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Jeremy White and Joe DiBiase are joined by Joe Marino, host of the Locked on Bills and Bills Squad shows for his weekly appearance with the guys to discuss the Bills 33-30 win over the Raiders, and the Bills season as a whole as they enter the bye week. They start by discussing the addition of CB Tre’Davious White and how he will help improve the struggling defense. They also touch briefly on the offense and just how elite they can be.
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00:01Joe Brady asked about the trade deadline, which comes up in a couple weeks.
00:04Bills have a bye, then they play Baltimore, then they play Monday night against the Vikings
00:08the next day.
00:09That is the trade deadline.
00:12Jeremy and Joe, good morning, everybody.
00:13It is a chilly, chilly Wednesday.
00:16Going to get up into the 60s, but this morning you're waking up, it might be still in the
00:1930s, a chilly morning here.
00:21We're talking Bills, Sabres, you know, all sort of good stuff.
00:24We've got some good colors, some good issues to get in line with.
00:26But Joe Marino of the Locked on Bills podcast joins us here on the Western Hotline, fresh
00:30back from Vegas.
00:32Nice trip for you, Joe, and the Mafia.
00:34We shared a plane ride back to Charlotte.
00:36You're back in your hometown.
00:38Good to be home.
00:39Was it just the right amount of time?
00:41I tell...
00:41What'd you do, two nights?
00:42I tell Sneaky Joe all the time that two nights is really ideal, any more than that, and you're
00:48really pushing it, and getting home is of the utmost importance.
00:53Hear that, especially when you've got a couple of young kids.
00:55But got in Friday morning, left Monday morning, good trip, obviously was amazing to be part
01:01of the Bills Mafia takeover of Las Vegas, and of course, get the Bills win out there.
01:07Yeah.
01:07They got the win, and now to the bye week, they did it without DJ Moore, once again, getting
01:12him healthy.
01:13Of course, Joe, I guess the big talk around the team is the defense here, and what they
01:19have, what they could fix, what changes they could make, Tredavious White's return.
01:23There's a lot of little things to get to.
01:25Let's start with bringing back Tredavious White, because I know you are a fan of this
01:28move.
01:29So, take us through, maybe I guess, the possibilities you see here, what people should expect, what
01:35this does represent, and maybe what it doesn't, if there's something it doesn't.
01:40Well, I think there's a couple of benefits to adding Tredavious White.
01:44First of all, it's nice to have a guy that I think can really help calm things down in
01:51terms of just getting people on the same page.
01:54Trey White's been part of top, I mean, really number one type pass defenses in the NFL,
01:59and to me, that's the biggest issue that the Bills have.
02:02It's not like they're lacking talented players in the secondary.
02:05They're just not playing well together.
02:07And Trey White is a veteran, an established guy, somebody that people respect, I think
02:12can help calm things down and maybe get through to some of these younger players and help connect
02:17Coach Leonard's messaging to these players and get them on the same page.
02:21The other thing is the Bills are still running a lot of zone.
02:24Now, they ran a lot more man coverage in the last game.
02:27Actually, they doubled their man coverage rate from weeks one through five to week six,
02:32but that's still like 34%.
02:33They're still running a ton of zone.
02:35And that's what Tredavious White's done, right?
02:37He's a master of zone coverage.
02:39And so I think that's going to be a benefit to the room.
02:42Now, to what degree does he play?
02:46I think that's going to be fascinating because I think a lot of that has to do with how well
02:51Davis and Nick Benosin performs moving forward.
02:54Because if he's playing well, then you're, I don't think you're going to pull him out of
02:57the lineup, right, to get Trey White in there.
02:59So I'm curious to see, you know, what the threshold is for getting him on the field.
03:04I mean, hopefully IGB just settles in and does well.
03:07And you don't really have that urge to see Tredavious White.
03:12But it's nice to have an option to fall back on in case it's necessary.
03:18So I don't think the, if I were looking for personnel additions to like really upgrade the
03:24defense, I could, obviously I think you can improve at corner, but you do have some young
03:28players that you want to play.
03:29I think adding depth there makes sense where when you talk about, all right, you want to
03:33get personnel upgrades.
03:34I think it's easier and more straightforward to do at safety and then, and then linebacker.
03:39And so I don't think this precludes any hope that Brandon Bean is going to go out and add
03:43defensive talent.
03:44I think it bolsters the depth at a position that it's necessary and gets a veteran in the
03:49room that can hopefully help things out.
03:51I want to ask you quickly about zone versus man corners because, you know, the bills had
03:56been a big time zone team under Sean McDermott and then switched to a little more man last
04:01year.
04:01And the idea here with the bills going to Jim Leonard was, it was going to be more man as
04:05well.
04:05And they're back in zone.
04:06How about just the skill set it takes to be a good zone corner?
04:11Because if they're going to go to so much zone and Travis White's coming back to help
04:14them in that department, Joe, how much of it is about, is it football IQ?
04:19You know, is it time on task?
04:21What are you seeing in terms of the breakdowns that they are having in the secondary right
04:26now?
04:27Yeah, what, what makes a good zone corner is somebody that can play with good vision
04:34and understanding of route combinations and how to space the field.
04:37And then of course, like the instincts to squeeze and pass off routes and, you know,
04:42when to continue getting to your landmarks and when to match and, you know, when zone becomes
04:45man, like it's a, it's a very, it's a high level of, of, you know, mental processing that's
04:50required to, to be good in zone coverage.
04:52And when you watch this Bill's defense, they just have a lot of breakdowns where, I mean,
04:58there's a lot of times where I just don't know if everyone got the same play call because
05:01you'll have one guy that looks like they're playing man coverage, but the rest of them
05:05are spacing the field in zone.
05:06And then when that player is in man, it kind of vacates the zone and then you have space
05:10available.
05:11And when you have busts like that, veteran quarterbacks like Kirk Cousins and Jared Goff
05:15and, you know, Matthew Stafford, they're going to find that space.
05:18And, um, I think that's been at the issue is just a lot of blown coverage assignments.
05:23And, you know, I think I'm not, I'm not wanting to defend Bobby Babich or Sean McDermott, but
05:28I think there was some, some good messaging that Bobby Babich had a couple of years ago
05:32about, you know, sub packages and, you know, rotating and playing different skill sets and
05:36sub packages.
05:37When it comes to your secondary, he said, he says, ideally we would never substitute.
05:41We would want to have, you know, those players on the field together because there's so much
05:45inventory built up of spacing the field together.
05:48And of course, processing different route combinations.
05:51And when you sub one person out, maybe you get a better matchup, but you also lose that
05:55inventory of, of time together.
05:57And this is a group that just hasn't played together and they miss so much time, uh, during
06:01the preseason and you can see it happening.
06:04Now, I still think a lot of that is inexcusable where, you know, you're six weeks into the season
06:08and on that nine play 91 yard drive, you have two busts and cover three, right?
06:14And that allows back-to-back explosive plays to Brock Bowers in the fourth quarter.
06:18And it's like, how does that happen?
06:20Well, it's, it's frustrating.
06:22And so, um, you know, it's, it's a group that needs to calm down and be more assignment
06:27driven.
06:28Um, now the argument would be to play more man coverage, right?
06:32And they did, they played a lot more man coverage against the Raiders.
06:36Um, the challenge with that, when you become more matchier with your coverage is, you know,
06:40everybody does still have to see it the same way.
06:42Um, and, and be careful because there's ticks and there's rubs and there's different things
06:48that can happen that, um, will get you in trouble.
06:51And I look at that first third down conversion that the, that the thought that the Raiders
06:54had, uh, in the game where it looked like the bills might've started the game with a
06:58three and out, but then Trey Tucker gets wide open down the middle of the field.
07:01And you have a situation where it's Max Harrison and IGB going up against that, that, that
07:07two receivers to, to the left of, of Kirk cousins, they motion at the snap.
07:11And now the number one receiver becomes a number two receiver.
07:14And those guys just don't pass it off.
07:16And you get somebody running free down the field.
07:17So like, there's still busts that can happen.
07:19And man, it's not just as simple as, Hey, you guard this guy, you guard this guy, because
07:23there's still going to be bunch sets to negotiate.
07:25There's still going to be a motion to negotiate.
07:27So they do have to see it the same way.
07:29Um, but I do think that the uptick in man coverage was beneficial to the bills against
07:35the Raiders.
07:35And while Kirk cousins still, you know, he had 313 passing yards.
07:38He was third in EPA per drop back of all the quarterbacks in the NFL last week.
07:42I'm not saying he didn't have a great game.
07:44They were more competitive in coverage, right?
07:46There's no denying.
07:46They had 11 pass breakups.
07:48I think things were a lot tighter despite there being busts, right?
07:51And there were some good scheme calls and those types of things that added to those yards.
07:55But you know, there's anything in football, there's risk reward.
07:58Um, but ultimately whether it's zone or man, the, the, the secondary has to communicate
08:04better together.
08:05They have to see it better together and get to their, their, their landmarks and compete
08:09and contest better.
08:10So, um, that's, that's, what's got to happen here coming out of the by.
08:14Um, and, um, you know, it's been, it's been troubling to see over the first six weeks of
08:18the season.
08:18Do you feel like part of that could, where we end up is if they don't rotate their boundary
08:24corners, which they've pretty much been doing all season long, Joe, like I know everyone
08:29saw Harrison against new England and then I don't like, I haven't noticed him a lot in
08:34these other games, but how much of a liability do you feel like he is week to week right now?
08:39And can you see if the golf really is that big a point here where they just roll out IGB
08:45all the time, basically over him?
08:47Yeah, Joe, I think, I think the rotation has been costly for the defense, whether it is
08:53the IGB, Max Harrison thing, or even sprinkling in Caleb, the alarms or at linebacker.
08:57I think it has, you know, further complicated the stuff we've talked about, about a group
09:03that's just not rep together and communicating well together.
09:06Now you just keep introducing new variables and it's like, you got to find some stabilization.
09:10So I, and even Joe Brady this week in his press conference basically said that those
09:14reps haven't even really been earned.
09:16They just want to get, get players, you know, some experience.
09:19So that way, if their number is called and, you know, down the line, that's not their first
09:22action, right?
09:23He basically came out and said that.
09:24I think there's a cost to that.
09:25There's a consequence to that.
09:27And it's not helping this defense improve.
09:31So I, I'd like them to, to kind of solidify who their back seven is going to be and roll
09:36with
09:36it.
09:36I understand that like, you're going to have a dime package and a nickel package, but those packages
09:40need to be those packages.
09:42And, and the, the rotating for the sake of rotating is not, not really helping this defense
09:46right now.
09:48And, and, um, you know, obviously they'd be able to win through it.
09:50They're overcoming some things, but you know, you're certainly making it more difficult on
09:53yourself.
09:54So figure out who your, your pest corner is opposite of Benford, figure out which two linebackers
09:58you want to play and roll with it and allow them to, to gel and come together as a unit.
10:03Joe Marino of locked on bills, Joe, a lot about CJ Gardner Johnson this week.
10:07Um, you know, of course, like the incident on the field, his personality, the bills are,
10:13uh, embracing the idea of guys that are a little bit different.
10:16What level of player has he been?
10:18If they decided to just, you know, pull the cord, like, all right, we're done, we're done
10:22with this.
10:23How difficult would it be to replace him?
10:25If at all?
10:27Well, the, you always knew that you were signed up for some of this with, with CJ Gardner
10:32Johnson, right?
10:33The conduct on the field has been an issue throughout his entire career.
10:39Um, you know, that's not uncommon, weird comments in the media.
10:42Those are normal things that CJ Gardner Johnson has always done.
10:45You knew you were getting the problem is he hasn't been a good player on the field, right?
10:48There's not been the, Oh yeah, but he does these things, right?
10:51He's been terrible on the field, missed tackles all over the place.
10:54He's as guilty as anyone with, with blown coverages and drifting and not, you know, not playing
10:59the down and just getting to landmarks, like he he's not helped the team.
11:03In fact, before he spit on the, or the tempted to spit on somebody, he missed two tackles
11:07on a tight end, right?
11:08A tight end on, on the outside.
11:11And a ton of yards after catch was conceded because he couldn't get the tight end down.
11:15Um, you know, you're a, you're a physical safety.
11:17You're supposed to get that guy down.
11:18And so the juice has just not been worth the squeeze.
11:22And it's been a really short period of time for him to be, you know, taping in the, in
11:26the, in the locker room for him to be saying those deplorable comments about
11:29Efton Chisholm and now this, right?
11:32And not that I think the, the bills in that game didn't benefit from maybe CJ Garner Johnson
11:37not being out there, but you certainly complicated the entire game plan against a unique offense
11:43that runs a lot of two back, a lot of two tight end stuff.
11:45They don't really, they run the least amount of three wide receiver stuff.
11:48And you had a unique situation where you were playing Cole Bishop, lower alignments.
11:52You had DeMar kind of playing as a deep post safety with CJ Garner Johnson.
11:56And then all of a sudden D Alford, who's severely limited, has to play a lot more in the slot.
12:00You have to bring in the Jalen Kilgore, you know, you, you just kind of mess up that game
12:04plan because, you know, a guy can't control his emotions.
12:07And so that you're just not offsetting the weird with the good, it's just not been there.
12:11And, and so this is off to a terrible start.
12:14You know, the team has told us that they're going to kind of remain committed to moving
12:19forward with him.
12:19But, you know, I, I'd like to, I, I think this is your opportunity to, to try some different
12:25things out.
12:26And I know that, you know, DeMar Hamlin doesn't always have the most fans out there, but I'll
12:30tell you what, uh, he's a lot more functional than CJ Garner Johnson has been.
12:34He, you know, does the CJ Garner Johnson make that tackle against Mike Washington on the
12:38draw play?
12:38Probably not right.
12:39Based on him not being able to get a tight end on the ground, you know, DeMar Hamlin's
12:42going to be just a lot higher of a floor.
12:45Maybe you don't get the ceiling, but you get a higher floor.
12:46And, you know, maybe there's a bigger conversation about adding, you know, some talent at safety,
12:51but, you know, I, I'd rather see this defense with three on the field over 22.
12:55Joe Marino with us on the Western hotline.
12:57Joe, I was kind of surprised yesterday when I was looking around at some numbers on their
13:01defense and at next gen stats, they had the third lowest pressure rate in the league so
13:06far through six games.
13:07I wonder from what you're seeing, if you think either that's missing some context or if you
13:12think that we maybe aren't realizing or the, that there's not a realization out there that
13:17they're struggling more than we think they are because of Deion Walker and Russo, especially
13:21having such big seasons.
13:24Yeah, I don't, I don't, I don't understand where that those metrics are coming from.
13:29I don't, I, I'm more of, there's other data sources that I like better fantasy points data
13:33suite as the bill's 17th in pressure rate, kind of more middle of the pack.
13:37And I think, and they were before the last couple of games, they were really towards
13:40the top of the league.
13:42And you faced the Raiders and Rams who both run the highest rate of six and seven man
13:48protections in the NFL with veteran quarterbacks to get the ball out quick.
13:52And you're have a secondary that is offering, you know, free access all over the place.
13:57So I think that is really missing context.
14:01I think the bill's pass rush has mostly been effective.
14:03You have seen a really, really strong effort, of course, from Russo and Walker, but I like
14:08how TJ Parker looked in this past game.
14:10This team will be better when Ed Oliver can be healthy.
14:13You know, I, I don't find myself as concerned with the pass rush.
14:16And if anyone has listened to me talk about football ever, you know how much I care about
14:20pass rush.
14:21I'm not trying to hide anything.
14:22I think it's more the sample size, expanding the six games with the last two being what they
14:26were.
14:27I think that skews it and doesn't really tell the, the, the correct story.
14:30Yeah.
14:31Parker, by the way, like I noticed him a couple of times against the Raiders.
14:33Cause he made that play a few weeks ago in on the force fumble.
14:37If he's going to get more snaps, I mean, I guess it does.
14:40It could be a rotation who it's at the expense of, but Bradley Chubb's been a little quiet
14:44to start the year.
14:45Like, would that be where you think he might get more work?
14:48Yeah.
14:49And I think, you know, Chubb, I think on that really the first defensive snap against the
14:52Raiders, he, he got to take, found himself in space, had to take on a block and then,
14:56you know, get involved with a tackle.
14:58And you can tell he landed weird on the side.
14:59And if he has like some ribs or something that, that affected him.
15:03And so his snaps came down and you saw a lot more TJ Parker.
15:06And I think that's back-to-back weeks where TJ Parker out snapped Michael Hoyt.
15:10And so I, I've liked what I've seen.
15:12I think he's developing nicely.
15:14You're seeing the technique, you know, that's, that's applying itself.
15:17I get a really good, like chop Euro step pass rush move that, uh, you got a good lick in
15:22on Kirk cousins and pressured him, uh, in the game against a good right tackle and DJ glaze.
15:27So I, I, I feel like the, the flashes have been there and now it's just a matter of like
15:31expanding the snap count and whether it's, you know, Greg Rousseau is playing a crazy amount
15:35of snaps or, you know, allowing Chubb to, you know, maybe as he's aging a bit to, to not
15:40have to play as much of a volume, you know, I think he's in position to, to take some of
15:44that and I've liked, I've liked some of the Ascension.
15:47So, um, I wouldn't be surprised if down the stretch here, we see TJ Parker really emerge
15:51and start to show a lot of promise here as the bills top pick from that 26 class.
15:55Joe, to the offensive side, Alec Anderson at left guard.
15:59I mean, he's jumped in part of the new offensive line, right?
16:02The only really new piece and it appears to be going well.
16:05There was a game or two where we talked about how they were attacking the left side of the
16:09line because maybe Dawkins and Anderson are working on their communication, but overall on film
16:14for him, have you liked what you've seen?
16:16And do you think he's earning maybe more time there, a contract extension?
16:20How's it gone for Anderson?
16:22Yeah, I'm, I'm having a lot of fun watching Alec Anderson.
16:25I think the last two games you have seen him really hit his stride and I thought he was
16:31dominant against the Raiders.
16:33And what I've really appreciated about him, especially playing next to Dawkins is the physicality,
16:39the nasty, the mean streak that he has.
16:41And like, don't get me wrong.
16:42David Edwards was a very cerebral player, super smart, a technician.
16:47You know, I think that it was almost a crutch probably for Dion because David's going to
16:51tell him what to do, you know, but Alec gets in there and he's just a different kind of
16:55dude, right?
16:55There's energy, there's nasty.
16:57And I think this entire group, this, this offensive line is playing with more of an edge
17:02and with more physicality and finishing more.
17:04And I think a lot of that has to do with Anderson and his role and then kind of elevating,
17:10I
17:10think in some ways, Dawkins, especially in the run game.
17:12And so I love what he's doing.
17:15He's playing with good control.
17:17He's playing with good technique.
17:18He understands assignments.
17:19Like he looks, he looks more than functional.
17:22I'll say that, especially over the last couple of games.
17:24And so the dude took a one year, three and a half million dollar deal.
17:28And, you know, he keeps this up.
17:29He's going to, he's going to get a nice payday here as his, you know, he's playing on this
17:33expiring contract.
17:34So it's, it's, that's been a, that's been one of the best stories of the entire season.
17:38Go ahead.
17:39I was going to say, and finally, no DJ Moore for two weeks.
17:41You win those two games, maybe along the way, the bills find some other things that
17:45are working for them.
17:45I know that over the years, the everybody eats era passes to the running back were very effective
17:51for them.
17:51And they have kind of rediscovered those in these couple of games without DJ Moore.
17:55Now you add in the DJ Moore and you have an offense that, I mean, if it's not already
18:00at the moon, sometimes I know it can be frustrating for us.
18:03It's got fits and starts.
18:04It really is an elite level offense.
18:06I saw today they have 12 punts through six games, which is the third lowest number ever.
18:12The lowest is 10.
18:13A couple of teams did that.
18:14A couple of teams done 11.
18:15They've got 12.
18:16I know turnovers are in there, but the point is they just don't fail on drives, right?
18:21Like they, they do not fail to get first downs and more added back in.
18:26What's the ceiling?
18:27What's the, how, how high?
18:28First of all, first of all, shout out Tommy Doman on those 12 punts.
18:32It looks like the bills have an answer at punter, right?
18:34So we can, we can enjoy that.
18:36Good on you for paying attention to the punts.
18:38Yeah.
18:39Are you kidding me?
18:40It's my, I love that stuff.
18:41Um, yeah, I think two things really has, um, emerged with DJ Moore out of the lineup.
18:47You mentioned the throws to the running backs.
18:50Um, let me give you some numbers on this.
18:51The bills are number one in the NFL in yards per attempt when targeting, uh, running backs.
18:56It's 9.07 yards.
18:58The league average is 5.8.
18:59They're number one in EPA per target.
19:01When targeting running backs at 0.65, the league average is 0.082.
19:05Their success rate, 63% throwing the ball to running backs.
19:09The league average is 47.2.
19:10Things are really good when Josh is getting the running backs involved, right?
19:13It signals patience for him.
19:15And, um, it puts maximum stress on a defense when they also have to account for that.
19:19So I'd love seeing that.
19:20The other thing is Keon Coleman, right?
19:22Like the number one receiver in the league in EPA per target right now is Keon Coleman.
19:26And in this game in particular against the Raiders, two of those catches, Josh Allen made
19:31like anticipatory throws that you don't often see from Josh to Keon Coleman.
19:36The first one over the middle of the field, you know, Josh throws that while Keon is still
19:40pressing vertical before he even breaks horizontal.
19:43And then he kind of gets it, throws it right in between two defenders and it's in stride
19:47that Keon Coleman, like that is trust that is chemistry.
19:49And then the outbreaker, the deep outbreaker where, you know, Keon, you know, pushes hard
19:54vertical and then within three steps, I love the turn that he had there to, to break towards
19:59the sideline and then bend that, bend that break back towards the football.
20:03And, you know, he was really firm at the catch point, made that DB play through him and,
20:06you know, snatched it away from his body.
20:08Like that's the stuff when you drafted a big physical body control receiver, like Keon Coleman,
20:12that you want to see, but for Josh to throw those plays, those routes in rhythm with a
20:17lot of trust in, and, and you could see that chemistry.
20:20And so I'd be excited thinking about now you, you reintroduce DJ more with that, with the
20:27running backs.
20:28And plus, you know, Kalosha Keer is there, Dalton Kincaid's there.
20:31I think, I think this offense that is clearly the best in the league has a lot of reasons
20:36to be excited for, be excited for what it can look like down the stretch.
20:39Joe, what was your vantage point on the flick touchdown in the stadium?
20:44Um, very much jaw on the floor.
20:50Um, I, you know, we've seen flick touchdowns, the amount of yards on that throw, what it
20:55was really just what made it different.
20:57You know, like remember he flicked the one to Jackson Hawes, it was against Miami last
21:01year.
21:01Like, that's a cool play.
21:02Yeah.
21:02Obviously the, the avoiding of people in the pocket was unbelievable, but the distance
21:07on the flick is what just really had my jaw on the floor.
21:10Were you, were you in that side of the stadium or were you looking at it from the other end?
21:14I was on the other end of that one.
21:16So I saw it from the reverse angle and I just, I remember being there, you know, for as much
21:22as Josh figures things out when he's off script, it was just like, Oh God.
21:25And you, the touchdown was really meaningful there, right?
21:27You didn't want to go up by six.
21:29You want to go up by 10.
21:30Right.
21:30And so, um, yeah, this is a third down play.
21:33It was, that was one that I was sitting with Jerry, Jerry Ostrowski in the stands that we
21:38both just like, you just look at each other.
21:40You're like, I, okay, do you, Josh, do you, man?
21:44You're right.
21:45By the way, I'm, I'm rewatching it.
21:46He releases the ball at the 14 yard line and it goes five yards deep into the end.
21:50So that's incredible.
21:51It's insane.
21:53Right.
21:53It's damn near a deep throw, right?
21:54Deep is 20 air cars, right?
21:56Flicked it.
21:57And it was kind of cool.
21:58Like we can debate whether it was targeted for Kalil Shakir.
22:01There was three, there was three players like in a row is Kalil Shakir on the low part,
22:06Keon in the middle and Skylar Bell behind him.
22:08Like, I think he just kind of knew if he can get it there, that there'd be somebody available.
22:12And, you know, um, it's why he's Josh Allen and he's doing Josh Allen things.
22:16He's one-on-one Joe Marino locked on bills.
22:19Joe.
22:20Thanks as always.
22:21And, uh, we'll talk next week.
22:23All right, guys.
22:24Thanks for having me.
22:24Joe Marino.
22:25You know, he and Jerry O and the whole, I mean, the mafia, everybody was in Vegas this
22:29week.
22:30A lot of Vegas.
22:31A lot of Vegas.
22:32It was a good time.
22:34803-0550.
22:34Our phone number.
22:35We'll get to more of your calls when we return.
22:37Also, Belknap heating hot and cold.
22:39Joe Kelly's going to run a couple of takes by us.
22:41We decided it's a hot take, cold take.
22:43Did we also get to, did we get the timeless ticket yet?
22:45We did not do timeless ticket.
22:46We got to do that.
22:47The brewers' timeless ticket?
22:48I'm reading more and more tweets like every hour about like how wild that whole promo was
22:56that they did 12 years ago.
22:58Yeah.
22:58And now people are trying to cash in on it.
23:01And it's just not going.
23:02Basically, the brewers are going to lose a lot of money because they're giving a lot
23:05of free tickets out right now to people that they kind of screwed over.
23:08So people bought a ticket they could turn into any future brewer game.
23:13Correct.
23:13And it never expired.
23:15It cost a thousand bucks 12 years ago.
23:16And it turns out now they're in the World Series.
23:18Right.
23:19All right.
23:19That's the short version.
23:20We'll get to some of the inner workings of it because there's a lot to get to.
23:23It's all coming up here on WGR.