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00:00You're watching Game Show Network.
00:07All three of these ladies claim that they use soap operas for psychological therapy.
00:13Only one of them really does.
00:15The other two are imposters and will try to fool the panel on To Tell the Truth.
00:23Jean Rayburn.
00:30Peggy Katz.
00:35Nipsey Russell.
00:43And Kitty Carla.
00:48And now from New York City, here's our host, Bill Cullen.
00:53Hi, thank you all. Thank you, Kylie.
00:56Welcome to Lottie.
00:56Oh, yeah.
00:58Good.
01:01Thank you, friends, and welcome to To Tell the Truth.
01:03It is me sitting in here for Gary Moore, and it is a pleasure to be here, and a pleasure
01:07to be trying to hold up the...
01:09Speaking of holding things up, let's say hello to our panel.
01:12Here from Match Game, fill in whatever year it happens to be in your particular town at
01:16this time, Jean Rayburn.
01:17I love your playing.
01:19Thank you, Bill.
01:22Then, of course, next in line is a regular member of our panel, Peggy Katz, who always
01:26does a tremendous job.
01:29It's cheerleader from Boston, I believe.
01:31Now then, a fellow who is sitting in for really the most valuable member of the panel of all,
01:35whose name shall not be nameless.
01:37The spring has sprung, the fall has fell, and this winter, it has been colder than usual.
01:49And, of course, our anchorman, good dig that, Gracie Anchorman, Kitty Carlisle.
01:54Welcome, Pam.
01:54We're happy to have you all here.
01:56Okay.
01:59Now, Bill Wendell just said our first guest is an occupational therapist.
02:02He's telling the absolute truth.
02:04May we meet her right now, please?
02:14Number one, what is your name, please?
02:16My name is Janet Falk Kessler.
02:19Number two.
02:20My name is Janet Falk Kessler.
02:23Number three.
02:24My name is Janet Falk Kessler.
02:26So, panel, as usual, it's up to you to pick out the real Janet Falk Kessler, and here is
02:31her therapeutic analysis.
02:32I, Janet Falk Kessler, am an occupational therapist.
02:36Together with Catherine Froschauer, we've initiated a most unusual program.
02:41We use television soap operas for therapy.
02:44Our initial goals were to improve our clients' attention span and to improve self-awareness
02:50through a group activity.
02:52We've found, however, that when clients discuss the fictitious crisis they've just viewed,
02:57they are better equipped to understand their own problems.
03:00For example, as a result of watching a soap opera on child abuse, one of our clients with
03:06a history of child abuse was able to talk about it openly for the very first time.
03:11Our concept seems to be making quite an impact.
03:14Indeed, when the TV set couldn't be used for a while, our clients made up their own soap opera.
03:20So, signed, Janet Falk Kessler.
03:31And we'll be returning for questions from our panel after our sponsors lead you down their
03:35own particular primrose path.
03:38Ultra 2.
03:39So then, panel, remember these three ladies all claim to be Janet Falk Kessler, who uses
03:44television soap operas as a means of group therapy.
03:47We'll start our round of questioning by calling on the redoubtable, whatever that means, Nipsey
03:51Russell.
03:51I'm redoubtable.
03:52Okay.
03:53Number two, what is the generic disease from which your patients are suffering?
03:59Well, most of them have psychological problems.
04:02I see.
04:02Number one, how are these soap operas selected?
04:07Do you just use whatever is on the air at the moment, or do you tape them and use special
04:11ones for special groups?
04:12Well, we watch the same soap opera each time, but it's whatever fits into our schedule.
04:17I see.
04:18Number three, when you speak of self-awareness, just what is that?
04:23Is not one always aware of oneself?
04:25No.
04:26Oftentimes, people aren't aware of what is causing their difficulties in life.
04:32Oftentimes, they don't understand how people may be perceiving them.
04:36I see.
04:36Then, sticking with number two, is it really a self-awareness or an identification and
04:41an analysis of one's problems?
04:42Well, whatever is going to help somebody function in their day-to-day life is what we're worried
04:47about.
04:48When you say...
04:49There you go.
04:50I know what my problem is, and I'm not telling.
04:51Kitty Carlisle, you may question anyone but me.
04:55Number one, where do you do this, and who are your patients?
04:58I work at a day center program, part of the Washington Heights Community Service, and
05:04we treat people who are from the Washington Heights area.
05:07And number two, are these all adults?
05:10Yes, they are.
05:11Number three, soap operas today deal with subjects that were only before found on the
05:17analyst's couch.
05:19In other words, you...
05:20Well, it's true.
05:22You find in your soap operas things like rape, incest, child abuse...
05:26Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
05:31Yes?
05:31Yeah, those things...
05:33You all are terrible, really.
05:35I haven't said a word.
05:36Good for you.
05:37Yes.
05:38Yeah, those things do occur, and they act as a stimulus to our clients, and in turn,
05:44it helps them get out their own particular problems, and we found it very therapeutic.
05:49And number two, do you take...
05:50Oh, thank you.
05:51Okay, rape, incest, and thievery, they are the agency that handles the account, I guess.
05:55Gene Rayburn, anything you want to know?
05:57Yes, sir, a number of things I want to know.
05:59Number two, if you have a group, as indicated here, and you're involved with child abuse,
06:07and you tune in the soap opera, and it has nothing to do with child abuse, how do you
06:11implement this?
06:12I mean, do you know in advance what the subject matter of the soap opera will be?
06:16No, we don't need to, because watching the problems will stimulate the people to talk
06:22about what's bothering them anyway.
06:24Number one, how long has this program been carried on?
06:26We've been running the group for a little over two years.
06:29And number three, has anyone graduated from the group?
06:32Yeah, people have left the group.
06:34In fact, in the two years, we've seen anywhere from 80 to 100 individuals.
06:39And number three, how about the rate of recidivism?
06:42It hasn't really occurred yet, because people stay in the group until they feel really competent
06:47enough to deal with their daily life.
06:48We try to make them functional.
06:50We don't speak of a cure per se.
06:54Okay, now to wrap it up and give it some direction here, we hope that he can.
06:58Number two, it seems to me you and the 80 patients must have to watch an awful lot of soap
07:03operas.
07:03I mean, what do you do, just tune in for the afternoon and then talk later?
07:06No, we use one soap opera a day for half an hour.
07:10It's an hour session, and we use the soap opera for the first half, and then for the second half,
07:15we talk.
07:16Now, number three, do you yourself get kind of hooked on to the soap opera after a while?
07:19I mean, you know, you really want to see what happens to Kathy and Jack and their problems.
07:23God knows what problems.
07:24It does happen.
07:25Sometimes I do look forward to it, and my patients do also.
07:28And sometimes they want to continue watching, like, the follow-ups.
07:32Yeah, I don't blame you.
07:33And number one, from what I see of the soap operas, your patients will be very well prepared to stand
07:37trial.
07:38It seems to me somebody's always on trial in those soap operas.
07:41Does that come in handy?
07:42Yes, it does.
07:43There are very often some of our clients have been involved in law cases.
07:47You know, I never knew Washington Heights was such a steamy place.
07:51Anyway, whatever about Washington Heights, time is up, and it's time for our panel to do their voting.
07:56So take your cards and your little pens there and do your voting panel, either for number one, number two,
08:02or number three.
08:04Now, of course, we pay $50 for every incorrect vote, and if the whole panel is full, the group over
08:09there splits up $500 amongst themselves.
08:12Okay, voting done.
08:13Nipsey, you started, so vote first.
08:15Yeah, I've developed the technique of putting in the corner my first choice and then my final choice in the
08:21square.
08:21I took number two because she answered my question about what the general ailment was, and I was kind of
08:29tired of number three because in all the years I've known about analysis and psychotherapy, I've never known anybody to
08:35graduate and just leave.
08:37Okay.
08:38Great.
08:38Kitty.
08:39Goodness, what a terrible indictment.
08:41Yes.
08:42It's true.
08:43Anybody want to answer it?
08:45I voted for number one.
08:47I liked what she said.
08:48She called her patients clients, and I think that's sensible because she's not a doctor, and it is a therapy
08:55course, and also she said they are often involved in court cases.
08:58Gene Rayburn.
08:59I have had the good fortune to be connected with the show on a network that has had the highest
09:07rating in daytime television for a number of years now, but running us a very close second are soap operas.
09:14Yeah.
09:15And now I know why.
09:16Mm-hmm.
09:17No therapeutic help on your show.
09:19Actually, if you watch those, that gang on Match Game, there's a lot of therapeutic help.
09:24If not present, necessary.
09:25Peggy.
09:26Well, you know, as I looked at all three of them, I thought one looked like a shoulder I'd lean
09:30on if I felt badly, and that's number ones.
09:33Okay.
09:34The votes are all in and leaning heavily toward your left as you look at them.
09:37Panel, the votes are in, and it's time to find out which of these three ladies is the real Janet
09:41Falk-Kessler.
09:42Now, who better to pick out the real Janet Falk-Kessler than her partner in this innovative endeavor, fellow occupational
09:48therapist, Catherine Froschauer.
09:51Catherine, if you would.
09:56No.
09:57Oh, she's a good actress.
09:57Perhaps there.
09:58Oh, it's number one.
09:58And look at that.
09:59No, it's back there.
10:00That's the longest chart.
10:10There we are.
10:13We'll be back with you.
10:15I have a question in a moment.
10:16First, I want to find out about the imposters.
10:18Number two, tell us about yourself and what you do, please.
10:20My name is Wendy Gartner, and I sell cars for Porsche out in Manhattan.
10:25Thank you, Wendy.
10:30And number three, if you would.
10:32My name is Linda Wansel, and I'm an illustration student at Parsons School of Design.
10:36Thank you, Wendy Gartner, and Ms. Kessler, what other kind of work do you do other than this?
10:46Well, actually, we use soap operas as the least part of our work, and primarily what we are involved in
10:54is helping people find out what their strengths are.
11:00And to what we've set up is a very special program in helping people with their work skills.
11:07And that's what we spend most of our time doing.
11:09So soap opera is not an integral part of it.
11:11It's just one of the things you take advantage of to help you in your work.
11:14That's right, yeah.
11:15We thank you both very much.
11:16And imposters for being with us on The Celebrity.
11:19Thank you, Ken.
11:20Thank you, Ken.
11:21Thank you, Ken.
11:22Thank you, Ken.
11:23Thank you, Ken.
11:23Thank you, Ken.
11:24Thank you, Ken.
11:24Thank you, Ken.
11:26Thank you, Ken.
11:29Our next guest is a remarkable mountain climber, and the word remarkable, when you think of it, is hardly the
11:35word for it.
11:36We'll get to that whole story in just these two minutes.
11:39On 1-5-0-0.
11:42Okay, as promised now, panel, let us meet an utterly fantastic mountain climber.
11:55Number one, what is your name, please?
11:57My name is Hulda Crooks.
12:00Number two, my name is Hulda Crooks.
12:05Number three, my name is Hulda Crooks.
12:08Okay, now, if you listen carefully to Hulda Crooks' climb to the top.
12:12I, Hulda Crooks, am a mountain climber.
12:15Recently, I scaled Mount Whitney, the highest peak in the continental United States.
12:19Not only that, from 1962 to the present, I've climbed the 14,495-foot mountain every single year with only
12:28one exception.
12:29On a lesser scale, I've hiked to the summit of California's 11,500-foot Mount San Gorgonio on 25 separate
12:38occasions.
12:38Hulda Crooks is one of my favorite ways of finding joy and happiness.
12:42When still in my 70s, I used to participate in 80- and 90-mile backpack trips, and I run,
12:49too.
12:50In fact, every morning before breakfast, I get out and run one mile.
12:53That's not bad for someone who, on her next birthday, will be 81 years young.
12:59Signed, Hulda Crooks.
13:06I do, too.
13:08I like it.
13:10Hulda Crooks, whichever lady you are, you put me to shame.
13:14I imagine you put us all to shame.
13:15Kitty, would you like to begin?
13:16Hulda Crooks, I like it.
13:18Yeah.
13:18I think it's just wonderful.
13:20Number three, San Gorgonio has been in the news fairly recently.
13:26Can you tell me why?
13:27Number three.
13:29No, I can't.
13:30Can you, number one?
13:32No, I can't.
13:33Number two, where do you run a mile every morning?
13:36Just down the road from...
13:37No, number two.
13:39Whenever I have a chance to run.
13:41But where?
13:42Oh, uphill or downhill.
13:45I live in an area that is mountain...
13:48Right now, I am living on Mountaintop Road.
13:52Where's that?
13:53In New Jersey.
13:54Oh, I see.
13:55I'm staying here in the...
13:56And number three, where do you live?
13:58I live in Loma Linda, California, in Southern California.
14:02Uh-huh.
14:02And number one, how long does it take you to get to the top?
14:06Usually done in two days.
14:08One night in two days, you rest.
14:11Uh-huh.
14:11And number two, where do you rest at night?
14:14I just have trouble climbing from 55th to 56th Street.
14:17I'm sorry.
14:18You knew me.
14:19You'd know why.
14:20I'm calling the bell so you don't have to answer.
14:21No, you need me to answer that now.
14:22Jean Rayburn, you do have to ask some questions, though.
14:24Listen, if you want to answer, my dear, you go ahead and answer.
14:28It depends on where I feel that I need to rest.
14:32Usually, I am with several others, and we sort of plan a mutual area, rest area.
14:39I forgot the question.
14:43Number three, when you climbed Mount Whitney, how many times?
14:47Number three?
14:48Fifteen.
14:49And do you take the same route each time you climb?
14:52No.
14:53You go a different route?
14:55Sometimes.
14:56Yeah.
14:57Number one, may I ask what your resting pulse rate is?
15:02Pulse rate?
15:03Yeah.
15:04What is your pulse?
15:05I don't know, because I never take my pulse.
15:08Number two, what is your pulse rate?
15:10I never bother with mine, but I do have physical examinations every six months.
15:14Does the doctor ever tell you what your pulse is?
15:16Yes, sir.
15:17He said it is very normal for a person of my age.
15:21What the hell are you, evasive rascal, dear?
15:24A little bit of climbing and a little bit of evading.
15:28Okay.
15:29Peggy, you got it here.
15:31I don't know my pulse rate.
15:33I don't think people know their pulse rate.
15:34Plaza 7, 8, 300, I thought.
15:37Number three, in which state is Mount Whitney?
15:41In California.
15:42And number one, what season do you climb Mount Whitney in?
15:47Between July the 15th and September the 15th.
15:51Now, number three, do you use ropes and pitons and everything when you climb Mount Whitney?
15:55No.
15:55Oh.
15:56But number two, do you do have to take your food up with you, don't you, and drink?
16:00Yes.
16:01Do you do it in a backpack, like, do you backpack up there?
16:04If I am taking a short trip, or that is an over, a weekend trip or so, I take approximately
16:0924 pounds, and if I take a longer trip, it is usually over 30 pounds.
16:14Oh, goodness.
16:15Now, number two, when did you get started with this mad pursuit?
16:18Okay, well, we will.
16:18In 1913.
16:201913 was your answer there.
16:21We just got it in under the wire.
16:23Nipsey's going to end it up.
16:24Number one, what is a piton?
16:26A piton is a stake, a wooden, an iron spike that you put into the rock or cleft or something.
16:36I see.
16:36Number three, what kind of foot gear do you wear when you're doing this climbing?
16:42I don't wear regular boots.
16:44I wear oxfords with a thick sole.
16:47I see.
16:48Number one, do you employ any of the normal techniques that we associate with mountain
16:55climbing, like that is pickaxing and hoisting each other?
16:58You mean repelling.
16:59Beg part?
17:00You mean repelling.
17:01Yes.
17:02Yes.
17:02That's the term for climbing with two ropes.
17:05Yes.
17:05And no, this is trail climbing.
17:08Repelling is only done on the eastern side of the slope.
17:11I see.
17:11Number two, is the descent more difficult than the ascent of a mountain?
17:15Usually, it is connected with a little more danger.
17:18Yes.
17:19It is easier to climb up than it is to go down.
17:22Really?
17:23Okay.
17:24Now, it's time, panel, to you to do your voting without any consultation, as is usual.
17:28So, if you would, panel, get your pens and cards and mark your ballots for number one,
17:33or number two, or number three.
17:37Yes.
17:37Very interesting, and it's a tough one.
17:40Okay, Kenny, you got it marked because we're going to begin with you this time.
17:43Yes.
17:43Well, I find it very difficult.
17:44They were all extraordinarily good, and easily, any one of the three could have been the mountain
17:49climber, and they're a lesson to us all.
17:51I voted for number three because San Gorgonio is near Palm Springs, and it is indeed in Southern
17:57California, and three said she lived in Southern California, so I voted for three.
18:01Got one in there for number three.
18:02What are you going to do, Gene Rayburn?
18:03Well, I tell you, I asked number two, one and two, about their pulse rates and got zero
18:08response.
18:08So, just, I have to vote for number three for that reason, because anyone who's climbed
18:13to Mount Whitney that many times would know that it's so good for the cardiovascular system
18:18that her pulse rate would be lower than normal and probably would be aware of that, and that's
18:23why I voted for number three.
18:24Got two number threes.
18:25Hey, are we getting a trend?
18:27Peggy Cass will let us know.
18:28Well, I voted for the siren from Loma Linda, number three.
18:32Do you know about that?
18:32We are all leaning very heavily toward the eastern slope.
18:36Nipsey?
18:36Well, I discounted number two.
18:38She volunteered a little bit too much information.
18:41She actually answered questions that weren't even asked of her, and I discounted number one
18:46because there's no way that woman can be 80 years old.
18:48I went to number three because she seems to have the calm confidence of someone who does
18:53it and not talks about it.
18:54By golly, that's a landslide or an avalanche, however you want.
18:58The panel, the votes are all in, and now it's time to find out which of these three ladies
19:02is the real Hulda Crooks.
19:03By way of identifying the real Hulda Crooks, I'd like you first to look at a couple of pictures,
19:08if you would, pictures that were taken of her atop Mount Whitney.
19:11Now, here is the first one.
19:12Just look over there.
19:13There you are.
19:14Now, if you have any doubt, this close-up should do it.
19:17There you are.
19:18Ms. Crooks, if you would.
19:19There you go.
19:20There you are.
19:26That was good.
19:28Hey, I don't know if you all noticed that, but number two was so convincing, she even
19:35convinced herself.
19:36She stood up at the end.
19:37Did you notice that?
19:38Very good job.
19:40Listen, the imposters were marvelous, number one and number two.
19:42Number one, tell us about yourself and what you do.
19:44Well, I lived in California for many, many years, but currently I live in New Jersey, and
19:49I'm just a housewife now.
19:51Thank you for being with us.
19:55And number two, I don't care what your pulse rate is, I want to hear about you personally.
19:59Who are you and what do you do?
20:02I am Wisconsin's VFW chairman for the developmentally disabled.
20:08I take care of about 189,000 in Wisconsin centers, in nursing homes, and in daycare centers.
20:17Well, good for you, number two, and thank you.
20:20Ms. Crooks, before you go, it's nice climbing mountains, which you do and you do well.
20:25Are you active in anything else?
20:27I am still a research assistant at the Loma Linda University School of Health.
20:32I work practically full-time as a volunteer.
20:34You are remarkable.
20:36You are all remarkable.
20:37Thank you, all the crooks and imposters for playing with fellowship.
20:48Check.
20:49Check.
20:51Those ladies have all had very interesting and full lives.
20:54Actually, numbers one and number two, our two imposters, told us what they did, and I was
20:59so intrigued listening, I heard the whole story, I never did find out who they were.
21:03So, you might be interested if you ever want to hire them, give them a job on a panel.
21:07Number one was Mickey Forner, and number two was Joanna Gnocke.
21:11We just thought you'd like to know that.
21:12I know we'd like to know.
21:13Hey, panel, thank you all very kindly.
21:16We will see you here tomorrow with the same hickey, I guess.
21:18Yes.
21:19Go with me.
21:19And number three is Nitsi Russell, and number four, Gene Raymond.
21:22Good luck.
21:23In addition to the Cash Awards, our first team at Challenges will receive Sarah Cummins.
21:26The excuse of fashion jewelry that you can buy from a friend, Sarah Cummins, with a jewelry
21:30with know-how.
21:31Our second team will receive Turtle Wax, the world's largest selling liquid car wax.
21:35Cleans, polishes, protects, and one easy operation.
21:38Turtle Wax with the hard shell finish.
21:51This is Bill Wendell speaking for To Tell the Truth, a Mark Goodson, Bill Todman production.
22:30Don't touch that remote.
22:32There's another episode of To Tell the Truth, this time with Gary Moore, heading your way
22:36here on Game Show Network.
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