00:00Frontex's executive director Hans Leighton says he wished no migrants were returned to
00:05Libya where they often face human rights abuses.
00:08But sometimes, he says he has no choice.
00:12The EU's external border and coast guard agency Frontex is regularly challenged by human rights
00:17groups for not doing enough to save lives at sea.
00:21Its use of aerial surveillance to enable the Libyan Coast Guard to intercept migrant boats
00:26often results in vessels returned to Libya.
00:29I don't want people to be returned to Libya.
00:31That's the only way we can do it, is to inform this Maritime Rescue Coordination Center.
00:37And if it's in Libyan territory, it's the Libyans who have to take the responsibility, and they
00:41do.
00:42And I've been asked, okay, but why don't you just skip the Libyans and only inform the NGOs?
00:47But that would mean that I would play with human lives.
00:50Because if the NGOs are not available, then there's no coordination, then people might
00:54drown.
00:55And I cannot take that responsibility.
00:56So as long, as much as I do not like people to be returned to Libya, if I have to choose,
01:01again, I'd rather save lives than not save lives.
01:05Meanwhile, NGOs which actively reach out to help migrants from dying in the sea are regularly
01:11criticized by member states, even prosecuted and accused of supporting smuggling.
01:17But Mr. Lightens believes his role is to work alongside NGOs in the protection of lives at
01:24sea.
01:25For me, NGOs are part of the ecosystem.
01:29I'm in touch with them.
01:30We speak.
01:31We try to understand each other's positions.
01:33We try to make sure that we don't block each other, because we all see the need to save
01:39lives at sea, for example.
01:41And also, by the way, NGOs, we cooperate in a way.
01:44For example, what we do is, after return people, we have a so-called post-return program,
01:49which is meant to help people pick up their lives again.
01:53And for this, we hire, actually, NGOs to perform this on our behalf with European Frontex funding.
02:00So I think it's actually a more nuanced picture than often being told.
02:05You can watch the full interview with Frontex's Executive Director next Thursday on the Europe Conversation.
02:11Contact.
02:12Contact us and take this Wellington joint.
02:17Contact us, our hosts and ourKKK together.
02:21Thanks be to Mar knob!
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