- 16 minutes ago
In this India Today Democratic Newsroom panel discussion, an editorial team examines India's recurring air pollution crisis as air quality index (AQI) levels reach hazardous marks across Delhi-NCR and multiple metropolises ahead of Diwali.
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00:00Good evening, you're watching Democratic Newsroom.
00:02Our band of editors are back with yet another topic to debate this evening.
00:07And this is right before Diwali and it's also a week where Delhi is witnessing
00:10some of the days with the worst air quality, not just Delhi.
00:14Multiple cities across the country are registering terrible AQI.
00:18To the effect, in Delhi, a match which was to take place between India and Sri Lanka in December
00:23has now been moved to Wysak.
00:26Abysmal, terrible, embarrassing, but will pollution ever rise from hashtags on social media
00:32and ever become a politically emotive issue?
00:34So, our politicians actually care a little bit about it.
00:38Let's open the debate.
00:40I have with me Pooja Shali, Gaurav Savant, Rajdeep Sargassai, Anisha Mathur and Akshita Nan Gopal.
00:46Rajdeep, let's go first.
00:48Want me to go first?
00:49Of course, always.
00:50Okay, look.
00:52It's a year-long issue.
00:54Just rewind to Democratic newsroom a year ago.
00:57You probably have the same arguments that you're making today.
01:00And the fact is that that kind of collective consciousness, the belief that this is a major issue doesn't exist.
01:10And there are various reasons responsible for it.
01:12But the worst thing I think we do is political blame game.
01:14I was shocked, for example, the other day, the Delhi's environment minister blames Punjab.
01:19I mean, you look at the numbers.
01:21Actually, the numbers show data of stubble fires in Punjab's gone down.
01:24Which is the number one state today in stubble fires?
01:28Madhya Pradesh.
01:28In every Indian state today, stubble burning is increasing.
01:32It's no longer a North Indian problem.
01:34Just travel across the country.
01:36Pollution now affects every Indian city.
01:38Which is why when you all were flashing, Delhi's choke point is typical.
01:42You know, you all sit in Delhi, sit in Noida, you're worried.
01:44Because it's happening in Delhi.
01:46It's happening across the country.
01:47But the right to breathe is not a fundamental right.
01:50The voter who demands better roads, wants free electricity, wants better quality of water, doesn't seem to demand better air.
01:58Why?
01:58Because possibly politics in particular in this country is transactional and transient.
02:04Abhi mujhe kya milega.
02:05Air emergency is something that's going to affect the next generation.
02:08It's going to affect generations ahead.
02:10So you don't think about it.
02:11It does not weigh down on you like livelihood issues of the day do.
02:16So there are a variety of factors.
02:18But the one thing I don't want, which is why I want to say happy Diwali to everyone.
02:21And I don't want this to become a raucous debate.
02:24Because the worst thing we can do with pollution is get into a political blame game.
02:28And chahi, aapne nahi kiya, aapne stubble burning ne ko rukwa nahi.
02:32Aray, the worst offenders are transportation, construction across the country.
02:37We don't want to look at, and we don't want to take the kind of tough measures
02:43that a battle against pollution will require.
02:45China did it.
02:46China did it in the early 2000s because they were tough about it.
02:49In India, on the other hand, we have a serious governance crisis.
02:53And as a result of this serious governance crisis in this country,
02:56all we do is blame game.
02:58Why haven't all these governments met on a regular basis on a war footing?
03:02Why have they not met?
03:04Preeti, if I may, it's very convenient.
03:06Rajdeep says China has done it.
03:07India cannot do it.
03:09Now, India starts doing exactly what China did.
03:15Rajdeep will be the first one to say elected autocracy.
03:18We are no longer a dictator, you know, democracy.
03:21We cannot do it.
03:22I am sorry.
03:22But, you know, you can't have all sides of the debate.
03:25And if I may, just on facts, it's not about Punjab or Madhya Pradesh.
03:29Every state is trying.
03:31Punjab is trying.
03:32Haryana is trying.
03:33And stubble fires have actually come down.
03:36Haryana, but they quadrupled in Madhya Pradesh.
03:38But if you go by data of Punjab and Haryana, which is usually the blame game, you know,
03:43from 2020 when it was 83,000 fires in Punjab, it's come down to 2,787 in November this year.
03:53So why does the Delhi Environment Minister blame Punjab?
03:55Because it's still too high.
03:57It's still too high.
03:58So Punjab's...
03:59And you will do nothing about the Delhi.
04:01Rajdeep wants to...
04:04Rajdeep allow him to finish.
04:06Rajdeep allow him to finish.
04:09Madhya Pradesh who wants to do his pravachan and does not want to hear anyone else.
04:12Make him...
04:12No, I get personal.
04:14No, I...
04:14I get personal.
04:15I will leave.
04:16I'm not...
04:16Guys, can we just...
04:17But can you...
04:18No, no, what?
04:19Like Madhya Pradesh, then you...
04:20One must look.
04:21Either you carry out a civilized debate, then that Sir Savant is unable to do.
04:26Practice what you preach.
04:27Rajdeep allow him.
04:28Okay, one second, Gaurav.
04:29Let me speak.
04:30Guys, okay, I don't want to bring out the timer, but let's be civil.
04:33So you can use one like...
04:34Rajdeep allow me.
04:35Okay, fine.
04:36No personal.
04:37One second.
04:37Please.
04:37No, no, that's a personal word.
04:38He must apologize for that word.
04:38Please refrain.
04:39I will not carry on otherwise.
04:41Please refrain.
04:41I have come on Diwali in the belief that you will carry out a civilized debate.
04:45Everybody's doing.
04:46Rajdeep.
04:46Okay, let's...
04:47One second, Gaurav.
04:48Gaurav doesn't have an argument because...
04:50I don't have an argument.
04:51There's no point.
04:52I am telling you the argument, but you have...
04:53Guys, you know, you've got to cut it, both of you.
04:55Enough.
04:56We have to listen to him.
04:57Bolo.
04:57Bolo.
04:58And allow each other to have their...
05:00And Rajdeep, now it's...
05:01Hey, Gaurav, steer clear from personal attacks and...
05:03No, no, you have to apologize.
05:04Allow everyone to finish.
05:06No, so, madam, if you...
05:06Okay, do you apologize for using Matadish?
05:08Okay, Matadish is a very respectable word.
05:11But if he's taken offense, just say sorry.
05:13So if I may, on the substantive point, Gaurav and others...
05:19I must tell Rajdeep and all our friends, you know, I completely agree that environment
05:25and pollution is an issue.
05:26We must take far more seriously.
05:28For example, when COVID-19 happened, we had massive restrictions.
05:31When this happens month after month, especially in the month of November, year after year.
05:35November is the worst month, year after year.
05:38November, we must have COVID-like restrictions, whether it's work from home, reduce the number
05:43of vehicles on road, cut construction in the national capital region, not just the national
05:48capital.
05:49All of this must happen.
05:50It's extremely essential.
05:52While you have a grab system, you have a graded response system.
05:54It just needs to be intensified, Pooja.
05:56All right, who wants to go next?
05:58I'll go.
05:59We are not asking the main question here.
06:01Rajdeep, in fact, you are also doing the same political blame game.
06:05The main question is, like you're saying, why is the Delhi minister attacking Punjab?
06:08The main question is, 20 years ago, you've also been in Delhi, I've also been in Delhi.
06:13It was a beautiful fog winter arrival.
06:15What has changed in the past 20 years?
06:18The question is, there is something that has specially happened in the state of Punjab and
06:24that has impacted.
06:25Let me make my point.
06:27And I'll tell you.
06:28And the issue is with regard to paddy farming.
06:31This has been called the rice bowl of India.
06:34Let me take you directly to the state of Sangroor.
06:36Let's do some research.
06:37Let's talk facts again.
06:38City.
06:39Sangroor especially, and with other cities, with the farm fire map also that was shown,
06:44why are there certain areas that are specially showing a higher farm count?
06:48The Sangroor area, which is the constituency of Chief Minister Bhagwan Taman, does its soil
06:55and in Punjab fit for the kind of paddy cultivation that we have forced our farmers to over-cultivate,
07:01give them a lowest harvest window and make it into a monocropping issue.
07:07What happened to other crops that used to grow in Punjab, which is the state that grows
07:11the best rice and is the highest rice producer?
07:14It's Bengal.
07:15Rice was not native to Punjab.
07:17Do you know Haryana produces more paddy than Punjab?
07:20We are also looking at the wind movement.
07:21Do you understand that?
07:22What is happening then in Punjab?
07:24The reason is we have not put government initiatives properly.
07:27We are forced.
07:28We blame farmers.
07:29Why do they not take subsidies?
07:31Let me finish my point.
07:31You have to find out rainfall, soil, over-cultivation, all of these are issues.
07:37And I'm not blaming one government here, but I'm asking why the governments have not done
07:42enough with regard to what farmers are facing right now.
07:45We are saying stubble bath, burning hole.
07:46It's a national issue which we have reduced to pay up.
07:48Why?
07:49That must be a limit.
07:50Yeah, yeah, so when you come back to...
07:52I think that, I knew this point would come up.
07:54The reason is, is Delhi reporting 2,000 farm fires?
07:58Is Uttar Pradesh reporting 2,000 farm fires?
08:00Has that number come down to nil in these areas?
08:03Why is Punjab still reporting?
08:07Yes, to the extent, like Punjab, Priti, 2,000, 3,000 farm fires, no Priti.
08:13What is the maximum cause for pollution?
08:18Is it stubble fire?
08:19Or is it your construction and transportation?
08:23Let's understand wind movement.
08:25Let's go one by one.
08:27Why are we getting into it?
08:29We have to understand what are the options that farmers have.
08:32The governments look at subsidy, low-term, election victories.
08:35Let's give the sower, the farmers, what they really need.
08:39Okay, okay.
08:39Done.
08:39Who wants to go next?
08:40Yeah, please.
08:40To answer a bunch of questions that have been raised.
08:44And I'm going to go literally by the affidavits that have been filed in the Supreme Court.
08:48Brilliant.
08:49Because for some strange reason, we tend to politicize everything and talk about tum ne kya kya and tum ne
08:56kya kya.
08:56And I'm sorry to say, that is exactly what we are here doing as well.
09:01Punjab shifted what it was cultivating because of laws that were specifically passed to change the way cultivation was being
09:09done to answer a particular issue that cropped up.
09:13Yes.
09:14So the water, the use of water, how much water you can use, all of that had to be changed
09:19by law.
09:20It was a law that was passed.
09:22Us time ke le tha, ab it doesn't work.
09:25But nobody is changing that right now because the wheat, the cutting of wheat until you can actually plant the
09:32rice, that window has gone, has shrunk so much.
09:35It is a problem that is flagged year after year after year.
09:39And again, 2014 is when the Delhi High Court flagged this issue of airpocalypse.
09:46I remember this, I was working at a newspaper which put it as the headline, airpocalypse Delhi.
09:53The Delhi High Court took, had taken slow motor cognizance.
09:56It is 12 years.
09:58Every single year, in November and in April, in the Supreme Court, we are reporting the same damn numbers.
10:06Isme itna hua, isme iti fire hoi, isme itnei transport chaheye.
10:09We are looking at a long term measure that is required, which is not working fast enough because as a
10:17globe, as an entire earth, we have poisoned the air so much that the earth is beyond the tipping point
10:26of pollution.
10:27Let's face it, it is not about Delhi, it is not about Punjab.
10:30So you agree that people made it to the state, what their crops and vegetation is?
10:35Before we get into cross-questioning, the same argument applies when Rajdeep was interrupting, you do not interrupt.
10:42Nanisha, after Nanisha, Akshita will go.
10:44One more point I want to make.
10:45As far as farm fires are concerned, again, numbers.
10:49Let's look at the numbers.
10:502021, Punjab had 28,937 farm fires between 15 September to 4 November.
10:592026, it's gone down, thank God, to 2,347.
11:03Haryana had 3,997, it's gone down to 62.
11:07Uttar Pradesh had 64, it's now at 30.
11:10Crop residue burning, uh...
11:13Yes.
11:14Crop, uh...
11:15Okay.
11:15I am the highest, highest this year in Madhya Pradesh.
11:18My limited point is to, please do not, please do not change this debate.
11:21Also the numbers are five times what they are reporting.
11:25Mumbai, just a minute, Mumbai has the worst air emergency that it's also had in the last 24 months.
11:30Why? Because of the nature of construction that takes place.
11:33We do not prioritize environment.
11:35That's my limited point.
11:36Okay, fair point, fair point.
11:37All of you talk of a strong government, a strong government cannot get five chief ministers to sit across a
11:42table and make a national trend.
11:42Rajdeep, can I get Akshita?
11:44One second, Nanisha, don't keep quiet.
11:45Don't run around the bush.
11:46Rajdeep, yes, we'll come back to you.
11:47Don't beat around the bush.
11:48We'll come back to you for all rebuttals.
11:50Akshita, go ahead.
11:51Rajdeep, for the last 10 minutes.
11:53Hey, you keep quiet now.
11:54But who is beating around the bush?
11:56For the last 10 minutes.
11:57For the last 10 minutes, everyone, calm down a notch.
12:00Pooja, calm down a notch.
12:02Rajdeep, please, everybody, tone it down.
12:03For the last 10 minutes, I think what we've been doing is pointing fingers, Delhi, Punjab, government, this, that, stubble.
12:11The root cause is vehicular pollution in Delhi.
12:13The root cause is also geographical location.
12:16It's also the fact that, look, in Delhi, environmental issues make it the way it is.
12:20But having said that, I also feel that the reason politicians get away with it is because everyone's lax about
12:25it.
12:26Let's face it, we all talk about it.
12:27We're all sitting in our homes with the air purifiers on and that's it.
12:31After that, when you have to go on elections, there's no talk of it.
12:34There's some talk of our Yamuna cleaning, of air cleaning, but nobody votes on these issues.
12:39People out there also, whatever steps the government says, let's say Grap 3, Grap 4 is put in.
12:43You have additional steps taken by the central government.
12:46Now, by the way, they've put more curbs.
12:47They've said no construction activities, we'll bring dust down, we'll promote public transport.
12:52Doesn't work?
12:52No.
12:52Everyone still takes their cars out, goes everywhere they need to, which is the Supreme Court's point, also about Diwali
12:57shoppers.
12:58My point is that people don't take it seriously.
13:00We can pinpoint.
13:01We can blame the governments.
13:02The governments will bring in restrictions.
13:04We'll curse the government for restrictions, saying it's making our life so hard, and then complain about the pollution as
13:09well.
13:09Are you done?
13:10Can I just come in for just 20 seconds?
13:12Because, you know, I think...
13:13Nothing for longer.
13:14No, no, 20 seconds in Africa.
13:16Gaurav is being very kind on Diwali.
13:17Gaurav is being very, very kind.
13:19No, I have just a very basic point.
13:21And I think successive governments across India have been extremely lazy.
13:25And, you know, contrary to what you might say, Akshita, people are not going to be bothered in India,
13:31because most of Indians are trying to figure out where their second square meal is coming from.
13:35Most of Indians don't really care about pollution.
13:38It is in urban cities, not that B-towns, not that villages aren't polluted, but it will never be an
13:44issue where most...
13:46Do you consider Delhi...
13:46Just allow me to finish.
13:47Just allow me to finish, right?
13:49So, it will never be an issue for most Indians, because, like I said, they have bigger fish to fry.
13:56They have issues about what they're going to do next, where their meal is coming from.
13:59This is an out-and-out issue of governance.
14:02And I think successively, I'm not blaming one government or the other.
14:06Successively, we have had, state-wise and at the centre, one of the laziest governments ever.
14:12They have always put environment right at the bottom of the stack, never ever looking at...
14:17I'm not sure. I don't think so.
14:18Most have. Most have.
14:19Because people don't complain.
14:20Why is he painting India?
14:2290% of you are looking for next week.
14:24I will just... I'm not saying 90%.
14:26But, Ritia, they don't...
14:27I said nothing like that.
14:28Guys, you know, I think you all have been given...
14:30Allow me to finish.
14:31Yes.
14:31Right? Allow me to finish.
14:33But that's too much of a statement that, you know...
14:34Most, yes, most Indians...
14:36Most Indians are not, no.
14:37Most Indians, yes, don't care about pollution.
14:40Go out there.
14:41Most Indians...
14:41No, they may not care about pollution.
14:42That's exactly what I also said.
14:43But it's not because they're looking for their next meal.
14:45Can I finish?
14:47Yes, most people who are struggling in a metropolis like Delhi, who have moved in from smaller cities,
14:53who have come here, are trying to make end meals.
14:56Next meal is a figure of speech.
14:57But, yes, allow me to finish, Akshita, before you interject.
15:01Allow me to make a point.
15:02I allowed you, right?
15:03Allow me to make that point.
15:04So, yes, most of these cities have people where they are coming...
15:08They don't care about pollution.
15:09They don't.
15:10It's not...
15:10I disagree.
15:11Okay, yes, you've made...
15:13Five times you've made that point, right?
15:15You care about pollution because you're sitting in a plush studio.
15:19Somebody who's out there, who's trying to commute from an X point to Y, pollution is not an issue.
15:24He has bigger fish to fry.
15:25This is a governance issue.
15:27And successively, I am not saying BJP or the Congress or the Aam Admi Party.
15:32Successively, each party has failed to prioritize environment pollution as an issue.
15:39You know, permit me to disagree only on the point that governments are not serious about it or they're not
15:45doing much.
15:45There's a lot that is being done and I'm not going this government or that government.
15:49Hear me out.
15:50It's reactive.
15:51Okay, hear me out.
15:52We are in reactive mode.
15:53We don't actually put in measures.
15:56Okay, so measures like 100% electrification of railways is a big step that's happening.
16:02Solar energy where India is taking a big leap in the International Solar Alliance.
16:07You know, you want solar energy in your homes.
16:09Various subsidies are being given.
16:11So, there are a lot of steps that are...
16:12Look at emissions.
16:12And emissions.
16:13You know, there is a lot that's being done.
16:16A lot more needs to be done.
16:17It's not that governments are not serious or governments are not doing.
16:20But this has to be a national effort where governments and people work together.
16:24But Gaurav, they've never prioritized it.
16:26They have never prioritized it.
16:28Can I now make a simple point?
16:28Yeah, let's go all the way back again.
16:30It's very interesting to say governments and people should work together.
16:32I don't think it's people here.
16:33No, no, one minute.
16:34One minute.
16:35I mean, you just...
16:36I had two and a half seconds and you interjected.
16:38Make your point.
16:39Rajdeep.
16:40You know, look at Mumbai.
16:41The BMC decides to have a campaign.
16:44To ask people to be more responsible and restrained.
16:47During Diwali.
16:48Immediately what happens?
16:50The BJP leader of the state targets Dia Mirza.
16:53Who frankly, out of the lot, who was chosen as ambassadors for this campaign.
16:57Is the only one who has credentials to do it.
16:59Because she's worked as a climate change ambassador for the last decade with the United Nations.
17:03Forget the reason why they did it.
17:05We all know why.
17:06I won't even mention it.
17:07This is the sad nature of the toxicity of what communism does in a country.
17:10But the point is...
17:13You know what, I'm going to start the...
17:16Someone is running a campaign.
17:18Stop what?
17:18The BMC has taken a very...
17:20You know, has taken a responsible stand and said that let's have a Diwali celebrated in a restrained manner.
17:26Immediately what are the reactions?
17:28Who is the BMC to tell me how I will celebrate Diwali?
17:31I will burst as many crackers.
17:34Who is the Supreme Court?
17:35Who is the Supreme Court to tell me that I will only celebrate crackers with green crackers?
17:40Diwali, there's a problem.
17:42When you said that...
17:43You see...
17:44There is supposed to be a year-long ban on crackers.
17:51Guys, you know, one second.
17:52Okay, I'm going to allow me to get...
17:55No, one second.
17:56No, one point.
17:57Everybody will come at their own time.
17:58One second.
17:59Can I finish?
17:59Yeah, okay.
18:00Listen, I'm going to start the shop.
18:01One second.
18:02You know, I'm going to make this really fair now.
18:03I have a stopwatch.
18:04Everybody gets a minute.
18:05And everybody gets a minute.
18:07Rajdeep, your minute starts now.
18:08So, citizens who are tied up in livelihood issues.
18:10You know, in a city like Mumbai, you've got so many other livelihood issues.
18:14Just the sheer battle for existence.
18:16Means that you don't prioritize this.
18:18You want to celebrate during Diwali.
18:19You celebrate.
18:20And Diwali is, of course, not the reason why pollution is 365 days.
18:24I think we have to realize that Indian cities are the worst of across the year.
18:27Not just November.
18:29It peaks.
18:29But we have some of the most polluted cities across the year.
18:33Citizens have to answer.
18:35But at the end of the day, governments have to answer.
18:37Show me a government which has made it the number one priority.
18:41Arvind Kejriwal for a while tried it with odd even.
18:44No, that was harebrained.
18:45Yeah, no, no, it was harebrained because there are countries where it succeeded but you have to have it part
18:49of a larger strategy.
18:51Reactive, reactive like what we are doing now.
18:52No, it cannot be at all.
18:53It cannot be at all.
18:54It cannot be at all.
18:54So put it on me.
18:56So put it on me.
18:56No, it cannot be at all.
18:59Guys, Kooja, wait your turn.
19:01Rajdeep, you're done.
19:26You're done.
19:26Akshita, one second, we'll come to you at your time.
19:29Okay, God of your minute starts now.
19:31Go.
19:31So that's exactly what I said.
19:33It has to be an effort where government and people need to work together.
19:37Point one.
19:38Point two, a lot has been done.
19:40The International Solar Alliance going for solar energy, 100% electrification of railways, going in for more electric cars.
19:47All of these are some measures that have been taken and a lot more need to be done.
19:51You know, you need that eclipse that you mentioned.
19:55We need to actually for that one month of November have massive restrictions across Delhi NCR like COVID that will
20:02really work to ensure that that one month passes off.
20:05But in long term, yes, double burning, some steps have been taken.
20:09More needs to be done.
20:10Punjab and Haryana have both done a lot because of international pressure, because of national pressure.
20:16Look at, you know, from Punjab, it's come down from 83,000 to 2,000.
20:21Haryana has come down from 4,000 to just 60 or 80 that you were mentioning.
20:25And these are figures in courts of law.
20:27So, a lot has been done.
20:29A lot more needs to be done as part of partnership between governments and people.
20:34And as far as environmentalists are concerned, you know, they can't just crop up and say, Diwali pe cracker mad
20:39burn karo.
20:39Gaurav, I've given you one minute, 10 seconds.
20:42Yes.
20:42Right?
20:42So, which one?
20:43That one point on Diwali cracker.
20:45On Diwali cracker, either you stop crackers on Christmas, on New Year's Eve, every time.
20:51But you're not letting me complete this point.
20:53Either you stop crackers throughout or don't target Diwali because it's become systematic.
20:59You target Hindu festivals.
21:00Holi may be pollution.
21:01Diwali may be pollution.
21:03Raksha, that's one minute 30.
21:05No, no, not you.
21:07Pooja, yes, now I'm finally coming to you.
21:09Your one minute starts now.
21:10Go.
21:10My quick point is, Rajdeep says that you're mentioning Punjab, Punjab.
21:15I'm mentioning it for a reason, exactly for what he said.
21:18Rather than look at issues which are about nativity of crops, bring in experts, think of long-term measures, sit
21:25together.
21:25What do we do?
21:27Grab three.
21:28Pooja will take only odd number vehicle.
21:30What do I do on the next day?
21:31I don't have two vehicles.
21:33Construction.
21:34I'm getting my house made construction.
21:36So, the Delhi resident needs to suffer while the governments don't have long-term measures.
21:41The industries can continue.
21:43Everything can continue.
21:44But a normal resident like livelihood.
21:46I also have to learn my livelihood.
21:48But I have to bear with all the restrictions and I will.
21:50I will willingly do it.
21:52Come to Diwali.
21:53I'm ready to not burst firecrackers.
21:55But is the pollution at 400 right now because of Diwali?
21:59Because of firecrackers?
22:01Yes, it may add to it.
22:02I don't deny that.
22:03But what were the governments doing all these months?
22:05Now you're telling me, one thing is coming in the year.
22:08We all look forward to it.
22:10Gifting also.
22:11Firecrackers also.
22:13Pollution is happening.
22:13I agree, we'll do it.
22:15But you tell me what the government is doing all these years.
22:17Bring in experts.
22:19Bring in incentives.
22:20Look at long-term measures rather than ask people to restrict on the festivals.
22:24Okay, one minute, 20 seconds were you.
22:26Anisha, you can go now.
22:28Cracker ban was mooted for the entire year round.
22:33Cracker ban was in fact, Supreme Court had put it in the year round.
22:36Do not allow bursting of crackers in the winter months.
22:40Whether then they had to carve out that exception because everybody created a ruckus.
22:47In fact, we had great souls going to the Supreme Court gates and bursting crackers there.
22:53Then the Supreme Court, in all its wisdom, had to go out and say, okay, you know what, because you're
22:59so touchy about festivals,
23:00you're doing a work on Diwali, you're going to go out and play on Christmas, you're going out and play
23:04on New Year.
23:05But now, for two hours, let's do it.
23:08Just do it.
23:10Just do it.
23:10Don't do it.
23:11Don't do it.
23:12Don't do it.
23:12Don't do it.
23:12Don't do it.
23:13Don't do it.
23:13Don't do it.
23:14Don't do it.
23:27Don't do it.
23:30Don't do it.
23:32Don't do it.
23:43Don't do it.
23:45You both were allowed, you are 120, you are done, you are done, hard cut, you are allowed 130, you
23:54are one minute, one second, yeah, yeah, yeah, wait, wait, wait, let my stopwatch come back on, just in case
23:58I lose a few seconds, yes, go start, start, start, no sir, I think that, you know, if someone wants
24:02to burst crackers, who else will they go to, they'll go to the Supreme Court, that's for a breach of
24:05the law to go to the Supreme Court, I think a couple of overarching comments have also been made, one
24:09of, you know, most Indians don't care about pollution, I don't think that's true at all, most people are very
24:13educated about it now,
24:14which is the good thing, which is why we're seeing a lot of outrage, which is why we're having this
24:18conversation, and no, it's not coming from a place of privilege, it's because we are starting to realise that, look,
24:23this is not something that works, most Indians know that pollution is harmful, that's why you're seeing this trend also
24:29of most people moving to tier two, moving to other cities as well, the other aspect is that governments are
24:35not doing anything, I think that's very unfair to say, because yes, governments are trying, I would love to see
24:40a lot more, I would love to see more cooperation on that front,
24:43but there are GRAP, graded response plans in place, the central government besides that has also come in with more
24:48restrictions in place, the challenge is also in implementation, because people, to some extent will say, we can't be inconvenienced
24:54on both levels, we're facing pollution, and we can't go ahead and stop everything else from happening in our lives,
24:59so I think that, what we're seeing right now is yes, the government is taking steps, the challenge is maybe
25:05that in the long run, it's going to take a long time, and we have to face that, that it's
25:10a pollution fight, that's not short term.
25:11You're 115, you can start timing me now if you want, otherwise I'll time myself, I just want to do
25:1526, we trust you, okay, there you go, there you go, okay, why I think most people really don't care
25:20about pollution is, because if they really cared, it would show as an electoral issue, it does not show as
25:25an electoral issue, because like I said, most Indians have bigger fish to fry, their life that they live, priority
25:32wise, pollution is not on the top of it, but it should be on the top of the government's priority,
25:38number, why I think successive governments fail,
25:41for example, we put in these Grap 3, Grap 2, Grap 1, the other way around, yet, where is our
25:49public transport, we haven't created a public transport, if somebody wants to now commute from Uttar Pradesh, and bring in
25:56a car into Delhi, which is not compliant with Grap 3, then they can pretty much, there is no public
26:02transport,
26:03There is a metro service, Mumbai now has a much better metro service, Mumbai now has a much better metro
26:08service, Mumbai is a good metro, Delhi is a good metro, Rajdeep, you haven't allowed me to finish 30 seconds,
26:12none of you, it's not wrong Rajdeep, we don't have a robust public system,
26:16Our public transport systems are improving, they are not as good as much better, okay, guys, none of you have
26:20allowed me to even move beyond 30 seconds, none of you, no, no, Preeti, go on, none of you, right,
26:24yeah, so, no, there's no one minute, it's just amazing, because then you keep crying, you don't get time, but
26:29you don't allow anyone to finish,
26:31Two seconds are left, go ahead, I didn't even open my mouth, well, anyway, no, I do think public transport
26:35in this country is terrible, we do not have, you can't walk on the roads, if somebody wants to walk,
26:40you can't, there are no footpaths, there is no public transport,
26:43it is a government issue, is what I feel, at least that's my own personal submission, governance issue, it is
26:49a governance issue, and issues with successive governments, Rajdeep, it's their responsibility, it's time is done, Pooja, right now, can
26:56we please, let it be, and all of you, have yourself,
27:00How do you celebrate Diwali, how do you celebrate Diwali, around this table, I want to ask, actually, yeah, go
27:06ahead, from one line, one line, Patakas Pooja, how do you Patakas, I'll celebrate, as it has been traditionally done,
27:13true to our traditions of the civilization, we'll do it, what is your, how do you celebrate Diwali, you're assuming
27:18that, sir, you're assuming that, how do you celebrate Diwali,
27:20We'll celebrate, we'll celebrate, we'll meet with friends, we'll all do it,
27:25Well, in Tamil Nadu, you wake up at 3am in the morning, and see who's the first one to burst
27:29a cracker, I can't do that here, unfortunately, because the Supreme Court has said nothing to it, you still, you
27:34have time limits, I can't do it at 3am at 4am, yeah, keep it as clean as possible, clean the
27:42house,
27:42I think that is one thing, that my parents are going to make me do, and decorate, you Rajdeep, eat
27:47well, sleep well, dress well, alright, okay, so on that note, it's a wrap, from all of us, have yourself,
27:56a very, very happy Diwali, and, we look forward, to seeing you next time, thank you for watching, happy Diwali,
28:02proud of us,
28:03And, thank you very much.
28:04Thank you, everybody.