- 15 hours ago
Победа Петера Мадьяра в Венгрии - как это отразится на Брюсселе?
В новом выпуске программы "Звонок", транслируемой из Европейского парламента в Брюсселе, евродепутаты Даниэль Фройнд (Зеленые) и Сандер Смит (ЕКР) обсуждают итоги выборов в Венгрии и то, что они означают для Европы.
ЧИТАТЬ ДАЛЕЕ : http://ru.euronews.com/2026/04/16/pobeda-petera-madyara-v-vengrii-kak-eto-otrazitsya-na-bryussele
Подписывайтесь: Euronews можно смотреть на Dailymotion на 12 языках
В новом выпуске программы "Звонок", транслируемой из Европейского парламента в Брюсселе, евродепутаты Даниэль Фройнд (Зеленые) и Сандер Смит (ЕКР) обсуждают итоги выборов в Венгрии и то, что они означают для Европы.
ЧИТАТЬ ДАЛЕЕ : http://ru.euronews.com/2026/04/16/pobeda-petera-madyara-v-vengrii-kak-eto-otrazitsya-na-bryussele
Подписывайтесь: Euronews можно смотреть на Dailymotion на 12 языках
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:01Субтитры создавал DimaTorzok
00:30Луис Альбертос
01:11Луис Альбертос
01:14Луис Альбертос
01:16Луис Альбертос
01:40Луис Альбертос
01:43Луис Альбертос
01:56Луис Альбертос
01:59Луис Альбертос
02:09Луис Альбертос
02:12Луис Альбертос
02:12Луис Альбертос
02:19Луис Альбертос
02:21Луис Альбертос
02:31Луис Альбертос
02:52Луис Альбертос
02:54Луис Альбертос
02:56Луис Альбертос
02:57Луис Альбертос
03:00Луис Альбертос
03:01Луис Альбертос
03:15Луис Альбертос
03:17Но я думаю, что это действительно верно.
03:18Но эти номера были очень удивлены.
03:20Вы это на вашем рейдаре?
03:22Я имею в виду, но это было очень четко два-thirds.
03:26И я думаю, что это удивительное, в конце концов,
03:29как быстро и четко Виктор Орбан консидировал.
03:33Потому что там была какая-то страха,
03:34что он не будет просто идти.
03:36Но теперь это выглядит как...
03:38Но сейчас это выглядит как...
03:40Но все равно, это впечатляет.
03:43Я был там в Будапест, на земле,
03:45и видеть просто рандом люди
03:47хай-фивая, чёрные, чёрные,
03:49на улице,
03:50проживаясь,
03:52что это был большой момент для Европы.
03:54Я думаю, что это был большой момент для Европы.
03:55Вы согласны?
03:56Я думаю, что мы не должны поларизировать слишком много.
03:57Мы можем еще видеть,
03:58что демократические и демократические ценности
04:01внутри Хунгарии,
04:02и даже институты статисты,
04:05выживали, были ухажены.
04:07Орбан консидировал его лошадь.
04:10И я думаю, что мы не должны
04:12преодолеть все спекуляции.
04:14Я был очень боюсь,
04:15что некоторые left-wing политики
04:18поларизировали
04:20предоставления.
04:20Я думаю,
04:21что это могло бы повредить
04:22от Тишаа,
04:23который результат,
04:24в конце.
04:24Но,
04:25я думаю,
04:25они были,
04:54я думаю,
04:56что,
04:56я не знаю,
04:56я не знаю,
04:57парламент research service before the elections to give me the numbers, and Orban has vetoed
05:01more than pretty much everyone else combined.
05:04Every single unanimous decision we have taken in the last years, first we get a veto from
05:09Viktor Orban, and he demands concessions, he blackmails the Union.
05:13So I think we have never seen anything like him in the history of the European Union.
05:18Right.
05:18Sande, do you agree?
05:19I mean, after all, pronouncing a veto, that's his right.
05:23Yeah, that's right.
05:24Of smaller member states, I think in the last years, I can agree with Mr. Freund that there
05:29was an abuse, especially also for the interest of foreign actors, foreign states, third countries.
05:34I think that was worrying.
05:36But in the end, we need this veto to defend the rights of smaller countries as a principle.
05:41In the case of Hungary, I think I worked alongside Fidesz during many years, when I was a parliamentary
05:47advisor here in the institutions, and back then they were really aligning always with
05:52the Juncker Commission in the first years with the von der Leyen Commission.
05:57So I don't think they're the ones always blocking EU policy.
06:02Not always blocking.
06:04He did block everything on Ukraine, basically.
06:08Is this today, is this the beginning of a new dawn?
06:13A spring coming to Brussels?
06:14What's going to be the vibe here in this town?
06:17I mean, the veto in chief is now gone.
06:19So I hope clearly that now there is a real willingness to act.
06:25But I also hope that member states understand that we cannot let this happen ever again.
06:31We should not allow a second Orban to now emerge, either because he comes back one day or someone
06:37else follows in his footsteps.
06:39I mean, that a single guy can basically block an entire union, can risk our security and
06:45uses the veto not to defend his or the Hungarian interest, but to just basically blackmail and
06:51extort from us.
06:52This is something that we should not let happen ever again.
06:55So we need reform.
06:56We need reform.
06:57No, I think we would need to keep the unanimity principle as such the treaties and shrine
07:02this principle, not because it's an idea of some Brussels bureaucrat.
07:09It was really well thought out because smaller member states need to be defended against larger
07:16member states through a qualified majority voting overruling their national interests.
07:21I myself, hailing from a small member state, the Netherlands know very well what this could
07:26mean.
07:27Small but powerful.
07:27Small but powerful.
07:28But nevertheless, I think we need to defend the smaller member states national sovereignty
07:33as well.
07:33How confident are you?
07:34To be really clear, Peter Magyar was elected on a national sovereignty electoral program.
07:40And I think it's a bit weird if we act now as if nothing of such ever happened.
07:46That's a good point.
07:47How confident are you that Peter Magyar will actually change the dynamics and not throw in
07:54the veto?
07:54I mean, already has changed the dynamics, right?
07:57If you look at the relationship that Peter Magyar has with people like Donald Tusk, with
08:02Emmanuel Macron now.
08:03They talk.
08:04They call each other on the phone.
08:05We haven't seen that with Viktor Orban in months and months.
08:08So already there is a different relationship.
08:11And I think he has been very clear that he wants a constructive relationship with the
08:16European Union.
08:17I think it's clear that the veto on the 90 billion for Ukraine will go away and we will be
08:22able
08:22to help Ukraine also financially now.
08:24And I think, I mean, having been there in Budapest on the ground on Sunday, when he said things
08:30like that he is going to have this constructive relationship, that he wants to join the European
08:34public prosecutor, jointly work against corruption.
08:37There were cheers from tens of thousands of people screaming, Europe, Europe.
08:41So I think this is very different than what we have seen in the last 16 years from Viktor
08:46Orban.
08:47Of course, what Mr. Freund is speaking about is very important.
08:50But that was what I was pleading in favor of.
08:53We need coordinated unity, not forced unity, not a forced unity forced upon smaller members.
08:59We need coordination, speaking with other heads of government.
09:03And that's what Peter Magyar is doing now.
09:05That's very positive.
09:06But that doesn't mean we need to get rid of the unanimity principle.
09:09And I really doubt that Peter Magyar would agree with Mr. Freund to get rid of the unanimity
09:15principle because he was elected as a national sovereignty.
09:19And we have a Hungarian parliament now.
09:21So that's I was a bit surprised to see left wing and liberal politicians cheering for a
09:26new Hungarian parliament entirely composed out of right wing, center right, national
09:32conservative, nationalist and ultra nationalist parties.
09:35There's no social democrat, green or liberal party left.
09:39So I think this conservative mandate given by the Hungarian voters is very clear and should
09:44also be respected in the European Union.
09:46And we have to work together to coordinate with Peter Magyar.
09:49And I'm very happy that he will unblock the 90 billion euro for Ukraine.
09:54But we shouldn't do as if he is now like a Volt or a green MEP pleading in favor of
10:00a
10:00European federation.
10:01Your thoughts on this, Daniel?
10:03Well, I mean, having spoken with actually lots of Hungarians on the ground, this is not a conservative vote.
10:10I mean, most people in this election voted for Europe, voted for democracy, voted for the
10:16rule of law and voted to kick Viktor Orban out.
10:19This is what motivated most of the of those people that now voted actually for Peter Magyar.
10:24And the big question now for him is basically if he is going to represent that voter base or not.
10:32Because many people actually voted in this election with the hope that they will be able to cast their
10:37vote that they really want to cast in four years time.
10:40Once democracy has been restored, once there is independent media, once there is rule of law in the country.
10:46This was not about a conservative agenda.
10:48This was about getting rid of all right.
10:50All right. All right. Let me stop you there as we are just getting warmed up here, as you have
10:55noticed.
10:59Now it's time for our viewers to get a real flavor of the European Parliament chamber, where members ask each
11:06other questions.
11:07And sometimes it can get heated.
11:09That means it's time for you both to challenge each other directly, just as you do in the Hemisch cycle
11:16behind us.
11:17So let's get started. And Sander, the floor is yours.
11:21Yes. Mr. Freund, you're really pleading in favor of getting rid of unanimity.
11:27What would you do in the future situation with the Greens in Germany being a coalition party in the coalition
11:33in Germany in Berlin,
11:34having this coalition force a European Council decision upon them to, for instance, go to war, like in the past
11:44on Iraq or Iran?
11:46How would your party in that case react?
11:49Would you agree with such a stance being imposed on the German government to go to war by an EU
11:55decision?
11:57Well, I mean, I'm a Democrat. I'm being outvoted here in the European Parliament on an almost daily basis.
12:03That's how it goes. This is democracy. I'm not pleading for a veto here in the European Parliament.
12:09Imagine if among us, 720 members of the European Parliament, we would have to strike consensus.
12:16We would have to reach unanimity on every decision. This House would be completely dysfunctional.
12:21And it's a little bit similar among 27 in the Council. So, yeah, I would accept decisions that go against
12:28my beliefs.
12:29I can fight for them. But at the end, we vote. And I accept that if we vote by majority,
12:34I can lose.
12:35All right. Are you happy with that?
12:37No, that basically means abolishing the national sovereignty of the German Bundestag over its foreign policy and military policy.
12:44That's a different question. And I want Daniel to ask Alexander.
12:48Well, my question is basically, I mean, you have said that, you know, the veto needs to remain.
12:53But if you look, for example, on the process of accession of a new member state, and I could even
12:59say, you know, taking a unanimous vote at the end.
13:01Maybe we keep that for now. But do we need 150 unanimous votes in the process where every single question
13:11needs to be opened by unanimity, needs to be closed by unanimity?
13:14I mean, isn't 150 vetoes or unanimous decision on a decision like that a bit exaggerated? Can't we bring that
13:22down to maybe one in the end?
13:25The current treaty already has a passerelle clause to deal with such certain issues.
13:31I think we can find solutions there without doing away with national sovereignty and unanimity principle.
13:38And I will repeat myself, but Peter Madja in Hungary yesterday said that he's opposed to a quick accession, of
13:45instance, for Ukraine.
13:46So he wants to say about every step in the process, opening of every chapter.
13:51So I don't think most smaller member states would agree to your approach there.
13:57Follow up, Daniel.
13:58Well, I think at the end we have to decide whether we want a European Union that is still able
14:04to act in a world, you know, with Trump, with Xi, with Putin,
14:09whether we're just the playing ball for the big guys or whether we get a seat at the table and
14:15a voice that is actually heard.
14:16You speak a lot about sovereignty and, you know, our capacity to act.
14:20And I actually think we only have that if we're able to speak with one voice.
14:25And if we have the capacity to act, not one single European blocking us from that.
14:30How do you respond to that?
14:32I think we need to speak with one voice, but not through forced unity, but through coordinated unity.
14:38The European Union was able to act after the Russian criminal invasion of Ukraine in 2022.
14:44The EU acted upon that, provided support.
14:48So we shouldn't do as if the European Union was helpless with the unanimity principle.
14:53This is false.
14:54I think in the future we can even your stance could even undermine support for the European Union and membership
15:00by bringing in this bomb of qualified majority voting,
15:06alienating smaller member states and creating more resentment among politicians, maybe even among Peter Magyar in Hungary, but also in
15:14my own member state in Netherlands.
15:15If you impose qualified majority voting, having France and your own member state Germany with a few others imposing their
15:22foreign policy or a military policy will upon my voters in the regions.
15:28Because you spoke about Budapest.
15:30I think that the population of capitals doesn't reflect the general population in EU member states or their stances.
15:36And I think the large majority of voters in the countryside and in regions want to uphold the unanimity principle
15:43to make sure that every voter in every region and every member state is heard.
15:48And these voters know very well we have to defend ourselves against foreign threats by third states and third countries.
15:54Sander, I gave you the last question.
15:56Yes.
15:58Mr. Freund, are you not worried, I already said it before, but aren't you worried that abolishing the unanimity principle
16:06will create resentment and alienate a lot of Europeans in these smaller member states,
16:11having other stances than maybe majorities in larger member states, for instance the Hungarian population, but also in the Netherlands
16:18or in Latvia, if we go towards qualified majority voting?
16:22Well, I mean, you mentioned Latvia, and I think the Baltic states are an interesting example.
16:27You know, they came out of Soviet rule, joined the European Union, and I think for a long time for
16:32them the veto was in a way the guarantee, you know, that something like in the Soviet Union doesn't happen
16:38again.
16:38Exactly.
16:38But the problem being that since the full-scale invasion in Ukraine, the Baltic states are realizing that if you
16:45have someone like Viktor Orban in the EU that wields the veto, if all of a sudden you have unmarked
16:51Russian soldiers coming over the border into Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania,
16:55well, then Orban becomes a security threat because he can block any kind of reaction.
17:01We don't even have an opinion on war crimes committed in Ukraine if Orban puts his veto in this because
17:08we can't have a foreign policy decision.
17:09You're still reasoning in all terms because Orban now is out of force.
17:14I mean, there will be others.
17:16You see how entrenched this thought was.
17:18But the problem is then, you know, that veto that can be in a way the protector of sovereignty can
17:24also become the supreme security threat.
17:27And that is the situation why I think we should get rid of it.
17:30All right.
17:31We have heard the views from our guests.
17:33Now it's time to bring in a new voice.
17:39I'd like to bring in European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen now in a press conference this week.
17:44She commented on the outcome of the Hungarian election and gave a hint of what could come next in Brussels.
17:51Here's what she said.
17:52Take a listen.
17:53We should also look at the lessons learned inside the European Union.
17:58For example, I think moving to qualified majority voting in foreign policy is an important way to avoid systematic blockages
18:10as we've seen in the past.
18:12And we should use the momentum now really to move forward on that topic.
18:16Sander, your thoughts on this?
18:18I think this is an example of a prepared, politically prepared, bureaucratically prepared, badly timed power grab by the European
18:27Commission, which has a lot to do about its own transparency and legitimacy among European voters in this era.
18:34I think that's what they should work on and not work towards abolishing national sovereignty on foreign policy, on military
18:42interventions, because, as was said, military operations.
18:46We have NATO and the EU, and we have seen that national democratic change is possible in Hungary, that the
18:52democratic will of Hungarian voters corrected the problems we had in the European Council on support for Ukraine last support
19:01bill.
19:01Did I hear that right?
19:02Is that the power grab of the European Commission?
19:04I think it's quite the opposite.
19:06And you speak about the democratic will of the people.
19:09You know, if you look at an issue like whether large corporations should pay their fair share of taxes, you
19:14have an overwhelming majority of Europeans in every single member state that want that.
19:19But we cannot get there because a single member state, maybe one that has a very favorable tax regime for
19:26large corporations and helps to evade billions of taxes being paid, can put their veto on these kind of minimum
19:34taxation levels, for example.
19:35So this is another example where the veto is basically going against democracy, is going against the will of the
19:43vast majority of Europeans.
19:45All right.
19:46We'll come back to this.
19:47Let's take a break here on The Ring.
19:50We'll be back with more after this.
20:00Welcome back to The Ring, Euronews' weekly debate show.
20:04I'm Stefan Grobe and I'm joined by Daniel Freund from the Greens and Sander Schmidt from the European Conservatives and
20:10Reformists.
20:11The idea here is to bring the European Parliament's debates to your living room.
20:16This week, we're focusing on a key question in this building.
20:20Is the EU in need of wide ranging reforms or not?
20:24One issue is the role of the EU High Representative, Kaya Callas.
20:28She heads the European External Action Service with its 140 plus EU delegations worldwide and employs more than 4000 staff.
20:38But Callas, like all her predecessors, has no direct control over national armies.
20:44There's also no single centralized EU foreign policy budget.
20:48Funding is split across institutions and member states.
20:51And Callas and her service must rely on a consensus of the 27 member states for foreign policy decisions.
20:59Is this efficient at all?
21:02No, it's not.
21:03I mean, why do we pay 28 different embassies in cities like Beijing or Washington?
21:11I mean, let's at least start with the councillor service.
21:14If a European needs a new passport, needs a birth certificate, something, why do we need 28 different administrations that
21:21they can turn to?
21:22Isn't one enough?
21:23That would be much cheaper for European taxpayers.
21:26Sander, your thoughts?
21:27Well, there's a matter maybe of inefficiency in diplomacy, but militarily we already have Article 5 of NATO, Article 42
21:35in the EU.
21:36And we should not, as an EU, start to double NATO infrastructure.
21:40We need to build on the European pillar, I think, jointly, but that's on a military capacity basis, not on
21:47the command structure.
21:48And I really, really would warn the European Union against assuming a role of commanding an EU army.
21:56That would be very dangerous and create a lot of resentment.
21:59But foreign policy, I mean, we're hearing every now and then that the commission president is sort of undermining the
22:06higher representative by taking too much out of the foreign policy portfolio in her own hands.
22:12Why are we having a higher representative at all then?
22:15I mean, it is a bit of a strange animal because we didn't, when we last made these treaties, we
22:20didn't fully commit to have an EU foreign minister.
22:22The governments wanted more control, so she is half in the commission, half in the council, and that is precisely
22:29what creates this awkward position.
22:32But if you say, you know, this is about sovereignty, look at the sovereignty of a place like Greenland.
22:39Greenland doesn't have sovereignty facing Donald Trump and the American administration.
22:44They had sovereignty when Europe was together and said, if you touch Greenland, you're gonna, you know, have the joint
22:53EU against you.
22:54That's when we protected the sovereignty of Greenland.
22:57Not every small country for itself.
22:59Places like Luxembourg, like Estonia, even a place like Germany doesn't have sovereignty in the face of China, Russia or
23:06the US.
23:07Only together are we strong enough.
23:09But the case of Greenland perfectly shows that we're not a big player globally.
23:14And he mentioned that earlier.
23:15We're not a big player globally.
23:16I think the agreement perfectly shows that if it's necessary, like the Ukraine war, at the start of the Ukraine
23:22war,
23:22the EU is willing and able to act with the current treaties jointly.
23:26We saw that on Greenland.
23:27We saw it on Ukraine, on the invasion by Russia.
23:30But if we look at Iran and the stances, the different stances of EU member states, Sanchez, Pedro Sanchez, maybe
23:37also Italy, but also France, Germany and other member states on the Israeli-American intervention against Iran,
23:44it's entirely divergent.
23:46And we saw this divergence also in the EU institutions.
23:49So it's doomed to fail to have a forced unity of foreign policy in this way.
23:54We need coordination.
23:56And Greenland and the Ukraine cases show that the EU is already able, within the current treaties, to act if
24:03it's necessary.
24:03Because the EU, rightly so, defended Greenland.
24:06And I led a delegation of the fisheries committee last September to Greenland to also strengthen our ties with the
24:13fisheries sector there.
24:14We have a huge fisheries agreement there.
24:15And I really can only commend these cases as an example for the future.
24:21So it's versus speaking with one voice versus a forced unity.
24:27I don't know where this forced unity comes from.
24:29The question is just if people like the two of us, members of the European Parliament, actually have any kind
24:36of say on these questions.
24:37Because in the current setup, it's left to the 27 governments.
24:41We here adopt resolutions, but quite honestly, who cares?
24:44But the question is if the European Parliament, the directly elected representatives from all those citizens in Europe that send
24:51us here to the European Parliament,
24:53whether this Parliament has a role in the foreign policy decisions, in the diplomatic relations, we got a say on
25:00trade.
25:01So some elements are there, but others are not.
25:03And it makes more sense if you have all the tools in your hand.
25:06Von der Leyen can threaten on boycotts and sanctions, but she doesn't have the other tools that Putin or Trump
25:14or Xi have in their hands.
25:16And that makes her weaker.
25:17Well, now it's time to move on to our fifth and final round where we continue our conversation.
25:26Now it's time for something different.
25:28I'm going to ask you a set of questions and you can answer only with a yes or no.
25:34OK, so let's start with a simple one.
25:37Is Orbán's defeat a turning point for the EU, Sandor?
25:39I think very much so in the sense that we can now provide the Ukraine with a yes.
25:45OK.
25:45Yes.
25:46Yes.
25:47Good.
25:48Will Magia be an undisputed ally of Brussels?
25:51No.
25:52No?
25:52No.
25:53No.
25:54Well, you guys agree on something here.
25:56Is unanimity making the EU weak on the world stage?
26:01Yes.
26:02Absolutely not.
26:03Would removing veto power make the EU more democratic?
26:07Absolutely not.
26:08Yes.
26:09And is the future of the EU federal?
26:12No, it's confederal.
26:15It is.
26:16Is the EU a credible actor on the world stage these days?
26:19Yes.
26:21Halfway, but rather yes.
26:24OK.
26:25Does Europe need a single foreign policy voice?
26:28No.
26:29Yes.
26:30Is this the moment for radical EU reform?
26:33Yes.
26:35No.
26:36Let's keep it away please.
26:38That's a good one.
26:39Are national governments the problem in EU decision making?
26:43When you sit in the parliament, that's how it looks like.
26:46Absolutely not.
26:48And national governments have the most direct mandate in the European Council.
26:52No.
26:53We are elected on EU election programs.
26:55National governments are national elections, so they have no direct mandate for EU affairs.
27:00Our national elections have the highest turnout of voters, the most direct media attention, and I think in the principle
27:06of subsidiarity enshrined in the treaties, we need to look upon these national parliaments as the prime expression of the
27:12national will.
27:12Well, fascinating conversation here for a yes or no question.
27:16That final answer brings us to the end of this edition of The Ring.
27:20Thanks again to Daniel Freund and Sander Schmidt for a lively conversation here from the European Parliament.
27:26Thanks to our audience at home.
27:27If you like, you can continue the conversation by sending us your comments to thering at euronews.com.
27:34That's it for today.
27:36I'm Stefan Grobe.
27:37Take care and see you soon here on Euronews.
Comments