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00:01One's for sorrow, two's for joy
00:09Three's for a girl and four's for a boy
00:17Five's for silver, six for gold
00:23Seven's for a secret never told
00:32Devil, devil, I defy thee
00:40Devil, devil, I defy thee
00:46Devil, devil, I defy thee
00:55Good morning everybody, we had Storm Agnes yesterday
01:08that brought some strong winds and some heavy rains
01:10towards northern and western areas of the UK
01:12but Agnes is no more
01:14It's going to be a much quieter day for many of us actually
01:16We've got some sunny smells around this morning
01:18It was actually a really miserable morning
01:20You know, there was no sunlight breaking through
01:22It was quite bleak
01:24But it had been really windy the night before
01:30About seven o'clock in the morning
01:31a guy in the photography WhatsApp group that we were part of
01:34dropped a picture in the group of Sycamore Gap 3
01:36but it was on its side
01:39It was a very pixelated picture
01:41You couldn't really see it very clear
01:43And I was like, that's got to be a Photoshop
01:44You know, and all the lads in the group were like
01:46Nah, it's can't be real
01:47Can't be real
01:48I don't think it's real
01:51I don't think it's real
01:52Buses, I'll fly up
01:53And we just basically headed straight to the tree, you know
01:59I knew from the military road
02:00You could get a good sight of the tree side on
02:02I pulled up on the military road
02:16Got my camera, my big lens out
02:18Aimed it at the tree
02:19I was like, oh my god, it is
02:21It's down
02:32We headed up to the tree
02:33It was about eight o'clock-ish
02:37When we got to the tree, it was just like gobsmacked
02:39Absolutely gobsmacked
02:41I documented it all
02:46And I recorded a video
02:48You know, put it on my social media platforms
02:50I was like, look, this is actually happening
02:52Absolutely shocking
02:54Destroyed forever
02:56Really sad, isn't it?
03:02I remember thinking
03:03It's as if somebody went along with a still-so
03:05And cut the time bridge down
03:06The sorrow around, you know, just the sadness
03:11It was horrendous
03:18I remember going on a social media
03:20And it was just the most sickening, sickening feeling
03:25For astronomers like me
03:28Sycamore Gap was particularly special
03:31Because it's so photogenic
03:33With the symmetry
03:36The truth
03:43Seeing the tree lying there
03:45Dead
03:47It just felt
03:48It felt like, oh, it was a murder
03:53My initial thought was
03:55Has the storm taken it down?
03:59But, when it was hinted
04:01Very, very early on
04:03No, no, no
04:04Someone's actually-
04:05Someone's done this
04:06You can see the markings on the tree
04:07You can see all this stuff
04:10It completely changed
04:16Who in their right mind would do this, you know?
04:23You're talking about psychopaths
04:25Something awful's happened up at Sycamore Gap
04:28We've just managed to stand this up in the last few minutes
04:31The famous tree at Sycamore Gap has been cut down
04:34It's like stealing joy
04:36That tree was ours
04:37I'm sitting in a car park
04:38Weeping
04:39All that remains is a stump
04:40It was palpable, the shock in the community
04:53I saw it on Facebook
04:55I remember seeing the pictures
04:56Thinking it's a joke
04:57Is it April?
04:59Disbelief
05:02Anger
05:03You literally had your head in your hands
05:04Going, I can't believe this is happening
05:09I just don't understand why
05:14It was such a bizarre thing to happen
05:16We just couldn't work out why anybody would want to do that
05:19It had to be something malicious
05:22It would have to have been cut down
05:24Because some brain-dead idiot thought it would be good fun
05:37I was at work
05:38And I started hearing across the office
05:40That the tree had been felled or had fallen over
05:45No one knew what had happened
05:47So 999 calls were coming in
05:49Nothing to be a police
05:50How can I help?
05:51I've been shocked as he reported that the tree at Sycamore Gap
05:54has been cut down
05:56The tree's been felled overnight
05:59It's all like the social media
06:00Apparently someone felled in the tree at Sycamore Gap
06:03I don't know if you're aware
06:04I'm not aware at all
06:05It will be on the national news tonight, I guarantee it
06:10Yeah, just to confirm there's a variety of folk-taking photographs
06:15Police officers were dispatched to identify what was happening
06:17And in essence, get that scene controlled
06:20If you could just clear back a tad
06:22Just so we can gather as much evidence as we can
06:25Okay? Thank you very much
06:29Right, I cannot see any property lying about
06:32I cannot see any oil
06:34I can't see any footprints
06:36Obviously every man and his dog's trailed through here this morning
06:39There has been spray paint
06:42Sprayed around the base
06:44There's a clean cut three quarters of the way through
06:47There might be a local tree searching to be fair
06:56In this case, the victim is, for want of a better word, the tree really
07:00So, straight away, it's criminal damage
07:03Someone has unlawfully cut that tree down
07:07It was damaged to Hadrian's wall as well
07:11I work in the major investigation team
07:13And the majority of the incidents that we do with are homicides, criminal damage
07:18It isn't generally something that crops up in any of my investigations
07:20And my experience around trees, felling, anything like that is pretty much zero
07:29So I identified Detective Inspector Callum Meagle
07:33Because he worked in the rural crime team
07:39I never thought that I'd be in a position like I am today
07:42Talking about a criminal damage
07:45Because that is what it is
07:48The fact that somebody had chopped down the sycamore gap tree
07:54For me, it's an attack on people's, erm, the way people live
08:04The sycamore gap means an awful lot to a lot of people
08:09So the tree was planted about 130 years ago by a local landowner
08:19In a dip between two escarpments
08:22Right next to Hadrian's wall that was built centuries ago
08:28To people of the North East, it's been somewhere that has been visited for an awful long time
08:33Families would make a yearly pilgrimage
08:36Families would make a yearly pilgrimage
08:38People would go there and propose
08:42And scatter ashes
08:44The tree has been through so much
08:51World wars, storms
08:53So you always believe that it's going to be here forever
08:57It did feel like a friend
09:02I know it sounds silly
09:04But it felt like it was a gift
09:06Just for you
09:08So, yeah, it was really special
09:10For sure
09:11I wanted to find out who was responsible
09:26Crime scene investigators were dispatched
09:30When I reviewed the photographs
09:32I could see a wedge and hinge method had been used to fell the tree
09:36And I had a few puzzled faces as to, uh, how do you know that?
09:43Which I explained that my father was a forester
09:46And so I understood the technicalities
09:51So the wedge
09:53It's like a big bit of cheese that you see in a supermarket
09:56You know, it's that shape
09:58And it is cut out
10:02On the side that you're going to fell the tree
10:04And gets placed to one side
10:10Our crime scene managers searched around the tree itself
10:14However, we weren't able to find it
10:19So we were minus the wedge
10:22I thought, hmmm
10:24This is interesting
10:26If you're going to do something of this sort of significance
10:30You would take a trophy
10:31And the most obvious section would be the wedge
10:36So I made the decision not to release the fact that the wedge hadn't been recovered
10:42I wanted to keep that quite tight in the investigation
10:45If we were able to locate that wedge
10:48We could find the person who has committed this crime
10:51BBC Radio Newcastle
10:57At two o'clock police investigations are underway in Northumberland
11:01Police were all over the hillside
11:03It was like a murder scene
11:05It's part of the fabric of our community
11:06But today at tree
11:08We had every TV, news, company asking for interviews
11:18To the point of where I didn't know which one was which
11:21This grand old sycamore fells
11:23We thought someone was playing tricks on us and then we saw the news
11:28It's just mindless vandalism
11:30Whoever's done this needs to do some serious time
11:33Like serious time
11:34The video that I put on the social media
11:36The post hit like over two million views
11:38Which was just crazy
11:39Because I only had like a couple of hundred people following us
11:41And that's when all the rumours started to fly about
11:46What do you think of it? That someone could do that?
11:50My guessing is maybe a disgruntled local farmer
11:52Don't like tourists or just someone who's very sad
11:57As soon as a case hit media
12:00I knew that we would then generate intelligence
12:05Nothing but a police, how can I help?
12:07The lad who's local to the area
12:10He's always joking about felling the tree at Sycamore Gat
12:14And I don't know why you would want to do that
12:16Because it's probably the most iconic tree in Northumberland
12:19Now I've got a feeling it possibly could have been him
12:26One of the first calls made to police
12:29Put forward a young lad from the local area
12:33Out of genuine concern
12:35You know, it's just strange that he jokes about doing it
12:38You know, it's a shit thing to do, I think
12:43I remember wondering
12:45Could this have been committed by
12:48Somebody younger in years
12:50Who hasn't seen the potential significance of his actions
12:56So we need to act quickly
12:58And make sure that we don't lose pieces of evidence
13:00Now the keeper were the hunting goal
13:02And under his army carried a bow
13:04All far to shoot the merry little doe
13:06Among the leaves so green-o
13:07Jacky boy, master
13:08Singing well, very well
13:09Hay down, ho down
13:10Derry, derry down
13:11Among the leaves so green-o
13:12To my hay down, down
13:13To my ho down, down
13:14Hay down, ho down
13:15Derry, derry down
13:16Among the leaves so green-o
13:17Now the first door he shot
13:20Hull whistle is the closest town to Sycamore Gap
13:23There's the Pennines on one way and then there's the Roman Wall behind you
13:27Jacky boy, master
13:28Singing well, very well
13:29Hay down, ho down
13:30Derry, derry down
13:31Hull whistle is the closest town to Sycamore Gap
13:35There's the Pennines on one way and then there's the Roman Wall behind you
13:39Jacky boy, master
13:40Singing well, very well
13:41Singing well, very well
13:42Hay down, ho down
13:43Derry, derry down
13:44Edge of the world kind of place, I think
13:46We're like the frontier
13:48The northern frontier
13:50Among the leaves so green-o
13:56I run a 14-bed holiday home
13:58I run the local Facebook page for Visit Hull whistle
14:01I'm a local councillor on the town council
14:03I volunteer in the charity shop
14:05And I also work one day a week in the shoe shop
14:08And I'm supposed to be retired
14:10In Hull whistle, a lot of people depend on tourism
14:16And lots of people come to the area to visit the tree
14:19Two chops, yeah
14:20Brilliant, thank you
14:214.99
14:22There's not much other than cattle and sheep and tourism
14:26Flash!
14:27It's taking more Gap
14:28It's just a tree on Hadrian's Wall
14:30Nobody ever thought about it, he talked about it or nothing
14:32Until Kevin Cousiner came to do the film there
14:35I am home!
14:36Woo!
14:37The tree looks absolutely fantastic
14:39In the film
14:40It's unbelievable now that the tree has gone
14:45People come into the pub at least a dozen times a day
14:48And they'll literally say
14:49Can you tell me where the tree is?
14:50The one that used to be in Robin Hood
14:52We sell more Sycamore Gap than all of the other beers put together
14:55We have a wine called Under the Sycamore
14:58We have Sycamore Gap Gin
15:00And then I have a tree which lights up as well
15:02So yeah, anything with Sycamore
15:04Everyone just wanted to know who it is, who's done it and why
15:10Northumbria police have confirmed they've arrested a 16 year old boy this afternoon
15:17The tree in Sycamore Gap is...
15:19And all of a sudden I heard that a young 16 year old kid was being arrested
15:25And he was from around this local area
15:28We literally couldn't believe it
15:30We couldn't understand why
15:35Once the rumours started flying about
15:37About the 16 year old lad who was arrested
15:39Everybody started like a witch hunt
15:41I remember going on social media and it was quite like
15:43Pretty nasty stuff
15:44When I was thinking
15:48I want to make sure this is actually correct
15:50Because this could ruin a kid's life
15:59Everybody focused on him and it was going to be him
16:01And I was like, you've got to think about it
16:03How can a 16 year old go up there and chop down that tree?
16:07It can't be him
16:14Searches were conducted and also he was interviewed
16:17He categorically denied being responsible for the criminal act
16:23He provided an alibi which checked out
16:26So he was quickly ruled out of the investigation
16:36I do know the 16 year old
16:38And I know that it has had a negative effect on him
16:41He was totally innocent
16:44At that point in time
16:47At that point in time
16:48Given the nature of the information that was passed to the investigation team
16:52You have to have investigated that properly
16:56Because that's justice
16:59But the next arrest
17:01We needed to get it right
17:03There is anger and dismay in Britain this morning
17:15A tree that has stood in northern England for hundreds of years
17:19Has been chopped down
17:21And police say it was a deliberate act of vandalism
17:24The fact of vandalism is just about England
17:27The film with Kevin Costner and Morgan
17:29Within 24 hours
17:31It had gone from local
17:33To national
17:34To international
17:36Global news
17:37The pressure that subsequently came with that
17:44Is quite considerable
17:45The tree stood in north Umberland
17:48In the north end of England
17:54I needed to go up to the scene
17:55And search for potential evidence
17:57So myself and Becky the boss
18:00Traveled together
18:01It seemed quite surreal when I looked where the Sycamore Gap is
18:08And it wasn't there anymore
18:10That's when the gravity of what had happened
18:13Started to sink in
18:14We'd parked up in steel rigged car park
18:24Which is the car park adjacent to where you would start the walk
18:27Towards Sycamore Gap
18:31The first thing was looking at
18:33Which route would they have taken
18:34What direction would they have come in
18:36What would they have been carrying
18:37Would have been one person
18:38Would have been more than one person that was involved
18:44I could see straight away
18:47The stump was laid bare
18:54I knew that
18:55As soon as a cordon was taken down
18:58People were going to be walking on the stump
19:00So what I wanted to do
19:01Was maintain the integrity of that first cut
19:03So the best way that I could do that
19:06Was to take a section of the entire stump
19:14I think people were quite shocked
19:18You know it had already been cut once
19:20And now the police were coming
19:21And they were taking sections away
19:26Actually having the surfaces that were cut on that night
19:29We would have the best possible way of matching up tool marks
19:32To potential chainsaws
19:38It was a scene that provided quite significant challenges
19:42It's a very, very rural location
19:45There's plenty of sheep
19:47But unfortunately there are no cameras
19:50There are no witnesses
19:52We had a Twice Brood Inn
19:56That was as close to the scene
19:59That we were going to get
20:01The police started coming in
20:07Looking at CCTV
20:09Because we have it angled right round the pub
20:16This camera looks across our car park
20:18And you can see Sycamore Gap over here in the corner
20:20You couldn't quite see the tree
20:22Because it's just in the dip
20:23But you didn't see the military road
20:25Right outside the front of the pub
20:26The cameras do have automatic night vision as well
20:33We had a little look
20:34But I couldn't see anything
20:35So he just downloaded everything he needed
20:38We were like
20:39Imagine if there's someone parks in our car park
20:41And you see them take a chainsaw out
20:43I'd be like, oh my god
20:50So we're at a point now
20:51Where we were really limited with what we had
20:54We needed assistance from the local community
20:58After the 16 year old was released
21:08There was lots of talk in the town
21:10About who and what and why
21:12And lots of theories of why people had done it
21:15It was a social media day
21:22I thought, you have got to be joking
21:27Everybody was like naming people
21:29I think it was Bob who lives down the road
21:31I think it was him
21:32I think it was him
21:33Just because they have a chainsaw
21:38The thing is
21:39Most people around here have got chainsaws
21:41I've even got a chainsaw
21:43We've all got chainsaws
21:46We've all got chainsaws
21:50They asked me nothing dear police
21:51How can I help?
21:52I've just seen someone make a bit of an odd post on Facebook
21:55They shared a meme about cutting a tree down with a butter knife
21:58They shared a post about cutting us down with a butter knife
22:01Not about specifically cutting the sycamore gap tree down with a butter knife
22:05One of the kids in my lesson today
22:09Was talking about cutting down the tree the other day
22:12I think he was your team
22:14And I was like, I'm worried
22:15It's a way of things to jerk them out
22:16Isn't it?
22:17Yeah
22:20Welcome here, please can I help?
22:22I've got a possible suspect
22:23He's got a motive
22:24We shall pass on to you
22:25I've got no evidence
22:27A local farmer believes they've got the name of the possible suspect
22:31Right, okay
22:32Have you got any details for the farmer?
22:33We had quite a number of names being put forward
22:37And there was a recurring name
22:40There's a chap called
22:42The name I've been given is
22:45He's getting chucked out of his house
22:47Part of the evidence against him has come from the National Trust
22:50And who was the sycamore gap tree
22:52Master of the Trust
22:54When you've got somebody being put forward on a number of occasions
22:57It will always, you know, prick your interest
23:00As a local living in Holtwistle
23:03Everyone is naming one man
23:08He had knowledge and previous experience
23:11And he also had a real motive to potentially commit this criminal act
23:20That night on day two, the second arrest was made
23:25Certainly there was a potential grudge with the National Trust
23:29Is this revenge?
23:33A second person has been arrested in connection with the felling of the sycamore gap tree
23:37We've just been told that a man in his 60s has been arrested by Northumbria police
23:43People are starting to think that somebody did this
23:45Who had a grudge against the National Trust
23:50Everyone believed it
23:51Everyone in the local area started to think
23:53Okay, that makes sense
23:54Maybe that's what happened
23:56I hope they throw the book at, you know, whoever did it
23:58We don't know who
23:59We wait for some news
24:03During the interview
24:04He provided an account of his whereabouts
24:08Which we were able to confirm
24:11He categorically denied
24:14Any involvement, any knowledge
24:16He said he wasn't fit enough
24:18To have committed this offence
24:21So I was satisfied that he wasn't involved
24:25And it was decided that he could be released
24:29Come to the Chi
24:31With me, Malone
24:34Within 48 hours
24:35We had interviewed and bailed two people
24:39We had names, we had people being put forward
24:41But we really didn't have anything solid
24:48As it happens, it was just complete hearsay
24:50You know, it wasn't true at all
24:52I got fed up of listening to
24:55It could be this, it could be that
24:57You need concrete proof
24:59And I thought, the police, they need to get their act together
25:02The eyes of the world were looking at this investigation
25:06And what was Northumbria police doing
25:07About identifying who was responsible for cutting this famous tree down
25:09Gang to the Chi
25:20With me, Malone
25:30It was a hard period of time
25:34We really didn't have anything to go on
25:36to go on i do get very invested in what i do because if i lose interest it would be a case
25:44that you know was never solved but i was never going to lose interest in this
25:53so i went back through the calls
25:55um i'm phoning regarding the cut down tree at sycamore gap
26:08there was one witness who was in his camper van on that night
26:14i was parked in the nearest car park called steel rig car park all night as far as anybody knows
26:29i've been the only vehicle here with no plausible explanation so i kind of don't want to be accused
26:36of cutting the tree down when you woke up in steel rig car park to find quite a number of people there
26:45he contacted an assembly police
26:49but the information he was able to provide was quite key
26:56when i turned up in the car park there was nobody here and i turned up about 10 half 10
27:00and obviously i went to sleep but one o'clock in the morning i was woken up by a vehicle leaving the
27:05car park
27:11all i know is that it was a four by four of some description i know that just by hearing it start up
27:17because i'm a mechanic
27:18i didn't hear it turn up but it woke me when it left at one o'clock in the morning
27:30that information meant that we could look at the twice brood in the cctv footage at that specific time
27:37around about one o'clock in the morning you can see a set of lights
27:50there's a vehicle traveling along the military road
27:53in a westerly direction almost an hour earlier at 23 55 hours there was a set of lights
28:04that had traveled in an easterly direction
28:07in the background you can see the vehicle turn off the military road heading up the minor road
28:19and out of sight
28:27up that road is the steel rig car park
28:40so that gave us 63 minutes and that would give enough time to walk from the steel rig car park
28:48to the gap fell the tree return and drive away past again
28:58so now we can use other CCTV opportunities to start looking at the potential journey into the area
29:04so now we can use other people to start looking at the potential journey into the area
29:10however in october everything changed
29:18we received an anonymous tip-off identifying two individuals
29:23daniel graham and adam carruthers we've never heard of those individuals before
29:28the tip-off made mention of the fact that these two lads had retained a section of the tree
29:43the fact that a piece of the tree hadn't been recovered that information that detail wasn't known
29:48i think at that point that's when i realized actually there's something significant here
29:53you think right okay what do we know about them what do we need to know
30:00daniel graham was on facebook has been a ground worker and quite obviously was involved in tree
30:08surgery i was expecting that they would have been from the local community however both individuals
30:16reside in the carlisle area which is quite strange there's quite a distance from carlisle across to the
30:21they're sick and more gap tree
30:28i remember taking a phone call from the intelligence unit he said i've ran the vehicles associated to
30:35them across ampr and he says there's a range rover that's registered to daniel graham
30:44and it travels from cumbria into northumbria police area and then an hour and a half later
30:52travels back out again and does exactly the same route but in the reverse
31:00spoke to the boss and said fasten yourself in i think we've really got something going here
31:05and it was at that point i raised them as suspects
31:08i wanted to arrest simultaneously to prevent any collusion between the two
31:20daniel graham lived in a piece of land in a caravan
31:23there were lots of outbuildings it's quite a chaotic location
31:29are you gonna let these dogs in the kennel i sure are they all right they're friendly
31:36covered in mud that's all oh that's all right is it daniel
31:39all right what
31:44daniel at this time okay i'm going to arrest you on suspicion of criminal damage okay
31:49we want an interview regarding the damage okay
31:51we'll call on underneath yeah i'm not gonna i'm gonna let me colleagues stay and you watch you put
31:59some clothes on i put some clothes on that's just when we arrest you we can't leave you on
32:03your own but i'll step out and i'll let you think hi
32:11i led the team that went to adam carruthers
32:16adam carruthers address was in an old airfield
32:19i woke him knocking on his caravan window it was certainly not something that he was expecting at
32:27that point in time
32:30for them to be traveling to custody was a relief
32:38okay the time now is uh 15 55 it's the 31st of october 2023
32:45daniel you're responsible for criminal damage namely felon of a tree at sycamore gap no no
32:53dan can you recall your movement on that night i'll be honest with you it's a month ago and i
32:57haven't a fucking clue you haven't got a clue i don't know would you recall if you had done anything
33:02out of the ordinary i think if i'd cut that tree down a bit and turned around here to say how
33:06my work where i was that day yeah i didn't cut that trade out from that day i didn't do anything
33:12exciting anything exciting last night or the night before good time we had them three days
33:17ago four days ago i couldn't have a clue that's for a month i honestly don't know well
33:24daniel graham seemed quite calm and quite ready to answer questions
33:31even in his posture when he was being interviewed he was very laid back he was quite
33:35almost arrogant
33:45um do you understand what you've been arrested for
33:50so you've been arrested on suspicion of criminal damage
33:53yeah yeah and it's in relation to the tree that was cut down in second wall gap
33:58yeah yeah do you have any knowledge about who's responsible but none at all
34:06like i just had a new baby on the 15th of september and my partner shared a cesarean so i was like
34:13around helping her so between this period the 23th the 28th of september would you have left
34:19company i wouldn't have thought so adam was non-committal his response was quite often i wouldn't have
34:31thought so you weren't in that area no i wouldn't have thought to
34:37it's quite an unusual answer either no you weren't or i don't think so i wouldn't i wouldn't have thought
34:44so like um i wouldn't have thought so no what about a lad called dan dan graham
34:56yeah i know dan you know dan how do you know dan it was quite weird i would have gone to be fair
35:02um he has just uh let me finish his dad's land rover before me dad died my dad's on
35:11road they're ready it's fucked so i put it into adam really well it's that's kind of a little
35:15mind and i understand she picked up that's pretty much one of the people i say it's got every day
35:21one of the best i'm not going to make to go to friends does it sound could be yours do you want
35:26his sometimes it comes to mind sometimes it always does adam stay up at your place no
35:33no i'm just asking if if as a friend he may stay you know for me do you have a stay at this no
35:47i was overseeing and managing the interviews
35:50and then also at the same time receiving updates from the two scenes
35:55so daniel graham's property was a piece of land with a large static caravan um and some
36:05outbuildings filled with all manner of agricultural machinery
36:15the black range rover was immediately secured
36:25the vehicle was transported to northumbria place where we could conduct a forensic analysis
36:39to see if we could identify further evidence
36:45have you got any reason why a range level will be in that vicinity
36:49the search has continued and within some of the small outbuildings there were chainsaws hanging on
37:17the wall
37:21obviously nasty questions do you want a chainsaw
37:26right i would be able to link those to the felon as a tree
37:30they wouldn't be big enough right would you have access to that if you had if you get a bigger saw
37:39they were fairly short bar saws
37:42they didn't have the sufficient blade length for chopping down the sycamore gap tree
37:47it doesn't work for you it is tree work it was tree work yeah
37:55would you say adam's pretty good at tree work yeah yeah yeah
37:59who's it you work for adam hey i worked for a few people to be fair
38:03um so i just like help out doing a mechanic sort of thing and have you had any training and uh
38:10train saw up in chainsaws or anything you want to ask no not a lot like if i'm honest i'm not really
38:14keen on them to be fair because they are nasty things
38:17adam was trying to push himself away from any capability and use of a chainsaw yet his friend
38:29stated that actually he was really quite handy with a saw have you done with all the trim before
38:35no no not not to my not to my memory like i've i've never you're saying you've never filmed one
38:42and you wouldn't know how to do it no i wouldn't i wouldn't have had to try it that way you start to
38:48think we're on the right tracks here at that point in time detective constable kim reed had been
39:07seconded onto the team and i asked kim to prioritize the devices seized from daniel graham and adam crullers
39:15was that your phone yeah yeah that's a lot adam had what we would refer to as a burner phone it was
39:24a very small phone with very limited capabilities and they've both said you'll never find anything
39:29on my phone what about the password should you have a password normally people don't provide pins
39:37to the phones if they have something to hide so when dan gives his pin code i had a bit of a
39:42sink and feeling and think they've got nothing to hide they're willing to help you that's my
40:00livelihood that's my livelihood that's my life coming in these days it's my livelihood because
40:04i don't usually put my name on the press that'll be locked up that's my business focus probably by
40:09time i got up here and i have to get on to me i'm going to be the center of the facebook because
40:14my news tied to this
40:22when the search had been concluded we failed to find anything that could clearly tie adam into
40:29using chainsaws or being involved in that sort of industry there was nothing else significant
40:35found on either of the searches
40:39and also unfortunately we failed to locate the wedge
40:48have you traveled with dan graham and his range rover into this area
40:52i wouldn't have thought so look okay uh concluding the interview with aaron corrales all right so
41:00i'm going to turn the interview i've got nothing further else than your colleagues
41:02will pass all the questions after you've conducted your interviews you've got to understand whether
41:09you are at a point where you could potentially go for charge we weren't at that point
41:15so on the evening of the 31st daniel graham and adam caruthers were bailed suspicion of criminal damage
41:25and have been bailed while inquiry there was an awful lot of work to do on both suspects
41:38this case had obviously been going for about a month with very little evidence
41:44and we needed something on their phones with one of our digital officers i reviewed dan's phone
41:51and we just opened the camera roll and then we went to the date of the the 27th 28th of september
41:57first one was a black video
42:03so we started to play the video
42:08you can kind of see some shadows on it and we could just hear sounds of wind
42:14and then all of a sudden we just heard sounds of a chainsaw
42:29we couldn't really believe what we were hearing
42:34and i remember thinking i need to ring callum and i need to tell him now
42:37i received a phone call from kim she said there's a video so i rapidly put the phone down and traveled
42:49back to the northeast
42:50the video was very dark and grainy
43:03it was undoubtedly the sound of a chainsaw
43:08and then there was the sound of a tree cracking
43:13and falling to the ground
43:21you can hear a tree crash into the floor
43:23i was astounded and i remember thinking this is it
43:40potentially you've got fantastic evidence but that has to be presented evidentially to prove
43:48that that is that tree because at the moment i was i had a black screen
43:56i spoke to our digital unit and said you know we need to get this all enhanced as fast as possible
44:05i continued just to review this phone
44:10when i looked in the camera roll i could see a little image
44:12so i opened that one up next
44:21i'm not a wood expert but it does look like a bit of a wedge of a tree that had been cut out
44:26next to a chainsaw
44:28that surely can't actually be the bit of wood that we're looking for
44:32are they really going to be that silly to to cut it down carry it and then take a picture of it
44:37this photograph linked back to the tip-off that said that they'd retained a section of the tree
44:47but how do i prove that that wedge came from the sycamore tree
45:07this is the slab from the sycamore gap this surface here is the original cut
45:21it's a massive piece of history it's quite something
45:36we enlisted the help of a forensic botanist and he was able to identify firstly the fact that the image
45:43was of a piece of sycamore but then he started looking at the characteristics of the wedge
45:51photographs were taken of the slab and he was able to overlay the picture of the saw and the wedge in
46:00the back of the car
46:01this t-shape lined up perfectly with the t-shape that we see on the image of the wedge in the back of the range over
46:19it's like putting the jigsaw piece in it just sticks into place
46:23the scar affectionately nicknamed the harry potter scar is likely to have been damaged to the tree
46:33as it was growing it is unique as a fingerprint
46:42i would say it's some significant evidence
46:47we had to get them re-arrested they've got some tough questions to answer now we need to know what's
46:54been going on
47:04so
47:26you
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