So, anyway, okay.
04:24Tyler Fitzgerald stays.
04:25He's not in the lineup.
04:26There you go.
04:27But he stays.
04:28And now you've got an extra pinch hitter tonight, because Justin Verlander is on paternity
04:33leave.
04:33All right.
04:33So, there you go.
04:34There's your roster move.
04:36According to AI, it says players can be placed on this list for a minimum of one day and a
04:41maximum of three days.
04:42Okay.
04:42So, yeah.
04:43He can't even do this beyond the weekend.
04:45Yeah.
04:45This is according to AI, our good friend AI.
04:48Oh.
04:48Me on the internet.
04:49I love him.
04:50Yeah.
04:50So, if that is the case, then he's placed Friday and Saturday and Sunday, then he probably
04:55would make his start on Monday.
04:57Well, he has to be back on the roster.
04:59Yep.
04:59Right?
05:00Or off this list, anyway.
05:01Off the list.
05:01Yeah.
05:02Okay.
05:02So, there it is.
05:03Justin Verlander back off with the team.
05:06Try this one on for size.
05:08I bet that most of you, and to a degree, me included, you're going to hear this and
05:14it's like, uh, it's no big deal.
05:16I'm not sitting here telling you this means this is a rumor.
05:20However, I'm more interested into what this idea represents for Giants baseball.
05:26Our good old friend, the author of Arson Judge, John Heyman.
05:32Oh, yeah.
05:33Odyssey baseball insider, by the way.
05:37Listen to this conversation on MLB Network.
05:40They're talking about star outfielder Kyle Tucker, plays for the Cubs.
05:45We knew he was available from the Astros.
05:48Actually, we all have it on pretty good authority.
05:52Giants tried.
05:53They tried to put a trade package together to get Kyle Tucker.
05:57But Kyle's going to be a free agent?
06:00Is he going to go back to the Cubs?
06:02Not necessarily, because the basis of this conversation was, I don't think the Cubs are
06:08going to have much success signing him to an extension during the year.
06:13So, in other words, Kyle's going to get.
06:15It's a free agent.
06:17Listen to what happens.
06:18This is on MLB Central, MLB Network.
06:20Look at him.
06:21He's not a pitcher.
06:22There's no risk.
06:23He was a number five overall pick.
06:25He's made a lot of money.
06:26He is one of the most, if not the most, consistent hitter in baseball.
06:31So, it's going to be very difficult.
06:33But the Cubs are, you know, it's a big market team.
06:35They're doing very well.
06:37They need to give it a try.
06:39That said, once the guy's a free agent, he's only been there a year.
06:42There are going to be other teams in there.
06:43Never count the San Francisco Giants at this point.
06:46They look like an aggressive team, as we've seen.
06:48And the Red Sox.
06:49Now, the Red Sox have a lot of outfielders, but we've heard of Durant potentially on the
06:53market.
06:53There would be a possibility as well.
06:55Okay.
06:56So, John Heyman says, Kyle Tucker could hit free agency, and I'd give you two teams that
07:01I think will probably come after him pretty hard.
07:04Giants and the Red Sox.
07:05I get the Red Sox.
07:07Red Sox are looking for a middle order of the hitter.
07:09I wonder why.
07:10Yeah.
07:10I can tell you that if I were a middle of the order hitter, I wouldn't even take their
07:14phone call right now based on the way they treat stars.
07:16But whatever.
07:17Depends on whether or not they are going to replace him in right field or not.
07:21Are they going to let him actually play the position that he likes to play?
07:23I don't know.
07:24Or just whatever.
07:25Who knows?
07:27If the price is right, they'll go anywhere.
07:29I get that.
07:29It's still Boston.
07:31The fact that John first brings up the San Francisco Giants, who already have now big
07:38dollar amounts out to Devers and Adamas and Chapman, and to a degree, you've got to think
07:44about these pitchers now, to a degree, Logan Webb, et cetera.
07:47For me, what defines this era of Dodger baseball is every time they get the big fish, and you're
07:55like, okay, they've got their big fish, but there's a new big fish available, they get
08:01him too.
08:02And then the next one comes, and they get him too.
08:06And it's been going on and on and on.
08:09It went from Mookie Betts to Freddie Freeman to Shohei Otani, and then even on the mound
08:16when they were grabbing Tyler Glassnow, and then they would go get Yoshinobu Yamamoto, and
08:23then the Giants wanted Rokie Sasaki, and the Dodgers got Rokie Sasaki, and then they went
08:27and got Blake Snell.
08:29The idea of what the Dodgers are doing is they are like, we are just going to financially
08:35drown the competition.
08:38There's only a handful of teams out there that can even flirt with playing the game of
08:44trying to stay with them, and whether you believe me or not, the Giants are one of them.
08:49And so what I wonder now, now that Devers is here, I know a lot of Giants fans sat back
08:54and went, okay, okay, the Giants are aggressive.
08:57We got our guys now.
08:59Dibs, is this just going to keep going?
09:03Well, it's allowed to.
09:05It sure is.
09:06All you have to do to answer that question is watch a Giants game, and watch what happens
09:11when there's a fly ball going foul down the first baseline, and you look out over the
09:16last corner of the upper deck, and you see it's got to be a 15-story behemoth of a building,
09:22and then you look at that entire splotch of land, and you go, man, there's a lot of buildings
09:26on here all of a sudden.
09:27Cha-ching!
09:29The construction there, it's not completed, but that thing is going to be an absolute
09:34factory of money.
09:35And you look at their contracts right now, and I did a deep dive, and we can get into
09:40the deep dive a little later on all the stuff.
09:42Deep dive, yeah.
09:43They, five players that they have under contract total $700 million that they still have to pay
09:50these players.
09:51Stretched out over a number of years.
09:53Correct.
09:53It all, eight years for Devers, and his number's the biggest of all the numbers, but, you know,
09:58with Webb, Lee, Chapman, Adamus, and Devers, that all adds up to them owing $700 million.
10:04So, what's another $200 million over the course of six or seven years if you're looking to get
10:09Tucker?
10:09So, can it continue?
10:12Yes.
10:13Will it continue?
10:14Based on what they've done recently?
10:15My answer now is yes.
10:17Yeah, the big reason there, it's not just the Giants' willingness, it's now just Kyle
10:23Tucker, when the Giants call, there's two things they have that they didn't have before.
10:27Number one, they have Buster Posey.
10:29Number two, you've got a lineup that another player will look at and go, add me to that,
10:35and we're going to be winning.
10:36Yeah.
10:36We're going to win some baseball games.
10:38Exactly.
10:38And you have a team now that is showing you that they're willing to go out there and spend.
10:43You know, Chapman gets an extension, Adamus gets a big deal, and you go out and you get
10:48Devers, and if you think that you're going to be underwater on his contract, right now
10:53the Giants are drunk with spending.
10:56They're out there just, hey, we'll take two of these and one of these and three of these
11:00and this is awesome, and we'll figure it out down the road if we happen to need to cut
11:04salary, but they're in the other mode now, Mark.
11:06So, yeah, go out and get Tucker.
11:09Beat the Dodgers to it and have him be your number six or seven hitter.
11:12I think most of our brains go to the Dodgers when you hear something fun like this.
11:16It's nothing more than that.
11:17This is just a fun idea, but it came out of the mouth of someone who covers this stuff
11:22real damn closely, and we're only in June, so free agency is still half a year away before
11:29this is going to become something, and all kinds of info will take place between now and
11:33then, such as, well, how'd you do?
11:36How's it going?
11:37Did you dip your toe in the water?
11:39Did you make the playoffs?
11:40Did you make a run when you made the playoffs?
11:42All of that has to sort of be sorted out, but our minds go to, oh, this is how you need
11:48to compete with the Dodgers, and my mind went two places.
11:52That's true in terms of baseball, but stop thinking about baseball for a minute and who
11:59are the Giants competing with, and why would stuff like this start to make sense?
12:05Mission Rock Project, entertainment, Bay Area.
12:09The Giants would do something like this because they're competing with the Warriors and the
12:1549ers.
12:15That's kind of why I, what I started to think about with this trade.
12:21Rafi Devers, like, how did you, what did you say to Greg Johnson, Buster?
12:26What'd you say to him when you walked in there and you went, yeah, $254 million, Greg?
12:33Greg, let's go.
12:35I'm going to need you to eat it.
12:36I'm going to need you to spend all this.
12:39You're going to have to eat the whole thing, Greg.
12:41Did Buster say, because I think, you know, he'll get 270, and I think, you know, wins
12:47above, like, we'll probably win 88 games instead of 85.
12:51Like, was that the conversation, or did he, like, put a report on Greg's desk and go, hey,
12:59dude, I don't know if you're looking around.
13:02Jimmy Butler's here.
13:04Steph's here.
13:05Yep.
13:05Draymond's here.
13:06McCaffrey's here.
13:08Niners have a quarterback now.
13:10They've got Bosa.
13:11They're doing this, that, and the other.
13:13They've got stars.
13:15Greg, we've got to open up the books and get all the stars for baseball reasons and
13:23for all the non-baseball reasons.
13:25Yeah, and I think that was probably the pitch for Willie Adamas in the first place.
13:30Like, we need more offense.
13:32We need somebody who we can anchor ourselves to to sell to the fan base that we're not
13:38just going to be, we're not just going to platoon all these guys and call guys up and
13:43call guys down.
13:44We need people that our fans can sink their teeth into, and so you extend Chapman, you
13:49already had Jung-Hoo Lee, and then you go out and you get Adamas, and it's like, yeah,
13:53this is just another piece.
13:55Really, really good player.
13:56Long-term deal.
13:57Yeah, don't look at the price tag.
14:00You know, it's like when you go to buy a new car and the salesman's trying to get you away
14:04from the sticker so you don't have sticker shock, and meanwhile he's showing you, ah, the
14:08seat moves in four different directions, and the stereo, and this, and the engine, and that,
14:13and, you know, he's selling you everything that you're going to fall in love with about
14:16the car, and then Buster says at the very end of it, oh, yeah, this one's going to be
14:20a lot of money, Greg.
14:22Franchise values, Major League Baseball.
14:25This is a story this week in basketball, because the Lakers were suddenly valued at $10 billion
14:31with a portion sale of their team that's way higher than what Forbes had them at just a
14:37few months ago, because Forbes had the Warriors at $9 billion as the number one team in the
14:42NBA and the number two team in sports, and then the Lakers were $10 billion.
14:46So, that's basketball, I get it, but also, franchise values are franchise values, and
14:52one thing I've learned is, at least in the last 10 years, whatever Forbes says a team
14:58is, it's more.
15:00Do you want to take a shot right now on Forbes' current baseball list?
15:04Where do the Giants rank?
15:06In valuation?
15:08How many teams do you think are valued ahead of the Giants in Major League Baseball?
15:12I can't think, Grandy, I can't think unless I have the game show music.
15:17MLB franchises worth more than the Giants.
15:21Well, I would figure the Yankees and the Dodgers would be two, right off the bat.
15:26Ding and ding.
15:27Yeah.
15:28A couple of dings.
15:29I don't know if I was expecting to name them all, but...
15:32Yeah, how many...
15:33Bing, bing, one, two.
15:35Name all the teams you think are valued higher than the Giants.
15:37Well, I'm going through right now the list, and, you know, the American League, I would
15:42say the only one I'm tempted by would be Boston, but I'm not putting them there, and the Mets
15:49are an interesting one, as are the Cubs.
15:53I'm going to say just those two.
15:55Giants and Dodgers?
15:56Yep.
15:59Okay.
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