00:00I think there's a lot to be said for keeping these really violent, serious perpetrators
00:07in our public view. So we need them to be held accountable for their behaviour. So there
00:12is definitely some arguments for this. What it won't do is solve the problem of thousands
00:19upon thousands of women and children at risk in the community. So it's got a narrow focus.
00:24And I think we do have to accept that those serious violent perpetrators, who have often
00:30violated many, many apprehended violence orders in the past, are people that our community
00:35needs to know are under the surveillance of authorities.
00:40Do you think it might give people a false sense of security in the community? I mean,
00:45you spoke about those repeat offenders, but of course, some perpetrators, in fact many
00:52of domestic violence, there may be no warning.
00:56We know that about 80% of domestic violence goes unreported to police. So we are dealing
01:03with that smaller end. So I do think that people need to be aware that this is a really
01:08limited move. And like all moves that use the criminal justice system, it only deals
01:14with that extreme end. I think that women and children who've been subject to domestic
01:19and family violence have very rarely put their faith in these systems. So they're
01:24not the people who are going to have a sense of false security, because they know the reality
01:28is that some of these perpetrators will continue to come after them and they will continue
01:35to take care of their safety.
01:37But let's face it, we absolutely do need to keep these violent perpetrators in our view.
01:43These ankle monitoring initiatives apply to quite a small group of people at the very
01:50serious offence end. And I do think that that's an important context. What we haven't done
01:55is address the perpetrators at the other end who have yet either to come to the attention
02:01of the police and the courts or to be charged with matters of these kinds of serious matters.
02:07This monitoring is part of a much bigger package, including bail reforms, meaning that alleged
02:14offenders will basically have to show cause as to why they should get bail rather than
02:18the reverse. Those laws have been in place for a few months now in New South Wales, keeping
02:26violent offenders behind bars. Have you noticed any changes for the better?
02:31We haven't heard a lot about this from victim survivors. But what I'd say is that it's going
02:35to take some time for this to filter through. And we've got to make sure that our courts,
02:40our magistrates, our police, our court staff are well equipped to manage this and to respond.
02:48So I think it takes time for these to hit the ground. What I am hearing from people
02:54in the courts is that there is a greater understanding of the level of risk and that these laws are
03:01being put into practice.
03:04Is this something that you think could or should be rolled out in the rest of Australia?
03:09Or do you think perhaps other jurisdictions might be best to wait and see what happens
03:14in New South Wales and kind of test its effectiveness?
03:18It's really important that people get some evidence about what works. And I'll tell you
03:22what we know is that what works is getting in early when women and children first step
03:28in and let people know that they're at risk. When we respond to them, so when we invest
03:34in response services like casework, support, domestic violence refuges, alternative housing,
03:42safety, planning, monitoring for surveillance devices and all of those things, when we actually
03:49get in earlier and respond to women when they first put their hands up for help, we get
03:54better outcomes. So I think that if nationally we could be doing that a bit more effectively
03:59and that means we actually have to put resources there and not just resources at this end in
04:04order to be effective. So nationally, I'd be saying that would be my first step. And
04:09I do think it's worth other states identifying how New South Wales is going with this. But
04:16I think across the country, communities are starting to say, why are we always asking
04:20women and children to change their behaviour? Actually, what we need are initiatives that
04:27bring perpetrators into view, bring accountability and ask those perpetrators to change their
04:33behaviour. So there may be some appetite for that. I think it's a very jurisdiction by
04:37jurisdiction choice.
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