- 7 hours ago
Tribunal Justice S03E38
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00:00You say your nephew illegally sold that bus.
00:03I love that vehicle.
00:04Been in my property for roughly three to four years.
00:07Right, because you didn't care about that vehicle.
00:09That's false, Your Honor.
00:10Seeing this raggedy, dirty bus for two years, I would be furious.
00:15And that's a pole in the middle, just in case somebody gets thrown off balance?
00:19Yes.
00:20Yeah, right.
00:21Now, on Tribunal Justice.
00:46Today's case was filed in Clayton, Missouri.
00:50Now, it's just case number 3041 on the calendar, the matter of Clemens v. Simmons.
00:55Thank you very much.
00:55You're welcome, Judge.
00:56Parties have been sworn in.
00:58You may be seated.
00:59Ma'am, have a seat, please.
01:01Okay.
01:01Mr. Clemens, you bought an 18-year-old bus.
01:05You renovated it.
01:06You remodeled it.
01:07You turned it into a party bus business.
01:09You said it was doing great until the point where it broke down, at which point you stored
01:13it at your sister's house.
01:15And after she passed away, you say your nephew illegally sold that bus.
01:20You're suing him here for $5,000.
01:23Sir, you are the nephew.
01:24And it was your mom who passed away.
01:26It was your mom's driveway that the bus was parked in.
01:29And you say it had been abandoned there for four years, that you gave him sufficient notice
01:33at the time to take it off the property, and he never did.
01:36So you don't owe him anything.
01:38Yes.
01:38All right.
01:39So you purchased a party bus what year, sir?
01:42I believe that I'm not for certain, but I believe I purchased that bus in 2016.
01:49Let's talk a little bit about this situation, because there's been a sufficient amount of
01:54discrepancies in the dates, et cetera, Mr. Clemens.
01:57Starting with papers that you submitted, one of them being the title to the bus.
02:03And on that bus title, it says that it was purchased...
02:07I'm looking for it.
02:08June 27th, 2014.
02:11Oh, okay, yeah.
02:12Yeah, you remember now?
02:13Yeah, it's been a while, and I've been doing a lot of things.
02:15But you came to court to sue your nephew.
02:18The least you could have done was gone over your paperwork to get your story straight.
02:23So what did you do with the bus from 2014 to 2016?
02:28It was at my house, where I lived there.
02:31How did you get it there?
02:32You didn't lift it and carry it.
02:33No, no, I drove it.
02:33It was running.
02:34Okay, it was running.
02:35So let's look at this bus that drove people all around the city having parties, correct?
02:41Correct.
02:42And there's what the inside of that bus looked like when you purchased it, correct?
02:47Actually, it was like a shuttle bus when I got it.
02:50So it didn't even look like that?
02:51No.
02:51That was after you ripped all the stuff out?
02:53I started getting it out.
02:54But when it was done, let's look at O2.
02:57And that's a pole in the middle, correct?
03:00Correct.
03:01Just in case somebody gets thrown off balance?
03:03Yes.
03:04Yeah, I have to hold on to it.
03:06Yeah, right.
03:06Okay, so that's the bus.
03:09Yes.
03:10Well, actually, it's like artwork.
03:12Artwork is never done.
03:13I worked on it every day after work.
03:16When, then, did it break down?
03:19It broke down.
03:21It started leaking, transmission fluid.
03:252018?
03:26Mm-hmm.
03:27Okay.
03:27Let me move over to you.
03:28Did you live at your mom's home?
03:30Yes, ma'am.
03:31And the plaintiff, your uncle, brought the bus to your mom's home when?
03:35Around 2016, 2017.
03:372016, 2017.
03:39Your mother passed away when?
03:41May 31st, 2018.
03:43So your mother passed away in 2018.
03:45And at that point, the bus was on your property for two years.
03:49Yes.
03:50You say no.
03:51You say the bus wasn't on their property.
03:53It hasn't been two years.
03:55Because my sister was alive at the time when I brought the bus.
03:59You didn't pay your sister to keep the bus on the property, did you?
04:02I didn't need to.
04:03Because she wanted the bus.
04:04My sister loved that bus just as much as I did.
04:07Okay.
04:08I have pictures of us on the bus on every event we all took out on her birthday.
04:15She went with me trick-or-treating.
04:17And that's why she let you keep the bus on her property.
04:21Sir, that bus was on her property only to benefit him.
04:26It didn't benefit your mother to have the bus on the property.
04:29In fact, let's see the bus on the property.
04:31There it was, sitting there.
04:33You say 2016 it got there, right?
04:35Yes.
04:36According to you, and you say no way, right?
04:38You say 2018.
04:392018.
04:40But then again, you had what we call a gratuitous bailment.
04:42Despite the fact that your mom loved the bus, it was a bailment for his benefit only.
04:47She was not benefiting from it sitting in her driveway.
04:49Whatsoever.
04:50In a gratuitous bailment situation, your mother would have just had to show that she used reasonable care that anybody
04:55would have used.
04:56In your situation, you didn't even agree to that.
04:59So you really had no obligation.
05:01And the law doesn't create any time frame for you to terminate a bailment.
05:08Okay.
05:08So as long as you give him reasonable notice.
05:11Did you give him notice that he should get that bus off of your property?
05:15Yes, ma'am.
05:16And when did you give him that notice?
05:17I would say July 2020.
05:21He was actually up at my house, and I told him.
05:23Did you get notice, verbal notice from your nephew to take it off the property?
05:27No, I got verbal notice that he said, stop coming to my house.
05:33Okay.
05:34And then when I was on the property, I was over there working on the bus.
05:39I never came inside.
05:40I was only to...
05:41But all it needed was transmission fluid.
05:44Yeah, the last stage, because I took the transmission out.
05:48We took the transmission out.
05:49That's fine.
05:50We put it in the shop and had it rebuilt.
05:53When was that?
05:55That was in February of 2018.
06:01You can't keep something that doesn't work just on property.
06:05But it works.
06:06It worked.
06:07I drove it.
06:08Right.
06:08It was well.
06:09It was inspected.
06:09It had a state inspection.
06:11Mm-hmm.
06:12And then it was licensed.
06:13So when you say here, all you needed was transmission fluid.
06:17That was the last stage.
06:19I poured the transmission.
06:20How long does it take to pour transmission fluid into any vehicle?
06:24It doesn't take two years.
06:27Coming up on Tribunal Justice.
06:29You didn't care about that vehicle.
06:31I love that vehicle.
06:32I know you're telling us you love it because you want $5,000.
06:39Grover Clemens is suing nephew Lamont Simmons for $5,000 for hauling his beloved party bus
06:45to a junkyard.
06:47But Lamont says his uncle abandoned the bus on his property for years, so he had every
06:51right to scrap the vehicle.
06:53Did he take the transmission out?
06:55He did took something out.
06:57It was sitting in the grass in my backyard.
07:00He did have a mechanic come to look at it, but he couldn't get it fixed.
07:04Do you have anything in text at all to support your position that you asked him to get it
07:10off the property?
07:10What happened to my sister who was there when I told you?
07:12Is that you, ma'am?
07:13Yeah.
07:13Can you step up, please, and tell us your name for the record?
07:16My name is Sierra Shotwell.
07:18Were you present during any conversation with your brother and your uncle regarding removing
07:23the bus from the property?
07:24I wasn't technically present, but he told me I wasn't there in person when they had
07:30that conversation.
07:31Okay.
07:31So that's hearsay, if you were going to testify, to that issue.
07:34Is there anything else you could offer with regard to the bus on the property?
07:38To my knowledge, he was getting fined for the bus being on the property from the municipality.
07:43So he was getting pressure from the county.
07:46Do you have any copies of any of the summonses?
07:49No, ma'am.
07:49Did you get any summonses for being on the property?
07:52There was notice to move it.
07:54There was no violations.
07:56Like the area picture said, the bus was parked on the pavement in front of the garage in the
08:02driveway behind the fence line.
08:04You weren't sure when the bus was on the property, because you said in 2016 it was still on your
08:09property, but we have the aerial view, which indicates historically that it was on the property.
08:14And then we have another aerial view on the right, which indicates that it was still there
08:19in the same exact place in 2018, and that it had been there until actually you sold it
08:25for junk.
08:26Yes, ma'am.
08:27And when the junk company took it, was there a title?
08:30I didn't have to have that title.
08:31You didn't have to be?
08:31It was the abandoned car, so I had to say it was abandoned.
08:33Okay.
08:34Yes, ma'am.
08:34And they just took it from you?
08:35Yes, ma'am.
08:36And how much notice did you give him to get off the property?
08:39I gave him at least three months before I got rid of it.
08:42And then actually when I told him verbally to come get his party bus, he said,
08:46I'm not moving that a** thing.
08:48According to your testimony, you asked him to move it.
08:50You gave him a period of time, and it wasn't for three months later that you sold it.
08:55Yes, ma'am.
08:56Mr. Clemens, I know that you wanted to say something about this photograph.
09:00Let's take a look at the one on the left first.
09:02Okay.
09:03I'm circling a vehicle on the left.
09:05Is that a circle around the bus?
09:06Yes, Your Honor.
09:07And likewise, on the right, that's the same bus.
09:11Now, Mr. Simmons, this was your exhibit, was it not?
09:15Yes.
09:15What was the purpose of this?
09:17To show you how long it'd been on my property.
09:20Because you've testified to Judge Domingo that it's because of this photograph that you know that the vehicle was there
09:26starting in 2016?
09:28Yes, sir.
09:28Okay.
09:29So I'm going to circle on the left the date of that historical photograph.
09:34What date is that?
09:352016.
09:36Really?
09:37I have May 7th, 2018.
09:39And on the right?
09:412020.
09:422020.
09:42Would it be fair to say that neither of you really have any idea about the dates in this case?
09:46I don't have the exact dates.
09:48Well, we're not even talking exact dates.
09:50I'm not asking you whether it happened January 7th, 2016 or February 14th, 2016.
09:57You were sure that the vehicle made its way to your mom's property in 2016, but you now know that
10:03even you are inaccurate.
10:04I never actually said I knew exactly the exact dates.
10:08I said it had been on my property for roughly three to four years.
10:11Right.
10:11And you don't have one from 2016?
10:13I don't.
10:14Okay.
10:14Tell us the condition of the vehicle when it was sold in November 2020.
10:18The transmission.
10:19And this goes to damages, by the way.
10:21Because you're suing for what?
10:22$5,000?
10:23It's worth more than that.
10:25Well, hold on.
10:26It's your burden to prove.
10:28Yes.
10:29To prove to us what it was worth.
10:31Okay.
10:31Okay, was the vehicle ever in an accident?
10:34No.
10:35And you would agree that if the vehicle was in an accident, that that would affect the value of the
10:39vehicle?
10:40Of course.
10:41Do you want to reconsider your answer and tell me whether or not the vehicle was in an accident?
10:44What do you mean an accident?
10:45An accident, like something hit it.
10:47It hit something.
10:48A guy scraped it.
10:50My sister's ex-boyfriend, he used it one night and someone scraped it.
10:57Describe that damage.
10:59It was a scrape along the side.
11:02I just had to replace the rubber trim.
11:04But I wouldn't call that an accident.
11:06There was no police report?
11:07Not that I'm aware of.
11:09There was no body shop record?
11:11Not that I'm aware of.
11:13When was this scrape that you claim occurred?
11:15Mm-mm.
11:16Maybe 2015.
11:18Here's the car facts for the vehicle.
11:20Why don't you please show it to him, Cassandra?
11:22Take a look at that and let me know whether or not that helps refresh your recollection as to whether
11:26or not there was a reported damage on that vehicle.
11:29I just circled it in blue.
11:3018, 18.
11:32I didn't make that report.
11:33I know you didn't make that report.
11:34What, the one I'm showing you right now?
11:35Yes.
11:36Listen, your testimony is very clear.
11:37You don't know anything about dates.
11:39And you most certainly testified your first answer to me whether the car was in an accident when I told
11:43you it was going to make a difference with respect to damage.
11:46Hold on.
11:46That there was none.
11:48No, I had no recollection about this.
11:50And you want to know why you had never had any recollection?
11:52Because you didn't care about that vehicle.
11:54I love that vehicle.
11:55I know you're telling us you love it because you want $5,000.
11:59Coming up on Tribunal Justice.
12:01Cats are sitting there laying there.
12:03I open the door and I can go in.
12:05They'll sit there and look at me like this is my house.
12:07This was a party bus for cats.
12:14Grover Clements says his nephew, Lamont Simmons, owes him $5,000 for junking his party bus without permission.
12:21But Lamont says his deadbeat uncle left the dilapidated bus in his yard for years and ignored his requests to
12:28move it or lose it.
12:29So you waited four years to bring this lawsuit.
12:32Why?
12:32You know, I was dealing with a lot of stuff, Your Honor.
12:36My doctors told me to remain stress-free.
12:39I had a weak heart.
12:41I had a heart transplant and a kidney transplant.
12:45So I was trying not to focus on anything negative and remain peaceful until I'm able to deal with these
12:55things.
12:55Do you have any reason why he would have filed this lawsuit against you four years after?
12:59Because he petty.
13:00He's petty?
13:02Why would you sue your own blood for a bus that you abandoned for multiple years?
13:08The bus was not in the condition that you first saw it in the pictures.
13:12No, we saw what the bus looked like.
13:13It was horrible condition.
13:14We got it.
13:15We also know what it looked like after the accident.
13:17Thank you very much.
13:18Judge Acker.
13:19So let's just say the bus is only there for two years.
13:21I'm going to ignore his claim about it being there for two years prior to that.
13:28Between April 2018 and July 2020, tell me how many times, sir, you drove the bus.
13:35From 18 to 2020?
13:38I think the answer is never.
13:40Yeah, probably once.
13:42The answer is never.
13:43Once.
13:43Once.
13:44Actually, I didn't drive it because we told you about that.
13:46You didn't drive it.
13:47I didn't want to move it.
13:49I didn't want to start it up.
13:50You didn't want to start it even.
13:52Because it started leaking.
13:54I wanted to, you know.
13:55You didn't even want to start it.
13:56So tell me how many times between April 2018 and July 2020 you washed it.
14:03I washed it?
14:04Yeah.
14:05Probably twice.
14:07Twice in two years.
14:08Because it didn't need, it wasn't two years.
14:10The bus didn't need to be washed.
14:13You know.
14:15I mean, listen, I do not mean to be disrespectful,
14:18but I'm imagining being one of their neighbors and seeing this raggedy, dirty bus for two years.
14:25I would be furious.
14:26I'm not even talking about their rights as property holders.
14:30I'm talking about what I would think if I lived in the neighborhood.
14:34Ma'am, could you take the stand again, please?
14:37Did you ever have occasion to see the inside of the bus?
14:40I mean, I haven't walked in, but I would pull in the driveway and I would see cats hanging out
14:47in the inside.
14:48There were cats.
14:49Sir, can you describe for me what the interior of the bus looked like in July 2020?
14:56An old, broken down building.
14:58And it was like cats are sitting there and laying there.
15:01I open the door and I can go in.
15:03They'll sit there and look at me like, this is my house.
15:07And they literally got like a bunch of them.
15:09It's not just like one.
15:10It's like they all over the place.
15:12It's my first time hearing that.
15:14Sir, I'm having a really hard time trying to get my head around why you think somebody should keep
15:21your broken down, cat-infested bus on their property for two years and why, after they dispose of it,
15:30you think they should pay you $5,000.
15:33You should be paying them.
15:34That wasn't the case.
15:36This was a party bus for cats.
15:38And there were no cats in the bus.
15:40When was the last time that you'd gone to check on the bus?
15:45Actually, it was the day before Black Friday because that was a Thursday.
15:49I know why he got sold the bus.
15:52He sold the bus because he wanted some money for Black Friday.
15:55It was on Black Friday when they took the bus.
15:59I got everything showing you.
16:00And then I kept calling him, asking him, because he told me to stop coming to his house.
16:06Listen, that's why you're upset.
16:07Because you're an uncle.
16:09That's your nephew.
16:11I have nephews and nieces and I care about them.
16:15I expect a certain degree of respect from them and deference.
16:19So you were annoyed.
16:21Now, were you trying to sell the home at the time?
16:23No, I was just trying to get rid of all the things that need to be get rid of my
16:26mother passed.
16:27So things that don't need to be there need to be gone.
16:30I even got rid of my mother old cars.
16:31His car was the last I got rid of.
16:33I took three months before I got rid of it.
16:35How much money did you get for the bus?
16:39Coming up on Tribunal Justice.
16:41What was your relationship before your mom passed away?
16:45Your relationship with the plaintiff?
16:51Grover Clements says his nephew Lamont Simmons owes him $5,000 for scrapping his party bus without permission.
16:58Lamont claims his uncle took advantage by abandoning the bus on his property years ago.
17:03So he got rid of the cat infested health hazard himself.
17:06How much money did you get for the bus?
17:09Like $30.
17:11You think you owe him $15?
17:13I don't think I owe him anything.
17:14I think he owed me, to be honest.
17:16I think you might be right about that.
17:18Maybe, but you're not suing him for anything.
17:20Yes, ma'am.
17:21So that's neither here nor there.
17:22What did you want to say, Mr. Clements?
17:24You can't sell someone's property, especially a vehicle.
17:28But understand, he also gave testimony, and you gave testimony that, to my mind, supports a conclusion that the bus
17:38might really have started to constitute a nuisance.
17:41And he may, as a responsible property owner, have done the responsible thing.
17:45But that's not true.
17:47Judge Domingo?
17:48What was your relationship before your mom passed away, your relationship with the plaintiff?
17:54He's my uncle.
17:55That's how he is.
17:56So you didn't have a good relationship.
17:58Not really.
17:59Do you agree you guys didn't have a good...
18:00That's false, Your Honor.
18:01Every summer, they were at my house.
18:04They stayed with me every summer, and every weekend, we went somewhere.
18:07But as they got older, right around the time your sister passed away, what was your relationship with the both
18:13of them?
18:13Well, I guess when my sister passed, and he thought he was grown and smelling himself, he started being so
18:22disrespectful.
18:23How old were you when your mom passed, sir?
18:25I was 25 years old.
18:26So you were grown.
18:27Ma'am, how old were you?
18:28I believe I was 19.
18:3019, when your mom passed?
18:31Correct.
18:32Okay.
18:32So there was no love lost by all of this, because you could no longer keep what wasn't working any
18:38longer on your property.
18:39And that's how it ended up being abandoned on their, now their property, for more than two years.
18:45And I don't think I have any other questions.
18:47Does anybody else?
18:48Then we're going to retire to deliberate.
18:50Ma'am, you can take your seat.
18:51Okay.
18:52Court now stands in recess.
18:54This case will be recalled.
18:55Parties are excused.
18:59I don't think this was the cat house he initially had in mind when he was building it with the
19:04pole in the middle.
19:06I kind of think that that wasn't what he was thinking.
19:09The statute of limitations for civil theft is five years.
19:13So he's within the time frame.
19:15And the defendant's position is twofold, or maybe threefold, but definitely it was abandoned.
19:20And it's pretty clear, based on the facts, the photographs, the inconsistencies, that he did abandon it.
19:26And he abandoned it after he was told, and I believe he was told, get this off my property.
19:31And I can't see how the plaintiff is going to recover in this at all for abandoning this property and
19:37not washing it or doing anything to it for years.
19:41I agree.
19:42The plaintiff would also have to prove damages.
19:43And he's looking for $5,000 for the vehicle that we saw in the photographs with the flat tires, with
19:49the bad transmission, was in an accident.
19:51He doesn't even come close.
19:53For all of those reasons, I would agree.
19:55I completely agree.
19:56I think the bus may have even constituted a nuisance based on these facts.
20:00I think that the defendant, yeah, I think that he not only was entitled to take it off his property,
20:06he probably at some point may have been obligated.
20:08It makes the whole neighborhood look bad.
20:10Also, I credited the sister when she said the city was giving them tickets.
20:14I did, too.
20:14Because she just, the way it came out, it just sounded truthful.
20:17So I really think that it got to a point where it was causing them more problems.
20:21So, yeah, I'm sorry to say his party bus gets nothing.
20:24Are you really sorry to say?
20:26No.
20:27Party's over.
20:28Party's over.
20:29It's done.
20:33Court is back in session.
20:35I remind parties you're still under oath.
20:37Thank you, Bird.
20:38You know, some cases give us some levity in the back.
20:40So this had a lot of play.
20:42You know, like, this was not the cat house you had in mind after you put the pole in.
20:46There were just things that you weren't expecting here.
20:49Problem is, you abandoned this property.
20:52Whether we choose any number of several different dates and time, 2016, when you say you finished working on it,
21:002018, after it was in an accident.
21:02Your sister passed in May of that year.
21:05You, sir, then were left with the property and what was on it.
21:09The bus had never been moved from 2018 to 2020, as was evidenced also by the aerial photographs.
21:16And, sir, you just walked away from it.
21:19And so, therefore, when he actually sold it or trashed it, he was in all of his rights to do
21:25so.
21:26And you have not established what that value was.
21:29So on so many different levels, for so many different reasons, sir, we have unanimously agreed to dismiss your case
21:36in its entirety.
21:38This case is now concluded.
21:39Parties are excused.
21:40You may step out.
21:44The judge's decision was based off what they heard, what were lies.
21:49He did have been in his port-a-bus.
21:51After his mom passed, he started, his attitude changed.
21:56I saw him for the person that he is as I got older.
21:59It didn't change at all.
22:00You've seen those pictures of my bus.
22:02I would never let cats live in my bus or anything like that.
22:07No, it was a cat hotel.
22:08They were selling cat nymphs out the bus on me.
22:11Life goes on.
22:13You can't dwell on things because they only hold you down.
22:18Just keep moving.
22:19Got family drama?
22:20Let Tribunal Justice decide your case.
22:24Find us on social media at Tribunal Justice.
22:52Bye-bye.
23:02Transcription by CastingWords
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