00:00So can this summit be seen as a success for President Trump?
00:04Let's talk to Giorgio, former foreign minister of Singapore
00:07and currently visiting scholar at the National University of Singapore.
00:11Giorgio, welcome, wonderful to see you and thank you so much for your time.
00:15In your judgment and given your considerable experience,
00:18was this a landmark moment or just political theatre?
00:24So far as theatrics are concerned, the visit went as well as it could have.
00:30The key is Taiwan.
00:33And China will not give details until the U.S. clarifies its position on Taiwan.
00:41Xi began his speech by talking about the Ducydides trap.
00:46Are we rivals or are we cooperating?
00:50If you are unhelpful on Taiwan, then we are rivals.
00:55Then all the other deals will not come about.
00:58And I believe that maybe in the next few days,
01:02we will see Trump making a statement on Taiwan
01:05and following up with decisions on arms sales to Taiwan.
01:10If the Chinese are satisfied that the U.S.
01:14one-China position is clear,
01:15then many of the deals will be unblocked.
01:18Then the details will be forthcoming.
01:22I wonder if summits like this should be seen as an event or a process.
01:28I mean, should we expect headlines, many headlines today,
01:32or simply, as you suggest, the start of narrative that could go on for weeks, months, years even?
01:40Well, much preparation had gone into the visit.
01:44So it was well choreographed.
01:47And it is quite clear, watching the videos, that Trump and Xi like each other.
01:54They were charming each other.
01:57And that's important, because whatever the strategic considerations,
02:02personal relations do matter in diplomacy.
02:06And among, between the leaders of the two superpowers in the world,
02:10this relationship matters a lot.
02:13Because if there is trust, then the room for negotiation enlarges.
02:18But if there is no trust and there is suspicion,
02:20then, well, everyone will be careful and much less can be done.
02:27So it's gone well.
02:31Trump looked happy.
02:32Xi looked happy.
02:34They went off their way to show friendliness.
02:38But the Chinese, being cautious and knowing that Trump is mercurial,
02:43will wait for him to make the first move.
02:45And the first move will be about Taiwan.
02:47I wonder what this summit outcome looks like from a Southeast Asian point of view
02:54and, in particular, where you are.
02:56I mean, what does a successful U.S.-China relationship look like from that part of the world?
03:03You know, for us in Southeast Asia, when the U.S. and China are in dispute,
03:08it's like father and mother quarreling, you know.
03:10We feel very upset.
03:11We feel very stressed.
03:12And we know that it's not good for us.
03:14So there's nothing more cheering for us than to see good relations between the U.S. and China.
03:21Then there's business to be made.
03:24We are not forced to choose.
03:25And life becomes much less stressful.
03:29And what does this summit, I wonder, tell us about not just China and the United States,
03:34but about the emerging multipolar world?
03:40You see, many Americans think that the long-term relationship between the U.S. and China is zero-sung.
03:49It is the Thucydian mentality.
03:51It's either you or me.
03:55China doesn't see it that way.
03:57China, in its history, however powerful it was, had to live with other powers in the world.
04:03So it's quite comfortable living in a world where the U.S. remains very powerful, very influential,
04:08so long as its own security and interests are looked after.
04:13So China does not see the future in zero-sum terms.
04:17And interestingly, Trump probably doesn't see the future as necessarily being zero-sum.
04:24And therefore, for the next three years, when Trump is still in power,
04:29the Chinese would like to have a constructive, strategic relationship.
04:33And it is possible.
04:34It is something which can be achieved.
04:36And it can be achieved, it will be three calmer years ahead of us.
04:42It's possible.
04:43And this visit may well set it off.
04:48George, fascinating stuff.
04:49I wish we had many hours to talk, but it's great having you on the program.
04:53I'm Giorgio, former Foreign Minister of Singapore.
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