00:00We're talking about the global volatility right now. The focus, of course, with the unrest, the Middle East crisis, the
00:05war in Iran and supply chains, but also, of course, the developments around AI and software and hardware.
00:12And this has been pitched by some in the tech space as the year for humanoid robots.
00:17Where are we? Given all the complexities of what's happening on a kind of global stage, where are we from
00:23moving from lab-based humanoid robots to actually real commercial uses, Jared?
00:28Yeah, yeah. I think we're going to see real commercial uses starting later this year and going into next year
00:34for these systems in industrial spaces.
00:36So, like, in fairly well-structured, repeatable-type use cases, the technology is there today.
00:42The AI systems are general enough to be able to learn these tasks, not just a single task, but multiple
00:48tasks inside these facilities, which really is what unlocks the commercial viability of them.
00:53This flexible-type automation. There are still plenty of roles for specialized systems, you know, static arms that just pick
01:0024-7.
01:01But where you really benefit with a humanoid is this flexible automation, being able to move from one use case
01:07to the other within a single facility.
01:09So, for you and for Humanoid, the company, this happens this year.
01:13Yes.
01:13Which industries are you going to be deploying into? I mentioned some of the names there.
01:17Yep.
01:17And what is the demand that you're seeing already?
01:19Yeah. The demand is off the charts, which has been honestly surprising for me because I've been in the robotics
01:23space for about 15 years now.
01:25And normally, you have to kind of pitch them on it.
01:28What I've been seeing is, in a lot of cases, these companies already have humanoid strategies.
01:32They are figuring out, in advance of the technology being available to them commercially, how are we going to use
01:38these to augment our workforce?
01:40So, the demand has been there. We've completed eight commercial POCs with our prototype systems.
01:46We're working on our production intent systems right now.
01:48The first systems for the production intent design are coming online later this year.
01:53And how many units do you expect to be shipping, say, by the end of 2027?
01:57Do you have a target in mind?
01:57Yeah. Basically, high hundreds to low thousands is the target by the end of 2027.
02:03What is driving that demand? Is it a shortage of labor?
02:06Is it because the unit economics now make more sense when it comes to robotics versus humans?
02:11What is driving that, what you describe as significant demand?
02:13Yeah. I would say the biggest signal we're getting is shortage of labor.
02:17So, the use cases that we're going after are in warehouses, in logistics facilities, in automotive suppliers and so forth.
02:26And these jobs are sometimes in areas that are just very hard to staff.
02:30And even the ones that are in the more densely populated areas, they're just not the jobs that, you know,
02:37Western society is going after right now as heavily as they had in the past.
02:41And so, these are allowing us to augment the labor force in a way that just wasn't possible with more
02:48specialized automation before because the ROI wasn't there.
02:51For a single use case, if you need to dedicate a robot for that, you need maximum usage of that
02:57system.
02:58But a lot of these are kind of sporadic use cases throughout a facility.
03:01Maybe I'm unloading in the morning.
03:03Maybe I'm packing during the day.
03:04Maybe I'm loading at the end of the day.
03:05And you need a flexible automation solution to be able to support all those use cases.
03:09Ultimately, long-term, jobs do get replaced, though.
03:12I mean, which jobs are going to be replaced most quickly by humanoid robots?
03:17I think anything extremely dull or dangerous is what we're going after right now.
03:21So, some of the use cases that we've been working on as well are in high-energy stations where literally
03:26people die during the year.
03:29And this is a major problem that they are trying to basically take humans out of that use case so
03:36that they're no longer exposed to some of these risks.
03:40So, yeah, all the very repeatable, fairly narrow complexity use cases are what we're initially targeting.
03:48There's a lot of money going into robotics right now, a lot of money going into humanoid robotics.
03:52It's very competitive.
03:54Yes.
03:55Does China end up winning this race, Jared?
03:57Yeah, it's a great question.
03:59I think China is very strong on hardware.
04:01They can iterate extremely quickly in places like Shenzhen.
04:05They have basically everything they need right in that location.
04:08But I would say what I expect to see happen is on one front, some of the parts will get
04:13commoditized.
04:14But this has happened in the automotive space as well.
04:16And yet, you know, a Porsche is not a commodity.
04:19So, I think that parallel actually also applies to humanoids.
04:23Some of the parts will get much cheaper, which will help the ecosystem be able to create more of these
04:28systems and deploy them in the world.
04:29But in terms of Chinese full systems, what I've seen in the space over the past five-ish years is
04:38that a lot of US customers, UK customers, European customers are always asking what components in your supply chain are
04:46coming from China.
04:46And I do think there is going to be this sovereign element to which humanoids are adopted in which regions.
04:55So, yeah.
04:55It becomes another sovereign story.
04:58I think that's exactly right.
04:58Robotics and humanoid robotics.
04:59Where does Elon Musk sit in this, the optimist?
05:02How do you grade that robot and his chances of success?
05:05Yeah.
05:06I think one of the major differences between us and almost all the other competitors is we started with a
05:12commercial focus in mind at the right time, right as the AI systems were coming online to actually make them
05:17commercially viable.
05:19Almost every company that started before us was more starting from a research standpoint.
05:24You know, you think about the Boston Dynamics and some of the others, like they have long research histories.
05:29And so, you know, in terms of Optimus, it's an impressive looking robot.
05:33It's not competing for the same types of use cases that we're going after.
05:37It's much smaller.
05:39Its payload capacity is much lighter.
05:41It has a five-finger dexterous hand, which are very complex and they're very expensive.
05:46Our system is simplifying where we can.
05:49So we've got a wheelbase.
05:50There are existing autonomous mobile robot standards that enable us to get the safety certifications to deploy them into customer
05:57facilities.
05:58We use simplified gripper systems because it helps us use or complete most of the tasks that our customers care
06:04about.
06:05And we have a much larger workspace and a much higher payload capacity than any of those bipeds.
06:10It doesn't sound like you see Elon Musk as a major threat at this point.
06:11Not at this point.
06:12And I don't think there's going to be a winner-take-all dynamic.
06:14I think this market is huge and there's going to be many players in the space.
06:18Jared, thank you very much indeed.
06:19Really fascinating.
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