Ken Starr’s former counsel talks impeachment

Brut America

"[It’s] categorically different and categorically worse.” Paul Rosenzweig, a senior counsel during Bill Clinton's impeachment, explains why President Trump's misconduct is worse.

Transcript

00:00It is a matter of real importance that what happens to the President of the United States

00:06doesn't just affect the President of the United States but affects every American and in many

00:11ways most of the citizens of the world to a greater or lesser degree.

00:17So that's an awful lot of responsibility.

00:38The Senate is being called to sit as the high court of impeachment all too frequently.

00:46Indeed, we are living in what I think can aptly be described as the age of impeachment.

00:54It's very hard for me to talk about that because I worked with Ken 20 years ago.

00:59I have thought of him for all that time as a good friend, somebody who was a bit of a

01:05mentor to me, but I have had a great deal of difficulty understanding how it is that

01:15he could have both advocated for Bill Clinton's impeachment and now be advocating against

01:22Donald Trump's.

01:24Ken Starr recommended to Congress that they impeach him, impeach Bill Clinton, because

01:29he obstructed criminal investigations of him by frivolously invoking executive privilege.

01:41That sounds a lot like what Donald Trump has done, both to Bob Mueller and to Congress.

01:48Ken Starr recommended that Bill Clinton be impeached for lying, not under oath, just

01:54under oath, but also for lying to the American public about his affair with Monica Lewinsky.

02:00That sounds an awful lot like something that Donald Trump has done.

02:04So I am puzzled.

02:07I haven't spoken to Judge Starr, so I don't know what's motivating him, but I find it

02:14difficult to reconcile the two pieces.

02:27I think the most notable is that for me, Trump's conduct is actually much worse.

02:34The underlying thing about Bill Clinton was an inappropriate but consensual affair with

02:41an intern.

02:42It was a very bad private act.

02:46Clinton's public errors, the misuse of his public authority, came when he lied under

02:52oath to the grand jury, when he lied under oath in the civil case, when he attempted

02:59to obstruct the criminal investigation of Starr, asking people to lie for him.

03:06Trump's misconduct is a violation of the public trust on both grounds.

03:13He has misused his authority to obstruct justice, ask people to lie for him, refuse to provide

03:19documents to Congress, much as Clinton did.

03:24But the other truth is that underlying all of this is a misuse of his own public authority

03:31for personal benefit.

03:32So where Bill Clinton's misconduct starts as private and then becomes public, Trump's

03:39is public from the beginning, is a misuse of public power from the very beginning.

03:44I think that the case against the president is pretty solid and pretty compelling.

03:51It would be more solid and more compelling if the president were to permit his closest

03:56aides to testify, people like Mr. Mulvaney and Mr. Bolton.

04:00I think trials have witnesses, trials have evidence.

04:04Every other impeachment that has ever been tried before the US Senate has had some witnesses.

04:12I don't see why we wouldn't do it this time.

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