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00:00Hey everyone, welcome to the It's Her Time to Shine panel here at Essence Fest.
00:07My name is Ashley Mackey, I'm a reporter with ABC7 in Los Angeles.
00:12And I am so proud and honored to be joined by Monica McNutt,
00:17basketball analyst and commentator for ESPN.
00:22That's right, round of applause.
00:24And Ari Chambers, commentator for ESPN and Anscape.
00:30And we're back.
00:32And we are here to talk about one of my favorite subjects, women's sports.
00:39So growth in media coverage, viewership and revenue,
00:45Kaitlyn Clark, Juju Watkins, Paige Beckers, Angel Reese,
00:48these all have become household names, right?
00:51So we see the growth.
00:53One of my favorite stats is women's sports are outpacing men in growth.
00:58In 2024, the NCAA Women's Championship game shattered records with over 24 million viewers,
01:05more than the men for the first time ever.
01:08How does it feel to be in the space where we're seeing and witnessing that growth in real time?
01:14Yeah, I mean, it's a blessing to be a part of the machine that can push these women forward
01:18so that we do have household names, but we have the responsibility to facilitate more conversation
01:22around the entire landscape of women's sports so that we can name all 156 in the WNBA,
01:28so we can be familiar with different sports in general.
01:32Women's sports is on the rise, and it's not by coincidence.
01:35We now have the privilege of being able to view it.
01:39It's easy to access.
01:41It's easy to consume.
01:43And we have a general understanding as a generation that women belong here.
01:46So our fight has changed from getting it on TV to now the storytelling behind it,
01:52and it's just a privilege to be a part of that.
01:54Yeah, I love that.
01:57I think, too, Ashley, it's not a morality thing.
02:03It's a sport thing.
02:05Period.
02:06And if you can appreciate competition and you appreciate folks achieving at a higher level
02:10and putting their best forward and be inspired by their stories,
02:15I love where we are, and I love the conversations that have come out of it.
02:18But, like, for example, my sport is basketball.
02:21If you can hoop, you can hoop.
02:22And that's it for me.
02:25So I'm encouraged about the trend.
02:27I think it's more than a trend.
02:29We both very much see it as momentum and not just a one-time movement.
02:32And, Ashley, before, listen, these kids are coming up in a time
02:35where the social media has been, like, prominent since elementary school,
02:38so they knew that, like, if you get trainers and you get better,
02:41you get a better following, okay?
02:42So the skills, just the game itself has advanced so much,
02:46and it has commercial value because we consume it all the time,
02:50and their skills match.
02:51Yeah.
02:52Talk about how, and that segues to my next question,
02:55talk about how the fan engagement has really contributed to that growth.
03:00Well, I will say that is...
03:03Let's go high.
03:06Let's go Michelle Obama high on that.
03:09That is unique in a way to women's sports because fans of women's sport,
03:14before the mainstream acceleration, which we love, were used to going and connecting with their favorite players high and low.
03:22Social media allowed them easier access to do that as opposed to finding the 112 channel on the cable package
03:29or adding this random streaming package so that they could watch the game.
03:32And so there is a connection there that I think is really unique to women's sport,
03:35but even that continues to evolve.
03:37I do think that the opportunity to get to know these players and tell their stories beyond the sport in which they excel,
03:43while the sport is fantastic, we all know that to a degree, your favorite players sometimes become your favorite players
03:49more than just the moments that they created, but the points where they were able to resonate with you.
03:53And social media has allowed these women to take full advantage of their platform
03:57because the women's, the length, the lifespan, I should say, of a female athlete often tends to be shorter than men,
04:05particularly for women coming out of college and looking to go on pro.
04:08And so for them, it's about being almost businesswomen, right?
04:11How can I continue to grow and expose myself, whether I want to go on to be elite social media status,
04:17influencer person, or parlay this into a different type of career?
04:20And you almost had to, right?
04:21You almost had to, to compensate for the lifestyle that you want
04:24because we're still working toward getting the salary, the desired salary.
04:27But the good case studies are like Angel Reese with her podcast.
04:30Stud Buds, Courtney Williams and Natisha Heidemann streaming on Twitch every night,
04:34staying relevant, just staying in front of people.
04:36Dijanae Carrington offering her beauty tips to everybody.
04:39The girlies are active on TikTok, right?
04:41So just a general cognizance of knowing like where I should be in this landscape
04:45to further the parasocial relationships that could be a great or a horrible thing,
04:49you know, whatever, it's whatever your cup of tea is.
04:51But they know that they have to do that at this point.
04:54And do you feel like the NIL agreement has played a role in that?
04:58Because now we're seeing...
04:59No, we weren't making millions.
05:00No chance.
05:02No chance.
05:02We're seeing Juju on State Farm commercials.
05:04As she should.
05:05So that has also, I feel like, contributed to making those names more household
05:11and getting more exposure and growth to different sports.
05:15I mean, the more I see somebody on my screen, the more I'm like,
05:18I know who they are.
05:19Yeah, exactly.
05:20Like, Juju's everywhere.
05:21You have different girlies everywhere.
05:24And then what's dope about it is when they get put on, they put on their people.
05:27Yeah.
05:28And I love that.
05:28I love that.
05:29Have all the girlies on, all the commercials, okay?
05:31Yeah.
05:31NIL has been really unique in that you have an opportunity to start building
05:36or at least padding away, right?
05:38If you have four years to capitalize,
05:40and maybe you're not the highest earners who are seven-figure earners,
05:43but you got enough to walk away from school without debt
05:45and a little money in the bank in terms of going on and maybe trying to buy property
05:49or just have a little bit of cushion,
05:51which we know in society at large is so hard to get.
05:53And it's dope because you can establish the partnerships when you're younger
05:56so that you can have a long-term partnership.
05:58It's not just these one-off deals, right?
06:00So, like, athletes are getting acquainted with the clients
06:03that they would be working with on the pro level
06:05and just can do long-term partnerships with them.
06:08And, Ari, I love how you brought up other sports, too,
06:10because it's not just basketball that's getting more softball.
06:14We're seeing more gymnastics on television.
06:18How do you feel like this is helping all of women's sports?
06:22Especially in the case of gymnastics, there's no pro league for gymnastics.
06:25So the gymnasts are burdened with the fact that they have to go into a professional setting
06:29directly after college unless you're Jordan Childs, right?
06:31So, like, you just have to set yourself up for the win.
06:34We see case studies like Libby Dunn understanding her audience
06:38and being able to capitalize off that.
06:39We have cases like Jordan Childs, who's currently on a world tour, still in college,
06:43but on a world tour.
06:45You have to establish a foundation for yourself.
06:47Softball makes significantly less money than basketball.
06:50That is just the facts.
06:51I know somebody, this was, like, six years ago,
06:53so I'm sure their predicament has changed, but they made $5,000 a season.
06:57That's not sustainable.
06:58So NIL allows you the opportunity to raise the capital while you're still playing,
07:02while you're still active, and learning how to be a businesswoman behind it all.
07:08Okay, so just to switch gears just a little bit,
07:11I love personally seeing how these female athletes are coming up
07:15and prioritizing mental health.
07:17We're seeing it in tennis.
07:18We're seeing it in gymnastics.
07:19We're seeing it in basketball.
07:21What's that like for you guys witnessing that?
07:23I think in general, in sport, we're at a place where we're having conversations
07:29about the holistic approach, right?
07:32Like, these athletes as whole beings, not just elite performers.
07:35I think that is especially unique when you talk about women,
07:38because women bear children, right?
07:40Like, and that is a whole other layer, frankly, in CBA negotiations,
07:44like the whole bit.
07:45But I think it's really cool, and I think it has forced leadership
07:48to be more mindful of providing resources, of being able to create spaces
07:52that are safe for the athletes, both to compete at a high level,
07:55but to say, hey, I'm having a rough time.
07:57And so I think that is a level of courage that we should really appreciate,
08:01and hopefully it only continues to progress.
08:03The thing about fandom is you can't guarantee that everybody's played sports, right?
08:08And so there's a whole group of people that don't understand the complexities
08:12around your mental health and how it directly translates to performance.
08:16And so I'm glad we're normalizing, tending to your mental health,
08:19training it as a muscle just as much as physical,
08:22so these athletes can go and perform to the best of their abilities as well.
08:26It's beyond what you can physically do.
08:28You need it to happen with your mental.
08:30Okay, so the stories are out there.
08:32They're stronger than ever.
08:34But now it's about amplifying those stories and voices,
08:37and that's what you guys do on Vibe Check.
08:40Monica, so tell me about it.
08:43What's the vibe?
08:44What is the vibe?
08:46Well, Vibe Check is a really cool project,
08:48and we're so thankful to ESPN, Disney, our sort of captains in the effort,
08:54Elle Duck and Andrea Cardin, Jhenea Gumuke.
08:56Like, it is about sport, again, right?
09:00But just different voices, different perspectives.
09:02And when I say different, I just mean female.
09:05And there are plenty of women that commentate on sports,
09:07but I think the opportunity to have a show that is truly led by our voices,
09:11I can't tell you the number of times that I look at my male colleagues in the green room,
09:15and I'm like, I love doing shows with men.
09:17You know I said exactly what you said, and then you said it after me.
09:20And so there's a sense of camaraderie in terms of all being able to really relate to what it took to get to such a show.
09:29And I take nothing away from our male colleagues.
09:31I've been fortunate to work with, I think Ari has as well,
09:33to work with some really great men along the way.
09:35But this is really cool, because it is our safe space in many ways.
09:41And it's fun, right?
09:43Like, when we were on the show on Wednesday, we started with Jump In, Jump Out.
09:47And it's just something that we would only know to do.
09:49And it's just a literal vibe.
09:52We have couches, y'all.
09:53We did a manifestation board in the middle of the show.
09:55Where else can you find fun, like, levity and everything?
09:59But vibe check, so I love it.
10:01And Ari, talk a little bit about Anscape and how you guys are bringing these stories to the forefront
10:08and amplifying these voices.
10:11Anscape is the creator studio, black content creator studio.
10:15We lend a mind to black voices and share our experiences through sport and culture.
10:21And it allows us a longer runway to cover the entire landscape of everything black.
10:27But it's for everyone.
10:28So if you want the black perspective, but for everyone, that's what Anscape allows.
10:33It just leans into more creativity and more space to storytell.
10:39Why is that important?
10:40I mean, we're sitting here at S&S.
10:41That's why black people are here.
10:42No, I'm just kidding.
10:44No, because the black perspective and the black experience is so unique to the space.
10:50And it's often overlooked because we have to conform to a more rigid pathway to storytelling traditionally.
10:57So Anscape allows the freedom to express, the freedom to showcase the dynamic journey of each black experience because it's not monolithic.
11:07So as vibe check has all women's voices, Anscape has all black voices.
11:12And historically, we haven't had the freedom to tell it our way.
11:17And so Anscape allows it to tell it our way.
11:20And I love that you started off with, it is black voices, but it's for everybody.
11:24It's important that everybody hears these stories.
11:28Okay, so what's next?
11:30We are seeing all the growth.
11:32How do we keep this growth going?
11:34How do we keep the ball rolling, for lack of a better sports pun?
11:37I think keep pushing the envelope.
11:42Yes, ball is ball, but we have the responsibility.
11:45Lord, we tired, but you know, we're doing it.
11:47To make sure that we stay intentional with the storytelling, make sure we stay fair and spread the wealth to everybody.
11:57I think that the more times we have the opportunity to tell the stories, the more chances that fans can fall in love with a wider audience, a wider scope of athletes.
12:09So that's our responsibility right now.
12:11And so the next step is to continue to do that.
12:13And Monica, ESPN is the leader, industry leader, right?
12:17So how does ESPN keep pushing the envelope?
12:21Girl.
12:23Oh, no.
12:26Girl.
12:27Listen, I think ESPN has done a good job, and that is my employer, and I'm proud of it.
12:34But it doesn't mean that there's not room to grow, right?
12:37And I think to Ari's point, and I get it.
12:39Like, I totally get it.
12:40I have sat in meetings.
12:41I've been a part of conversations.
12:43There's this battle of, like, ratings and conversation and which comes first.
12:46And, like, at the end of the day, as a company, we're tasked with making money.
12:49And so to Ari's point, when you have an opportunity to spread the seeds of interest wider than maybe the top few names,
12:57who you know are going to rate, like, we cherish those opportunities.
13:01But I think ESPN's commitment to women's sports is sincere and true.
13:04I mean, they've had the women's NCAA tournament for going on two decades now.
13:08Like, they have given us some of the staples in terms of journalists that have covered women's sports and covered it for a long time and covered the sport well.
13:16It has allowed us, many of us, to become friends beyond just being colleagues.
13:19And so I'm very thankful for that.
13:20I think they are mindful of the landscape and of the topics changing, acknowledging diverse experiences, not just limited to race, but also identities.
13:33And they are very mindful to have those conversations with the programs that we cover at large, with us as broadcasters,
13:40so that we continue to tell these stories in a respectful way that also educates and entertains.
13:44I love that you said sisterhood, and I know I like to make things mushy at my Pisces.
13:48That's what I do.
13:48But you can't fake the chemistry that we all have, especially on the women's sports side.
13:52It's very unique.
13:53You know, we've been in other networks, and, yes, I like the people that I work with,
13:57but I truly love everybody I work with at ESPN Talent Facing.
14:01And so, like, that chemistry shows on screen, and I hope that you see the infectious energy between us go to you,
14:08and we break that screen.
14:09We break that, what is it?
14:10The third wall.
14:11Third wall, thank you.
14:12The wall, the third wall.
14:13Yeah, I think the whole point is, well, I've heard a lot of people describe this,
14:18the growth or the surge of women's sports as a wave, and I feel like we don't want it to be a wave
14:24because a wave implies that it ends somewhere, right?
14:27Like, we want to keep this going.
14:29So what can people do or other companies do to keep this going, to keep pushing, to keep?
14:35Honestly, Ashley, I think you see it starting to be done.
14:37For example, just the WNBA contracts or the TV contracts for the next few years, right?
14:42While ESPN has been a leader, two years ago, when was the Final Four in Dallas?
14:45Two years ago or three, though?
14:46Two years ago, yeah.
14:47Two years ago when the Final Four was in Dallas, I remember sitting with South Carolina and Don Staley,
14:51and she's like, look, I love what ESPN has built, but competition for who wants to show women's games
14:57is healthy for the growth of the sport at large, right?
14:59And so we'll have the finals this year, but I think NBC, Amazon, CBS, everybody getting in on the women's package
15:06and raising the numbers.
15:07Like we talked about at the end of the day, this stuff does come back down to money.
15:11Raising the value, raising the numbers.
15:13We see the WNBA expanding.
15:15We've got women's professional volleyball on television.
15:17There's professional softball leagues popping up.
15:19Like, we just had that wonderful event for Faith trying to break the mile mark for a women's runner.
15:23Like, I think part of the growth is companies investing.
15:26And again, not because you've got some morality clause, because it's not just morality at this point.
15:31It's good business, right?
15:33So I think the investments from companies, but then from fans, like, watch, right?
15:37When you watch, the ratings go up.
15:38They're tracking that.
15:39Watch, engage, all of the things that you do when it comes to your favorite sports in general,
15:44apply that to women's sports.
15:45And I typically approach things in a little bit more pessimistic, protective lens,
15:50but I would just say trust the eyes that are on it.
15:54This is not a one-off.
15:57People's interest in women's sports right now is something, like, I've never seen before.
16:00I've been in this over a decade, and there's something different about this time.
16:05And I don't know if that's because the product is better.
16:08I don't know if that's because players are really focusing on their personal brands
16:13and, like, appealing and know that they have to be that business.
16:16But you have to trust the eyes that are on it and not tread so timidly to push the names.
16:22We are the machine.
16:23I want every network to know that we are the machine that can push these names,
16:26and the player marketability is many times based on us.
16:31So if we want it to continue to grow, we have to continue to invest in it,
16:34and the return on investment is there.
16:36It's written in ink.
16:38Numbers talk.
16:39The numbers are here.
16:40And women in sports, I love that we're not just seeing that growth, like, on the court or on the field.
16:47We're also seeing more women in leadership in sports, behind the scenes, in marketing, all of these things.
16:54Why is that important?
16:55Well, the research bears out that when you look at your C-suite women, your high earners, there's a connection to sport at some point in their career.
17:06And I think for both of us, it's why we're so passionate about encouraging young women to stay in sports.
17:11You might not go on to be a professional at whatever level.
17:14You might not even go on to play D1 basketball.
17:16But there is a correlation to success, particularly for women, from the things that you learn by competing, right?
17:22Your ability to be resilient and to bounce back, your ability to develop teamwork, to take criticism, to give criticism, all of those things, problem solving, all of those things.
17:31And so there's a real tie to the opportunity that sport allows, even break down, let it be all the way broke,
17:37like just to the confidence of being able to navigate everyday life.
17:40So I think when you look at the opportunity of sport, we say about the W, pick a city and pull up.
17:46But in the same way, in your local city, like pick a high school, pick an organization and pull up, right?
17:53Just to be a part of the community, to be a part of building confident members of society moving forward.
17:58Let's be very clear.
17:58I know your question.
17:59This has nothing to do with your question.
18:01But if you do want to have sports coverage, don't wait for a major network to do it.
18:05We all have the power in our phones.
18:06So anybody young out there who, or at any age, honestly, who wants to do sports broadcasts, you have every tool that you need on your phone.
18:14You do not have to wait for an ESPN, a CBS, a NBC, none of that.
18:18You don't have to wait for any of that in order to tell the stories.
18:21We have the power.
18:23Yes, I love that.
18:23And I love seeing you guys on TV, honestly, because I got my broadcast journalism degree from Montana.
18:30Not too many of us.
18:32So I love seeing more people who look like me on screen, you know, because they say if you see it, you can be.
18:39100%.
18:39Absolutely.
18:40So at the beginning, I said sponsorship revenue was on the rise, but women's sports still gets less than 1% of total sports sponsorship dollars worldwide.
18:52How do we fix this?
18:53You know, I'm a creative.
18:58Anyway, I'm just kidding.
19:00No, I just think that at the end of the day, a business is a business.
19:04And right now we're at a pivotal moment because the interest is there, which is generating revenue.
19:10So it's a matter of if you're in the rooms pitching women's sports, making sure you're intentional on, like, having the same discussions about women's sports because you know it's proven to be lucrative.
19:21There are many times where I'm in a room talking to people who have a lot of money that can give to women's sports that just don't know how.
19:29So just continue to make sure people know that it's a space with so much potential that is untapped right now.
19:36So I don't necessarily know the answer because, again, your girls are creative, but I can spread the passion and spread what's going on within the women's sports landscape and letting people know that the cost of inaction is indeed greater than the risk.
19:50And women's sports valuation is over a billion going into next year.
19:54So there's so much room for growth and opportunity there.
19:58That stat always shocks me because I'm like, God, it's just so much money out there if you know how to get to it.
20:03But I think it dovetails nicely into your previous question.
20:05Who is deciding where this money is going?
20:08Who is in those boardrooms, right?
20:10And so this idea of the cycle of a woman in sports life, even if you don't go on to be a pro or high D1, if you were competed through high school,
20:23the likelihood that you go on and have the confidence and the fortitude to navigate and find your way into some of those boardrooms, right,
20:30like it increases just based on the stats.
20:32Now I get it, that's super sort of utopian when you look at it at large.
20:36But I also say, and I know this isn't necessarily the most popular answer, men's sports has been around and established for so much longer than women's sports.
20:44So part of it is you just have to keep taking one step and putting it in front of the other, giving it a little bit of time.
20:49Literally, if you look at the W, the NBA has 50 years on the W, and that's a long time, right, of institutionalized mindset.
20:56And so I think, again, the more fans watch, the more fans engage, the more we demand, the more that companies are like, hey, wait a minute.
21:04This is a business investment, and those numbers can start to tilt.
21:07Well, that was going to be my next question.
21:10We've already touched on it a little bit.
21:12But how can people watching, how can, like, you mentioned there's money out there, but they don't know how to help or contribute.
21:21Like, how can people continue to help women's sports rise?
21:25Continue to talk about it.
21:26I'm always going to resort to social media, post about it, talk about it, generate the interest.
21:30A lot of times people are like, I don't know where to find it.
21:32I promise y'all, if you just Google games for the day, it's right there.
21:36So, like, let's remove this narrative of it's hard to find and just do the research.
21:41And when I say do the research, I literally mean typing in WNBA games for the day, softball games for the day.
21:47It comes up.
21:48Google's a great person to, like, or a person, company to just give you the answers.
21:52I promise y'all, we're capable.
21:54That WNBA league pass is, like, 25 bucks.
21:56Yeah, like, for the whole season.
21:58Not that expensive.
21:58There's games and content right there, right there.
22:00Yeah, I agree.
22:02Like, engage.
22:03I mean, that's a huge thing from fans.
22:05And engage at every level, like, where you have the bandwidth.
22:08I just can't.
22:09I can remember flitting around the country to play in AAU tournaments and how important that was to my journey.
22:16But, like, to go to an arena or a gym and there are fans there cheering on women's sports, like, what that does for the ecosystem of women's sports at large is huge, yes.
22:25But also, like, just watch.
22:26Engage.
22:26Go to a game.
22:27Pick a city and pull up.
22:28We say that all the time.
22:29Pick a city and pull up, honey.
22:31I love that.
22:33Okay, so final thoughts.
22:34What's it been like for you guys to be in this moment where we're seeing all this surge from women's sports?
22:40I would say rewarding.
22:44But I just need a couple more years to make sure that it won't be fleeting.
22:48And I am standing ten toes down in the fact that it won't get away from us.
22:54But, again, when you are on the front lines of fighting for something, and I know Monica said it's not a morality clause.
23:00It's not.
23:00But when you've been on the front lines beating these doors down, you develop a fatigue and a bruising.
23:07Yeah.
23:07And I just want the bruises to heal and so we can enjoy the moment that we're in.
23:12That's where, like, candidly, that's where I'm at with it.
23:14Um, that's a great question, Ashley.
23:18I think, like Ari said, all of us that have been in it, you approach it with a little bit of trepidation.
23:24Um, I personally have had to sit with, do I want all of this attention?
23:33Because for us that have been near and dear to it, and I have talked with reporters about this, I've been present for it.
23:41You walk away from a press conference at a women's college basketball game or the WNBA and the team and coaches are like, thank you for coming.
23:48That's not the ecosystem on the men's side because when the columnists write about the men, it's not always glamorous and all of that.
23:56And so I think with this rise has come an underbelly that honestly smacked me in the face because I was, I was like, whoa, what's happening?
24:04Like, not my precious little bubble of women's sports.
24:07Like, what is happening?
24:08Um, and so I really have had to relish with, like, do I want to be a part of conversations pitting two of my favorite women's players against one another on a first take?
24:15Like, that's the nature of the show, and it signifies the growth of the game, but it has also come, um, with some sacrifices, I guess, if you will, those words.
24:25And so I have decided that we're going to keep rolling and keep pushing and take advantage of the opportunities to push the good.
24:30Um, and that you can have a dialogue that includes disagreement in a healthy way, uh, but again, like, the reality of it, as we sit in this beautiful space in New Orleans that celebrates the beauty of blackness, in particular, the beauty of black women, especially in this administration, we got a societal tonal pole.
24:47So there's so much that comes into the conversation of loving and celebrating women's sports that sometimes you're like, what?
24:53Like, can we talk about basketball?
24:55Like, or can we talk about softball, volleyball, whatever it may be?
24:57So it's been a lot.
24:58And so I think to have the sisterhood in terms of how we cover it and to be able to have a vibe check where we can honestly debrief and kind of share that perspective with fans, all of these things are good for the growth.
25:09But I would be lying to you, like Ari said, if it didn't come with some fatigue.
25:12The protectiveness that's required or this is a panel for a different day, but a lot of things are in jeopardy right now with this current administration.
25:22And, um, that's the fight.
25:24That's the fight to make sure girls can play sports, stay in sports.
25:28Uh, title nine is at risk and that will, that will have lasting effects on the professional landscape.
25:35So that's where my eggs are right now, the advocacy and activism behind that before I can enjoy anything that's happening.
25:44Do you feel like that underbelly that both of you guys are talking about, is it more heightened in your opinion in women's sports?
25:53Right now?
25:54Is it more heightened right now?
25:56I think just in general, like, like you said, pitting the two women, the two favorite players against each other.
26:01Do you feel like that also happens on the men's side?
26:04Because, I mean, I think the internet is just a scary place in general, but.
26:07I mean, we're dancing around it.
26:08We don't have to.
26:09The thing that has been rampant and has kind of been, um, disheartening in the women's space is this idea of race, right?
26:16Um, it is not, it just is.
26:18For us as black, it just is.
26:20I walk into a room, I see, okay, this person is that, this person is that, right?
26:23Like, and it has been weaponized in a way where if you acknowledge it, somebody is like, ah, you're racist.
26:34Like, wait a minute, hold up.
26:35I'm just, I'm just stating the obvious of our American society.
26:40And no, I don't want to harp on this, but there are more than one factor at play, right?
26:46And I think, to me, why you connect to a player is very personal.
26:50Players from every part of the world, every race, every ethnicity, every identity can be excellent.
26:56And it's fantastic, and it can all be celebrated.
26:58But I think some of the vitriol that has been targeted, particularly at black players, is crazy.
27:07I mean, yeah, and I, I feel some, not guilt, guilt is the wrong word.
27:12I feel some type of way that we, as talent, can't do, or we do so much to minimize that, that tension.
27:23But it's still not enough because you have people who aren't versed in the women's sports space coming in,
27:28giving expert opinions that aren't experts.
27:30And because there's so many new people, people don't know who to rely on for actual historical context
27:35or who's actually valid in the space.
27:37So that's what we're battling.
27:38We're battling the credibility because there's a whole different...
27:43It's popular now.
27:44Yeah, it's popular.
27:45So you've got to talk about it.
27:46So anybody has an opinion.
27:47Whether you have the credential, exactly.
27:48Anybody has an opinion on it who don't watch the sport, who don't consume anything,
27:53and just can place their opinion and be taken as fact.
27:57And still we rise, though, for the record.
27:59We go high.
28:00We go really high.
28:01Like, I mean, if somebody asked me, would you reverse course and not be here?
28:08No.
28:09I want to be here.
28:10I want to stand in this moment.
28:12I want to be able to talk honestly about it.
28:14I can turn off my notifications because every time I open the app, I didn't say that.
28:18But okay, fine.
28:18I am not reading those.
28:19That's what I had to learn.
28:20I had to learn.
28:20We're not reading comments.
28:22Just turn it off.
28:22We're not reading.
28:23Just turn it off.
28:24Internet is scary.
28:25In some ways, it's the cost of progress, right?
28:27And like I said to you earlier, I'm making right with it personally.
28:33Still sitting with it.
28:34Well.
28:35We got each other now.
28:36Heavy.
28:36We got each other.
28:37We got each other now.
28:38I'm calling money.
28:38I'm like, money.
28:39I'm going crazy here.
28:42Well, obviously.
28:43We could keep going.
28:45We could.
28:45We could have a key.
28:46Truly.
28:46But I think that's a good place to stop it because we will be up here talking about this
28:51all day.
28:51Thank you so much, everybody in the crowd, for listening in on our conversation.
28:58Thank you all.
28:58Thank you, Monica, Ari.
29:03Thanks, y'all.
29:04Y'all been great.
29:05Go to the WNBA game.
29:06Yeah.
29:07Yeah.
29:07We've grown, but we got some more work to do.
29:09Absolutely.
29:10Pick a city and pull up, y'all.
29:12Pull up on that.
29:13Thank you guys for the great conversation.
29:15Enjoy Essence.
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