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Hypersonic weapons, quantum tech: What India needs for future wars
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00:00Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and let me give a warm welcome to Dr. G. Satish Reddy.
00:06Thank you. Thank you very much.
00:07And he has, if you look at his bio data, I'm not going to read all of that out.
00:11He's currently member of National Security Advisory Board,
00:14advisor to the government of Andhra Pradesh and ministerial level,
00:18and an old friend who had actually much of his distinguished career is with the DRDO.
00:25He's a former chairman of DRDO and secretary, Department of Defense, R&D,
00:30and former scientific advisor to the defense minister.
00:33So he's got a very, very impressive credentials.
00:36And today what we're going to look at is two things.
00:39One, looking at his DRDO background, and if you looked at what was there for decades,
00:45and I've covered DRDO and done a book, my book is partially on the DRDO and its growth,
00:49was, it was the best industrial, defense industrial model that was there in terms of run by the government.
00:58And therefore, collaborated with a lot of public sector industries,
01:03came out with a lot of very good projects, including Agni, Prithvi, all our strategic missiles,
01:12leave alone that aircraft, the LCA, tanks.
01:16It built a whole host, I'm just mentioning a few.
01:19Some of our most important technology emerged, defense technology emerged from the DRDO.
01:23But as we find in space, and now, of course, atomic energy, there is time for change.
01:30And because today's warfare is dominated by drones, artificial intelligence, autonomous system, robotics,
01:37yesterday we had a session on that, and apart from electronic warfare,
01:41these are increasingly being developed by private startups.
01:44So my beginning is this, can we now shift this huge defense industry that was dominated by DRDO,
01:53and as space has tried to do, allow them to come in a big way,
01:58and DRDO becomes the research and development hub, rather than also the manufacturing hub,
02:03how open to it, and second, on the startups business,
02:06how much of these startups can come up and occupy the space that's there?
02:10Yeah, I'll give you a comprehensive answer.
02:12The things have changed in the last two decades, particularly in the last 15 years.
02:18Lots of systems have been developed here in the country.
02:21Where the indigenous content, about 15 years, was back about 30-35 percent,
02:26today it has 65-70 percent is indigenous content, what are the equipment, weapons, what armed forces have today.
02:33So lots of systems have been developed in the country.
02:37Today we can confidently make a statement that we are self-reliant in the areas of missiles,
02:42radars, sonars, torpedoes, airborne early warning systems, tanks, guns, torpedoes, ships, submarines.
02:49All this made by DRDO in the public sector, not necessarily by...
02:53I'm coming to that, actually, I'm coming to that.
02:55So that was the situation, so you have developed, actually.
02:58You have been technologically, you are a step behind, you are technologically made.
03:03Industry, which was there, private industry, has been a component supplier, a subsystem supplier,
03:08which have been basically has been BTP, built to print.
03:12Now has it become built to specifications.
03:14There are more than 25,000 industries which are working as tier 1 and tier 2 for the defense industry
03:19today.
03:19Then, the government has taken a decision to make the private industry develop the system of systems, very critical systems.
03:28Now missiles are being made, manufactured by the private industry.
03:32Bombs are being manufactured by the private industry.
03:34Tanks, armored vehicles are being made, guns.
03:37Like you take the gun, Bharat Forge and Tata is making the gun.
03:40Today, lightweight tank, L&T has made.
03:43Now Tata and Mahindra are trying to make the gun.
03:46Today, missiles, at least about 12, 13 missiles are being made in the private industry today.
03:51So private industry doors have been opened to the private industry in the defense sector.
03:54And DIDU is working with the private sector in a mode called Development Come Production Partner, DCPP.
04:01When you take a project, right at the design stage, the private industry gets joined with you.
04:05It used to be only Bharat Dynamics Limited and Bharat Electronics Limited, what you have said earlier.
04:10It has changed now.
04:11So lots of private industries.
04:13So there are more than 130 private industries who are working as development come production
04:18partners with the industry.
04:19And you have just seen, 15, 20 days back, now all the missile systems, whichever private
04:26industry wants, looking at the capability, technologies will be given to them.
04:30So that is again a huge change.
04:32So the private sector's contribution in the overall thing has gone up.
04:35That is why Indian private sector has started exporting the things today.
04:40If you look at, the gun is getting exported, which is made by a private industry today.
04:44So a lot of systems like that.
04:46Coming to the startups, that's a revolution what has happened in the country.
04:50It's a revolution, I call it.
04:52Because look at 2016, in this country we had 458 startups.
04:58And today we have more like 2.25 lakh startups, which are registered with the government of
05:03India, DPIIT.
05:052.25 lakhs.
05:06More than 25 lakh people are working in there.
05:08And most of the 90% of the startups are owned by youngsters.
05:12And they have entered into the defense and aerospace sector in a big way.
05:16A lot of satellites are being made.
05:18Launch vehicles are being made.
05:20You have seen the success of SkyRoute the other day.
05:23There are other people who are coming.
05:24In defense domain, the drones, 90% of the drone sector is with the startups today.
05:32Cybersecurity, fully with the startups today.
05:35So many payloads which get into the things which are most modern, like synthetic aperture
05:39radar, hyperspectral and sort of things and all that are coming up with the startups today.
05:45So startups have been encouraged by the government of India in a big way to get into defense
05:51and space sector and space for defense also in a big way.
05:56So there are a few thousands of startups which are working now.
05:59That's the science.
06:00And there is a very important factor I want to say.
06:04The mindset of our young people in the country have changed.
06:10If you talk about 25 years back, everybody looks to join a job.
06:15Or otherwise, tie up with a bigger industry like BHEL, BEL or HAL or HMT.
06:20Try to become an ancillary unit to them.
06:23So there used to be a job-oriented mind or ancillary mindset.
06:26Now it is not so.
06:28Everybody thinks, why not I come out with a unique product?
06:31Right.
06:31And a globally competitive product.
06:34It is not just here.
06:36See, the propulsion systems what Indian youngsters are making and the world is coming and trying
06:41to take from them.
06:42Which is my question that I wanted was that you have encouraged startups.
06:46But how do you build them into the next generation of Indian defense companies?
06:51You have experience.
06:52You've built DRDO and the way it is.
06:54Now, how do you take a startup to become a giant defense company?
06:58Or you say, stay a startup.
07:00Just keep doing the parts.
07:02That's fine.
07:02No, no, no.
07:03There are multiple mechanisms which have been brought in.
07:05Firstly, a startup which is coming up, initial teasing trouble is the finance.
07:09So the government has come with multiple schemes to support that.
07:13You have seen IDEX.
07:14Right.
07:15IDEX is the one which promotes innovation.
07:16Please define it because many people may not know IDEX.
07:18IDEX is the one, an organization which has created mechanism to fund the startups in the
07:23country, innovations in the country.
07:25So a lot of challenges have come out in that, which are defense challenges.
07:30And whoever is technically competitive, they are all funded.
07:34More than about 620 startups have been funded by the IDEX today.
07:38And then there is an ATIDI scheme wherein you fund up to 25 crores.
07:43So there are about 525 such problems which have been funded today.
07:48More than 620 startups which have been funded.
07:51Similarly, in DRDO, to fund again these people, there is a mechanism called TDF, Technology Development
07:58Funding.
07:58The Technology Development Funding funds up to 50 crores rupees.
08:0350 crores rupees for each startup and industry.
08:07So a lot of problems, challenges, technology developments have been taken.
08:10So if it put together more than about 700 and a plus startups and industries have been
08:14funded in a way.
08:15Then the defense acquisition procedure has been modified.
08:18This is what I wanted to talk about and let's talk more about it is that yes, you've told
08:24them there's this innovation challenge here, develop this, we're giving you this money.
08:29But there is what they call a valley of death where he successfully demonstrates a technology or she or he
08:38or a company and but never gets a meaningful production order.
08:43So they have got this big invention, they have done it for you all but no one is, you know,
08:48buying this stuff.
08:49How have you sorted that thing and that's why it comes to procurement?
08:52Yeah, that is what exactly is the right point.
08:54The defense acquisition procedure has been modified and updated now, 2025.
09:00Wherein, any IDEX challenge if you win or a TDF you win and then you have successfully proven, right at
09:07the beginning of the challenge which is given, the armed forces have assured the orders.
09:11So as soon as you complete the technological development and you have demonstrated, automatic route is there to get into
09:17the defense acquisition procedure and it goes to the defense acquisition council and you are given orders.
09:23It's almost all, many of the companies who have won are getting the orders today.
09:26One more thing here, I want to say that.
09:28There are some provisions given to these people where up to 300 crores value if there is an order.
09:34You don't even look at the revenues of the company also because the startup cannot have revenue.
09:40So there are many startups, that is the root weight they got orders now.
09:44If you win a IDEX challenge, if you win a TDF challenge, you are automatically getting into the acquisition mode.
09:50This is happening today, this is already in the process.
09:54This takes us to the next question in the sense that always there has been great deal of skepticism and
10:00since you worked in DRDO you know that the armed forces has not wanting to accept indigenous developed systems because
10:07they say firstly it takes too long.
10:09DRDO or any other institution takes too long.
10:11Secondly, they want the latest, latest thing that's there and that is not available by them.
10:17How do you then draw this line that is there between encouraging indigenous innovation and never compromising on operational requirements
10:25is what they say.
10:26How do you beat that trap that normally happens?
10:30Your experience is there also.
10:31You know how the armed forces gave you all a tough time for anything that moved.
10:34Can you imagine these startups, they'll say no, no, no, that's better, that has been developed in China, that's better.
10:38How do you stop all that and make sure that they buy it?
10:41There are two, three things I want to say here.
10:44One is procedurally there have been a scheme which is brought in.
10:49Indigenously designed developed product, IDDM, indigenously designed developed manufactured item is given the top most priority in the acquisition today.
10:58If you don't have an IDDM product, then only go for buy, buy Indian sort of a thing.
11:03This is procedurally, this is number one.
11:05Number two, if you look at the systems which are being made now, it is not that days where you
11:12have so much of delayed, eight years, ten years, taking and all that.
11:15Most of the products are being made very quickly.
11:18You must have seen yesterday, Adani, there was a big advertisement.
11:21ULPGM, that means you launch a PGM, a precision guided munition or a missile from a drone.
11:29That has been developed in a record time of in the world that it is less than one year with
11:33a DRDO.
11:33Private industry, DADANI and one more industry together within that.
11:37Lightweight tank, one of the class in the world, a 25 tons lightweight tank has been developed in about two
11:45years in this country.
11:46So timelines have changed.
11:48The LCA Mark 2, LCA Mark 1 you must have taken about 18 years or whatever it is.
11:52Now LCA Mark 2 is going to take about three years.
11:55AMCA is given a timeline of about four years for the first takeoff flight.
12:00So things have changed.
12:01That is why I said the indigenous country, what was there in the armed forces earlier, 30 percent, has become
12:06now 65 to 70 percent.
12:08And there is a mindset, seeing all these developments in the country.
12:12The mindset in the armed forces also has changed.
12:14Now their confidence in the indigenous systems has gone a big way.
12:18So there is a lot of synergy between armed forces, DRDO and industry.
12:22In every project armed forces people are posted into the project where DRDO is taking.
12:27So that together right from the day, that synergy has come today.
12:30It is no more that I have to look for the outside product, outside product is better or whatever it
12:35is and all that.
12:36Those things have changed.
12:37That is how, as I said, in the startup when they come up, the startup product is a unique product.
12:43Look at any of the products.
12:45It is unique globally, not in the country.
12:47So when you say unique globally, that means you are globally, you are a better product than anybody else.
12:52So there is nothing else that you look at.
12:54So Indian startups, not our own people, lots of people from outside this country, US, Canada, France, Germany, Japan, they
13:01are all coming and taking from our startups.
13:03So things have changed.
13:04Now India, see that is why if you see the exports, last year it was 23,600 to do crores.
13:11This year it has gone to 38,458 crores.
13:15Finally we are getting there, yes.
13:16I am very sure next year it will cost about 50, 60,000 crores.
13:20So our industries have become part of the global supply chain.
13:24So world is looking to India now, come with the systems we are ready to buy.
13:28That's scenario.
13:29You are also a very good salesman I can see, apart from the scientists.
13:33You put it very well.
13:35But coming to Operation Sindhuur, and this was the battlefield test, right?
13:42And there we experienced, what would you say did Operation Sindhuur teach us about the ability of DRDO, our private
13:52sector industry, these young technology companies?
13:55What should we learn?
13:56Where were the gaps and what should we learn?
13:58See, firstly I want to say, Operation Sindhuur is a completely different conflict what we had with respect to that.
14:05This is the conflict, which is a contactless war, what we had.
14:08This is the conflict, which is air warfare.
14:11This is the conflict, India fought with indigenous systems.
14:15Most of the systems what have been fought have been indigenous, whether it is Brahmos, whether it is Akash, whether
14:20it is Amrsham, our own drones and various other things,
14:23all have been indigenous systems which have been used in this.
14:27Never, so many indigenous systems have been used.
14:30So the confidence level in the armed forces in the indigenous systems has gone up.
14:35Our startups have participated in the warfare in a big way.
14:38Drones, anti-duron system, drone delivery system, drone surveillance systems and all that.
14:43Second most important thing, in the Operation Sindhu, we could attack many of the targets, whatever we wanted,
14:50whether terrorist camps, whether air force stations, radar stations, air defense stations, bunkers and all that.
14:55But our defense system was so strong, we didn't allow anything to come and attack our side.
15:01That's the positive. What do we need to learn? What are the gaps?
15:04See, war continuously changes. Look at the war, what is happening in the world, whether the Ukraine-Russia war, you
15:10look at Iran-Russia war.
15:11You need to change strategies. You need to come up with no modern, modern weapons.
15:15You can't be happy with the success of the Operation Sindhu. You need to have better weapons for the next
15:20time.
15:21A surprise element always should be there when you go for the next war.
15:24So we need to work on the most advanced systems or first-of-its-kind systems and the unique systems
15:30which we need to have.
15:31Whenever a war comes, the enemy should be surprised with the capability that India has today.
15:36Good. I see our Andhra Minister Nara Lokesh is here and you advise the Andhra government.
15:42So tell us, what are you doing in terms of start-ups for the Andhra Pradesh?
15:45What are the kind of start-ups you are trying to develop? What are the challenges you face?
15:49And where have you headed to? Are you trying cluster development or individual development?
15:52Firstly, our Honorable Chief Minister is very technologically progressive, advanced thinking and things like that.
15:59He always has.
16:00You must have seen that. He's the first one in the country where the quantum value has come up in
16:05the country
16:05to develop the quantum technologies in a big way and quantum cities being built and quantum facilities are coming,
16:11a lot of quantum people are coming and lots of facilities are being given to the start-ups.
16:16The policy what has come up, particularly in the aerospace and defense policy,
16:19is a unique policy where everything you are able to provide.
16:22There are so many facilities given, so many subsidies given, the land is given on leasing,
16:27the land is given on various subsidy prices, our land can be even, you can pay an installment sort of
16:33thing.
16:33A lot of facilities are being in. In fact, common facilities for the testing and other things are also being
16:37built.
16:38And there are many zones occur at the whole of the state from Vishakhapatnam, Jagai Baita, Nandik.
16:43You talk about Hindupore, you talk about Madakasera, you talk about Laipakshi,
16:47you talk about Tirupati where Sri City are there, where otherwise universities are there,
16:53R&A facilities coming, Space City is coming.
16:55So there are multiple zones which have been created.
16:57How are you developing the start-up, particularly defense start-up, because that's your area of specialization.
17:03Are you trying a cluster approach or you're saying anybody can come or is there any specific technology you're trying
17:08to work out or innovation?
17:09There are multiple clusters. One cluster is for drones and robotic systems.
17:13Another cluster is for missiles. Another cluster is for aero and electronics and propulsion systems.
17:19One cluster is for naval. One cluster is for space. And then there is an R&D center in Tirupati
17:24being established.
17:25So if you look at the whole, almost all the areas have been covered where you have anchoring industries.
17:31And this is how it has been thought about. And so develop in multiple areas, in the multiple technological areas.
17:38Okay. I'm going to end with a question to you, because you were head of DRDO.
17:45So if you had to look at 2035, 10 years from now, what would be the three or four critical
17:50technologies India needs to develop and who should be doing that?
17:54See, firstly, we need to have a hypersonic missile. This is number one.
17:58Sorry?
17:59Hypersonic missile.
17:59Yeah.
18:00This is one technology.
18:01Right.
18:01Can you just talk about the hypersonic missile?
18:04Hypersonic missile is one which actually travels at six times the speed of the sound within the atmosphere, not like
18:11a ballistic missile where you go out of the atmosphere.
18:14So radars cannot detect and reaction time available to the enemy is very less.
18:17And so India is the first country in the world which has tested a hypersonic engine, which is a scramjet
18:26engine, for about 1200 seconds.
18:28So India is in the right path to develop it and things. This is number one.
18:31So Agni's speed is what and hypersonic missiles will be what? Agni's speed right now is two mark, one mark?
18:35Agni is a ballistic missile.
18:37Right.
18:37Agni is a ballistic missile, goes out of atmosphere and comes in and that's…
18:41So you are going to almost 300, 400 kilometers any radar can detect.
18:45Whereas hypersonic missile, you are just at about 30 kilometers, 25 kilometers.
18:49So unless you go near, you will not be able to.
18:51And you are moving about eight mark, eight times the…
18:53Six mark.
18:54Six mark plus.
18:55So you don't have any reaction time to do it also.
18:57That's one, hypersonic.
18:59Quantum technologies, which I said now, just now we've talked about quantum technologies,
19:03where we, country has taken a lot of steps, quantum mission has been created.
19:06How will quantum change defense?
19:09Quantum technologies will change in a big way.
19:11Why I'm saying is, one is quantum communication.
19:13Nobody can meddle with your communication.
19:16This is number one.
19:17Second, quantum computing capability.
19:19You will have decrypt anything and you will be able to solve any equation, anything and all.
19:23That the quantum sensors, quantum magnetometer, quantum radar, quantum electronic warfare,
19:30the sensitivities, you will be able to detect a minor choosing also.
19:33So this is going to change the complete spectrum of warfare today with the quantum technologies emerging.
19:39This is number two.
19:40Number three, materials and manufacturing technology.
19:43We have to lead the things in a big way.
19:45And country, India, has to become a world's manufacturing hub.
19:49And that's the goal we need to have by 2035.
19:52That is what makes the country Vexit Bharat.
19:55So these are the things what we need to work.
19:57Never mention one.
19:58And we've got 40 seconds.
19:59You'll have to give me that answer because I don't want the minister to wait also.
20:02Propulsion systems.
20:03When you look at the major thing, you are looking at engines.
20:07Now, in terms of engines, we've never really been able to do a jet engine of great, this thing,
20:13where we're able to demonstrate across.
20:15We're still buying our engines from the US.
20:16Look at any of our major warfare equipment.
20:21The heart is where the power lies, but we're not able to do that.
20:24Why not?
20:24And what needs to be done?
20:26I think I need to clarify clearly to everyone on these things.
20:29The country has moved ahead a lot in the engines today.
20:32We could develop our own tank engine.
20:34We could develop our own helicopter engine today.
20:37We could develop our own engine for the cruise missile.
20:39Not jet engine.
20:40Kaveri engine has been already developed, which was for the LCA.
20:43Now, today, the dry engine is going to go into getting to UCAL.
20:46So, engines, even for the aircraft, have been developed.
20:49What is the engine we need to develop is what is required for AMCA,
20:51which is a 110 kilonewton engine, which is a small size and all that.
20:55There are efforts being made in that direction.
20:57I am very confident that, having made so many engines now,
21:00in the next 10 years, India will have its own engine, 100% sure.
21:04Well, with that very, very encouraging thing,
21:06let's give Dr. Satish Reddy a very warm round of applause.
21:09Thank you so much, sir. Thank you.