The Scotsman Bulletin Monday May 20 2024

The Scotsman

The Scotsman Bulletin Monday May 20 2024  Scotsman Deputy Editor Alan Young talks with Political Editor Alistair Grant about the Scottish Parliament findings of a pilot programme over abuse levelled at MSPs including Lib Dem leader, Alex Cole-Hamilton experiences.

Transcript

00:00 [MUSIC PLAYING]

00:03 Hello, and welcome to the Scotsman's Daily

00:08 Bulletin for Monday.

00:09 I'm Alan Young.

00:10 I'm deputy editor of the Scotsman.

00:11 I'm joined today by our political editor, Alistair

00:14 Grant, to take a look at some of the main headlines.

00:16 Hi, Alistair.

00:17 Hello.

00:18 How's it going?

00:19 Good.

00:19 Let's have a look at the front page today.

00:23 And we lead today on, like many of the papers,

00:26 really across the country on the upcoming report

00:30 from the Infected Blood Inquiry.

00:33 This is clearly a massive scandal.

00:37 It's been a decades-long fight by victims,

00:40 as we have said in the headline there.

00:43 We may finally get detail on compensation,

00:47 very large compensation payments, later on today.

00:50 The report, I believe, is out around lunchtime,

00:53 and we're expecting a statement from Rishi Sunak in the Commons

00:58 a bit later on today as well.

01:01 If I can draw your attention to the wing column there,

01:04 we have Alistair Grant's story with Alex Cole-Hamilton,

01:09 the Scottish Lib Dem leader, talking about the level of abuse

01:14 that he experiences as an MSP.

01:17 And this is a bit of a theme, Alistair,

01:19 because we had a report on Friday,

01:22 I think it was, which detailed hundreds of cases against MSPs

01:27 where they've been targeted with abusive communications

01:31 which have been alleged to be criminal,

01:33 who've been so serious.

01:35 But bring us up to date with what Alex was saying yesterday.

01:41 -Yeah, so just to give a bit of background on this,

01:43 I mean, the Scottish Parliament initiated a review

01:45 of security provision on the back of the death

01:48 of Sir David Amess, the Conservative MP

01:51 who was stabbed multiple times as constituency secretary in 2021.

01:56 And this led to a trial programme,

01:58 which you referenced there,

02:00 that looked at online threats against MSPs.

02:03 It was set up last year, involved 38 MSPs

02:06 from across the political parties in Holyrood,

02:08 and it identified 7,661 abusive comments,

02:12 of which 461 were deemed to be potentially criminal

02:16 and were referred to Police Scotland.

02:18 So it's quite an eye-opening volume, I guess,

02:21 of abusive comments that MSPs are dealing with

02:24 on a near daily basis.

02:26 And Alex Cole-Hamilton yesterday was on BBC Scotland's Sunday show,

02:30 and he was asked about an interview he'd given

02:32 to a rival Sunday paper

02:35 where he talked about, essentially,

02:37 his experiences of online abuse.

02:39 But he'd mentioned the fact that he had been getting therapy

02:42 for the last couple of years,

02:43 I think the last two and a bit years.

02:45 He'd been seeing a counsellor about the kind of stresses

02:48 and strains of the job.

02:50 Part of that was to do with the abuse that politicians face.

02:53 And it's something that we've heard a lot of in recent years,

02:57 concerns around the abuse that MSPs have to deal with

03:00 just for being in the public eye.

03:02 Social media, obviously, playing into that in quite a big way.

03:05 And also, the stresses and strains of the job, I guess,

03:09 and how they've affected people.

03:11 I mean, Humza Yousaf spoke quite openly

03:12 about receiving therapy himself

03:14 when he was transport minister, I think, a number of years ago,

03:17 and spoke about potentially doing it again

03:19 when he was in Bute House.

03:21 He's obviously not first minister anymore,

03:22 but he was quite open about his own experiences.

03:24 So I think it's something that there is a lot of concern about.

03:28 I think the job of being a politician,

03:30 you know, people are rightly sometimes critical of politicians

03:34 and keen to scrutinise them,

03:37 but they obviously do a very difficult job.

03:40 That sense of not being able to switch off,

03:43 being a 24/7 role, very long hours,

03:46 often away from family for long periods of time,

03:49 it does take a toll.

03:51 And social media has played a part

03:52 in that kind of constant stream of commentary

03:56 and sometimes abuse that MSPs have to deal with.

04:00 And I think it's probably a good thing

04:01 that politicians are being open about the impact that has.

04:05 And I think a lot of people will understand

04:06 that these things have a cumulative effect

04:09 and they do start to kind of eat into your perception of yourself,

04:13 I guess.

04:14 - Indeed. And we of course know that politics in Scotland

04:17 in particular has been particularly toxic in recent years.

04:21 And John Swinney has obviously taken over as first minister now

04:25 and has made reference to that on several occasions

04:28 and on doing things differently.

04:30 I guess there must be a fear

04:34 that if the current level of abuse continued,

04:37 it's going to stop people putting off,

04:40 it's going to put people off rather,

04:44 becoming politicians in the first place.

04:47 - Yeah, I mean, if you speak to the people behind the scenes

04:49 in political parties from across the political spectrum

04:52 in Holyrood, they'll tell you that that's already the case,

04:54 that potential parliamentary candidates are put off

04:56 going into frontline politics

04:57 because of the sheer level of public scrutiny that involves,

05:01 not from them, it's not always about them,

05:03 it's to do with their families as well.

05:06 And people will talk about the abuse

05:08 of some of their family members,

05:09 members of SNIV just because they are in public spotlight.

05:13 So it is a real concern about putting off people

05:16 who potentially have a lot to offer to public life.

05:18 But choosing to go into frontline politics now

05:20 is a very different thing

05:21 from what it was a couple of decades ago,

05:24 this particular year.

05:25 As I say, that kind of 24/7 nature of it,

05:27 you just can't really switch off.

05:29 You've got this smartphone in your pocket

05:31 that's constantly keeping you updated

05:33 with exactly what people think about you.

05:35 It's quite easy to say that people should just switch off

05:38 from that and people should treat online commentary

05:41 with a pinch of salt.

05:44 I think that's sometimes easier said than done

05:46 for some people.

05:47 People have obviously different thresholds

05:49 of what they're willing to put up with.

05:51 And if comments are directed towards family members,

05:53 it becomes a very different thing again.

05:55 So yeah, it's already having an impact.

05:58 As you say, Scotland has been quite divisive

06:01 in terms of its politics,

06:02 certainly over the last 10 years

06:04 since the independence referendum

06:06 and the constitutional question.

06:09 And people like John Swinney obviously came in

06:12 as the new first minister

06:13 and has talked about the toxic nature of politics.

06:15 And I was actually at an event

06:17 in which Nicola Sturgeon was speaking at last week,

06:20 at the end of last week,

06:21 in which she said that the culture in politics

06:24 is now downright toxic, to use her words, at times.

06:27 And she was accepting that she played a role in that.

06:30 I think some of our critics would say

06:31 that she played a very big part in that.

06:35 But John Swinney as well accepting

06:37 that he's also played a role in that.

06:39 I think going forward,

06:41 I'm slightly cynical about the chances of politics changing

06:46 in any major way.

06:47 I think it's sort of where we are now.

06:50 Social media is not going anywhere.

06:52 The nature of political debate is what it is.

06:54 But yeah, it's a concern going forward.

06:56 And I think it's something

06:57 that people do need to grapple with.

06:59 - Thanks for that, Alistair.

07:01 Fascinating story today,

07:02 and you can read it in today's paper

07:04 and online at scotsman.com.

07:07 Please do keep an eye on the site throughout the day

07:09 where we'll have all the very latest news and analysis.

07:12 If you can, please do subscribe

07:14 and you'll be able to read and watch absolutely everything.

07:16 And if you're writing about today,

07:17 please do also pick up a copy of the paper

07:19 from me and from Alistair.

07:20 Bye for now.

07:21 (upbeat music)

07:24 (upbeat music)

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