Das Duell in London: Mehdi Hasan vs. Maximilian Krah – Teil 1
In diesem ersten Teil des „Head to Head“-Interviews prallen zwei völlig gegensätzliche Welten aufeinander, wenn Mehdi Hasan den AfD-Abgeordneten Maximilian Krah in London direkt zur Verantwortung zieht. Das Gespräch beleuchtet direkt zu Beginn die ideologischen Fundamente der AfD und geht der Frage nach, ob die Partei eine reale Bedrohung für die deutsche Demokratie darstellt. Besonders intensiv wird dabei der Begriff der „Remigration“ seziert, wobei Hasan versucht, Krahs rhetorische Strategien zu entlarven und hinter die Euphemismen zu blicken. Ein zentraler Punkt im ersten Teil ist zudem die anhaltende politische Isolation durch die sogenannte Brandmauer, die von Krah als reines Machtinstrument der etablierten Parteien gebrandmarkt wird, während Hasan nach der tatsächlichen Regierungsfähigkeit und dem Umgang mit staatlichen Institutionen wie dem Verfassungsschutz bohrt. Es ist ein Schlagabtausch, der ohne Umschweife die tiefen Gräben der aktuellen politischen Debatte in Deutschland offenlegt.
#AfD #MaximilianKrah #MehdiHasan #HeadToHead #AlJazeera #Remigration #DeutschlandPolitik #Debatte #ZukunftDeutschland #PolitikTalk #Brandmauer #Demokratie #AfDVerbot #HardTalk #Klartext #PolitikVideo #Aktuell
In diesem ersten Teil des „Head to Head“-Interviews prallen zwei völlig gegensätzliche Welten aufeinander, wenn Mehdi Hasan den AfD-Abgeordneten Maximilian Krah in London direkt zur Verantwortung zieht. Das Gespräch beleuchtet direkt zu Beginn die ideologischen Fundamente der AfD und geht der Frage nach, ob die Partei eine reale Bedrohung für die deutsche Demokratie darstellt. Besonders intensiv wird dabei der Begriff der „Remigration“ seziert, wobei Hasan versucht, Krahs rhetorische Strategien zu entlarven und hinter die Euphemismen zu blicken. Ein zentraler Punkt im ersten Teil ist zudem die anhaltende politische Isolation durch die sogenannte Brandmauer, die von Krah als reines Machtinstrument der etablierten Parteien gebrandmarkt wird, während Hasan nach der tatsächlichen Regierungsfähigkeit und dem Umgang mit staatlichen Institutionen wie dem Verfassungsschutz bohrt. Es ist ein Schlagabtausch, der ohne Umschweife die tiefen Gräben der aktuellen politischen Debatte in Deutschland offenlegt.
#AfD #MaximilianKrah #MehdiHasan #HeadToHead #AlJazeera #Remigration #DeutschlandPolitik #Debatte #ZukunftDeutschland #PolitikTalk #Brandmauer #Demokratie #AfDVerbot #HardTalk #Klartext #PolitikVideo #Aktuell
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NewsTranskript
00:00Die deutschen Grenzen sind dicht, liebe Freunde. Sie sind dicht.
00:06Germany has a new political powerhouse.
00:08The Alternative for Deutschland, or AfD, is now the second largest party in Parliament
00:12and is currently polling first nationally.
00:15AfD! AfD!
00:17Formed in 2013, the AfD began as a Euroskeptic movement.
00:20But on the back of Europe's refugee crisis, it morphed into a hardline anti-immigration party.
00:25Its critics say it is a far-right extremist party with ties to neo-Nazi groups
00:29and policies that threaten the German constitution.
00:33Mainstream German politicians are refusing to work with them so far.
00:38But the AfD say that they are the only party that can save Germany
00:41and restore its cultural identity through strict immigration controls and mass deportations.
00:47My guest tonight is one of the AfD's most controversial and well-known figures.
00:51He was a member of the European Parliament and the party's executive board,
00:55but was sidelined after a series of controversies.
00:57In 2025, he became an AfD member of the German Parliament.
01:01I'm Mehdi Hassan, and tonight I go head-to-head with Maximilian Krah.
01:09I'll challenge him on the AfD's remigration agenda,
01:12its far-right rhetoric, and some shocking bribery allegations.
01:17Tonight, I'll also be joined by our panel of experts,
01:20Deborah Feldman, a German-American writer and political commentator,
01:23Gerald Knauss, chairman of the think tank European Stability Initiative,
01:26and Ralph Schulhammer, head of the Center for Applied History
01:29at the conservative think tank, the MCC.
01:47Welcome to Head-to-Head. Maximilian Krah, thank you for joining me on the show tonight.
01:51Thank you for inviting me.
01:52For many years, we've wondered whether we should have the AfD on this show.
01:56You're top of the polls.
01:56But you're also considered to be an extremist party.
02:00That is the view, for example, of Germany's domestic intelligence agency, the BFV,
02:04which last year classified your party as a right-wing extremist organization.
02:12A designation that admittedly is on hold, it's on pause,
02:15while your party contests it in court.
02:17But three of your state party chapters were also classified as extremists.
02:20Your youth wing has since been disbanded.
02:22So when your critics say the AfD is an extremist organization,
02:25a racist far-right threat to German democracy,
02:27they're not wrong, are they, based on the evidence?
02:29They are, because the question is, are they completely objective,
02:33or are they politically instrumentalized?
02:35The intelligence get their orders from the Minister of Interior.
02:43And now, look, we came, and now we are the strongest party in the polls.
02:46We are, in East Germany, close to 50%.
02:49So our success costs a lot of jobs for established politicians.
02:53And now you have two ways.
02:54You can argue with us, like we do today, so we can debate,
02:57or you can just say they are extremists, shut them up.
02:59A poll came out last month from ZDF, a very respected poll,
03:02found 72% of Germans say the AfD is a danger to democracy.
03:06True.
03:06That's a 7 out of 10 German secure party.
03:08It's a danger to democracy.
03:09We have to work.
03:10We have to work and convince people that we are not.
03:12But if the mainstream media is telling the audience
03:15that we are a danger for years and years,
03:18then of course some people believe that.
03:19Well, it's not just the mainstream media.
03:20Germans' domestic intelligence agency is saying.
03:22And you're saying they're biased.
03:23Yes, they're biased.
03:24But that's weird, because when they were criticizing Muslim groups
03:27for being extremists, you cited them in your manifesto in 2017.
03:30You were fine to quote them.
03:31Yeah, but sometimes we read what they write,
03:33and then we say, okay, this is maybe biased and that is not biased.
03:36Oh, the bit that's anti-you is biased,
03:37and the bit that's anti-Muslim is not biased.
03:43It's a question of analysis.
03:45They take the facts and then they make an interpretation.
03:47And what they interpret as extremists, in our case,
03:51is a standard for politicians outside.
03:53I mean, look, we have in Austria the Freedom Party
03:55that in some parts is more to the right wing than we are,
03:58and we don't talk about Donald Trump.
04:00But given the standards of the German domestic intelligence
04:03and taken to Donald Trump, I mean, he would be much more than extremists.
04:07Do you think Donald Trump is to your right?
04:09We are very close to Donald Trump.
04:10You've called yourself the German Donald Trump.
04:12Others called me that way, and I think it's flattering.
04:15I think you introduced yourself to a journalist from The Spectator in that way.
04:17There are many watching today who will say that you,
04:19the German Donald Trump, are yourself an extremist.
04:23In the German intelligence agency's report on the AFD,
04:25you were cited hundreds of times by name.
04:27They said, your view of humanity is incompatible with the German constitution.
04:31You're also famously on record saying, quote,
04:33not all members of the Nazi SS were criminals.
04:36Something so outrageous that even your own party,
04:39they kicked you out of their parliamentary delegation.
04:41That's not completely right.
04:42Well, Marine Le Pen, the French far-right leader, said,
04:44that's too much even for me, and they cut off ties with you.
04:46Even that is a simplification.
04:48Marine Le Pen always wanted to kick the AFD out of her group
04:50for several traditional reasons the French right has for Germany,
04:53and they needed a reason or they needed something they could sell to the press.
04:57Are you defending the SS?
04:59No, I never defended.
05:00There was a lady, and she told me,
05:01Mr. Carr, you said we should be proud of our ancestors.
05:04Now, my grandfather was an SS soldier.
05:08What do you say to me?
05:09And then I asked, have you checked the case?
05:11Was he a criminal?
05:13Only from the given fact that he was a member,
05:15I will not tell you that he was a criminal.
05:17And, I mean, this is the praxis that even the allied forces
05:20during World War II made for those cases.
05:23So, when they captured an SS soldier, they asked,
05:25are you...
05:26Yeah, but the SS is a criminal organization,
05:28but not each and every one.
05:29You have to check, is he guilty?
05:31Is he a criminal?
05:32I never denied one German crime during the World War,
05:35but I say, even then, you have to check personal guilt.
05:38Look who sits with you in the German parliament right now.
05:40Matthias Helfrich, who called himself
05:42the friendly face of Nazism.
05:44Dario Seifert, he was a former member of a neo-Nazi group
05:46that's blacklisted by the AfD.
05:48Is he a member of the parliament or is he an employee?
05:50Dario Seifert.
05:51He should be my colleague.
05:52I've never heard the name before, but maybe you're...
05:54He's a member of the Bundestag.
05:54Okay.
05:55He actually took Angela Merkel's seat in parliament,
05:57so people know him quite well.
05:57Ah, that's the guy, yes.
05:59That's the guy.
06:00The former neo-Nazi group member.
06:03Then there's Bjorn Hooker,
06:04one of your party's most influential figures,
06:05the AfD leader in Thuringia,
06:07twice convicted in a German court
06:08for using the banned Nazi slogan,
06:10Everything for Germany,
06:11which was the motto of Hitler's stormtroopers.
06:14He said it twice, and then he said,
06:16it's wrong to portray Hitler as, quote,
06:18absolutely evil.
06:19There do seem to be a lot of Nazi sympathizers.
06:20Yeah, but let's say,
06:21I mean, the audience can decide it.
06:22If I would say everything for the United Kingdom,
06:25then you would say, okay, it's a patriotic phrase.
06:27I was always interested in history.
06:29I didn't know that this was a special Nazi slogan.
06:31And he said...
06:31Well, he did.
06:32He's a history teacher.
06:32Maybe.
06:32I would say we have a problem with free speech.
06:35The phrase everything for Germany was used much,
06:37but often much before.
06:38Or is this the issue that there's a lot of people in your party
06:40who like to play footsie with Nazis
06:42or with the Nazi period of history?
06:43Maybe it sounds that way,
06:44but it's not the fact.
06:45I wouldn't say that this is typical.
06:46Look, we talk about immigration.
06:48We talk about demographics.
06:50We talk about economic development.
06:52And then, okay,
06:52the party is now more than 10 years old,
06:55and you will find such examples,
06:56which I don't like.
06:58Those are bad examples.
06:59But you cannot judge a party by such isolated facts.
07:02You have to make a whole...
07:03I mentioned two members of parliament,
07:04one of whom you conveniently hadn't heard of,
07:06and the most influential state leader of your party.
07:08No, no, no, not the most influential.
07:09Come on.
07:10Turingia is a very small state.
07:11He's seen as one of the most...
07:12In fact, Alice Weidel was asked,
07:15would you make him a minister?
07:16And she said, yes.
07:16So we're looking at a future government minister as well,
07:18saying this stuff.
07:19I tell you that he will not become part of the government.
07:22How do you know that?
07:23Alice Weidel said she couldn't.
07:24Yeah, he said she can imagine,
07:25but what shall you do?
07:26Imagine you're on a TV studio,
07:28and they ask you after a member of your own party.
07:30Then you don't begin to split your own party.
07:33One of the biggest criticisms of your party's platform
07:34is to focus on what's called remigration,
07:36of getting rid of immigrants,
07:38which is a far-right concept
07:38coined by an Austrian extremist ally of your party
07:41who once stuck a swastika on a synagogue.
07:44It was in your party manifesto,
07:45the word remigration, last year.
07:47You have recently distanced yourself from it, I believe,
07:49having once been a champion of it.
07:50No, I've never been a champion of it.
07:52I have made clear that I don't like...
07:54That the concept is completely unacceptable.
07:55My own wife is from Slovakia,
07:57so she is an immigrant.
07:58So you cannot tell me that I want to remigrate my wife.
08:01I'm sorry.
08:01That's not the way it works.
08:03The fact that your wife is an immigrant from Slovakia
08:04doesn't mean you didn't write a book about remigration.
08:06I never wrote a book about remigration.
08:08I wrote a book on what it means to be
08:09right-wing, contemporary right-wing.
08:11The book on remigration was written by an Austrian,
08:14Mr. Zellner.
08:15He came up with the concept,
08:16and you endorsed it and pushed it.
08:18I just watched an interview with this afternoon
08:19where you talked to the interviewer,
08:20a 2023 interview, only three years ago.
08:21You said we should do it.
08:23We could give the right incentives.
08:24We should be doing remigration.
08:25Yeah, but not to people who have to unnationalize.
08:28Of course, we have...
08:29Look, Germany has the second largest number of refugees
08:32worldwide after Colombia.
08:34Of course, we have to take care
08:35that a large number of those people
08:37who came who have not integrated in society
08:39don't speak the language,
08:40that they go back into their home countries
08:42when the war is over.
08:43You said this is about finding a path
08:44to raise the patriotic consciousness
08:46of the indigenous population again,
08:47and to motivate migrants, this is 2023,
08:49to either assimilate or re-migrate.
08:51That's Politics from the Right,
08:52a book you wrote in 2023.
08:53In Germany, there are two meanings
08:55of the word re-migration.
08:56You are right, there is one
08:57which is given by Mr. Zellner.
08:59And I clearly...
08:59He's an ally of your party.
09:00No, no, no, I clearly distanced.
09:01It's not even allowed to members of parliament
09:04from our party to have joint events with him.
09:07Hold on, hold on.
09:07Why were three members of your party
09:09at an event with him last month in Porto?
09:10And we will clear that with them
09:11and we'll make them clear
09:12that this is not okay.
09:13True.
09:14We made very clear
09:15that we don't allow joint events
09:17with Mr. Zellner in public.
09:19You used to do events with him.
09:20I met him from a publishing house.
09:22They had a big event.
09:23Well, he was a guest and I was a guest.
09:25But look, I meet so many people.
09:27And of course, there are groups that vote us
09:29and they follow his movement.
09:30What is your definition of re-migration?
09:32Re-migration is the sum of all legal ways
09:35to bring people out of the country
09:37who don't have the right to stay there.
09:39So if you have criminals, they have to leave.
09:41If you have people who live only from welfare
09:43and don't want to work, they should leave.
09:45So all legal immigration.
09:46This is what the Labour government does.
09:48That's not controversial.
09:49This is not controversial
09:50because the official definition of our party,
09:52what we as a party understand by re-migration
09:55was now judged by the German administrative court.
09:58And they said,
09:59in the way the AFD is using the word re-migration,
10:02there is no problem with the Constitution.
10:03This is why this extremism thing is now on hold
10:06because we have another definition.
10:09Bjorn Hooker, as we mentioned earlier,
10:10one of your leading AFD leaders.
10:11He said, Bjorn Hooker, he's not leading.
10:13He's not even in the executive board.
10:14He's the leader of your party in a German state.
10:16He said, without problem,
10:18we would also without problem
10:19be able to live with 20 to 30% fewer people in Germany.
10:22How do you get to 20 to 30% fewer people in Germany
10:24without deporting German citizens?
10:25I don't know.
10:25He's a sports teacher, not a math teacher.
10:26Ask him.
10:28I'm asking you.
10:29Do you accept that deporting 20 to 30% of the German public?
10:31Once again, I don't know about his calculation.
10:34This is not what is written in our manifesto.
10:41In our manifesto, it's very clear.
10:42Remigration is the sum of all legally possible ways.
10:45Remigration is a far-right concept
10:46that talks about deporting citizens
10:48who are not assimilated.
10:50That is how Martin Selber is defined.
10:52You can try and redefine it for this audience.
10:53That's what it means.
10:54That's why it's always been a far-right term.
10:55It is Mr. Selber's definition,
10:57which is used here in Great Britain.
10:59In Germany, we have Mr. Selber's definition,
11:00and we have a definition in our manifesto.
11:02And this is why I advise my party not to use this word.
11:06You advise your party not to use the word,
11:08not because you don't believe in it,
11:10but because you know you'll get banned if you use it.
11:11It sounds pretty cynical.
11:13We have more and more migrants in Germany who vote AFD,
11:15and I'm the champion.
11:16I made a lot of videos in which I made clear
11:20especially the Turkish community should vote AFD.
11:22The former Soviet community is already without...
11:24Okay, so let's talk about those immigrants.
11:25Why does your party leader, Alice Weidel,
11:27distinguish between Germans and passport Germans, she says.
11:30People who acquired German citizenship weren't born with it.
11:33Will there be two classes?
11:34How many years ago?
11:36She said it in 2019.
11:37Yeah, this is seven years ago.
11:39Never since.
11:40Let me finish.
11:41Then in August 2025, last year, she was asked about it,
11:43and she defended the use of passport Germans
11:45in an interview with Welt.
11:47Okay, so I only know the old thing.
11:49Okay, Mrs. Weidel, her wife is from Sri Lanka.
11:53Yeah.
11:53You really tell me that the party leader
11:56who has a wife from Sri Lanka
11:58has a racist view on the world?
11:59I mean, come on, that's bull****.
12:01When you have a wife from Sri Lanka, who...
12:02looks like Sri Lanka,
12:04then you are not a racist.
12:05Okay.
12:06It's obvious.
12:06That's what you think racism comes down to.
12:08Yeah, but I mean...
12:08Whether you have friends or family who are non-white.
12:11Really?
12:11This is the way...
12:12I mean, this is the typical accusation...
12:14Maximilian, it's 2026.
12:14Why did you say last year
12:16the equality of citizens
12:17based solely on a piece of paper
12:18that one holds
12:18is the founding myth of the modern state?
12:26Because it is that the way.
12:27The modern state says...
12:29There's not an equality
12:30between a Turkish-German...
12:31It's a complete equality.
12:32The myth or the basis
12:33of the modern state
12:35is that every citizen is equal.
12:36Maximilian, this is what you said in 2023.
12:37When we talk about the people,
12:38das Volk,
12:39we are talking about a community of similars.
12:41When we talk about the people,
12:42it's far more than a political or legal category.
12:44It is a natural,
12:45biological,
12:46verifiable reality.
12:48The German language has a problem.
12:49Das Volk means both
12:50the ethnic group
12:51and the citizenship.
13:00Why did you say
13:01it is not a social contract?
13:02It is something that is in the genes.
13:05Do you understand why people worry
13:06when German politicians
13:06start talking about the genes?
13:08Yeah, we are not
13:10Sidney Sweeney,
13:10but the point is
13:12very easy.
13:13You have ethnic group
13:14and you have the citizenship.
13:15You mentioned a lot of migrants
13:15are voting for the AFD.
13:16Let's talk about Muslim Germans,
13:17a lot of Muslims in Germany.
13:18Turks, for instance.
13:18You have said that Islam belongs
13:20in Saudi Arabia,
13:21not Germany.
13:22And the 2026 manifesto
13:24for the state of Saxony-Arnhalt,
13:25this year's big election,
13:26calls Islam
13:27a culturally alien religion.
13:28Islam does not belong to Germany.
13:30You know who used
13:31similar rhetoric
13:32about a religious minority
13:33in Germany
13:33back in the 1930s?
13:34Please don't bring now Hitler.
13:35Everyone wants to bring Hitler
13:37when there is a problem in Germany.
13:38It sounds to me
13:38like exactly how the Nazis
13:39spoke about Jews.
13:40No.
13:40I can point it to you if you want.
13:42I say Turkish Germans
13:43shall vote for AFD.
13:44I mean, what religion
13:45usually Turks have?
13:45The Jews are not German.
13:46They are an alien people
13:47in our midst.
13:48That was Hitler's words.
13:55How is that different
13:55to the AFD manifesto?
13:56Islam is a culturally alien religion
13:58does not belong to Germany.
13:59Where is it from?
13:59Is it a state level?
14:00It is the Saxony-Arnhalt manifesto
14:02for this year
14:03from the AFD.
14:04Are you going to disown this as well?
14:05But this year
14:05there's no election in Saxony.
14:07This is the 2026 manifesto.
14:09I'm reading from it now.
14:10My constituency is in Saxony.
14:11I should know my manifesto
14:12and I know that
14:13there is no election this year.
14:14Saxony-Arnhalt election
14:15September 2026.
14:17Saxony-Arnhalt.
14:17This is another...
14:19I think everyone here
14:20heard me say Saxony-Arnhalt.
14:21It's another state.
14:22I'm sorry.
14:23We have many states in Germany.
14:24I'm not able to...
14:25Can we focus on the issue here?
14:26Hitler said the Jews
14:27were not part of Germany.
14:28They were alien religion.
14:29This is what the AFD is saying
14:30about Muslims today.
14:31Not really.
14:31The point is we invite
14:33every German citizen
14:34to be part of this.
14:35We have meanwhile
14:36an organization
14:36that is called
14:37Migrants Within the AFD
14:39which are very influential.
14:41The Kurds say,
14:42okay,
14:43we are not an extremist
14:44party anymore.
14:46Of course,
14:47our critics
14:47always bring points,
14:50even mistakes we made.
14:51The critics did not
14:51write your manifesto,
14:53Maximilian.
14:53The AFD wrote this manifesto
14:55saying Islam does not belong
14:56in Germany.
14:56Do you agree with that sentence?
14:58Islam does not belong in Germany?
14:59The manifesto was written
15:00by a scholar
15:01who speaks fluent Arabic
15:03and has a highly appreciation
15:04of Islamic culture
15:06and Islamic people.
15:06It doesn't matter
15:07whether you have Muslim friends
15:08or you're married to Sri Lankans.
15:10Racism is racism.
15:11These statements are racist.
15:12Let's go to our panel here
15:13who are waiting patiently.
15:14I'm joined by Gerald Knauss,
15:16chairman of the Berlin-based think tank
15:17the European Stability Initiative.
15:18You heard us talking a lot
15:19about re-migration.
15:20Maximilian says
15:21we've misunderstood it all.
15:22It just means
15:22deporting criminals.
15:23What's your response to that?
15:24If the AFD
15:25is found to use
15:26Martin Selner's term
15:28re-migration,
15:29it can be brought
15:30to the constitutional court
15:30and be closed down.
15:31So it's very important
15:32for the AFD
15:33in its manifesto
15:34to write exactly the words
15:36that they were advised
15:37by lawyers.
15:37Maximilian Kran knows
15:38as a lawyer
15:39how dangerous it is
15:40for the AFD.
15:41So he's warned about it.
15:43Since January this year,
15:44AFD has continuously
15:45met Martin Selner,
15:46inviting him to Thuringia
15:47to the Landtag.
15:48Björn Höcke,
15:49whose party really
15:50this has become,
15:51Alice Weidel tried
15:51to kick him out once,
15:52she was unable.
15:53His party in Thuringia
15:54has invited Martin Selner
15:55Martin Selner
15:56has made events
15:57in Brandenburg
15:57where another AFD,
15:59active politician
16:00who's just been
16:00also in Portugal,
16:01has said Germany
16:02will do well
16:03with 20 million less people.
16:04And what the party
16:05in Sachsen-Anhalt
16:06is saying here
16:06is based on
16:07the most toxic myth
16:09in German, European,
16:10and Western politics today,
16:11the idea that there's
16:12a great replacement
16:13that needs to be reversed
16:14because it's
16:14an existential threat.
16:15I've lived in the Balkans
16:16in the 1990s.
16:17I've lived in Sarajevo.
16:18I've seen,
16:19after the Cold War,
16:20in Europe,
16:21how these kinds of ideas
16:22have led to ethnic
16:23cleansing, expulsions,
16:24and in the end,
16:25the genocide in Srebrenica.
16:26And when political parties
16:27talk like this,
16:28we need to be very,
16:29very careful
16:29because it's serious.
16:30Before I let Maximilian
16:31come back in,
16:32let me bring in
16:32some other panelists here.
16:33I'm also joined by
16:33Ralph Schulhammer,
16:34head of the Center
16:35for Applied History
16:35at the MCC,
16:36a conservative think tank
16:37in Budapest.
16:38Ralph,
16:39what's your response
16:39to what you heard
16:40from Gerald
16:40and from Maximilian
16:41about remigration,
16:42ethnic cleansing,
16:43Islamophobia
16:44in Sachsen-Anhalt?
16:44I can give you easily,
16:46easily a handful of quotes
16:47from the National Socialist
16:49Economic Programme
16:50and you will find people
16:51on the American
16:51and European left
16:52and also on the right
16:53who would agree with it.
16:54So this is a little bit
16:54of a gotcha game.
16:55But secondly,
16:56the term remigration
16:56was coined as
16:57the description of Jews
16:58after World War II
16:59going back to the countries
17:00they fled from.
17:00That is the historic origin
17:01of the term.
17:02And by the way,
17:03remigration is happening
17:04as we speak.
17:04Germany is now the country
17:05with the second largest
17:06refugee population.
17:07The reason why it's
17:08no longer Iran and Turkey
17:09that they no longer
17:09have a larger population
17:11than Germany
17:11is because people are leaving
17:12Iran back to Afghanistan,
17:132.2 million,
17:14and people are leaving
17:15Turkey back to Syria.
17:16Do you believe that
17:17German citizens
17:17should be quote-unquote
17:18remigrating?
17:19No, but when Alice Weill
17:20speaks about passport Germans,
17:21I think we have to keep
17:22in mind how did
17:23naturalization laws
17:24change in Germany
17:24over the last couple of years.
17:25There was a term
17:26not coined by me
17:26by the German government,
17:28so-called
17:28turbo-naturalization.
17:30So they created quotas.
17:31I think in Berlin
17:31it was 40,000.
17:32They said 40,000 people
17:33every year
17:34need to get citizenship.
17:35So this was no longer
17:36tied to people integrate,
17:37they learn the language,
17:38they become part of society,
17:39that we need to meet a number,
17:40therefore they have to
17:41become citizens.
17:42George is shaking his head.
17:43Is that correct?
17:44Well, no, it's incorrect.
17:46The German law is very clear.
17:48The turbo-naturalization
17:50citizenship was for
17:51some people
17:51extremely qualified,
17:52the Japanese
17:53or the Indian engineer
17:54who was in the country
17:54and who after three years
17:56should get it.
17:56Very few people got it.
17:57What we have in Germany
17:58is a system
17:58where after five years
17:59and a lot of refugees
18:01came more than five years ago,
18:02there are some conditions as well,
18:04but the reality is
18:05that Germany has had
18:05a lot of refugees
18:06who have been given protection.
18:07I need to bring in Deborah
18:08who's been waiting patiently.
18:09Deborah Feldman
18:10is a German-American writer,
18:11political commentator.
18:12The AfD is soaring in the polls.
18:13They may secure
18:14their first state premiership
18:15in Saxony-Anhalt in September.
18:18Thank you.
18:18As an immigrant
18:19and a Jewish woman
18:20living in Berlin,
18:20how concerned are you
18:21about the rise and rise
18:22of the AfD in Germany?
18:24Well, I'm a passport German,
18:26but I got my passport
18:27on the basis
18:27of my Jewish great-grandfather,
18:29who was actually the son
18:31of an ethnic German Catholic
18:33who had an illegitimate child
18:35with a Jewish woman.
18:36As a result of this,
18:37he was expelled
18:37from the German Volk.
18:38So, in a sense,
18:40I'm a product
18:40of what Mr. Kraw
18:42has referred to
18:42as mixed culture.
18:44I already feel uncomfortable
18:46in Germany
18:46before the AfD is in power
18:47because I am a progressive
18:49and anti-Zionist Jew.
18:50So, the liberal mainstream
18:51in Germany
18:52is very narrow
18:52and expels anything
18:53that doesn't belong.
18:54So, my Anise is already great
18:56and is, of course,
18:57increasing
18:57with the approach
18:58of the liberal mainstream.
18:59If you say
19:00that the liberal mainstream
19:00is narrow
19:01and they blame everyone
19:02of extremism,
19:03like even you
19:03from the left side
19:04and they do with us.
19:05I'm not going to vote for you.
19:06Everyone is extremist
19:07who is not mainstream.
19:08I mean, it's very easy.
19:09What do you make
19:10of Maximilian's position
19:11that remigration
19:12now is not the definition?
19:13He's not a fan of the concept.
19:15Do you buy that?
19:15You've very openly said
19:17that you understand
19:17it is not strategic
19:18to maintain
19:19these convictions publicly
19:20and I understand
19:21you want to bring your party
19:22into the mainstream.
19:23You would like
19:23to have access to the power
19:24that the mainstream
19:25now has access to.
19:26What you've said
19:26about Jews in Germany
19:27is the Israelis are great
19:29because they're
19:29ethno-nationalists
19:30defending their borders.
19:31The current Jews in Germany
19:32have nothing to contribute
19:33and most of the Jews
19:35are left
19:35and basically communist.
19:36That is your ideological answer.
19:37Maximilian Briefly Respond.
19:38I was the last,
19:39I mean,
19:39if you have seen my Instagram
19:40last weekend,
19:42last,
19:42have you read the comments
19:43on your Instagram?
19:44Let me make a point.
19:45Last weekend,
19:45I was at a wedding
19:47on the Code Azur
19:48where my good
19:48German Jewish friend,
19:50your Tom,
19:50who got the German passport
19:51the same way like you
19:52because his great-grandmother
19:54came from Germany
19:54and he had to leave
19:56because of the Nazis.
19:56He came back
19:57and became the Nazis.
19:57He married his German
19:59bride.
20:00So,
20:00and now you tell me
20:00I have something against
20:02Jews in Germany
20:03that's complete nonsense.
20:04You said earlier
20:04you want more migrants
20:05voting for the AFD,
20:06more Turkey.
20:06Do you think there are
20:07too many Muslims in Germany?
20:08I look after the different
20:09groups that come
20:10and I think that...
20:11That was a very simple question
20:12that you can ask.
20:12No, if I ask,
20:13sorry,
20:13if I ask a Turk,
20:14do you want to have
20:15more Syrians?
20:16Then he said,
20:16of course not.
20:17If I ask him,
20:18what about your Turkish cousin?
20:19Of course,
20:20yes.
20:20That's great.
20:20But to say...
20:21When asking the Turkish
20:22or Syrians,
20:22I'm asking you
20:23I don't like the phrase
20:24that we put all the Muslims
20:25in one basket.
20:26Do you think there are
20:27too many Muslims in Germany?
20:29I would like...
20:30I don't know what's going on
20:31up there.
20:31It's a very simple question.
20:32Are you thinking of the political...
20:33Are you worried
20:33what your base is going to say?
20:34Do you think there are
20:34too many Muslims in Germany?
20:36If I would now get the answer,
20:38can we take young people
20:39from Tehran to Germany
20:40who are formerly Muslim?
20:41I would say yes.
20:42I understand you're a politician
20:42and you answer a question
20:43with a question
20:44but I'll ask it again.
20:45I don't want to have...
20:45Do you think there are
20:46too many Muslims in Germany?
20:47Which kind of Muslims?
20:49You tell me.
20:50I have no problem
20:51if you say we have now
20:5110,000 young people
20:53from Tehran in Iran
20:54who come to Germany
20:55for studying
20:55and have no problem with them.
20:57I don't want to have
20:5810,000 Somalis.
20:59Okay?
21:00It's a difference.
21:01You don't like Somalis?
21:02I know the data
21:03and I know that
21:04how Somalis perform
21:05in Western countries
21:06and I know how Iranians
21:08perform in Western countries.
21:09Both are Muslims.
21:09Do I have a problem
21:10with Iranian Muslims?
21:11No, I don't have.
21:12Do I have a problem
21:12with Somali Muslims
21:13in Western countries?
21:14Obviously, I have.
21:15I'll ask you one last time.
21:15Do you think there are
21:16too many Muslims in Germany?
21:17I think the question
21:18can't be answered
21:18because you cannot put
21:20all Muslims in one basket.
21:21I think that is not correct
21:22Let's end on a point
21:23of agreement.
21:23We shouldn't put Muslims
21:24in one basket.
21:25Yes, so you should
21:26chat to your friend
21:27in Saxony and Holt.
21:28I will tell him your regards.
21:29We will take a break there.
21:31That is the end of part one
21:31of Head to Head.
21:32When we come back,
21:32we're going to talk about
21:33some of the AFD's
21:34foreign policy controversies.
21:36Don't go away.
21:37Coming up very soon.
21:39Thank you.
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