- 5 weeks ago
In this episode of Powerhouse, Diego Sanchez interviews Mike Malloy, CEO of Sage Home Loans, and Sakhi Gandhi, Director of Partnerships at Robinhood. They discuss the partnership between Sage and Robinhood, aimed at simplifying the mortgage process for homebuyers. The conversation covers the seamless experience provided to Robinhood Gold customers, the competitive mortgage rates offered, and the strategic focus of both companies on enhancing consumer finance accessibility. The episode highlights the importance of technology and efficiency in the mortgage industry and the future growth strategies of both organizations.
Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:
Sage Home Loans aims to revolutionize the mortgage industry by simplifying the process.
Robinhood's mission is to democratize finance and make investing accessible.
The partnership between Sage and Robinhood focuses on creating a seamless customer experience.
Sage offers competitive mortgage rates due to operational efficiencies.
The collaboration is designed to enhance the value for Robinhood Gold subscribers.
Sage's proprietary technology enables a digital-first mortgage experience.
The branding experience integrates both Sage and Robinhood for transparency.
Robinhood Gold has no minimum balance but an annual fee for access to benefits.
Sage is focused on growth and plans to expand its market presence.
The ultimate goal is to create a financial super app for consumers.
Related to this episode:
HousingWire - Sage Home Loans partners with Robinhood for exclusive rate offer
https://www.housingwire.com/articles/robinhood-gold-sage-mortgage-offer/
Sakhi Gandhi LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sakhi-gandhi-b8171257/
Mike Malloy LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-malloy-977813143/
The Power House podcast brings the biggest names in housing to answer hard-hitting questions about industry trends, operational and growth strategy, and leadership. Join HousingWire president Diego Sanchez every Thursday morning for candid conversations with industry leaders to learn how they’re differentiating themselves from the competition. Hosted and produced by the HousingWire Content Studio.
Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:
Sage Home Loans aims to revolutionize the mortgage industry by simplifying the process.
Robinhood's mission is to democratize finance and make investing accessible.
The partnership between Sage and Robinhood focuses on creating a seamless customer experience.
Sage offers competitive mortgage rates due to operational efficiencies.
The collaboration is designed to enhance the value for Robinhood Gold subscribers.
Sage's proprietary technology enables a digital-first mortgage experience.
The branding experience integrates both Sage and Robinhood for transparency.
Robinhood Gold has no minimum balance but an annual fee for access to benefits.
Sage is focused on growth and plans to expand its market presence.
The ultimate goal is to create a financial super app for consumers.
Related to this episode:
HousingWire - Sage Home Loans partners with Robinhood for exclusive rate offer
https://www.housingwire.com/articles/robinhood-gold-sage-mortgage-offer/
Sakhi Gandhi LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sakhi-gandhi-b8171257/
Mike Malloy LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-malloy-977813143/
The Power House podcast brings the biggest names in housing to answer hard-hitting questions about industry trends, operational and growth strategy, and leadership. Join HousingWire president Diego Sanchez every Thursday morning for candid conversations with industry leaders to learn how they’re differentiating themselves from the competition. Hosted and produced by the HousingWire Content Studio.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Welcome to Powerhouse, where we interview the biggest names in housing and ask them
00:12about their strategy for growth.
00:15I'm Diego Sanchez, president of HousingWire, and my guests today are two special ones.
00:20It's Mike Malloy, CEO of Sage Home Loans, and Saki Gandhi, director of partnerships
00:27at Robinhood.
00:28Mike and Saki, it's so great to have you on the show.
00:32Thanks.
00:32Glad to be here.
00:34It's a pleasure.
00:36All right.
00:36So we're going to get right into it.
00:37This should be a great conversation.
00:40Mike, for those in the industry that aren't familiar, what is Sage Home Loans?
00:45So Sage Home Loans is part of a larger organization called Red Ventures, and we're still growing
00:51in the mortgage industry, but Red Ventures has been here for 25 years, one of the nation's
00:55leading digital marketing companies, and a company that's founded on two core pieces
01:01of DNA.
01:02One, great digital experiences that allow people to make the best decisions they can, and
01:08second, partnering with other great brands to help them achieve their financial and strategic
01:14goals.
01:15And so Sage is a mortgage company built on that same DNA, and the Robinhood collaboration
01:23is the best example of how we're taking that Red Ventures DNA and putting it into practice.
01:29All right.
01:30So, Saki, same question for you.
01:31What is Robinhood?
01:34Robinhood started out about 10 years ago with a simple mission of democratizing finance for
01:40all.
01:41I say simple, and we started out by basically making investing easier for everybody.
01:48If you remember, 10 plus years ago, you had to have a broker in the middle that you'd be
01:53contacting to make your investing decisions.
01:56Now you can simply do it on an app, and you're not paying high fees while doing that.
02:02And so Robinhood started out with that mission.
02:04And over the last 10 plus years, we've kind of expanded into different assets.
02:08Providing access to mortgages being our most recent venture with Sage, which is very exciting.
02:17But the idea really stemmed from making a user's financial journey as seamless as possible and
02:25making it accessible for the everyday American.
02:28All right.
02:29I'm hearing a very common theme between those two company descriptions.
02:32We're trying to simplify the consumer finance experience, which can be very not simple at
02:39times.
02:40So, Mike, two weeks ago, Housing Wire reported on a new partnership between Sage and Robinhood,
02:48which you referred to in your intro.
02:50Can you walk us through this partnership?
02:53Yeah.
02:54And so the collaboration between Sage and Robinhood is those two missions coming together.
03:01Here at Sage, we talk about we want to revolutionize the mortgage industry by making mortgage simple.
03:08Right.
03:09At the same time, Robinhood, as Saki said, is about democratizing finance.
03:15Right.
03:16Those two things work perfectly together.
03:18You think about how we can simplify, how we can make it easy, how we can make mortgage more
03:24accessible.
03:26Right.
03:26For all of those folks on Robinhood's platform who are thinking about how do I make my get
03:33control of my finances?
03:34How do I simplify access?
03:36How do I make things easy, make things simple?
03:40Right.
03:40That partnership is the most important thing we're doing here in order to drive those missions
03:49forward.
03:50And so is there a handoff to Robinhood or from Robinhood to Sage at some point?
03:57How does that experience go?
03:59Because sometimes in these consumer finance partnerships, that handoff can be a sticky point
04:04or a point of friction.
04:05And I'll ask that question of you, Saki.
04:08Yeah, there is a handoff.
04:11So essentially, this offering is available to our Robinhood Gold customers.
04:17We have just a little bit of a shy of 4 million gold subscribers on the platform today.
04:23Our mission with gold is to make it truly the most valuable financial subscription out
04:28there in the market.
04:30Gold comes with a lot of different benefits, you know, from a 3.5% APY match, a 3% retirement
04:37benefit, you know, lower commission on futures trading, many such things, research access
04:44from Morningstar, and mortgage is the newest benefit there.
04:49And so for a gold subscriber, you know, they're able to experience that benefit.
04:53They get a significant discount on their mortgage rate, which is super meaningful, especially
05:00in this particular economy where like there's rising interest rates.
05:04This home ownership is becoming more and more inaccessible, if anything else.
05:08And so they go through the journey.
05:10We learn a little bit about them on our platform.
05:12And we basically have a seamless handoff with Sage where, you know, the entire application
05:18process and the funding of the loan, et cetera, is completed on the Sage platform.
05:23So it's super seamless and frictionless, as much as possible we could.
05:28And what we really valued in this relationship is both Sage and Robinhood have the shared values
05:34of like simplicity, as you alluded to earlier, Diego, being tech forward, making sure that
05:40we're digital first.
05:41Like if you remember, there's been definitely times where, you know, homeowners have had to
05:46sit down with someone and sign like a gazillion documents.
05:49Um, we really wanted to make sure that digital first experience was a part of this, uh, because
05:56that's what Robinhood has had for our, for our customers from day one.
06:00And that's how Sage works as well.
06:02And this partnership together with both companies just made a lot of sense.
06:06Yeah.
06:07Picking up on that, Diego.
06:09So someone will start a Robinhood subscriber, gold subscriber will start in the Robinhood app
06:14or the desktop, but most folks start on the app.
06:16They'll move into, into, they'll see something, they'll say, Hey, I have an interest here.
06:22They'll then move down a digital pathway.
06:25It'll be completely seamless.
06:27It looks the same.
06:28It feels the same.
06:29The branding's the same.
06:31The landing pages are the same.
06:33It's all built on that digital DNA of both organizations and that idea of simplicity.
06:38And then when we're getting into the things where we need licensed folks and the Robinhood
06:44team is not doing it, it still moves down a path that looks and feels very much similar,
06:51but then it'll be just, you know, in the Sage modality.
06:55It'll be in our digital systems and then with our team, but all based on that exact same idea
07:01that we can make it simple, we can make it consistent, we can make it feel like a seamless
07:07experience.
07:08And that's exactly what both teams spent a lot of time, effort, energy, you know, making
07:13happen across the last six months.
07:15Yeah.
07:16I want to ask more about this, this platform and this, and this seamless experience, because
07:20to Saki's point, I've gone through mortgage processes that had a bit, had been extremely
07:25difficult and extremely paper intensive.
07:27And moving between different platforms and systems and back and forth between different
07:31people.
07:33Mike, have you built a proprietary technology platform at Sage so that you can create a more
07:40seamless experience for these Robinhood gold customers?
07:43Absolutely.
07:44And so, and, and it's, it's our Robinhood gold customers.
07:47It's also all the folks who do business with Sage.
07:50We have proprietary point of sale, proprietary CRM workflows.
07:54We do use an industry solution for, of course, our disclosures, our compliance, our reporting,
07:59but we also have proprietary product and pricing.
08:02And so all of those things allowed us to build a truly bespoke, right?
08:08Solution for our colleagues at Robinhood.
08:11So folks would make it look and feel like the incredible experience they get for all the
08:16other products they get through Robinhood.
08:18If they were, if Robinhood, you know, is delivering all these incredible things, like Saki said,
08:23across the investing and retirement and all those things.
08:26And then they got into something that felt, you know, sort of clunky, that wouldn't have
08:31been okay.
08:32And so that we spent a lot of time and energy together as a team, Robinhood and Sage working
08:37together to build that truly digital, truly seamless experience.
08:44And Saki, for your Robinhood gold customers, is the branding experience that this is a, a,
08:50a Robinhood mortgage powered by Sage or how, how do, how do they, do they ever see the Sage
08:55brand in the, in the process?
08:57They do, they do.
08:58They come across it and we've like natively embedded it into the offering and the experience.
09:03But as, you know, Mike was alluding to, like you, typically people start on the app, app
09:10is the, is like, you know, the largest touch point, but they'll see the, they'll see the
09:14benefit.
09:14They'll click through it.
09:15They'll indicate interest.
09:16They go through an in-app journey, which clearly specifies that this is powered by Sage
09:23and it is a partnership with Sage.
09:25So that when that official handoff happens for all the licensing purposes and stuff as well
09:30in the, in the Sage ecosystem, there's no surprises.
09:35Transparency is a very important tenant for anything that we do here at the business.
09:40You know, you, you talked about earlier also like financial, the whole financial ecosystem
09:46feels very overwhelming, the consumer financial ecosystem.
09:49And so we want to make it as simple and transparent as possible for all the consumers that we're
09:55bringing on to our platform.
09:56$4 million is a lot of, a lot of Robinhood gold customers.
10:01Does that require a minimum balance or annual fees of some kind?
10:05No minimum balance.
10:07There is an annual fee associated with it.
10:10It's a, it's $60 a year or five bucks a month, either or.
10:14Um, but truly the value that you're getting in terms of all the different benefits across
10:19investing and other financial like parts of your life.
10:23Like I alluded to retirement, I talked about, uh, research access and stuff is just exponentially
10:29large in comparison to like that, um, small fee.
10:32But that, all that being said, we are constantly working on growing that and making sure that,
10:38um, you know, that the value that goes back in the consumer's hand is larger and larger
10:43by each passing day.
10:44Yeah.
10:45I mean, that's the best 60 bucks you're going to spend all year.
10:48I'm telling you.
10:50Well, I was just going to say I'm joining before I do my next mortgage.
10:52We reported that it's a 75 basis point discount on, on mortgage rates, which is really substantial.
11:00I mean, that can be an enormous, uh, payback on that membership fee.
11:04Uh, Mike, how is Sage able to offer such an incredible deal to Robinhood gold members?
11:12Yeah.
11:12Well, Diego, I always start, some friends have asked me the same thing.
11:15I start with, it's not that we can't do math, right?
11:17Uh, it's, it's, it's, it's, there's a, there's a core tenet of thinking about
11:22how you truly serve consumers.
11:25And our, our colleagues at Robinhood are an incredible example of this, which is when
11:31you can create efficiency in operations, you should pass that back to the end consumer.
11:38So I'll start with this, Diego.
11:40Our par rates are well below the industry average.
11:42Why?
11:43Because our cost to manufacturer loan is less than half of the MBA average, all in, including
11:49GNA and everything else, less than half, right?
11:53That's a massive advantage.
11:55We pass that along to every consumer we do business with.
11:58And then you think about, okay, well, there's also a big piece of this, which is how do you
12:02reach consumers?
12:03And that's an expensive thing that everyone in our industry knows, right?
12:07But here, our colleagues at Robinhood have created a platform, right?
12:1128 million total people, total subscribers, 4 million gold subscribers, right?
12:18So they have reached that audience.
12:20And so we put all of that value that they've done with building this incredible grand also
12:25into the offer.
12:27And so all of those things mean that we are still doing a wonderful loan.
12:32It's a great, it's a great collaboration across the board.
12:35But what we're doing is finding value through better efficiency and better reach to a client
12:43base and putting every bit of that value back into the end consumer.
12:49And we're seeing, you know, wonderful take up because people say, this is an incredibly
12:53valuable thing for me as a Robinhood gold subscriber to get.
12:58So, Saki, a question for you.
13:01Why did Robinhood decide to partner specifically with Sage around mortgage financing?
13:08I mean, I'm sure Sage has built a great platform, but there are other companies out there who
13:13talk about a pretty easy to use mortgage platform.
13:16Why Sage in particular?
13:18I mean, I touched on this a little bit earlier, Ben.
13:22You're right.
13:23There's a ton of great mortgage companies out there.
13:26But Sage really stood out for us.
13:28You know, their simplicity and design in general really resonated with how we build products
13:36for our customers here at Robinhood.
13:39Transparency was a very, very important tenant of like how we were operating and making sure
13:44that there's no hidden fees, et cetera, which a lot of different other mortgage providers
13:49do have in the back end, you know, was also important.
13:53And so we communicated that their team was exceptional to collaborate with, very forthcoming, really
14:00easy to work with.
14:01And so, you know, like everything from the alignment of passing value back to the customer,
14:08which Mike just alluded to, the efficiency in the process, the native experience that
14:13we were able to build despite the different like legal and, you know, technical challenges
14:18in the mortgage industry in general, as well as like what a true strong partnership it was
14:25between the two teams to work together so simply that it almost felt like an extension of our
14:31team.
14:31So all of that combined really helped Sage stand out to us and our broader leadership and our
14:38team that we like, you know, we really enjoyed the partnership and collaboration between the
14:43two companies so far.
14:45That's amazing.
14:46Mike, is Sage planning to do more partnerships kind of like this where you're empowering,
14:53you know, companies that operate in a tangential part of consumer finance with mortgage or are
14:59you going to focus on this one?
15:01So this Robinhood collaboration is our core focus right now.
15:07I got the date that went live here on my screen, on my sleeve.
15:11We are locked and loaded to serve every Robinhood gold subscriber and make sure they have a great
15:20experience.
15:20With that said, Diego, I know a lot of folks in the mortgage industry, but people are just
15:25getting to know Sage.
15:27We are the fastest growing mortgage company in America.
15:30We were, you know, less than a hundred million in total production in 2023.
15:35We'll do three billion this year.
15:37We'll do five to six next.
15:39And our goal is, is, is, is toward the top of the charts.
15:44But we do that with focus, with not doing things as a hobby, with being really, really, really,
15:52really good and keeping it really simple around the things we're great at.
15:56And so we're focused on making this Robinhood collaboration the very best it possibly can
16:02be.
16:03So we're serving every one of their subscribers, you know, every minute of every day.
16:09And so that's what we're locked in on.
16:11Yeah.
16:11I love focus and simplicity.
16:14And we keep talking about those two things in this conversation, Mike, it's pretty incredible
16:20growth, especially during a very tricky housing market when origination really, really plummeted.
16:27So congratulations on that.
16:29Beyond partnerships, what is your growth strategy for 2026 and beyond?
16:34Well, you know, I think keeping it simple is the core, making sure you focus on the things
16:42that you're good at and that drive, truly drive demand, right?
16:47How have we grown in a challenging market?
16:50Exactly what I said before.
16:51We've used proprietary technology, the ability to reach clients, customers, and efficiency
17:01and operations to pass value back.
17:04And we have found that people have responded to that.
17:08Our Robinhood Gold subscribers, other folks we've been able to do business with have responded
17:13very well with us.
17:14That's our growth strategy.
17:16Create an efficient market, simplify product offerings, simplify process, use data rather
17:25than documents, right?
17:27In order to deliver a truly, you know, one of a kind experience based on moving through
17:36a digital flow as if you're doing business with someone like Robinhood instead of as if you've
17:45got an 800 page stack of documents like we used to do in the mortgage industry.
17:50I've been in the industry for a minute.
17:52I know how that works.
17:53And we aspire every day to keep it simple like our colleagues at Robinhood rather than
18:00to go back to the old days of mortgage.
18:03Yeah, I mean, I love that simplicity.
18:06The cost to originate really stuck out.
18:09And, you know, a lot of the costs for IMBs and other mortgage lenders is in the people,
18:17specifically the LOs and the commissions that they earn.
18:21Are you compensating your LOs differently than most of the industry?
18:28We have an incredible group of LOs.
18:31They wouldn't work for me if I wasn't compensating them fairly.
18:34But we run a pure play, simple, direct consumer model, right?
18:40So we are not out on the street.
18:42We are running a sort of a, again, we are delivering them opportunities through Robinhood,
18:49through other channels we have that allow those folks to do an awful lot of more loans
18:54than others in the industry.
18:55That simplicity in our operation allows those and the technology stack we've built allows
19:03those loan officers to do four or five X what most people in the industry do, which
19:08means on a per transaction basis, it may be less.
19:11But those paychecks at the end of the month may make them very happy.
19:15And so we think about, again, efficiency, technology, simplicity in everything we do
19:21and just continue to leverage that to create a great experience.
19:26So, Saki, we'll end this conversation with you.
19:30Yeah, I used to be in your role at various companies, and I know that you kind of model
19:35out what the benefit could be to Robinhood before you sign a partnership.
19:40How have you thought about uptake in terms of those 4 million Robinhood goal members
19:44and how many each year could go through the mortgage process?
19:48You're asking me the fun technicals now.
19:56Unfortunately, I can't talk about specifics on the uptick, but the goal subscriber base
20:02is growing on an annual basis year over year hugely.
20:06Like, you know, I think when Mike and I started talking, like the numbers were much different
20:11than where they are right now, which is around 3.9 million subscribers.
20:15And so our goal is to make sure, as I mentioned earlier, that Robinhood Gold continues to be
20:23the most valuable financial subscription out there, basically a no-brainer.
20:28And there's something for just about everybody just embarking on their broader financial journey.
20:34So, you know, mortgage is our venture when I think about gold into something that is more
20:40mass market consumer, as well as an offering, making it more and more homeownership, more accessible
20:45for people.
20:47When we think about uptake and like adoption, while I can't say specifics, like the, you know,
20:54the interest in the offering has been great, which is why like we started out with a pilot
20:59and we got so much interest and traction from our customers that we ended up rolling out
21:06and like going full launch with it very, very soon after.
21:10So I hope that can give you guidance on like, hey, things are going well here and like subscriber
21:16base is growing.
21:17So there's something right that we might be doing when we think about gold holistically.
21:21But looking ahead, you know, this is one of our first larger partner powered offerings
21:29on gold.
21:30We hope to continue adding value back both through partner powered as well as Robinhood
21:35native products on gold.
21:37And, you know, hopefully these numbers on the gold subscriber base start to look even larger
21:42over time as people realize the value that the subscription can bring them in their everyday
21:47life.
21:47So that's the hope, that's the goal.
21:50And, you know, we want to make all of our consumers, investors and owners and be part
21:55of that financial journey that they're embarking on.
21:59Robinhood's end goal is to be that financial super app.
22:03And so as we think about 2026 and beyond for ourselves, it's really about unlocking access
22:08to more assets, more opportunities, more ownership, more capabilities on the platform that can
22:15get them, that can get us as close to that financial super app goal.
22:20And, you know, our consumers as close to their like financial empowerment goals.
22:25Well, kudos to both of you.
22:28Affordability is a major challenge, if not the major challenge in housing right now.
22:34And like I said before, 75 basis points takes a huge bite out of that affordability problem.
22:40Thank you both for joining me on the show today.
22:43Yeah.
22:43Thanks, Diego.
22:43Thank you for having us.
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