Like Tesla For Watercraft: This Entrepreneur Is Leading The EV Boom At Sea

Forbes

Imagine a Tesla for watercraft. Jonathan Lord and cofounders Ben Sorkin and Daylin Frantin started building electric boating company Flux Marine in 2018 after years of research at Princeton University. Seven years later, the pair have raised more than $30 million in funding to develop EVs for the sea. “Since age 14, I spent many days out on the water. I had the opportunity to see a beautiful environment—except for the noise and the smell of these gas engines,” Lord says. Flux Marine operates out of Bristol, Rhode Island, and builds high-performance electric outboard motors (up to 150 horsepower) and battery systems for small boats. Flux largely works  with existing manufacturers to power new builds—boats with Flux engines cost around $120,000. But it also offers some “repowers,” in which they’ll swap out old engines to make existing boats more climate-friendly. “The electric revolution is happening,” Lord says. “We’re really just at the beginning.”  Read the full story on Forbes:   Subscribe to FORBES: https://www.youtube.com/user/Forbes?sub_confirmation=1  Fuel your success with Forbes. Gain unlimited access to premium journalism, including breaking news, groundbreaking in-depth reported stories, daily digests and more. Plus, members get a front-row seat at members-only events with leading thinkers and doers, access to premium video that can help you get ahead, an ad-light experience, early access to select products including NFT drops and more:  https://account.forbes.com/membership/?utm_source=youtube&utm_medium=display&utm_campaign=growth_non-sub_paid_subscribe_ytdescript  Stay Connected Forbes newsletters: https://newsletters.editorial.forbes.com Forbes on Facebook: http://fb.com/forbes Forbes Video on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/forbes Forbes Video on Instagram: http://instagram.com/forbes More From Forbes:  http://forbes.com  Forbes covers the intersection of entrepreneurship, wealth, technology, business and lifestyle with a focus on people and success.

Transcript

00:00Most startups fail not because they run out of money.

00:02They're actually just building a product that no one wants.

00:04Making sure you're solving a customer pain point is critical.

00:17Jonathan Lord, thank you so much for joining me today.

00:20It's a pleasure to be here. I've been excited to come.

00:22I'm super excited to chat with you. You are the co-founder of Flux Marine.

00:25You guys are working on making the voting industry more electric.

00:29Can you tell me from your own words what you guys are embarking on today?

00:32Absolutely. So Flux Marine really started as a project back in college.

00:36And our goal was to really be the catalyst to electrify the marine industry.

00:40The marine industry as a whole is a huge contributor to global warming and pollution.

00:45And so we wanted to really have an outsized impact.

00:48And we looked at the engineering behind it, whether it's possible, whether it's feasible.

00:51And we looked at the market out there.

00:53And really no one was actually trying to take on electrification in the marine space.

00:57So we made a couple of prototypes and that was going on nearly 10 years ago now.

01:01And so we're now scaling manufacturing and doing our little bit to electrify the marine space.

01:06It's super cool. So in like practice, what does this mean?

01:09What were the prototypes you were working on?

01:10Is it an electric motor or what else are you guys creating today?

01:14Absolutely. So we build electric powertrains as a whole.

01:16So we don't build boats, but we build the motors, the batteries, the software that control them.

01:21So that's really our sweet spot is the vertical integration.

01:25So we build the battery packs.

01:26So we purchase battery cells from suppliers.

01:29And then we form them together, put the battery management system on it,

01:32which is really the brains of the system, married to a propulsion system.

01:36So we focus on outboard.

01:37So when you see boats with engines hanging off the back of the transom,

01:40there was the outboard powered boat.

01:41So we chose those because it's the largest part of the market,

01:45but also the fastest growing market segment.

01:47So that's some of the things we discovered early on.

01:49And we put our heads down, focused a few years prototypes of

01:54small lower power systems that we'd put on boats.

01:57Not all of them would work so reliably.

01:59And then after a few years of iteration, they're now working pretty awesomely.

02:04We have a lot of happy customers and they're all across the United States from

02:07Washington, California, Massachusetts, Maine, all the way down to the British Virgin Islands.

02:12It's really exciting to hear.

02:14You guys are based in Rhode Island now, but you are normally from Oxford, correct?

02:18Yes.

02:19So what has your experience with boating been in both of those locations?

02:23Absolutely.

02:23So I grew up in England, in Oxford, and I grew up sailing very small dinghies

02:28out either in the med or actually on reservoirs in England.

02:31So very much on the small scale, we'd have coaches who would have a rib next to us

02:36shouting at you through a megaphone.

02:38And that was really the earliest memories I have of being out on the water.

02:42And then through high school, I actually joined the rowing team.

02:45All through high school, I rowed.

02:46And again, we would have a coach in the launch boat with a gas engine powered.

02:51So ever since the age of 14, all the way through to college, I spent a lot of time,

02:56many days out on the water, early mornings, which had the opportunity to be a beautiful environment,

03:01except for the noise, the smell of these gas engines.

03:05I was going to ask, what was the impetus for building this with so many positive memories?

03:10When did you realize there are actually a lot of issues with the industry as well?

03:13Absolutely.

03:13I mean, from day one, it's always quite evident, the issues, the pollution being a primary one.

03:20But really, the motivation was just the opportunity to have an impact.

03:24The electric revolution was happening in the automotive industry in the mid-2010s when Tesla was

03:30coming around and it was really becoming evident that they weren't going to go bankrupt.

03:33And looking at the marine space, no one was really taking this ground up approach that was necessary.

03:38So we made a couple of prototypes, showed it around to people.

03:42People saw it, asked who built it, how much did it cost, where they can buy one.

03:46And that was really the motivation to go off, spend a few years manufacturing or

03:53learning to manufacture, building the system that builds propulsion systems.

03:58Right. So take me back to those early days. What did these initial prototypes look like?

04:01How different are they from what you guys create today?

04:04Incredibly different. Really, it's hard to compare. In the early days, our first prototypes were

04:09actually just battery systems. So learning how to make a battery system that was designed for the

04:13marine environment. What you can't do is just take an automotive battery and then marinize it.

04:18It really has to be designed from the ground up. So we started with the battery system

04:22and then moved to the drivetrain, the powertrain. So everything from the motor and the power head,

04:26we fully designed the entire the entire drivetrain. So one of our value propositions is that we actually

04:31have no legacy combustion architecture components within our system, which means that they're all

04:37designed around electrification for the marine environment, which allows us to really leverage

04:41all the benefits of electrification. So now our flagship system is 115 horsepower. We're pushing the

04:47envelope of going increasing the horsepower range as well as going down in horsepower's range to really

04:52service as much of the market as possible.

04:54Yeah. So for people who aren't familiar with the marine industry, what is that market? How wide

04:58are those margins that you're trying to reach, like the smallest and the largest?

05:02Absolutely. So on the small side, you can think of maybe one horsepower. So these are the small

05:06dinghies that you see around going out, often going out to a sailboat, for example, all the way up to 600

05:11horsepower. So 600 horsepower is the largest horsepower, but very few of those are sold. But about half of the

05:18entire of the entire space is under 150 horsepower. So that was, we looked at the first principles

05:23math of how much energy is needed, how much power is needed, what's that require for battery storage?

05:29What are the implications on weight of the boat? And we found that actually, if you complete this

05:34ground up design approach, we can scale up to about 150 horsepower with technology as it is today.

05:40And as battery technology continues to improve, the energy density of batteries improves, the power

05:44density of motors improves, we can continue to push that envelope. But right now, there's no one else

05:49in the market who has a more reliable, higher power system who's actually shipping systems out into the

05:55market. So what were the steps to get there? Because of course, we're talking about these very early

05:58prototypes and now what you have today, but I'm sure so much happened in the meantime. So what was the

06:04team that you had to build and the things that you had to start creating in order to get from point A to

06:08point B? So for a good few years, there was just the three of us, myself and my two co-founders.

06:13So we were at the time, just college students with a dream to have an impact. And we, after graduating,

06:19we bootstrapped for a while. So we'd enter pitch competitions, non-dilutive grants. So we'd fly

06:24around the country, we'd pack up our prototype into a suitcase and then reassemble it in whichever

06:30location where that was down in Texas in Savannah. How big were these prototypes at the time?

06:34So this was a 40 horsepower. So we, because we designed it from the ground up, it was actually quite

06:38lightweight. So between our two suitcases, uh, so about 40 kilos, um, we could get the entire

06:44outboard into it. Um, we would then have to maybe carry a couple of power electronics in our, in our

06:48hand luggage, which the number of TSA, uh, certificates that said they've looked through our

06:52system because they say, is this a lithium ion battery? No, it's definitely not. But are you sure

06:57it's not a lithium ion battery? It's like, yes, we're absolutely sure there is no batteries in this

07:00system, but it's a battery powered outboard. Um, so we had spent a good few years fundraising just

07:07for non-dilutive grants. Um, it was quite hard to go out and raise for equity with, without a

07:12prototype and without a functioning prototype. So that was really our goal is to build the minimum

07:16viable product, the idea, either idea, the product that fills a lot of the, uh, all the key components

07:22and the value propositions of the system. And actually a customer would be willing to pay for and

07:26use. So some of our early adopting customers were, were sailing, sailing fleets, um, sailing clubs who,

07:32uh, who wanted to, uh, not contaminate the sound and the environment with, uh, with pollution and

07:36sound. Um, and then we continue to just iterate and iterate until now we have just under 50 full-time

07:42employees. Um, we're based in Bristol, Rhode Island. We have about 45,000 square foot. Um, and

07:47we're now in the transition of ramping up production and turning what was originally just a very large

07:51workshop, uh, into a full-fledged factory. So walk me through, obviously you guys came into this for

07:57the impact of it. You realized that this was a problem environmentally, sustainability-wise,

08:01but what about on the business side of things? Like how did you realize that this was going to be

08:04a viable product to sell and to get money from investors and all the things that like from the

08:10business side of things really mattered when you were deciding to put your life's work into a company?

08:14Yeah, great question. So the motivation was really twofold. So the environmental aspect is,

08:18is certainly a key part of the motivation. Um, but really the experience of being out on the water,

08:24there are so many reasons why you would want to go out in the water, spend time with your family,

08:27with your friends. Um, but all the drawbacks, the maintenance, the noise, the hassle that are

08:32associated with combustion engines. And so those are lessons that we, we saw in parallels that we saw

08:36with the automotive industry that now electric vehicles, people don't necessarily purchase an electric

08:41vehicle because it's sustainable. Actually, there are still many challenges that have to be overcome with

08:45supply chains of batteries and, and rare earth metals, but, um, really the experience of actually

08:50these electric vehicles going out on the water. It's a surreal experience when you'll accelerate

08:55faster than any combustion power boat can accelerate, but you can still have a conversation of a room,

09:01room volume. So, um, it's, it's a combination of both the, the environmental impact, but also the

09:06opportunity to create a better boating experience. Um, is why we, we set out and, uh, and spent the last 10 years,

09:12uh, trying to develop it. And you guys have around 30 million in funding, correct? Yes. Yes.

09:16What has that conversation looked like with investors? Like why are they excited about this?

09:20So we have a lot of different types of investors. Uh, we're very fortunate to be working on an

09:23exciting product. So a lot of our early customers were, or sorry, I should say a lot of our early

09:28investors are also our customers. Um, so that was a large motivation for some of them. We have some

09:33family offices who are, who are very mission driven. Um, Ocean Zero actually led our last funding round,

09:38um, who's really trying to shine a light on the, um, impact, um, and the opportunity that, uh, the

09:44marine space can have and how, how bad of an impact it's having on the marine space.

09:49A lot of this conversation on sustainability really targets like the younger demographics,

09:54like Gen Z and even younger, really caring about sustainable practices and sustainable products,

09:58but the boating industry like does not really skew that young yet. So have those demographics also

10:05been so interested in the sustainability side of things? Are they just for the convenience of

10:10like being able to have a conversation or what has their like primary interest been and why you guys

10:15are a good fit? So the marine space is incredibly segmented. So depending on where you are, um, both

10:22in the U S and around the world, but also how you're using your boat, um, will have a strong impact on

10:27the motivation for, for buying electric systems. So for example, if you're a fisherman, uh, being able to

10:33troll around, um, on the lakes and not be polluting the water that you're fishing in, um, is a great, uh,

10:40great motivation for them. And also the, from a regulatory perspective, there's now thousands of

10:44lakes across the U S that ban the use of combustion engines. Um, so it opens up new markets, but, um,

10:50one really interesting thing we're seeing is that, um, the demographic of our customers is shifting

10:54lower from the traditional, uh, traditional market because people don't necessarily, if they're new

10:58to boating, um, don't really want to get into changing spark plugs, fuel filters, they're not

11:03familiar with it and it's not something they're necessarily looking to learn. So it opens this

11:07whole new demographic, um, on lakes, for example, homeowners associations will often ban the use of

11:13combustion engines just for the, uh, for the good among everyone, that they don't have to deal with

11:17the noise, the wake. Um, so having these electric systems really opens up new markets, um, across all

11:24sorts of different demographics. What do you think is the future of this? Because I feel like

11:28there have obviously been a lot of changes, like you said, within the electric vehicle industry

11:33from the past couple of years, but what else is next? What are people looking for in terms of like

11:37how to continue innovating in this industry? Yeah. So, I mean, we're really just at the beginning

11:41right now, um, over the, before Flux Marine came around really, there was, there was nothing more than

11:46just small trolling motors, motors under, under one horsepower. Um, so right now we're just learning

11:51or trying to get our, our name out there and being, becoming a household name. So, um, companies,

11:56rental fleets, for example, uh, pleasure craft, lake boats, um, you're just going to start seeing

12:01electric boats coming around and, and they're going to become more, more commonplace.

12:04And we've seen that a little bit with electric cars, but one thing that I think about a lot is

12:08like, you know, a lot of people want to be able to use EVs, but the infrastructure doesn't really

12:12exist around the country. Like if you're going on a very long road trip, like you have to make sure

12:16that there are charging stations at the proper places along that trip in order to use an EV efficiently.

12:22Are you guys coming across similar limitations infrastructure wise or what has that conversation

12:26looked like? Yeah. So that's, that's one advantage that we have over the, over the automotive space.

12:30So when you think about the automotive spaces, you say you might go for a long road trip. So you're

12:34going, uh, from A to B traveling. So, um, you have to find those charging spots along the way.

12:39The difference in the marine space is often you're going out because you want to go out on the water.

12:44So you're starting at home location and then going back to that location. So going from A to A again,

12:48um, which means that the need for this charging infrastructure, um, is low, but also if you look

12:53out on the marinas and docks, you already have shore power. So these are kind of power pedestals

12:58that yachts would already plug into, uh, larger boats already need to power their refrigeration

13:02systems, AC systems. So you can get what's equivalent to a level two car charger. So we design

13:08our systems and our boats to give you a full day of boating out on the water. You then come back,

13:12plug it in overnight, takes you just 30 seconds to plug in and it'll be good to go the next day. So,

13:16um, we're very lucky that actually a lot of the charging infrastructure is already in place,

13:20but what we're going to start seeing more of is DC fast chargers. So this is really valuable for

13:25rental fleets. For example, if you want to rent your boat in the morning, you can then charge it

13:29up over the course of 30, 45 minutes over lunch and then rent it out again in the afternoon. So

13:33we're already starting to see, see, uh, see lakes like Tahoe, Lake George, the Monaco, um,

13:39Marina already has DC fast chargers. So, uh, they are starting to come up and we'll, we'll start to see

13:43that more and more over the, over the coming years.

13:45What have some of the challenges been though? Cause I'm sure like with any emerging industry,

13:48there are many roadblocks that you're having to overcome. So what have those been for you guys?

13:52I would say one of the biggest challenges is just awareness, uh, awareness of the technology.

13:56Um, it's not necessarily a novel idea. People think electric cars, electric boats, it makes sense.

14:01It's the future, but people often think, oh yes, 10 years time. Sure. That makes sense.

14:05So our biggest challenge is just getting people out, out on the boat, realizing that this is a product that

14:09fits a lot of their needs already. Um, and so just kind of spreading awareness. Um, and the industry

14:15is, the industry operates is quite antiquated. So it works through dealership networks, uh, boat shows.

14:22There's a lot of boats that are sold at boat shows. Um, and so we're starting to see the transition.

14:26Um, again, the parallels drawn from the automotive space where Tesla was the first car that you could,

14:31uh, purchase with a click of button on your phone. And so this is kind of the transition that we're starting to see

14:35in the marine space. Uh, but there are more and more dealers. There are more and more people, um, sharing knowledge

14:41on the space that actually it does make sense for a lot of people. Um, and actually gives you a better,

14:45better experience out in the water. How is it different locationally? Like one across the US,

14:49but also coming from across the pond, how are these conversations different? How is the way that you're

14:54like, you're the marketing or consumers are using these new technologies varied across these different locations?

14:59Yeah, it's been a really interesting, um, project to learn and, uh, to learning the dynamics of the, of the market.

15:05So if we break it down on, on geography, so, um, Europe as a whole, uh, from a regulatory perspective,

15:10they're, uh, maybe more favorable, um, towards electrification. Places like, um, Amsterdam has

15:16banned the use of gas engines on the canals, um, which is a little bit different from the regulatory

15:21environment we see in the US, but, um, actually at a state level, um, California has been great with,

15:26uh, funding grants for, um, both kind of commercial, um, systems, but, um, also Native Americans,

15:33um, gives an opportunity to stay present and not necessarily be polluting. Um, but within the US,

15:39it's, uh, again, it kind of very much depends on how people are using their boats. So, um,

15:45the Great Lakes is a great market, um, down in Florida, even within Florida, there's a lot of

15:49different markets. So kind of, you think of the boats you'd see picture in Miami, these go fast

15:54boats, it's not necessarily the market for where you're going offshore, uh, fishing, deep sea fishing.

15:58But, um, if you're cruising around lakes, near shore, intercoastals, uh, it's a, it's a great

16:03opportunity. So all up and down the, uh, the East Coast, California is, it's, it's great markets. Um,

16:08but it comes, it depends on how people are using it. Um, and we're fortunate that we don't need to

16:12sell to everyone. It doesn't make sense for everyone. If you're trying to go 40 miles offshore,

16:16pure electric is not necessarily for you, but there are so many people who are, who are boating maybe

16:21five, 10, 15 miles a day. They just want to go out, have a little bit of a cocktail cruise,

16:25go out to a sandbar. Electric is perfect for them. They get to eliminate the maintenance. They,

16:30cost of operation dramatically decreases, uh, and actually the total cost of ownership over

16:34the lifetime goes down and you get a better experience. So, uh, so those are the markets

16:39that we're going for. Is that like 40 miles off the coast, something that you guys are hoping to

16:44capture in the future? Or is that just like not the market that you guys are setting out to,

16:47to win right now? So right now we're focused on the smaller horsepower outboard segments. So

16:52the mode is up to about 150 horsepower, which, um, gives you boats up to about 30, 32 feet,

16:57um, which is already a substantial portion of the market. So, um, our focus now is really getting a

17:02strong foothold within that market segment. And as technology continues to advance and improve,

17:07then we can start to insert ourselves into, into those markets. Who are the majority of your

17:12customers today? Like, are they individuals with boats? Are they the fleets that you were talking

17:15about? What is this like demographic of consumers look like? Really all sorts. There's,

17:19there's no one particular type. So, uh, we have, for example, sailing clubs, uh, rental fleets,

17:24yacht owners who have tenders, um, fishermen and people who just want to spend time out on the lake.

17:30Um, so I'd really say there's no one particular type of customer. Um, and that really stems from the

17:35fact that we built a ground up solution, uh, that allows us to be the first drop in alternative to

17:41combustion motors. So the idea being that if your boat can take a gas engine, it can take one of our

17:45systems. So, um, that allows us to, uh, to be really the first true alternative to these combustion

17:51engines. And that's an easy swap, just swapping the, the engines? There's definitely a lot. There's

17:55some planning that goes into it. And so for the time being, we're focused on new builds. So we're

18:00working with boat builders and hull manufacturers to create a product line. And this really helps us

18:05scale up faster. But we certainly do do a lot of repowers. Um, there's just a lot of I's to dot and T's

18:10to cross to make sure from a safety perspective, um, because that's really one of our top priorities

18:15is to, uh, um, I tell my engineers eliminate the opportunity for mistake. Uh, and that comes from

18:20whether that's whoever's assembling the system, integrating the system, or the customer using

18:24the system, don't give them the opportunity to make that mistake. So, um, that just adds a little

18:29bit layer, a little bit of additional legwork. Um, so we've focused on these new boat builds to

18:34onboard new sales and distribution partners. So, uh, we're now actually at a point where we can ship a

18:39entire propulsion system on a pallet to some of our boat builders. They will rig it on a system.

18:43They've got, we've trained them up in high voltage safety, how to rig the system, and then it goes to

18:47their dealership network. Um, so that's our focus for now, but it's definitely, uh, as time, time goes

18:53on, we're going to be doing more and more rebuilds. Yeah, totally. How do you and your two co-founders

18:57divide and conquer today? Like what's everyone's job? Where are you guys coming in with your former

19:01experience to help, you know, fuel this thing forward? Absolutely. So, uh, I mean, now we're fortunate to have

19:06an such an incredible team, but, um, each of our roles has changed quite a lot over the, since

19:12inception. Uh, so my background's in a mechanical and aerospace, um, engineering. Then my co-founder

19:17is, uh, focuses very much more on the battery side, uh, and then Dale is on the finance side. So, uh,

19:22make sure that all the, uh, the numbers gonna make sense. Um, but as we evolve, it's, it's now very much

19:27more kind of working and managing teams. Uh, so we've broken down the engineering teams into both

19:31mechanical software control systems. And so splitting those responsibilities, uh, between us

19:36is, uh, is how we're doing it. What's been the biggest challenge in terms of team building?

19:41The, I'd say the biggest challenge of team building is, um, there's quite a lot of challenges

19:45with team building, I would say. Um, finding motivated, passionate, uh, people who are really

19:50willing to go above and beyond because we're a startup. We don't have the resources that the giant

19:55corporations do. Um, pair that with also being in a, in Rhode Island, which is the smallest state.

20:01Uh, so attracting talent away from these big cities has been a bit of a challenge. So to overcome

20:05that, we've really focused on building relationship with universities. So Brown University, Iris, uh,

20:11the yacht restoration school down in Rhode Island for technicians, um, has been a great way for us to

20:15get kind of that talent pipeline, um, to working. And we found that some of our most talented

20:20engineers and our most valuable engineers have actually started off as interns for us, uh, maybe

20:25interned a couple of times for us, and then come on to be full-time, full-time employees with us.

20:29So coming off of COVID when supply chain was obviously a huge issue across industries,

20:34tariffs coming into play within the last, you know, couple of years, how is that impacting you

20:38as you guys are pulling in, you know, materials and building what you guys have to build?

20:41Yeah, certainly. So starting with the pandemic, um, we were, when the pandemic first hit,

20:46we were, we were working at a technology incubator space up in, up in Boston. Um, and we were in the

20:52middle of making a prototype and we, uh, we had to leave our facility. So especially working on a hardware

20:57product, if you're not able to prototype, it, uh, puts you in a bit of a tricky spot. So,

21:01uh, we took a step back and realized that actually everyone is going through this.

21:05And if we can just make some progress, we're making, we're taking advantage of this situation.

21:10So we had to find some solutions. We worked with, uh, actually the Department of Commerce of Rhode

21:15Island was, was very good to us. Uh, they gave us a grant to work with the, uh, yacht restoration

21:20school down in, down in Rhode Island and Newport. Um, so that allowed us to continue to prototype

21:25until we actually finished the, uh, a system that would add, we were able to take some investors out,

21:30uh, and actually closed our funding around. On the tariff side, the tariff side has definitely

21:34been, uh, definitely been a challenge. Um, but we are fortunate in that probably two years ago,

21:40uh, as the technology was starting to mature, we were starting to see, um, a shift in the defense

21:45opportunities. So, um, we knew that we needed domestic supply chain. And so we'd slowly been

21:51working our way back, uh, to enable us to, to build fully in America. We did a large part of

21:57our prototyping out in Asia and China, just really for the speed, reliability, uh, and turnaround time

22:03they were to offer at a cost that we could afford. So we, we'd spent the last two years trying to bring

22:07our supply chain back. Um, so when tariffs came in, we actually only really had maybe 5%, 10%,

22:13that sort of scale of our products made overseas. Um, and so those were certainly a shock when we

22:17were getting 150% tariffs on components that are only made in China, but really we're fortunate that

22:23we'd already been planning ahead for other reasons. Um, and so some of those have now been moved to

22:28either fully domestically or at least in, in Mexico. Um, so we've, uh, we're fortunate. It's, uh,

22:33it's definitely been a challenging time, but we're fortunate that we, uh, we'd started planning for

22:37this, um, a couple of years ago and not, not having to address it now. Do you have any products that

22:42you're still having to get from China? Uh, we, so depending, we have a few couple of

22:45suppliers, but we're not solely dependent on those suppliers. Um, so it's just a nature, um,

22:50our most cost effective battery cells, um, come from China to put depending on the price

22:54sensitivity of our customers and the use case, uh, we have a couple of different suppliers that

22:57we can rely on. What is your goal with this in the future? Like, is it a metric with Fluxmarine?

23:02Is it to be a, you know, founder that has sold their company? Like, what are you hoping to get out

23:06of this entire experience? Yeah, I would say the thing that I'm most looking to get out of this is really

23:11to be the catalyst to electrify the marine space and really have that impact. Um, our goal is to

23:17sell as many electric outboards, um, and propulsion systems as possible. And whether that's under the

23:21Fluxmarine brand, whether that's getting acquired, going public, uh, we're not so focused on the exact

23:26exit strategy, um, so long as it means that we're selling and building as many electric propulsion

23:31systems as humanly possible. With so much changing across the technology industry right now,

23:37you know, AI coming into play, so many IOT technologies being a huge part of so many

23:41companies right now, what's your best piece of advice for other founders who are starting to

23:45build in the, the tech and transportation industry so that they can stay ahead of the curve and like

23:50use these new technologies to their advantage? Yeah, I think that's a really important question.

23:53Um, I think focusing on the MVP, the minimum viable product, uh, one thing that we learned early on

23:59from some of our mentors is that most startups fail not because they run out of money. They're actually just

24:04building a product that no one wants. Um, and so really getting out in the field early and not

24:08just staying heads down in a, uh, in the engineering buildings is, is critical. So making sure you're

24:13solving a customer pain point, uh, because it's quite easy, as you mentioned, with all these new

24:18technologies, with AI, um, to just add AI onto something rather than actually solving a particular

24:24pain point. Um, so I'd really say no matter how long you've been doing something, really go back to

24:28the fundamental questions of what pain point are you trying to solve? Kind of what is the problem you're

24:33trying to solve? And what is the solution? And starting in that order rather than kind of coming

24:37up with an idea and a solution for maybe a pro or for a problem that isn't really as broad as you

24:42might anticipate. Have there been any bits of customer feedback or, you know, conversations

24:45within the community that have like made you guys pivot or totally changed your mind on something or

24:50have showed you like this was not needed, but something else is? I'd say we've had no kind of

24:54fundamental pivots. Uh, a lot of times it just is reinforced what we've already thought of, uh,

25:00the need for a ground up design rather than taking, um, a legacy combustion system, which,

25:05um, from the outset is certainly the easier option. You can go to market a little bit faster,

25:09but it's actually going to come back and bite you on the back end. So, um, there haven't really been

25:14many true large pivots, um, but there have certainly been a lot of learning opportunities from customers.

25:20Um, customers have a talent for breaking things. Um, and so I, I often I tell our engineers if,

25:26if you don't assign a failure mode to the system, life will assign you one. Um, and especially being

25:31in the marine space with salt, with corrosion, it's very easy to underestimate the challenge

25:35of working assault in the marine environment. Um, and really the need for safety. Our customers

25:40are trusting us to go out onto the ocean sometimes miles offshore without a system and trusting it that

25:46it doesn't break down. Um, so really that focus on safety, um, and understanding all the potential

25:51failure modes, um, before just handing it to a customer. Are you guys using AI or IOT to start

25:57solving some of those problems or how are those, these new technologies coming into play for you

26:01guys? Yeah. So more IOT we're certainly using a lot. Uh, it's, that's one of the benefits of

26:05electrification, the amount of data that we're, that's coming on and we can send to the system.

26:10Yeah. Um, really just increase the amount of trust that we have in our system and customers have

26:14in the system. So it allows us to get into the realm of preemptive maintenance. We can often see if a

26:19system there's any abnormalities with the system before the customers do, uh, which helps with

26:23that low level triage and fixing the system. Um, so I would say that's, uh, the main use of IOT.

26:30AI, we are, we're certainly leveraging AI, but we're not necessarily leaning or depending on it.

26:35One of the great uses I found for AI is really data, data analytics. Um, again, tied to the IOT aspect

26:41is the amount of data that's coming off. It's quite hard to go through, pass, make meaningful visualizations

26:46from. And so if you can then explain that to an AI, which our software engineering engineers do,

26:51um, incredibly well, they can create these beautiful, um, beautiful graphs, not only for

26:55our customers, but also our investors to see the impact that we're having for where that's CO2

26:59mitigated by the, what would be the equivalent fuel burn that we would have been doing on this boat.

27:04And what's the environmental impact on that to just the cost savings, um, and then the behavioral

27:08trends. Um, so we are certainly using AI, but, um, it's, it's not part of the MVP for us.

27:15Our goal is to scale up the system, um, and just really keep it as simple as possible while

27:19delivering the, delivering a premium product. Totally. My last question for you is what is next

27:23for you and FlexMarine within the next, like, you know, 12 months? What can we expect to see?

27:27What are you guys working on? What are you excited about? You can start to see us across marinas,

27:31off, uh, lakes all around the U.S. Uh, so we're onboarding new hull manufacturers. We have some really

27:36exciting partnerships coming up. So we're going to be down in Flora for the boat shows. Uh, we're all

27:40across the Northeast. Um, and then just seeing us with, uh, more oyster farms and more aquaculture

27:45farms. Uh, they've been some of my favorite customers, uh, going out, see them. They spend

27:49eight, 10 hours a day. Um, and so just really, you're going to hear our name more often, uh,

27:54and see more flux marine systems out in the, out in the water. Love it. Well, thank you so much

27:57for taking the time to walk me through all this today. Thank you for having me. It's been great.

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