00:00Dan, it's great to have you back with us. Let's just walk through some of these numbers.
00:03The fourth quarter results, your revenue came in just above $170 million.
00:08That was ahead of estimates.
00:09When it comes to your first quarter forecast, your revenue forecast coming in above estimates as well,
00:16and then the year forecast, you see revenue between $732 million to $742 million as well,
00:25so a $10 million range here.
00:26Walk us through what you expect to drive that growth in revenue.
00:32Well, first of all, just to put what we just did in 2025 in perspective,
00:36in the last decade, there has been less than 10 tech companies that have delivered over $500 million of revenue,
00:4250% of revenue growth, and 30% free cash flow margin, and we're like number 10.
00:46So we feel very fortunate to be in such a lead company, and because of our investments in AI,
00:50we've been able to serve 50% more people in 2025 while keeping our care team costs flat.
00:57And on the customer side, we grew our reach to over or about 25 million people across 2,800 clients.
01:03But guess what?
01:04About 90% of Americans still don't have access to a digital physical therapy solution.
01:08So we're just getting started.
01:09It was a hell of a year, one for the record books.
01:12And, you know, what's ahead?
01:13You know, in 2026, you know, we feel like we are executing on a generational opportunity
01:18to automate the world's largest services industry, which is healthcare.
01:23We're approaching $600 million of revenue for a U.S. PT market valued at $60 billion.
01:28So we're just getting started in our core product, but we didn't come this far in automating PT to stop
01:33at PT.
01:33So even at, you know, $60 billion, PT is just 1% of U.S. healthcare spend.
01:39So we're hard at work at developing our next product to automate another slice of healthcare.
01:42You know, we see this as a multi-decade journey, and 2026 is just another step on that journey.
01:47Well, let's talk about AI, and there's a few different ways to get into it, of course.
01:51You think about what AI has done to software stocks over the past couple of weeks.
01:56You could make the case that Hinge's stock has also been caught up in that.
02:00And there's that existential threat, right, or that concern that AI is sort of going to really challenge the business
02:06models of a lot of software companies.
02:09And, Dan, I'm curious to hear, you know, how you're thinking about that and how you plan to maybe future
02:15-proof Hinge Health here.
02:17Great question, Katie.
02:18Look, since our founding, we've always had potential new entrant threats.
02:22You know, large tech companies, incumbent healthcare companies who are very, very large, or new startups.
02:27But we've thwarted those and thrived for over 11 years because our competitive advantages go well beyond just a code
02:32base.
02:33So, first of all, our proprietary data, even if OpenAI and Gemini scrape the entire Internet, they haven't conducted 100
02:40million treatment sessions like we have.
02:41Simply put, we might have the most granular data set for musculoskeletal conditions in the entire world.
02:46Now, second is our distribution channels.
02:48We've spent a decade building deep relationships with health plans, PBMs, employers.
02:53That requires not just work on our end, but substantial work on their end.
02:56Thirdly, our product experience extends well beyond software to include hardware and in-person care as well.
03:03And when it comes to automating healthcare, you won't be able to do it with software alone.
03:06You're going to need hardware and in-person care.
03:08And, fourthly, our clinical validation.
03:10You could build some apps in a day or a week, but to bring to market several two-year studies
03:17validating clinical and financial outcomes,
03:19each still takes two years, no matter how much AI you have.
03:22And so, healthcare is very much a trust and reputation business.
03:24Well, it's interesting.
03:25I mean, if I take a look at your stock, you went public in May, of course, and you've kind
03:32of been on a round trip.
03:33You briefly traded below your IPO price.
03:36I have to imagine that, you know, if these after-hour gains stick, that you'll be back above that.
03:41But what do you think the market is missing specifically about your story, you know,
03:46bearing in mind that there are some sector-wide factors here as well?
03:50Yeah, look, I don't know how all of the IPOs are performing from 2025.
03:54Last I looked, I think we were still, despite our round trip, the fourth-best-performing IPO of 2025, or
04:00tech IPOs.
04:01So, it's been a pretty tough year for tech IPOs.
04:03But there's vanishingly few tech companies with over $500 million of revenue, 50% revenue growth, and 30% free
04:10cash flow margin.
04:11And as the Oracle of Omaha said, you know, in the short term, the market is a voting machine, but
04:15the long term, it's a weighing machine.
04:16So, we're going to stay focused on delivering exceptional numbers.
04:20And in the long term, I think the market's going to catch up.
04:22And, Dan, we don't have much time left, but I do want to check in.
04:25When it comes to breakeven profitability, you know, the expectation was that 2026 was going to be the year.
04:32Is that still your expectation?
04:34Well, look, when we IPO'd, we gave a long-term model that said, you know, our aspiration was 30%
04:41free cash flow margin and 25% operating margin.
04:43We've already hit, within nine months, our long-term free cash flow margin of 30%, which is pretty damn fast
04:49relative to other IPO companies.
04:50And we're at 20% non-GAAP operating margin in 2025.
04:54And it was a 28% non-GAAP operating margin in Q4.
04:57So, there's, you know, funky things with stock-based comp, but we are committed to GAAP profitability, so inclusive of
05:03stock-based comp.
05:04And our aim is to be GAAP profitable in the years ahead.
05:08But we're already on a non-GAAP basis.
05:09We're already, you know, strongly profitable.
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