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00:00Welcome to Variety's For the Love of the Craft, The Nominees, presented by Sony Pictures Classics.
00:05I'm Clayton Davis, Chief Awards Editor at Variety, talking with Ethan Hawke,
00:09nominated for Best Actor for his work as Lorenz Hart and Richard Linklater's Blue Moon.
00:15Hey, when Shakespeare wrote, not marble, nor gilded monuments of princes shall outlive this
00:21powerful rhyme, did people say, my God, what an ego? No, they said he is a genius and he knows
00:27his work is going to last. So now you're Shakespeare. Look, Oklahoma is going to win the goddamn
00:32Pulitzer. I know that. High schools are going to put it on from now till doomsday because it is so
00:38inoffensive. But really, who wants inoffensive art? All right, Ethan Hawke. That's me. That's you.
00:48Now four-time Academy Award nominee, Ethan Hawke, thank you very much. It's good to be able to say
00:53that. Listen, congratulations on all the success with Blue Moon. It's an incredible performance.
01:01I am just really elated that you're getting your first lead nomination after so many years
01:07in this biz. How does it feel to, you know, you know, be good at everything?
01:13I wish that were true. It does, you know, I've made a lot of movies in my life. You know,
01:22one of my favorite quotes when I was young was William Holden. His advice to young actors was
01:29do every movie you can. One in 10 will be good. And one in 100 will get you an Academy
01:35Award.
01:35So I thought, all right, I gotta go for 100. All right. We're getting up there.
01:40We're getting close. Well, you know, you and I have spoken a lot this season. You take on this
01:47role of Lorenz Hart. You said no one but Richard Linklater would have cast you in it because they
01:51would have seen that you could do this. Do you still feel that way today? Does that still hold
01:57true? Yeah, so much of our work is born out of friendship. You know, this movie kind of happened
02:08because of a shared love of theater, like the genesis of it. You know, for when we first did
02:17Before Sunrise, I was starting my own theater company and he would come and, you know, we first
02:22met when he came to see me in a play. And, you know, he lives in Austin. He comes to
02:26New York and
02:27he loves to go see plays. And so we're always going to openings together and talking about theater
02:32and these amazing people we meet there. And so when he slipped me this script, it felt the script
02:40felt in conversation with our life. And I don't think other anybody else really, really would
02:47have thought of me for this character. But because he knows me so well, he knew how passionately I would
02:53feel about it. And usually if an actor's turned on and excited, it helps generate the, you know,
03:00the energy required to make a good performance. Yeah. Robert Kaplow's script, you know, it feels
03:09like a play and there's like, you know, a lot of great moments throughout. And he was very
03:14complimentary of you about, you know, the collaborative nature that you guys had had when you were on
03:19script about, uh, on set about the way certain, uh, lines were delivered. Um, what was it about
03:27the story and did you know a lot about Loren's heart, you know, before coming into it? You know,
03:33I knew, um, when, when we were writing before sunset, I think we, it was one of those times that
03:40like, I think we had three CDs with us in Paris, you know, like in the old day before you
03:45had Spotify
03:45and all this stuff, but we brought like three CDs. And one of them was, uh, Ella Fitzgerald
03:51sings the Rogers and Hart songbook. And we played the hell out of that. But I don't think until I
03:57read the script, I even understood that Rogers and Hart and Rogers and Hammerstein were the same Rogers.
04:03Yeah. I knew both their music, but I did, I didn't know that. And, um, but luckily
04:12I've Rick's process is so slow and so deliberate that, you know, I had 10 years to dream about
04:18Larry. You know, I did the first reading of the screenplay more than 10 years ago. So it's been
04:26a part of my subconscious and then slowly the script to get better. And then eventually Rick was really
04:33serious that he was going to make the movie. And then it was like, all right, it was on. And
04:37then it
04:37all has to kick to another level, but I felt happy that I've been able to dream about it for
04:4310 years.
04:43Oh, any Rogers and Hart article I came across, a Hart biography. Oh, here's this Chet Baker's version
04:51of this. There's this Bob Dylan's version of it. You know what I mean? It's so, I got to fill
04:56my
04:57imaginative tank up over years. I didn't have to rush to be ready. Yeah. I think, uh, I was looking
05:04at
05:04this just before, I think time of recording pretty much almost to the day blue moon premiered a year
05:10ago in Berlin. Um, it's been a journey. Some people, you know, release a film and they're just
05:17hoping to get out at opening weekend and then, you know, just kind of let it, but this has been
05:21a
05:21year in the making, uh, take me back to a year ago and, and see where the, how far the
05:27film has come
05:28to this point. I mean, did you ever think it would be where it is today as claimed as it
05:33is?
05:34You never, you just never know. It's so, cause I'm about, I'm about when we get off the phone
05:41here, you know, I'm going to head to Berlin myself for a premiere of this film, The Weight. And
05:46you just, every movie you really do, um, give your all you believe, you hope you have, there's a best
05:56case version of what it could be. And sometimes, I mean, when we screened Boyhood, I had no idea
06:05whether it, I knew I loved it. You know, I was clear that I loved it, but I didn't know
06:11whether
06:12Boyhood would have the same kind of life that Waking Life had, like just a obscure, cool movie
06:18that had its own fans in some weird back room at a bar or something, or whether it'd be a
06:24movie
06:25everybody would hear about. And, and when we premiered in Berlin, you just, I remember being so,
06:34it was right before the premiere that I really realized all the goodwill that Rick and I had built
06:41up over the years. And all of a sudden I just got petrified that we were going to let everybody
06:44down. Like there were all these articles about first movie, Hawk and Linkletter combined on 10
06:49years. It better be good. It better be, um, because we hadn't really thought like that, you know? Um,
06:59and it's been wonderful to see the movie collect its fans, you know? I mean, it's, uh,
07:08in the, it's so hard to penetrate the zeitgeist right now without a tremendous amount of money
07:15in advertising. So when that happens, you, you kind of feel this wash of gratitude of being really
07:22lucky. Yeah. Uh, listen, you, you give me a great segue and, and I know you're not a guy that
07:28typically likes to receive a whole, uh, barrage of compliments, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna be a little
07:35bit of, uh, your hype man here. One thing I've heard all throughout the year, uh, you know,
07:41I saw, I saw the movie pretty late. I started Telluride, which is like, it's late by festival
07:45standards. Right. And everything I just kept hearing from everyone was like, Ethan Hawke is
07:50the best. Like Ethan Hawke is the best. And it just really has been something that you don't hear a
07:55lot
07:55in this business. You should hear like, you know, they're actually secretly a jerk, secretly a monster,
07:59but everyone was just like Ethan Hawke is like, like, I just want the world for him. And Julie
08:05Huntsinger had said that. Telluride is why she gave you the tribute. And then that just like kept
08:09trickling along. And you, you know, you mentioned you and Rick have brought, uh, have garnered a lot
08:15of goodwill over the years. Uh, I guess the question to you, how do you not be a jerk in
08:23this business?
08:23You know, cause I seemed like, it seems like it should be easy, but, um, some people can't,
08:29can't beat that, but you, you and Rick seem to have, uh, mastered being nice guys.
08:37Well, you know, my brain launches back to my old friend, Philip Seymour Hoffman, who used to say
08:45that this job, you, you have to walk a razor's edge of feeling like it's the most
08:53important thing in the world. And you can, you really can change the world and make it a better
08:59place. If you can achieve a certain level of excellence, you have to believe it with your
09:04whole heart. And simultaneously you have to feel like a little kid who's just playing and treat it
09:12like it's a game that is so much fun to play. Um, and so you, you, you work really hard
09:21and then you
09:22just playfully give it away and you just have to kind of walk that balance between not taking it too
09:28seriously. Um, and I've seen a lot of wonderful people. I've seen a lot in, in, in my time, but
09:35I've also seen a tremendous amount of people that managed to walk that line. And, um, Rick is definitely
09:42the best at it. Uh, he's part of, I think why he's such a great friend, not he's, I can
09:51come up with
09:51different reasons why he's a great director, but why he's such a great friend is he is a natural
09:58humility of understanding that we're all, whatever is happening, we're going through it together and
10:04we're only as good as our generation. Um, we're only as good as our audience. We're only as, you know,
10:10that we all make each other up. And when you have somebody like that in your life as a baseline,
10:18always, you know, um, you know, I've gone through hell, I've gone through nine openings with him,
10:25you know, and I've had countless films that didn't get made. We've been humbled over and over again.
10:30And you just have to keep, um, playing. You have to take it really seriously and also admit that
10:37you're playing. And if you can do that, I kind of think even in any job, keeping your sense of
10:43humor,
10:43um, and, uh, understanding that you're part of a collective, those things really help.
10:49Yeah. Ah, that's awesome. Thank you for that. You know, the, the name of the series is for the
10:53love of the craft. And I always, uh, tell people sometimes when you work so much at something,
10:59some people lose that love, but obviously you still very much love acting. You love creating
11:05because you're multi-hyphenate, uh, here with, you know, you've written, you've directed,
11:09you know, you, you kind of are in love with art in general. Uh, does it still feel the same
11:14way
11:14today as it did, you know, when you were a young, young chap coming up in the space?
11:21One of the things I love about the title of your, for the love of the craft is it's, it's
11:26a word craft
11:27that isn't used enough, you know, because when you think about it, like a craft, it's, it's kind of
11:35what I learned from Sidney Lumet, like you got to think of, if you're making a rug, you want to
11:41make it really well and the stitches to be tight and for it to be beautiful, but you also admit
11:47you're just making a rug, you know, it's, it's the, the world's going to be okay, whether you make
11:51the rug or not, you're just in, in craft. Sometimes the word art has this, it can have a pretentious
12:00quality to it, or it can have a mystic quality to it. Like it's lightning in a bottle. And I've
12:06always loved the word craft because it is a job. It is a trade learning how to be a good
12:16performer
12:16and what is good storytelling and what's the math of storytelling. And, um, and there can be a certain
12:23amount of magic to it, but usually that magic comes with a specific design and invitation,
12:31you know, and you can, if your head and craft is in the right place, you can pretty much rely
12:39on it.
12:40Uh, and when it's not, you know, then, then it's something else, but craft is something I've been able
12:49to rely on. And I think I understand that word in a different way than I did when I was
12:54younger.
12:55And, um, you know, when I think about the craft of acting, I really do think about Uta Hagen's
13:01respect for acting and really treating it the way you, you know, if you want to be a good violin
13:08player, there are certain scales you can practice. You, if you put in the hours, you will get that time
13:15back, um, that it will reflect in your work, as I mean to say, and learning how to approach scenes,
13:24how to approach reading scripts, how to, you know, what they all, they used to call it scene study,
13:30understanding what is the energy and motivation behind characters and drama, and then the actual
13:37brass tacks of performance. Um, a lot of it is really learnable and really exciting.
13:45When you break it down like that, Lumet's book, making movies is just a great, cause it's just
13:51no magic to it. It's all, it's all like math. And I remember I came across it in a Barnes
13:56and Noble
13:57and I read the whole book, but back in the days when I had nothing to do, I literally said,
14:01I read the
14:02whole book in the bookstore. Um, cause I, I found it hypnotic in how much a trade he, he looked
14:11at it
14:11for a guy who made at least like 10 hall of fame movies, you know? Wow. Even the way that
14:19he would
14:19talk to Newman and the, like about the verdict, he kind of reminded Paul that of his days in
14:30studying Stanislavski and with Strasbourg and, and, and he, he brought him back and it's reflected
14:35in the performance. It's a deep, it's a deep soulful performance. And, um, sometimes the business
14:43of it can kind of beat you down because you think it's a game to be played in one. And
14:48when you think
14:49about it, like a craft, a job to be done well. And when you have as actors, we don't always
14:56get
14:56the best opportunities. You know, the, you, you sometimes got to tread water for years waiting for
15:02another really fine opportunity. Um, and I knew with Lorenz Hart that this, this was going to use
15:11everything that I'd learned about craft and how to do it. Rick called it a deductive process. And we
15:18really, through the rehearsal process, we got to do all the things we've dreamt about doing.
15:24Yeah. Um, what our heroes have done, you know, the ways that Scorsese and De Niro would build a
15:31character. And, um, it, that's very exciting to us. And, uh, and of course it's coming through his
15:39particular viewpoint, his particular energy, the cinema that Rick makes is different than other
15:45people's. And it's wonderful to be a part of that band. Yeah. Well, that's awesome. Listen,
15:51maybe got me in the mood to watch a Sidney Leventon movie today. I'm going to probably pop one in
15:55now.
15:56Once we're done, uh, final question for you, you know, listen, uh, what, one of your best
16:02performances that you've given throughout your career, uh, you know, it's blue moon is so
16:10unlike anything I would have thought for you. It's also something I would never thought for Rick
16:15either. I like, it's like one of the most on Rick movies in many ways. And maybe that's why,
16:20why so it's so special because it was, it was so surprising for the, for the both of you and
16:25also
16:25had some great, uh, actors in it as well. Andrew Scott and Margaret Qualley. Um, but what, what will
16:31you remember fondly, uh, most about, about playing Lorenz Hart and what is it that has stayed with you
16:38after you wrapped? There's a certain, uh, thing I don't understand, but sometimes it happens.
16:50And all the work and craft and stuff goes
16:56into creating these moments where you disappear. And there's this thing where you walk on a red
17:03carpet and you do this, and people think acting is about like going to award shows or something.
17:08And it is, cause that's, it gets a lot of press and the industry needs it. We need it. We
17:14need it.
17:15But it, so it almost seems like it's a celebration of personality. And the thing that moves me the
17:21most is every now and then you do all this work and all this rehearsal and all this prep,
17:26and then you go to set and you disappear. And then you, all of a sudden it's rap and you're
17:32like,
17:32what happened? How did it go? And that happened a lot on blue moon. You know, there were,
17:39there were, I watched the scene with Andrew Scott and I on the steps and I'm like, when did that
17:45happen? When did we do that? It's almost like you, you give yourself over to a production and then it
17:53becomes its own, it's a collective imagination experiment, you know? And so I remember
18:02Bobby Cannavale's eyes looking at me, encouraging me all the time, telling me I, you know, his
18:07non-verbally saying, you got this and let's keep, let's keep working. You know, cause sometimes you
18:12just get, sometimes you get tired. I was doing pages and pages of dialogue a day and wanting to do
18:18it well. And Bobby was always there for me and Margaret's support and Andrew's support. Their,
18:23their, their eyes, I will remember, um, and the way that they made me feel that like this can be
18:31achieved. And, um, and of course, you know, Rick's unflagging friendship. That's, that's what I take
18:39away. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Yeah. I give a shout out to Rick, but, uh, no, listen, you, you both,
18:44you both deserve it. Uh, Robert Kapilow's nomination for original screenplays, well, very well deserved.
18:50And, uh, listen, enjoy the ride, man. You know, you guys don't have to wait 10 years to make
18:55another one, you know, feel, feel free. You know, I give you permission, but thanks for, uh, sharing
19:01your craft with us and, uh, congratulations on the nomination, man. Uh, appreciate you, Clayton.
19:06Really appreciate you. Thanks. Thanks for all the help you've given me. And, you know, I really,
19:10I'm really grateful.
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