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00:00:00My therapist always says, take care of little Nia.
00:00:03So when you see this photo of yourself, what feelings do you have?
00:00:23My grandmother was very religious.
00:00:27She made me go to church and Sunday school and Easter speeches and all that.
00:00:32I didn't realize it then.
00:00:33I just went because I was supposed to be going.
00:00:35But it came to some points in my life where a thing just happened that was so real that
00:00:40there was nowhere else to go but with God.
00:00:44What was the activation moment of trauma for you?
00:00:47I think there were several things.
00:00:49I think that the first was being left with a babysitter.
00:00:54There was a woman that was older than me.
00:00:55I mean, it was older and her, you know, touching and doing things to me that don't normally
00:01:03happen to kids.
00:01:04Like molesting.
00:01:05Right, basically.
00:01:06So I was introduced to sex at a very young age.
00:01:09Really young.
00:01:10Yeah.
00:01:11Second thing was that I had this lady that lived next door to us in an apartment.
00:01:15She was married to this guy.
00:01:16They had two kids.
00:01:17Yeah.
00:01:18And he was around my age and I used to hang out with him.
00:01:19And I was there one day and I remember like it was yesterday.
00:01:23They got into an argument.
00:01:24Yeah.
00:01:25And me and the little boys was playing in the room and I heard them, you know, and I
00:01:31heard that saying before, yeah, you wait till I get back.
00:01:33I'll be right back.
00:01:35And I kind of looked at the boys.
00:01:36I'm like, oh, you know, and sure enough, he came running upstairs and he went in the closet.
00:01:42Right.
00:01:42And when he was going in the closet, he was coming through the closet and I saw when he
00:01:46pulled it out, it was like a big, it had to be like a silver 357.
00:01:50Oh my God.
00:01:50And I looked at them and I immediately was like, yo, we got to hide.
00:01:54Yeah.
00:01:55But why did you know to hide?
00:01:57Because I had been around that before growing up.
00:01:59So I went and climbed under the sink in the bathroom and hid.
00:02:07And I heard some yelling and all I heard was.
00:02:10He killed his, the wife?
00:02:12He didn't kill her.
00:02:13He shot her like four times.
00:02:14Oh my God.
00:02:15Right.
00:02:15And he ran, left us there.
00:02:19My mom and dad came looking for me.
00:02:22Eventually, they found me under the sink and the police said everything was there.
00:02:26But I just, you know, they just stuck with me.
00:02:28Right.
00:02:29And before I was eight, I had already accepted this is the norm.
00:02:35Right.
00:02:36I was already desensitized.
00:02:38At eight years old?
00:02:39Yeah.
00:02:40I was already thinking like, okay, this, this is what life is.
00:02:43And it gave me this thing to like, always like protect myself.
00:02:47Right.
00:02:47Yeah.
00:02:48Yeah.
00:02:48Because nothing felt safe.
00:02:50Right.
00:02:50Do you have siblings at this point?
00:02:51My brother died when we was younger.
00:02:53What did it do to your mother?
00:02:55I mean, my mom had a like very toxic relationship.
00:02:57You and your mom?
00:02:58Yes.
00:02:59My sister is my little sister.
00:03:01Yeah.
00:03:02But I call her my little big sister because she's probably the only person that can talk
00:03:06sense into me.
00:03:07My relationship with my father was probably very toxic.
00:03:10Oh, so?
00:03:11Well, because he wasn't there.
00:03:13Okay.
00:03:14I didn't have the example of what a family was supposed to look like.
00:03:18Right.
00:03:19The first thing before you marry someone, it's like, what is his relationship like with
00:03:22his mother?
00:03:23I feel like my mother, it came from her not being raised right.
00:03:29Very violent, very verbal, very cold.
00:03:32I just remember that I was kind of on the outside because I looked so much like my father.
00:03:38They divorced and all I know is my father just told me straight up here, never trust
00:03:42another woman again, which made me go, shit.
00:03:44Well, what was that about?
00:03:45Because whatever happened between them hurt him.
00:03:48So one was not feeling safe and protected when you were molested.
00:03:53Right.
00:03:53Two was a void of love and compassion and acceptance from your mom.
00:03:57Yeah.
00:03:57And then the third one was, okay, now I'm going to completely disconnect from myself
00:04:02here because there is no love here.
00:04:04And I'm going to go to the streets and I'm going to hustle and I'm going to make money
00:04:08and I'm going to prove that I'm worthy of this love and I'm going to be somebody.
00:04:12When I left my mother's house, I had to be around 13, 14 maybe.
00:04:15Yeah.
00:04:16And the reason why I left because she pulled a gun over me.
00:04:18Right.
00:04:18And basically told me like, you know, you're going to either do what I say or I'm going
00:04:23to take you out of this world type thing.
00:04:25I was just like, yo, I'm just going to school.
00:04:26Why was she so hard?
00:04:26I don't really know her father like that.
00:04:29And as I get older, I start to realize that you just never know what somebody went through.
00:04:35You know, one thing I love about my mother, she was spicy.
00:04:38Uh-huh.
00:04:38Like she got a tongue that can cut half the world down.
00:04:43I love it.
00:04:43So I'm raising boys.
00:04:44Right.
00:04:45It's very interesting when you are trying to get that young boy to be a man and to go
00:04:54out into the world.
00:04:55And I would say that I do a good job of being present with them.
00:05:01Right.
00:05:01But then there's that part of me where I'm like, I don't want to raise mama's boys.
00:05:06I got an option to go to this boot camp.
00:05:09And in that camp, I was able to get my GED, learn life skills, and a bunch of different
00:05:14things.
00:05:15It was my first time being pulled away from my environment.
00:05:20Right.
00:05:20So it definitely gave me time to think about, you know, what I wanted to do with my life,
00:05:26where I wanted to go.
00:05:27And it was a different type of experience because it was like a lot of structure, something that
00:05:32I wasn't used to.
00:05:32And it's crazy because I'll never forget it was one of the times that I was there and
00:05:37I was getting ready to get out.
00:05:38But I remember we went on a field trip because it was near water.
00:05:43And I remember just being on a military ship, like, you know, because the waves were crashing
00:05:47against it.
00:05:47I was just like, I don't want to go back home.
00:05:49I might just shit jump.
00:05:52Really?
00:05:53Yeah.
00:05:53And I thought about it a few times.
00:05:56It was surreal.
00:05:57That's probably the only time in my life where I haven't felt that low that I felt like this
00:06:01could be the end for me.
00:06:03Yeah.
00:06:03And, you know, I buckled back down.
00:06:05I came home and I definitely turned my hustle up.
00:06:10Like, I just went about it as a business.
00:06:12And this is around the time that I had my son.
00:06:15And he made me focus on becoming a man.
00:06:21We are born as beings meant to be here to love.
00:06:25That's the crazy thing, though, because as I say here at 46, I can tell you that.
00:06:31Yeah.
00:06:31But I can't honestly tell you that I've experienced love, especially non-conditional.
00:06:37Like, I couldn't tell you that.
00:06:38There was always something to it.
00:06:40Well, maybe you had to get open to it first to heal it, to attract it.
00:06:44Well, I mean, you know, when you're coming up in a family, right, there should be at least
00:06:51a baseline of health and just healthy, you know, just conversation, right?
00:06:57And I can say that I probably got more love in the streets than I did when I was.
00:07:04And that's one of the reasons why I love my grandmother so much, because she was the
00:07:07only person that I can recall.
00:07:10My dad's folks was a little more common.
00:07:13Yeah.
00:07:13My mom's folks, they weren't playing the radio.
00:07:16Is your mom still alive?
00:07:17No, my mom passed.
00:07:18My mom passed during COVID.
00:07:20She had dementia.
00:07:22So my dad, same.
00:07:23Yeah.
00:07:23My dad passed away the day after Kobe Bryant.
00:07:25The crazy thing is when she was there and I was going to visit her.
00:07:30And when she had dementia, it was a little crazy because I couldn't really, because I was
00:07:35trying to get to a space where I can forgive her.
00:07:38I used to try to talk to her.
00:07:40And then, you know, my mom's smart, even if she had dementia.
00:07:43It's like when I started talking about the hard stuff, she started like, you know, acting
00:07:46like she don't really understand what I'm saying.
00:07:48She didn't want to talk about it.
00:07:49She didn't want to talk about it.
00:07:49It was too painful for her.
00:07:51Yeah.
00:07:51You know, I love my mother.
00:07:53You know what I'm saying?
00:07:54Of course you do.
00:07:55And I think I spent most of my life, which is probably one of the reasons why I'm successful.
00:08:00Yeah.
00:08:01It was trying to prove that I'm enough.
00:08:03And every time I got to a milestone, there was no fulfillment there, right?
00:08:10Because she didn't acknowledge it.
00:08:12She didn't acknowledge it.
00:08:13I can't say this.
00:08:30You know, lately I've definitely been on my journey, so I've done a lot of work.
00:08:34One of my uncles just passed.
00:08:36And he's one of my favorite uncles.
00:08:39Everybody who knows my music knows I talk about him.
00:08:41He's my first uncle that gave me $20 and I flipped it a zillion times and that's how I'm here.
00:08:46Yeah.
00:08:46And his name was Bo Slick and he gave me his disability check.
00:08:50He passed last month.
00:08:52Oh, that must have been tough.
00:08:55It's crazy because I went to the funeral home in our hometown and I went and saw him, right?
00:09:05And I hadn't seen him in a while.
00:09:08And he had a smirk on his face and I was like, live is slick.
00:09:11He's still giving him hell.
00:09:12Boy, he think it's funny.
00:09:13Yeah.
00:09:13He go home.
00:09:14But it's crazy because he was laying in the exact same place, the last place I saw my mom.
00:09:18And so on the way back, I tell my driver, I give him an address and I say, yo, take me
00:09:25to this address.
00:09:25And we pull up.
00:09:26It's like an old church.
00:09:28And my sister has it set up nice out there.
00:09:29Well, we set it up nice where my mom's buried.
00:09:32We got like a bench and all these things.
00:09:33She has a crown and stuff.
00:09:35So it's really beautiful.
00:09:36Yeah.
00:09:36And it's peaceful.
00:09:38And I went out there because I had some life changes that was going on.
00:09:41And I just, I wrote her a letter on the way there and I sat down and I read the letter
00:09:46to her.
00:09:46I told her about her new granddaughter, how amazing, beautiful she was.
00:09:51I told her that working on my relationship with my son and we're in a kind of cool place.
00:09:57I told her about my middle daughter and how beautiful she's turning now.
00:10:02I told her about, you know, my life changes and the things that, you know, that I'm concerned
00:10:06about some of my fears, you know what I'm saying?
00:10:08And, you know, and I basically forgave her.
00:10:11Ooh, that's good.
00:10:12And the basis of the letter was to tell her, you know, everything that was going on in
00:10:16my life.
00:10:17And, you know, even if she's not proud, I understand.
00:10:21What did you say in the moment of forgiveness?
00:10:24I understand what it's like to raise a rebellious kid.
00:10:28I understand what it's like to have your own wounds, your work that she need to do.
00:10:34Right.
00:10:34And she didn't get a chance to do that.
00:10:36And I understand that maybe she had a different way of loving me that I didn't understand.
00:10:42Right.
00:10:43And because my mom the type of you, if I go to the basketball court and get jumped, she
00:10:48going to take me around there to fight everybody one on one.
00:10:50Me too.
00:10:50Right.
00:10:51I'm taking my kids too.
00:10:52She's like, come on, him first, him second, him third.
00:10:54And I got your back.
00:10:55Right.
00:10:55And the Vaseline's in the car.
00:10:56And I'm going to take my earrings off.
00:10:58There you go.
00:10:58And let's go.
00:10:59Yeah, that's her.
00:11:00But do you understand that that was her way of loving you?
00:11:04Well, this is what happened.
00:11:06And this is, I'm going to keep it a book.
00:11:09This was like, I was in LA.
00:11:10So this was like maybe two nights ago.
00:11:17Or early morning meditation, meditating in the morning.
00:11:19And I was meditating and I had a vision that I saw my mom and I was talking to her.
00:11:32I was just talking and I just, I just asked her, I said, you know, I forgive you, but can
00:11:42you forgive me for not for taking what she gave me and embodying that?
00:11:51Right.
00:11:52And having that same type of energy.
00:11:55Because when my mother died, I didn't, I didn't grieve.
00:11:58Right.
00:11:59I didn't cry.
00:12:00I didn't.
00:12:01Not at all.
00:12:01Nothing.
00:12:02And I asked her to forgive me for not sending her off.
00:12:08One thing I learned about life now is that I, even if somebody treats you wrong, it's how
00:12:19you react or respond.
00:12:21Absolutely.
00:12:22Right.
00:12:22That's been the biggest lesson for me.
00:12:24And I can't look at what she did to me and then react.
00:12:30Right.
00:12:30Like my response is, is, is what we had.
00:12:33And I, and I promise you, like I sat there and I explained to her, you know, the things
00:12:38that affected me and why I couldn't connect at that moment.
00:12:42And that, you know, she asked me for forgiveness, but I wanted her to forgive me.
00:12:49It's like we left in a gray space.
00:12:52Right.
00:12:52She doesn't know how I feel.
00:12:54I don't know how she feels.
00:12:55I promise you, it was like this, this pain, like it was like somebody like stabbing you
00:13:02in the chest with a, with a pitchfork or something.
00:13:06And, and it was just like hurt so bad.
00:13:09And when she, when she told me that she understood, I started to feel it dissolve.
00:13:15When you get to a place where you can forgive, even when there's pain involved, that's freedom.
00:13:23I, it's, it's so tricky because I, I promise you, like I'm a liberal, so I'm like a very
00:13:28balanced and fair person.
00:13:31But 99.9% of the people I've led in my life have, have, have walled or did something that
00:13:39I just was like, wow.
00:13:41And, and, and it, it could be anyone from any day.
00:13:45So it was always just that, and I go back to that instance when I was in that, under
00:13:50that cabinet, you, you, you feel what I'm saying?
00:13:54It's just like, you, you, you feel that.
00:13:56And I imagine going through that, you know, throughout your life.
00:13:59And that's what I have to tell people.
00:14:01Like, I don't think people understand that it's like, when you tell people you lost this
00:14:05many people, they look at it like you're exaggerating, but it's, you got to really think
00:14:08about it.
00:14:08Let's just say Tupac.
00:14:10Tupac was 25, six when he died.
00:14:13Imagine how many people he lost.
00:14:14If he ever sat down and told you, I'm double his age.
00:14:18I live past him.
00:14:20So I've lived four or five different lives.
00:14:22As you had these different versions of self, right?
00:14:29Did you feel connected to the experience or did you have an awareness to say, I know that
00:14:35what I'm doing is wrong, but this is what I have to do to survive?
00:14:39Well, this is the thing.
00:14:42I learned my gifts early on.
00:14:44Yeah.
00:14:45I was a visionary because I always see things.
00:14:47And I noticed that I was a disruptor because I find myself going with the not so popular
00:14:52decision, you know, but I know what's right in my heart and I'm a problem solver and going
00:14:58backwards.
00:14:59Like God gave me a gift.
00:15:01I understand that because he kept me safe.
00:15:03He kept me alive.
00:15:04He kept me free and he made me successful in a sense.
00:15:07I hadn't gave anything back to him yet, which is why I lost my voice because I told my vocal
00:15:11chords in the beginning of my career, which is why I said-
00:15:15How did you do that?
00:15:16Not knowing how to perform and tore my vocal chords.
00:15:19Did you have to have an operation?
00:15:20Yeah.
00:15:20And I didn't have insurance.
00:15:22I got three Lamborghinis and no insurance.
00:15:24Yeah.
00:15:25I had insurance on my cause and didn't have insurance on me.
00:15:27I had to pay for it with a brown paper bag.
00:15:30After that, I did my pray and he got me out of it.
00:15:33And then I got hit with a Bell's palsy.
00:15:37Oh, that's it.
00:15:38And my face was crooked.
00:15:39That's like one of the last times I talked to my mother because I told her I was scared.
00:15:42I was like, I don't think my face will ever go back again because it was like crooked.
00:15:45But do you remember what happened when, because you know, that's an emotional nerve thing.
00:15:51Well, I wasn't taking care of myself.
00:15:54I was drinking Cristal for breakfast and Waffle House.
00:15:57Oh my God.
00:15:57Yeah, I was 260.
00:16:00I was just in bad shape.
00:16:01I got an album out that's doing well.
00:16:04Yeah.
00:16:04I'm going around the world.
00:16:05I'm at war.
00:16:07You know what I'm saying?
00:16:08I'm losing friends left and right.
00:16:09I'm at war with people who have, you know, at the time way more money than I did, more influence and power.
00:16:14Yeah.
00:16:14And it's like, I'm just holding my own, right?
00:16:17Again, under that sink.
00:16:18And it's just like the same people that told me that it was my brothers and now they're trying to kill me.
00:16:21Like, imagine that, right?
00:16:23And this ain't like around the corner.
00:16:25This is state to state, right?
00:16:26Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:16:27So now I'm dealing with all this and I'm trying to navigate it.
00:16:31And, you know, God got me out of that again.
00:16:34Look, I think it's really important for black men and black women to have these conversations.
00:16:39I don't think we have these conversations enough.
00:16:42And I think it's a really tragic place when there's a person who's afraid of intimacy, right?
00:16:48Because intimacy is the trigger in which we can actually start to unpack ourselves.
00:16:53Are you guarded?
00:16:54Because you seem guarded.
00:16:55Yeah.
00:16:56Very.
00:16:56One thing is my relationships have been very much on the surface when I started losing a lot of people, right?
00:17:04Because you don't want to get to it.
00:17:05Are you talking about love relationships or homies, like people?
00:17:08Homies and then even love relationships I've been in where, you know, people just ain't right.
00:17:14You do realize, and I've had to learn this too, because I can be guarded as well, right, is if you are carrying that, you attract that.
00:17:25So if someone else is guarded or someone else is not being their full authentic self, it's because in some sort of way we haven't settled in.
00:17:35And I think it's really hard to do when you're in the industry that we're in, because everything about this industry tells you you have to be a certain version of yourself that people expect you to be.
00:17:49But see, that's the thing.
00:17:50See, I go even farther back.
00:17:53Yeah.
00:17:54Because my situation's a dire, right?
00:17:58Because if you're not guarded.
00:17:59Then you're dead.
00:18:01There you go.
00:18:02And, you know, if you're not guarded and you're not smart, then you end up in prison.
00:18:06If you're not guarded, you're not smart, then you're up in these situations where, you know, you're on a losing end.
00:18:12Then going into music, it didn't make it any better because now this same type of energy follows you.
00:18:18Now you're an ass.
00:18:19But see, that's the thing.
00:18:21That's where the imposter syndrome get reversed.
00:18:24Yeah.
00:18:25Because it's not me wanting to be like them.
00:18:29It's them wanting to be like me.
00:18:30Right.
00:18:31I'm the truth.
00:18:32I ain't his daddy, his cousin, his uncle, his brother.
00:18:34I'm him.
00:18:35Like, there's nobody that I know that's walked this path of life that I walked that can stand while I stand and say I did the things that I did.
00:18:42Anybody who really has common sense knows that, right?
00:18:46But I want to ask you, how do you know that I'm guarded just by having this conversation?
00:18:50Because I'm from where you're from and I see it.
00:18:51Oh, talk that talk.
00:18:52Game, get game, recognize game.
00:18:55I see you're guarded too, though, a little bit.
00:18:57Well, I'm, yeah, I am.
00:18:58Yeah.
00:18:59I'm guarded.
00:19:00What would make you guarded?
00:19:01Don't fuck with my kids.
00:19:02Mm-hmm.
00:19:04That's like off limits.
00:19:05Right.
00:19:07Not even a little bit.
00:19:08And if you do, you will hear from me.
00:19:11That comes from me not always feeling safe as little Nia.
00:19:15What?
00:19:15And me not wanting my children to ever not feel like they don't have me active in their lives as their safety.
00:19:22I love my son.
00:19:23I think he's an amazing guy.
00:19:25I think he's very charismatic.
00:19:26I think he got all the things.
00:19:28But I think that the way I've tried to love him over the years was totally wrong.
00:19:33Not his love language for one.
00:19:34And I think the things that I instilled in him as a youngster, you know, doesn't serve him now.
00:19:41You know, I had a really public breakup recently.
00:19:45It was a wake-up call for me in the sense of like, okay, you're going to do this on your own and you're going to be fine.
00:19:54Right.
00:19:54And you're not going to worry about what anyone thinks and has to say because the relationship was rocky for a very long time.
00:20:00So, because I don't believe another person can break anyone up.
00:20:04Like, I just don't, I don't buy that.
00:20:06Right.
00:20:07To your point with your son, I think my older son saw me trying to keep the family together.
00:20:18But I had to come to a place where loving myself was bigger and more important than saving anybody.
00:20:34Well, if you can't, if you got to save your star player, if your star player is not doing good, the team is-
00:20:38Can we not talk players?
00:20:39Can we use a different, can we say like, the best horse in the race?
00:20:43Right.
00:20:44Oh, my God.
00:20:49But the reason, but the reason I know that you're guarded is because when I was in high school, I only dated drug dealers.
00:20:55Oh, really?
00:20:56Oh, my God.
00:20:56That's where I was.
00:20:57I lived in South Central LA.
00:20:58That's what it was.
00:20:59Wow.
00:21:00I would have never thought that.
00:21:01Really?
00:21:02No.
00:21:02But going through your, your trials and tribulations, like-
00:21:07Yeah.
00:21:07I know you're working on yourself.
00:21:09Like, we all are.
00:21:09Do you feel that you're okay?
00:21:13Like, not what people are supposed to see or supposed to think.
00:21:17You.
00:21:19I think I'm exactly where I need to be, which is some days I'm like totally good.
00:21:26And then other days I'm like, oh, God, this feels like so much work.
00:21:29I feel that.
00:21:30Or, you know, and then other days it feels like women shouldn't have to be this strong.
00:21:38Right.
00:21:39I don't want to be this strong sometimes.
00:21:41Right.
00:21:42Okay.
00:21:43You made me cry.
00:21:44I got you first.
00:21:46But you're good though.
00:21:48No, I'm good.
00:21:49I mean, listen, it is what it is.
00:21:52I mean, it's life is a funny thing because like I always saw myself, my vision of myself
00:21:58was, you know, well-medicured man, good skin, wedding band, playing Jane Watts.
00:22:08You know, I'm wearing this right now.
00:22:09That's not playing Jane, by the way.
00:22:11That's very reminiscent of Hustler days.
00:22:14That's a little hustler-y.
00:22:15We're supposed to be playing Jane, but I felt a little spicy.
00:22:17And I don't think anybody should have to be that strong.
00:22:23Black people have survived insurmountable obstacles.
00:22:31The journey of being Black in America is not easy.
00:22:35And I'm not a victim to any of it.
00:22:38But I'm realistic to the journey.
00:22:42I know how I am treated differently in certain situations.
00:22:45I understand that I have to raise my boys to be men.
00:22:49I understand that I have to figure out the balance between being soft and vulnerable and open.
00:22:56Is that hard?
00:22:58No, because that's who I want to be.
00:23:00That's who I really am.
00:23:02But I would say, personally, I would appreciate that because it's hard.
00:23:07You know, because women have their own thing.
00:23:11They go through it.
00:23:11And when you deal with men and you have that hard exterior, it's hard.
00:23:17You're right.
00:23:18Because we're already fighting the world.
00:23:20You know what I'm saying?
00:23:21But so are we.
00:23:22But that's where we got to find the happy media.
00:23:24I didn't have enough examples in my own life to, like, understand what it really meant or what it really means to see a relationship between a man and a woman that is healthy and balanced.
00:23:40Wow.
00:23:40And you work through things instead of, like, every conversation is not an argument.
00:23:46Right.
00:23:46And I don't think black men and black women have those conversations enough.
00:23:51Even now, we're doing the work.
00:23:54That don't mean everybody else is on board.
00:23:56And that's the crazy part.
00:23:57But that's the thing.
00:23:58You got to let them go.
00:24:00You got to let them go.
00:24:01And you got to let them be on their own journey.
00:24:04And you can't fight for it anymore.
00:24:05And you got to love them exactly where they are.
00:24:08And you got to say, baby, you know what?
00:24:11The hardest thing to do is to walk away from someone that you still love.
00:24:14You didn't tell me you was a pastor too.
00:24:16And it's okay.
00:24:16No, I'm just speaking from my own.
00:24:18I'm speaking from, like, you know.
00:24:19I 1,000% agree.
00:24:21Experience.
00:24:21Because the hardest thing I had to do in life was walking away from everything that I knew that could support me.
00:24:26That's right.
00:24:27But what was the moment that you knew you had to walk away?
00:24:29Something happened in the Bay.
00:24:32Somebody got killed.
00:24:33And they tried to put it on us while I was on tour with Khalifa.
00:24:36They came and locked me up right here in L.A.
00:24:38I just remember being in jail.
00:24:40And, you know, I took care of everybody.
00:24:45A million-dollar bill for everybody.
00:24:48$10 million.
00:24:49Oh, my God.
00:24:50I'm sitting in the county jail.
00:24:52And as soon as I get in there, somebody comes to get me out.
00:24:57And they're like, we got to get you out of here.
00:24:59And I'm like, no, I can't leave these people in the county jail.
00:25:03I got to stay here until, you know, I can get everybody out the same way we came in.
00:25:07Yeah.
00:25:08And, you know, of course, I didn't want to tell nobody how to touch my finances.
00:25:11Yeah.
00:25:11So I had to figure that part out.
00:25:13And I'm getting everybody out.
00:25:14But my point is I sat in there for two weeks until I can get everybody out.
00:25:16Right.
00:25:17The people that I had that were supposed to be in my corner, ain't nobody checking on my son, my daughter, my household.
00:25:23Nothing.
00:25:23And when I got out of jail, I was at the lowest point of my life.
00:25:27I did everything right on this tour.
00:25:29I didn't take any gang members or nothing crazy.
00:25:32I took the people that was working.
00:25:34I stayed on my bus the whole time.
00:25:36I did everything right.
00:25:38And I got caught up.
00:25:38I had Minister Farrakhan calling me every other day like, Jeezy, brother, the enemy is coming.
00:25:44I'm just like, what the hell is going on?
00:25:46Why is he calling you?
00:25:47He called me and said, brother Jeezy, your message is changing.
00:25:52The enemy is coming to get you.
00:25:54I said, with all due respect, Mr. Farrakhan, all my enemies in my neighborhood, I'm not going back there in no time soon.
00:26:00He said, no, the enemy.
00:26:01But what he was saying was that my message was changing and I was starting to educate my people.
00:26:07Oh, wow.
00:26:08And now here comes the enemy and he was aligned.
00:26:12It was when I got to that arena to do my show in front of 30,000 people, it was my turn to go on stage.
00:26:19It was maybe 70 police back there waiting to take me to jail.
00:26:23It was a span of my life, maybe like three years, probably shortly after my first album.
00:26:28So, like, it was shootout to shootout.
00:26:32Like, I've been in shootouts with my dad being right there.
00:26:34And it's like a combo of everything.
00:26:36So, it was a combo of the street shit I had going on before that.
00:26:39Yeah.
00:26:40It was a combo of the get money life with these guys.
00:26:43And then it was a combo of just people that I just never had a liking for.
00:26:47They didn't have a liking for me that we just was in the same city trying to coexist.
00:26:50I used to get up and pick my outfit based on what I was, if it happened tonight, how I was going to look.
00:26:59Right?
00:26:59You were like, if I die tonight, my shit's going to be fly.
00:27:02Do you realize what that does to your psyche just leaving the house thinking like, I got to make sure my shit is fly if I get killed?
00:27:08Boxes, everything.
00:27:09I want to wear the best boxes.
00:27:11You're like, I will not have any holes in my underwear.
00:27:14I promise you, that was my life.
00:27:17I didn't understand how I was going to even make it out.
00:27:21Right?
00:27:22And that's where all the drinking came in because now I'm trying to self-soothe.
00:27:25I'm trying to learn.
00:27:25Were you an alcoholic, you think?
00:27:261,000%.
00:27:27Did you go to like AA or did you just?
00:27:29No, I just stopped.
00:27:31You stopped.
00:27:31Because my mom and my dad, they was, you know, my mom's side of the family, they drank a lot.
00:27:36And when I was leaning in on my vices, I started to notice that there was a couple of things that happened a few times where I wasn't sharp.
00:27:44And I was just like, okay, if I don't stop this, I'm going to get got.
00:27:48And then I would just like back away from the alcohol.
00:27:51And what I would do is, well, two things.
00:27:53The first thing is I wanted to get healthy.
00:27:57So I got down, I dropped 60 pounds, got myself together.
00:28:01This was right before the recession because any time of my career before, from streets is watching to the recession, which was about six years.
00:28:10Yeah.
00:28:10I was out of it.
00:28:12Like I wasn't even, I was leading men, right?
00:28:15I went everywhere with 150, 200 people.
00:28:17And every city I went to, it was another 300 waiting orders.
00:28:20It was like, it was like a real thing.
00:28:23And I was needing everybody off the end of a cliff.
00:28:24So you were saying that you feel like we can't connect because we're doing too much time fighting each other.
00:28:50Absolutely.
00:28:50Instead of fighting for the relationship or fighting for love and understanding and commitment and compassion.
00:28:56And, but it starts with, with men feeling, you know, comfortable enough to be vulnerable and open.
00:29:04And that's a hard thing to ask a man to do because we were not conditioned that way.
00:29:11We were not, a lot of us weren't raised that way.
00:29:13It can be considered a sign of weakness in the same way that therapy is considered a sign of weakness.
00:29:18We're talking about your experiences and my experiences.
00:29:21We have more in common than we probably ever thought we did, right?
00:29:25And so to me, that's the thing that makes me feel this sense of urgency to have this conversation with you.
00:29:34But also there's a hopefulness.
00:29:37There's a hopefulness that if we actually each do the work, we can actually come together.
00:29:42Because there's nothing more important to me than black people.
00:29:46Right.
00:29:47We are the greatness in every room.
00:29:50Right.
00:29:50We are the ones who set it off and make it happen.
00:29:53We are the ones that create the culture.
00:29:55We are the artists.
00:29:56We are the artistes.
00:29:58We are the voices.
00:30:01What?
00:30:01That lead the masses.
00:30:03But what has always hurt me to the core is why is there this dismantlement of the black family?
00:30:11Why isn't it that black men and black women can't sit like you and I are sitting in a space and have really open dialogues about things and work through the trauma?
00:30:22Because that's the only way we can really, really, really be productive.
00:30:29You said if it couldn't work, then you would leave.
00:30:32Yes.
00:30:32Even if there was a family, even if there was kids involved.
00:30:37If the other person is not willing to do the deep, hard work, then you stay.
00:30:48And when you stay, you have to make yourself smaller to stay, to survive.
00:30:54I 1,000% agree with you.
00:30:57Or you may not.
00:30:58I think for a woman, it means you have to make yourself smaller to feel like you're fitting into this space with this person who's not ready yet.
00:31:08Right.
00:31:08You can still love them, by the way.
00:31:10Right.
00:31:11You can still love them.
00:31:12You can still wish them the best.
00:31:13I mean, you might have moments where you want to cuss somebody out.
00:31:18Like, that's normal.
00:31:19Like, we have feelings and emotions.
00:31:22But you can love people right where they are.
00:31:24Right.
00:31:25Because to me, that's really a sign of my own personal growth.
00:31:29If you can love the person that hurts you.
00:31:31Right.
00:31:32But you mean love them from afar.
00:31:33You love them from afar.
00:31:35Right.
00:31:35You wish them well.
00:31:36You bless them on their journey.
00:31:38And you hope that the next time around that they have the opportunity to do the work that they do the work.
00:31:43Like, what happens when you're a man and you want nothing more than that, right?
00:31:47Yeah.
00:31:48And that's not what you're getting on the other side.
00:31:50And there are kids involved, right?
00:31:52And there's somewhat love there.
00:31:55And you understand that somebody else might have their thing.
00:31:59But they're not taking this journey with you of healing.
00:32:03Because I think love is two people healing together and giving each other the space to do so.
00:32:08And the thing for me is, you know, when I went to visit my mother that day, I went to forgive her.
00:32:17But I also went to tell her that I'm going to stand up for Lil' J.
00:32:21That's right.
00:32:22Right?
00:32:22The Lil' J that she put in that position.
00:32:26And I think a lot of my healing journey, especially in my real life, had a lot to do with me never standing up to my mother the right way.
00:32:35That's right.
00:32:35Which made me be a certain way in real life.
00:32:39You're kind of all the things.
00:32:41Right.
00:32:41What's all the things you mean?
00:32:42I mean, like, you've kind of, you're like a cat.
00:32:46You've kind of lived nine lives.
00:32:47Yeah.
00:32:48You've had many different versions of self.
00:32:50Myself, right.
00:32:51So right now, where are we?
00:32:52In my life, I wanted to have a family family.
00:32:55Yeah.
00:32:56I wanted to be that guy.
00:32:58I wanted to be the person.
00:32:59To get it right.
00:33:00To get it right.
00:33:01Me too.
00:33:02I wanted to get it right.
00:33:03To get it right.
00:33:03To be right.
00:33:04Yes.
00:33:05Do all the things.
00:33:07And you get in that space and you're letting your inner child down and you're not protecting them.
00:33:12And that's making you shrink in situations like that too.
00:33:15Men do.
00:33:16Yes.
00:33:16Because if you're not appreciated, if you're met with resistance.
00:33:19Yes.
00:33:19If you're met with that inner thing that somebody else has from their thing.
00:33:25But to me, that's fixable.
00:33:27You got to want to do the work.
00:33:29I agree.
00:33:30But you just say it clearly to a person that's meeting you out.
00:33:35There's an expiration date on everything.
00:33:37Right.
00:33:37Right.
00:33:38Like, and you got to know when it's time to be done.
00:33:43Right.
00:33:43And that's usually not about another person, an affair or, you know, some chick that's willing to, like, make you feel like a king.
00:33:53Right.
00:33:53And that's why most men cheat.
00:33:55Most men cheat because the-
00:33:57That's fascinating to me.
00:33:58It's so gross.
00:33:59It's so stupid.
00:34:00I personally, this is my quote.
00:34:03Real niggas don't cheat.
00:34:04You don't think so?
00:34:05Hell no.
00:34:06I kind of understand what you mean when you say that.
00:34:09They do not.
00:34:10I understand what you mean when you say that.
00:34:12It's something in us.
00:34:14Yeah.
00:34:14That makes us want to be right.
00:34:17Right.
00:34:17Across the board.
00:34:18But is that so that you are living up to the expectation that you've set for yourself?
00:34:26Because, again, you're going back to your childhood wounds of trying to be perfect to receive the love from your mom?
00:34:34Or is that really where you've landed that you want to be a man that does things the right way because you want to be honorable and you want to respect the woman that you're with?
00:34:43Because those are two different things.
00:34:44I want to be honorable and I'm just-
00:34:47Anybody that's real, and when I say real, I mean real with yourself.
00:34:51Yeah, yeah.
00:34:52You know what I'm saying?
00:34:52Yeah.
00:34:52Like, you're going to hold- there's a sense of integrity there.
00:34:56Absolutely.
00:34:57You know what I'm saying?
00:34:58In my life-
00:34:58God, what happened to integrity?
00:35:01My life is built on integrity.
00:35:03Yeah.
00:35:04That's my moral compass.
00:35:05Yeah.
00:35:06If I'm not integral, I'm off.
00:35:08Yeah.
00:35:09And for me, you know, doing the work is integral.
00:35:13Right.
00:35:14For me, coming forth and telling my truth is integral.
00:35:18Right.
00:35:19For me, taking the mask off and saying, you know what?
00:35:22Even your favorite, Trapper's favorite, Trapper has flaws and things that he has to work through.
00:35:29Yes.
00:35:29It's integral.
00:35:30Doing a versus battle in front of the world where they know that they know who you are and what you're capable of and you're taking another approach because you want to save lives is integral.
00:35:40That's that disruptive, not making the favorite or the most favorable choice because you know you have a position to play.
00:35:51So when I say that-
00:35:51Well, it's in your purpose, right?
00:35:53Like when you're more in align with your purpose.
00:35:54And I swear to you that more than ever, I understand my purpose is walking in these footprints that God has left for me.
00:36:03And what is your purpose now?
00:36:04My purpose is to be the best version of myself and to teach my culture everything that I learned along the way.
00:36:12Just like I did when I was in the streets and I made music, now that I'm writing books, everything that I learned is in that book.
00:36:19Everything that you see me do in real life is my contribution to the blessings that I have.
00:36:27Showing men that we can come from where we come from can still be integral, still be solid individuals because I think what you're saying is we haven't seen enough examples of solid individuals.
00:36:39That's right.
00:36:40We don't have that roadmap.
00:36:41People is either one side or another.
00:36:43It's like, you know, somebody's thinking for self.
00:36:47We're not thinking for we, right?
00:36:48Somebody's either trying to-
00:36:50And by the way, I had to go back and dial my ego all the way back down.
00:36:54That's the other thing we haven't talked about.
00:36:56There's no space in any of what we're talking about for ego.
00:37:01Right.
00:37:02And if you're living by ego, you're basically trying to either, A, control someone or to get them to see life the way you see it.
00:37:09Yes.
00:37:10And I had to learn that that's not how you live life, right?
00:37:15And most of my ego came from fear.
00:37:17Absolutely.
00:37:18Right?
00:37:19There's good ego.
00:37:20There's good ego that allows you to do this because this is something new, right?
00:37:24There's good ego that allows you to be a disruptor.
00:37:28Yes.
00:37:29That's good ego.
00:37:29Because in disrupting the system, in disrupting what we're used to seeing, you're also providing a new way of doing things, right?
00:37:38It's hard, though.
00:37:39Yeah, it's hard because you're putting yourself in a position to be an example.
00:37:44Right.
00:37:44But you're still learning and growing.
00:37:47And also, you're putting yourself in a position to lose everything that you've built because people can look at you.
00:37:53And you know our culture.
00:37:54You can do one thing and they're like, are we cool on him?
00:37:57Yeah.
00:37:57You know what I'm saying?
00:37:58It's just like I had to learn not to teach or to preach.
00:38:02You know, I'm not this role model.
00:38:04I'm just saying that when you come from where we come from, it's okay to evolve because at the end of the day, I don't want to be, I don't want my kids to think I was just a great artist.
00:38:15You know what I'm saying?
00:38:16I'm a great man.
00:38:17I'm a great person.
00:38:18You know, I'm a great father.
00:38:20That's more important than anything.
00:38:21Because I was saying God to him, like all that, all these things, I'm all the things, right?
00:38:27I just said that to you and you looked at me like I was crazy.
00:38:30No, I was trying to figure out what things you were saying.
00:38:33But I'm all the things, right?
00:38:36Yeah.
00:38:36And I'm also somebody who's failed.
00:38:38I'm also somebody who's lost.
00:38:40I'm also somebody who my life plays out in public a lot, right?
00:38:44And people always see the bad things.
00:38:46I'm always somebody who wants to do the right thing.
00:38:49And sometimes, you know, the masses don't want that, right?
00:38:53And sometimes, you know, I've been taught to keep your mouth closed and don't tell people anything, right?
00:38:59Especially how you live and how you move.
00:39:00Well, that's what we've all been taught.
00:39:02Right.
00:39:03And now just opening up and having these conversations, you know, there's a lot of times where I'm just like, wow, like, you know, when you see people not getting the message right and you go, they just really don't understand.
00:39:15As Black people, this is a beautiful time for us to be inspired by each other.
00:39:22Right.
00:39:22To be able to say we no longer have to have this experience on this planet in this small vacuum.
00:39:30Right.
00:39:31Where we are of service to the world.
00:39:33And when I say to the world, I mean to white pop culture.
00:39:36Right.
00:39:37Now there are tools and examples and people and practices in place that can inspire us in a different way.
00:39:45When I was, you know, nine years old wanting to be an actress, when I was little, Nia, there were like very few people I could look up to and say, oh, that's who I want to be.
00:39:54Right.
00:39:55We've cracked that a little bit.
00:39:57Right.
00:39:57A lot of bit.
00:39:58Right.
00:39:58So now I think what you're saying is we all have the choice.
00:40:04We have the choice to decide when and where we're going to get the mental health support that we need.
00:40:11But you got to want it.
00:40:13And I think the stigma behind mental health, especially with Black men, is huge.
00:40:19It's a weakness.
00:40:20It's a weakness.
00:40:20And the reality is, is your brain is a muscle like anything else on your body.
00:40:27If you can go to the gym and lift weights, then you should be able to sit down with someone and exercise that muscle in between your ears and have those conversations.
00:40:36Because those conversations are tough, but they're also really necessary.
00:40:40Yeah.
00:40:41It's hard, though, because I have, you know, I have people that I know look up to me that they're really, you know, have been there with me through a lot of things.
00:40:51And I think they don't understand.
00:40:54Where you're at.
00:40:55And where I'm going.
00:40:55It's like the disconnect is so real.
00:40:58And it's almost like there's only a chosen few people who understand what's really at stake.
00:41:04I was talking to a guy friend of mine a while ago.
00:41:08And he said, Nia.
00:41:10And I was just complaining, complaining, complaining, complaining, complaining, complaining.
00:41:13And I was like, what am I supposed to do?
00:41:15Like, you know, I love this person.
00:41:17And he said, everyone has a cap on their capacity.
00:41:21And if their capacity is full, you could be doing back flips, front flips.
00:41:32You could be the best.
00:41:34The sex could be amazing.
00:41:35All these things could be amazing in that relationship.
00:41:40But if that person's capacity and desire to grow isn't there, then you hit that wall.
00:41:50Yeah.
00:41:51And I'm not saying that everyone that hits the wall should give up.
00:41:55Right.
00:41:55I'm saying that if your partner hits the wall and you're not quite there yet in your personal growth, you have a big decision to make.
00:42:04If I'm already in my partner's now, what happens?
00:42:07Well, how do you know she's not?
00:42:09Let's just say I know.
00:42:10Like it wasn't.
00:42:12What do I do?
00:42:13You're my sister right now.
00:42:14I'm your sister.
00:42:15You're giving me some advice, hypothetically speaking.
00:42:19Well, you don't want my advice because my advice is I'm out.
00:42:24Really?
00:42:25No, I don't give up easily.
00:42:26Right.
00:42:27I will never give up on someone I love.
00:42:29I don't care how high we are or how low we are.
00:42:33That's how I feel about it.
00:42:34I love me now.
00:42:35Yeah.
00:42:35There's a point I didn't.
00:42:36So I can't give up on myself.
00:42:39That's choosing yourself.
00:42:40Is that wrong?
00:42:41No.
00:42:43That's the ultimate freedom.
00:42:45The ultimate acceptance, who you are now, where you are now.
00:42:50And where's that picture you showed me earlier?
00:42:52Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:42:53Of you when you were younger.
00:42:55That's my guy right there.
00:42:56It's Lou Jay.
00:42:57I talked to him all the time.
00:42:58Oh, my God.
00:42:58I'm so cute.
00:42:59He was kind of cute.
00:43:00You know what I'm saying?
00:43:00He was a cutie.
00:43:02He was a cutie.
00:43:02Cutie patootie.
00:43:03You know what I'm saying?
00:43:04A little gangster, but he's good.
00:43:06Well, you got to have a little gangster.
00:43:07It's boring if you ain't got no gangster.
00:43:09When you look at him now, what do you feel?
00:43:12Honestly, I'm going to share this, and I haven't shared it with anyone.
00:43:18I had a meditation where I was in a deep meditation for like 45 minutes.
00:43:25And I dozed off into this field.
00:43:30Like it's like a field.
00:43:32And it was like an old house in the middle of the field, like a barn house.
00:43:37And I walked through the field, and I walked in the house.
00:43:39And there was a TV on.
00:43:41I was playing cartoons.
00:43:42And I walked around the house.
00:43:44I didn't see anyone.
00:43:45Went in the kitchen, went in the room, didn't see anyone.
00:43:47And something told me to go downstairs.
00:43:49And I walked downstairs into the basement.
00:43:53It was kind of dark, a little light on in the corner.
00:43:56Couldn't really see much.
00:43:58And I walked around the basement, and I ended up in the corner.
00:44:03Yeah.
00:44:03And I heard someone sniffing.
00:44:05I walked over, and I said, hey, what's going on?
00:44:09And then he had his back to me.
00:44:11And I said, what's wrong, buddy?
00:44:14And he turned around, and it was my younger self, the same face in his picture.
00:44:20That's amazing.
00:44:21And I said, what's wrong?
00:44:23He said that I'm tired of everybody.
00:44:29Like, he basically was trying to tell me he's tired of not being able to trust anybody, and everybody doing them dirty.
00:44:36Dirty.
00:44:37Right?
00:44:38And he was crying, and I just looked at him.
00:44:42I said, it's okay now.
00:44:43I'm here, buddy.
00:44:44To protect self.
00:44:45And he said, you sure?
00:44:46I said, yes, I'm here.
00:44:48And he just looked at me.
00:44:51He said, you promise?
00:44:52And I said, yeah.
00:44:53And I said, give me a hug, man.
00:44:55And I literally, like, this is real talk.
00:44:58Like, I'm laying in my bed, right?
00:45:00I ain't cried since Tupac died.
00:45:03Right?
00:45:03We all cried that night.
00:45:03And I'm laying in my bed.
00:45:05And I'm feeling tears roll down my face in my bed.
00:45:09Oh.
00:45:10And I looked at him, and I said, you're good, buddy.
00:45:14I'm here with you now.
00:45:15I got you.
00:45:16And then I said, why are you in the basement?
00:45:19He said, because I was hiding.
00:45:20I said, well, what do you want to do, man?
00:45:22He said, I want to go play.
00:45:23I want to have fun.
00:45:24I said, well, let's go play.
00:45:25So I took him upstairs.
00:45:27He ran outside, ran around the whole field in the yard, swinging on the chairs.
00:45:31I'm literally feeling myself go from tears to smiling because he's happy.
00:45:40And we played all day, played until he got tired, and we went in the house, and we sat
00:45:45on the sofa, and he watched cartoons until he fell asleep.
00:45:48And he sat on my lap where he, like, waited across.
00:45:51And in the middle of it, he just woke up, and he's like, I love you, man.
00:45:56And when I tell you-
00:45:57That was it for you.
00:45:58It's almost like my heart, it, like, exploded.
00:46:01Like, whatever pain that was in there-
00:46:04That you were carrying.
00:46:05It was like a million pounds lifted off my chest.
00:46:09And that moment, I just said, no matter what in life happens, I have to choose to take
00:46:16care of my inner child and take care of myself.
00:46:19And that's what I promised my mom when I wrote her that letter, when I went and sat with her
00:46:24at a grave site.
00:46:25And I just remember walking away from it, and I looked at my phone, and I said, I did
00:46:33it for us, man.
00:46:34I did it for us, Lil' J.
00:46:36And that was all I needed for me, because that moment for me, my life has just been clear
00:46:44ever since.
00:46:45And I always put everybody else first.
00:46:47Me too.
00:46:48And I never put myself first.
00:46:49Never.
00:46:50I know.
00:46:50And I've tried to love everyone that's carrying my life.
00:46:55Everyone.
00:46:56Like, the best way I could.
00:46:57Not to say that I know what love is, or I know what these things are, but the best way
00:47:01I know how.
00:47:02And I always got the short end of the state.
00:47:05And for this one time, in this one place, I chose myself.
00:47:10Our world, our people, they need to hear this shit.
00:47:12Absolutely.
00:47:13Like, they need to know that, you know, you don't have to be stuck in this place, that
00:47:20this trauma, and this pain.
00:47:22No.
00:47:22And all these things want us to be stuck in.
00:47:23We're supposed to be living joy.
00:47:25Living joy.
00:47:26Joyful lives.
00:47:26Women are supposed to just be able to be feminine and soft.
00:47:30Right.
00:47:31Right.
00:47:31Still be in your power.
00:47:32Right.
00:47:32Still be successful.
00:47:33Right.
00:47:34Still be mothers, professionals, famous, whatever it is.
00:47:38Right.
00:47:38We can be all of the things, right?
00:47:40And men should be able to be loving.
00:47:42Absolutely.
00:47:42And not feel like they're going to get emasculated or these things, because, and I just feel like,
00:47:50if everybody took the time to look inward and to work on themselves.
00:47:56In an honest way.
00:47:58You have to be honest.
00:47:59And I just feel like if we can do that as a people, we'll be in a better space.
00:48:03And I think for me, it's risking a lot because, you know, anybody that would have been in my
00:48:11position that would have been thinking for self.
00:48:14And I think it's success.
00:48:15There's no way they would have.
00:48:16I think it's success when you accomplish what I accomplish.
00:48:20That's success.
00:48:20Yeah, yeah.
00:48:21But success is for yourself.
00:48:24Significance is what is about others.
00:48:27And I'm in a significant space right now.
00:48:29I don't know that I've ever had a conversation like this with any man.
00:48:34Oh, wow.
00:48:35So for you to say the words, but still have this very masculine presence is kind of nice.
00:48:43Because it's like, it goes against what I think women will be like, he's soft.
00:48:49I don't want, you know, because there are women out there that don't want that.
00:48:52One thousand percent.
00:48:53I don't understand that.
00:48:54I think you want the balance, right?
00:48:55I think women want leadership.
00:48:57They want to feel protected.
00:48:58Do they want leadership?
00:49:00Well, it depends on the woman.
00:49:02Right, yes.
00:49:03It depends on the woman, right?
00:49:05Right.
00:49:05And it depends on where you're leading me.
00:49:07Because if you're leading me someplace where I don't want to go, then no.
00:49:10Right.
00:49:10We're not doing that.
00:49:11Right.
00:49:12But if I trust you.
00:49:14Where does the trust come into play?
00:49:18Well, you got to know each other.
00:49:20You got to be, you got to.
00:49:21And to know each other, you have to be transparent.
00:49:26Absolutely.
00:49:27Open book.
00:49:28Are you able to forgive?
00:49:31I started with myself, my mother, you know, some people in my family that some foul things
00:49:40happened.
00:49:40You know, as a family, those things should happen.
00:49:43But I don't know how you forgive somebody who had a malicious intent.
00:49:51So in that moment where you are trying to really work through your own trauma, is it safe
00:49:58to say that it's healthy to say, that person is where they are, I need to leave them there
00:50:05and forgive them exactly where they are and still love them where they are?
00:50:08Well, I can say this, I've been through some shit.
00:50:12You know what I'm saying?
00:50:13I'm not laughing.
00:50:14I'm just like, but the way you said that, I'm definitely laughing because of the way you
00:50:18said it.
00:50:19You're definitely laughing at me right now.
00:50:20See what I'm saying?
00:50:21This is why we can't open up.
00:50:22This is why I can't open up.
00:50:23This is why I should say shit.
00:50:24I'm laughing because of your face when you said it.
00:50:27It was like, I want to know what you're saying.
00:50:29I've been through some shit and I've been through some shit with people I really love.
00:50:33What's the worst thing someone's ever done to you?
00:50:36I mean, left me in my lowest.
00:50:37I thought I'd take care of them the whole time.
00:50:39Like, you know, cross me out.
00:50:41I mean, try to line me up, you know, get me knocked off.
00:50:44That's hardcore.
00:50:46Took from me, stole from me, betrayed me.
00:50:50But you gotta let all that go, have you?
00:50:52This is the thing I had to learn.
00:50:54And this is the part where it get a little tricky.
00:50:57Most time when people do something to hurt you, it's out of fear.
00:51:01Of course.
00:51:02Right.
00:51:03But I didn't understand that at first.
00:51:04I thought this was personal.
00:51:05Yeah.
00:51:06Right.
00:51:07Well, that's because we black people are raised that way.
00:51:09Like that's kind of part of our culture.
00:51:10You're trying to hurt me, so I gotta...
00:51:12I gotta hurt you back or hurt you first.
00:51:14There's that.
00:51:15And I think when I started to realize that it was out of fear,
00:51:21that softened the blow.
00:51:24But like, god damn, them niggas didn't be dirty, man.
00:51:27They do.
00:51:28Yeah.
00:51:29Just like, I don't understand it.
00:51:30That's good that you have that still in you.
00:51:34Because to me...
00:51:35What?
00:51:36...that's a part of who you are.
00:51:38You gotta always keep teeth.
00:51:39Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:51:40Grits.
00:51:41Let me say this.
00:51:42The thing that I had to come to grips with is that no matter how dirty I feel like they've done me,
00:51:52they probably never thought about that another day in their life.
00:51:55It probably didn't even matter to them.
00:51:56It was business as usual.
00:51:58And the thing that I have been living with is the fact that every day, which has probably been for the last decade...
00:52:05You think about it.
00:52:07I think about it.
00:52:08And I'm the one that's being affected by it.
00:52:11You're hurting.
00:52:12Yeah.
00:52:13I'm the one that's hurting.
00:52:14I think that seems like the last thing that you need to reconcile.
00:52:17Yeah, that's the last piece.
00:52:19So we've talked about all of these things, all of these themes, all of these moments in your life, some moments in my own life, where you have made a conscious decision to move forward and to choose yourself.
00:52:34Right.
00:52:35Right?
00:52:36But what we haven't talked about is your current marriage and your current situation.
00:52:42And I think it would be unfair to you to not address that in this space where we're being really open and honest.
00:52:52It doesn't have to be the details of anything.
00:52:54Right.
00:52:55But if you've done all of this work and you've given yourself that grace, and you've given yourself that space to grow,
00:53:05and you've given yourself permission to love self, right?
00:53:09Then what happens when a man gets to the point where they're just like, okay, I'm filing for divorce?
00:53:16Integrity intact.
00:53:18I could never say anything that would not honor somebody.
00:53:23Absolutely.
00:53:24But I can tell you that this has not been an easy journey.
00:53:30Right.
00:53:31I can tell you that I'm saddened.
00:53:36I can tell you that I'm disappointed.
00:53:38I can tell you that I'm uneasy.
00:53:42Right?
00:53:43But again, like, God has put me in a different path.
00:53:49And that path is going to entail for me to take care of myself and to love myself and to be in the best situation that I can thrive as someone who've been through all the things that I've been through.
00:54:03It's kind of something you can't explain.
00:54:05Yeah, you can't.
00:54:06The real thing is like, you know, I don't like to fail in anything.
00:54:10Me either.
00:54:11No.
00:54:12I don't want to lose.
00:54:13I don't want to fail.
00:54:14I don't want to fail.
00:54:15Especially when I know what...
00:54:16You've poured in.
00:54:17Right.
00:54:18Right.
00:54:19And, you know, as I said across from you, like, I can only be responsible for myself.
00:54:24True.
00:54:25You know, and I can only do what I can do.
00:54:30Right.
00:54:31And I can't expect someone else to do what I'm doing.
00:54:37But did you go to therapy with her?
00:54:39Yeah.
00:54:40Okay, that's good.
00:54:41Right.
00:54:42So you actually addressed it.
00:54:44Right.
00:54:45Tried to work through it.
00:54:46Tried to do the work.
00:54:47Mm-hmm.
00:54:48And it just was, like, not happening.
00:54:50No.
00:54:51Right.
00:54:52Well, then, shit, you tried.
00:54:53Yeah.
00:54:54I don't know about for you, but for me, it is a switch.
00:54:57Right.
00:54:58And when that switch goes off...
00:54:59Is that what you...
00:55:00That was your switch?
00:55:01Gone.
00:55:02The...
00:55:03Yeah.
00:55:04Right.
00:55:05But...
00:55:06But, you know, I had to realize for myself that anything that happened in the last,
00:55:11what was it, a year and a half of my life.
00:55:12Right.
00:55:13That shit didn't have nothing to do with me.
00:55:14Right.
00:55:15And that's my point of case.
00:55:16That didn't have anything to do with me.
00:55:18Right.
00:55:19I was not embarrassed.
00:55:20Right.
00:55:21I was not...
00:55:22I was...
00:55:23The way that Black people stood up for me...
00:55:26Mm-hmm.
00:55:27And the way that Black women were like, oh, no, you don't do that to her.
00:55:31Mm-hmm.
00:55:32I was shocked.
00:55:33Right.
00:55:34Because I didn't realize that what I had done or what I've done in my career had so much impact.
00:55:39You didn't really?
00:55:40Really?
00:55:41No.
00:55:42Not at all.
00:55:43And I'm not even being, like, funny.
00:55:44You're America's sweetheart.
00:55:45Like, it's crazy.
00:55:46Well, shit.
00:55:47It's fine.
00:55:48It's fine.
00:55:49What the hell?
00:55:50You don't know that?
00:55:51I don't...
00:55:52I do not...
00:55:53I don't regard myself in that way because it's always really about the work for me.
00:55:58Well, I'm gonna say this.
00:56:00I feel...
00:56:01Yeah.
00:56:02...like I'm sitting across from you.
00:56:05Yeah.
00:56:06That's why I wanted to have this conversation with you.
00:56:08Because I want to personally tell you...
00:56:09Yeah.
00:56:10...that you embody...
00:56:11Yeah.
00:56:12...what a well-minded, cruel-ass black woman is supposed to be like.
00:56:21And we stand with you always.
00:56:22And the reason why I wanted to talk to you because you are my sister.
00:56:26And this is a safe space for me to say what I need to say.
00:56:30Because at times when we're at our lowest, we need our sisters.
00:56:34That's right.
00:56:35Just like you guys need your brothers.
00:56:36That's right.
00:56:37And that's why this conversation was so real because I hope and I pray that this conversation
00:56:47can open up different conversations in our culture about being there for each other.
00:56:51And not being at odds with each other no matter what we've been through.
00:56:55And, you know, I gotta give you your flowers.
00:56:58You know, you've done an amazing job at maintaining your integrity throughout your career.
00:57:08Right?
00:57:09As a person, as a human being.
00:57:11And it meant the world to me to sit across from you and just to tell you my story.
00:57:15As a man, I just hope that women, our women, black women in particular, can see this.
00:57:22Yeah.
00:57:23And give us a safe space.
00:57:25Really women all the way across the board because we as men, like we hurt to be vulnerable
00:57:30to tell us, you know, your partner that, you know, right now I'm in a bad space.
00:57:35I'm not feeling so good right now.
00:57:36Yeah, I'm in a bad space.
00:57:37We ain't gonna do it out here every day.
00:57:38You wouldn't even imagine.
00:57:39Right?
00:57:40And there's no safe place for us to land.
00:57:42There's no safe place for us to have these conversations.
00:57:44We can't have it with our homies.
00:57:45We can't have it with our brothers and our partners because it doesn't rest.
00:57:48It doesn't translate because they don't have life experiences.
00:57:51Right.
00:57:52They don't have that empathy there.
00:57:53Right?
00:57:54Yeah.
00:57:55They don't have that mothering, that nurturing thing.
00:57:58You know?
00:57:59And this is like for me, it's real because, you know, when you buried as many people as
00:58:07I have, right?
00:58:08Or seeing people go to prison for long periods of time, or just seeing people fall to the
00:58:13hospital, you know, they're all missing a certain element.
00:58:17And the element is to be able to have a safe space, the process.
00:58:21Because when you're in pain and you're in odds, and I've been in pain most of my career.
00:58:25Like I've been the angry black man for sure.
00:58:27Really?
00:58:28Yeah.
00:58:29Because I was just mad at the world because I'm like, why do I have to keep fighting these
00:58:32battles?
00:58:33Not that I'm not a fighter.
00:58:34Right?
00:58:35No, we all are.
00:58:36You don't want to have to fight through it.
00:58:37Right.
00:58:38It should be a joyful experience.
00:58:39And if you do, you want to be able to at least process with somebody who feels your pain
00:58:44and understands where you're coming from.
00:58:46They probably can give you some insight of what they think, but it's safe.
00:58:50And I feel like there's no safe spaces for us.
00:58:54And to ask you a question, I'm going to take your homework.
00:58:57I'm going to go home.
00:58:58What?
00:58:59Did I give you homework?
00:59:00Yeah, because I hear what you're going with this.
00:59:02I'm going to write my list of people that I should forgive.
00:59:06Yeah.
00:59:07I'm going to forgive them because my sister told me that it's okay to do so.
00:59:10That's right.
00:59:11I hope they don't think I'm soft.
00:59:12You are not soft.
00:59:13No, you got to.
00:59:14Because otherwise we're caring.
00:59:16I need to write.
00:59:17Listen, I need to write the list.
00:59:18Well, what we write a list.
00:59:19Why don't you write your list and I write my list.
00:59:20Listen, I want to see whose list is longer because I got some shit on my list.
00:59:24I don't know about yours.
00:59:25I want to thank you for your time.
00:59:27I want to thank you for your energy.
00:59:29I want to thank you for your realness.
00:59:32And I hope you understand how many lives this is going to affect and change because I promise you, a lot of the anger and resentment and the dumb shit that men do is coming from a place of not being able to be seen or heard.
00:59:47We're demonized and I can only imagine what it's like on the woman's side.
00:59:51But I hope that this will open up, you know, just that, that dialogue of being able to talk to each other.
00:59:58And like you said, being on the same team rather than fighting each other because I'm going through a real, real hard moment in my life.
01:00:06Like I felt it's something that I would have, you know, gave my life for it to work.
01:00:11The last question that I have is we have established that everything starts with love.
01:00:21But I don't think we can grow into that real deep love and acceptance that this whole conversation has been about without forgiveness.
01:00:31So what do you do when you know you have to forgive someone?
01:00:35For me, I'll tell you what I do.
01:00:39When I know that I have to forgive someone, when I'm in my bed quietly meditating, I literally send them love vibrations.
01:00:48I literally send them like visualize the person's face and I send them love vibrations because by me releasing love towards them,
01:00:59I no longer have to be connected to the negative feeling of being hurt and disappointed.
01:01:09I have actually sliced that, chopped that down.
01:01:12You don't have access to me.
01:01:14There may never be another conversation.
01:01:16But energetically, I know that I can send love to someone and it actually helps my healing.
01:01:22Now, whether they receive it or not, I don't really care.
01:01:25Right.
01:01:26It's more for me.
01:01:27And sometimes we don't need an explanation from the other person as to why it's so important to forgive.
01:01:37But I promise you, you could do all this work that you're doing right now.
01:01:43We could do all this, have these conversations.
01:01:46If you are not able to forgive, you will hit the wall again.
01:01:52Well, I'm going to say this, and I received that.
01:01:57I don't know if I'm sending anybody love vibrations in my bed.
01:02:02But what I will promise you, I will write my list.
01:02:07That's funny.
01:02:09See, this is what I was saying, man.
01:02:12No, because I was honest.
01:02:14You're like, no, I'm not sending no love vibrations because it ain't feeling like that right now.
01:02:19So what I'm going to do is I'm going to write my list.
01:02:21Yeah.
01:02:22And I'm going to forgive.
01:02:23Yeah.
01:02:24But I'm not going to forget.
01:02:26But see, I'm looking in your eyes, and I'm not really buying that.
01:02:30I'm going to forgive, but I'm not going to forget.
01:02:34That's halfway, right?
01:02:36That's halfway.
01:02:37Cut.
01:02:56I found.
01:02:57I'm not doing November vors xiadh on the front side.
01:03:00I'm not looking in my hand at Phillyx superior side.
01:03:02Not this whole point, doesn't happen.
01:03:04Be careful, but I can't.
01:03:05I'm not looking out for you guys personal issues and than Amber Bryant.
01:03:08And then I'm not looking for you with Mayor Br Давай baki, all the way you would make.
01:03:13I am not going to look forward to him.
01:03:15That's right.
01:03:17I am looking forward to him.
01:03:19I'm looking forward to him.
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