00:00What brings you to the World Government Summit?
00:03In short, of course, it's an invitation.
00:05We're all invited here, but it is pretty spectacular, I have to say.
00:08The people that you meet here, for us there's a special occasion
00:12because we also just announced flying to Dubai.
00:15We will start our operation to Dubai as of October.
00:17So it's great to meet clients, to meet, of course, with travel agencies,
00:21to meet with lots of people that will use our flights.
00:24But the World Government Summit in itself is just...
00:26I find it spectacular what they brought together here.
00:28You're talking about opening up in the region.
00:31You're obviously also in the midst of being purchased.
00:33How's that deal going?
00:35Yeah, so good, I think, in essence.
00:39We expect to get regulatory approval in the second half of the year.
00:43Look, people that will know me a bit better than you do
00:46know that I'm always a bit impatient.
00:47So it's a slow process.
00:50I think Europe as a whole and the European Commission really,
00:52they do take their time.
00:54But we do expect in the second half of this year to get approval.
00:56From the European Commission's perspective,
00:58obviously they've got to do their due diligence
01:00and all the usual compliance elements.
01:02But from your own perspective, with your business solely in mind,
01:06would a kind of a loosening or relaxing of some of the procedural elements
01:12help you and certainly other businesses with transitions?
01:15Yeah, I'm not even sure whether it's loosening.
01:18I'm very okay with, of course, people following indeed a due diligence process.
01:21That's not a problem.
01:22I think speed, right?
01:24And speed, of course, is of the essence certainly for businesses.
01:26And so now we cannot proceed with many things that we would like to proceed on.
01:31And we would like to have access to, for instance, joint ventures with Delta
01:35and France KLM and other airlines in the world.
01:38And that is now being held back.
01:40So, of course, the faster we can move, the more benefits we can immediately give to consumers,
01:46bring to consumers.
01:47And that is what we, in the end, are in business for.
01:49And that is a bit paused at the moment.
01:51So, yes, absolutely, the faster the better.
01:54And talk about speed.
01:56This region is growing.
01:58You're announcing new deals to come to the region.
02:01How important is the Middle East and your future plans?
02:04And also, looking at the current geopolitical situation,
02:08how much is that impacting your desire for growth?
02:10Yeah, no, very much.
02:11I mean, and again, you can see it.
02:13You can feel it always here, right?
02:14I mean, I've lived in the region for a couple of years.
02:17And it's that, I think it's a combination of almost social ambition levels
02:21and then, of course, having the resources,
02:23but also the vision very much to drive towards the execution on that vision.
02:28So, I'm always, yeah, impressed with what we see in the region here.
02:33We have, indeed, announced Dubai.
02:35We have recently started flying to Tel Aviv.
02:39We have increased our flights into Beirut.
02:42And hopefully, really, more to come.
02:43I don't think that this is the last that you'll see from us in the region.
02:47Talking about the region, we've been discussing AI.
02:50It's been a hot topic here today at the World Government Summit.
02:52How do you see AI and its role in airlines?
02:57Not just yours, but the industry moving forward.
02:59Yeah.
02:59Yeah, so, look, it's not just a buzzword, but I do think...
03:04We spent quite some time with my executive team last year
03:07really figuring out what is this, right?
03:09Where can we take this?
03:10Lots of external people coming into our executive team,
03:12and we're talking about the possibilities.
03:15We've identified for ourselves at least five big bets, as we call them.
03:19Five AI bets.
03:20And, again, very much, I think, towards the consumer, right?
03:23How can a consumer benefit from all of this?
03:25So, disruption management.
03:27Hey, we're Scandinavian Airlines.
03:29So, occasionally, we get hit by real snowstorms, right?
03:32Something that you really won't experience here.
03:35And then, let's say, right, it's 100 cancellations a day.
03:38You've got aircraft, crew, pilots, everything all over the place.
03:42How do you put that puzzle back together, for instance?
03:45And we believe that AI will work through those variables infinitely better than a human being can, right?
03:52Or than a group of human beings.
03:53So, that is, for instance, one of those big bets.
03:56How do we deal with disruption management?
03:59And, yeah, when you have everything up in the air, and how can you put it back together?
04:03So, you see AI more functionally in terms of troubleshooting and helping from a logistical and management perspective,
04:10rather than operationally, with regards to, I know, regionally, they're looking at flying taxis and other things.
04:15We're quite some time away from planes flying themselves.
04:19Yeah, yeah, no.
04:21Look, let's, in a way, run, right, already, before we can really do all sorts of spectacular other things.
04:28Some of walking, I think, is behind this.
04:30I think we're really going now into a phase of running.
04:32But we do all sorts of things.
04:34But, indeed, autonomous flying, I'll stand corrected, but I don't think we'll see this on big aircrafts,
04:42but the ones that we're using in my professional lifetime.
04:44I think that's going to take a while.
04:46But we can do so much, right, better forecasting, whether that is in revenue management,
04:50but even water forecasting, right, water management and waste management on more of an aircraft.
04:55How do you better forecast that, which brings weight down, which, of course, then brings fuel prices,
05:00or fuel down, fuel usage down.
05:02And so, one of the big bets is actually that AI will program for us, right?
05:08How can you do coding and programming, the easiest levels of programming and coding already,
05:14through AI, rather than having people do it for you?
05:17So, yeah, I think there's plenty of opportunities, really, in the business.
05:20And many of them will be supporting customers, like that disruption management, for instance.
05:25So, it sounds like AI, from your perspective, is going to help from a functionality perspective,
05:30efficiencies, helping your performance and continuing to improve, but also, perhaps,
05:36helping the bottom line from a financial perspective as well.
05:39Yeah, absolutely.
05:40Yeah, I mean, look, disruption management is, of course, number one.
05:43It is a disruptor for our passengers, but also for ourselves, right?
05:48When you have tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of passengers out of place,
05:52and all those variables that I mentioned before, aircraft, crew, pilots, everywhere,
05:56how do you put that piece together, that puzzle back together, more quickly, more efficiently,
06:02that will ultimately drive, right, benefits for us as well on our bottom line, right?
06:07Fewer passengers in hotels, passengers on their way again, crew in the right position, aircraft,
06:12and next day already in the next position, rather than maybe two, three days.
06:15That is, of course, a benefit to us.
06:17So, yeah, no, we're quite hopeful, but I always, I am, I think, in my drive with my executive team,
06:24quite practical, right?
06:26It just needs to be, how can we solve current problems that we collectively, as human beings,
06:31aren't smart enough to solve, and can we then, through the use of AI, solve our problems?
06:37Talking about your executive team, obviously, we mentioned the fact that you're in the process of being sold.
06:42You know, your performance generally has been exceptional.
06:44Where do you see the future for your airline?
06:46Yeah, no, I actually, and we've been saying this all along in Scandinavia, of course, as well,
06:51because there is some question mark around, well, what will happen to the brand?
06:55Look, the brand will absolutely survive this. The brand will be very strong.
06:59When you look at the Air France KLM growth potential, very limited in their hubs,
07:05and you could even argue that KLM and Amsterdam Schiphol Airport is completely full to capacity.
07:10So, I believe that for Scandinavia as a whole, Copenhagen is our main hub,
07:16but certainly SAS then as an airline within the group, I believe there will be real, real growth potential,
07:22and you'll see more of SAS in the future than what you're seeing today.
07:27Talk about very positive things in the future and the growth, but what challenges may not just your airline,
07:33but airlines in general face in the coming years?
07:36Obviously, we talked earlier about the regional instability, the question marks certain European carriers perhaps postponing or temporarily cancelling flights.
07:44What do you think are going to be the kind of four things we need to watch for in the
07:49coming two years from a general airline perspective?
07:52Well, I mean, look, it's the airline business. Things happen, right?
07:56I'm now 26 years, I think, in this industry, and I've had my fair share of SARS and MERS and
08:02financial crisis and, of course, COVID.
08:06So, something will always happen and it will always be something that you don't expect, right?
08:10But the usual suspects, currency fluctuations, oil, right, fuel prices were, of course, glued to our monitors this week as
08:19well and to the news.
08:20What is happening in the region? What's happening, of course, in the relationships between the United States and Iran?
08:27And there with, right, what kind of impact on fuel will that have?
08:32And then there's always demand as a whole, right? We've seen it in COVID.
08:38Without demand, you can't do anything, right? No, really, really.
08:41So, there will always be, yeah, things happening in the world.
08:45And I'm on purpose being vague here because we don't even know what it is.
08:49I mean, it's only six years ago that we shut airspace completely for COVID.
08:54That's not a long time ago, right? So, something will inevitably happen.
08:57And then, yeah, I think there's opportunities as well for the rounds of consolidation in Europe, definitely.
09:05AI, as we've discussed, I think plenty of ground for optimism as well.
09:10They're about how can it drive further margin expansion for our businesses.
09:13And finally, of course, we're here at the World Government Summit.
09:16We've got European leaders, leaders from across the world.
09:19What's your message to them over the next couple of days?
09:22Yeah, I think maybe not so much for them because I think over here, once more, I really...
09:29There's always a different buzz. There's a different speed here anyway.
09:33But to Europe, I am definitely in the camp of Europe needs to move faster.
09:39It needs to have more of a vision.
09:41I'm not overly critical in the sense that everything is bad in Europe.
09:44But clearly, really, it isn't.
09:46But I think lowering the red tape, lowering requirements, regulatory requirements,
09:54speed back in the game, and maybe a bit more of a...
09:58I don't know whether it's fascination for or whether it's appreciation of,
10:04but entrepreneurs, people that really create and really drive something.
10:08I do find the hunger in this part of the world always exciting.
10:14And I think Europe has lost or missed out on some of that.
10:18And perhaps these couple of days is a chance to rediscover it.
10:21Thank you so much for your time this afternoon.
10:23Much appreciated.
10:23Thank you for having me. Thank you.
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