- 6 weeks ago
'The Better Sister' stars Jessica Biel and Elizabeth Banks, along with co-showrunners and executive producers Regina Corrado and Olivia Milch sat down for a discussion about the Prime Video thriller series in a THR Q&A powered by Vision Media.
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00:00Hi everyone! My name is Kara Warner. I am your moderator for this very special conversation
00:13about Prime Video's The Better Sister, a very exciting limited series dropping on Prime Video
00:19May 29th. I am very pleased to introduce the reason you're tuning in. Please welcome stars
00:26Jessica Biel and Elizabeth Banks who also serve as executive producers and your co-showrunners
00:31and executive producers Olivia Milch and Regina Corrado. Such a good team. I would love to kind
00:39of kick it off with this project's origin story. Who found the book first? Was the book the entry
00:45point or the scripts for the show? How did we all assemble here today? Yes, absolutely. Well,
00:49Tomorrow Studios, our amazing producers sent me this book and Alifair Burke is the best,
00:55most incredible writer. Everyone go buy her books and so twisty and turny, so satisfying.
00:59And I think the thing I really connected to and both Regina and I did was this idea that siblings
01:04get different versions of their parents and that your birth order and what is happening with your
01:08parent as you're a child and how that differs from what your sibling gets. That really felt like a
01:14universal story that we could, you know, sink the roots deep into on top of it being a very satisfying
01:19murder mystery. So we felt like, all right, let's let's let's go on this. And then, you know,
01:24we were able to assemble this incredible team and it's just been a dream. We love the savagery
01:28between sisters. That's a big draw for us. Yes, there's like endless material for sure.
01:37For you both, what kind of, did you read the book first or were you approached with the script first
01:42and kind of how, what were your first impressions? I read the script, I read the pilot episode,
01:48the first episode. It's not a pilot, I guess it's called episode 101. I read, which, you know,
01:55is really, it's Chloe's, you know, it's the night that Chloe finds Adam. And then Craig Gillespie
02:02called and said, you should read the book and then let's talk because you'll see like there's more.
02:08And so I read the book and so then I knew largely what was going to transpire and who Nikki essentially
02:16was to Chloe, the backstory and more of it. And, um, but what I loved about the scripts then and my
02:24conversations with producers, these guys, everybody was how much more we could do with an adaptation
02:31and like how deep we could go into character stuff, what we, how we were going to sell the past of the
02:37flashbacks and what weave them into the present. I love the idea of, um, playing with time and which is
02:44like everyone's enemy and, uh, you know, the big bad. And then also I'm a big sister. Like there
02:51were tons of connection points for me personally to the story. Again, I also just love that it was
02:56a great murder mystery. Uh, and yeah, I don't know. It just felt like we could really work. I'd also,
03:03we were being spoken to at the same time, like as a package, like let's do it to get all together.
03:09And I kept being like, well, is she going to do it? Like, I think it'd be really good.
03:16And, uh, I'd been told for years that we looked alike, that we could be sisters. So it was like,
03:21I feel like serendipity has finally happened and it's going to come together and this is the one
03:26that's going to come together around. Yeah. Yeah. And I sort of similarly read the 101 first and then
03:33was dipping into the other episodes that I think I had been given. I wasn't given everything right
03:38away and then was reading the book kind of simultaneously. And, um, hearing about that
03:44Elizabeth was going to hopefully maybe be involved. I was trying to figure out how would I do this with
03:49my family, you know, going to New York for so long. And my husband was on tour and I was like,
03:53oh my God, how do I, how do I figure this out? But it was such compelling material for me. I mean,
03:59the sister stuff, I think I just, I love a murder mystery. That's something that I love being a part
04:04of, but the sister stuff was like the, the savagery I think was the new element, like one of the newer
04:10elements for me to consider like, oh wow, how, how do we walk, you know, these sisters and started this
04:18one, you know, one place with them and then have them make this incredibly massive arc and, uh, you know,
04:26become aligned by the end of this thing. And that was, that was probably the other biggest draw.
04:30Yeah. How did you all kind of, I mean, it's maybe a question for you two and then you two,
04:34how did you approach the adaptation? Because obviously you guys are producers involved too,
04:39and, and how you decided to kind of tease out little elements of the story. Obviously you have
04:42a source materialist guide, but how did you, can you talk to us about the fun of getting to stretch
04:47it out a little bit? Oh my gosh, of course. You know, I think that you have, when you have something
04:52like Alifair's book, you have this incredible foundational text, right? And you can build upon
04:56that inherently the structure of a novel. Obviously there's interiority, obviously there's sort of a
05:01beginning and end, particularly in a murder mystery where you're, there's a driving force, right? You,
05:05you want to know what happens next. And part of the gift of long form storytelling is you get these
05:10moments to investigate, to breathe, to get to know characters. And we found that as we, we initially
05:15started looking into that structure, we were being drawn towards these other moments. The more we got to know
05:21these characters, the more we understood where they came from and maybe want a little glimpse of
05:26that. And, oh, this is just outside of what's happening, but we really need it to understand
05:30why they're behaving this way. And so the more that you kind of get your tent poles and you get the,
05:35the structural integrity that you need from the, the book, the source material, it evolves. It's a
05:40living, breathing thing that grows and it tells you what it needs. And then you get to start, you know,
05:45listening to that together as a family, taking care of it. And, and that's such fun to collaborate and,
05:50and, and find that all together. So if you have actors who are so good
05:55that the interiority, they do it for you, you know, so you're doing it through images and not words.
06:01And there are so many beautiful, or we don't say that.
06:08You know, there's so many beautiful, poignant from my perspective in the show that are just these
06:14sisters by themselves and they, they just speak volumes for us. Yeah. I wondering, you can flip this
06:19question and vice versa, how I, how I say it. I'm wondering if you could both talk about what you
06:23love watching each other do kind of, if it's, you know, what you love Jessica as Chloe doing or
06:28Jessica, the producer doing and vice versa, because I think you both have great experience on both sides.
06:34I'm just curious kind of what it is to work in that realm, like, you know, the experience.
06:38That's such a nice question. That is a nice question. It makes me think about when we were on set and
06:42something would be happening like lighting wise or, or script wise. And I'd be like, why is that
06:48happening? You'd be like, all right, here's the situation. We're doing this because this needs to
06:52happen. Like when her director hat pops on, like she just knows so much about, and I thought I knew a
06:58lot, but I would be like, what? Don't worry about it. This is what we're doing. And I'm like, oh, yeah,
07:04that makes sense. So I loved watching Elizabeth do that off camera. And then I just, your spontaneity
07:13and your unpredictability, like that I was on set with her always. I'm like, what is she going to do?
07:18Yeah. You know, I, I, I want to cultivate that in myself. Like that's something I'd like to work on.
07:24And, and I don't know if you can actually work on that, or if that's just like who you are as a
07:28person or not, but like that kind of your, your ability to improvise, your ability to find the
07:34humor and be, and, and, and just know some shit to say that you're going to be like,
07:39damn, I didn't expect that. I love that kind of ability. And so for me that, those are the things
07:44that make, that they came up for me. But you, but you don't realize that I got to lean into that
07:48because that was Nikki's, Nikki's whole goal with Chloe is to like throw her off balance, right?
07:56Like it is to jab her in the side. It is the like, you're not better than me. Like I know who you are.
08:00Like everything you're saying is bullshit, nonsense. Like I have moral superiority the
08:06entire time. She stole my husband and my son. Like I have forgiven, but I mean, I haven't forgotten.
08:12Like, you know, we, we can keep going. So part of like, I love, thank you for saying that,
08:18but I do think a lot of it was, was that the, it's what I was playing, you know, what it is,
08:24the character is their dynamic. So I was really leaning into the dynamic of like, how can I
08:29fuck with you? But that's like a real skill. I don't think I'm personally like a really good
08:36fucker with somebody. But you didn't have to play it though. You know what I mean?
08:41I know. That's why I enjoyed watching you do that. And then in my, my mind, I'm like,
08:44I want to do that too. I want to be better at that. Maybe even just my own life.
08:49There's some really good one-liners. You both Chloe and Nikki get to deliver like very perfect
08:54sisterly. Like, yes. Like we were written a lot of very good material. What is it like for you
09:00kind of working with actors who also know what they're doing as producers? Because they're not
09:04just vanity producers. I even know that. It's the best. I highly recommend it. No,
09:09it was like, it was such a gift. First of all, to have people who are so experienced and
09:14so self-sufficient, right? It was like, these are pros. They didn't, they, we, we were working together.
09:20They needed what they needed from us, but they were taking care of everything else. Like they
09:24viewed the project holistically. They came to us doing this incredible work and then also making
09:30sure that everything else was, you know, handled. And it was such a, a joy to feel like, oh, we have
09:37partners. You know, this wasn't some, this wasn't something, oh, we have to tend to. It was, we're,
09:42you know, and that, but that's for real. Yes. It was no, there was like, it was like, oh,
09:47we're all in this. We're all equals. We're all partners. And, and that it was just the best.
09:51I mean, it really, I, I think that when you work with intelligent people who care,
09:58who are very good at their jobs, you show, you don't want to disappoint anyone. I never wanted
10:03to go to set and disappoint Jessica. I never wanted to disappoint Olivia. I like, I didn't want, you know,
10:09you just go to set and you're like, I have to be, I have to bring it today. Today's the day. I get today
10:15to do this scene and this is it and it lives forever. So let's show up for it. And anything
10:21less than is a disappointment to these, like you set a bar, everyone set a bar and we had to,
10:27we had to meet it or exceed it every single day. And I, I love environments like that where I,
10:33there's just mutual respect all the way around and nobody wants to, nobody wants to be the mess up,
10:38you know, the, yeah. Nobody's wasting time. No. You know, you're not. Well, that's the moms.
10:44I was going to say that. The moms and us are just like, we don't have time for any of this.
10:50We just got to get through it. Let's go. I feel like, I don't know if this is true,
10:53but I read that the days were kept, like we were always making days, we were always mindful.
10:57We want people to go home and have dinner with their family. That's exactly right.
11:00And we had amazing directors in that sense too. And, and the entire crew, yeah,
11:04the ADs were unbelievable. But I think that really does, we, we were doing such great work and we also
11:10knew that we would continue to do great work if our cast and our crew got to be with their families and got to
11:14get rest. And that was really important to us. You can make great art and you can make great TV
11:19shows without destroying people's personal lives. And that may be, you know, a revolutionary thing to
11:25say, but. And we were doing nine pages a day. Yeah. Yeah. It requires an incredible amount of
11:31preparation. Yes. So the whole crew gets credit for getting us out to have a nice dinner in New York
11:38City. Hat tip to the ADs for sure. Yes. Well, I was also going to talk about, it seems like you have a lot
11:42of fun playing together, but also you have an extended kind of supporting cast that seems very
11:48fun to come on in. Yeah, the best. Like really, can you talk or tease a little bit about the other
11:53people that come and dance with you in the show? Yeah. It's a who's who of New York phenomenal actors.
11:59Yeah. You know, we, we, I remember making sort of like a short list of like guys that I really like
12:05that I knew lived in New York because that's who we were, we were casting for. And, um, Corey was on
12:10it and Fred was on it and, uh, Paul Sparks was on it and it was, you know, it's just, we got the most
12:18incredible people to come. And then Kim Dickens is like a total revelation. I mean, I feel like you
12:24have written for her and they knew exactly what they were going to, they, to be able to write for
12:29someone who, you know, is going to deliver all that. I'm sure is really, uh, uh, a gift and
12:36they were great. And then Bobby was, they had a great dynamic. They were really fun to see together.
12:40Lorraine. Lorraine. And Gloria Rubin. Gloria Rubin shows up, you're like, oh,
12:49she's everything, you know? So great. How about New York as a character, like getting to shoot in New
12:54York and play with, you know, New York should be a character. It's the best. I mean, my first night
13:00there was the balcony scene when Nikki has just shown up and we shot on the balcony on Central
13:08Park West, overlooking the park and the entire skyline. So I walked in like day one of the show
13:14and I was there and it, nothing puts a character in their place more than being like, oh, look,
13:18this is the bigness of the city, the beauty of this view, this apartment, like everything
13:24about it when Nikki would have been like, I don't even understand what world I just dropped into.
13:29So to have the actual place, it was so fun and really served so much for me, you know, of like,
13:38wow, this is just her everyday view. She doesn't even care, you know? It's like, it's what it was,
13:44I mean, it's super fun to play with it. Yeah. I mean, the city is a dream, right? Like what really
13:51living out, like my Sex and the City dreams. Oh no, you got to go to Odeon and we were like,
13:56they're going to shoot at Odeon. And I was like, staying right around the corner, I walked
14:01to work that day. I was like, this is unbelievable. My kids were there, they were getting to experience
14:06the city. It was special. It was really special. Well, it's also fun to hear that you're using your
14:11locations because I'm such an easy audience person where I'm like, well, that could be a set and I don't
14:15know. They could affect it. No, we were so lucky in that way that, again, the location scouts,
14:21the ADs, the directors and how they're able to build it because there's a texture, right,
14:25to the city. And there's a texture both to the buildings, to the architecture and to the people.
14:30And that was really important to us when we were casting people from New York and also just the
14:34faces, our lead ensemble, but and also our background and wanting to make sure it felt like the city,
14:40you know, and felt real. And that was so important in the diversity of our cast and just the
14:46interesting faces because you walk down New York City Street and you're like, put him in a movie.
14:50Who is this guy? And everybody has a story. And that was, you know, I think we really got to feel
14:56that as you get into the stories of each of our cast, like the richness of the inner lives of every
15:01person. Well, and I think another layer of that too is costume and wardrobe and hair and makeup.
15:06Can you talk to us a little bit about embodying the characters that way with, you know,
15:10I feel like Chloe's wardrobe is pretty top. I don't know what Nikki is, but I also appreciated
15:15her colorful ensemble, but I'm just wondering how that is for you both and in, you know,
15:19creating those also as part of your work.
15:22Stacy Bata, our costume designer, she, I just, you know, she and I talked sort of briefly at the
15:31beginning about again, just what would be opposition to her, this sense that there's a creativity in
15:38Nikki. There's sort of like a free flow, you know, she's single. She like, she's, she's just a freer
15:47spirit, I suppose. But at the end of the day, she came here with a suitcase. So what's in the suitcase?
15:52Yeah. What did she think she needed?
15:54Yeah. Um, so it's not exactly, it's, it's all probably actually a little nicer than what she
16:02wears in her real life, right? Like she probably just wears like black jeans every day and like
16:07boots and whatever. But like, it was like, okay, but you're going to go to New York and you're going
16:11to go to this, you're going to go see your son and you're going to see your sister. So don't like
16:17what's in the suitcase. And it really mattered to me, like what was, and then what we, what am I going
16:22to borrow from her? So what now we have to get into the wardrobe because we're here a lot longer
16:27and like, what does that look like? So for me, it was really fun to just think about what could be
16:31in the suitcase? Why would it have been packed? And that it's not actually exactly really Nikki,
16:38you know, it's a, it's a facade. And the whole show is about putting out facades.
16:43Mm hmm. Yeah. The borrowing clothes too was so important. And I want to hear what Jessica has
16:49to say about all of her incredible clothes that I wanted to steal so badly. But that was, yeah,
16:54that was the borrowing clothes. There's a t-shirt that Chloe wears in a flashback that then Nikki
16:59pulls out of a wardrobe when she sleeps in the, in the guest house. And, and, and the silk robe
17:05that Chloe has on and then Nikki wears it. It's that is so real and important that sisters take each
17:11other's clothes and also that it's not endless, you know, there are the things that make up our daily
17:16lives and wanting to see how that they live together. That was so important to us. And
17:19Stacy did such a great job with that. I think about Stacy, she has a very strong vision.
17:23So we could say, no, we think it's this, but she'd say, no, it's you. I don't think so.
17:29But you know what? Okay, I'll show you what we have. Like, well, that's not what I, she's,
17:33she's just her, I love that. That's important to the mix of things. Yeah. I don't often notice
17:38wardrobe as much as I should, but even, I feel like top to bottom, you know, from every character on screen,
17:42like even the men are like the characters, the way they're dressed, it all makes a lot of sense.
17:47There's a certain elegance and it harkens back a little bit. We mentioned like film noir,
17:51like there's a little bit of this, you know, and there's something that Stacy tapped into,
17:57you know, it was, it was really, even, even with Nikki, when it was messy, there was a certain sort
18:02of elegance to it. I was, I loved. Yeah. Can you tease a little bit, again, obviously we're avoiding
18:08spoilers because we need people to watch it. Can you kind of tease what you love most about how
18:12the episodes unfold or kind of the story that you're getting to tell, whether you're appealing
18:17to certain audiences or what kind of ride we're all in for as we watch all these?
18:21Every episode has a cliffhanger that's bananas. I mean, truly. Yeah. You guys, the cliffhanger,
18:28you know, in this genre and in the era of the binge, you gotta have that hook that makes people go,
18:34I gotta watch the next one, even though it's one o'clock in the morning, I'm gonna do it. Right? So,
18:39and they, it's just expertly done, I think, in how we're driving down one lane and we think we're
18:46going in one direction and right at the end we make a right turn. And it just keeps you hooked
18:52and watching. I thought, I, I've loved how it unfolds and really keeps the viewer like on edge
19:00and you think you know people and then something else gets revealed and it's really interesting.
19:04Yeah. And I think the other element, well, one of the other elements is just that everybody
19:09is a suspect. Yes. Everybody. And you really don't know what, what's going to happen. You really don't
19:17know, you know, uh, who, who, who it's going to actually be in the end. And, and everyone is kind of
19:25culpable on some level, right? You know, many of the characters kind of all play a part and
19:31how everything kind of goes down. It's almost like these sliding, sliding doors moment where
19:36if you just made a different decision, something different would have happened, but they didn't.
19:39And I like how that unfolds. And of course, just how the sister relationship evolves and how it turns
19:46into just something so different and so empowering and powerful and like kind of volatile, but like,
19:53like these two women are just so aligned at the end and it just starts off so differently. So
19:59I love that. I love watching that kind of unfold. When Lorraine, when Lorraine in the,
20:03in 101 says, I'm, I'm happy he's dead or whatever in the car and she means it.
20:08And I was like, oh my God, Jesus, did she do it?
20:13Like everyone is a suspect. It's really fun. Yeah, it is. And you talked a little bit about like the
20:18subtlety in the cliffhanger, because sometimes we know like you have to pay attention to every episode,
20:23but sometimes I would have maybe glanced down at something and I would be like, wait a second.
20:26And I'd have to kind of go back and be like, I got to catch that specific line or end again,
20:32which I think is very well crafted on your part. For you both. Yeah. Like,
20:36was there anything like a specific goal in what you're putting out in each episode or kind of
20:41how you want to manipulate in a, in a creative way? I don't know if that's an agenda item or not.
20:46I think we definitely do step back and say, well, are we achieving everything we need to
20:50in these episodes? Is there a balance of the humanity, the sense of humor and the mystery?
20:56Because I think that if I'm coming to this show, I'm watching it for the sisters and I'm watching
21:01it for the family. And I want to know what, because that's, that's the, those are the things that I
21:05enjoy. But then you wrap all the mystery around and all of the other characters and it gets very
21:11tangled and juicy. So I think we were always very dedicated to sort of stepping back and saying,
21:17are we doing all of these things at, at simultaneously? Absolutely. And it's a puzzle
21:22that you're, that you're building and then taking apart and having an audience build with you again.
21:28And so there's multiple moments of revelation and steps of revelation. And I think for us,
21:33the present linear narrative, what we call the PLN, wanting to make sure as we're revealing the mystery
21:39of the present, it couldn't be nerdier. I couldn't show up not knowing my lines,
21:50do you know what I mean? I haven't mentioned Faulkner yet, which was many times yesterday,
21:56immediately glossed over her eyes. They're like, oh really? He was involved in this? No. But I think
22:00that was like that present and the past and that in the structure of the episodes, you see that we want
22:06to give little information and parts of the past as the same time that we're revealing something
22:11of the present. So there'd be a cliffhanger always at the end, but also in the episode, you'd be like,
22:14wait, what happened? Okay, so when they were kids, this happened and then they met at this point.
22:18And so you're really wanting to allow the joy of discovery as you're piecing together both the past
22:24and the present, because that's also the experience that the characters are having. So you really want
22:28that mirroring to happen. And that was a really fun structural component and then to get to execute it and see
22:35it all play out. It was very satisfying. It's fun to hear you talk about it in that way too, because
22:38again, in knowing the PLN now, I don't know if that's something you would say today where you are
22:43in the PLN, but the way you kind of little carrots or little treats along the way of, I think in the
22:48first three of the, the hint to why the sisters' doors were locked, right? Like that's just a throwaway
22:53thing. And you're like, I bet we're going to revisit that. Like just those little things. It's so well done in that sense.
22:59As we kind of come close to wrapping up our time to not take up more, is anything, any final words,
23:03any words of words of wisdom for the audience? Have fun. Don't spoil it for your friends.
23:11Yeah. Okay. You don't, don't, don't be that guy. Yeah. That's my main thing. It's like,
23:18tell everybody to watch it, but don't spoil it. Yeah. I would say, I went back to the pilot after
23:22I saw a finale, just to be like, oh, what hints were here? By the way, there's some very obvious
23:29things. Yes. But it's really fun. And it's, and it also, yes, here's what I would say to the audience,
23:35watch it and then watch it again. And so you can appreciate what these performers are doing,
23:40because it is so complicated, it is so layered, and they are holding so much in any given moment.
23:46And to understand what actually happened, and then to go back and watch that kind of art be done,
23:51that kind of performance, it's, it's incredible. So that would be my recommendation.
23:54And don't read the book. Yeah. Until after. Until after the show. Until after.
23:58And then go buy a hundred copies of the book. Yeah.
24:00For Christmas presents for everyone, or Hanukkah presents, or whatever. Yeah.
24:04Plus, if you have any notes, write Olivia. We would love to hear. We would love to hear.
24:11She will write you back. Yeah, exactly. Guaranteed.
24:15Excellent. Well, thank you so much for your time. Thank you.
24:18All episodes available May 29th, if you don't already know that, tuning in. Thank you all so much.
24:23Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. It was so wonderful.
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