00:00If the pharma pharma isn't buying based on something as cheap, if you will, or something is, you know, you
00:08know, is is within reach.
00:10It's just more like is it sort of the data differentiated. Does it fit with their portfolio? Does it fit
00:16with their broader strategy?
00:17As long as all those boxes are checked, the deal will happen and does happen.
00:21So there is scarcity of very, very good assets, but but there is enough sort of to to fill in
00:27the pharma sort of gaps, if you will, that's in the coming years.
00:31And kind of pivoting from there, I mean, there's been this narrative across M&A for the past few for
00:36the past year that kind of we're in an anything goes environment regulatory wise.
00:40Do you think that applies in health care and biopharma as well? And could we see some of these mega
00:45MOEs or is that just not the need yet?
00:48We are in an environment right now where there's an emphasis on getting products in the hands of companies that
00:56can take them further, develop them and really get to the patients.
01:00And so that's a very positive environment for transactional matters.
01:04So from that perspective, absolutely. We're seeing more transactions happen, more transactions go through.
01:10I think parties at the outset have a better certainty now that on timing and getting deals through.
01:18The bigger. I mean, on that, it's been years since we saw something over 20 billion dollars.
01:23Do you think this is the year where we finally see that?
01:25Yeah, I mean, if there is a year, it will probably be this year or next year, quite frankly, because
01:28the current environment is fairly business friendly from the regulatory perspective.
01:33And I think people, you know, are probably considering whether it makes sense for them to do these larger pharmas,
01:40because, as you said, I mean, there's been very, very few, very large deals and the very large pharma, the
01:46last far large pharma deals have been around 2008, 2009, quite frankly.
01:50But the regulatory environment wasn't really permissible for that either.
01:55So I think that has changed quite a bit now.
01:57And I think there is sort of a momentum towards that.
02:00Whether that happens or not, the implications of that is a very different question.
02:03But if one wants to do a big merger, our guess is that that's certainly within the cards.
02:09Krishna, where would that come from?
02:11What is the sector that you think the biggest deals are going to be coming from?
02:14Is it obesity, oncology, something different?
02:16I think the areas of real interest that I see the most activity are, one is the intersection of immunology
02:24and oncology.
02:25So, you know, this is using the body cells to combat cancer.
02:29There's a significant amount of interest there, whether it's B cell depletion or CAR-T deals.
02:35I expect that to continue.
02:37That's a really exciting area, and especially for the patients.
02:40The level of innovation there is unbelievable.
02:43And then the metabolic, right?
02:44This is, you know, the traditional GLP-1s and ML and add-ons.
02:48But also there, we're seeing people interested in alternatives to that.
02:52So those are the two areas that I think are going to have the most interest this year.
02:57And if you look back to M&A and also licensing deals as well, which are a big part of
03:02the life sciences ecosystem,
03:04both of those were the two leaders leading up to the end of the year.
03:07So those are my two areas.
03:09I think if I agree with Krishna, but if I would answer it as the electivity follows innovation.
03:16The reason we have now more immunology transaction, the broader autoimmune deals,
03:21or we have more cardiometabolic transactions is because of the innovations, right?
03:26We, if we had a GLP-1 available 10 years ago, I promise you people would have bought it.
03:31Right.
03:31But I think now with this innovation in that proteometabolic space, I think we're seeing a lot of activity.
03:37Oncology has been the most sort of attractive sector historically in the last 20 years, 15 years,
03:43because there was a lot of innovation happening in oncology, right?
03:46I mean, a lot of the specific subtype oncology or cancer as a disease has turned into a chronic disease
03:56in some sort of categories
03:57in certain mutations of breast cancers and prostate cancer and the like.
04:01So there was a lot of the electivity there.
04:04Now with cardiometabolic and autoimmune, I would also highlight neuroscience as one up and coming sector for the years ahead,
04:12because I think there's a lot of shift towards addressing that as well.
04:16But broadly, the innovation will determine where the deal actually is.
04:19By the way, you're allowed to disagree with each other.
04:21I know you're good friends.
04:22I think you'll still be friends after this.
04:24I think Eric just disagreed in a very polite way.
04:27I was going to say a very diplomatic way to disagree.
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