00:00Make the point for us, though, this sort of distinction or no distinction between a lab-grown diamond and a
00:06diamond that's mined in the quote-unquote traditional way.
00:09Is there a difference?
00:10No.
00:10There is zero difference.
00:12Chemically, optically, structurally, it's a seed of carbon who all grows under the ground and take billions of years to
00:19get out of the surface and a lot of money and differentiation and time to extract versus putting it in
00:24a microwave.
00:25But it's a seed of carbon.
00:26Same baby at the end.
00:28If I take one lab-grown and one mined diamond to my friend Brian's dad in Midtown, who's been doing
00:35this for, you know, 40 years, can he tell the difference between the two?
00:39No, because there is none.
00:40There is no gemologist in the world who can see the difference between a lab and a mined diamond.
00:45Do you know, I often made a really bad analogy, but it's a little bit like IVF versus an IVF
00:50baby.
00:50I've got four of them.
00:51Trust me.
00:51They're all the same.
00:54Well said, well said.
00:55All right.
00:55I thought early on when they started doing lab-grown diamonds that there were limitations in size.
01:00But tell me, is that not the case?
01:02Can you do anything in terms of size, shape?
01:05You can do anything.
01:06The more technology advance, the less any constraints we will have.
01:12But there is no limits in anything, in color, size, quality.
01:15I actually believe today that the quality of lab-grown diamonds are superior, especially in the very high end of
01:21the diamond market that we are in, that we can find in the mine.
01:24Do you make them like, you know, I think about, what is it, the four Cs or whatever?
01:28Like, do you just make, what's grown in the lab, are they all just the top of the tier, if
01:34you will, in terms?
01:35No.
01:36No.
01:36So you do make different, yeah.
01:38That's correct.
01:39So any diamonds come from the level of money, investment, quality of the reactors we have, technology behind it.
01:47So no diamonds are the same, whether it's a mine or whether it's a lab.
01:50So what is the technology?
01:52So there is two types of technology in order to make them.
01:55So as I said earlier on, it's a seed of carbon.
01:57Yeah.
01:57So basically, the carbon is the strongest material in the world, right?
02:02And what you put in a reactor, and we basically replicate what happened under the ground in those reactors with
02:08two methods called CVD and HPHT.
02:10So pressure.
02:11One is the pressure, one is replicate through the heat.
02:14Okay.
02:15And by doing that, within four to six weeks, a diamond is formed.
02:18Four to six weeks, how much energy does it take?
02:20Okay, so that's an interesting question, because the biggest challenge at the moment is, one, the resale value, and one,
02:26the sustainability, which are the main questions.
02:27Because it's no more a secret that a diamond is a diamond, whether it comes from a lab or a
02:32mine.
02:32So now the two challenges in terms of education we face.
02:37Coming to energy.
02:38Obviously, it takes less energy in a reactor than under the ground.
02:44So the reality is it takes a fifth less, approximately, in a reactor than under the ground.
02:50However, it's not 100% sustainable yet.
02:52I actually don't believe it.
02:54However, it's improving every day with technology.
02:57With renewable energy.
02:59With using, so today we only use recycled gold.
03:02So everything is improving all the time.
03:04We don't use water.
03:05There is no deforestation.
03:06There is no human traffic problem.
03:08So there is no many problems that we can talk about.
03:11I know, though, before we got going, we talked about the impact, certainly, on the economies that have depended on
03:17mining.
03:18And I guess it's safe to say that, I don't know, is that the downside of all of this, you
03:23know?
03:23Yeah, Sub-Saharan Africa, like Botswana, for example.
03:25Jen Jabasaja was here talking to us about that just a few months ago.
03:28Exactly.
03:28So there is that downside.
03:31Yeah, it's correct.
03:32It's correct that the Botswana economy has relied for years and years on the mine industry.
03:37But actually, the world is evolving through technology.
03:40And I think countries need to adapt.
03:42I think we do need to help those countries.
03:44So Astra, for example, give a percentage of their income for giving education to kids in Africa.
03:50And I think a lot of companies should do and help anyway, in general, in the corporate world.
03:55However, the mining industry, if you look at it today, also have given a lot of the percentage of their
04:00mining result to the beers.
04:03And I think today they are potentially buying out the beers or a part of it.
04:06So maybe it's not a bad thing for anyone.
04:09The world needs to diversify and the economy of each country needs to diversify.
04:14I want to talk a little bit about what took so long technologically for us to get here.
04:17Because, I mean, you know, it was almost like I got engaged a decade ago at this point.
04:22And this wasn't even a thing.
04:24Like lab-grown diamonds were not even part of the conversation.
04:27I talked to young people today.
04:29And it's like...
04:30For your wife to be or just...
04:32Were they around?
04:33So the lab-grown diamonds have been around since after the war in 1950.
04:37They were actually made the first...
04:39But they weren't really...
04:40It was not prevalent.
04:41So out of the diamond market, lab-grown diamonds was 1% of the market in 2015.
04:46Yeah, that's...
04:48Okay, fair.
04:49Yeah.
04:495% of the market in 2021.
04:5240% last year.
04:5470% of the engagement ring of the US today are lab-grown diamonds.
04:58And The Economist is expecting it to be 75% by 2030.
05:04I actually think it will be faster than that.
05:06Yeah.
05:06So you're illustrating my point perfectly.
05:08Why did it...
05:09Why was it such hockey stick growth?
05:10And why did for so many years, was it under the radar?
05:13Well, the reality is the mine industry has been dominating the industry, the diamond industry,
05:19for 100 years.
05:20And I've done an amazing exercise of marketing with the beers.
05:23First of all, telling us that the diamond is rare.
05:26Diamonds are not rare.
05:27The reality is there is enough diamonds in the world so that 8 billion people can each have
05:31alpha carat each.
05:32And you will still be having hundreds of thousands of them being hidden somewhere.
05:37So the reality is a diamond is not rare.
05:40But they've done a beautiful marketing exercise in order to promote it that way.
05:44Why are diamonds still, though, then so expensive?
05:47Like if so many people are choosing for engagement rings to do lab-grown diamonds...
05:52I mean, the lab-grown diamonds that I've seen have not been expensive relative to a mine diamond.
05:57What's the cost differential?
05:58Yeah.
05:58Percentage?
05:58The difference of price is approximately 70% between a lab-grown diamond and a mine diamond.
06:0970% cheap, less expensive.
06:11Yeah.
06:11Lab-grown diamonds are cheaper at 70%.
06:13First, it costs less to make them.
06:14You don't have to extract everything from the planet.
06:17You don't have anything.
06:17But you know the real question today is actually the resale value.
06:21The biggest, I will say, problems between lab and mine diamond is they should work together.
06:28They should work together instead of fighting.
06:30The biggest critiques that mine diamond gives to lab-grown diamond is, oh, there is no resale value.
06:35And I always say, yes, obviously, you may have no resale value, but there is a resale value to everything.
06:41So let me give you an example.
06:42Just got about 25 seconds.
06:44If you get two carats of lab-grown diamond today, you'll probably, in D-color, which is a high-end
06:50what we do, it probably will be $6,000.
06:52The same equivalent in mine will be $60,000.
06:56By the time you leave the shop, you've already lost $30,000.
06:59Yeah.
07:00Personally, even if I lose everything, I know what I want to buy.
07:02I'm just going to take this and just, like, share it to my husband.
07:05I hope.
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